 Hello and welcome to the drum history podcast. We are joined today back by my friend, Mr Chris Ruscio. Chris, welcome back on the podcast. Thank you. Very excited to be here again. Talking about Lars this evening. Again, you can't get any better. No, you can't get any better. And the first one was awesome. We're talking about the gear of Lars Ulrich. Part one was basically his origin as a young drummer up to basically the end of the 80s, which we're going to pick up there and then get some some info from still in the 80s and then move forward. So Chris, this is going to be we're going to try and get through from where we left off through to the today. I mean, you just saw Metallica not too long ago. So we'll get to that point as well. So we're going to talk about a couple things kind of in that same era and then we'll move forward from there. So go ahead and take it away and we'll this will be cool. Okay, so I wanted to make some corrections from our last episode. You know, you know, I want to keep all the information is as true as I can. So I believe I said on the Imperial star and the superstar, the US superstar tour kit, I believe I said he was using Ebony ambassadors on the on the reso heads. That's actually Ebony pinstripe. So I wanted to correct that. I also wanted to talk about the monsters of rock snare drum. I believe I said that was a king beat. That's a master craft. So I wanted to correct that. That's a master craft 80 56. So correct that. And we also we talked about the Japan 86 kit. And I remember saying, you know, I don't know what the makeup of the wood is, but I went ahead and researched that. And it's some birch and some cordia mixed. So I just wanted to get that information out there and correct that. So, you know, and so we can keep everything, you know, true, no wrong information. No, I appreciate you doing the research and you were forgiven of your very small mistakes. Thank you. Thank you. So I want to discuss something pretty pretty neat, something I didn't know existed, you know, for many, many years till I got my first superstar kit. So I believe this was part of the superstar Imperial star line. It was something called a shell support. Now what a shell support is, if you can imagine the two pipes in a symbol stand how they extend, well, a shell support, it extends, it's got a rubber foot on the bottom, and it's got a threaded rod with a wing nut. So what that does is that goes up through the grommet hole, the wing nut tightens, and you extend it and you put pressure on the shell. That was mainly done to support those massive, massive power toms. So it just nuts, man. I've never, I mean, have done the power Tom episode. I've done, I've never seen that ever. But it almost, again, for people who are like listening and not watching, it almost reminds me of like one of those like things that you extend on your steering wheel. It doesn't really look like that, but just to like, like a club. Yeah, like it's like the drum version of the club. Yeah. And so the grommet hole was right behind the bass drum Tom out. So it kept a lot of pressure on there. I assume he used them. That was top of the line that came with the Imperial stars that came with the superstars. And really, after that, they never did it again. They don't have it on the grand stars. I don't see it on the art stars. So it's something I thought was pretty cool to not to gloss over. I don't want to gloss over that. That's pretty cool. No. And to state the obvious, it is to support the integrity of the shell under the massive weight of the power toms, the power toms. And that that shell is not weak either. So I don't know. Yeah. They must have known something down there at Tom to include them. But that was pretty cool. Yeah. Interesting. So really quick, I'll read it. The description on the photo you sent with many drummers playing single headed bass drums. The Tom a shell support can perform several functions. It will prevent overling of the shell due to Tom Tom weight, prevent damage and transit and keep a pillow or other muffler in place. It's cool. Yeah. Not a bad idea. You know, it's a three for one. Yeah. And they and they stopped doing that really after after 86, when they moved on to grand star, you didn't really see it again. So I thought that was pretty cool. And like I said, I didn't know about it for many years. Very cool. Yeah. You just kind of look at a catalog and you gloss right over. And I have I have a set and they are pretty neat. And and then like I said, that was it. Tom didn't didn't really use them again. So so I wanted to definitely bring that up. I believe I imagine he would use them. He had the power toms, you know, they were offering that that was top of the line. I don't see why he wouldn't use it. Honestly, he's got big toms. Yeah. I wonder how many of those are floating around right now. Or if people have it and they just think like, this is just a piece of hardware and they don't know what it goes. Right. I didn't know what it was either. I'm like, what am I supposed to do with this thing? And then I'm looking at it. I'm like, oh, that's got to be a shell support. So yeah, it's something something something more rare. Yeah. All right. What else do we have? Okay. So I want to get into and I know we spoke about hit the two high hats, you know, he had the auxiliary high hat on the right. And he had his main high hat. I did want to mention that he used a clutch used a drop clutch. Now in many magazines and many articles, this was always, you know, this was said to be a DW clutch. Okay. Now when I was doing my research and I was trying to find this DW clutch, I could never find this thing. I was on DW message boards and Facebook groups and I'm asking around and still to this day, nobody has seen this DW clutch. So, you know, I'm, I'm talking, you know, I got some guys also on the Facebook and the Instagram and they said, Hey, I see you're not running that clutch. And I'm like, I can't find it. And they're like, you know what, it's a guy, Justin, Justin Vincent, good guy. He said, you know what, that's a cannon clutch. That's what he's using. And I said, brand cannon, which is not the most high end. Right. Cannon percussion. So I'm like, no, it's a DW, but I'll hold up an example of it. When you look in the videos, especially like Seattle 89 and a mountain view had some clear pictures, this was the shape. I remember this being the shape and I could never find it. I'm like, well, it looks like a Rogers, but it's not a Rogers. And then when he told me it was that cannon, that matches up. So there's some conflicting information out there. But I really think it's the cannon. And I wanted to bring that up. If you want to, if you want to take a look at the videos too, for the people out there watching and listening, this shape matches it. So I believe that he's using a cannon clutch up until the load error when he now we can see it's definitely a DW. Yeah. Can you explain, I've seen them, I've used them, I think on a few kits back when I worked at like Guitar Center in Samash, what is the purpose of a drop clutch? A drop clutch is so, you know, on the fly, you can basically drop the hi-hat to a closed position. When you step on the pedal, it picks it up, it holds it up. Now, now I want to switch to closed real quick. I could tap that with the stick. It'll drop down for me. But when you press the pedal, it catches it and opens it. It picks up wherever you have it set. So you could have it set up at the most minute adjustment, drop it down, pick it up and do all kinds of neat things. And so he definitely definitely did have those on his kit. And after matching it up and Justin helping me out there, I believe it could be a cannon clutch. And before we move on, I wanted to discuss one more pretty cool thing. So Lars always had like a stick holder on the right side. For many, many years, it was pretty much it was the bottom half of a symbol stand. I would describe it as like an old cheap symbol stand. I actually, you know, I have one here, you could see it's just like a single brace. See how I have the stick in there? Yeah. Comes out if he needs to use it. Goes back in and it holds it like that. He always kept one on the right side. Up until Black Album. Black Album, Torquette, it did change. He pretty much put the clamp on here. And now you hold three sticks. Oh, cool. So that was a pretty cool thing I wanted to bring up. Yeah, that's interesting. It's almost like overkill to use a whole symbol stand to carry one stick. Right. But the technology of that little like what you always see now on like what you had that little kind of clamp, maybe that didn't exist before that or something like that. Right. Yeah. See, nowadays, he uses like a bag and he has something like this, but they make something for it. So back then, especially when you kill them all, he probably had something laying around. And he said, well, hey, you know, let me let me put a stick in here. And that's pretty much all it is the cheapest stand you could find. I remember I remember them describing it as we said, he sweats and spits a lot. They said it was an old rusty single braced, you know, cheap stand that he would hold the stick in. So that's one of those deep dive gear things that gear nerds know about. So yeah, yeah, that's that's pretty cool. So cool. And then moving along here. So where do we go from there? So we talked about the The Damage Incorporated Tour last last episode, but I wanted to mention something pretty cool in October 4, 6 and 7 of 89. These were the last three shows of the Justice Tour. They were in Sao Paulo, Brazil and Rio de Janeiro. Apparently, they couldn't get all his gear down there. So he has this. Well, it's a Pearl World series. But it's it's a customized kid. It's got flames all over it. Yeah, if you when you see the picture, you'll see it's got flames all over it. Concert toms. It looks to me like all his gear did make it down there, except for the shell. So his symbol stands are there, his symbols. And he's got this. I probably he probably rented it or something. So I did look into it a little bit. And it's actually like some guy who customizes drums. I think it's called Luthier. All the stuff was in Portuguese, so I couldn't really dig too deep into it. Sure. But so it was the four rack toms, the two kick drums. He only had one floor, Tom. But it's a sight to behold all the flames on there. It's cool. But like, honestly, that kid, it's funny how that happens where it lives. The kid is living its life. And then something like this happens and it becomes a part of history. Yeah. You know, you know, the three shows never seen again. And here we are talking