 Saya akan beritahu kelebihan untuk keperluan-kelebihan, dan sekarang saya akan mengambil pembentangan Amantuma dari kawal Estonian sebagai CEO dan juga pembentangan kepada kawal Kita ada Han, saya rasa semua orang tahu Han dari Autonomous, Janish, Patel Jadi ini adalah pembentangan hari ini. Saya pasti anda bersyukur dengan saya Jadi kenapa kita beritahu dia tentang kawal Estonian? Ia berikan banyak keperluan-kelebihan dan idea hari ini dan hari ini Saya pasti anda mempunyai banyak pertanyaan Jadi saya tidak akan beritahu banyak pertanyaan. Saya akan beritahu mereka satu pertanyaan Dan kemudian saya mengambil pembentangan kepada pembentangan Saya rasa Mitalink telah bercakap banyak tentang pembentangan atau blockchain Yang sangat menarik, kerana banyak orang mencari blockchain Mereka selalu mencari bagaimana blockchain boleh berlaku Dan ia berlaku bahawa anda boleh melakukan segalanya di kerja Dan mempercayai semua masalah yang kita ada Mitalink selama beberapa hari ini telah berbincang banyak tentang pembentangan Bagaimana dengan masalah berlaku tentang pembentangan, perjalanan, perjalanan Pembentangan keperluan dan perjalanan Pembentangan keperluan dan perjalanan Pembentangan keperluan dan perjalanan Saya hanya menyebutkan beberapa masalah Dan ia cukup jelas mengubah beberapa masalah Jadi pertanyaan saya kepada pembentangan Kita ada pembentangan di sini Kita ada pembentangan yang berlaku Dan ia berlaku kepada pembentangan Kita ada seseorang yang berlaku dengan pembentangan Dengan pembentangan, pembentangan Pertanyaan saya kepada pembentangan di sini Yang satu untuk hari ini adalah Jika anda berlaku Anda adalah pembentangan Pertama, pembentangan tidak pernah memilih menang Tapi anda perlu memilih menang atau Pembentangan yang smart Di apa masalah Anda inginkan yang anda akan mempunyai Pengalaman yang terbesar Orang yang baik Orang yang smart Orang yang teka Anda dapat kembali yang terbaik Bersiap yang lebih besar Dan jika anda membuat Bersiap yang terbaik Jadi mungkin anda akan memilih Baiklah, saya tak faham. Jadi saya memilih negara? Ada apa-apa aplikasi untuk negara? Apa aplikasi? Bagaimana anda boleh memikirkan bahawa kita ingin meminvesti di sebuah negara? Jadi, kita dah meminvesti dan negara pertama yang kita investi adalah di Anz Company. Dan sebabnya, ia menolakkan masalah untuk kami di BC. Dan perniagaan jaman yasa di general. Pada masalah besar, masalah kebanyakan, masalah eskode, masalah collateralisasi. Dan hanya perniagaan basic untuk di BC untuk mengahwini apa yang kita lihat untuk mempunyai perniagaan, perniagaan korporat, bagaimana mereka berubah. Jadi, untuk kami, aplikasi yang sangat basic untuk menggunakan bersama-sama bukan untuk kami untuk membuat perniagaan. Kita bukan salah satu-satunya. Ken Boshi di sini, juga mempunyai perniagaan, tetapi untuk kami, aplikasi dan perniagaan menggunakan adalah perniagaan yang paling penting. Dan kami merasa bahawa Anz Company mempunyai sesuatu yang kita mahukan untuk melihat di Singapura. Saya sebenarnya terpaksa mempunyai perniagaan. Kita akan pergi ke UHA. Bagaimana itu? Jika saya boleh mengambil perniagaan lain di sini, saya rasa apa yang Dinesh berkata adalah sebuah vc. Tapi mari kita memikirkan yang lebih filosofik. Kita bermain permainan di mana kita memikirkan sebuah negara yang sempurna. Apa yang sebuah negara yang sempurna? Pasti dia akan mengambil perniagaan di Block Chain. Kenapa dia akan mengambil perniagaan di Block Chain? Kerana jika kamu mengambil perniagaan di Block Chain, apa yang kamu sebenarnya lakukan adalah membuat semua orang yang berharap sesuatu yang berlaku. Mungkin kita ingin mengambil perniagaan di Mars. Kita percaya kita perlu tinggal di dunia dunia. Dan perkara seperti itu, perkara yang kita semua rasa harus berlaku, kemudian kamu ingin membuat perniagaan menerima penggunaan, kemudian sesuatu yang berlaku sangat mudah. Dan sekarang, proses ini masih sangat berlaku. Dan itu bukan untuk berkata bahawa kita akan berlaku dengan cara genasi dan vcs, tetapi akan ada mekanisme. Mungkin Dawa adalah pilihan yang pertama untuk mengambil perniagaan. Kita semua dapat sangat mudah memperkenalkan perniagaan dan perniagaan. Kita percaya kita harus berlaku. Dan cara itu, kita semua rasa baik mengenai perniagaan ini. Block Chain akan jadi sistem operasi, seperti yang Fatalik beritahu kami, tetapi sistem operasi untuk perniagaan ekonomi yang baru, dan ia akan menjadi perniagaan yang tersebut, yang kita belum cukup berlaku. Kita belum mempunyai perniagaan untuknya, tetapi ia akan sangat berlaku. Ia akan sangat berlaku. Ia akan menjadi jurnalisme yang ditulis oleh semua kita. Ia akan menjadi musik yang berlaku oleh semua kita. Ia akan menjadi perniagaan dan perniagaan yang berlaku oleh semua kita. Saya rasa itu adalah perniagaan yang akan menjual kini yang paling penting. Ia sangat menarik. Kerana perkara yang kita tak