 ThinkTech Away, Civil Engagement Lives Here. Welcome to Out of the Comfort Zone on ThinkTech on Spectrum OSA 16. I'm your host, Arby Kelly, and today we are talking about public speaking. Now, before I introduce my really cool guest, I want to share with you my recommended book of the week. Now, if you've ever struggled with public speaking, whether that's what to say, dealing with nerves, how to manage your audience, this is a book I would recommend for you. Now, I thought I'm a public speaker by trade. Obviously, I know everything there is to know about public speaking, but even I was surprised and impressed when I read this book. So this is What's Your Message, and it's written by Cam Barber, and he's actually from Australia, which I think is super cool. So when I read this, I hear him talking in an Australian accent. But this is a book I would recommend. If you have to do presentations for your work, for fun in Toastmasters, this is a book that will make your life easier. And now today, I'm excited to present to you our guest today. Now, our guest has been here before. She's a master on TV and of the show. And she also is an expert in public speaking. Please help me welcome Pam Chambers. Hi there. Oh, what? Hello. I saw your hand out like this, and I was like, hi, hi. Let's try to match. OK, OK. OK, let's do this, OK, and then a regular. Very nice recovery. I like that. So, Pam, can you help explain to our viewers just a little bit about what you do? Yes, I teach people how to speak in public. And I teach them to be comfortable and confident and know how to deal with whatever might come up. It's one thing to be in your own little private space imagining what this will be like. But then when the audience shows up, things can happen that are unexpected. So I give people tools for how to deal with those things. And I've seen that happen before, where someone will they'll rehearse and rehearse and rehearse in private, and then they get on stage. And it will be like some little thing that happens that totally throws them off your game. Someone could have a sneezing fit in the audience, and that could derail you. Or a door suddenly slams, or the lights go out, or someone asks an irrelevant question that has nothing to do with what you were talking about. Or like happened to me once. Someone in your audience says that they're an expert on your topic and stands up to speak about it while you're still on stage. Oh. Did they say they were an expert in body language? They did. And I wasn't experienced enough at that stage to handle it. But I know after talking with you, you gave me a couple of great tips. And I was like, oh my goodness. I wish I could time travel so I could go back and handle that. Well, perhaps it will happen again. Yes. And you'll have your chance. And then I'll be ready. So Pam, what are some of the reasons that people struggle with public speaking? There are, I think, two main ones. One, people say, well, I'm afraid of being judged and evaluated. Please tell me they're not going to. And I say, no, you are being judged and you are being evaluated. The audience has to evaluate whether they feel safe with you and whether they trust you and want to follow you. So they must evaluate. Just like when we see a stranger approaching us in a parking lot, we must evaluate. Yeah, we can't help it. It's just what we do. We must. And then the other thing is that if people are seated with an audience and they offer an idea, that's pretty safe because they're with a group. But the minute they stand up and separate themselves from the herd, they're now vulnerable. The way an animal is, if an animal separates itself from the herd, that's the one that's going to get attacked. So there is a biological fear. It makes sense to be afraid. So we have to outsmart that. We have to outwit it. We have to be bigger and better than that. And I think when you realize what the problem is, then it's easy to find strategies to fix it. Some people, they're just so paralyzed by this idea that they can't even figure out why they're afraid. Yes. And then the other thing that is derailing is adrenaline. So let's say that you know that in two minutes you're the one who will be up there. It's possible that Mother Nature will release adrenaline throughout your system so that you can fight or flee the way we might have needed to do as a caveman. Yeah. And that's your system, just trying to keep you safe. Trying to help. There's danger. I'm going to give you all the resources to keep you alive. That's right. You're going to fight or flee. But we're not going to beat up the people in the front row and we're not going to run out of the room screaming. So now we're stuck with all this extra energy that has no place to go. And so I teach people before you stand up, pull on the seat of your chair really hard. Do an isometric exercise. Pulling upward toward the ceiling to release and use that extra energy. Interesting. It works. It works the same way letting too much air out of a tire works. Interesting. And then if you get up there and you realize, I forgot to pull on my chair, then you can dig your toes into the ground really