 Hi everybody. I'm Tom Hall as you may know me from previous episodes of the Rock to the Cloud series that we're talking about all things server here in the UK. In this video we're going to be discussing well the exciting subjects of Windows Server 2019 and everything that everyone's favorite subject licensing. So as you know every episode we've got fantastic special guests to kind of help answer these questions, debunk a few minutes, kind of get in there and try and understand a few things. But as with every single episode if you've got any questions or you've got any comments please drop them below and we very much appreciate it. So this episode we're talking about Rock. The Rock obviously sponsored by Dwayne Johnson, our fantastic sponsor of everything we do on Windows Server 2019 Rock but also OEM licensing and we're going to be talking about sort of debunking the mix behind it. There's a lot of confusion that people have about why would I choose this license and type what do I use it for what's the scenario. People get really confused about it so it's actually super super simple. If you need to attach Rock then obviously you need to know how to license it properly. So today for the next 30 minutes we're going to be catching up with a very special guest, our one and only Mr Pete Burns all the way from Scotland. So A.P. how you doing thanks for joining us. So what are we going to be talking about today Pete Burns and you know maybe you can tell the audience a little bit about yourself and we can kind of figure out why you're an expert. Why are you an expert Pete? Why am I an expert? That's a long and protected story and I don't think we've got half an hour for that Tom. So a quick portrait history I spent many years in server storage and networking kind of grew up around that arena moved into software over the last kind of five to ten years and I found myself as the Windows Server 2019 server champ for the UK and I on supporting all of our great partners resellers and our M&As, our HPE, Dell, Fujitsu and Lenovo partnership as well. So really anything that's to do with server and attach and the person to come and ask that question to. So you're not really you're not a architect because there's loads of solution architects out there but you're more of a you're more of a surveyor. Yeah you're a solution surveyor. Yeah I'm more of that quantity surveyor so so dealing with the costs the commercial side of everything what's the best license type and this is this is an ideal session for today because certainly one of the things that I found is the myths around OEM rock against volume license or open licensing so any other form of Microsoft licensing what you can and cannot do so I know that you've got some some questions that you're wanting to ask me today so I'll hand that back to you or you're wanting this just to be a free form. Well let's jump into those questions straight away about OEM and rock licensing and you know let's let's blow people out the water with this stuff because I you know I think I think once they once they hear what you've got to say I think they'll be certainly selling more more more Dwayne Johnson than ever before. Right okay so right fundamentally first question really simple what is the difference between OEM rock and OEM rock with everything just eat. Well this is live it's fine don't worry about it. Deliveroo you've got delivery coming anyway let's not worry about what you're on for lunch and the question just to go back to that is what is fundamentally what is the difference between OEM rock and volume licensing because you know I want to know. If you look at it from if you look at it from a feature and functionality point of view and standpoint there is no difference so it's the same license the difference is in the license terms so how you actually buy the license so generally a volume license is purchased through an agreement that could be you have to make a certain commitment over a certain period of time and then that's renewed after that fixed term so it could be anything from 12 months to three years whereas OEM and rock is purchased upfront with your service purchase your server purchase so it's more of a perpetual license so if you think about it there is no difference in the features and functions of the actual license they do the exact same thing it's the license terms that are different and that's where quite a few people get confused because they think okay you can't do some things with it. So it's the same thing it's just how you pay for it that's different and am I right in thinking that you know volume licensing for example there's like a minimum requirement or there's some there's other rules attached to volume licensing and whereas with the rock and OEM license you can just buy it on its own but is that a thing? It is and certainly over the last few years we've seen a difference in how we at Microsoft have licensed OEM and rock we've moved away from more of that live and die on the server that everybody thinks OEM and rock does. There are certain things that that you can do now for example Windows Server 2019 data center version comes with reassignment rights straight out the bat so there is a license you can buy as an OEM or rock with reassignment rights that gives you the ability to move that every 90 days so if you have an infrastructure where you are looking to move from server to server over the lifetime of that infrastructure then data center with reassignment rights is the license of choice for you then if you look at standards sorry Tom if you look at standards what you what you do have is we've changed in since 2019 whereas before it lived and died on the server now the additional licenses that you buy for Windows Server standard can be moved to another appropriately licensed server so we've brought in the ability for you to move your licenses from server to server with different features and functions. So that's great because that's obviously a lot more accessible for people and that whole live and die motions gone. Now again I'm just really conscious that sometimes when I talk to people that we you know there's acronyms right and you know I kind of think probably people probably know maybe what those acronyms are but let's let's demystify those acronyms so there's OEM and then there's rock again there might be some differences between them but I know that OEM stands for