 The following is a production of New Mexico State University. Hi, I'm Mary Meyer with the New Mexico Department of Health WIC Nutrition Program. I'm excited and proud to be here today to introduce our Family Health television series. The WIC Nutrition Program provides nutrition education, supplemental food and health referrals for pregnant, breastfeeding, postpartum women, infants and children up to the age of five for moderate to low income families. Our Family Health series is a collaboration between the WIC Nutrition Program and New Mexico State University. These television programs provide support for families to develop lifelong healthy habits. If you're participating in the WIC program currently, let your local WIC office know if you have watched this episode today. Hello, my name is Lorenda Worth. We're here to do a nutrition education facilitated session like you would see in your normal WIC clinic, local WIC clinic. Hi. Hi, I'm Jennifer. This is my daughter, Bemsha. She's nine and a half months old and she's my first child. We've been breastfeeding all time. Wow. Good morning. Good morning. Hi, I'm Kelly. I have four children and number five is coming soon. I've nursed all of my children and I plan on doing the same with this one. Hi, my name is Olivia and this is Sonia. She is my sixth child. I've nursed all six children and currently I'm a breastfeeding peer counselor at the WIC office. Hi, I'm Nicole and this is Jace and I'm a WIC client and she's my first and I am a new breastfeeding mom and I like it. So what are some concerns that you have had with breastfeeding so far? Any questions about how do you know if your baby is getting enough breast milk? How do you know if they're still hungry or full? That's one that I get a lot with the breastfeeding peer counselor. How do I know that my baby is eating enough and are they having enough to eat? How can I measure how much the baby is getting? A lot of times it's difficult for them to really understand the measurement of the weight. I like to bring them into the clinic and have them nurse the baby, wave the baby, nurse the baby and then wave the baby again and they can see the increase in the weight and it's amazing that they see that. And what are some other things that you, how else can you tell if your baby is getting enough breast milk? What are some other signs that you would look for? With me I would look for, if they continued to cry afterwards, that would be a little bit of a concern to me. But mostly I would just, when I'd go to the doctor, just if they were maintaining their weight or at least gaining a little bit, that kind of told me that everything was going okay. And if they seem satisfied after they've eaten? Right. Those are all good ways to tell if they're getting enough breast milk. So sometimes you can tell also by their diaper changes. So an easier way if you can't get a hold of a doctor or somebody is to see if they have six or eight wet diapers in 24 hours. They'll have two or three dirty diapers and normally if they're active and content, which all of them are, it looks like they're getting plenty of breast milk. So those are good indicators. I usually let her, she's not on a schedule right now. I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing. But right now, since she's so little, I just let her, when she cries or gets upset, I let her nurse and then I just let her nurse until she either passes out or she lets it fall out of her mouth and she just doesn't want anymore. So that's how I can tell that she's done and satisfied. And that's another good indicator. People usually nurse eight or more times in 24 hours. And you know that that's a good sign that they're getting plenty. But that's good. Do all of you kind of feed on their schedule? Yes. That's good. That's the best thing I do. Do you have other concerns about how to tell if they're getting enough breast milk? Anything else you would look for or anything you've heard of? I know my two-year-old, there was a concern that he was in about the fifth percentile according to the charts that the doctor had. But after talking to Olivia, you know, being that she's a pair counselor, she was telling me that babies that are nursed generally have a lower, they don't gain weight as quickly. And so that was reassuring to me because at some point I was kind of feeling that maybe I should stop nursing in order to give him a better, you know, more nutrition. And after she told me that, it kind of eased my mind that he was still getting what he needed. So it was pretty helpful then to have a pair counselor? Yes, it definitely is. That's good. So how did any of you have any concerns, any problems with soreness or latch on? In the very beginning, like for the first couple of days, I was so up and down because I was so full too. And then after that, and also she was having trouble latching on because neither of us knew what we were doing. And so it just took a couple of days to get used to each other and finally she figured it out and it was great. And we haven't had any problems. That's pretty normal. So how do you find different experiences and how long it took for you and Baby to get comfortable with you? Mine was about a week. Like that I was sore but they gave me the lanolin to put on my nipples and also when I took a bath I would put teabags on there and that really helped a lot. And I also got these things my mom bought from motherhood, I think it is. And they have what are they called, soothies, I think they're called. And those