 All right, we're recording now. And Fletcher, I'm going to make you a co host because if I do a share screen, I can't see if anyone raises their hand. Hey everyone, welcome to the April 26 conservation commission meeting, I will be chairing tonight. So that's my comment for tonight. I'm sorry, I apologize for the apologies that are missing the last couple of meetings, but I'm back and ready to get back in the swing of things. And so Dave with that said you want to want to give us an update on all things conservation department. Can everyone hear me okay. Yes, I'm happy to give you a couple of brief updates on on things happening around town with regard to conservation. So, yeah, I mean spring spring is is here and things are growing and we're we're we're we're out there, Brad and Tyler out there beginning their work on the trails and conservation land. They've been trying to finish up. We had a lot of trees down over the winter, you know with all these flashy storms. So, at one point I would say a month ago month and a half ago they had probably 100 trees down over our trails. They've made some headway on that. There's still much to be done there so if you do see trees out there that are down around along trails please email Brad. And he will add them to the list and we'll get out there and hopefully we'll have some volunteer help as well this summer. Along those lines we we are going to be looking for an assistant land manager, Tyler is is moving on to other other career things so we will be advertising for an assistant land manager so if you know anybody out there who would like to work in the field and and work on great projects and trails and bridges and and community gardens and the list goes on. Please let us know and and direct them to the website that that posting should be up in the next day or so. 40 hours a week. 40 hours a week. Yeah, it's a it's a full time job 12 months a year fully benefited. Yeah, it's a great way for someone to, you know, get a start in the field of land conservation and conservation management, etc. So, working with Aaron myself Brad and the commission and lots of great volunteers out there. And also getting going on community gardens. As you know, the four of our farm community gardens were extremely popular last, last year, and I believe, I believe they maxed out I think they're around 60 gardeners there now. So some, some work to do. This is off of route nine in East Amherst, Southeast Amherst. And, yeah, we still have some work to do the, there's still some concerns about deer damaging the crops that folks are growing so we're working on some approaches there with healthy Hampshire. So we're also getting about 14 gardeners going at Amethyst Brook. So there'll be another 14 plots at Amethyst Brook happening in the in the next, you know, couple of weeks it's still a little early people love to get out and obviously turn the soil over and maybe get some peas in the ground or garlic, but you know tomatoes and other things. So if you're going to the New England spring you may want to wait a while on those so we're getting we're getting going. Is that as Amethyst Brook then is that maxed out 14. Um, that 14, we are going to have it's just from a staffing standpoint and and a supporting standpoint we're going to cap it at about 1415 this year, and just see how it goes. So they're also beginning to frame and I can't remember whether Aaron had talked about Pover's pond or not but we probably should put it on the agenda in the future Aaron for us to give the commission kind of maybe like a 20 minute half an hour update on some of the work that we're doing kind of behind the scenes with Pover's pond and and and we'd love to tell the commission a little bit more about our are the beginning of our work there and and get your input on that. We have hired a fuss and O'Neill right. I'm getting my consultant O'Neill to help us with some work there. And they're beginning to think about how do we create a vision for Pover's pond where the beaches are stabilized. The water is accessible the trails are are accessible to the degree possible and the dam and the dyke are are fully up to all codes and specifications at the state level and that we have a plan for dredging and the list goes on. And that's a big list that buffers as we know. So we should we should schedule a time on an agenda with the commission that's not very full and and we probably present a PowerPoint to you there and and begin to get your input. The other thing that is happening. Just on Pover's pond there has been some very busy weekends there as you probably know, with the weather I was away on vacation but while I was away I believe Amherst reach 8587 degrees and that prompted a lot of people to flock to respond on a couple of very busy days. Brad was there Tyler was there we also had the benefit of having some of the crest staff. The alternative responding responder program here in Amherst join us up at buffers and talk about kind of, you know, what's acceptable activities up there ie alcohol glass, things like that not acceptable and and we had a really good experience working with the crest team. So, you mass, we're working with with crests again and with Brad and Tyler, while Tyler is with us. Over the next couple of weekends because you mass graduates very late this year they graduate on Memorial Day weekend, which does present some problems or challenges, I should say for us at the pond if the weather spikes again in the in the area. So we'll work with the PD will work with crests and we'll work with our staff on trying to manage buffers and make sure that people have a good experience up there that it remains a family, a family, a place that families can feel safe and comfortable being and not have alcohol and other behaviors that make it not so so we're working on that. And lastly, just a couple of hickory updates and I don't know, Aaron, if you were going to give a little update I won't steal your thunder on Aaron's been doing great work out there, multiple times a week, working with the with the director dynamic, who was hired by amp and I'll let you talk about that Aaron but suffice to suffice to say that both of us are out there I spent the morning out there we actually did a cleanup around the clubhouse Brad Tyler and myself. And we did some, some, some trash cleanup and secured the clubhouse a little bit more and kind of gussied up the frontage there, along West Pomeroy Lane. We're getting going with the, you know, accessible trail there Aaron and Nate Maloy from the planning department have begun to work with our consultant to flesh out a design for the ADA trail that we got the state funding on and, and we will bring that to you as soon as we have it. That would be sometime in the next four or five weeks so probably your next meeting, we should again carve out some time to talk that through with the commission. We're under deadline to have a design by honor around June one June 10 so again that would come to you in a notice of intent, but we at least need to have a design done by the end of May. And we think that's doable. And then Aaron and I have been talking with and meeting with representatives from mass fishing and wildlife, talking about turtle habitat out there. And how we can very modestly improve the turtle habitat in the sand traps that are there. Turtles love those sand traps they've used them for the past 50 or 60 years when that was an active golf course. And interestingly enough succession is taking over on the, on the course of course as we know but it's also taking over the sand traps. So, with a little modest raking and, and line trimming weed whacking essentially, we need to keep those sand traps open and accessible without thatcher root mass. So the turtles can use them in the coming years. So, that's something we're going to be working on in the next four or five weeks with mass wildlife. So those are just kind of a smattering of some of the things we're working on around town. It's going to be a very busy May and June, and will be on June probably down a staff person so it's going to be one of the best weekend to be all over all over town we're also hiring a modest summer staff. So if you know anyone who would like to work for the department doing trail work and things of that sort. During the summer, they could apply online on the town website. So, I think I'll stop there and when do you think you'll be posting the seasonal positions. Say that again pleasure. When do you think you'll be posting the seasonal positions. I actually think it's posted now. Okay, I think they're up there now. We are flexible on that. Usually we hire three to five summer staff. And it really it could be a part time gig for somebody or it could be you know anywhere from 15 to 40 hours a week. So people just might want 20 hours or something like that. So, there is some weekend work covering the pond. But it's, it's, it's a fun job, you're going to get a little wet you're going to find some mosquitoes maybe hopefully not poison Ivy but we know it's out there. But anyone you know who might want to learn about trail maintenance and managing puffers pond. It's a fun, it's a fun summer. Thanks. I mean, just echoing Dave's comments. I've been getting out hickory between two and three times a week depending on the needs. I've signed off on the building permit to start installing the fencing. I finished the, the inspection of the install of the silt fencing that is required for the wetlands permit. The process road is completed. There are a few sort of details associated with the permit that we're waiting on mostly 100% construction drawing to be provided to us that contains all the final detail that we need. And once I get that and I think there's one or two administrative things that we need to take care of then at that point I can be signing off on the building permit. They've been very responsive and diligent about responding to my requests and asks so you know things have been going pretty well out there. I just, I know Michelle has a question Fletcher could I just add, we, we are working with with dynamic and their team on some more signage out there. We've talked to them about that they're working on it but we want to get more kind of construction related signage up there just to alert people who might be out there on a weekend when there aren't, you know machines moving back and forth things like that. But as Aaron said I would just echo that they've been very responsive and the Aaron Aaron's requests and requirements and requirements of the permit. And we hope that continues as they move through the phases of construction. So, if you all as commission members get any feedback, positive or negative please pass it along to Aaron or myself. If you'd like to know, we're also going to be working a little bit on some additional social media last, if you will, to just continue to inform people that, you know what what is happening out there, you know the trees are down the trees are moving off the site. And they'll begin to do some pile driving for the, for the arrays themselves, and then how will this proceed as we get into May, June and July. And as fencing goes up and bridge work continues things of that sort, but if you hear feedback, we'd like, you know, independently we'd love to hear that. Michelle, you