original equipment manufacturer and I know that rock stands for reseller option kit but as a license type is there differences between two of them because again we've mentioned them in the same breath but what's the difference between those two? Again there is no difference in the features and functionality of the actual software itself so the application does the exact same thing as OEM and rock. The difference is and the easiest way to remember it is OEM is pre-installed and reseller option kit rock is installed already so reseller option kit comes as media in the box in the server that the reseller can then add an add value service on and configure that server for the customer so the reseller might be buying different components building a server infrastructure that could be server storage and networking then they can also buy rock with that server and then configure the server before shipping it out to the customer and then with OEM if you are going down and I'm going to use another two acronyms that we will go through so with CTO and BTO so CTO is sorry Tom I did say I was going to explain what they meant CTO is configured to order which means that the hardware vendor say someone like Dell HPE Fujitsu Lenovo will configure that server for the reseller and then ship it directly from the factory to the reseller through distribution so with CTO you tend to find that you would do OEM version because they will they will install it at the factory so it will be pre-installed on the server ready to be installed whereas rock reseller option kit is more of a BTO which is built to order which is more to do with what's in stock at distribution so distribution will hold stock of server storage and networking components that they will then put together as a bundle for the reseller and then you can put rock reseller option kit with that so everything ships together so if you're looking for something very very quickly that's in stock then BTO with rock is is more of the the choice for the partner that's the two differences yeah yeah yeah that that makes sense and is there any differences in features or functionality because I'd imagine you know or even if you were to say going by a copy of Windows Server on its own is there you know is there a difference between that and rock and OEM what are the benefits of doing it this way that why why bother for me that there are three numbers 82 25 and 33 that we should always remember around OEM and rock licensing 82 25 82 25 and 33 okay so 82 25 33 but so 82 faster to actually deploy the server on average it's about 25% less expensive than a volume license and it takes about 33 steps less to configure that server once it's actually the customer what we mean by 33 steps less on average a server would take about 38 different steps to go through to install that server so if your server turned up and you had your operating system and you downloaded your operating system from a volume license perspective it would take you about 38 steps to configure that and have it ready to be on your infrastructure whereas with an OEM or rock version it's actually only five steps because the drivers come pre-tested and certified for that hardware so whether it's Dell, HPE, Lenovo or Fujitsu we've been working with all of these manufacturers for the last 25 30 years and they all pre-test and certify their drivers to work with our software and it's all bundled together so rather than having to download the volume license version and then go away to the Microsoft website and the vendor website and download the latest drivers everything comes in that box and it's pre-tested and it's certified so it's actually ready to go so that's one of the advantages of OEM and rock is everything is all certified and and testing and I'm going to probably talk about something else as well and that's support because support is obviously very key and critical to any implementation of a server infrastructure. I was going to ask you that Pete because whose product is it because it's obviously it's a Microsoft product but you're buying it say for example from the OEM or from distribution in an OEM box called rock which is a reseller option key so say for example I'm buying a HPE server with a HPE rock. Who do I go to for support? Tom you hit the nail in head that's one of the advantages again of OEM and rock is you're going to run one company for support so your hardware vendor that you purchase the server from and the rock version from they will give you installation support so you get free installation support within for the first 90 days so you don't have to if you have any issues configuring it or installing it you would then have to phone the hardware vendor and then phone Microsoft you don't you phone the hardware vendor and they have the correct support personnel to manage both software and hardware issues. Okay that that is really simple so it saves you time money and stress and it enables a reseller to put more margin on and it gives peace of mind for the end customer makes definitely 82 25 33 Tom 82 25 33 I've written that down I'm sure that will be in my recap at the end if I've learned nothing it's those three numbers so Pete honestly it's always well told to you thank you I mean one of the other advantages as well and that I personally see and I get a lot of conversations back from the reseller community and from distribution is virtual machines so that's what that's the way that everybody is setting up their servers these days is they're virtualizing their environment so they're doing more for less yeah yeah but Pete this is a massive subject yeah I mean I'm so glad you brought this up because you know we've been talking to like other server experts and you know this whole hybrid you know environment people getting bigger and bigger and bigger is changing the way that people are deploying the infrastructure and virtual machines is really important so I think you were going to probably let us in on why that's important for for Windows Server right definitely and if you think about it one of the one of the myths that we spoke about earlier about debunking is that OEM and rock lived and died on the server and we've shown that we've got features and functionality within the OEM and rock license deployment that can help alleviate that that kind of pain point yeah one of the other myths to debunk is that virtual machines can be moved