really really helped because at first for the first week it felt like they were on fire and those just like kept it, yeah. Another thing that's helpful also is cabbage leaves. You just put the cold cabbage leaves inside in between your bra and it just really helps cool them down. Did that help with let down too? It does, it does very much. So if you have soreness or engorgement you can use the cabbage leaves and that can really help. Did any of you have any other soreness? Maybe latch on, other latch on problems or issues or what pretty smoothly? With my first one it was difficult. I didn't have much help. And I think if I would have had more help it would have more information, more people to talk to. If I would have had a peer counselor I think that really would have helped me nurse my first child longer. We only went eight weeks with her and with the one right before her we went for 18 months. So I think there's a big difference in just knowing what to expect and have somebody there to give you the support. Yeah, so it's the support that makes a big difference. I found this exact same thing with my first, we nursed about three months and it was pretty hard starting and pretty hard going. But as I went along and got more experienced I nursed my last one until 18 months and it just kept getting longer because I was more confident in what I was doing. So the information and support from clinics and peer counselors and friends and other moms is really helpful. All of my friends have nursed their children for at least a year and just having that support from them makes a big difference. Just seeing that they could do it for a year. Wow. So how long have you been a nurse? Do you have ideas or how do you gauge how long you will nurse her? In the past how long you did nurse her babies? I kind of, with each of them it was different. My first was about three months and then we introduced the bottle and she found that was quicker. My second I went to about a year and then the third was about two years and then it kind of stayed that for the first also. I think about two years is where I kind of feel comfortable going myself but it's just my preference and where we were at that point in time. And that was too after you that support and more support and more information and more knowledge? Definitely. Any ideas how long you'll nurse? I want to as long as she wants to. I'm not going to try to unless she's like long years old. I want to try to nurse as long as I can. It's been a really good experience as compared to just sticking a bottle in their mouth and just holding the bottle. It's like you bond with your baby more I think. With breastfeeding. As long as she wants to then I'm going to. Any ideas how long you'll nurse? As long as she wants to. I went with my last one. My first one, eight weeks. The second one was four months and then I had a preemie and I nursed him. I pumped him and gave him my milk while he was in the hospital for three months. And the last, the thing, number four, what number am I? Number four, he weaned himself to a cup at nine months and he just decided he wanted it was quicker and faster for him and he just realized that's what he really wanted to do. The last one I nursed her until she was fifteen months and then now her will see. And when he weaned to the cup, were you giving him then frozen breast milk? You know what, I didn't store enough breast milk to give him and eventually I dried up but it was a gradual thing. So I was supplementing some formula with him but he wasn't very interested in it. He didn't like the taste. So it was more of the juices and things like that and so I would supplement his calcium with other dairy products so he could feed himself. Very independent. Well at first I was thinking, you know, a year. And then I have just been enjoying breastfeeding the whole time so much that I think in two years. I think that when they walk across to you and you know, you know, they're walking and talking I think that's a little too long for me. So I think two years is going to... But who knows, when I get there I'm like, hey, hell right. Some people do it just for... I know my mom did us till we were three and it wasn't like a constant thing like all day long like two or three times a day it was just at night or to take a nap just like for the comfort of it. I guess so. So it's really just a preference then? How long? Comfortable nursing? Change, excuse me. Oh, I got it. So that when you used the lanolin cream was that helpful? Very, very, very helpful. And was that, did you get that in the WIC clinic? The lancinol? My peer counselor sent me some from Berlin and she just had the sample ones though. So in the hospital they gave me a tube of it. I was reading in the pamphlet that they gave me at the hospital cinnamon and let's see, what else did they say? Cinnamon and I think there was another spice. Cumin or something like that? That they said if you eat that then sometimes it'll upset their stomach and make them sick. Like the first time, couple times when I came home from the hospital and I ate McDonald's. Oh, she was very gassy. Yeah. Have you noticed any foods that your baby reacts to? I really didn't. I've heard different things like if you eat garlic that it makes your milk sweeter and that they might enjoy it more. I hadn't noticed any troubles with any of the food that I ate. I was very fortunate. So babies are different than some might react to foods and some may not react to anything. I kind of fell with Brussels sprouts. I've