got something to say. I'm curious about the maintaining that turtle habitat, because it's interesting because it's sort of artificially created this. This habitat for them is the town going to get help from us wildlife to maintain those sand pits or is it going to be on the town to sort of perpetually manage the old sand pits as turtle habitat because they're state listed right. I think given the importance of the Fort River in the Connecticut River watershed in general you know there's any time we, anytime we talk to somebody at the state level about the fort and about Hickory Ridge. There is no shortage of kind of people stepping forth. You know we've got a couple of grant proposals out as you know for culvert replacement and things of that sort. Yeah, I think the short answer is yes Michelle, the state is going to help us. What we need to do in terms of maintaining those sand traps and it's not all of them there are some that are higher priority. It's not a real heavy lift. We need to make sure that succession doesn't kind of take total hold of them and we get invasives in them or some sort of a thatched layer growing up over them because as we know nature is doing its thing out there. They just need to be probably some of them, the ones we target will be thoroughly rate and some of the, you know, if there are woody plants coming up in them, those would be, you know simply removed by hand. So it's raking some hand pulling, maybe some line trimming, but it's not a heavy lift. And Mass Wildlife is going to, they want to come out and send people to help us do it in year one, and then we would know how to do it in future years and I think once we do it once it probably wouldn't have to be done every year it could be done every three years or on a cycle. Great thanks. Probably a great, it'd be a great volunteer project to in the future, because it's fun. And a good component of the land management plan once that starts coming together. Thanks. Yeah, Mike Jones says hi Michelle. Oh, Michelle knows Mike. Mike is, I found out with my bike by Mike the other day. You found out what Ben Masie. Yeah, whether grad school folks. Okay, well hey I'll have to mention that to him too. Yeah, Mike, Mike has been so helpful and he's just, it's, there's this tremendous interest in the Fort River and our holdings and what we could do whether it's, you know, managing invasives in stream aquatic with that improvements, you know, muscles, freshwater fish, anadromous fish, it's all there and we now own, you know, both sides of what is it 1.3 miles of of former golf course so it is amazing. That's great. Yeah. Okay, we're going to move on. It's good stuff. I think the creek rage of it. Okay, land management applications. Speaking of land management. So pleasure, would it be okay if we do the update on the North Amherst historic trail first just because the folks are here for that. Yes, that's what I meant by land management updates as well. I'm just going to put my on the agenda there. So, if somebody's here from the North Amherst historic trail, you're about to get it up just give us your name and a quick update on what's going on. I'm just promoting these folks. Hey, Meg. Hi. Hi pleasure, everybody. Great. Hi. Erin, I just, and David, just before we start, I want to remind everybody that I heard about purpose upon the breakfast is happening again. This June 3rd, and there's everything the same abandoned. So spread the word. And I'm going to keep an eye out for that. Thank you so much for your time when you talk about it because I have some ideas, but I mean, just as a member of the public. Thank you for that reminder, Meg. I just was emailing somebody from Kestrel and we had talked about promoting it on our website and social media. And so yes, June, June 3rd, the morning of June 3rd, and this is the first breakfast in what about three years, I think, four years. Yep. And where will the breakfast be. It will be at Mill River Park. Okay, and it's to be right on our history trail. You want to segue. Well, Meg, why don't you tell us about the historical trail then. Okay, shall I go first? Yeah, David's starting. We have a plan. Sure. So my name is David mix Barrington I live on Pine Street. I'm a professor at UMass. I'm also the chair of the committee, which is looking into making a hill rich, no river history trail. And the general idea that we're looking at is that we would put posts at various places between North Amherst and Cushman. And these posts would have text on them. And they would have art on them drawings, some kind of video with visuals on them, and they would have QR codes. So there would be some connection to a website. We know that the conservation commission is very concerned with consistent branding of signs and posts being posts being put on the ground being coordinated with other posts in the ground and we're totally on board with that. And would want to work with that at the beginning of our planning, how that would happen. I'd like to just show you briefly where we might put them on these posts. I mean it's tentative now we'll deal with this as we go on, but we've identified right now, like 14 possible sites. And there are four of them that have been researched already. We, there was this grant from the CPA for I think $12,000 which got an arch, Eric Johnson, who is an archeologist, and Kit Curran who is an archivist, who are doing work into the background of some of these sites. And we've got lots of information about that. So if I could share screen which apparently I can do now. Let's see if we do this. And I can annotate great. So this is North Amherst. So the roads are still pretty much in the same place and so it's probably not difficult to orient it you see Cushman called the city on the right and factory hollow in the middle which is perfect pond and North Amherst village on the left. So if I can, whoops, I can annotate and make stamps of stars. Okay. So starting at the North Amherst library, which I just made a star on the North Amherst library. And in 1856 was a blacksmith shop. And when they are doing the construction just now they found lots of horseshoes from the blacksmith shop at that time. And I think mega is going to say more about what's being on there but there's already a plan to have exhibit of those some of those black horseshoes in the North Amherst library. We have this library somewhere down. Let's see what we next along here. There was a street railway. And Cindy Jones has all the records of that street railway. And could we do lots of things about that you could get all the way from here to Kennebunkport from sorry you can get all the way from here to South Carolina on street railways in 1900. And so there's that whole pre-core thing up here. This is the old mill, the puffer mill. And that would be a place where we could talk about the puffer family who built large, large parts of the North half of Amherst, including the pond and the puffer family has been done this all these things and there are major component of the history up here. And that is where the Coles and Jones family farm was, and that was been a lumber business for two centuries and a farm for most of that time, all kinds of things going on there. Down here in this river that is no longer there is the middle of the river recreation area. And we don't have an artifact a particular location there, but that would be a natural. Yes, that right. Yes, the canal that you see there is the north boundary of the mill reservation recreation area now, and you can see evidence of it as you go as you go along. So that place might be a good time to talk about Native American activities. There were lots of them. Some of them are documented. They are associated on particular places and we don't really want people to go look up any particular places that are there now, but we clearly want to have some text and picture and links about Native American activities here and that might be a good place for them. Up here. This is where the water came out of the mill river. Part of it was diverted to go to this grist mill. And most of it used to go through the grist mill when the grist mill was operating. The place here is where the diversion happens, and the Eric and Kit are looking into that place and finding more about what's there. Generally they were moving streams up and down all over the place, and things happen there. Okay, then you then along here is roughly where the existing Julius Lester trail is, and about where this corner is in the road is where there's a footbridge across here. If you cross that footbridge, you come up onto. Summer Street was now summer street before my factory street. And this is marked factory. This was a large industrial complex at that point for the time. Lots of buildings kit has maps of all of them, where they are and so forth. And so if we're going to explain what the industrial history was here, that's where it was happening. And so this neighborhood through here in the middle of the 20th century that was a Lithuanian neighborhood, where the majority of the people in that neighborhood spoke Lithuanian at home. Pete Kosolaskus who just had his 100th birthday is one of the, you know, from that neighborhood from there. And we will want we'd want to do some more oral history with him about things about that neighborhood what was going on there and put things up there. You see these factory housing. That's emblematic of factory housing. And those those buildings that little row of buildings along summer street are still there. And so what is this neighborhood like, what are those people who do they live here what do we do. Then up here is the Puffers pond dam actually it's there. And so what's the history of the dams on that location. What went as time goes on at that point. Then if you walk on State Street for example and come into Puffers pond along here where the beach is when I losing my thing. There's stars. Okay. So where I just put that star is where there was the ice house, the Puffer family had a large business to create ice. That was the main. I think one of the main purposes of building the pond there to get this ice business and the the ice house burned in the 1940s in a spectacular way that because Laska still talks about. So something like that would happen. Then you can cross the street on summer street. Then you go in on the Robert Frost trail. As you go through this is now the Kevin flood accessible trail and goes up to this roughly along along the road to this road through here is a paper mill. This is a lower Roberts paper mill up here is the upper Roberts paper mill at the lower paper mill. There were two people who were scalded to death in 1849 in industrial accidents. One of them a child. And kit has got tons of documentation. This was a big story across the nation and was reported all over the place. So we would talk about that and talk about industrial safety about this about going through this neighborhood up here at the upper mill. This is one of the most interesting remaining sites. There's more buildings that are viewable. And we'd like to like put a marker up which would indicate what did the buildings look like when they were intact and so forth. And what we what was made in Roberts and at the upper mill, what was done in that place somewhere about here is the clam club. And