from server to server to server immaterial of what licenses underneath them so because most organizations these days are virtualizing their environment that underlying operating system sits at the the same level in the same features as the hardware so if you imagine if a company has just purchased new hardware new software and they're virtualizing their environment more than likely they're going to keep that server infrastructure for anywhere between three to five years and it's not going to change that's the same for the operating system as well because what's important is the virtual machines that sit on top of it so if the hardware is going to be there for three to five years and the operating system is going to be the exact same across that three to five year time frame then the virtual machines are the critical element because they're the elements that need to be moved from server to server in some instances and virtual machines that that's one of the myths you don't think you've got a question yet Tom yeah I do because you know I think this is one of the things when you know when I've spoken to pre-sales experts and stuff like that they kind of say to me well I'm not even going to bother putting the license on that because they're going to use it on a VM and you know what you're saying to me is actually I think a few more questions need to be asked by people what is the scenario where are you using it how long is it going to be in place for because there's potentially cost savings for people if they use all the licensing tools that are available of which rock and OEM is one of them I mean it might well be that VM is actually right for that customer if it's going into a certain scenario but if if it's actually going to be like you know a standalone machine that you know the asset's going to be sweated in the branch or something like this then maybe rock or OEM is actually the better license is more cost-effective and quicker to deploy that's kind of what I picked up from everything that you've just explained so it's all about asking the right questions isn't it Pete it says and what there's two questions to ask and I just held up three fingers there there's only two questions to ask the first question is that's it is what is your host operating system and here's another fun fact for you Tom in that 75% of all servers there are are sold will have Windows Server 2019 or a previous version sitting on them so there's still a huge demand for Windows Server and if 75% of them have them on there they'll either be on as the host operating system or the guest operating system so it's always important for resellers and pre-sales to ask those two questions what is your host operating system and what is your guest because Windows Server 2019 still has an opportunity in both of those environments and what we were what I was meaning by the virtual machines is that what you'll have is you'll have your server infrastructure then you'll have your operating system and then customers will virtualize that environment so they'll be putting different versions of Windows Server in containers or whether in virtual machines those virtual machines can be moved from server to server to server so if you have your server infrastructure and your operating system that you are going to be keeping the same for three to five years it makes sense by the most cost effective operating system license so rather than paying and if you're the only and you can reuse it then that's that's great value for money as well so definitely and something else that people talk about a lot is downgrading now but I understand why people do it right maybe because they're sweating assets but actually I think I think the important thing really is is you know when we consider where we're going with with the server business with the cloud you know I think hybrid being the new end state for being obviously I know a lot of people would like to go all the way to the cloud at the con but getting there is obviously that's where you know the you know the latest versions of Windows Server get you there but if you want to downgrade can you yes simple answer is yes there you go and the the the phrase to remember is n minus two so what we're what we mean by that is from 2019 you can go back to previous versions so you can downgrade back to 2012 any version that's still in support 2003 no because 2003 and 2008 are no longer supported products within the Microsoft family so you can't go back and downgrade to to those versions and there is another thing that was quite a few years 2003 was quite a few years ago right so it certainly is I think that's fair but there are there are still a number of companies who are still using 2003 because the application that they're using on top of it dictates that they still have to use 2003 so again with virtualization if you own the license for 2003 or 2008 then you can still put it in a virtualized environment but it's better and safer to have that in a 2019 environment because of the security and and everything else that goes with that and I believe you've got a session on security coming up so I won't steal any of that thunder because I believe you've got a better expert than me on that Pete there's no better expert than you on anything I won't hear it but but I think they might be better than you actually they are better than you on security but you're you're the best on licensing so we've got the right man for the job for this conversation thank you thank thank you Tom there is there is one other thing to to think about as well with when you're talking about downgrading and so downgrading there are two different things you've got downgrading where you can downgrade to previous versions and then you have down addition which is completely separate so down addition so if you imagine the scenario where you have a customer that's purchased data sensor and within a virtualized environment they actually want to use standard so they can down down addition to standard from data center so you can actually go from addition backwards so you can go from data center to standard and if you wanted and there are many people that would do this but you can actually go from standard to essentials so and that's fine does that consume the license or I'm just saying because that sounds like a very expensive way to buy a standard addition that's what my mind's doing well I mean