dapat berlaku seperti lembaga. Jadi perniagaan Block Chain akan sangat menarik. Kita sebenarnya menggunakan Block Chain untuk membuat perniagaan untuk lembaga. Lihat perniagaan, perniagaan akan masih berlaku. Ia sangat menarik sejauh sebagai perniagaan hidup. Dan kemudian kita melihat perniagaan yang sebenarnya dapat berlaku sepanjang sedikit dan melalui perniagaan. Apa yang anda fikirkan tentang perniagaan hidup dan perniagaan hidup? Kita akan biarkan orang ini pergi dulu kerana saya sangat ingin tahu jawapan dia. Ia rasa yang terbaik perniagaan area yang terbaik. Baiklah. Pertama-bama, jika Tuhan benar-benar berlaku, jika Tuhan berlaku di Block Chain, Jika Tuhan berlaku di perniagaan, Ia akan berlaku di perniagaan. Sebenarnya, Tuhan tidak berlaku. Jadi, kita berlaku dengan setiap perniagaan yang tidak sempurna untuk membuat perniagaan yang tidak sempurna, dan perniagaan yang tidak sempurna dan perniagaan yang tidak sempurna menjadi salah satu pilihan yang baik dan yang tidak sempurna. Saya rasa dalam general pertama, saya bersyukur bersyukur dengan kesilapan bahawa Autonomous adalah baik. Kemudian, saya rasa yang paling menarik daripada perniagaan Block Chain, tidak hanya daripada satu aplikasi, tetapi daripada aplikasi yang berlaku bersama dan untuk membuat perniagaan yang tidak sempurna. Jadi, satu perkara yang saya beritahu adalah aplikasi yang pilihan Thomas Bertani membuat memperkenalkan perniagaan Estonian di dalam Ethereum. Dengan diri sendiri, dengan baik, anda mempunyai sistem identiti yang lain dan sekarang memakai perniagaan Block Chain. Di mana yang menarik adalah apabila anda mempunyai aplikasi yang bersama dengan kontrak smart, aplikasi di dalam Autonomous, sesuatu seperti pilihan perniagaan yang memperkenalkan perniagaan untuk $1,000. Jika anda ingin membuat itu, anda dapat membuat sistem identiti. Apabila anda memakai Block Chain dan pilihan perniagaan, sistem identiti sudah berlaku, anda boleh memakai perniagaan. Anda tidak perlu bercakap dengan perniagaan yang membuat itu. Jadi, saya rasa yang lain adalah jika anda memakai perniagaan Block Chain untuk menghormati pilihan perniagaan, kita akan memperkenalkan ibang-biasa kita di Singapore untuk membuat base pada Seronok untuk membina alat. Jadi, yakin yang benar saya rasa anda bisa memperkenalkan perniagaan untuk memperkenalkan perniagaan memperkenalkan perniagaan yang dikatakan dengan memperkenalkan perniagaan yang memperkenalkan Kita berbunuh di antara berdiri, terutamanya dan kriptografi yang berjaya. Dan saya rasa... ...dan ada banyak kemungkinan daripada itu. Ia sedikit... ...berbincang untuk mengikuti sebuah pembantu. Tapi saya akan... ...mencari yang terbaik. Nama saya Zaman. Ia memang mengambil saya lebih lama untuk berbincang. Jadi, tempat jemput yang mana kamu berdua dalam ruang ini? Sejujurnya, sebuah film... ...pemotongan... ...pemotongan. Okey, untuk... ...pemotongan yang tak berbincang... ...mencari sebuah pembantu yang berbincang... ...dan berbincang... ...dan berbincang... ...selepas itu. Saya... ...pada kerja hari ini... ...pada... ...SAP. Saya di pejabat CEO. Tapi... ...sebelum tahun lalu... ...saya telah mengambil... ...infrastruktur Estonian... ...dan sistem Estonian... ...pemotongan. Selepas itu... ...dengan... ...dengan... ...dengan... ...selepas itu... ...dan itu... ...selepas itu... ...selepas itu... ...saya berbincang dengan... ...saya selalu berbincang... ...selepas itu... ...selepas itu... ...saya berbincang... ...dan mempunyai... ...pemotongan... ...pemotongan... ...untuk... ...mungkin hari ini... ...saya cuba datang... ...selepas itu... ...selepas itu... ...dengan... ...selepas itu... ...saya... ...saya tak berpunyai dengan Estonia sehingga tahun lalu... ...dan apabila saya pergi dan mempunyai masa... ...mereka... ...bukannya... ...membuat sebuah... ...stak... ...pemotongan... ...pemotongan... ...yang semua... ...bukannya... ...pemotongan ini... ...pemotongan... ...dan... ...bukannya... ...pemotongan ini... ...bukannya... ...aku boleh membunuhkan kelebihan dan kehadiran... ...untuk berabung... ...tidak ada Estonia dengan suatu kealaman yang saya telah... ...berl�ang... ...sepada siapun... ...sepada siapun ke-2an... ...atas jalan... ...setelah... ...kepada... ...a-baik pilih patally yang tersebar... ...pakaian yang tidak terlalu tepat... ...dari bahawa... ...awak dapat membenci kemahaman... ...di sebuah halaman... ...sarikat yang lebih bergurau... ...atau boleh memperbaiki... ...dan akhirnya... ...awak dapat membuat... ...sebuah negara yang lebih berjuang... ...dan jadi saya harap... ...awak jika Tuhan... He made a perfect country. He would at least look at the Estonian model and hopefully the Singaporean model as well. To me, impartial answer, sorry that was a long-winded introduction. But impartial answer to Professor Lee's question, I would have to say that if you can get the identity layer