it's referred to in the books by late bill bill Robinson and official Holland there's a book there, talking about this place where it was the social center for working class people in the early half of the 20th century. And we don't have much documentary evidence on it, but we'd like to find more about it from oral history and put something about that. Then you come up here and you wind up in Cushman village and now you're in Cushman village. There's a series of schools here. There's right about here is where the real we're now the store Cushman market is is was a railway station and depot. We'd want to talk about that. We might be able to if up here to the north. There's not much left visible evidence like this pond is not really there. It's a long stream, but a lot of things happened and this was a huge factory at one point. And we'd like to say something about that. So that's the series of things let me hand off to somebody else ask any questions but those are the kind of places we want to mark as we would want. We're in conservation land some are not. Great. Thanks, David. Thank you. Brian. Or should I get off the screen. Sure. That'd be fine, David. Yeah, thanks. Brian, you're muted. You're muted. So I just want to before Brian starts. So this was going to be sort of like a five to 10 minute presentation and I think we're already sort of at the 12 minute mark so I just want to be conscious of thank you. Yeah, okay. So one of the things you've been doing in this project is thinking about the context of the area. So we thought about it maybe in four ways. One, there's the geophysical context, because once the glacier receded and this whole landscape appeared a glacier Lake Hitchcock had the water area watershed area there. So we think it'd be kind of nice to talk a little bit about that so we can fix this location in that historical context. Second, there's the question of the indigenous peoples and the use they made there. Dave talked a little about that. This is a interesting, Dave, maybe you'll remember. Oops, you froze. Peter, Brian is frozen. Okay, that's me in south. Brian froze, Brian you froze. But keep talking, we hear you. Maybe try shutting your camera off. Yeah, yeah. I think the problem is my wife's trying to do her district meeting upstairs. So, a lot of bandwidth. We hear you, we hear you're talking, so just talk. Okay, so that was a, there's a fabulous document on the history of Puffer's pond that goes through a lot of the stuff that we've been talking about here. One element of it has a tremendous map on Native American trails and the contact period, and it is quite obvious that the trail we were talking about was at one time either itself or very close to being an important east-west indigenous trail. So we really would like to nail that down and I'm hoping that someone, again, I'm thinking maybe Dave can remember where the information that's in that document that somebody posted it from the concom some time ago might exist. So Dave, maybe I'll follow up with you separately on that. Everybody else knows the third piece of context is really that whole industrial era. I'm not going to elaborate on it, but very intense period but also relatively brief. So we want to talk a little bit about what Amherst was like at the beginning before the water powered activity, and then what it permitted and what it enabled in the development of the town. And then finally, the context is sort of, well, what now? And interestingly, you know, we're sort of back to what it was at one time with all these artifacts and markers of past activity. But because of all the activity to preserve land in that area over a period of decades, it's got a quite different context now in sort of frozen in time in a way. It's not allowed to revert to its natural state to the extent possible, but we think that's kind of the end of the context for it. So there you go. And I'm very, very much more briefly than I thought going to talk about the connection so David, I'm experienced and talked about the actual trail and Brian talked about the context I want to say just a very few sentences about the connections that we want to make with other projects in town and other things about our town. One is the horseshoe project discovering these horseshoes coming out of the dirt when they were digging up the ground for the new addition to the North Amherst Library. And we've got those in this woman who knows a lot about horses is launching a project for want of a nail. It's about the history of the horseshoe of the blacksmith shop and what was done there and we're hoping to do an exhibit in the live new library with some of those horseshoes. Some other connections we're imagining is helping people in other parts of town being kind of an example of other parts of town that might explore their history and learn about it and others developing some for example elementary school curriculum. Kids would come and let read things. I'm just doing this really fast. We are also possibilities expanding the project of trail park further west along the river over land that send to Jones owns toward 116. It's very wet so it could be a community park it could be a dog park maybe I don't know what's available and but it's it's a huge amount of land that's available to develop. Another is because of the dynamic webs dynamic nature of a website. We can continue to develop new things for example, what else was happening in Amherst at this time or here's a poem Emily Dickinson wrote the year the man was scalded to death well maybe that's a little too grim but to do some contemporary you know what was happening at the same time in Amherst because it was a very there were the different parts of Amherst were really different downtown was the kind of elite Amherst College and Lincoln Avenue homes and then in North Amherst for these immigrant families so some kind of expanding on what some of the different the connections that we can make with that I guess that's enough for now. There's a huge amount more that we're, we've got unlimited imagination. It's, it is and it's great. You guys are. I appreciate the enthusiasm and just correct me if I'm wrong, we have already talked about like any permanent issues and things I know we've talked about the signs before. We haven't any issues with those signs correct in terms of placement area yet with placement. No, we're going to work with you on that the purpose of this is to give you an update so you know I was just trying to ask us. And we're asking you for now. Yeah, we're not yet ready to ask you anything but anything. Okay, excellent. We want you to be ready so that we're able when you are. Oh, here's another connection. John Gerber's developed this amazing trail one of the things we've always wanted is a walking trail from from the North Amherst to downtown that doesn't go along North Pleasant, and he's developed one that goes from the park all the way up to the Renaissance center and goes through the university. I appreciate that. We got to stick to the agenda here. I love the enthusiasm we could go all day and all night and I do we're all done. And then clearly we can, you guys will work with Dave and Aaron on on on like the signage, keeping it consistent all that stuff later on correct. Absolutely. And where to put it and all that. Okay. Commissioner questions and comments. Yeah, this is an awesome update. enthusiasm. Go ahead Dave. One quick thing. Two or three timeline would be great in the future Meg and David and Brian so keep us all in the loop. I think you have money for design and research but I don't think you have money for fabrication yet, but it would be great to get a timeline, and then I see three. The goals are going to be conservation commission town council if you're in the public way, you know if some of these signs need to be in the public way and then private property of course so think of the writer's walk downtown I think the writer's walk was done very well you've probably already looked at that. We need we need to have some consistency in terms of branding these will be right of course but that's that's our next step is a timeline and a budget but we haven't finished the research yet we still have a lot of time. Just wanted to put it out there and we're happy to work with you. Thank you everybody. I really do appreciate go ahead Michelle. I just like the integration of indigenous history so go for that too because you know Amherst got a lot but we don't hear about that so much. Oh yeah. Amherst has some dark, dark history. Yeah, that. All right, thank you very much. You guys. Thank you. And we'll be obviously talking soon. On to the next meeting. Right. Stargazing at Mount Pollack. Thank you very much. Bye. Bye bye. Okay, so can we will move on to Aaron you want to. Yeah, so it's Fletcher might you we can do whatever you'd like but I would suggest that we might consider jumping into the hearings and then handling the other. The other items as other business just because we have a lot of people here for the two hearings. And just as a as an update that 46 faring is going to be continued tonight and the reason for that is because I had a conversation with Tom Reedy earlier today and there was some a butter concerns that were expressed to me about the fact that the conditions were sensed in June of 22 and that so much has transpired since that time with 46 faring street that it's kind of off the radar screen of a butters. So Tom agreed to re notify a butters, as well as post illegal ad for the May 10 meeting. And also, I asked him for updated materials notice of intent application to to accompany his revised plans, because there is some confusion in the original plan application with regard to the house relocation, which was noted in the original plan application that house was going to be moved there and that house was moved to 175 West Street so we kind of need new information with regard to the house so it's an update. Okay, thanks Aaron so let me just recap that so if anyone's here for 46 faring street hearing we are going to continue that to May 10. The butters that are here are going to get a new a butters notice and we will have a legal ad posted which goes on our website correct Aaron. The legal ad will be posted in the Daily Hampshire Gazette. But all of the new application materials will be posted on our website as soon as we receive them. Okay. All right. I hope that's clear. Of course we're getting some folks raising some hands. Can we table this until we get to that on the agenda, or you just want it because we have people raising their hands already so it's at your discretion pleasure. I will. We're going to hold off on public comment on that on 46 faring because we still have an agenda item ahead of us right now with the dbw so we're going to continue with that but just what everybody know. And we'll bring that back up. I'm happy to bring some things back up if people have questions after that first hearing, but again 46 faring street is going to be continued to May 10. And you should get a butters notice if you're in the butter. Thanks Aaron. Okay, you need a motion. Oh yeah, do we. Is that a hearing thing or. No we're going to we're going to do that after the dbw. We're just giving a public a heads up that we're not we're going to continue it because a bunch of people. But I'm