kind of sworn those off until after. You know, we had a really gassy nighttime experience of being up half the night and that's just no fun. So is it easy at nighttime? When the baby's hungry you just bring him to bed and nurse while that can sleep. That's what I do. I've been sleeping with her the whole time and it's just so great to have her right there. A lot of people say don't do that because then they'll get spoiled or whatever and it's really hard to get him out of your bed but I didn't listen to anybody because I would rather have her with me especially if you're breastfeeding. It's too hard to get up and get her from her bed if she's crying. It's so much easier to have her right there. That's why breastfeeding is so much easier. It's just easy access. Oh yes. It's nature's fast food. Oh yeah. I like that. So what concerns do you have any other questions or concerns about breastfeeding or about your foods, soreness, any issues or things that you... Sometimes the tea does not work on me. Sometimes. The mother's milk tea? Yeah. And sometimes she'll just start crying. She's not getting enough. She's sucking and it's empty. I know you can't completely empty out but she's constantly having to switch sides and I drink the tea and I don't fill myself fill up for at least another two or three hours or something like that. I was wondering if there's other ways to bring your milk to me. Do you all have any... Sometimes if you just let baby nurse a little bit longer on each side then the milk will come. Later on you won't have that fullness. You won't have that engorgement filling. Your milk will just... You won't be as full. Your breast will be more soft and not as engorged. Because I mean baby's not getting milk. It's just that you're not as full. Your body's regulating how much milk. So the flow is a lot less than it would be if you're full. Right. You'll still have your let down but you won't be... But you'll be less engorged. Okay. I have very rarely felt that the let down, the feeling of the tangle-ness, I only do it feel that every once in a while and you know, Vemtia has always seemed to get plenty of breast milk from me. Even when I don't feel really full she seems satisfied. Okay. So that fullness tends to go away the master after some time. Okay. Even if you're still okay. Alright. And also if you're not relaxed she'll pick up on that a little bit so she'll be a little frustrated. She'll notice or she'll feel your tension. So try to be as relaxed as you can and maybe have a drink of water or juice so that you stay hydrated. But that can be really helpful. Yeah I do. I chug lots of water. That's good. Yeah. And that's one thing that I found with the support that I, you know, when you sit down to nurse take a drink of water, drink a glass of water so that you're keeping yourself hydrated while you're nursing. And that was really good advice for me that seemed to make a big difference. Yeah. Yeah. Hydrated and comfortable not tense but definitely make a difference. That really makes a difference. I find that when I'm on the, you know, say I have to get dinner done or, you know, I have something pending. It's like I don't relax. I just need to, okay, it'll get done. You know, just baby needs to eat now and it'll get done later. You know. Yeah. We might eat a little bit later but, you know, it'll get done. Right. Right. Yeah, it's important to feed them when they're hungry. They get frustrated. It's harder, I think. They're anxious and frustrated and crying and they may not latch on. Any other questions or concerns that you might have? Well, to summarize, if you were all talking to a new mom or someone that was just about to deliver, what are some things that you would tell her or talk to her about to encourage her to at least try to breastfeed? To give it a shot. It's the best food for your baby. It's right there. You don't have to get up and mix bottles in the middle of the night or, you know, make sure that you have formula in the cupboard and that you're doing something great for them that will affect them for the rest of their lives. Anything else that we talked about that you might share with a new mom to encourage her to start breastfeeding or try breastfeeding? Definitely the bonding. The time that you spend is, you know, very high quality. I think that there's, you know, there is a bond, a connection that you get with your baby that you can't get in other ways. You know, they're not to say that it's, you know, it's just there's something there that you get when you nurse that you don't get in other ways. Okay. And anything else? I think, you know, for one, the expense factor, it's a lot cheaper to nurse your baby and you don't have that, it's okay, sweetheart. So it's definitely cheaper and the bonding experience is important to you. My sister-in-law was not going to breastfeed while she wasn't considering it. She was just going to automatically go to a bottle and I talked her into it and the only reason I know so much about it is my mom would tell me, you know, she told me she breastfed all of us and it was, she said it was like one of the best experiences that she could ever have, not only the bonding, but that it's a lot, I don't know, it's of course cheaper. It helps with their eye and their brain development. They don't gain as much weight. They have, there's a lot less chances of obesity and stuff like that. And it, I don't know, best, I've heard or whatever facts and stuff that I've read and books and stuff that they do, start to do stuff a