right, if you can trust that someone is who they say they are, no matter how they look or how they talk, and then build up a set of services around that, the more secure you make the lower layers, the more you can empower people at successively more interesting applications. And frankly, what it comes down to is not necessarily, sorry Vitaly, not necessarily about the technology, but about the culture and the processes and the sort of mindsets behind it. Estonia has some remarkable advances in that that maybe we'll have the chance to talk about. There's a whole bunch of slides, 55 through 60, we're making loud points already. So it's going to be identification of land, identification of company, identification of people. Those are very interesting. I'm not going to make any controversial statement like the accountants will all be out of job. Okay, I'm not to do that. Actually, I don't think internet audit, co-census and so on will be very interesting. But I promise not to ask any more questions because I have so many questions for Vitaly. We have been talking to each other for quite some time, I will reserve those questions. And I want to open the questions to the floor because I know you have a lot of questions to ask. So can I have the first question from the floor? Tell us where you're from, which country, which company you're from and your name. Please. Hi, I'm Jun from Spark Systems, which is part of Diamond BC. Now, this is the perfect panel to sort of bring this question. The main attractiveness or one of the main attractiveness of blockchain is that it's secure. So my question is actually very basic. How secure is it hackable? And to what extent should this be a concern? Is this a marginal concern or is this something that can, because you're basing identities of it, you're building layers on top of it. So how dependable is the security? So in general, there's two ways that you can hack something to do with the blockchain. One of them is to break the blockchain. The other way is to break the security system that the individual person uses to talk to the blockchain. And that would include hacking into computers, private keys and so forth. That's something I would argue that so far, that's been the source of almost 100% of at least 99% of the problems. So it definitely is a kind of very practical sort of security issue. I know there are lots of people dealing with it, although actually a few days ago, people asked me about sort of watching blind spots. I would even argue that sort of focusing on that particular angle is one of them and something I'd like to see more companies doing. Regarding the blockchain protocols themselves, I would say, first of all, it's number one. It is the case that there is no single entity that's a single point of failure where if they decide to sort of either disappear or try to attack the network that the system is going to break. But at the same time, as we've seen practically speaking, a lot of these systems do tend to fairly have a lot of moderately concentrated as a set of infrastructure. Miners, mining pools, even routing protocols. So it's not quite at the sort of level of a sort of ideal utopian system where you have a company of computers and he actually literally needs to break into 500,000 and one of them in order to break the system. But it's kind of somewhere in the middle. Hi, I'm Marcelo from Deeks Markets. Thanks for your presentation. I really enjoyed and I do agree with most of the statements you make. And I have a question about scalability. You mentioned that banks and governments generally talk about scalability of blockchain technology and you also referred to Ethereum as the world computer. And I do agree with that statement. And my question to you is considering that the security of the network and the trust in smart contracts relies on the fact that every node has to run smart contracts with the same set of inputs to validate that the result is the same. No one's tampering with the logic. That essentially means to me that the amount of processing power they have in the entire internet, in the entire cluster of computers running smart contracts is as fast as single computers. So that is a huge paradox to me. So I'd like to hear first how the platform is going to evolve and change to tackle that from the minute. So first of all, in the very short term it's not as fast as one computer. It's as fast as 0.05 computers. So what a lot of people don't realize is that especially in public blockchain there are economic centralization constraints and other issues that basically mean that it's not very safe to have a blockchain where every node has to run even more than 5% or 10% of the time. So there's a bunch of academic papers on it. It'll take a while to explain the math and it'll take less time if I had a whiteboard and it don't so