 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump, mind pump, with your hosts, Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. In this episode of Mind Pump. Hey, let's- Oh, Kermi! Before you tell everybody what goes down in this episode, I have to share something that I didn't realize that you can do now on iTunes. This used to drive me crazy when I had a specific episode that I wanted to share with someone that I wanted them to listen to. I used to send it, and then it was just send the link of Mind Pump, and then they got 500 episodes they'd have to try and figure out. Now they have updated that on the podcast, the iTunes app. So when you're listening to an episode and you find an episode that you really want to share- It's probably gonna be this one. You really want to share with somebody. If you look down in the bottom left-hand corner, you'll see a little square with an arrow on it. You hit that square, and it automatically sends that exact episode either via email, via text message. However you want to send it to somebody, it's really easy now to share the episodes, which was pretty cool. I think they just updated that maybe a few months ago. Excellent, thank you, Adam. So for the first 30 minutes or so, we have nice conversation. We talk about being hungry in business. You know those- You just fired up a little bit. Exactly. Then we- Oh, actually, we did mention our sponsor Organify in this episode. I also want to make the note here. If you enter the code Mind Pump, you get 20% off. Then we get into Justin's chicken story. Apocalypse. It's- You might now want to miss that one, unless- Unless you're PETA or- If you're PETA fast forward, pass that part. Yeah, you're not gonna want to hear that. We talk about hunting and killing our own food, and then we get into the questions. The first question is how we mentioned protein cycling and cycling other supplements. So how do we recommend that we do that? Like how often should you cycle your protein low and cycle some of your supplements? Then we answer the question of a gentleman who can't eat vegetables, literally finds them absolutely disgusting. Sounds like my two-year-old. So what should he do? Hint, bustle. Bustle. Then we get into the next question. Somebody's asking us if they should do their post-prime session after they do the sauna after the workout, or if it should be immediately after their workout. The answer to that question is not what you might expect, or is it? Then the last question, sandbag training. You sandbag are you? Again. What do we think about sandbag training for muscle development and for fat burning? Also, this month, enrolling any of our programs. Look, if you want to get in shape, the best thing you could do is hire one of us personally. The second best thing you could do is enroll at that point out there. Of course, is enroll in the MAPS program. These are programs designed by us specifically. We design them for specific forms of adaptation. Lots of specifics going on here. That's right. And to be specific. MAPS Anabolic is our foundational program, great for overall strength and development. Then we have MAPS Aesthetic, which is for those of you who are cosmetic focused, or if you're a stage competitor, bikini, physique, bodybuilder. We have MAPS Performance for those of you who are athletic minded or just want functional performance. If you want to be able to move as good as you look. We also have MAPS Anywhere, which is our program that includes no equipment. So in other words, you can get that program, work out in your closet. Nobody has to know. Move as good as you look. I like that. Then we have MAPS Prime, which teaches you how to prime your workouts. And Prime Pro, which is correctional. Or you could do the Super Bundle, which has almost all of those programs. And one, if you enroll in any of them individually or in the bundle, this month you get access to our forum for free. Our private forum normally costs $87. It has 2000 plus members, many of which are personal trainers, fitness professionals, other competitors. And of course, me, Adam, and Justin are on there every single day. It's a great way to kind of fire off ideas and get the support you need along your fitness journey. You get that for free this month if you enroll in any of those programs. Now, all you gotta do to get those is go to mindpumpmedia.com and enroll. T-shirt time. Oh yeah. Give away them shirts, Doug. Yeah, kind of a disappointing last week. Only six reviews. Whoa, let's take a record low. Record low. Here are some crickets. We need to tell people how to leave reviews again. Good idea. So here's what you do. You go to your podcast app. Go up in the search function. Even if you're already subscribed, you have to do this, search Mind Pump, two words, click on our icon. Then you'll be able to see a tab that says reviews. Leave a review. The odds of winning a free Mind Pump t-shirt actually quite high. So you definitely want to do this. It has to be five star, by the way. And we're giving out two shirts. First up is Nick George 89. James Gaines 116. Both of you are winners. Send the name I just read to itunesandmindpumpmedia.com. Your shirt size, your shipping address and we'll get that right out to ya. I came in at six. What time did you come? Six. Oh yeah. I'll remember that. Six, six, six, six, six. I usually text him right before. When you guys were on that call, when you finally strolled in here at like nine or 9.30, I was meeting with our young, motivated, and I can talk about him because he doesn't listen to the show. He's too cold. He wanted to have a little meeting with me. You talking about draw? Yeah. He wanted. A boy draw. Draw. Draw Dizzle. He wanted to have a meeting with me to tell me how motivated he was and to tell me how hard he was going to work. And so we had a good little meeting at breakfast. I could tell he was very nervous. But. Could you tell him coffees for closers only? Well, you know. Give him one of those speeches. You push it away from his vicinity. I mean, you guys know damn well that when it comes to those type of conversations, I'm probably not the funnest person to talk to about that, right? Like I'm not easy. But I believe. A lot of times you just need a hug. Seems like that. It's fun. You're fun-ish, but not the fun man. Well, I think. You know what I mean? So you're not fun. It's spurts. Well, I mean, I think for you guys, it's cool because we're all the same team. You know what I'm saying? It's kind of like when you watch, or like when you have like Dennis Rodman on your basketball team. Like you hate the guy when you play against him, but you want him on your team. Oh my God, you're Dennis Rodman. Yeah, right. So that's. I don't know. Maybe like Horse Grant. Are you gonna wear a dress? No. No, I'm definitely more Dennis Rodman. Dennis Rodman was the first out of. He's so flamboyant. He was the first biographer. Exactly. He paints his toes. So he, I read that. Do you guys ever read his? I feel like Scottie Pippen. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you kind of are. A little bit. I'm kind of Jordan. So that would be Justin Jordan. So Justin's Jordan, you're Scottie Pippen, and I'm Dennis Rodman. Pretty much in the clutch, I win championships. I'm just kidding. I'm like Joe Montana. No. Wait, you're a sport asshole. Oh, my bad, my bad. Sorry. I'm like Larry Bird, dude. Sorry, I forgot we were talking about golf. Yeah, straight. No, it was really cute to watch him get all flustered but share with me his passion. He's only 18. You know, I forget that he's only 18 because he's always with us. I love, love when I see young kids like that, 18, 19, 20 who are motivated, driven, and hungry. Well, you just see the fire finally spark. And it's rare. And here, I know I'm going to get a bunch of people mad at me right here, but it's rare to find this in those millennials. I feel like a lot. Do you think though, it's rare in just general. It's always rare, right? It is rare in general. I think it's even more rare in that generation. I think that, I mean, you talked about this just the other day about the, you know, people not even getting their driver's license. Yeah, there's, there's, it feels like a lost art. There's some weird statistics going on. I mean, when I was doing, I mean, I was managing JINs. I was really, I was 19 and I was, I didn't know anybody my age. That was, that was, you know, aggressive like that. So it's always going to be rare, but you're right. There's these weird, interesting statistics right now with kids, like they don't want to drive. They don't go out as much. They have less sex. They don't go to movies as much, although that could be to, you know, it's all due to technology, I think, right? Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean, Taylor even had to kind of talk some sense into him because I know when we first gave him his offer and told him what he would get paid hourly, he wasn't that excited. It wasn't like, and Taylor was like, what the fuck is wrong with you? You have an opportunity to be a part of something that is amazing. It's growing. It's fun as shit to be a part of. You're doing something you love. He's like, we don't even beat him up right now just for saying that. Right, that you're passionate about. Just wait till this whole room upside in. And Taylor's like, do any of, he goes, do any of your friends make that much money? And he's like, well, I have one friend that makes that kind of money. He's like, what does he do? He's like, construction. Like fuck, he does construction for, you know, eight to ten hours. Hard ass labor. Right, he gets up at five o'clock in the morning and he's fucking carrying around two by fours all over the place and nailing shit on, on bill. You get to come in here and have a good time. Right, he goes, and so he's like, and do something you're passionate about and that you love. And then with the potential that it could grow into something that could turn into possibly your career, wake the fuck up, you know? And so he kind of had that. I like Taylor. Right, he kind of had that conversation with him. And he admitted this. He admitted that this part of this, it was his own like struggle, this inner struggle he had. And then he kind of asked me like, you know, I just want to feel confident that I have the position. And I said, dude, you, that was what the first conversation was. You have the position. But I said, let me tell you something, you know? And you work your ass off. We have the hours for you to put that work in. But I will tell you this, you know, we will sit down with this exact same fucking counter and I will evaluate your work and tell you if it's contributing to the business because you can make all the cool fucking videos you want. If it's not driving more revenue to the business, I don't give a shit about it. And then that's hard for someone to hear who has an art that's into what you're like, the loves what they're doing, they're passionate about. It's just called reality. It is reality. And I'm like, if you can't show me that you're not adding value and by adding value, I mean fucking money to the business, you're not worth that position to me. I'd much rather contract that overseas, maybe somebody who's less talented that I don't really like, that I don't care about, that I'm paying $8 an hour over there just to get the shit done. Because what we've proven to do already is working. And if you can't find a way to make it work better, then it might be a short-lived position for you. There's two opportunity or two directions he could go with this. Cause I'm imagining myself at his age, right? And if I hear that, all that does is give me a boner. It just gets me really psyched. Well, that's what I'm looking for. Like fuck yeah, like what? I'm looking to separate that, right? I'm looking to separate that right there is I'm looking to see like that type of push either pushes someone like you to the next level or it scares the fuck out of somebody who's weak. I push pushes you to push. I was in that, I was in that position. I had, I gave Mark Mastroff, who was the founder of 24 Fitness, a tour of the gym as a 18 or 19 year old kid. And bass, and this was- I didn't know that, you didn't tell me that. Oh yeah, he, so he came in to my club. Was he just happened to be touring that day? No, so he was with, with John, who was the VP at the time. That's right, I remember. And he came around and John was taking him to his clubs and he says, I want you to meet this kid. Cause at the time I was, I was doing numbers nobody had ever seen before. So- Okay, now you've been there for a little bit. How long- I was an AGM, maybe only a few months or a couple months. So you're still green. But I was blowing, I mean, I was, like I said, I was hitting 40, 50,000 in commissionable revenue. And, you know, before that the records were set at like 27, you know, 25. So nobody ever seen that before. So he walks in and, and he's like, and they're everybody's like, oh, Mastroff's here, everybody's freaking out, right? Cause he's the founder. And then they come up and they're like, hey, he wants you to give him a tour. He wants to see what you're doing because he wants to know why you're doing so well. So I'm like, fuck yeah. So I literally, I remember like, like it was yesterday when they told me that like the hair stood up on its end. But not because I was nervous- You're excited. Like I was like a dog looking to like fight. Like, let's do this. So I took him on a tour. I did my whole thing, which, which back then nobody had done before, but I was, I was selling fitness before the membership. I was selling personal training, I was selling results and all that stuff. And I came up and I sat down with him, did the whole presentation. He gave me a couple of objections, you know, try and see how I would overcome them. I overcame them. And he goes, if everybody did what you did, he goes, we would, he would be three times the company in terms of revenue. So I said, that's awesome. I said, when are you gonna make me a manager? And he said, oh, you know, you got some time. You know, it's gonna take some time. You're young, this and that. I said, I am outperforming everybody that you have. I want that opportunity. And he said, you'll get it. He said, just be patient. I said, okay. I'm gonna make it so ridiculously obvious that you need to promote me, that you'll be embarrassed not to. I mean, those are the words that I said to a great man. And he left and that's what I ended up doing. But, you know, like you're talking about withdrawal, like that's a situation that sometimes you're in life where you're shown an opportunity like either you sink or you crush. And most people decide to sink because it's scary. But every once in a while, you get those people who are like ready to destroy and it's kind of like the fallback for, you know, like you get into a real pressure situation like that. And it's real easy to pull back. Really easy to pull back. It's a totally different operating system when you decide to face and you decide to perform and do it on command. Oh yeah, it's uncomfortable. Very uncomfortable. But it's exciting. But you're right. Dude, the hairs in the back of your neck stand up. You know, you just, you get into this zone and your eyes get focused. You know, everything tenses up. Like I was in that same experience not too long ago. So. Oh, it's great, isn't it? It's great. I was like, I felt like I was back in the arena. You're alive. Oh, back in the arena. Damn it. I love that shit. You learn to seek that as you get older. When you're younger, you tend to avoid it, right? You avoid. And I think that's what, you know, the slight millennial jab I just had was it's, I think that is a lot of what it is. Is I think right now at a young age, they still are trying to avoid those situations. I think most of them. And when I say them, I'm like, I'm not talking about people listening to this podcast because it's already been shown that if you're a podcast listener, you're already above the average person, right? As far as. Scientific studies have shown. Yeah. That way you're a smarter person. This is all the fault of the helicopter parents. Boom, I said it. Yeah. Hey, let your kids figure shit out. I'll tell you what, I'll tell you what right now. If you're a young, you know, 20 year old something, you know, 20 something year old, the opportunities for you today are better, better. Don't listen to the statistics where they say, oh, the workforce is harder and this and that and that. Bullshit. You have technology right fucking now where you can create your job tomorrow with less money than ever, than ever. I have met, because of this podcast, I have met several self-made millionaires that did nothing but use YouTube, social media, Instagram, that kind of shit. And it cost them almost nothing to do. That did not exist 15 years ago. The opportunity is insanely there. If you have that fire inside you, don't go get a job, go make a job, make that shit happen. It's right there for the taking right now. I think the other hard challenge they have is learning to separate too, like the things that they love to do and that's fun, that's, you know, their passion versus the stuff that you need to do and you have to do, right? Like one of my favorite quotes is, you know, we do the things that we have to do now so we can do the things we wanna do later. And you know, there's no doubt, I know he's passionate about making videos. I'll give you an example. So like we're sitting there having breakfast and I pull out my green juice from Organifi and I stir it up and like, he has no idea what that is. And I'm like, wait a second, you work for us. You don't know anything about Organifi. Like you need to understand that you may be really good about making these videos and making cool stuff, but you need to know anything and everything that we're into. And there's a ton of shit that you guys haven't been a part of for two and a half years. You gotta know the message that Mind Pump has been about for so long. You gotta know what would it take for us to partner with a company like this, especially since- Yeah, the decision-making process that even gets to that. Right, we've been a company that's came out and bashed supplements for such a long time and we have finally- Yeah, like why are we working with this company? Right, and then how can you translate this into videos and make it entertaining for people while still staying true to our message and our, this is what we've had a hard time with. We've hired two different companies that do what he does. And we've had to fire them because it's like, they can't, they don't understand- They go based off some old formula. Right, well they look at- It doesn't work for us. They look at what is that beach body and like all these companies out there that