hard. And that won't be visible to the audience, but it does the same thing. You can use that adrenaline and you can dig in, but you're not showing the audience and it's helping you. It's giving that feeling that adrenaline purpose. Yes. And it's you controlling the adrenaline instead of it controlling you. So then we have that feeling of being in command. That's clever. I love that. I invented that myself. I had, once I discovered that it was adrenaline that was my problem, I thought, why hasn't anyone shown me what to do about this? It's not in any book, except mine. Manage your adrenaline. I love that. Thank you. Usually what I do when I feel this adrenaline is I recognize that, well, this is easy for me because I actually like public speaking. But I always have to make the conscious choice that I am excited to be here instead of afraid. Because biologically, they're very, very similar. But if you can kind of turn that into bouncing on your toes, like, I'm excited. This is happy. This is good. That's something that helps me get jazzed and excited instead of, oh my gosh, what if I said the wrong thing? Right. Another thing along those lines is a mental preparation of loving your audience ahead of time. Because if we don't love them, we will fear them. So we're driving there. We're fearing what if they don't want to be there? What if they don't like me? What if they blah, blah, blah, blah? And we're on the fear channel. And that's so unproductive. But if we can love our audience, we love that they're coming to see us. We love that they're making the effort. We love that they care enough to get there. We love them. And then we are on a much better channel. I love that. And we were taught, as kids, don't talk to strangers. And now we're expected to be able to speak to strangers. And be comfortable and capable at it. Right. How is that supposed to work? Yeah, no, a conscious choice has to be made to love those people. And you have to go through that training. Because you've grown up all your life being told, strangely or scary, you're supposed to be seen and not heard. You get all of these lessons about, no, don't speak up in class. Raise your hand. All these lessons about how it's not OK to be standing up and putting yourself out there. Right. Right, right. And then you get out into the real world. And they're like, you're going to be in sales. You're going to be in presentation. And your job depends on it. And you're totally unprepared. Or they don't even tell you. The first job that I had where I had to do public speaking, they didn't even include that fact in the job description. So unbeknownst to me, a month later, I would have to stand in front of 300 people and introduce the seminar leader who I worked for. Oh, that must have been nerve-racking. It was horrible. And this went on month after month after month. And it actually got worse. Because every time I shook visibly and stumbled on my words, I reinforced that I am not good at this. So I would dread it. And then I would beat myself up afterwards. And it just took forever for me to say, you know what? I need to do more of this. So you created this cycle where you feared it. And because you feared it, it went horribly. And because it went horribly, you feared it. And it just went around and around. Yes, around and around swirling down the drain. Yeah, that downward spiral. Oh, gosh, I know what that feels like. I'm sure a lot of your viewers are saying they're nodding their heads and saying, yes, that's how I feel. But with a toolbox filled with tools, we can do anything. And now public speaking is basically what you do for a living. Yeah. Yeah. And so I think for our viewers, if you're thinking, whoa, I could never do that, Pam has actually done that. So this would be a great opportunity for you to find her website, seek her out, read her book, and definitely watch the rest of the episode, obviously. But Pam, can you tell us a little bit more about your journey, some of the steps you took to where you are now? Well, let's start at the beginning. When I was in the third grade doing my first book report, and I was excited because it was on Charlotte's Web. I'm sure a lot of the girls out there, men, women, know Charlotte's Web. So I was standing there excited. And I flubbed up on a word. And a leader girl in the class, leader, popular, powerful girl, laughed. And because she was a leader, the rest of the class followed. So I was being laughed at. Now, I should have laughed along with them, but I didn't. I was so flabbergasted. And I remember deciding, this is not a safe place standing here. So for the next couple of decades and a half, I was so good at not having to be standing up there, cleverly, cunningly, making my way around that stage instead of on it. And then that seminar job came along. And I thought, I am sick of feeling this way. I'm just sick of it. Other people can do this. I bet I can. So I asked my boss for weekly opportunities to speak. And that's what did it. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Weekly. You had this thing that you hated and dreaded doing. And you went to your boss and asked to do more of it. Yes. It was a courageous thing. That's incredibly courageous. Thank you. It was better than living with that horrible feeling the rest of my life. So then what happened? Well, so then they asked who wants to go to Hawaii and maybe get our seminar working there. And I was the only volunteer. I came here. I was here for three months. And I did get the seminar going. But more to the point, I found a home that I wanted to claim as my own. So I've been here for almost 40 years. Wow. And self-employed that whole time. And I found there were people who wanted to know how to do what I was able to do. And I found that I could teach. That's the main important thing about my career. I found out that I could teach. And that's different. It's one thing to know how to do something, but being able to reliably, consistently teach other people how to do that thing, that's incredibly different. Yeah, it is. And it takes being willing to tell people the truth about how they're coming across. And so I have to be really good at preparing people to receive feedback about things that they're doing that would be better if they didn't do. There's ways of standing, ways of talking, word usage, faulty eye contact, all kinds of things that people do that aren't so good. Yeah, and I know when I first got to the island, I saw you speak. And I thought, I need that. So actually, I reached out to you and I asked you to mentor me. Yes. And I remember that was so helpful to me. Like, at the time, it was hard to be like, I'm not actually perfect. There are some things I should change. But once I recognized the validity of your feedback, it made a big difference for me. Thank you. It was a pleasure to be your mentor. Thanks. You were hungry, thirsty, receptive, did it? Yeah. And I think that's the key to learning. That's something you look for in your students is that they are hungry to change. They're willing to listen. And they're going to do what you ask them to do. Sometimes the need, the pain has to get so bad that they have to come to me or to Toastmasters or to Dale Carnegie. But often, people won't take those steps until it really gets bad or something happens that they never want to have happen again. So a lot of people are just kind of coasting past this point in life. But perhaps their time will come. And I think that's the big thing is so often we choose not to change until the pain of changing is less than the pain of where we already are. Because of course, we're afraid of the unknown. But I know there have been times in my life and in my business where I dug in my heels. I would not change until I was so miserable that I couldn't bear any longer. So when someone wants to work with you, what's the very first step that they have to take? They need to contact me. And it's easy. Website, phone. I got rid of my landlines, so I'm not kidding. People trying to text me on a landline that doesn't work. I think I did that. Now, I was talking about painful. I texted you. Oh, you did? Yeah, 377. Oh, that number is a landline. So I had to get rid of that. Anyway, so they can contact me. And the first thing that we do is we usually have a one-on-one session so I can learn what they're up to and what their objectives are and what kind of speaking they do. And inevitably, this is not a pre-decision that I make, but inevitably, it's the class that I end up recommending to them. Because if they just meet with me, they're going to get comfortable with me. They need to get comfortable with a group. And so the group is the public classes anyway are composed of people from all walks of life who all want that same thing. And it's only 10 people. I have one coming up on June 8th, as a matter of fact. So people come and they think, oh, I'm going to be the worst one in the class. Or I'll pretend like I know it all. And then we get them comfortable. And then there's a series of five classes that they go through. I love that. And viewers, we will be back in just a moment to learn more about Pam's class and how you can get involved. So stay tuned, and I'll see you in a minute. Crazy world, so caught up in the confusion. Nothing is making sense for me and you. Hello, everybody. Thanks for joining us on Think Tech Hawaii. I'm your host, Andrew Lanning. The security guy. I host a program called Security Matters Hawaii. And I hope you'll join us on Fridays. We are at 10 AM. And we're going to be talking about those security things that really should be important to you. And maybe get behind the scenes on some of some things that you may not know about the industry or about products or even about your habits. I'm security is all about people, processes, and products. We hope to bring that to you in an informative and hopefully a useful way. So again, 10 AM on Fridays, Security Matters Hawaii on Think Tech Hawaii. Join me. Thank you. Welcome back to Out of the Comfort Zone on Think Tech on Spectrum OC16. I'm your host, Arby Kelly. And I'm here with special guest, Pam Chambers. And we are talking all about public speaking. So before we left, we were talking a little bit more about your class. Oh, right. Can you tell us some of the challenges that people face as