I'll skip it. But there are short term fixes that can mitigate that and that can let you go up from running a computer 5% of the time to running half the time. But that only gets you to 10 acts. If you want to do 1000 acts then you want to do something that's sort of substantially more radical. So our long term strategy is the approach that we call sharding which is that basically instead of every computer verifying every transaction you kind of put transaction into groups and then you kind of randomly select nodes and assign each transaction group to one particular set of nodes and you can process many groups in parallel. So the throughput of the system could potentially sort of go up with the more computers that get added to the network. So that's an approach that we're currently kind of very actively looking into but of course it'll take some time before I actually push out a live network that has those kinds of properties. Hi, Matthew Bowen from Thompson Reuters here. Let's just make an assumption that in the next five years somebody creates a viable quantum computer and you can instantly factor large prime numbers effectively getting rid of the current RSA security. Yes. What effects do you think this would have on blockchain? Okay, so two main effects. The first so in general quantum computers have two major classes of algorithms that cryptographers don't like. One of them is called Shure's algorithm that can completely break many large classes of mainstream photography including RSA, ECC anything based off of any kind of finite cyclic group. Second algorithm is an algorithm called Grover's algorithm which is much more universal it works on any function but the speed up it offers is only a square root. So before it would take like a trillion steps to make an algorithm it goes down and take a trillion steps. So in the case of blockchains use cryptography in two places. One of them is for account security and the other one is proof of work based blockchains use hashes for mining. Now if some entity creates a quantum computer then a quantum computer will be able to use Grover's algorithm and it will be much faster than everyone else because instead of taking to the power of 70 steps to create a block 35 steps. So for that reason as soon as blockchains gets created there's quite a large chance that all proof of work blockchains will pretty much entirely be at the mercy of the particular user that creates a quantum computer first. That's one of the secondary reasons why we're interested in proof of stake where you don't kind of rely on mining for security. Second quite account security. Account security okay shores algorithm means you can break a bunch of cryptography algorithms there are still these algorithms are how they are vulnerable to Grover's algorithm but you can fix that pretty easily by basically just increasing the key lines to concrete data. And so you should be able to just sort of switch from one algorithm to the other block she's always important to find. One of the features we're actually planning in a future release of a theorem is we're actually planning on kind of abstracting out the cryptography so that the cryptography isn't a part of the protocol it's actually a part of what's approved from the road schedule. So basically the sort of main conclusion is yes wato computers won't be annoying but at the same time it's good news and at the same time wato computers will make up for it by making a bunch of nice algorithms like AI much faster and hopefully improve the progress of that field by that decade or so. No this very much I think matches the Estonian philosophy as well they have something called E residency where they take all of their their identity and government infrastructure make it available to foreigners to apply for so anyone in this room can go to an Estonian consulate give their passport pass an interview and background check and then get an Estonian digital identity card from which they can log into Estonian system selling my card from Shanghai to East Nice Well thank you and the benefits are enormous you can incorporate an Estonian company remotely you can you know do company administration remotely let's say you're an entrepreneur in one country PayPal will do business with your banks you can then incorporate Estonia to PayPal to get PayPal to do business with Estonian banks and the question we get all the time is around the RSA stuff and the certificate implementation to which we say there are many more problems to think about than the what is essentially an implementation detail of the cryptography the point is more to get people to use these systems to get cultures and institutions aligned around their benefits we have to believe we have to trust I think in our own in ourselves that as technological breakthroughs happen we'll be able to keep evolving