about it. But so it's definitely it was a Pearl World series. When you when you look into it, you could see the old style Pearl Tom mounts. Okay. But it was customized and it was like an independent drum shop down there. And I knew I seen this thing before somewhere. And I did see a photo of Igor Cavallera from a supple tour. He was using it to a little really. And, you know, they're down in Brazil and that thing is down in Brazil. So just some cool information there. I wanted to, you know, kind of honorable mention kind of thing. So it's a cool paint job. I mean, it's it's it might not be everyone's taste, but like, it's clearly like a dude who like paints hot rods or something like that. That's what I would describe it as like an old hot rod flame job. So yes, exactly. Yeah. So it's an honorable mention. I wanted to bring it up. It is you can see it on YouTube. And there are a few known pictures. But if you know, you type that in, you know, Brazil 89, you'll see not the best quality, but you'll you'll see a couple of videos on it. So cool. Something I wanted to bring out there. So very cool. All right. So that's so that's the 80s. That's damage damage justice tour. We're wrapping that up. Okay. So there's a there's a couple quick tours in between. So there's a tour in the 90s. I think it's about May, May 11th to May 26th. It's a tour with Dio Bonham and I think Warrior Soul. It's a quick tour. So now he's using what looks to me to be white grand stars. Now I remember we discussed the garage days kit, how he was in that ad with the beer and he was standing over a white grand star. It looks to be like he brought that kit back to me. It's a white it's a white kit. I know it was in the 90s and they had something called grand star two at the time. Before before we get too deep in it, let me talk about the grand star line a little bit because if you're listening or watching, you could be a little confused. I mean, I'm confused sometimes to just say about it. So first came out in 86 with something called Crestar. Now Crestar was a short lived in name only. They changed that to a grand star custom. Now grand star custom was an eight ply birch shell lacquered inside and out. It was the more high end. Right underneath of it, they had regular grand stars. It had like a cheaper a cheaper badge. It was seven ply and it was wrapped. That went all the way through the 80s. In the 90s, they bought out the grand star twos. The grand star twos were seven ply birch and they were wrapped. They shared all the hardware as the art stars. So I believe him to be using grand stars from that period. The ad says grand star two, but when you look at it, I think it's grand star custom because we know we like to switch to a single lugs, but I'm seeing the same bass drum spurs and the Tom mounts on the shell as the grand star custom. I don't think he would switch that over. You know what I'm saying? The spurs and the mounts, I believe it to be a grand star. So it's a white grand star custom at the same size as he used on the damage justice tour. He's got the Danish flag. He's got the monkey mounted there. Everything is kind of like still stuck on that damage justice tour. You know, it's got that same feel, but now we're using the white grand star custom and we have chrome lugs on it as can be seen in the pictures. So that happened for like two weeks, three weeks, they used that. That was a couple quick shows with Dio and that's before they started recording the black album. And you said a lot, and this kind of answers the question that a lot of people will have in the comments is what happens to these kits after they're done using them. You said a lot of them they take back to like. They take back. And now as we start to get into the 90s, we know there's multiple, multiple kits. I mean, we used to see two of the art stars on the stage, you know, he would go between both of them. And there's, you know, I remember reading when they got to say in anger, there was like seven kits. There's two kits on the stage. They're sending two up to the next town. They keep a couple for like radio shows or, you know, stuff with Sirius if they have to do something that would Sirius XM so they keep like two or three on hand. So there's multiple, multiple kits. But when I talked to Jimmy, which I believe to be accurate, he takes all the stuff back. So that's what I'm thinking that that grand star custom is the same one in the ads from the garage days. And it moved up to the ad in the 90s. He's kind of got the same beer in the picture. You know, he's got the same haircut. And so something that kind of gives it away. Let's keep moving from there. Okay. So now we're getting up to the, to the famous kit, the white, the white art star, maybe the most famous, if not the second most famous kit in the world. I think Mr. Mr. Pierre holds that most famous kit. So quickly, the, the Wherever I May Rome's tour starts in August 1st. And they're in Petaluma, California, kind of before they get going. He's using, he's using that gray grand star custom from the Damage Justice Tour for two shows. There's videos on it. But it's got the chrome hardware this time. Okay. So that's, that's what I see. And then we move, then we move into the art star era. Yeah. So that is what is behind you right now is the art stars. That's the art, that's the art start to, yeah, our start to, which look awesome. Yeah. So for years and years and years, this has been a big, big point of debate. And I'm going to clear it up today. They are art star twos. There is no doubt they are art star twos. They do look like grand stars because they have the single black lugs. He was always partial to the single lugs. So he had them customized for him. Sure. So they're art star twos. Now the unique thing about this kit is the sizes are 10 by 10, you have a 12 by 11, 14 by 13, 16 by 15, and then a two 18 by 16s. Aside from the floor toms, everything had a two inch difference. The diameter and the depth were all spread two inches apart. I remember here. And so they could, you know, hear them better in the mix. So they would stand out opposed to having your 12, 13, 14, 15 16 by 24 bass drums. There was always a debate about the snare on this art start to kit. I don't know if some bad information got out there, but it was always said to be a white painted bell brass. I don't believe that to be true. I believe it was the the PM Maple 526 art wood. Because I difference. Yeah, I've never seen ever any any mention of a white painted bell brass, any pictures, any indication. You know, you think on a kit this popular, something would get out there. Sure. There would be some kind of information. So I think it just to be just some bad information. I know he used a bell brass in the studio. But I really don't think that this is a bell brass, because you have to remember to this, this was a retail kit. This was released as retail. And in in the ad, it was said that he would do it under one condition that if it was an exact replica of what he used on stage. And it didn't come with a white bell brass. It came with a maple 526. So I mean, there's some pictures too, where you can see kind of under and in it looks wood. It looks like wood to me. Yeah. Yeah. So I really don't believe it to be bell brass. In the studio. Yeah, we know it was a Gretsch bell brass snare, but but this this was a maple, an ArtStar maple PM, I think 526 power metal snare. That's what I believe that to be. So cool. Beautiful. Iconic drums and then symbols. Do we change anything with symbols at that point? Well, the symbols, that's another thing. There's still the AC Resilient. But I'm reading that and the the research I've done, they're saying that there's a few rock crashes in there. Now, he's always used a medium or medium thin crash. And as we got up to like the current day, it's a projection crash. Maybe it is, you know, it's hard to know without getting actually seeing it. You can't really tell from the pictures, but we're still using an 18 and a 17 on the left and a 1918 and 17 on the right. Some information, like I said, says it's rock crash, but the rest of it is medium thin. On the other side, would he run two different kinds like that? I don't know. Yeah. Honestly, honestly, I don't know. Gotcha. No ride though. We're still no ride. We still don't have a ride. We have a, it looks like a 19K China boy. And that was probably the same on the Damage Justice I might have messed that up to. I believe that was a 19 inch K China as well. Cool. So now this came in a couple variations, this white ArtStar. It looks like right after they left the Phoenix Theater in California, they went on a European, kind of like a European leg of their tour. These stands, all the hardware was chrome. You had the black shell hardware, but all your symbol stands were chrome. Even on the snare, we could see that the hoops are chrome. So it wasn't fully black yet. So that was one of the variations. It still has a Danish flag on it. It still has the monkey on it. This is all going to change, but this is kind of like the European variation. So I remember reading that a gentleman at Tama named Joe Hibbs was in charge of this project. And you know, when they built this kit, they said they wanted to bring over the single style grand star lugs to the ArtStar because the ArtStar, I didn't mention that before, that's a nine ply maple. And it comes with a one piece lug. So they wanted to like the damage justice kit. They wanted the single lugs. So Joe was in charge of getting all this ready for the video music awards of 91. And I remember reading, he had like 1800 pieces, including the symbol stands that he had to get powder coated or plated. So yeah, the video music awards, I believe they were in September 91. So they came back quick from Europe. They did the video music awards. And now that kit, everything's black on it. Symbol stands, all the hoods, all the hardware. So also the Tama logos on the front reso heads, they're a little smaller. You know, if you're watching on YouTube at home, you could see how these logos are a little smaller from the variation when they were in Europe with all the chrome hardware. So that was another change. The Danish flag is gone now. The monkey is gone now. We'll see him again later down the road, but he's gone now. So after the video music awards, they go back to, they go back on their European leg. And we see the chrome variation again with the chrome hardware and the chrome snare hoops. And when we get back, I think it's Peoria, Illinois. I think it was October, I think the end of October 91. Now we see the kit again with the black hardware, and that's it. We don't see the early chrome