they're going through the class? Sure. The first challenge is they have to do a one-minute talk on the first day. And they go, we have to speak already? And I said, did you think this would be a lecture course? And they were kind of hoping it would be. But I know how to manage my time. So there is time for everyone to do a one-minute talk. And they don't have much time to practice it, which is better, I think, than over-rehearsing. But it is a subject they know better than anyone else in the room, and that's them. So it's a one-minute talk about a childhood memory. So what's good about that is no one can argue with them that, no, that didn't happen, or no, you didn't go to Disneyland. It's their own expertise that they're sharing in one minute. The biggest challenge they have is they run out of time. People are so afraid of not having enough that they put in too much. And that's not good to go over time or to try to take more time than you were given. And then they have to stand there with their arms at their sides, not in a defensive, yes, not like that. They have to stand there with their arms at their sides and people give them feedback. People in the class speak directly to them about what they liked and what might have been better. And all they get to say is, thank you. Oh my gosh. They don't get to argue, they don't get to say, oh no, that doesn't apply to me. No, they don't get to defend, argue, explain, or justify. All they can do is say thank you. And then the feedback goes in, and then they can do one of three things. Use it, question it, or not use it. But if they're busy deflecting the feedback, then it doesn't go in. Yeah, so that's the first thing they learn in my class is how to receive feedback. Interesting. And how to give it, how to give feedback. Give feedback about something that people can change, not you should be taller. Maybe you might want to stand taller. I would like you with better, if you had longer hair, I think your speech would be better. They also think stupid. No, they're not allowed to do that. And then, so the person receives the feedback, and then that person calls on the next speaker. And that's so that the next speaker can say thank you because it's an honor to be called on as opposed to, oh man, why'd you have to call on me? So they don't get to do that. They have to say thank you. And the men have to empty their pockets. So in the first class, they learn all these rituals and protocols about how to be in this class. At the end. So they set up the expectations. Yep, yep. And at the end, everyone says something I learned tonight is or something I learned today is which proves that this is useful. There is learning happening here. And it's a good review for everyone. And it's a nice way to close the class. I love that. So what are some of the transformations you've seen people go from that very first class where they're like, ooh, to the very end? Well, some people don't change as much as they might like. And that's possibly because it's just not in their nature to become a silver-tongued orator. But some people make dramatic changes that everyone can see. And for example, one woman, she just kept being too quiet. And every time we would say more volume, can't hear you, we would show. And I said, it seems like you're afraid that you'll be yelling. Yeah, I'm afraid I'll be yelling. Well, you won't be yelling, you'll be audible. Finally, in the nick of time, in her last five-minute talk, she was loud enough. Oh, we were so excited. We burst into applause when she was immediately loud enough. Wow. So we said, how did you do that? Once she was seated, not receiving feedback anymore, she was seated. I said, how did you do that? She said, I practiced with my dog, not my husband, not my daughters, with my dog. And I had him way across the room. And I said, would Pam think this was loud enough? Oh, I love that. Well, so imagine someone that we can't hear. And then suddenly we can hear. Now, suddenly that person's confidence quotient in our estimation goes way up, way up. Yeah, and even from a body language perspective, when someone is talking and they're being too quiet and you can't hear them, that's immediately a signal to everyone that they're not sure what they're talking about, that they don't want to be heard. Yeah, they don't want to be there. And the ironic thing is, if they're not loud enough, they have to say it again. Right, why would you want to say it more times than necessary? So there's that. There's huge improvements in how people dress, because we have one whole class that's all about image. I love that. I remember a banker, I said, you need better pants. You are a high-ranking banker and you deserve nice pants and they don't have to be expensive, but they have to be nicer than that. And he came back next week, new pants, and he stood taller, he looked great, he looked like he had just gotten a promotion and he was pretty proud. But no one had told him that before. And I think that some of the problems is, you know, we, I actually had a sales call this morning with the manager who wanted to be better at managing. And one of the problems was he was great at his job, but then he was advanced to the next level and no one gave him a guidebook for it. Oh man. Like he went from being in sales to now he's supposed to manage other people, have the difficult conversations, deal with higher ups, and he's expected to just know this. Being a good salesperson and being a good sales manager, they have almost nothing in common. Oh. Yeah, so I'm talking with him again later, but I think it's so valuable that you are giving this feedback to people, the things that no one has thought to tell them, the things that they haven't thought to look up on their own, or the things that they've just haven't been able to figure out. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Right, right. I teach people to love feedback. And I make them say the number, the level of feedback that they want on a scale of one to 10. And I give them examples. Here's what a five would sound like. Here's what a 10 would sound like. I like that. Yeah, so they always say 10, because who doesn't want the most that they could get, but they need to hear examples of those. So once they say the number 10, the door is open. Exactly, they open the door, they're walking through it. And I think that's so important because if people aren't asking for feedback or looking for feedback, then when they get feedback, it's almost intrusive or it's unwelcome. So asking people, do you want feedback? And if so, how much feedback do you want? I think that's really valuable in making sure that they are opting in to receiving the feedback. Thank you. Took a while to look for me to learn that, but here I am 33 years in. Uh-huh, or an expert now. I learned something just last month that I hadn't known before. And that is I need to let people know what to expect when they work with me because one client I was more than they were bargaining for. I was told afterwards, we don't want you to call on people in the training. I said, but these are leaders. You know, they don't want to be called on. But how can they be leaders? I know, I know. Yeah, but I never had to tell anyone please know that I will be calling on your people. The ones who show up for this workshop, I will be calling on them. I'll be expecting input from them. That doesn't even make sense to me. I know. If you want your people to have the best training possible, they need to be involved and engaged in the process. I think what they wanted in retrospect was for me to only expect volunteers to speak. But that would have been three out of 30 people. And it's not really the volunteers who usually need the help. It's usually the people who are like, I don't want to be here. I'm pretending I'm not here. They're the ones who need the help the most. Well, do you know who really needed the help, RB? The bosses. Oh, isn't that the truth? I see that so often. See, they were projecting their own, I don't want to be called on, onto their people, which set this whole tone. So in my other book, not this again, there's a chapter called We Were Fixing the Wrong Thing. And in this case, I was really working with the wrong people. Yeah, because the people who needed the help are the ones who are always like, oh no, I don't have a problem. I'm the leader here. Or they would sit in the back and watch their people go through a training that really they could have used themselves. So my point is I'm still learning myself how to navigate these waters of working with people, dealing with people, not being surprised by people. There's always more to learn. But so Pam, we've only got just about one or two minutes left. Where can our people find you? And what would you recommend as a next step for them? Okay, well, this is my book, Life is a Presentation. And it's very short, as you can see, and easy to read. It's available for free. And I've got it. Oh good, thank you, yes. It's available for free if people go to PamChambers.com. And there's a little subscribe here button, which allows you to download the book. Don't worry, you will not be bombarded by tons of emails. I don't do that. But, and you can unsubscribe at any point once you get the book. So that's the first step, read it. Download it, read it, print it, don't print it, read it on your computer. Send it to a friend. Send it to a friend. Look at the rest of the website. There's a page called Super Short Shows. And it's full of over 40 really short videos, maybe 38 seconds long, on all different topics. All right, so viewers, if you are struggling with public speaking, I would absolutely recommend you go to Pam's website. That's PamChambers.com. You get her book. You check out her videos. And you just start working on being the person you want to be, the person who's comfortable in front of the room, the person who's confident, no matter what they're asked to talk about. And you can be that person. Pam became that person. And she can help you to become that person, too. Now, viewers, next week, if you tune in at 1 on Tuesdays, 1 PM on Tuesdays, I'll be working here with Katie Flaschner, a ballroom dancing expert. And we'll be talking all about how you can get started on ballroom dancing and why you should. See you then.