these systems independently of the culture and the processes and in fact you can look at the history of technology this has happened over and over and over again both in hardware and software things that people thought would completely remove a use case or make a certain use case unviable market forces generally save the day actually I have a question is that things from overview and discussion the most difficult thing about what we are trying to is about the virtual world quite some time that we have in the virtual world for the government we have the justice department we have the cause we have the lawyers working and now we are talking about smart contracts in the virtual world that we don't really have a virtual core the mindset will then be very different from the regulatory from the way the regulator will start thinking about issues how do you have situation where you are across all asset classes when you provide the services they will cross all jurisdiction and you have issues of you are serving different national identity we are no more talking about the physical world we are no more talking about the hidden land we are talking about serving people digital identity on the net it is something like a hidden net rather than a hidden land from your investment perspective and from your experience and from the autonomous how do you feel like how do you feel about this what is your what's your opinion and maybe a general point that it's always difficult to imagine innovation for instance at the time of Mozart when people were listening to music you had to bring in the whole chamber orchestra or play us and now we all have it sit on our phone as digital packages but you could have possibly managed and that would be the way we would ever have listen to music and replicate music I think it may be a little bit the same with blockchain and how we're going to digitize assets generally it's now still a little bit the phase where oh the first black man is president of the United States it's a novelty, it's a new thing and soon it may be a woman I should probably say hopefully it will be a woman the next president of the United States and that again is going to be a novelty but I think you're happy to take me up on this one that in five years blockchain is going to be inserted in a lot of processes and we won't even realize I don't know what happens to you when you drive a car but I don't lift up the bonnet I don't understand what's going on underneath the bonnet I just want the car to take me from A to B and so every FinTech conference I attend and I swear I don't attend all of them it's blockchain, blockchain, blockchain it's sort of the big novel thing let's have that countdown a little bit let's hopefully see more real businesses being built on it and it's going to become quite evident that blockchain in certain use cases either permissioned or fully decentralized is actually a cheaper a more efficient, a faster technology and we're going to get used to that just like we are now used to listen to Mozart on our iPhone Janesh, so you as an investor you have to get in 10 so we always talk about blockchain a lot of people think that blockchain is a solution for working for problem but can we really make money investing blockchain? I think it actually goes back to what Han and Vitalik have already said it's about how you use technology to deliver services or applications or use cases I have a 10 year fun life so I have to make a return on investments it's pretty black and white for what I have to do in my day job so I'm not in a position to take a technological view whether it's on quantum computing because I sit on the board of a quantum computing company or whether it's on blockchain but what the quantum computing company does that I sit on the board of is they try to find top applications with where the architecture sits today and delivers that to banks non-financials it's the use cases that matter to companies like us, funds like us and actually interesting enough have this to be the case pretty much across the corporate world right now everyone's trying to find solutions that can apply whether it's blockchain technology, whether it's quantum computing or whether it's any other sort of new and emerging technology that's coming out in any second so it falls back down to this issue of use case Let's look at the future returns Let's back to the floor you have any question Hi, I'm Simon I was just having a question around the role of oracles that they're going to play on a variety of blockchains and to what extent oracles risk becoming new single points of failure Yeah, I mean oracles are definitely going to be very important you need data if you want to have smart contracts if you're interested in things based off of data if you don't want them to that set if you don't want them to become single