variation anymore. Now it's from there on, it's all that black symbol stands, black hoops, black lugs. I mean, the clutch was black. It's definitely cooler to have the all black and like just the powder coating. I've always loved the powder coated hardware and stuff like that of any brand. It's always like, even as a kid, most kids who were not drummers, I didn't know what powder coating the process even was. I still didn't really know fully how it works. I just know I want it and I like it. But yeah. I mean, it was kind of not many people were doing it back then. I think, like I said last episode, I think Randy Castillo from Ozzie had a white and black kit, but it was single lugs, a single lug Thomas. So maybe that's also why Lars wanted to split it to the single lugs or to the split lugs. I'm sorry. Sure. So it wasn't cool, but this is just like, and these particular, these lugs look awesome. I mean, it's just the shark tooth they call the shark tooth and it stands out on stage and it's almost like with everything being black, it makes the actual shell just pop. Everything just pops. And I mean, I mean, if you look back there, we got a 16 by 15 mounted rectum. It's a four ton. Do you know how heavy that was? Oh my God. One of these days, I got to stick it on the scale fully loaded because the thing is massive. I'd really like to know what it weighs. But so and doing some more research, they'd never made a 16 by 15 until the art star two and the grand star two came around. Then when you look in the catalog, they actually offered that as it's labeled as a rectum. Now, I don't I don't know if they thought that somebody would mount it up above. Maybe it was supposed to be like a floor on the lower mounted Tom, but yeah, he did it. Yeah. Yeah, because they would have, you know, you could technically put it on a symbol stand or its own mount on a, you know, like a mount of a symbol stand on the floor, but but Lord, it's huge to put it up top. I mean, and that says something about their Tom mount switch. And that's another thing. So early variation, we have the mth 50 and see if I get in the camera there. Hex rod here. And we have a hex rod where the Tom goes. And then he switched over to the all black to an mth 300. We have this sort of round big around pipe. And we have a gnarled kind of just circular rod. And that was the changes with the Tom mounts. But something has to be said for these Tom mounts to hold that giant rack Tom up. I mean, it's just amazing the quality of the hardware. So really the Japanese stuff. I mean, this is kind of why the why they came in and sort of killed off some of the legacy brands because the hardware alone was so much better and things were more affordable. And I mean, still to this day, even nowadays, it still holds up. You know, like I said, last time, some of the pedals, we got some better technology, but the hardware, I mean, there's just there's no debate. The simple stands, it's just amazing stuff. So yeah, yeah. And we have also, I'm sure you probably have a model number or something, but the simple stands with the weights at the bottom. Yes, yes, man. That's interesting. So that's huge. That's a change to he's using now. So we went from the Tom of Titan to it's now it's called Thomas Stilt. And the stands, he's used a particular model numbers and HC 104 TB. And like you said, they're they're just the massive symbol stands, they've got the counterweights on them. And his he had them done in black. So really, really heavy stuff, really heavy double braced. Now what the stilt was is kind of if you're listening, if you can kind of picture where the where the three legs are at the bottom, the tripod, there's there's that pole in the middle. This had a collar where you could slide it up and down and kind of suck the leg up until the symbol stand in. So that was that was something new too. And they ran that for a while. And he used that pretty much up all through St. Anger. He used that hard. Wow, really? Yeah, yeah. And I didn't notice that. Okay, that hardware at that's some amazing stuff. Yeah. So that's what I mean, is it like and this is just like kind of looking at it like, I guess it's just to keep because like now we have symbol stands that are much lighter symbols symbols aren't really lighter now. No, no. Is that much like the counterweight? Is that necessary, you think to that? Well, only so now what Tommy uses, they're using the road pro. And so I do own both and I find that, you know, even with the new technology, with the same size symbols, my road pros are shaken around. They're moving around because, you know, I don't want to make it all about me, but I keep like tape on the rug. So if I ever have to move stuff, I know where it goes. And you know, I'll do I'll play for a couple minutes or a couple hours and the symbol stand is moved. You know, it's out of the tape area with the with the the stilts and the Titans, they don't move at all. You know, so that's the difference I noticed with them. And there's like literally like there's there's more on the line when you're playing an arena and this kit and it can't be moving. So right, exactly. That makes that makes sense. So yeah, it looks like he's got some cool stuff to like a little cup holder attached to his like. Yeah. So what that is, if you zoom in, it's just like a cup holder. I don't know. I don't know what stores they had back then, but it's kind of a car cup holder you'd find at Walmart or something. Yeah, like a truck stop or something. Yeah. And it's cut up and it's got white duct tape on the side of the shell. So yeah. And like I said, he's got the the stick mount with the clamp to have three sticks on the other side. On the other hi hat stand, he has like a bag now to hold the four sticks on that side. When he had the Titans on the Damage Justice, it was kind of just like a stick resting in the hi hat legs, you know what I'm saying? Kind of like wedged in the opening, just leaning there. So he's kind of getting, you know, some better equipment there and doing things a little differently. Yeah. And this is the era of like, looks like we've got spandex pants with white socks. I'm glad you said that because I'm going to bring this, you're going to think I'm a nerd, but wow, those are the shoes. Well, these haven't been used by him, but these are one of the shoes. Explain, explain a little bit. So they're ASIC gel light threes. I feel kind of crazy, you know, even showing something like that. But you know, this is the time in your life to show things like that. So we got some orange and black gel light threes. I don't know how much more I could, you know, dig into it. But this, if you look at pictures, these are the shoes. So those are cool looking shoes. I mean, honestly, for today, and you know, those are cool. So you got the spandex, you got the ASICs. Definitely an interesting time. Yeah. Well, I mean, you've got Simon Phillips wearing his like Tama branded spandex pants and stuff like that. Honestly, though, like these guys are athletes the way they're playing. It's like good to, I mean, it's, you know, it's, especially then, I mean, they play for a still to this day, they, when we went down to giant, I'm sorry, I could call the giant stadium MetLife Stadium. It was a two hours and 15 minutes there and nonstop. So these, you're like, they're athletes, they're just going nonstop. So totally. Yeah. All right. Well, anything else we should touch on while we're at this point? Well, we should talk about the pedals. So the pedals kind of did go through a change. I mean, I believe it was the Probeat 45s, HP 45s, when the kit first came out in the variation, in the first variation. So he did switch to the HP 90s, the first generation iron covers. That's the one with the silver board and the black inlays, really, really cool pedals. So that was, that was switched. We had, we're running a RIMO ebony ambassadors on the bottom. We're still using pinstripes on the top. We still have an auxiliary arm, auxiliary hi-hat arm on the right. So the symbols really don't change much in layout from the damaged justice tour. The throne is an HT 90. And he always kept towels on them. Like I said, he sweats a lot. And I, you know, you do slide around on some of the vinyl or leather. So there was always some towels there. There was always kind of a multi-clamp on the main hi-hat stand with a towel hanging over it, like a Tama multi-clamp. And then you drape a towel over it. So those are some pieces of hardware there. Yeah. And I, and you have some pictures, too, of like, like ads with like Lars showing this off. I mean, it's, it's worth saying that, like, he's a main draw to Tama. Like, Tama is like ruling the world at that point. That's, I mean, the Tama, Metallica, Lars, they're ruling the world right now. And that's, that is the next thing we should go into. They actually released a retail kit. The story goes, they released 25 of them, 20 came to America. I think five were supposed to go to Europe, but only three made it. Two got damaged. And there is a, I believe I've included a picture of the only retail ad that I've seen in English. There's another one in German. But it says the same thing we discussed that, you know, he talks about if he's going to do it and he's going to release a retail kit, he wants it to be an exact replica of what he uses on stage. So then they get into, well, Tama said, you know, that might drive the cost up too much. So he said, well, why don't we release one exact and one with maybe like Chrome symbol stands like the first variation we saw in the European tour kind of, you know, Chrome stands Chrome hardware, not black to keep the cost down. And then he then he talked about in the ads royalties and this and that, and he said he wasn't going to take any royalties, kick them back to you and get the savings. But for being such a popular kit back then, there's really not much information on that retail kit. And that's another thing I was talking with, you know, Billy Harrington actually owns one of these retail kits. That's what it is. I didn't realize the level of rarity. I didn't think it was like a 10,000 were made or something. Right. There was 25, three were damaged. And Billy was saying the same thing. Hey, I can't really find any information on this. Same with me. You have the one ad, and then you have one in German, and there's not much information on it. So if anybody from Tama is watching this, please go into the vaults, you know, give us a build sheet. Some guy from the most one of the most popular kits in the world, you know, I'd like to see some more. So but crazy. I've run into I've run into him three times, you know, on eBay, and there's