happy to do that after the first this last next year. And, well I just have another administrative question for this because we are going to. So we're going to open this. Yes, so Beth is here from the dbw. I got my cheat sheet. Okay, sorry. Okay. So this is a public means now being called to order because the request for termination, this means being held as required for the provisions of chapter 131 section 40 of the general laws of Commonwealth and act relative to the protection of the wetlands as most recently mentioned in an article 3.31, what was protection act on the town of Amherst general bylaws. Okay. So the question here is Beth, Beth, are you here in the house. Yeah, I just promoted best I'm not sure if there's anyone else here from dbw who needs to be a panelist. Just raise your hand and I'll pull you in. Hey, Beth. Hey. So can you just kind of give us, you know, who you are and why we're here. Yep. I am Beth Wilson. I'm an environmental scientist with the Department of Public Works here in Amherst. I'm here to discuss a project that the town is proposing. It is a pilot study for a groundwater treatment system off of Crossbrook Road in Amherst. Next to me is Linda Rauch from Elate, which is our contractor who's going to be helping us with this project. I don't know if she can. She's going to comment on one of the slides but she doesn't, I guess need to be a panelist yet. I don't know how that works but she should be out there somewhere. Oh, there she is. Great. I think I'm just going to share my screen. All right, I have a little PowerPoint and then and then just PDFs of the site plan and everything to present. So just to give everybody a little background about the site and the area. Ice Pine Woods condominiums and Field Association housing, which are both on either sides of Crossbrook Road. In the 1970s, all the land and roads, driveways, utilities, etc. are privately owned in this area by the two homeowners associations. Many of the buildings that were when they were built in the 70s were built with footing drains that originally drained into a stream channel that open stream channel. And the water, which is groundwater because it's coming from footing drains was discolored orange red. With because of the iron content, right from the get go basically back in the 70s took about 10 years but in the 80s, the residents of that part of town came to the town with this problem of orange red water that they weren't happy with. So at that time, and then mid 80s into the late 80s, the town in collaboration with the homeowners associations installed a groundwater collection system slash treatment system that consists of a 24 inch underground pipe that all the footing drains were connected to the the pipe discharges into an underground 2000 gallon settling tank. And that selling tank has an overflow pipe to the town sewer system. And currently MRCPW maintains that collection slash treatment system. We clean out the 2000 gallon tank on a regular basis and we ensure that the pipes are functioning. I think what I want to do just quickly. Is, can everybody see that site plan. Can you zoom in just a little bit Beth it's really hard to read. Yeah, I was afraid that I kind of wanted to show the whole thing to show some of these lines. So at some points we can zoom in but basically crossbrook road comes along and makes this curve so Galpond is sort of up here. So crossbrook road is coming here curves. When you get to here you can actually see the the edges of the road. So that's crossbrook comes along here. I guess I just wanted to point out that this line is the existing drainage system. The main hole here is one that a lot of the residents are familiar with. There's a mailboxes on crossbrook road about right here and it's that manhole that's behind the mailboxes so most people are familiar with that one. So the drainage system just comes along here. All the footing drains connect to it. And then it just goes along next to crossbrook goes under crossbrook. And in this area here is where the underground settling tank is. And then the overflow goes into the sewer lot sewer main that goes up crossbrook. So I just wanted to kind of orientate people with where the existing system is. I think that's pretty clear these are some of the ice pond woods buildings crossbrook comes along this way. So back to this. So the issues with the current system, the settling tank doesn't remove all of the iron and manganese so this groundwater has high levels of iron and manganese in it. We've sampled it, the groundwater from the from that particular manhole and from other areas nearby for a number of analytes and what comes out always highs iron and manganese. And the settling tank doesn't remove all of it and so there's still dissolved iron that flows into the town sewer system, and it follows up. Some of our sewer equipment, right downstream is the Kester Lane pump station right on Kester Lane. And that is the first place where a lot of our equipment consistently gets fouled up by iron. What happens was, when the iron gets oxidized it comes out of solution. It forms a precipitate that's sort of that orange slimy stuff you see often in nature naturally, often especially wetland areas. So I'm sure a lot of you have seen it everyone at ice pond woods and fields Association has anyway that same stuff will come out when it gets exposed to oxygen at the pump station or at the wastewater treatment plant. And it follows up our equipment and costs the Amherst taxpayers. A lot of money to fix all that over and over again. So what we're proposing at the town's proposing is a pilot study of a small scale water treatment system to remove that iron and manganese. The treatment system would be housed in a manhole along the drain line. So that drain line I pointed out on the map. As I mentioned before, the town's working with a contractor, it's water treatment contractor elite is how you pronounce that. And a late applied for and was awarded an innovate mass grant from Massachusetts clean energy center for the project, which is great. And then I also just wanted to mention that because it's all this whole area is all privately owned the roads and everything are are owned by the homeowners associations. The town has a lease agreement with ice pond woods. All the work we're proposing is on ice pond woods land not on fields Association land. So we have a lease agreement, having to do with the solar system that's going to power the small scale water treatment system. And we're working on a utility easement for where the manhole is going to go. So proposed work. The project is within the buffer zone to two intermittent streams. And the work is basically going to is going to involve putting in a new manhole connecting a new manhole to that drainage line. So we have to excavate basically an eight by eight by six hole to put in a new manhole. And then we're going to trench from the manhole to where solar panels are going to go on one of the garage buildings that's owned by ice pond woods. So we trench need to trench about 275 feet to put in underground electric. The trench will be approximately 24 feet wide by 18 inches to 24 inches deep so not not very deep, not very wide. So erosion control we place between all work areas and resource areas. The manhole excavation and trenching are all expected to be done. We may do the manhole project one day and then the trenching another day but each will be backfilled and completed the same day as is the goal. There's a soil stockpile area identified on the site plan I'll show you, and we do plan to cover it if it's left overnight or if there's any precipitation. But again we really expect to be able to backfill everything, the day that it's excavated. There's one tree that's near the manhole excavation area it's basically a dead believe it's a cedar tree and it's so dead that you can hardly tell what it is. But that is probably going to have to come down. And then today during the site visit. So the site plan I'll show you has the trench in a certain location. And today at the site visit Aaron and Alex and I kind of looked at the situation and thought that it might work out better if the trench was moved on the south side of Crossbrook Road instead of the north side of Crossbrook Road and that was because of trees and tree roots that come along the north side of Crossbrook Road some big trees and then you can just see the roots are all where we were going to put the trench. And then also it was suggested at the site visit today that we put together de watering plan in case the manhole excavation get some water in it. So now I want to go back to this, just go over again. I will zoom in on some things but just for the overall picture of it. Again, Crossbrook comes along here. This is the parking area along Crossbrook. This is a paved area for this building, belonging to Ice Pond Woods, other parking area just so people get an idea of where this is. The solar panels are going to go on this rectangle here of this garage building that belongs to Ice Pond Woods. We're going to trench to an existing electric meter that's right here. And then we're also going to be trenching so this is where the trenching is going to change we originally want to go on the north side of Crossbrook Road. But it seems that it would be better if the trench started from here came to about right here and then came along this the south side of Crossbrook Road. And then crossed over to where the manhole is going to be. And of course then the erosion control here would continue on the south side of that entire trench. And just to point out that the reason for that change was because that straight line as it's shown on this plan runs right along several mature and healthy trees along the roadway so it's we're trying to kind of move it away so it doesn't kill all those trees along the road. Yes. That seems doable to you, Beth. That shouldn't be a problem. It shouldn't be a problem. I already today got in touch with somebody at Ice Pond Woods to start talking to them about so the original easement this is the easement. Or it's actually the lease. These two lines here are the either side of the originally agreed upon lease and then this is going to be our easement here. So it would be just moving that lease area down down to this side. And the person I got in touch with seemed to think that that would be all right but that's one of the reasons I'm Aaron will say that we're continuing we're not closing the hearing tonight. So we can get a plan together that would be the final approved plan. Okay, thank you. Sure. And then in terms of resource areas this is the delineated bank to one stream so there's a stream that comes along right here and we've got delineation points for that stream that stream as a culvert goes under frostbrook and then connects up with this stream. So that's delineated going in that direction and this is the 100 foot buffer lines for that bank. Yeah, so that that is about it. So we closed this location for the manhole, partly because it's, we feel like it's best to be at the end so that we're sure to catch any footing drains or even just any groundwater that seeps into the drainage line. Biggest bang for a buck for treatment. Also access for doing all the monitoring and any thing we and anything we have to do the treatment