lot faster than bottle-fed babies. Like I've noticed she tries to, she pretty much can already, did one, I brought her home from the hospital, hold her own head up and look around and hear a noise like across the room and try to look for it. And, you know, like I've seen, I don't know, not that formula babies are breastfed, that they're just like slow, they're not as advanced, I guess you could say. I've seen, you know, I think so and not. She's developing pretty good groups. That's what I told her. Like, it's about the bond and it just seems like it, you know, it has everything and then the, the colostrum for all their immunities and everything like that. Cause when they're that little, you really don't want them to get sick and formula, you can't, you know what I mean? Cause when you get to the colostrum, they get all your immunities, you know? And it's like all the vitamins and stuff like that that they need and you can't get that from formula. So I just like pretty much talked her into it. Like, I think she's going to now. I think another plus that women don't think about is it helps your body heal faster if you have a little bit of an endless weight and lose the weight. You're burning so many calories trying to produce this milk with nutrition for your baby instead. It really, I mean, you just really lose your weight a lot faster and you heal faster. I don't. That's generally, that's great. Any other last comments? No? Well, thank you for sharing. That was good. That was good. You all were pretty good. She's fast asleep again. I know. She still needs a little sleep. Yeah. She's dreaming. She's moving around. I knew that to go play outside. She's so cute. Yeah. She's ready for her nap. I know. She's ready for her nap. Yeah. She's so cute. She's fast asleep. Nice and warm with the lights. Yeah. Oh yeah. I think it was a little warm for someone. She got a little too hot. She gets scared real easily. I don't know. I don't know. By moving something, her arms go way out to the side and she shakes. She's like, Yeah. That's a startle reflex. Yeah. They do that. Yeah. And if you rub her, not right here, she'll... That's what she said. Less stress with her. With the formula. Oh yeah. She... At nighttime when she has the formula, I have to give her gas drops in the formula because otherwise her stomach gets rock hard. Yeah. And then she just fusses and fusses and I have to rub it and stuff like that. She's letting all her gas out today though. Yeah. The first thing she did when she woke up... I was going to mention also that... See? Yeah. I was going to mention also that... Thank you. That when you have a premature baby, also your milk is specialized. Your milk automatically has... has higher fat content. Weight. So it helps your baby gain weight. Yeah. And I thought that was so amazing. Isn't that... Yeah. That your milk is specialized for that. For your baby's needs. And as your baby grows and changes, your milk changes also. Yeah. I would try what Olivia said and maybe nurse longer and see if that helps with her. Yeah. Or after you nurse, pump a little bit, pump for an extra five minutes. Okay. And that will tell you the body that you need. I'm going to make your milk. More milk. Okay. That's a good idea. Yeah. She's so used to the breast milk that when she eats the formula at my time, she would not eat the rice starch the infant milk by itself. I have to mix the soy with it a little bit with it because the soy is sweet. And the rice cereal is not. And she's used to the breast milk being sweet because she will not drink the formula without, you know, something sweet in it. So it's like so expensive. I couldn't imagine her eating that full time because even with one bottle a night, those little cans go within like two weeks. And they're gone. And they're like $13 for a little can. And I have to buy two of them because she's spoiled and she won't eat the one by herself. I have to mix them both together. So she's like $24 for the formula. She'd be pretty gassy if she drinks that all the time. Yep. Yep. Just at night time. And sometimes in the car, like if I'm driving and she's in the car with me and I can't, you know, I can't like nurse her and do everything at once because Sean works so I'm by myself a lot of the time and it's just, it's way too hard. And she just, I don't know, she fusses in the car sometimes so I always have like a bottle made in case that way, you know, because she does not like it in her car seat at all. She gets mad in her car seat. She's like, get me out of here, mom. Hello. That's the only way I can calm her down in the car. So I've tried to just let her cry until I get home but she cries so hard that she is gasping for air and I don't like her to get that upset because it's too hard to calm her down once she's gotten that upset. She's like, having a hard time breathing. Okay. So we're going to go ahead and wrap up. It's hard being a baby at all. We're going to go ahead and wrap up for the morning. Thanks for participating and you guys have a great day. Thank you. Thank you. Hello again. I hope you've enjoyed the show today. If you have any questions regarding information you've heard today or would like information about the WIC nutrition program, please call 1-800-280-1618 and do join us for other family health episodes in the future. The preceding was a production of New Mexico State University. The views and opinions in this program are those of the author and do not necessarily represent the views and opinions of the NMSU Board of Regents.