always been something in the way just just how life goes. And I've missed him three times. I'm not going to miss the next time. Next time you're like selling your car or something. Well, do we know how much originally they were selling for and what do they typically go for now? I've heard two numbers. I don't know if they're, you know, they're accurate, but I heard five grand back in 1991, and I heard 10 grand. Maybe that's, you know, 10 grand for the one with the chrome stands, five grand, I'm sorry, with the black stands, five grand for the one with the chrome. I don't know. That seems kind of high for back then, but I mean, it was the most popular kit in the world at the time. I mean, that's, you know, quickly Googling it because it's easy now 11. That's equivalent to $11,000 in purchasing power today. Yeah. So it was quite expensive. Honestly, the last time I saw it, I missed one about five years ago. It was up for 12 grand, but it finally sold for six grand. You know, you can imagine how hard I was kicking myself when I missed that no one got down to six grand. I should have jumped on it. That's a story for a different day. That's a lot, but that's but I mean, this is what you're, this is what you do. This is what you do. So, you know, you live, you learn, I regret it. I can't go back. I've run into it three times. I'm hoping one more. I did see you'll get it. Yeah, I did see one in 2019, but it was heavily damaged. Why somebody would let a kit like this get in such bad shape? I mean, well, I mean, the Gene Krupa drum set that I just had an episode on was Gene's drums, and it was in like a wet basement for decades. And you never know. People don't realize you never know. You might look at it and someone just someone doesn't know what it is, and it's in an attic or someone died. And it's, you know, exactly. So this thing popped up. The price was actually four grand on reverb, but you know, it was missing lugs. It was missing kick drum hoop claws. There was no snare. There were no stands. It was just beat up. So I let it go. But that, you know, that was going for four grand. I know the guy who got it. So congratulations to him. I mean, if you got the time to put into it. And there was not much information on these still to this day. So that that kind of, you know, that surprises me of a kit that that popular. There's not much information. But and each one of them came with a serial number and a badge inside signed by Lars. So if anybody tries this, you know, say, hey, you know, this is Lars kit, look inside, there's a batch with a serial number and he signed it. So that was another. That was another thing with the retail kit. So very cool. He did that and kicked back any like royalty kind of payment. Yeah, that's what it says in the ad. So yeah. Yeah. But yeah, so that I mean, they did release another one in 2017. Another, you know, a Lars deeper purple retail kit, but nothing, nothing quite as popular as this. This is iconic. This is iconic still to this day. Whenever, whenever you talk about the drums, everybody mentions, hey, well, they say the white grand star, but I'm telling you, it's the white art star too. They say, hey, that that white drum set from the black album, everybody just brings that up. So this is this, this is the height. This is the kit. So yeah, very cool. All right, good to know. So let's keep chugging here. Okay, so this kit goes on till about summer of 94. Um, now we get some major, major changes that kind of are still in play today. So summer 94, it's the same. Well, I shouldn't say the same art star kit, but it's, it's the same style. When you, when you look at it off the bat, it looks like he took the 10 by 10 and the 16 by 15 off. But when you dig into it some more, these are virgin kick drums. You can tell from the video, there is no Tom mount in them. So if, if he were just to pull the toms off, you would see a hole or you would see the Tom mounts that he left. So he got two new kick drums for this kit. So he got two 16 by 24s and he's using the 12 by 11 and the 14 by 13. He's using the two 18 by 16s in the summer of 94. So he's cut it down dramatically. Sucks the hi-hat in closer. Now the story was, I believe he went to Alice in Chains rehearsal and he was playing, I think the guy's name is Sean Kenny or something like that. So he was, he was playing his drums and he had, you know, one mounted rack Tom and he said, he commented, you know, the hi-hat stand is right in front of me instead of all the way over to the side. And it's just a much easier to play. Yeah. So, so that led to him downsizing. Yeah. And didn't Alice in Chains famously like comment about the hair cuts on like MTV unplugged or something? Like friends don't let friends get haircuts. Right, right, right. So this, we're still a little bit before that. He's still, I know, but it's funny that connection with right, right. Yeah. So now still got the black hardware. Now the interesting thing about this summer 94 tour is he's using three Chinas. So the China we know today on the right side where the ride would normally be, we see that pop up for the first time in 94, right there on the right, the lower one that we still have today. This is when we first see it. Okay. On this case, we're still using the regal tip, five B's wrapped. That's, that's going to come to an end also. And we're still using the A's zillions. And I should mention all along from the pretty much from ride to lightning till today, everything's brilliant on the symbols always has been. Is now was then that that doesn't change. Everything's brilliant. I didn't mention that. No, but he was using, we assume old zillions before pre label zillions were just assuming but then it was Platinum's, then it was A's. It's A's and in the end it's going to be A customs. Yeah, yeah. And everything's been brilliant. So now he switches to, he has a double Tom stand. I think it was an HW99N double Tom stand. Essentially what that is is just the MTH 300, but instead of being mounted in the kick drums, it's on its own stand now. It's in between the two kick drums in the middle. Cool. I mean, I think it's cool. He's obviously, so he's cut down two Toms. So it's basically he's just lost two Toms. He's lost two Toms. There's still power times at this point. You know, they still got the black heads at 14 by 13. I mean, it's still pretty big. It's still pretty big power Tom, but he's, he's still got it. So. All right. That's cool. Well, it seems like this two Tom in the middle setup went into other kits down the road. So, you know, that he obviously liked that setup. Yeah. That's, that's still the way it is to this day too. Yep. Exactly. Okay. Well, let's keep, keep going. Oh, actually, while you said, I don't want to forget, you said Regal Tip sticks. Regal Tips. Yeah. I heard the other day I read online and this is something that I'm, I, there can be more info about it. I believe Regal Tip is actually trying to like reopen and go back, come back kind of out of the, but they got COVID problems and family members passing away and stuff. That's, that's good to hear. I would like to see some five Vs come back out on the market. Definitely. Yeah. Yeah. Don't hold me to it, but everyone go do their own research. But I think that's what I saw. Good. That's good to hear. So. Yep. All right. Like I said, the three Chinas, this didn't last long. I believe it's being 18 where the right, where normally where a ride symbol would be. He uses a China still to this day. I believe that to be an 18 and probably a 19 and a 20 probably still using the K China. Very hard to give you 100% definitive answer on that. There's not many pictures of 94, the kit available. So it's hard to, you know, really see what he's using. But if you were interested to see it, that one was used on Woodstock 94. So if you pulled that up on YouTube, you can get a, you know, you can get a show there with that, with him using that kit. So. Nice. One of the first CDs I bought a used double disc CD set of Woodstock 94. So special memories for me. That was unique show. Yeah. Very unique. Seems like a bit of a mess. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. All right. That's cool. So then next we have Donnington. Donnington 95. Everybody comes back with a little different hair. It wasn't a long tour. It was three shows. I think they did a couple in London and then there was, there was like a contest up in Taktoyaktak. I hope I pronounced that right. Way up in the Northern Territories, I remember doing them, they did something and like they called it the big igloo. I think Hole was there, Veruca Salt. So it was a contest. Some people had won and they went up to see that show. So this was kind of like a three show. They called it Escape from the Studio 95. So right between, you know, Summer Night, the white Artstar 2 and the Silver Sparkle Star Classic from Load and Reload, it's kind of another mixed up kit. So I'm seeing two Artstar, well, they've always been Artstar. I'm seeing the Artstar kick drums, but now with the Artstar hardware in crawl. And they look to be downsized to a 22 by 16. The single lug hardware and the two toms are definitely a 10 by 10. I think it's a 10 by it could be 10 by nine and a 12 by 10 or 12 by 11. You know, some shows he's got the black grand star hardware 10 inch and then he's running the single or the yeah, the single lug Artstar chrome hardware and the 12 and then vice versa. And then some shows he's using both of the grand stars with the black hardware. It was kind of just like kind of a kit. Maybe he just threw together and sorry, I bring these out for three shows. Yeah. So because again, the amount of effort because if it's not a world tour mega arena, you know, 70 shows or whatever, whatever, most people don't now notice on stage. Right, right. So they had those three shows on the symbols seem to be the same. You know, I think I think we lost two Chinas or lost one China. I think he's now using two. I don't see the third one anymore. I think he's still using the right side high hat. Not many not many pictures of this. You can see Donnington 95 on YouTube. It's not the best quality, but you could see it. And he's running remote clear clear ambassadors on the bottom. Uh, remote clear pinstripes on the top looks to be the two 18 by 16 floor toms 95 is when we first see him use the Eastern ahead aluminum sticks. So 94 was the last time that he used the regal tip 5B woods. I remember him saying and I remember reading that, uh, you know, when they were doing that summer tour, the nights would get cold. Some nights would get cold and he would snap like four or five sticks, the first two songs. And he said he just couldn't