are huge on the internet that are making millions of dollars, but it's hard when- Their message is dinosaur. Right, well not as a dinosaur. It's actually, I mean, it's dinosaur is, I don't know if dinosaurs are right workers. I feel like what they're doing is working and many people that are modeling after that is working too. It's more like- It's current, let's say. It's not forward thinking. Well, it's the wrong message. It's what we're, it's what's click baity, right? It's what is gonna draw attention to then try and market and sell them. The key is to understand those methods and utilize them with our message, which is one of integrity, which is one of real good fitness advice that helps people for reals that doesn't just, isn't just bullshit, but it's legit. Like, that's what's sorely missing and we got to fight fire with fire, so we're gonna use some of those techniques, but we're not gonna sell bullshit, you know what I mean? That's one thing that we talked about from day one. And so, I mean, I can't wait till we're doing what they're doing, but way better because of our message. Well, and that's what I was trying to get across to him is like, I was like, you need to know this. I can't hold your hand through this conversation. You should be asking me like, what was it that made us partner with this company? Like, what did you guys like so much about them and what are they doing so different that you said no to all these other companies, but all of a sudden that you're working with this company? Like, you need to be prompting those questions from me so that I can then give you those answers and then you can think creatively to create these videos. You know what, let's give them some green juice, give them the things. No, I did. Have them use it. Yeah, no, I did. Because I was making it for myself and so I let him taste it and some of that and I told him I was showing him what it well was and I flipped it around and was kind of teaching him everything. I thought I'd never say this, but I actually enjoy using a green powder. I never thought I would say that. I don't replace vegetables with it, by the way. I'm not in that camp, but I actually enjoy using it. That's what I think it's, someone asked, I've been getting actually a lot because I posted on my Insta story and they're like, oh, how often are you taking this? And it's like, well, I don't have a, I take this four times a week or I take this every day at this time. I evaluate my diet, right? So in a perfect world, I'm not taking this. Like in a perfect world, I'm getting four to six good-sized servings of vegetables a day, but in reality, I fucking know I can't always do that. And so I'll look at like the previous day, if I go like, oh, shit, I only got like two servings yesterday and I'm heading into this day and oh, look, I already missed it in one meal already. I'm gonna take that because I already know that I'm behind from the, so that's how I use it. So sometimes in a week, I could use it four times, maybe one time another week and then maybe seven times another week. And when we're traveling and we're doing things, I'm not being able to get to my meals like I normally would. Yeah, I even drink a lot of water in, every now and then I get this sort of craving for some juice or soda or something like that. So I've actually ended up using the green juice in replacement of that. So something like I would normally do where I'm casual about it, I'm hanging out. And that's something that I can drink that's a little bit different. No, that's smart. So I used to do this all the time when I was getting ready for shows and I was competing and obviously I can't have things that are, you know. Oh, I could see a big, I could definitely see a big. Oh yeah, no, for sure. I mean, not only am I feeling my body with stuff that it needs and is good for, but it's also. What is like six calories per serving? Yeah, it's like, and then if you blend it on ice, it's got a little, so, I mean, that's how you use it there, Justin. That's definitely how I use it during competing time because this is how I get this like, okay, it satisfies this craving. And to be honest, to be totally transparent, like I used to use a lot of times like BCAAs, and stuff like that, which has got the bullshit flavoring and stuff like that. It's just because you want that taste. Yeah, just because I want some. You still wanted the Diet Coke story now and then too. Right, right, so, but this is a much better alternative to that, that doesn't have all that crap in it, so. So you got it, so Justin, I want you to tell Adam that story that you told me out there. You want me to tell it? Dude, I know you're tormented. I'm a little tormented just because. But it's life, dude. It's what you have to do sometimes. It's life, dude, this is like, this was intense. This was an intense thing I had to go through, but. He had trouble telling me the story. Well, only because, nah, I'm all ears. Well, I didn't want to like come across certain ways. You know, on the podcast, we have to kind of think about things at a time, like what people's reaction may be to, you know. Life, we kind of do that. You know what I mean? Like kind of, yeah, but I don't know. Doug would probably disagree. I'm totally okay with talking about stuff and this is part of life, right? So, I haven't even brought up the chickens in a really long time. Yeah, what's going on with them? Did you eat them? No, listen, let me tell my damn story. You know, I suck at telling stories. You guys fucking jack me every time. Yeah, sorry. So basically, okay, like I have how many now? I have probably like six or, no, I have eight because we just added two. Dang, you have a lot of chickens. We got a lot. And we just got these two that two months ago, Courtney decided, oh, we need, cause they're not really producing. They're still having a really hard time producing eggs. And we were trying to figure it out. Not making them feel comfortable, dude. Dude, we ended up getting like two eggs for them to be moms and, you know, kind of deal with that whole thing that they had going on. And, you know, they grew up and now we have those other two, but they're still like this dysfunction amongst the group, right? And, you took care of that. Yeah, yeah, well, we'll get to all this. But basically, like, so there's one, there's one chicken that just, just dominates, right? And so there's like the two new ones are the sweetest little chickens, like ever. Like one of them comes up to me, I like pet it and stuff. And like my youngest son, that's like his little buddy, you know, and it's the cutest little chicken. Anyways, all these other ones are assholes. So they act like little dogs, the cute ones. Yeah, the cute ones, you know, and we just introduced them to the group and like it took them forever to accept them because they're assholes. Right. I don't know, chickens were such fuckers. Oh yeah, for sure. Dude, chicken fuckers. You got to massage their feet, dude. Massage their feet. Yeah, that's all, get them to settle down and have more eggs. We used to do that all the time. Are you serious? I should consult you. Anyways, I should have consulted you. Anyway, basically, so there's this one fucking, there's this one chicken. And it's a big one, right? Big, the biggest of the big, right? It eats all the food, pecks the fuck out of everybody else. Like it almost left like one of the smaller ones, the sweet one, like dead. Like it just like pecked the hell out of it, ripped out all its feathers. Oh fuck. I mean, it was like, I was like, oh, this asshole, you know. And Courtney was just like, you know, at a loss because in the mornings, every morning it crows just like a rooster. It's just like super loud and obnoxious, six a.m. This has been happening for the last couple of weeks. And like, I know our neighbors do not like us. This thing is just obnoxious. It's like just going after everybody. It's like hoarding all the food. Bro, what did you do? Just listen. This is all part of the story. See how engaged he is though? Yeah. So you obviously had to practice this story like three times. No, no, no, bro, I'm just getting better. So I take this chicken, right? It's the spotted chicken. I just have to be clear about all this stuff. I took him, her, and I walked away from the coop. And I'm petting it nicely. But you had to do research, right? To figure out how to. I did have to do research. Yeah, I did. So anyway, yeah, I mean the climax is I had to take care of it, right? I had to take care of this problem. So Courtney and I kind of decided, she actually was like thinking about it herself. She was like, oh my God, like this thing, it's like it's taking over everything. Like we got to do something about it. So I just can't do it. And she just was all like distraught about it and asked me to take care of it. And I was like, okay, you know, like this is something that I have to do. And so I went on YouTube. I'm looking up some different techniques, you know, the most humane, you know, or the most like the quickest way to do it. What are you looking up for? What? Take care of what? To kill it. Oh, to kill it. To kill it, yeah. Oh, shit. Tell me the truth. Well, he's speaking in fucking parables here. I can't put it together, man. I didn't want you to yet. Oh, you killed it. And then it'd be the end of the story. He's like the mafia. What happened to Johnny? I took care of him. I took care of him. You