system. Right here this is a grass area also if we put the manhole anywhere along in here would have been in a wooded area so this is this is just grass. So the water, what, what's the source of this water it's coming off the roof or it's coming out of the ground. It's coming out of the ground, it's ground water. And so it sounds like nobody likes the look of the color. Not yet. But it also is fouling up the town utility line. Yep. I'm confused about why it's this is a bad thing. It's really because it's just fouling up the town. Yeah, it's, you know, I have iron. Yeah, no, I'm sorry. You don't need to explain that I understand. I'm just trying to wrap my head around. I think it's a bad thing. But I'm, I see, I think, yeah, we have a pump seems like a lot of work to change colors. Well, you're not just changing the color you're you're you're taking it out to, you know, in a way, it's cleaning up the ground water. Okay, so it's groundwater and it's all is it also run off from the house. There is some yeah there's definitely some stormwater that gets into the system to this is a groundwater source issue. So yeah, the any surface water any stormwater that gets in is clean, but then unfortunately it will mix with the groundwater that's that's coming from the footing drains and getting in. You said all the utilities are private. Yes, yes. So this system, like I said in the 80s, the town worked with the homeowners associations to put this in and has just always dpw or the town is just always maintained it. Like it is responsible to continue to do that. Just for an example, down on pot wine lane we have a well and it has a pump and it was used for irrigating the Plumbwork fields down there. And we can't use that well or the pump that's in it anymore because it's so gummed up with iron precipitate. So if you open the well, the well house, you open it it's just all orange and the pump so we're actually looking into putting in a new well down there in a different location that's bigger to try to get away from water. Okay. It's not water. Definitely. Are you, are you good now about that for. Yeah, yeah, I am. Well, actually, no, sorry, wait. I just wanted to last slide is for Linda to talk a little bit about the actual treatment how how it works and what it is. Thank you. Yes, hi, Linda Roush, representing L attack. So the treatment system. Oh, it's an electrochemical passive water treatment. So what that means partly is that as opposed to a lot of groundwater systems where you would have to pump it up above ground and have a treatment unit and then send it back down below. And then you're able to passively flow through in the man way manhole. So there's six treatment reactors that are interconnected that fit within this manhole, creating that reactive barrier. And above ground is the what's shown is this pole mounted control small control panel, which houses the power supply to the canisters and also a communications device that allows for monitoring remote monitoring of the system. Very energy efficient treatment. Really because of not needing to pump, which is a big power consumption for water treatment typically. So we're able to solar power it. Solar mounted on the roofs that Beth mentioned on the garage building for ice pond woods, and then there's net metering so any extra power goes to the ice pond woods community. So L attack will be monitoring the system's performance to confirm the removal of iron and manganese to the surface water quality standards. All right. Do we have any of these in anywhere else in town. Just knew it's pilot. Yeah, L attack is actually a local Amherst based company. They have done some pilot work in South Hadley on water treatment system so they definitely have done some work but first project with Amherst. Cool. Thank you Linda. Aaron do you want to add anything or do you have any site photos or how do you how do you want to. I do have some site photos. I mean I think I can flip through the site photos if you want but if you, I don't know if you want to take public comment or commissioner comment while I share the photos just so we can multitask maybe. Sure, if there's anybody. Let's start with commissioners first questions or comments to start to start off with here. So wrapping my head around the colors here. Michelle go ahead. I'm just so in the 80s just so I get the story straight. This private development didn't like the look of their groundwater so the town basically subsidize the filtration of that into the town sewer. And now there's some kind of agreement that is going to maintain that and it's messing up the town sewer system. And so the town has to deal with that is that pretty much the story. Yeah, I mean the settling tank as far as I can tell from just old letters and things. The settling tank works. But there's always been since it was put in some iron still getting into the sewer system that overflow still takes dissolved iron which then ends up into our sewer system downstream. I mean, I guess this is kind of a maybe crazy question, but like, is this the only option for this groundwater. I mean, is this like a perpetual agreement between the town and this HOA. Yeah, there's pretty much an I don't know if any kind of a written agreement but but I think just from hearing from residents. We've been maintaining it for such a long time I kind of think would be. I don't know I can't speak to that exact that's more of a bigger town question but we've always been responsible for it so I but but this is just a pilot this is a pilot study to see if this will work. In the event that this fails, we would be trying to think of another way to, you know, it's the idea is to basically upgrade the current system because it's just, you know, not not getting all the iron out so we're going to try this. I just getting a straight straight there thanks. Yeah, sure. Any other commission members need a clarification of private first public here. Go ahead Alex muted bud muted. Yeah, when we were there today was clear that most of the trenching is in areas that are already asphalted. And very little of it is breaking new ground. And when they move the trench to the south side of the road that will be essentially in the in the road. There's very little of the trench that goes off the road. That's just background. I had a question on sort of goes to the subsidy that the town provides, and I was just curious what is the cost of the town of taking care of this. I had to get back to you. You don't need to I just thought if you had a finger as curious budgets are tight. And I, I'm wondering, even though we've done it for a long time. Why isn't it the responsibility of the homeowners Association if they are fouling up the town sewer system. Why isn't it their cost. So I can answer that. I just want to jump in really quick. I think we with the concom jurisdictions we're talking about wetland issues here and I, you know, I'm sure there's other questions that are pertinent but I just want to make sure we're staying in our lane with regard to sort of the content that we're reviewing for this hearing. Yeah, I think we're going to get to that. Andre, do you have a I think I was going right, right along to where Aaron was going as savory as it is to to think of the town, town funds going toward something like this, it, as far as, you know, to me, making those kinds of decisions, unfortunately, or, or fortunately, perhaps, so we got that cover. Do you have a jurisdictional question, comment, not at all. No, I'm looking forward to hearing the public comments on it. Okay, excellent. So anyone else from the conservation commission. Okay, great. Can I just say two things to it is just that it is grant funded. There's a large, most almost all of it is being grant funded. And also, the back in the 80s, there was discussion of the high iron and manganese content being associated with the landfill with the old landfill with, I guess, leachate in into groundwater affecting the pH lowering the pH and then pulling these metals out of bedrock and overburden and causing higher levels of of those in the groundwater in this particular area of town. That said, we have really sampled the water a lot at this point. The landfill the South landfill was capped in the mid 80s right at the same time that this was all happening. The leachate from the old landfill was improved greatly by it being capped. So, you know, the samples that we've got that we're using for this for the pilot study for you know these are the concentrations we have and then we sampled for a whole lot of other things are really current you know I went back to about 2006. And it's really what I'm looking at is this is the water that's getting into this system so it's groundwater from zero to 20 feet below grade because that's where your footing drains are. And really what we're looking at that's where all we're seeing is iron and manganese at this point. But I believe back in the 80s. There was more discussion by residents of the town being a little more responsible for it and that may be what explains why it was put in I also know there was cooperation with the homeowners associations for its installation I believe some of the homeowner. I think that was provided some of the materials and things like that when the system was first put in. So, that might explain give you a little bit more background as to why it's why we even how why that system is there. It's very helpful. It is. Thank you. Thanks, Beth. Yeah, we will take some questions from and share comments from the public please two minutes, if you do less better your name and where you live. If you want to raise your hand will will get you in there. Okay, we have nobody from the public. We obviously we're going to continue this. Oh, Barbara. Yes, Barbara what we see your hand, you can hop on here to participants raising their hands. So I pulled Barbara in and when Barbara is done I'll pull in the next. Okay. Yep, Barbara whenever you try that again. Oh, yeah. Oh, there she comes. And then Debbie. Yep, there we go Barbara yep. Zoom move slow. It's okay with the panelists. Yeah, Barbara you muted so whenever you're ready. Barbara you're still muted I'm sure. Okay, there we go. Yeah. Okay, thanks. Gotcha. On the economics we pay the same property taxes as everyone in town, but we have to pay for plowing and maintenance of our roads, which is a significant expense. Also, we had a pipe burst we had to pay for that and a new fire hydrant. So the town is benefiting from this situation I would say economically. One of the two other things one is not all the footing trains go into the system. The houses. The hollow that face or farm words. I mean, or farm are not tied into it. It's only some of the houses that are. And the question I have is whether there will be testing beyond just the iron and manganese or will it be limited to that. Yeah. Well in the past, we've done more than just iron and manganese. We've cleared all that data was with Bucky. He's got. Yeah, yeah. So it was, it's, we've tested for volatile organic compounds we've tested for PCBs even other metals. But anyway, we're, we're also going to test one more time. And the next week or so for a whole, a whole range of contaminants again. The town will continue to do the same testing as well as well as the project. Yes. Okay. Excellent. Thank you. Yep. Thank you. Hey, we had one more. Debbie, I think I saw you up there. Raise your hand again. We'll get you, we'll get you on here. Two minutes please. There you go. Debbie, you should be on. Debbie's been pulled in. She just takes a few minutes. I think we're going to come through. It's that South Amherst bandwidth. Okay, Debbie. Yep. We're got you on there. You're muted. Okay. Yeah, we got you. So I, I guess the, the other thing that's important to know is that some of this groundwater sometimes filters back into the pond, which is a conservation area. So I think that's something that, you know, we can't lose sight of. And that was also some of our concern about the orange water was, you know, what's the impact going to be on the pond. So it's, it wasn't only, you know, just because the residents didn't like the orange water, but it was because there's also a pond that supports a lot of natural wildlife that we wanted to make sure that wasn't damaged in the process. Yeah. Yeah. Shelby, have a quick one. I think there's somebody else that wants to talk. Yes. And, and has raised and Debbie all set. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. All right. And just hold on a second there. We'll get you in there. And you're there. Just muted. Am I there? Yes, we got you. Okay, you can hear me. Yes. Okay. I'd like to emphasize. The history of how this happened. Because it sounded a little frivolous. The neighbors didn't like the orange water. Indeed, we did not like the orange water. But as it came out, thanks to the old landfill technology, not what it is now. And the water was polluted. And the plume came toward this area. And the understanding to the residents here in the town at the time is that the water was affected from the leach at plume. That's why the town went ahead with the system. It wasn't just because we didn't like orange water. So we always have a concern that the water quality of gold pond, the pond there is preserved. And I'm hoping the system will work, but. We shall see. And I hope it does. Yeah, can we. Sorry. Could you state your, your last name for the record and just for the minutes because I only see your first name. Sorry. Could you spell that one more time? I missed the first part. Green. Oh, green. Got it. Thank you. Thanks, Ann. Beth, how long is the pilot again? Did you say. I think, did you already mention that? Yeah, it's going to get monitored for six months to a year. Six months to a year. Great. Thank you. Is there anyone else? Okay. Well, thanks, Beth and Linda for the. Thank you. Thank you. I should explain to what's going on. Thanks you for the. Residents down there as well. Giving us a little bit of history background for us to grapple with. As you know, we're constantly dealing with. Everything now that happens in Amherst's in wetlands. And we're constantly up against. These issues all the time. So we just want to make sure we're all. Staying on top of everything. So. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Can you get us a new plan by the next meeting? Is Aaron's that appropriate? Yeah. Michelle, do you have something to quickly want to say? Just, you know, thank you for more of the history about, you know, the. Original intent about it, but there is two phases to the pilot. Right. The second phase is going to be. More output into Galpond. Is that correct? That's not really decided at this point. You know, there's been a lot of. People concerned that if the system works. Are we going to start to want to discharge it? You know, sort of maybe upstream of Galpond or something, because at that point, the water would be clean. And it does consist partly of stormwater. We can't really speak to that at this point because. Not only because we don't know if the system is going to work, but also because we don't know if the system is going to work. So, you know, I think one of the things that would involve. Definitely working with DEP because. They are aware of this drainage system. And they sort of consider it under certain different, a few different categories. So, you know, we would be working with them sort of saying, okay, we've been able to treat this water to this point. What do you think, you know, what, what, what are our options of what to do? So just take the iron and manganese out and the, and the waters continues to go into our sewer system. It's a benefit to the town because we're, we no longer are damaging our, our equipment. So there really just isn't an answer at this point. And honestly, it's, it's going to come a lot down to what DEP thinks. If the system works. Yeah. If the system works too. That too. Yeah. Well, thanks for getting all that stuff together and get a grant for it. So thank you for that. That was a great question. Wonderful to hear. And we have a local. Local company working on it. Anyone else. Can we get a motion. To continue the public hearing to May 10, 20, 23 at 7, 45 PM. Seconded. All right, under the motion cameron with the. Second. Can I get a voice vote? Andre. Hi, Cameron. Hi. Alex. Okay. Thanks, Beth. Thanks, Linda. We'll see you all at the, uh, Mark, uh, May 10th at what time, Erin? Uh, 745. 745. Sounds good. Thank you very much. Thank you. So just for administrative purposes. You were opening this one too. No, no, we're not opening it tonight. Um, I think not new. Well, it is new. So just to give a little bit of background, this was submitted in June, end of June, 2022. It was submitted to us and received, but at that point we were under appeal on the DEP and rad. And so we couldn't officially open the public hearing. We accepted it. We scheduled it. And we've just been continuing it since then. Um, tonight will be 13 continuations since the application was received. Um, so what I would suggest to the commission is, um, that we allow the applicant to renotify a butters, republish the legal ad, and that we officially open the hearing at the next meeting. Once we have updated materials and, um, all the appropriate, um, Notifications have been made. Okay. Um, Sure. Should we take questions from the public? Um, if you're comfortable doing that Fletcher, that's completely fine with me. Um, There may be folks. There's really not much to report. We just said all we have for information. Is there any print in the concom with any questions, comments first? Regarding this continuation. 42 46 very. Fletcher, I'm having trouble hearing you. Yeah. Sorry. Yep. You got me there. Yep. Better. Okay. You have any questions or comments. Regarding this continuation. You're asking me. Yeah. No. No. Okay. Thank you. Um, So I will, I'm happy to just give a couple. If there's anybody from the public has any questions, but I think we have it. Reads your hand and just make it brief. But, um, we are going to continue this with the proper notifications and we'll add to moving forward. So it's okay for me to let folks in Fletcher. Yeah. Quick question. Okay. Ralph. Yeah. We got you there. You're muted. So if you guys. Make a quick question, comment. Yeah. Hi, thanks. Carl's trim 73 fearing. Um, I'm just sorry. I'm a bit confused. I've heard 42 52 fearing 46 fearing and 48 hearing. 48 fearing tonight. I wasn't aware there was a 48 fearing until tonight. And that's the, the first. Item that we're going to be talking about. We're going to be talking about a 48 fearing until tonight. And that's the, the first. Item that was continued, I think. So the 52 fearing is an existing house. If I'm not mistaken. The 46 fearing is a, was an NOI to move a house that's been moved somewhere else. And what I saw now is a 48 fearing, which is a request to build a house on this. What I'm thinking is the same property. That sounds like three very different things. And I'm confused whether we're continuing something or we're. Asking for a new notice of intent for a new thing with a new address and a new project. I'm not sure which is 52, which is 48, which is 46 at this point and what your project you're really talking about for this May 10th continuation. That's my question. Yeah, appreciate that. Yeah. I might have met. Throw in a couple of numbers around there by mistake. 46 fearing is what we're referring to. But that's not, we've heard first today was 48 and 52. I've heard three different addresses. So. Yeah. I'll make it into hearing. So that's what I'm trying to get together here. I'll just make a little clarification. 52 faring LLC is the applicant. So they're the owner. That's what we're referring to is the LLC that's set up as the ownership of the parcel. 46 faring is the parcel. Where that is subject to the notice of intent application for the single family home project. To move a family home. 46 is to move a family home. So. When the notice of intent was submitted. The language in the notice of intent application referenced moving the single family home. So that's what we're referring to. That's what we're referring to. That's what we're referring to. That's what we're referring to. However. That's called 46. Okay. Correct. It was, it was supposed to be the location where the house on sunset have was moved to that was the original intent. But they were able to find another site to move. That home to at 175 West street. And so. Because there was already a notice of intent application for this project, So. And so that's where the. The, the original notice of intent application was moved to the house. So I did ask the applicant to resubmit their materials. To be clear as to what is actually being proposed. With the project as an updated. Um, Um, And so. Part of the request today. Uh, Was based on a conversation within a butter who was concerned about all of the above issues that you just raised. And the fact that the original notice of intent application. Um, Was based on an updated, um, revised materials so that we're clear on that and the public is clear on that as well. Um, For the, a butter notification so that people can have access to. What is now the actual proposed project on the site. Okay. I think I understand, but what it sounds to me like is a different project. With a different address and a different. Um, And so I would say that the notice of intent has changed dramatically and that it's not a revision of their plans, but an entirely new plan. That's what it sounds like to me. Just, I'm trying to get the language clear. So we're still under the original NOI, but they're doing something completely different. That what you're saying. Right. So, and, and this is not, it's not uncommon. So for example, when somebody files a permit, like, let's say. They're going to file a permit for X, Y and Z in the course of the application process, a plan can be revised many times before it's approved in a public hearing. So, you know, we've seen that with multiple different sites. I would, I could give some examples if you needed me to, but the projects undergo many changes in the course of the hearing process and also because we, um, didn't move this forward because there was an appending appeal that we were in negotiations of. So, um, That's kind of the backstory. Oh, my comment would be, I think they understand that my questions been answered. Thanks a lot. I guess my comment would be that I would ask the commission to view this as a new intent with a new address and a new project. And we'd have a new, a new submission instead of a clarification of