do it anymore. He said, you know, he loved regal tip and they were always so good to him, but out of necessity, he had to change. So 94 is marks the end of him in regal tip. So now he's with Easton ahead. They are aluminum sticks and they kind of got that plastic sleeve that lays over them. Still using them to this day. Good sticks, different sound on the symbol than opposed to wood. I've never used the ahead sticks. I've seen them. I think at Guitar Center, I held them once, but the whole thing is that they, um, they just like don't break, right? Well, they do break, but not as often. So I had a pair. My first pair was 99 when 99 when I first started getting into drumming and, you know, they were 29 95 back then. I don't, I don't know what they are now. They, they do, they do last a bit longer, but the sleeves tend to wear out and you'd have to go get replacement sleeves. And now when the replacement sleeves wear out, it's not easy to pull them off and put them back on. I can remember, you know, I was like 17 or 18. I was always borrowing my mother's hair dryer to get these sleeves on. You'd have to heat them up and slide them on. Um, so, but they did break not, not as fast, but when they broke, it's like 30, $30, you know, to go get another pair. I mean, nowadays it's a little easier. Maybe, you know, he's endorsed by him, but back then being 17 or 18, you really couldn't do it. You don't want to pay 30 bucks. That's like with the drum heads now. It's like, I broke a head. I got to pay for this thing. It's definitely stronger than would, but, and he mentioned this too. They sound different on the symbols. And I remember reading in the studio, you know, sometimes he'd have a wood stick in his right hand and the aluminum stick in his left, just to get that desired sound on the symbols. So I do remember him mention that because they do, they do sound differently. The aluminum and the kind of plastic sleeve. So yeah. So that's 95 and that picks up. And like I said, that's still this way today. He's still using them. And they got some kind of, I remember we discussed how he had in the earlier years, probably it was the Torna green tennis wrap tape. And it moved up to probably stick handler when he was endorsed by them. But now he's using the Easton makes kind of a black wrap too. Not quite like that stuff. It reminds me more of the stuff you'd put on a baseball bat. I mean, Easton is a baseball bat company too, but it's like this black wrap. So he uses that over the aluminum. Okay, I was going to say, I mean, in my mind, I was the name was sounding familiar. It is the same company that makes baseball. Yeah, pretty much aluminum baseball bats. I don't know if they go by Easton anymore. Now I just read like ahead. So maybe they dropped that name. Maybe they got pulled out. I'm not sure there. I had an Easton baseball bat as a kid. Yeah. But in the early years, I could remember the ads when they would come out in like the modern drummer, he was Easton ahead. And now I just see ahead, man. So maybe I'm overlooking it or maybe somebody knows what changed, but I can't really answer that one. So stuff changes. Yeah. So all right. So then if we move forward here, we're at a pretty big change. We're at a pretty big change. So so now load has come out 90 summer 96. He is he is now using so art star and grand star pretty much yesterday's news at this time, the new thing going on is star classic Thomas star classic. He's using the maple. I believe that was also a nine ply star classic maple single lugs, not a one piece. So he always liked that. And they had something come out back then. It was called the star cast mounting system. So no longer was the mount bolted to the shell or screwed to the show, whatever you want to call it. It was kind of like a bracket that, you know, bolts to the hoop. And then it's kind of like so what it does is it lets the shell, you know, resonate some more. So just now the norm on like a rims mount or anything. It's a nicer and out more scientifically. It's like better for the drums. Right. So the first time we see that is 96 with the Thomas star classic. So that kit was famous. And I believe Cunning Stunts and he used that all the way up to 2000. I believe the last time we saw it was Jason's last performance when they did fade to black in 2000. But so that kit was used for a while. So it was called silver sparkle was the color. The sizes are now 16 by 22 on the kicks. So we're kind of, well, I should say 95 kit is kind of mimicking what was to be in 96. So we're using 10 by 9 12 by 10. And we're still using a 16 by 16 and 18 by 16. So we're done with power toms pretty much except for the floor toms. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they're still bigger than what we got going on today. But the power toms are pretty much gone. You're not going to see a 16 by 15 or a 15 by 14. Thank you. No more that that's done. So okay. So that's these drums are awesome. I mean, were people like, like, were, were Lars like, you know, enthusiasts such as yourself, is this kit received well, or is this kind of Lars changed? And I know there's hair cuts and all this. But do people like these in the deep in the Lars world? It's like, it's like two different factions. Like, like a guy like me, I mean, you see what's behind me. I'm kind of stuck there. Nothing against the star classic. They're wonderful drums. And, and, you know, I'm gonna, yeah, I'm gonna agree with him. It is so much easier to play what he set up with nowadays. But it's just like, you know, these, the kids that I got behind, that's, this is what I dreamed about in like, I should say middle school. I got a lot, I got a lot of failing grades thinking about this kid behind the white art star kit, black hardware. So this is kind of so like the two factions you've got your guys, your older thrash guys, your older Metallica guys, you know, they, they're kind of into this, you know, they, I'm not going to say it wasn't perceived well, but it's, it's not as popular. I got you. So it's a sign of the times changing. And it's, I had a star classic kit. It was like my first real deal drum set I saved up for working all summer at a butcher. And I bought the drum set. And I loved it. I used it for years. And they're great. They're great drums, nothing against them. But no, I understand You just got a change of the times now. And so, so for me, it's the, it's the old power toms. That's just how I am. I'm not saying they're better or smarter, easier. That's just, I can't explain it, but I understand. Yeah, yeah. Gotcha. So all right, pedals, symbols, hardware, what do we got? So pedals, we're still using the first generation iron cobras, like, like, like the second half of the white arts, art star two kit, we're still using the first generation iron cobras. The stands are still the HC 104 TB is the real heavy duty Thomas Stilts. So now that he's moved, removed a Tom, or actually he removed two toms, but now that he removed the Tom on the left, the high hats in closer now. So he's using a high hat to base drum attachment. I don't think I wasn't able to find the model on that, but it's kind of like so it, you know, well, anybody who does drums know what it is. It clamps to the hoop. It clamps legs go up or sometimes like nowadays they make them with no legs. It's a legless high hat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he's using that. Interesting. We see a ride come back. A ride symbol comes back in 96 and not only does a ride symbol come back, we see the first ever the first time ever I see we see a splash symbol on a tour kit looks to me like he's got a 10 inch splash mounted on there above his 18 that he still has say 18 inch FX China. I could be wrong, but I think the only song I've ever heard in it was a bleeding me. So and I know they did play that live. So maybe that's solely why he had it, but he never had it before in any tour kits and to this day, he's never had it again. So that's that 96 to 2000 we see the splash. It's kind of short lived in that it lives kind of in that area. We're still using I believe at this time where I think he's down to two crashes on the right and two on the left. You know, and we're a customs now you said no, we're still a zillions at this time still brilliant. I think they're medium things now or medium, where we're still not at the projection that comes with the custom. Now he's using a Tom Bell breast there 14 by 6.5. I believe it is the PL 565 Bell breasts. That's news has been using would like we discussed. Well, you know, we had that little area where we we heard it was a Bell breast, a white coated white painted Bell breast. But you know, we really don't think so. But now he's using a Bell breast, it's confirmed it's in the pictures. So that's that's the snare. Yeah, coated controlled sound coated reverse dot. And we were on the kick drum. So black kick drum hoops. I love that. I think it looks awesome on the silver sparkling. You kind of have like a white coated ambassador reso head with the black Tom on decals. So that's pretty cool. Looks like we got he's he's smart to always have there's cup holders all over the place. There are like near the hi hat. It looks like there's one. It's like I like the little utility things like that or like or he's got towels all over like you said, the spitting and the sweating. It's like, you know, you do this all the time, you know what you need, you know, you're going to drop a stick and you're going to need to pick it up and where it needs to be. Interestingly enough, for this for years, they kind of call it that he was he said it was called the coffee table the the the second floor Tom it never it never really gets used stuff just kind of gets piled on it. But they still have to like tune it and sound check it and everything. But yeah, that's interesting because like it would be without that, it would kind of be just very different. You're used to him having that bigger of a drum set. So for him having it set up, it like feels right to have that big of a kit, even if you don't use it, right, right. It just feels right. Yeah, it's still that way to this day. He's you know, they're a little smaller, but he's still using to I mean, there's been some instances on the tour where he's moved up forward, kind of like a V stage. And you know, he his kits tend to rise from underneath the stage now. But now that he's closer to be one floor Tom, we'd be missing the second probably for you know, portability or where he is, you know, whatever he could fit in that area. So so that's kind of that's kind of what's going on with that. This star classic is pretty interesting. Oh, actually, the color anyway, during