see, I took care of him. Like you jerk it off. What do you do? I did over here. What's going on? I mean, I definitely did something to its neck. So you came up, you came over. You had to kill it. Yeah. So I took it out, you know, away from the group and I was like, you know, I want to, like, I love animals, dude. And so I'm just petting it. And I'm just like, you know, I want to make sure that it, like, it knows. Like, I'm like, dude, you know, this has to happen. You know, I was petting it. It was looking at me a certain way. And so I grabbed it by the neck and, you know, I did this technique. And so, you know, I kind of swung it and then, you know, snapped its neck. And, you know, and then it got crazy. It's still alive for a minute. So, yeah. So, yeah. So what was it doing, like fighting? It'll run around like crazy. Well, it's just, it's this whole head kind of filled down, you know. And then, like, and then it's whole, it was like trying to kind of move and the pet is coming out. Yeah. And then I was, yeah. And then I was like, you know, put it down and try to let it all kind of resolve. And then it looked like it resolved. And I'm like, oh, man, okay. And I went to go get it, you know, because, and then it, the body like resurrected. And then it just, you know, jumped like and went right back towards the coop. And then, like, these other two chickens came out of nowhere, like the younger ones. And they like, it was in the corn. I was kind of watching it. I was right next to this, the stair. And like these other two chickens came right over and started pecking the shit out of it and like trying to like get into the action. Bro, they saw. Like piranis. And these are the two that love Justin. I can't believe you didn't consult me on any of this stuff. I know that this is what I did, bro. I honestly, bro, I didn't even think about that. Yeah. I mean, I would have watched you through exactly how to do all this. But what you should have done is you actually should have broke its neck in front of everybody else. All the rest of the rest of them. All the rest of them that they knew. You should have said, yeah, set the precedence right there. Who's boss? I thought about that. Right there. I kind of had that as I was holding it in my arms and walking it away from them. Just like, I kind of looked them all in the eyes. Just listen. This is, you know. This is why you're looking at all of them. It's kind of the reality. The funny, the crazy part to me is that the two little sweet chickens saw the big one that's fucking going down. And they're like, yeah, you know what I mean? Almost as if they planned the whole thing. Like they were sweet to Justin as kids. Wow, I didn't think of that. They totally. You're making connections. Was this just at the other day? This is yesterday. Oh, this all happened to you yesterday. So let me ask you. So I know you're an animal lover for sure. Definitely. Have you ever been hunting? You know what? I've been hunting, but I haven't actually killed anything. So it's OK. So you had to do this with your bare hands. How do you do that? What happens? I had to really kind of summon this other operating system. I just like, I'm like, look, this has to be done. I have to do this in a certain way. Did you feel like a caveman all the time? Yeah. So I just like, it brought back this real weird like primal button. You know what I mean? Like it just happened. The first time you do that shit, it is real. It's very real. Most people have a hard time. I know I struggle with that stuff working. I mean, you had to get used to it really quick. How do they kill chickens normally? Oh, dude, we don't want to go down this route. That's not good. Yeah, yeah. No, I have some. I mean, when you get into some stories like that, we'll talk off air of some of the shit that I had to do and go through working on a ranch. There was some gruesome shit. And you and your friend, you gave it to your friend, right? Yeah, gave it to your friend. She's made a nice stew out of it. The way I look at it is like, because I want to, I have never been hunting. I've never killed an animal before. I love animals, but I also eat animal. I eat meat all the time. And I want to go hunting so bad, but it's not because I want to hunt. It's because I feel like a massive hypocrite because I eat meat, but I've never killed it before. And so. Well, that's what a lot of vegetarians will tell you where they'll say, like, you should go out and do that. And if you still feel fine and OK with it. That's what I want to do. That's where I, that was literally going through my head. Like, I felt like connected to, you know, because we had meat that night, too. And I'm just like, OK, you know, like this is like, the reality of what it takes to produce your food and on my table, like I have to know, you know, I've got to be a part of that. And I still felt like this is life. Like this life takes life to survive. So, you know, this is this is one of those things. I didn't eat chicken for a couple of weeks after the first experience for me. But mine was really gruesome compared to that. Oh, yeah. So I, because I, we actually. Yeah, I didn't want to cut its neck. We raised them. We raised them, killed them, plucked them, boiled them, did all that. Like I did like from start to finish, like every for every process of that, right? And the first time we had to do that, it was like. Just because it was one of the sweeter ones. I had a real hard time. Well, and I spent hours, hours of doing that one day, you know what I'm saying? Like my first day of doing that was like, all day, all I'm doing is slitting throats and like to, and then working with them for like four hours. And then like later that night, like chicken didn't sound very good that day. Well, it took me about a week or so before. It's this, it's this part of us as humans that we are completely disconnected from. I mean, the only time you see meat, you only time you see meat in modern societies is at the grocery store and it's covered in plastic in a container. And it's a cut of meat. Like you don't realize. And so I've had this, this thought so many times because I do have a lot of empathies for vegans who do it for moral reasons. I've said it so many times on the podcast and part of me is like, look, I need to go kill an animal and eat what I kill. Otherwise I feel like a massive hypocrite. Cause one of two things going to happen. I'm going to kill the animal and then become a vegan. Cause if I have a big problem with it, that's what I'm going to do. Or I kill it, realize what's going on and don't become a vegan, but I was. I could see you going that direction. Going vegan. You think so? Out of the three of us in this room, I think you're the most likely to do that. Maybe. Who knows? I don't know because I've never, you know, I've never done it. The closest I've ever come was when I went to Sicily as a 12, was I 12? 12 years old. And we went to my cousin had just eloped with this dude who was from like the hills of Sicily. So they're like old school Sicilian, like you drive up and they've got, you know, suspenders on and a rifle and they've got animals and, you know, like old school Sicilian people. And we walk into this barn where we were all going to have this big dinner later on that night. And there's a, I'm 12, so I have no idea what the fuck's going on. And there's just like little, like lamb, you know, tied up in the corner. So I'm like, oh, they have a pet. It's so cute. So I played with the lamb. I'm over there playing with it and you know, doing the whole thing and fuck dude. Next thing I know, like two hours later, here comes my uncle and my dad and all these guys and they've got the knife and they're like, hey, you want to watch this kill the, you know, this is what we're going to have tonight for dinner. And I'm like, oh fuck. But I'm 12 and you know, at 12 as a boy, you're trying to become a man, right? So if I was like 10, I would have been like, no, and I would have ran away. But I'm 12, so I'm like, okay, I have to stay here and watch this whole thing. And I did and I watched the whole thing and it disturbed me, but then I ate the meat and I was okay. So I think I'll be okay hunting too. I told you guys for my best friend who got married this was last year, year before, right? I had to go, that was part of my duties as a best man. Him and I had to go slaughter a pig. What? Yeah, dude. What kind of a wedding? Yeah, that's a lot more involved. Yeah, it's a mom. That's part of the tradition. And then from that, you literally slaughter it and then we go and clean it all, like all the brothers and all the family get together and that's all part of the wedding process. They got it. Yeah. Oh my gosh. And then you prepare it and then for the wedding dinner and I was like, dad, that's part of the wedding dinner. See, I've gutted animals before, my grandpa would put up a deer and I'd help him clean it out and all that stuff. And I've done that with fish countless times. This is the first time, with a live animal where I'm just like, okay. When you take the life like that and that close with your bare hands, it's a different thing. It's a part of us in my hand. Because I've done all of it, right? So I've done, not all of it, but I've done a lot of that, right? Being, growing up on a farm, been around a lot of stuff with that and I've even hunted. And there's a difference in shooting something from a