points of failure there are definitely ways where you can at least partially decentralized your independence on oracles as well you don't have to rely on one critique like the median of five of them there's I think a lot of different approaches so I'm not I'm not really too worried about that although it definitely is I definitely do want to kind of I think one thing that the community can do to ensure that it becomes practical to do things like just focus on five oracles just to try to promote standardization efforts so it's to promote the existence of an ecosystem where we actually have lots of oracles so that the more we have the more the less we need to rely on a specific one Hi, I'm Gaurav I'm from Atorus, a blockchain startup My question is how do you see different blockchains coexisting together Do you think that applications could cluster towards some blockchains according to use cases applications use different blockchains together I think it's I mean first of all I think we've already seen some consolidation we've seen I think most like watchings that don't have that don't provide any kind of unique value toward every some set of use cases they continue to exist because that's what watchings do but they're not really getting anywhere and you can't really bootstrap when you're watching at this point in time and the number of them has gone down pretty substantially but at the same time it definitely doesn't need to be one of the blockchains to rule the ball and there are ways to create applications that even set up multiple contracts there are ways to make blockchains talk to each other there are ways to literally create high level smart contracts code that compiles down into contracts code that sets on top of multiple blockchains plus communication systems between them we need to see relay which is like a sort of contract that sort of verifies Bitcoin transactions inside of Ethereum it's been doing some work in that direction already and I think that's an area that's definitely going to see more progress I think we should take a question from practitioners who at this stage may wonder how is all this relevant and applicable to what I'm doing as working at a bank or a law firm or an account to see firm so by all means who wonders how is this relevant to me we'd love to hear or you can quit and join us on this it's not really a question I think blockchains give us the opportunity to see performance Vitalik can correct me on that we spoke about the gentleman next to David about ROI today our society is about consumer profiling we want to know what people do when they spend is there a way blockchains can be used to see performance of employees at manager level or marketing level banker level or government level is there any way of watching can be used to see the performance of what of everyone in a bank to deliver KPI because when you join a big company like IBM you have KPI in sales fund managers to deliver results as well i mean one general consequence of wider watching adoption in general is that more of the individual operations that all of us make are going to leave a cryptographic trail of evidence behind them that people can point to and you can actually it's visual can for example show a history that says in 15 of the 20 let's say investments that they advocated actually did end up but did end up succeeding or they let's say in a credit reading context that they successfully made their phone bills without interruption for 10 years in a row so those kinds of things are definitely going to become easier and lower cost i mean that said they're not going to solve the problem entirely because i think in a lot of cases you just run into the inevitable barrier that sort of verifying performance is subjective there's only so much that sort of more visual cryptography can do in getting that and what what how like said about leaving more cryptographic trails isn't necessarily a bad thing for example when Estonia put its put its health records and health registry online and this question folks asked how should i know that this hasn't been hacked that my information isn't hacked safe and the Estonian eHealth ledger has when you log in the first thing you see is all the doctors all the nurses who have access your data your responsibility to make sure that only the doctors you recognize have actually looked at your record now where this gets really interesting is the laws if you see a name on that ledger that you don't recognize there's a button and by law they are required to do an investigation the doctor has to explain why in that instance they access your record and the penalties are extremely severe if they can't it's pretty much automatic forfeiture of their license so they make the penalties so severe that no one actually does bad things and so we at least maybe in the US we hear