this time period, there was kind of a couple variations on it. So if you look in especially the King Nothing video, the King Nothing video, he's playing a it's probably an art star, but it's got the grand star lugs. So he's playing a silver sparkle grand star, which they didn't make that. So that was something custom. And there was also, you know, back when MTV was popular, there was something called, I think it was called the motherload contest. This was up in Aberdeen, Washington, kind of like what we talked about in Tuk Toyaktuk. It was a bunch of contest winners. And he shows up, and you could see the video on YouTube, he shows up with the kind of like the same setup as the star classic, but it's a it's a silver sparkle grand star. Or I should probably an art star, but I still get that confused. It's got the grand star single lugs is what I mean, sure, in silver sparkle, which they didn't make. And it mimics this load error star classic. So that's pretty neat. So there's a couple variations there. Yeah, if you yeah, if you wanted to check that out, it's called the motherload contest on Aberdeen, Washington. So that's pretty neat to see kind of like a bar area. There's like 50 contest winners. So that's that's a cool variation to check out on that. Yeah. And I imagine custom stuff. I mean, first off, Thomas has the ability to do a bunch of stuff to do one of their biggest. Yeah, they'll do anything. They'll do anything for us. Yeah. So and I believe that gear was given away at the end of the show. So that's yeah, he's not going to give his star classic tour kit away. No, but it's something to give away, you know. Yeah. So that is a massive change of style of kit. But it seems like for a while we stay in that same vein. So up next, I mean, that's 96 2000 to 2000, you know, you have load, reload, S&M garage ink comes out. You know, there's from now from then till now, it's it's kind of all the same layout. There's there has been changes, subtle changes. But when he went from the white art star twos to the summer 94, and then to the silver sparkle, that's the biggest that's the biggest period of change. Yeah. Well, let's just go through them though. So we got up next looks like on the list of pictures you sent, we got the green sparkle St. Anger kit, the St. Anger kit, Thomas star classic maple emerald green nine ply, we are still using the Thomas stilt stands, the HC 104 TBs. And now we're kind of using an emperor kind of coated emperor on the batter heads, and some clear ambassador on the rezzo heads. Now during this period, the monkey and the Danish flag, they do come back for a little bit in the beginning. I have seen some pictures of it. So the sizes then they're they're still using the 20 he's still using the 22 by 16 kick drums, using the 10 by eight Raktom, a 12 by 10, I believe it is. Yeah, definitely. And we go to a 16 by 14, and a 16 by 16. So that's another change. The floor, Tom's get a little smaller in the length there. And now he switches over to the second generation iron Cobras. I have awesome. Yeah, I have I still have it here. And they're nice, man. I think I have the that's an HP 900 P power glide iron Cobras. I had them myself too. They were good pedals. And an interesting thing now that we're going to talk about pedals, and this is going to go all the way back. He's always been kind of a traditional felt beater kind of guy. Everything you know, as iron Cobra went on the beater styles and sizes changed. But he's always when you look at pictures, he's always run the original felt beater. That's that's always been a thing that I've noticed. Yeah. I mean, he's seen all the evolution of every all this gear. So yeah, that's one thing you can stick with. Yeah. So that's what he that's what he's used to playing. And that's what he keeps. Dan more kick pads are coming into the picture. They came in around, you know, 96. I forgot to mention that, but they're pretty much to this day, we're using Dan more. I think it's the metal power disc kick pad. So that's there. Now, St. Anger, we have to talk about it. I feel like there's a lot of stuff with Lars that like people can have their opinions one way or another. We've been we're staying above it all. And we're like, you know, we're not getting into the debate about all the stuff about people like Lars. It's everyone has their own personal taste. Exactly. The snare sound, though, and all that stuff with St. Anger is like, I mean, it's it's different. It comes up all the time. What's your take on the whole thing? I mean, it's it's not my favorite. But it is what it is. He's you can't argue he's the most influential one of the most influential drummers of all time. So yeah, it's not my favorite. But you know, he's just he is who he is. It's they tried something. They tried something new. I'm not one of my favorites. Not a fan of the guitar sounds any of that. But you know, there's still some really good songs on there. So when you when you listen to load, reload, and then you go into St. Anger, there's some some really heavy songs on there just happens to be mixed differently, I'll say. Some people love it. Some people don't. Yeah, it's a different decade. It's a different like it's a different millennium. Things were different than two, you know, now you're getting away from the grunge and you have more you're like your Lincoln parks. I think I remember him saying something about that summer or that winter before they recorded, he was listening to a lot of Lama God and anybody who listens to Lama God when Chris Adler was the drummer, he's kind of got that snare sound to a little different. Yeah, a little different than St. Anger. But I remember reading somewhere. It may not be true, maybe rumor, but I remember reading specifically that Lars was a fan and kind of, you know, I don't want to say recreated, but that was influencing him at the time. They tried, like you said, they tried something new and it is what it is. So. Yeah. And I mean, I think most people, if you're watching this and you're in part two an hour and 10 minutes in, everyone's probably seen some kind of monster. But I think that's a pretty cool documentary just to see to get a look at their, you know, what things were happening with the band. Right. And if anything, it goes back to it's pretty cool to see all the gear that was there. If anything, if you're kind of like, I know we're doing a gear episode here. So there's just all kinds of variations of stuff when they went up into, I forget what the name of the bunker they went up to before, you know, things fell apart and James went to rehab. But there's all kinds of tama drums up there, different colors, different variations. So just watching some kind of monster just when you see all the gear, that in itself is pretty cool. But you know, I did enjoy that documentary for what it was. Yeah, it was very raw. Yeah. So the snare, though, when I'm looking at these pictures, this gets to like, is that his signature series? Yeah, we should mention that. That's another thing that changed. He gets his own signature series snare. Like you just said, it's kind of like a diamond plate steel snare. There's a model on a model number on it. It's LU 1465. You could still get it to this day. 14, six and a half deep. And he still has that to this day. But now, you know, it's in black diamond. I think last year, they released like, I think was the 30th anniversary, they released the black album version or anniversary version with the snare. It had his picture they had on the cover of the black album where their kind of faces are white or gray. And it had that on the badge. It was the 30th anniversary. It was pretty cool black diamond. Yeah, it was a cool. So he's using that now in the same anger. And he's going to be using this model up until today. Like I said, it'll go from the silver diamond plate or the whatever you want to call the color up into the black diamond nowadays. So that's another thing that did change. So change of members as well. When did Jason leave? Was that what album is he out on? So I think the last thing they did together was S&M. I remember seeing the video. It's kind of to me, it's kind of a sad video. So I never really I know it's in 2000. I never really looked at the date, but they played fade to black. And you could just tell it was really there was a little bit more of a motion in that one. He knew it was his last show. They knew it was his last show, but Lars was using the silver sparkle star classic in that video. That's on YouTube if you want to search that. So his I believe yeah, he was 90. S&M was the last thing they did together. Okay, because I'm looking at pictures and I'm going, okay, Robertson now, which I was watching the other night, I was watching Encino Man as one does. And Robert was playing bass and like the band in the high school. Really? Yeah, he's in there. Well, I got to check that out. Yes, at the end and I saw it and I don't think it's Mike Patton singing. It's there's a few it might have been Stephen Perkins on the drums from Jane's Addiction. And because at the end it gives credit to or I might have googled it, but it was it said Robert drinking help. Okay, green sparkle, sane anger, anything else on this one? A customs come into the picture. Oh, cool. The zillion A customs come in. So it's still the, I'm going to say left side 17, 18, 18, 17 on the left. He still got his 18 inch China. And we know he's got another China way off by the second floor Tom. But now the dino beats, I'm sorry, their projection crash. I should mention that. Sure. Now the dino beats are still around, but they change from Z custom to a custom dino beats. That's when they do about sane anger about that area. And they're still like that today. Wow. Yeah, he's still using projection today. That's when the switch happened around sane anger. Awesome. All right. Well, that's good. So I mean, talk about a versatile symbol. I mean, a customs are they cross the gamut of, but he also, but again, he likes lighter symbols because a lot of metal guys aren't using a customs like we discussed last episode. Like it's it's hard for me to comprehend him using the thin symbols, but I guess they work. But except for that black album, the white art star two kit, like I said, information says on the left side rock crashes. You know, I'll bring that up. I don't know if it's true or not. It could be something to bring up. Yeah. Sure. All right. Death magnetic up next death magnetic 2008. The same thing. Thomas star classic. It's called magnetic orange. Custom color for him. You really couldn't get you can get something close. I believe back then it was called marigold sparkle. I think