 Hello, everyone. I'm James Milan. Welcome to this public affairs special program. I am joined today by Professor Robert Bellinger from Suffolk University, and we're here to talk about a really intriguing project as far as I and I think a lot of other people are concerned, which has to do with our neighboring town, Lexington and others. The famed Lexington in many ways in terms of its role in US history. And we're here to talk about the fact that the professor is going to be in charge of a project conducting research that may. Well, it's not going to confound that history or that mythological place that Lexington has but it will, it will deepen our understanding of what the world was, what the world was like at that time. So first of all, with that rather lengthy introduction, excuse me for not getting to you first professor, but thanks so much for joining us. Thank you for having me. Yeah, we really appreciate it. I was me too. And I have been looking forward to this conversation for a while because you're the project garnered some attention, including a, you know, prominent article in the globe happy to say, a couple of months back. Right around Patriots Day and the celebrations that take place there. And there's good reason why they chose that timing to feature this story. So I'm going to ask you just to very briefly mentioned the project that I'd like to talk to you about your own career trajectory for a little bit and then we'll delve more deeply into the research you'll be doing. But if you don't mind just a quick introduction to what this project is. Okay. It's a project of the Lexington Historical Society. And what I am tasked with doing is researching the African and African American history of Lexington during slavery, during the era of the American War of Independence and into the 19th century. Right now I'm focused on the 17th and 18th century, and really trying to get a sense of that broader history to deepen the story that is told at the historic sites and for the town in general. Yeah, so one thing I can assume is that the results of your research, unlike a certain amount of academic research, which I know has a relatively confined audience here, I think maybe you'll be looking to find that your work has an impact, a direct impact on the narrative as it is then passed on to visitors to Lexington to conquer to this area. Is that accurate? Yes, that's accurate. And really this work falls into the genre of public history, which is a recently more recognized field. And in fact, at Suffolk University they have a concentration for history majors in public history. And what public history is, is any history that interfaces directly with the public, which is historic sites, monuments, interpretation of those sites and monuments. And so this is a public history project. And what makes it really exciting and very special is that there are a number of public historians who have been doing this work over the years. And who have come forward to share what they have done with me. And so I have a great foundation to build upon and to compare the notes and the conclusions of all of these wonderful local and public historians. We will get back and focus for much of this conversation on the details of the project. But let me ask you to take a step back first and tell us just a little bit about yourself and how you come to be a professor at one of our local universities here. And not only that, but a historian clearly. Is this something that has been present for you as an interest or passion for much of your life? Tell us a little bit about how you got here. Well, I guess I could say it has been a passion for much of my life because I'm old and have lived a good portion of my life. But it was not always a passion when I was younger. If we were to go back to my high school years and someone asked me my feelings about history, a deep passion would not have been part of the response. It was one of my least favorite subjects. And part of it was that it seemed to be taught in a way that was very distant and which I didn't feel connected to the stories that were being presented. When I went to college, I got introduced to history again through the discipline of black studies. And it was presenting things I had not heard of before, but also presenting it in ways that were connective, that involved passion, involved. And I had a wonderful professor who helped me see how literature and history connected and how these stories were human stories. And so that's how I began to get involved in history. But I still did not think of myself as a historian at that point. I was really focused on being an educator, which is really my first passion, having been a teacher for more than 40 years and having taught all ages from preschool through university. And so that's what I pursued a master's in education and then I was teaching. And then somewhere along the line, I decided that I wanted to move on from teaching social studies and photography to teaching history. And so I began to work on that and I got a job teaching history at a secondary school, a private secondary school, and really spent four years deeply engaged in teaching. American history. And then from there, I ended up going to subject university as a one year sabbatical replacement. And in the history department. And that one year turned into two years. And now I've just completed 34 years. And at the end of this month, I will be moving on from Suffolk University. While I was there, I did teach courses in American history, but I also was a founder and director of a black studies program, which and director of the Clark collection of African American literature, and was also involved in the public history program that they have there, because I've done a lot of work in that area as well. So I think that's how I got to here. As I saw this article in the globe, I was really drawn to the project itself. I think it's wonderful. As you know, it touches the part of me that I no longer teach history, but I