this and these words like increased cryptographic footprint and we kind of freak out and we think about big brother but the reality is if you're thoughtful about how to implement it if you educate the people who use it and you create a culture and a legal system that actually takes advantage of this increased transparency you wind up with a vastly improved system and you're going to sign up for the US so we crossed the 10,000 person mark about a few months ago which is bad for something that's only been publicly marketed for about 9 months and you have to remember Estonia has a tiny tiny country they're just a million and a half people so their approach to this is if you can get even 1% of EVE residents to start a company in Estonia or to invest in it you're actually moving the needle on a relative basis we're running out of time and we'll be about another last question that we can have on the floor hi, Julia following on from some of those topics what do you view on how blockchain can help some of the big banking problems around KYC and onboarding? I think in general sort of identity verification is definitely one of those problems that blockchain technology can at least be applied for solving very well like I think one of the things that one of the positive consequences is a kind of natural sort of bootstrap and standardization but essentially sort of digital sort of self-solver and identity so the model here is basically that right now you basically have to KYC yourself with a bunch of different entities separately and they all end up having to verify the same thing but I think what the world of identity could look like if what we're doing sort of takes off is that a basic notion of an account anyone can create an account anyone can create 10 million accounts accounts are just cryptographic then you have a set of entities and these entities can make different kinds of accertations about accounts so an entity might say this account corresponds to a unique person who happens to be a citizen in some particular country an accertation might be this person has some particular phone this person has past criminal background check and so and then these accertations don't need to be collected on any kind of centralized server each individual accertation is just between the asserter and yourself and of course it's just a simple cryptographically signed message if you want to affect yourself to some party all you do is you provide the link to your blockchain based identity sign a message for both a cryptographic key that proves that it's you proves that it came from the entity that has an account plus send send the one of these certificates and say these five entities make these claims about me and then that's it and then the recipient of those piece of information knows that your account you actually do have those properties at least if they trust the providers that made those accertations the important thing there is that number one it's a kind of organic sort of process where you don't even need to kind of all get together and kind of all stay in rest at the same time it's an ecosystem that can kind of grow naturally start off with phone number verification start off with it's don't need any residency verification and go from there number two don't need a centralized place to store all the data it's sort of naturally much more distributed no sort of central thing that someone can easily pack number three much more efficiencies begs and potentially other entities can't just sort of look at these accertations and what's even what's a particular you know certificate exist you can use it everywhere so in about a third of what Vitaly said isn't unique to the blockchain at all take the example of E residency that's the Estonian government asserting that the name on your card matches the name on your passport the name of the certificate match the name of your passport or that your fingerprints are yours or that you haven't been found in any criminal history data basis and the Estonians themselves use this to tremendous effect they all carry around essentially digital identity cards for which they can sign an encrypt documents to to each other and by some measures this literally saves the government of Estonia about one to two percent of its gross domestic product which is extraordinary basically means that in modern countries we spend one week of every year dealing with paper and with signing contracts and so the point is not necessarily to get there all at once but just to start making steps I'd like to add one point to Judith's question so I think that the misconception is generally that the KYC thing is a really big elephant that has to be top down engineered and you have to have banks coincide and then government regulators and agencies and then the people have to have buy in now the beautiful