it's kind of close, but less cool of a name. Exactly. Definitely. Definitely. So his is magnetic orange, pretty much the same size as the St. Anger. Now the big change is he switched to the road pros. That's and they're still using road pros today. That's when that switch happened. Um, yeah, they're a little lighter than the H C 104 TB's that he was using all these years, but that's good hardware nonetheless. Sure. So that's when that switch happened in 2008. Pedals are still the same. You know, the symbols are really still the same. He's using his cuss his his line snare as 14 LU 14 65 still on the silver, you know, still using the emperor coated on the, uh, the batters on the toms, clears on the bottom, not really much more to say. So he's just like, which is, there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, you don't need to reinvent the like your drum set every single time, but it's cool that for each tour, he's just doing a different color, doing a different color, some subtle changes here and there, you know, some hardware upgrades, but, uh, so mainly all the variations and all the changes are kind of, kind of behind him. It's kind of done. Um, and things that he's in his niche now and he's getting older and this is what he, this is what he plays and nothing wrong with it, but that's, that's just it. So yes, yes. And so unless there's anything else next, we go to purple, we go to the deeper purple, which is another custom kit. Um, nothing's really changed except the fact that now they released this as a retail kit. So I remember in 16, uh, I believe it was 2016 might have been the late, it came out late 16, hardwired, but I, but maybe at late 16, early 17, they released this as a retail kit. Um, without the snare, I believe at the time, and I think it was four or 5,000, just a shell kit. Uh, but that's the second time that he's had a, uh, a retail kit released to his specs. So that was pretty cool at the time. Um, and there's some guys that have, can I talk to a guy, Jeremy, Jeremy Olsley, he's got one of the kits. I think he's a bus driver for a lot of bands or, um, Oh nice. Yeah. So he actually has one of them and that's a really nice color. It's beautiful. I forget how many they released. I think it was more than 25, not too entirely sure, but it seems like, you know, it was around for a while. I mean, it wasn't around for years, but you could probably get it six months after it was released and you could probably find it today. If you looked hard enough. Um, same thing, you know, you got your 10 by nine, your 12 by 10, 16 by 14 floor, 16 by 16 and your two 16 by 22s. Um, and I believe he did use, I believe he used Remo, uh, Ebony's ambassadors on the bottom. And, and, and he used his, now he's got the, we spoke about the Lars Olrich model snare, the black diamond. He's using that. Um, and I have seen the same kit with clear ambassadors on it. So a little variation there. Yeah. But that, that, that's mainly how that went. But, and it looks like, which I assume was on the, the other kits too, it still has the bass drum, the front bass drum, like, still has the anchors, the anchor. Um, I believe we're starting to, now we're starting to see the Remo logo on the kick drum heads. I believe, yeah, you're right. Yeah. I believe that came about the, uh, the death magnetic kit, the magnetic orange. Uh, but now we're seeing the Remo logo under on the, on the very bottom and the Tama one on the top. I wonder why? I mean, beyond just like, I want to support Remo and represent them or a contractual, we're going to pay you money kind of thing. Yeah, that's, uh, that's something that'd be nice to know, but we never saw it before. And so that's another subtle little change there. It looks good. I mean, sometimes people like, there's a fine line of like, the bass drum head is like, one logo is cool. In my opinion, two is looking, that's still pretty cool. But when you start to have every brand, all over the whole thing, that's a thing that's kind of, uh, I don't know. Yeah, I'm not into it. I mean, this looks cool. Yeah, this is cool. So, um, although the hardware did change, um, I'll get you the model number on that. We're using the HP 900s. Now the, uh, the newest model, and they're still available today. That's what they're still using, um, the iron cobras. It's got the cobra spring underneath. That's pretty cool. So he changed to that. But again, he's still using the traditional felt beaters. And if you look, he's always kind of run, at least in the later years, he's run kind of like a grip tape down the pedal board, probably for traction. I know Charlie Bonante does that too, but it's kind of like a strip of grip tape on the pedals for traction. Yeah. Yeah. Which makes sense. Cause I mean, again, like, Lars is playing so much and so hard that he's like, do whatever works for you. Exactly. So those are some subtle little changes on that kit. So yeah. And we really haven't gone into mics too much, just kind of by, by choice, but it looks like we've gone from like the Sennheiser 421s, like underneath, like, or in the, like, in the Tom. Inside. Now we've got the clip on. Right. Instead of being mounted, you know, the kick drum mounted on a separate stand. So that's a change too. Don't really, I don't really know too much about the mics, but yeah, that is a good observation. So that's another change there. Sure. Okay. Well, this is, like you said, now we're kind of getting into some minor changes and moving quickly here. So we're up to what you just saw, right? Yeah. Two weeks, two, three weeks ago. 72 seasons. In my opinion, I think this is the best, at least looking kit since the White Ark Star 2s. This is cool. So we're just right off the bat. I mean, we've got the black hardware back, at least on the shells, you know, we're still using chrome stands, but we got the black shell hardware back. Now that's cool. That is cool. Some people like the yellow. Some people don't, but I think it's cool. I think it's so new. I think Tom calls it sunny yellow lacquer is the color. And I believe it's one of their catalog colors. You can get that. I don't think it was, I could be wrong. We're going to find out in the future what's going on. But let me rewind a little before I forget. When Luxaterna came out back in December, he was using the White Ark Star 2s again for that video. It got a lot of people riled up and we thought, you know, hey, is he going to tour with this? Is Tom going to release something? Oh man. Yeah. So he, and they were the, it wasn't like, it wasn't a variation. They were the originals. You could see the rash on the kick drum. The 16 by 24 kick drum is back and it's got the rash on it from where the 16 by 15 sat. So he brought that back for two videos and then they just disappeared on us. Yeah. Just a little taste, but it's just kind of like, I feel like stuff like that is to show like, we know, we know you like this. Yeah. So I would love to see that come back. People have, you know, hinted to it. I don't think so, but we may, you know, we may, they may release one of the yellow kits. There might be a retail release. But let's, we'll dip into that one a little. So the Toma logos on the kick drum, again, you've got your Ebony, probably Ambassador stock Toma heads, you've got yellow Toma logos, yellow Remo logos. Let me mention before I get to, he switched power stroke. I should have mentioned that a while back, probably about the load reload silver sparkle kit. He switched the Remo power stroke from the pinstripes for his kick drum batter. So I apologize. So we'll correct that. But so he's using the power stroke still using the emperors, the emperor coated on the Tom batters. The hardware pretty much hasn't changed. The sizes have changed a little. I believe that's a 10 by seven. It's very shallow. I noticed that and I had to look it up and there wasn't really any information because it's so new. But if you look on the newest Toma catalog, it's there, they're offered, they, you know how they always build little, they show you examples of kits you can buy. They've already built. It was always a 10 by seven and a 12 by nine were mentioned as the two rack toms. And noticing that it's a little more shallow. I think he's, I think he's definitely gone, gone with a 10 by seven on this one and a 12 by nine for the two rack toms. It looks like the 16 by 14 and the 16 by 16 are still there. But then he's got his, you know, his black diamond plated his model snare drum. And we're still using the projection crashes. And he's still using his eastern sticks at this time. So, okay. So this is so new. So let's see what happens in the future. Maybe they, maybe they do release this retail. That would be cool. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's awesome. It looks like under mounted mics on the cymbals, which is pretty. Yeah. And that's another thing I wanted to bring up. Didn't really research the mics, but people are starting to say there's some triggers. They're seeing some triggers on these drums. Being an older drummer, I really don't know much about triggers. Somebody said it was for the gate. I don't even know what gate is, but I'll mention it. They said it was, you know, for the gate. I don't know. I'm just mentioning what I heard. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it would, it would, you'd hit it and then it would, it would release maybe if there's too much bleed from other things. Right. You'd hit it and it would tell it to open up and let the mic work at that point. Okay. That's good to know. But that's what I've heard. So there are some triggers seen. I really don't know too much about triggers and mics, but that that is something new I've heard. I think it's common. I mean, if even if he is, I think it's very common. Yeah. You know, we're going to supplement something or, and I've heard that, you know, there's people who are saying that like, oh, he's playing this and they're supplementing things on recordings and things. And it's like, whatever, I think he's doing a good job. He's doing, listen, he's 60 years old. Yeah. He said, you got to give him credit. You know, I don't, I'm 40. I can't do what he does 60. So you got to give him the credit. You know, I dislike hearing all that, all the criticism that he gets. I mean, everybody, they say, I, you, I can drum better. Can you, can you drum better and run the biggest metal band in the world? You know, there's, there's still on tour. Like I said, I, I, I've been waiting 25 years to see him kind of like a bucket list thing. And I was able to cause he's still out there doing it at 60. So he deserves credit for that alone. So yeah. And I'm seeing some pictures that you sent me where like simple stands are like knocked over and stuff. And what's the story with that? That's an interesting point. So he has four, he's using four drum kits. They've got this new kind of circular stage. They call it in the round. At least that's what my ticket said. It's a stage in the round. And I've heard him refer to that. So his, his drums are underneath the stage, all four of them. And they stay that way pretty much until whichever song starts. And when I was watching some of the early videos, I think when they were overseas, the cymbals are too tall to be at full height under the stage. So I saw, you know, the top would open, the drum texts would then lift everything up. Got it. And they would get him into position to rise up at a stage, you know, because, because they've got the snake pit in the middle. So the stage dips and it rises and wherever he is, it looks like it's a height clearance thing. Why they're kind of knocked over or just, yeah, until they get him up and onto the stage, or at least until they get the platform opened and then everything gets adjusted. And a pretty cool note that that platform actually spins very, very slowly. You can't tell until like the song is over, he was facing you when the song started. And now you're looking at the side of him. So that's, that does spin too. And he's got four of them. It's, it's a pretty cool design. Everybody gets a chance to see, to see him in different. That's cool. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like there's like little cups under the cymbal stands. What do you think? Yes, because it looks to me like it's like a smooth, hard surface. I mean. Okay. So it's a stop kind of. Yeah, kind of like a stop. Because if you're on a carpet, you know, it's not moving. He's had carpet before. I, you know, this is kind of so it doesn't walk on you, I would take it. Yeah, I've never seen that. So that's interesting. That's something new too. Cutting edge stuff. And it looks like we have cameras mounted on the kit as well. They got cameras mounted. They're doing a lot of, yeah, they're doing a lot of media stuff now. They've got those, I don't know what you would call them like their stands with the circular video screens on them and the speakers on them. So they do a lot of, they do a lot of media, like you'll see them at the show. And then now that camera that's on his hi-hat stand or symbol stand is now projecting him up on the screen. So that's all wired into that, into the show. Yeah. And the videos they release on YouTube. So it gets kind of like a close up there. That's really cool. Yeah, that's cool. You know, I think it's awesome that they're still going and I've heard nothing but good things about the current show. Oh yeah. So again, you had a good time. Yeah, the show was good. I mean, like I said, last episode, you know, you listen to these albums, you listen to the CDs in your car, the cassettes on the radio, and it sounds amazing. But when you actually get there and you see it live and you hear it, you feel the kick drum in your chest, it's just, listen, I'm not going to lie, there was a tear happiness came down when they played Harvester of Sorrow. It's a great show. So if anybody's on the fence, go see them. It's worth it. It's definitely worth it. They put on a good show and they're still playing for two hours, 15 minutes, probably would go longer if, you know, they didn't have to get shut down by whatever jurisdiction they're in. Sure. Yeah. So definitely, definitely a good show. I guess, Am I, are we missing anything else here? Or is that pretty much? You know, there could be some things I overlooked and I'm sure they'll say them in the comments, but it's a lot, a lot of variations to remember. So if I did gloss over something, I do apologize. But like I said, you know, shoot me a message, we'll discuss anything for the people listening or, you know, but I think we pretty much covered it all. I think we have. Well, I mean, let's just take a couple minutes here. And so you have made four, three or four recreation. I've made three. They're replicas and replica. I don't want to lead anybody in the wrong way. Lars did not play any of these. These are not his, but they are exactly what he used at the time. If you understand what I'm saying. So, you know, he used grand star customs. So these are grand star customs. I tried to keep everything 99 percent, you know, period. Correct. I still do play and they don't, they're not like museum pieces. So some things are changed. You know, me personally, I like E-mad two heads from Evans. That's just me. I play them all the time. So, and, and, you know, the mitle symbols. So they're 99 percent correct. But, you know, like you saw the shoes, I tried to get that right. The stick positions, the monkey, there's all kinds of spandex pants you wear. I've tried to get it all correct. So, yeah, which is impressive. And you've gone to extreme detail, which is again, what led me to you, Billy Harrington, recommending you for that. But, which I appreciate. Yes, exactly. Remind us of the three that you have made. So I've made, I've made the Damage Incorporated Chrome, the Mirror Chrome US kit. I've made that. That was the first one. And then I said, well, you know, I've always loved grand stars. So then I did the Damage Justice Grand Star custom, the Gunsmoke Blue. And that, that's my favorite one. And then I said, you know, since I've come this far and another thing, when you build these kits, it's not like you can just go and buy an entire kit. So you have to piece it together. So, you know, you know, marketplace is a great place if anybody wants to build a kit. So I'm running all over, you know, the tri-state area, Pennsylvania, New York, Jersey, and you're piecing it together. Maybe some things they pop up on eBay, you know, and you're piecing it together. So after these two kits were done, now I'm left with a bunch of racktoms, one kick drum, one floor tom. I said, you know what, I might as well go for it and build the Art Star II, the white one. Because, you know, I can wait here until another one pops up. Or I can just kind of just, you know, replicate it. This is not an Art Star II because of costs. You know, what I would have to do is I would have to buy an Art Star II, take all the hardware off of it, buy a Grand Star, take all the hardware off of it. So essentially, I'd have 18, you know, 18 pieces, and then I'd have nine pieces I couldn't do anything with. Because the Art Star II were single lug. Right. And the Grand Star is the split lug. You know, he just, you know, he put his order in with Tama, and they're like, we'll make it to your specs me. And you can't find this hardware alone. So it was kind of, it took me about five years. And like I said, it was a bucket list thing. And I just, I just did it. And, and then that's what it is. And like I said, I love talking about it. If anybody wants to know anything, you know, shoot me a, shoot me an email, whatever direct message I'll help anybody out. So I just, I love, I love all things Tama and large, you know, as, as you can see, so. Sure. So, well, I think you've done a great job. Thank you. I appreciate it. Really representing, you know, your passion for this. And I mean, and again, people can comment below, I'm sure there's things that they can be added. But like, this is the second time we've done it. They were like, with, with the amount of time, probably three and a half or four hours of recording, it's almost 10 o'clock at night, you wake up for like 445, so, so I appreciate you giving me all your time. No problem. And listen, if I over, if I overlooked anything or got something wrong, it was definitely not, you know, purpose on purpose, you know, it's just like I said, it's a lot of changes and a lot of variations. So and, and let me know if you know something I don't, let me know. Yeah, definitely. And you've given me like 320 photos organized by folders, which makes this YouTube version of this that much better. So yeah, I appreciate it. No problem. I hope everybody enjoys it. Definitely. So like I said, probably there was, I was looking for something like this when I was doing these, these kits and even prior, you know, when I was a teenager, what does this guy use and what is he using? And there's nothing really out there that exists. There's somebody glosses over really quick. So this is kind of like the first thing. And I hope I hope people get a lot out of this and I hope they enjoy it. So absolutely. Well, remind people where they can find you on like Instagram or anywhere else to come and see what you've done right now. I'm only on Instagram. Chris RZ 28 at Instagram. And like I said, I got videos and pictures. I am flirting with doing the 72 seasons kit. I can't guarantee it. But that would be cool. Yeah, that would be cool. Do you think that would be easier to do because of like the modernness of it? Oh, yeah, you can, you can get a, you can buy a star classic. If not his exact yellow in the yellow they offer that's close enough. So that would be easier. So just as expensive, but easier. So yeah, so I'm active. I got pictures, videos of the kit, and I'm always around to answer questions. So you check me out there on Instagram. And, and that's pretty much it. So cool. Well, I appreciate everyone who has watched this. If you've made it all the way through both parts, put a comment below and let us know because I think that, you know, it's cool when you watch almost four hours of content about a drummer. And I think a lot of people do that. I know the Neil one people watched what five and a half hours and were someone told me they watched that whole series three times, which that's like 15 or 16 hours. So see if you can beat that with this and watch this like four times. So definitely. Thanks to Billy Harrington for connecting us. Thanks Billy. And we got a little bit of info out there about his kit, which might lead to someone else coming out of the woodwork and just saying, I have more info about that. That would, that would be interesting. That would be good, definitely. Any, any information you can get would be cool. Like I said, if Tom is watching this, you know, give us, give us some ads or some paperwork, whatever you got in the vault. We don't need to know prices. We just want to see build sheets or anything. It's such an iconic kit. You know, give us some info. That would be really cool. So totally, totally. All right. Well, Chris, well, thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing so much time and your knowledge and I have a great time doing this with you. It was a pleasure and thanks for inviting me. Thank you very much.