distance and falling down and then you're dragging it home and then having to do stuff versus with your bare hands having to take the life. Up close and personal. I'm wondering why the bird's not coming. Save us. Say listen, bird, you're cool. Just be cool, right? This Quas brought to you by OrganiFi. For those days you fall short on getting your organic veggies or whole food nutrition, OrganiFi fills the gap with laboratory tested certified organic superfoods to help give your health and performance the added edge. Try OrganiFi, totally risk free for 60 days by going to OrganiFi.com. That's O-R-G-A-N-I-F-I.com and use a coupon code MINEPOMP for 20% off at checkout. All right, our first question is from Jacob Emery24. You mentioned protein cycling and cycling other supplements such as creatine. How often and how long should you cycle these and other supplements? That's a great question. I don't think there's a good specific answer. I really don't. Well, they're varied. I can tell you what I do with protein cycling. I have anywhere between two to maybe six days out of the month. So either once a week, once or twice a week or sometimes once every other week, okay? So it depends on what's happening with my life at the time. But I will have a low protein day or even just a low calorie day. In fact, when me and Adam were in LA, I don't think I ate more than 1200 calories each day. We ate almost, we barely ever ate. And when I do that, I actually feel phenomenal. Not during, well, I'm doing it during it. I don't really necessarily notice anything. But when I come back and then eat normally, I seem to get this boost that I wouldn't have gotten had I not done that in terms of performance or whatever. And so that's one of the reasons why I do it. The other reason why I do it is going low on protein or fasting, where you don't have any protein, that's one of the reasons why you accelerate or promote apoptosis of sales, which is the program cell death. So it's the lack of carbohydrates and the lack of protein that actually promote that. Now, fat will inhibit some of it, but you can have just fat and low calories and not have protein or carbohydrates. And you'll still do this. In fact, Dr. Volta Longo is, his fasting mimicking diet is similar to that. I know I'm butchering it, but it's similar to what I'm talking about. As far as creatine is concerned, I used to take creatine every day, day in and day out. For years, you said, right? Since I was 16. Whoa, wow, that consistent with that. Yeah. So I've been taking creatine for a very, very long time. Luckily it's been proven to be safe. Oh man. I know that would suck if some shit came out. But I do take, I only take creatine on my hard workout days now. So now I take it probably three days a week and that's pretty much it. So I guess that counts as cycling. I don't, I should probably go completely off for a couple of weeks, but I think it's a good idea to do all supplements that way and the way I judge it with supplements, because there are some supplements that I'll take that I notice somewhat of a benefit is I'll take them until I notice I don't get that benefit that much anymore. And then rather than taking more, I stop. So coffee is an example, coffee, caffeine. I get a great benefit from it. I feel great, I feel motivated. I get lots of ideas. I'm on fire. When I start to notice that I drink the caffeine and don't get really that much of it and it just kind of makes me feel normal. That's when I start to cycle out of it and then kind of repeat the cycle. So. Well, I like that you said that because you're right. I think it's almost impossible to give like a protocol for this because of the individual variance of not only the individual variance of everybody's body types and genetic makeup, but even their routines and their habits and the foods that they naturally gravitate would completely change how I would recommend this. For example, when we talk about creatine, not that long ago, I just started, it was maybe two, three weeks ago now or I don't know when this comes out. So it's only been a little small while that I've been taking creatine again. And part of the only reasons why I did that, one, it's been a long time since I've taken creatine and I've been meaning to get around to like, oh, let's see if I throw it in and see if I notice a little difference, right? The other reason that really sparked me to do it was that I had reduced my red meat intake significantly. And that's the main source that we, where we can find creatine naturally, right? So when you eat a steak, you get some creatine in there. And it's not quite the amount that you would get in a supplement serving, but if you're somebody like me who eats red meat a lot, I'm getting quite a bit of natural creatine in my diet. And because I haven't been eating nearly as much, I thought, okay, well, this will be a good time to do it because if I ever was gonna see a boost from supplementing for it, it would be when I'm lacking it in my diet. So, and the same thing would go true for things like protein. Like the people that I think in my opinion are gonna benefit the most from cycling off protein or having a protein-free day like Sal does, are the people that over-consume it. So if you're somebody who consumes 200 grams, 300 grams of protein pretty consistently, those guys and girls are gonna see probably the most benefit for cycling off of it once every other week where you have a day where you pretty much don't have any or have very, very minimal. So that's how I would recommend if you're somebody who is oversaturating yourself with a protein, I would cycle off of it pretty frequently. Like if you're a high protein intake person, 200 grams plus for a normal body weight, I would be telling you, okay, once a week, kind of like what Ben Polkowski recommends. That's what he said, right? Once a week. That was the goal that I used to aim for. But I also think if you're someone like me, where right now I'm struggling to hit my protein targets, although I still think it's beneficial, I think it's less beneficial for me who's already struggling to get enough protein in on a regular basis, then the guy or girl who is over-consuming a lot. So just keep that in mind. Did you notice anything, by the way, from the creatine? Because you said you hadn't taken it for a while. I am digging it right now. I'm feeling good. My workouts- Stronger, right? Yeah, stronger and going longer. My stamina and my workouts, I mean, that's really what it does, right? I mean, we're replenishing our- Stronger and going longer. That's the best- That's the best creatine commercial of all time. Yeah, I was gravitating to that. It's one of the few supplements you can take and notice. You know what I mean? Where you take it and it's within five days, you're like, oh shit, I can tell. Oh yeah, I know. Because we were not sponsored by a creatine company and Organifi doesn't supply creatine, I had to go buy it, right? And I asked the guy, I'm like, hey, I want to get creatine. I just want the pill form. Which ones you got? He's like, oh, we got these right here. He's like, take that one. And I'm like, oh, what's- Come on, create 5,000. Why is this one? He's like, well, that one has creatine and ATP. And I'm like, boom. I was like so confused. My drop. What do you mean? He's like, yeah, yeah, no, you got to get that one. That's the newest one that has creatine and ATP. And I'm like, okay, that doesn't make sense to me. Fucking creatine is what's getting converted over into ATP. But I understand how you're putting that in powder form for me to consume. And I try to get him to explain it to me and I'll just, never mind. I'll just, I'll go home. You know, it's funny about that. I'll go home and look it up myself. That's another way it works. So yeah, you can buy a Dinosign. But your body doesn't- Your body's with it? No, you destroy it. It doesn't do any, it's- So it's like- It's like leptin. It's like when people take leptin, the same thing. Yeah, it doesn't work. It's like, here's a good example. If you want to boost nitric oxide, okay. Arganine is one, basically the closest step to converting to nitric oxide. However, citrulline, which gets converted to arganine, which then gets converted to nitric oxide, does a much better job of boosting nitric oxide than arganine does. Even those are an extra step. And that's because it doesn't get destroyed by the body like arganine does. So yeah, I love seeing these supplements like pure ATP. It's like, why would I even take creatine then? I'll just take that shit and just be like- Oh, that's why I was so confused. But I'm like, this is hilarious. They're now doing this with creatine. I didn't even know that this was a thing until, because I hadn't bought creatine in a long time. It has molecules. And I'm like, that's kind of like powerful. He's like telling me and I'm like, oh, I shouldn't have asked. Why did I do that? That's literally what they say, right? Totally. Why should I take this creatine? Oh, it's got enzymes. It's chemical explosion. No, no, no, electrolytes. That's the one that we're going to say. It's the catalyst for electro stimulation. It catalyzes animalism. You know, I mean, a little bit of an off topic, but it is along these lines. I mean, this is what the industry does, is we take a little bit of information that we know is true. We know that creatine helps replenish your ATP-ATP molecules, right? So with that, what if we put ATP in with the creatine? Boom! And so- Anybody start of the combo. Right, so then if somebody who is an average consumer who may have read a couple magazine articles or a study, you might look at that and go like, oh, shit, this shit's on your regular creatine because I'm getting the ATP with my creatine. Yeah. Some of the supplements out there crack me up like deer antler velvet. Like, how are they harvesting this? Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Nobody thinks about that. There's a whole bunch of deer, and there's people just picking up the velvet. What is it? The white tree bark that's blessed by monks that you always say? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Or, you know- Do they put some kind of like urine, you know, like for like testosterone? There is a urine one. Right? What is that? Bullfrog urine. Oh my God. It has to be some weird, right? It does. Then people will buy it. Yeah, yeah. People won't buy it if it's like- Yeah, if I said, hey, I piston this, this is gonna help you. It can't be like, it's not gonna be going on testosterone. If you drink this, you're gonna get results. It can't be like golden retriever urine. We'd be like, eh, that's not that exotic. Right, yeah. You know, African frog snake piss or some weird shit like that. Oh my God. Wow. I've never heard of an African frog snake. That's like from ancient Greece. That's crazy. You guys know what- Mythical creature. You guys know horny goatweed, right? There's a supplement. So horny goatweed actually has something in it that does prevent the enzyme that degrades nitric oxide from doing what it does. So you do get better boners with horny goatweed. Do you guys know why it's named horny goatweed? No. Well, I'm sure the goats were banging stuff, right? Yeah. So like herders noticed, this is the legend, noticed that their goats were just like fucking like- She was raging. Like crazy. And they deduced that, oh, it's cause they're eating these things. So then they picked them and then they made their own teas and whatever. This is a long time. It's an old supplement. Oh my God. Is that an old wise tale too? No, that's- Or is it a crazy goat? So they have something to eat to it? No, that's literally why it's called horny goatweed. Wow. You know what I mean? It's cool because it's got my three favorite things. There you go, ladies and gentlemen. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's your knowledge bomb of the day moving along, Douglas. Quick commercial break. Hey, people ask us all the time how they can support Mind Pump. Here's what you can do. You can go to www.brain.fm. forward slash mind pump and get 20% off brain FM for meditation or focus. You can also go to audibletrial.com forward slash mind pump and get a 30-day trial plus one free audio book. Lastly, you can go to getnatureblend.com forward slash mind pump and you will get a discount on Ben Greenfield's CBD product. Brunk writer 3-4-4-5 can't eat vegetables. The thought of putting something green in his mouth repulses him. Both the taste and the texture. Hold on. How old is this guy? Stop. Just keep going. He's like, yeah. So putting something on them or cooking them just doesn't do it. The only way is to blend with a bunch of fruit and almond milk. Is this a sustainable way to get nutrition or is he missing out on blending? You want it in a sippy cup? Yeah, just just. You're a dick. You know what? This is actually more common than you would think, actually. But you know what pisses me off about this question? What? I'll tell you what pisses me off. Vegetables is a big category. So like, can't eat vegetables. He's made up his mind. I'm not going to eat vegetables. Like, that's the number one thing. But let's just say you do genuinely, you don't have an allergy to them and you don't have some psychological blockage. Because that could be very true, too. Like, you could psychologically be so repulsed that the folks want to vomit. I'm going to go down that direction. So if you finish your statement here, because I'm going to defend this poor guy after you guys mutilate him. No, I'm not going to mutilate him. So I have a story that is kind of related to this that I've experienced recently. So I don't make any, it's not a mystery that I don't like the taste of alcohol. I just simply don't. I don't enjoy alcohol at all. If I do drink, it's because I plan on getting buzzed or drunk. So it's not like I'm enjoying the alcohol. And if I want to enjoy the taste of alcohol, it's usually mixed with some kind of colorful foodie, something. Yeah, I'm going to get something that Adam and Jess are going to make fun of me over, which has always happened. Well, you never do that. But this whole time, I'm Italian. My family, they love wine. And my ex-wife's family used to drink wine all the time. And my girlfriend, she enjoys whiskey, believe it or not. And sometimes she likes red wine. And so she's telling me, we're having this conversation. I'm like, I just don't like the fucking taste. Like I don't like the taste. And she's like, you have to be mindful of it. You have to smell it and start to appreciate the flavor, not necessarily like the flavor, but just appreciate and really be mindful of it. So I actually have been having a shot glass worth of wine every night for the past maybe three nights, just a shot glass worth, because I'm not trying to drink a lot of alcohol, but because I'm trying to do this, and I'm approaching it with the mentality of, I want to see where I can take my mind with this. Not necessarily because I want to drink wine, but because a lot of people like wine. There's a reason why a lot of people like wine, right? So let me see what I can do with this. So she pours me just a shot glass worth, and it takes me, no joke, we'll sit outside for an hour and a half and we'll have conversation. That's how long it takes me to drink this. Cause what I do is I smell it, I stick my nose in the glass and I smell it and smell it and smell it. Then I taste a tiny bit, let it sit in my mouth. And I'm really trying to understand the flavor and appreciate it. And something interesting happened, something snapped after like the second or third night. I recognized like it reminded me a little bit of vinegar. And I don't mean cause it's bad wine, but you know, if you leave wine out too long, it does turn into that, right? And there's some, somebody who's a big wine connoisseur who's listening right now, they're like, bro, you're drinking shit wine. No, no, no, no, no, no. What I mean is it's like, I don't know, I could kind of understand now why people appreciate it a little bit. And I do like things that- Well, you drink kombucha, right? Exactly. So I'm realizing that part of the reason why I don't like wine isn't because I don't like wine necessarily. It's because I decided I didn't like wine. A long time ago, when I was a kid. You put that in your head and it's always been your go-to. Totally. And so now, believe it or not, I'm starting to appreciate a little bit. And I think if I keep up with it, I'll probably start to enjoy the taste. Now my girlfriend has had a similar experience with vegetables. She grew up in a family that ate no vegetables ever. She'd never ate vegetables at all until her 20s. And she said she did the same thing where just the smell of vegetables or the side of it made her gag, but then she started really getting into health and wellness. So she started doing what I did with the wine. And she said after doing that, after a few months, there were certain vegetables that she started to enjoy eating. And now, me and her, vegetables is one of our favorite parts of our meals. Now I grew up with vegetables, so it's not a big deal, but she is a huge vegetable lover. Well, she'll eat it and enjoy the taste. So that would be some advice I'd give you in terms of trying to eat them. Well, before you go, the reason why I'm so hard on him is because of the fact that, you know, as I was raised, that was like, I hated them. I hated vegetables because, and I figured out, once I moved out of the house, or not even moved out of the house, I think once I was like in junior high or high school, it's like I started to go out and go to my friend's houses and taste, you know, how they prepared them. And that was like game changer. It was like, it was getting microwaved, you know, it was like butter all over it. So the go-to for like my parents was like, you will eat this and so we'll make it more tasty by putting like velvety cheese on it and like, you know, like butter and like all these things. And they made it more soggy, more disgusting, and it just like, it was terrible. So, you know, when I actually had a little bit of like a crunch to it and, you know, I was able to really kind of taste how it should taste with like light, you know, oil on it or like it was, it had some garlic or it had, you know, something that, you know, all in the preparation of it, it changed everything. So. Well, I had a similar relationship with them as Jessica did, and that's where I was going to defend this guy or girl, whoever, I don't know if this guy or girl defend them about this is because, you know, I struggled with this for a long time and there was a couple of reasons. And I find it most common that when I have clients that struggle with eating vegetables share this similar story. Now there's exceptions to the rule, but for the most part, most people