a previous submission. It sounds very different to me. And I think it would need new, a new analysis. All right. Well, certainly take into consideration. But you should get a new about his notice. And so you're, you'll be notified this time when the new hearing comes about, comes up. Yeah, uh, Ralph. And you guys correct me if I'm wrong. I think one of the issues that one of the. What the notice of intent is regarding the area where, where this activity is supposed to, is proposed to take place and the application or applicability of. Of the bylaws and the. Essentially the wetlands laws. The actual activity of what they're doing has changed, but the. Jurisdiction that you're talking to us, the, you know, I think we deal specifically with the, with the. With the notice of intent of them doing something on that. Parcel of land. So I can, so something could be anything in your mind. So yeah, I mean, essentially. I just, it sounds like it's pretty different to build two buildings. But we're not, we're, so we're, we're looking to, we're making sure that the, that we're protecting the wetlands there. We're not, we're not a building. Inspection. You know, we're not, we don't approve the building, so to speak. We approve whether something can be done there. Okay. So if it's not technically a new project, which it sounds very much to me, it should. Well, I guess I just investigate that maybe with the legal aspects are what. Intent means in this case. That's my question. It seems like a different intent from my point of view, different coverage, different. Activity on the land building that kind of thing. I mean, I think to get at the, the kind of core of what Rolf is saying is this was actually submitted right before our bylaw regulations changed. And so now we have new bylaw regulations. So it's been a while. So anyway, it is impactful in that sense. Okay. Thank you for taking so much time with my questions. I guess I will keep, keep my ears open for a notice of intent and see what the intent is at this next, and the next notification. Thank you. So I think we should. I will still need a motion here to make this continuing to. May 10. Again. Yes. Seven 40. Yeah. I'll move to continue the public hearing for 46. Fairing street to May 10th 2023 at seven 40 p.m. Second. All right. Andre with the motion. Michelle with a second voice vote Cameron. Hi, Alex. Alex. Hi. Michelle. Hi. Andre. Hi. And I for Fletcher. Okay. May 10th is looking. Looking stacked. Oh, it's going to get better. Yeah. I believe it. All right. Can we talk about stargazing now? Yes. Yeah. Absolutely. Let's do that. Okay. So the Mount Pollock stargazing application, this is the same organization who previously had been approved for stargazing. I'm hoping this will be kind of a relatively simple approval. To, for us to approve the stargazing with the same conditions that we previously approved. It's the organization is a, is a school. It's the same organization. I think work with sort of special needs folks. And they take them stargazing so that they can. Go up on Mount Pollock's and. Learn about. The stars constellations. Yes. Yes. And maybe more. Yes, exactly. Yeah. All kinds of good stuff. Yeah. So the same group has come, come before us before with a. Yes. Yeah. They had a previous approval for last year. And so they're just looking to basically do the same thing this year. And I mean, I know that. Land use applications are really sort of the intent is for them to be kind of in effect for, for the year. With something like this that's so benign. I kind of feel like, gosh, I wish we could approve it for like a couple years in a row. So they could just do their thing. But. But yeah, it's kind of administrative. It's good to know they're there. Somebody, you know, you never know. Exactly. Commissioners, any questions. Comments. So we're, we're not, yeah. Parking. We're not Parkinson issue, all that stuff. Yeah. It's first come, first serve. They're required to notify the police department to have the permit with them when they enter the site, everything that they bring in, they have to pack out. They just bring a couple folding chairs and a telescope. So it's pretty benign. Nice. Okay. Thank you. Commissioner's can I get a motion? I move to approve the stargazing. Land use application at Mount Pollux. Nice. Michelle with the motion. Cameron with the second voice vote. Andre. Hi. Alex. Hi. Cameron. Hi. Michelle. Hi. And I for Fletcher. And I'm going to go to that. And I'm going to go to the other one. I'll go to the other one. So the Puffer's one, because I think that's going to be also a very easy one. I was contacted by a fraternity. And from UMass, who wants to do a volunteer cleanup. At Puffer's pond. There. I connected them with Brad Bordewick, who is our land manager so that he can. picker uppers to do the trash cleanup. And I know that's a very technical term. And so they'll do the cleanup and then at the end of the cleanup, Brad will coordinate with them to pick up the bags. So I thought it was a really nice event. And yeah, I don't know if there's any conditions that you guys feel strongly that we need to implement on this one. If they're working straight with Brad, I feel pretty confident. I was wondering, are they going to go down the trail across from Puppers? I'm just thinking about all the poop bags that get left on that trail and be kind of interested in getting a count just to see where the impact is. A count, no, you know, that would actually be a really interesting thing to get a count of doggy poop bags just from. Just pick them up on that trail. Yeah, and this is, you're talking about the trail that goes down to Mill River, Michelle? Yeah, where that bridge is. I mean, there's probably plenty to pick up at the beach and the other north side, but if they had an extra person, just go down there. I'm sure there's things on that river. Or an enthusiastic crowd here, poop bag collect, but do you want data though? That's what you're going to ask. Yeah, it would be really interesting information. It's, that's a terrible, isn't that amazing? Also, yeah, I mean, the little beach off that trail going down Mill River, there's a lot of broken glass there too and kids, like the little preschool goes down there to swim and I don't know if they're feeling ambitious, that'd be, that'd be great. When you say the little beach, you're talking about it's a little beach on the Mill River that's between Mill River recreation area and the dam. I guess, so I think I'm talking about Cushman Brook, so maybe I'm not in the same location. Well, no, it turns, I believe it turns into the Mill River at the outlet of the pond. It goes from being Cushman Brook to Mill River right at the dam. Yeah, if they're feeling ambitious. Okay, yeah, I can mention those things to them because that's really kind of an interesting thought. Yeah. All right, how about we get a motion? I move to approve the volunteer event, cleanup at Poverst Pond and beyond. Do we have a date, I don't know, for 2023? Yeah, it's May 10th, I believe. Or May 9th, the day, oh no, I'm getting the date wrong. Oh, it's the Sunday before our next ConCon meeting. I know we didn't have another meeting before the cleanup. Let me see if I can look at the, it is, it is the 7th, excuse me, the 7th of May. Cool, May 7th, can we get a second? Second. Excellent, voice, vote, Alex. Aye. Cameron. Aye. Andre. Aye. Michelle. Aye. And aye for Fletcher. Excellent. Okay, so the next one is a little, this is kind of like the more unique and complicated and I actually sent each of you an email. So this is for an art installation. Originally the ask was for to do this at Hickory Ridge, but we're really concerned about having anything at Hickory Ridge right now because there's just so much going on there. So I spoke to the applicant like four o'clock today. I've been trying to reach her since April 14th and she is comfortable doing it at Wentworth or also at Groff Park. Groff Park is a recreation area. It's not owned by Concom. So we could give approval for Wentworth, but if they want to use Groff Park, I think they're gonna have to go through a separate channel for that. The art installation is basically to bring in some sculpture that she's created and basically just set it on the site and leave it there for about 48 hours for people to come and view. Michelle had some additional questions about the application. So I asked her to kind of write something up which she sent and I read and I, it sounds very interesting. It didn't really give me like a sense of, this is what I've been able to understand. There's no footing, there's no permanent disturbance. It may temporarily mat down the grass or vegetation a little bit, but it's very temporary in nature to be placed. I think my only concern to be totally honest is that it's gonna be like vandalized or damaged or that something's gonna happen to it out there. So I mean, I think as long as we tell her, or excuse me, I'm working on making sure I'm being gender neutral with how I say things, tell the applicant that something could, that we're not responsible to damage to the materials that she places on the site for the viewing. That was kind of my biggest concern. Is there signage that will go with it? No, they're doing an event to basically invite people to come see it. I think it's like 20 cars or something that they may need, but it's first come, first serve on the parking anyways. So, yeah, the Wentworth side, so it'd be in the field. Yeah, I mean, it seems like the old farm road would be the better location to put it just for the purpose of having a location to put it where there's some space. I think that the area on Stanley Street, the old Kiwanis field is actually owned by the recreation department as well. It's not until you actually get into, down by the Fort River that it's conservation land. But Dave would know this better than me strategically just popped in. Yeah, I mean, my first concern obviously would be just the vandalization, so whatever, but this is not to make money, right? No. I think it's like a school-related project. Yeah, if I could, Fletcher. I mean, the possibility of vandalism exists anywhere that this goes, whether it's a recreation area or a conservation area. So I think that's really up to the applicant. If the applicant is willing to take that risk, then we can't do anything to safeguard the safety of this sculpture. And I will say that having it at a more prominent location like Groff Park might be less likely to be, I mean, we do have a lot of challenges at Wentworth Farm with vandalism there and with kind of unauthorized activities, shall we say. So, you know, if there's very, you know, I have no concerns other than that. It sounds like a very, very little impact to a place that the applicant would want to put it. It's just whether they're willing to take the risk with their sculpture. And I also know there is a time consideration because I believe they're trying to do this by the time the semester is over. So my fear actually is if this doesn't go on a conservation area, going to put it on a recreation area just creates, kind of there's a little bureaucracy to go through to get to yes on that. So if somebody could remind me how big is this, I read the application, but it was already big. Yeah. 27 feet by 12. Yeah. But for 48 hours, right? Is