well would you call me one of your three VMs or how would that work you would you would use one of your unlimited VMs within data center to achieve that so you can go back so rather than than having data center as your virtualized environment because you know with data center you've got a limited virtual machine capability so in one of those virtual machines you can actually down addition to standard if standard was what was dictated because of the application that was sitting on top of that because again if you imagine it's a kind of stacked environment so you've got your your hardware your server storage networking your operating system your virtualized environment then your application sitting on top of it I love talking to you because every time I've talked to you afterwards I always think I've learned something that's brilliant so thank you Pete and well I think we're at the end of the licensing section you know what I mean and if people if people are still watching because I know I know everyone loves licensing and we we've got this bit that we do every one of these rock to the cloud podcast whatever you want to call them any sessions that we talk about server we've got a little section called the server that means review I think we probably come up with a better name for that but I mean it's particularly catchy but as always the guys who help me make this show they are they are jokesters they think they're really funny and they also like making me look a bit silly so they're conscious that I am not a solutions architect or in fact a solution surveyor like yourself Pete but they they they go and pick server means apparently server means are a whole big thing in this in this community right and apparently people find them very funny and every time I do in my life I don't get it right so they've gone out and they found two means that they're going to show and you know like when they do that thing on the internet where they make people like watch those things where they go through amazing and there's a horrible place it's a little bit like that they flash the meme up and then they they see our reactions okay so fingers crossed if I count them in three two one can we see the first meme I'll do that in a second not yet lads and then Pete we're going to get your views and opinion on what your thoughts are around the meme and obviously then anybody who's watching in the audience please let us know what you think of these memes and if there's any memes that you want to see forward them on and then then we'll see what we can do about getting them on the show so three two one here's the first meme what's your meme got to do with servers Pete is that funny I don't know one one does not simply reboot a server are you your Lord of the Rings man he's not Lord of the Ring he's Lord of the Rings isn't man yeah I would certainly say it's Lord of the Rings and and yes one does not simply reboot a server and again with the way that today's technology is you you don't need to reboot a server and I'm sure Tom you've got loads of stuff coming up about things like story spaces direct and stories replica that takes away the need for you to reboot the server so yeah I think we could slate that one away I think I think what we can do is we can send Sean Bean a the video for storage spaces direct afterwards and then that we can get rid of that meme problem solved meme busted yeah thanks a lot of people in okay so right meme number two three two one here we go what's going on here is we really should upgrade is that that looks like it's a is that a loaf of bread I think that's a loaf of bread that looks like a sourdough loaf of bread is a what sorry I think that looks like a sourdough loaf of bread that's a lot of people were were perfecting during lockdown really have you seen a few of them servers in your time Pete I certainly have a big lumps of lumps of bread that just sit in the corner yes I like that one saying you've made a bit of dough out of these three feet Tom there is no answer to that what can I say what can I say sorry I couldn't I couldn't help myself making a little bread joke okay right sorry look obviously let's get these memes out of there because I obviously don't get them which is fine yes I look stupid appreciate that and I know the audience appreciates that there's always somebody on their side who looks as as stupid as possible on film but if you've got any thoughts on the memes like I said drop us a note and we'll get them into the show but we're going to do a quick recap just so everybody understands what's going on so Pete what did you know what have we covered today we've covered OEM and rock licensing we've debunked a few myths around what you would use it for when you would use it we've learned something which is 82 25 33 so it's 82 faster 25% cheaper on average asterix and it's 33 steps easier to install saving you time and money but people are installing servers and so that's really kind of what we've learned we've understood about downgrades and VMs and what to use where so those are the things that I've really taken for today's episode Pete is there anything I've missed no Tom you actually covered you you've covered all of them there I think the 82 25 33 I think is should be top of mind for everybody when you're talking about OEM why OEM and rock is 82 percent faster to deploy 25 less expensive as you said and also 33 steps less and then debunking the myths around what you can and cannot do with it not living and dying on the server as it did before which is absolutely fantastic so rock in OEM should be a consideration in every server built that our partners are doing I can and does have a place and should be in every server built that's my thought anyway Pete that was a beautiful episode we learned all about rock and I was talking to Dwayne earlier on the phone and he said don't be a jabroni make sure you are quoting with rock where possible because that is the best thing to do for your servers and so that's it for today thank you very much for joining us on today's episode of from the rock to the cloud we've had Pete poems with us and again can't thank you enough Pete so thank you very much sir appreciate you have a great day you're welcome Tom and thank you very much for the invitation and hopefully I'll be on a few more sessions and podcasts that you're doing in the future of course Pete we'd love to have you