that can't stand them, hate them, all this stuff, what kind of where Sal was going is at some point in your life, like you've established this, you know, and more often than not, it's when you were a child and either one, you had a parent that forced it down your throat. And so there is this like resentment that you have to, you know, like when your parents tell you have to do something you really don't want to do it just because you're being told to. So you've built this relationship with it because you had to, now you don't want to, or you grew up in a home like mine where my parents not only didn't make us have vegetables, we rarely even had them around. And so I ate sugar and crap and all kinds of bad food. And so I never even created a palette for that. And I was eating all these foods that were artificially enhanced that caused my palate to be off. So then when I go to try and eat vegetables, they're bland and boring as fuck and just tastes like I'm eating grass. And then I get older and I get a little bit wiser and realize, okay, vegetables are important. I need to make sure I have them. But now I'm like in my early 20s and I'm a trainer now and I know I need to somewhat have them. But then I would eat them but it would be like forcing them down because I'm eating them because I know I need them but I can't enjoy them because at that time in my life I was still suffering from the demonizing of fat. And so I didn't use olive oil or salts or butter or things that can make a fricking vegetable really, really fucking good when you learn to cook with these things. So I was eating just plain ass broccoli, asparagus, green beans, I mean just with just boiled or steamed with nothing on them. So talk about a guy who already doesn't have a palate for it and their palate's all fucked up because all the crap I used to consume. Then I go to eat vegetables. Then when I'm eating the vegetables I'm steaming or boiling them only. So I was like, this is just rough for me. Now it wasn't until later on that I really start to enjoy them when I started to season them and I used salts and butters and oils and balsamic and actually could learn to prepare them a little better. And I was like, oh shit, okay, these could be a little more palatable. That really changed the game for me. But I will say this, you don't wanna beat up on yourself if this is one of the ways that you get your supplements. I think it's totally okay if you blend them up. I think we're trying to address this relationship that you have with it and talk about site. You're not losing by blending it up. You're not, I mean, if you are juicing it, different story, but if you're blending it, you're getting a lot of the benefits from it. And this is also why I highly recommend the green juice that we use from Organifi. If you're somebody who doesn't consistently like me because even though I've learned to like them more, I eat them more often. There still are days where I could go all day long and not really get any vegetables in. And so when I do that, then it becomes important that I include something like this into my diet because I'm already somebody who has to actively think about including, like Sal out of all of us is the best at this. This guy will literally come in with four cups of broccoli and he'll sit down and eat just broccoli by itself. You got a mountain. Yeah, and I've tried to, since being around him, that's something that I've taken and I've tried to do and I've definitely gotten better with it. I definitely can do that now. I've learned and Doug made this incredible dish for us one of the first times we traveled with the Brussels sprouts and walnuts and bacon. That's all we ate that night. And balsamic and then ghee butter over it. And I've shared this recipe on my Instagram before, like, man, that was a, I literally now will sit down and just eat a whole bowl of Brussels sprouts because it actually tastes phenomenal. So, you know, between trying to put that in and practice it using different things to prepare it, look up recipes. If you're just boiling or steaming it, man, that shit can get boring real fast, especially with somebody that's already struggling psychologically with them and doesn't enjoy the taste. Well, here's, there was a second part too about blending them. If he's missing out because he's blending them. I address that. Yeah, I mean, it's pretty much okay, but also keep this in mind. And I'm learning more and more about the importance of this. Chewing your food. That's part of the digestion. It is. Not only is chewing your food part of the digestion, so people, I used to think chewing the food as part of the digestion, because it's just my teeth that's- You're breaking it down. No. That's what you're thinking. It's also the saliva. Yeah, for sure. Your saliva mixes in there, and while you're chewing things, your stomach is producing things. So it's a, it's actually a big part of it. So yeah, you can totally blend them. It's totally fine. That's a great way to get them if you hate them, absolutely hate them. But chewing and eating things is the best way. I mean, is it hard for you not to feel like a parent right now though? Chew your food and eat your greens, okay? Do it. All right, next up, Nick Ford Health. On the days he uses the sauna after training, should he do his post-prime directly after his workout or after his sauna? This is a good question. I'm wondering if he's wanting to know Prime Pro or Maps Prime, because if he's priming his body for his workout- Well, it's the post-prime, meaning that, so in Maps Prime- His purification sessions. Yeah, so in Maps- So Maps Prime, so it's Prime and Prime Pro. Maps Prime teaches your body, this is for the listeners who don't have the program, it shows you how to design your priming sessions, which is a far, far better thing than a warm-up because it sets your body up. So it sets what you do before, but also- Throw away your pre-workouts and do this and stuff. Right, but it also shows, we don't talk about this much on the show, it also teaches you what you should do immediately after your workout with what we call a post-prime session. The post-prime session's job, okay, so the pre-prime session's job is to set your body up for what you're about to do by giving you a better chance to have better recruitment patterns based on your body. Yeah, you're teaching your body these movements going into the workouts. Yes, after the workout, the post-prime session is designed to solidify whatever signal that you've sent with your workout. So that's an important thing to understand because the closer it is to after your workout, the better. But here's the second reason why you shouldn't do it after a sauna. And why you shouldn't do any kind of hard training or correctional anything right after a hot sauna. Heat does depress the central nervous system. That's why when you get really tired, you get lazy and lethargic. It's just part of what he does. It's part of the benefit of what he provides. But if you're right after your sauna session, number one, you're far away from your workout or further away from your workout, so it loses some of its potency. But also, you're all hot, your CNS is kind of down-regulated a little bit and everything feels a little... Now you're gonna go try doing this post-prime session which is supposed to take advantage of the CNS that you just amped up with your workout. That is no longer there. So there's actually a big difference. You're far better off doing your post-prime session right after your workout and then do the sauna afterwards, but not doing the sauna in between. Quick commercial break, you guys. We keep getting asked all the time, how can I support the Mind Pump family? Here's one of the best ways you guys can. You guys love that Chimeric Coffee that we have. Chimeric Coffee with a K, you go to chimericcoffee.com, put in the discount code Mind Pump for 10% at the checkout. Also, you guys have not tried Ben Greenfield's new bars out. They're fantastic. If you want some, go to bengreenfieldfitness.com forward slash nature bite. Put in the code Mind Pump and get 10% off. Go check it out. DJ Pellet 85, or maybe Pelé. Thoughts on Sandbag, DJ Pellet 85. Thoughts of Sandbag training for both muscular development and fat burning. You fucking Sandbag-er. I almost sound racist. Remember when we used to say Sandbag-ers? Do you remember that? Oh, at 24. Yeah, yeah. Somebody who used to hold revenue for the next month. You know what they would do? You're a Sandbag-er. You know what they would do, Doug? So at 24 Fitness, you would have these closeouts. Okay? They wait months. There was an end of month closeout, which is when you ended all the monthly promotions. And then there was a mid-month closeout, which is when you ended some shorter promotions. And the goal was to have these massive sales days, right? So what idiots would do, and I call them idiots, because I used to look at this and be like, this makes no- Why would you not close somebody right away? And hold on to it. It makes no fucking sense. It's crazy. Well, there's other things, and we're motivated to win. Sal, Justin, this was long gone by the time Justin came in, but I remember this. Do you remember way back in the days when we actually could control when the credit card actually was charged? Oh, my God. So a strategy that some would do would be this. So let's say I max out my paycheck. So like back then, we used to get