that what's the proposal? Yes. Okay. By 12 by nine, sorry. So it's going to be nine wide, 12 tall and 27 feet long. So if that's on the old farm side of Wentworth, there's basically that like causeway walkway. I mean, is there space for that and people to do their normal dog walking and walking? They're just trying to envision where that would go. Yeah, that's a great question, Michelle. And frankly, you know, that trail is not all that wide. And that is an area where we do have a lot of kind of unauthorized activity. So I have a pretty high level of confidence that it would be vandalized there fairly quickly. I'm just trying to rack my brain here a little bit. Dave, could we, I mean, I know that she wants to, the applicant wants to do this fairly soon and that Groff Park is actually owned by recreation. Is that? Well, everything, yeah. Everything is owned by the town of Amherst. We should clarify it's kind of for anyone else. So it's owned by the, all of these areas are owned by the town of Amherst under the care, custody and control of one committee board or department or another. So the recreation, you know, the recreation commission just met on Monday night. I was at their meetings. So that's, you know, I think that's where you were going, Aaron. Is that where you were going? Right. I was just wondering if it would be appropriate for us to, you know, share with them or, I mean, I would have no problem with them doing at Groff Park, but I wouldn't want to step on another committee's toes and say, yeah, you can do it when it's... That's what I mean. I mean, they're not meeting again until sometime in May. So I'm just worried about the applicant's timeline here. Yeah. Puppers is too big. I mean, too, too high traffic. Like the north side of Puppers. The north side of Puppers. They've got the field. Yeah. I was also thinking like the Amethyst Brook off to the left. Like if you're walking on the trail, there's a field off to the left there. A lot of people would enjoy seeing it. It's only for 48 hours, right? Yeah. It's quick. This is not so, yeah. So if the weather's not even that good, you're not going to get a lot of traffic, you know? I think Amethyst, though, is like busy all the time. Yeah, Amethyst is pretty high traffic. What about Podic? Podic is also another spot where it seems like it could be. It's getting, the grass is... Yeah, too high. It's growing. Yeah, yeah. What could be kind of interesting is Elf Meadow. Elf Meadow is off of Holst Road. And honestly, it's kind of a quiet conservation area. Do you all know where it is? Elf Meadow is off of Holst Road. It's down near Brookfield Farm. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's a big open field. We mow it. There's no grassland birds there. People kick soccer balls around there. It's parking, OK? Parking is on street parking. And for 48 hours... Do it. You know, I think that might be a good recommendation. And I just like the name. Elf Meadow Conservation Area. It leads to the back side of Brookfield Farm and there's trails that take you all the way out to Middle Street and Southeast Street. It's a quiet conservation area that a lot of people really don't go to. And there's a field there that would easily accommodate this structure for 48 hours. And all the parking you need. Yeah. So maybe we have the applicant look at Elf Meadow, work with Aaron. If need be, we could work with the applicant. They might want to knock on a few doors down there and say, you know, with the permission if the commission is willing to move in that direction. And I knock on a few doors down there and just let the butters know that this is going to happen on such and such a day that Aaron can work with the applicant on. But that might be a good compromise and try to avoid vandalism with this structure. Would it be something to consider to say to the applicant, we're fine with you doing your project as you've submitted. And it's OK to do it on Wentworth, but here are some other options. And you can choose the location that you think would work best for your project, but just let us know and be aware that, you know, we're not responsible if something happens to it. Yeah, I think we're going to have to have some sort of clause in this permit that the town can take no responsibility for the structure itself. But I would strongly encourage the applicant to look at Elf Meadow because I do not think this thing this this will last 48 hours at at Wentworth Farm. It's a it's a as we all know, it's a very high traffic area. People bike down there, they dog walk down there, they run down there. And as I said, we do have it's 12 feet tall. So people are going to be hanging off that thing. Yeah. So Elf Meadow, if you're looking at Elf Meadow, sounds great, maybe number one Elf Meadow. And if there's some reason why Elf Meadow won't work, then sure I can give a shot for Wentworth Farm. But I think they will not have a sculpture at the end of 48 hours. And they'll have to pick it out of the pond. Right, exactly. It may be floating out there. Right. And don't forget the poison I have to get there. Can I just add, I don't I didn't revisit our Lakeland use policy for this. But if this was a different season and then maybe in a different structure, we might be talking a little more about disturbance of the grass. But I'm thinking because it's May, the grass is short. There's not a lot going on. I don't have concerns about this particular structure. But I just want to say that for the record that I would not necessarily just be a go ahead with any kind of art installation at any point in time anywhere. Just wanted to lay that down. Yeah, and I will say that I've seen other towns do art installations and even permanent art installations on conservation lands sort of strategic. And in some cases, the art is there when the property is acquired. Like a good example is the spot up in Shootsbury with the bog. There's a bog, Ames Pond. Is it called Ames? Julian's Bauer. Julian's, yeah, Julian's Bauer. Well, it may be the same name. I mean, it may be the same. But anyway, there's, yeah, there's like several stained glass sculptures around it. But a lot of communities do do that. And they open the lands for like a temporary installation completely up to you just that it's not unique to Amers that communities have been asked to do this. I thought this might be an interesting, it's such a short duration. It might be interesting just to try and see how it goes. And we might learn something from it. And, you know, I know we stamped and did the art in the park and, you know, up on the orchards, our kill orchards. And they did some really interesting stuff up there. So, yeah. Yeah, maybe if it goes good at Elphale, it could be a spot that we use repeatedly. Yeah. All right, Michelle, give us a motion. I moved to approve the art installation. Art installation. We're at Elphale for Wentworth, given, you know, heated warnings and conditions of removal of structures. Second. All right, Michelle, the motion. Andrea, the second. Voice vote, Cameron. Aye. Alex. Aye. Andre. Aye. Michelle. Aye. And aye for Fletcher. That's all right. All right, we're getting there. So, yeah, so we had two emergency certifications since the last meeting, the first 785 Main Street. This was a residential sort of building with multiple apartments in it. And there was a sewer main break or I'm sorry, not a sewer main break, a sewer, a blockage in the sewer line between the house and the sidewalk. And so I was contacted by a tenant with concerns about it and ended up communicating with Ed Smith from Board of Health and basically was able to get them an approval but made sure that there was some mitigation associated with the emergency certification. The mitigation being that any sewage that made it into the wetland as a result of the emergency would be limed and that any disturbance that the disturbance had to be stabilized and erosion controls were installed and that any stockpiles needed to be removed within 48 hours. They were able to within 48 hours remove the stockpile, they backfill, they seeded and mulched with straw and there's erosion controls up. So that's completely taken care of. Palm Roy Court, this is a beaver flooding issue that we have sort of, it's a perennial problem. The beavers get in, they block the Plum Brook and the Plum Brook backs up and it floods out the utility line and it also floods Palm Roy Court, the roadway and so Eversource submitted the application to just to breach the two beaver dams that are blocking flow in the stream right now and causing flooding conditions so that I issued that emergency cert as well. So both public health and safety related emergencies and we just need to ratify those two documents. I moved to ratify emergency certification for 785 Main Street and Palm Roy Court. Do that again. All right, Michelle with a motion under the second voice vote, Cameron. I'm going to recuse myself for 785 Main Street since I have personal involvement. Okay, no sweat. Voice vote for Alex. Hi. Andre. Hi. Michelle. Hi. And I for Fletcher. And okay, I'll give her that. I didn't make you any of this. Yeah, so we, yeah, so Amherst Hills, we're going to table that. I just haven't had a chance to complete my review out there yet but the draft MOU with DPW, it's kind of been kicked to the can a couple of times on that one. It's in your folders. I feel like we kind of at the last meeting wanted a full complement of board members present in order to review that. So I'll leave it to you all if you would like to discuss that tonight or not. I didn't look at my apologies. Yeah. I don't feel ready either. Yeah, that's okay. That's completely fine. It's not really time sensitive. So yeah, we can move that, we can table that to an appropriate meeting. And I believe that is all I have for you this evening. The only thing is we may want to just take public, see if there's any other public comment before we close out of the meeting. Just in general. So like general public comment. Yeah, the town charter requires that every agenda has a public comment, a general public comment section at some point during the meeting. And so just a general public comment. Yep. All right. We have open public comment period. If anyone's interested in raising their hand, but you get two minutes. No comments. It's something about people wearing blankets though. Right. Or getting them... Did you see that? Delivered. I got brownie points for this one. I was freezing. I got tea too. Oh, yeah. My comments to myself. Good for you. Are we supposed to do this at the end of every meeting? The comment period? Yes. Yep. Yep. The public comment is, it's in the town charter that every board and committee have a open public comment period at some point on every agenda. Okay. I don't see anything. I think we all know what the next one is. I'm the chair. I can't do it. I'm here to adjourn. We can have the same time. Go ahead. Oh, thanks, Andre. Five, 59. Eight, 59. Yep. Are you on California time, Michelle? My computer is on California time. All right, got a motion. Can I get a second? I can do it. Yeah, Cameron. All right, voice vote, Cameron. Hi. Alex. Hi. Andre. Hi. Michelle. And I for Fletcher. All right, thank you guys. Have a great night. Yeah, take care everyone. We'll see you next time. See you next time. It's gonna be up. Bye.