thing is it could actually be a very spontaneous bottom up process I think that's what Vitalik is also saying and I think that's what Estonia has somehow engineered all you need is one identity smart contract where you have one check with your real world identity so in the case of Estonia you go to a consulate and they look at your passport and they see that you are who you claim you are so you make a claim about who you are I could perfectly claim in the smart contract that I'm Mickey Mouse but when I go to the Estonian consulate they will look at my passport and they see I'm not Mickey Mouse so my claim so my claim is being verified once and then I have that smart contract with my identity and that can start to be layered on by every service provider who needs to KYC me so this whole absurdity of me opening a bank account in Market Street and then having to take that same bundle of papers and copies of passports to you know Marina Bay Financial Center to open another bank account could be out of the window without a massive white elephant type IT project at a national level they could probe a lot more bottom up and I think there's a lot of hope that this will be solved soon and it gets really interesting where you have states involved Estonia needs to get this right it has a much higher burden to make sure that he's not Mickey Mouse than your your average company does it has to maintain its obligations to NATO and the UN and the EU and the OECD one last question guys, don't know is it the end of the secret services then No.5 No.CIA where did that question even come from is there a question in there I'm not sure if we follow you talk about this identity right no Mickey Mouse, no who you are so what about secret services well the example we use is that without digital identity it's like we're all driving along the information super highway without license plates I think if you do put license plates on everyone in all cars you still need the cops so they will likely sadly long be a role for law enforcement to stop bad actors but just like a state gives you your passport to navigate the real world I think the argument here is that a state or some trusted entity like a state should give you your digital passport to navigate the digital world I think it's worth clarifying that at least I personally absolutely oppose national identity being mandatory to do anything on the internet so these are tools we do too you know these are tools and there are many applications where you want to remain anonymous and there are many applications where in order to increase trust you want to be identified and I think even one of the benefits of these kind of more sort of user control approaches to the identity and also even have a choice of how much they want to reveal in order to increase if they want to reveal more to increase the level of trust that they can if they want to I was just making an argument to keep the secret service in business so I think we run out of time with the prospect that it's actually going to be a long long question and discussion about decentralization about the sugar system decentralize being democratic as well I don't think there's time to discuss about those but those are really very important issues but we really run out of time so I'm passing it back to DeKal and before we do that if it's okay I just want to make one quick plug the Estonians are actually going to be here in Singapore next week it's Tuesday and if you'd like I'm sure we can figure out how to inform this group of that event Thank you and with that we conclude the formal presentations here I think we could have gone on for an hour or more than that but we're keeping you away from asking bilateral questions to our panel so why don't we thank our entire panel for a very important particularly thank David obviously I want to thank Vitalik I want to thank all of our panelist speakers but we do have tokens for everybody but I also don't want to be the one holding you off from the food that we have outside of your chance to speak so I just want to give two tokens away I want to give one to Vitalik because obviously being the main speaker and a huge inspiration I do want to give a token to him so Vitalik if I could just hand this to you Autonomous has been doing a lot of hard work and we don't always recognize and think those smoothest but Rebecca do you want to come up here Rebecca we have worked with Autonomous and it's a great job Thank you Rebecca Thank you to everybody we got Aaron here from DBS so thank you to everybody for coming I hope you learned I learned a lot from this I hope you do stick around for a little while longer outside speak to our panelist I'm also going to be around for a little longer to eat some food it's there for the same thing and I hope to see you again for a future event Thank you very much