paid by percentage of override. So if you hit 110% of goal or whatever back then, you made X amount of dollars. This is so again, company rules. Yeah, this is super illegal, right? You're gonna get fired. So, and let's say- You never did this. Let's say I sold, you know, I hit a day before the end of the month and I hit my max goal. So I'm maxing out my paycheck. So you're not gonna make any more money, man. I'm not gonna make any more money, but the club still technically has about another $10,000 in revenue that people's credit cards are supposed to get ran that day. So what you would do is you would not run those credit cards that day. You would wait till the first of the month, the next day, and then you would run the $10,000 through to start them next month off really good so you're off and running. And that's sandbagging. That's real sandbagging, so. Okay, all right, all right. That is dirty. Horrible. Dirty. There's worse stuff, but okay, so say it. Yeah, we'll stop with that. Yeah, well, if we ever want a job back with anyone. Yeah, we don't, so. So sandbag training for muscular development and fat burning is excellent. One of the reasons why sandbag training is so awesome is because it is an awkward tool to hold. You can do things with sandbags that you can't do with weights and that you can't do with other tools. Just because of the nature of the sandbag itself. If you're an athlete, it's extremely valuable. If you're a grappler, a lot of your workout should be done with a sandbag. If you've got big sandbags that you could throw and lift and run with and put up on your shoulder. Think about lifting somebody up, right? Like how awkward that is. So it's very applicable to those types of sports and those interactions, you know. Because yeah, the sandbag does provide that sort of like that weight that shifts on you when you have to adjust and you have to be able to move your body accordingly. And so it's nice for training when, you know, you're in those types of sports for sure. You have a lot of experience training with sandbags, right? I do, yeah. But what are some good like great exercises? I mean, I do some cleans with them, which I always like to do. I do some lunge walks where I have it like loaded on one side specifically. Or you know, I'm carrying, I'm front loaded and I'm carrying it. Just to accommodate for the weight. Cause a lot of times when I go to tackle, you know, like and they're still trying to drive forward. Like, you know, I would have to turn and I have to keep driving. And while their weight was shifting, I had to accommodate for that. So it was very applicable for football too. I think that it, you know, since you guys said all the good things about it, I think it's not the best thing for building muscle or the best thing. It's like an accessory. Right. It's something that I think is- Yeah, for aesthetics, I don't know it would be hot. Right. And so it is not, like anything else, I don't think that there's one thing that's the best for this or best for that. Where I see it, I think the person that should use it is if you're like, these guys just named a wrestler or a football player, it has way more carryover to what they're doing. Now it does, I think for functional training, so if you're someone who's more driven functionally, which is not muscle development or fat burning, you just want to be a functional person. You don't give a shit about how lean and ripped you are and how big your muscles are. We're not thinking about fat burning throwing a sandbag right there. Well, that's exactly, and that's the question. The question is both muscular development and fat burning, and I would say, no, no it's not. It's not that great for it in comparison to a bunch of other stuff that you should probably be doing inside the gym with barbells and dumbbells. But I do think, like the guys were just saying, it's an incredible tool. It's an awesome tool that can be utilized with lots of different benefits, like the guys were just saying. I also think that it's probably one of the more functional types of things that you can do in the gym because let's be honest, in real life, how many times have you thrown a bag of dog food over your shoulder in Kerala? How many times have you grabbed a five gallon bucket of water and carried it on one side? Well, how much was that 200 pounds, that one that you picked up? Yeah, that's a great point that you said that, Justin, because so they, at the golds, you work out at the right, they have this big 200 pound sandbag. And from a muscular development perspective, and this is, by the way, this is not for the beginners or intermediate. This is if you're advanced. So if you're at the level like Adam, where he's been training a long time, he understands his body and he's developed quite a bit of muscle already and he's trying to figure out different ways to hit muscles differently in the target small areas, a sandbag can be amazing in one respect in particular, rounded back lifting. Rounded back lifting, yep. We don't talk about rounded back lifting. Now, rounded back lifting doesn't mean that my lower back is all rounded and I look like a dog taking a shit. That's not what I'm talking about. What I mean is when you're doing a lift or a dead lift or a row or whatever, very rarely are you lifting with a lot of intensity where your scapula is spread. Spread out. It's usually hugging. Yeah, so with the sandbag, you gotta lean over. Which in real life is actually more common. Oh, that's how you lift things. You lift things with the scapula. I mean, you go grab a couch or whatever. You're not sitting there with this super ridiculous posture. You gotta kind of reach around it and kind of hug it. And so when you're lifting a heavy sandbag off the floor with this rounded upper back position where your scapula spread, you will develop those muscles in different ways, differently than you would with other traditional barbell lifts. And so like, you know, for Adam, I mean, you did that for a second, right? And how did you notice? What did you notice in your back? Oh, God, I mean, I overdid it. I don't know if you guys remember, I did talk about it briefly on the show. I mean, that was, somebody had posted, first of all, picking it up, there's probably only, I don't know, maybe 10, 20 people in our gym that could even do that. 200 pound sandbag is no joke. Only Jerry, right? Yeah, I was lifting it up over five feet too. So I was lifting it up and then setting it up on a platform up about five feet, maybe a little bit higher. So that's pretty fucking brutal. I mean, it's brutal to do one of those. I was trying to get 10 out for time and I think I ended up doing 15 of them just practicing the mechanics of it. And boy was I frickin' sore. I mean, I was sore everywhere, from my low back to my hamstrings, my glutes got sore from it, my biceps having to wrap my arms around that. Oh, that's a really good point. Oh God, my biceps felt like I had one of the hardest bicep workouts I'd done in a long time. I mean, it got me, it got me, I overdid it for sure. I mean, I should have not, I mean. But it's interesting because you could have done the same volume, the same intensity with other exercises that you're used to and you wouldn't have been hammered by. Right, right, no. I mean, that definitely is an example of how unique and different it is in comparison to normal barbell dumbbell movements and then to go do something like that. It is that different from normal lifting that it got me really good. And of course, pushing at that level, that's not smart. That's not the smart trainer in me. I would never allow a client to have never done, like I had not done any real sandbag work or stonework really ever. But I'm a strong guy who's aware of mechanics and I'm pretty, I have pretty good proprioception. So I feel confident that I could pretty much look at almost any movement and exercise and perform it. I would hope I can. And so I, instead of like working my way up to that, like I should have, you know, maybe do a 50 pound bag, then a 100 pound bag, then a 150 pound bag, and then eventually get to 200. I wouldn't grab the 200 pound bag, which some guys can't even get off the damn floor. And I did it in that, you know, I paid for it for sure. I'd like to get a sandbag in here. I think it'd be good. We could show people how to use it. Yeah, no, I actually. That would be a nice YouTube series. You know, it is. And it's actually not that expensive to do. And since we just brought it up right now, if you remind me when we get out of here, I'll order one because I wanted to do that already. So I'd love to get like from 50 to a 200. So 50, 150, and then 200. And then we've got the big steps so we can even emulate kind of what you did with it. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Excellent. With that, we just talked about YouTube. We have a YouTube channel. We post a new video on it every single day, 365 days a year, 366 days on leap year. Whoa. Yeah, so basically every day it's Mind Pump TV. Go check it out, hit subscribe. We love you. Also, if you wanna ask us a question that we answer on an episode like this one, the place to do it is Instagram. The page to do it on is Mind Pump Media. Now I have a personal page. It's Mind Pump Sal. Justin is Mind Pump Justin. And Adam is Mind Pump Adam. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. 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