still think like a history teacher and I think, oh my God, it would be so great to have this additional information to share with our students here. Students of color and white students for sure. Simply to be able again to make sure that that history is the most complete version that we're able to come up with, as we know, it's hard enough to figure out what happened. One thing that's really exciting is over the years, I have met many, many dedicated high school history teachers like yourself, who really have put in a lot and really make their classes interesting. I just was not fortunate to have one of those teachers. But there are some amazing work being done at the high school level these days in particular. I've been impressed by that. Yes, and obviously the fact that both your own interest being stoked by, but also the fact that the way that you were able to connect with a course of study, happened for you through black studies programs and then again through the public history program that you yourself have helped to establish there at Suffolk is again another indication that kind of history the way it is dominantly presented in our American curriculum still, you know, we've got a long way to go to to make sure that that is of feels like it is something of relevance to more young people. First of all, let me ask you how is it as a noted local public historian that you came on the radar of whoever it was who conceived of this work to begin with was it in fact your own conception tell us a little bit about where this idea comes from. Um, you know, it's interesting, often I'm involved in in projects and when I think back to how I began to get involved. It's a little fuzzy. You know, it's interesting I know all of this great historical information but when it comes to my own history sometimes it's not as clear. Yeah, but I know that I had attended a couple of things that the Lexington Historical Society had when they began talking about expanding the view of African and African American history in Lexington. And I met folks at the Historical Society and the fact that I am local, and I'm a historian. I think had a big role in me in me being asked if I would be interested in taking on this position. And I said, Sure, I thought it was exciting interesting I, I had been starting to look at Lexington's history a little more, and thought this would be a great opportunity to dig deeper. What kinds of things do you are you anticipating being able to add to the historical narrative as it currently stands. What I'm hoping for this first part of the research that I'm doing. I've been trying to read through what's been written and also have started to dive into the archives. Over at the Historical Society, because I want to be able to look at the actual documents and what documentation there is, as well as what people have made of that. And so, as I'm, as I am right now I'm looking to see if there are any gaps there are any questions that are hanging that can be filled through the archives, and then do more expansive look at other archives in the area. And, and begin to try to piece together family connections, identities, and as much information about both the enslaved and free black populations of Lexington, and, and what's exciting is that that also carries over into neighboring communities. Because during the 17th and 18th centuries, many of these communities were just being formed. So the borders and geography were much more fluid, people move between them. You might have someone living in Lexington, marrying someone in Arlington, and moving there, or, you know, shuttling back and forth, but that might affect surnames and other things and then you might have children of those unions. So, it's been exciting because it's also carrying me into Arlington or Monotomy, into Concord, into Lincoln, and really looking at the surrounding communities as well. So it's giving me a really good sense of this error. You know, when I, you know, I mentioned there was a Boston Globe article the the the project itself has garnered some attention, I think, because of that irresistible paradox or irony that Lexington considering to be considered to be one of our bedrocks of freedom and liberty, had an enslaved population, even at that at the time in which it took that it that prominent place in our history. And I do think that people have latched on to as I did that particular aspect of the work that you're doing but you were just mentioning that that there were that you're also going to be looking and and and and fleshing out more the history of the free black people at that time. How, how, you know, from from what you already know, you know, what, what, what, what were the dynamics to the extent that that you can speak to it between the free back black populations in this area at that time, and they're enslaved brethren, do you do you have any sense of that. Well, I don't have any real specific anecdotes, but I do know that in some cases, you might have someone who was free marrying someone who was enslaved. So my initial thoughts, also based on research done in in slavery and other parts of the United States and also just in general, the connections were pretty clear. And often they bridged family. They definitely were a source of support. And they the roles that the free black community played might be multiple. But one thing I do know is that I think part of this larger community, and I'm not sure if they engaged in celebrations together or not those are some of the things I'm considering as well. And as you have already alluded to a lot of your work is going to be in the archives both in Lexington and surrounding communities. Archives are by definition kind of storehouses of documents and documentation so therefore literacy paid plays a prominent role in what voices endure over time. Do you have you already and do you expect to find, you know, kind of testimonies and memoirs and things like that from, I assume, more likely free bought black populations because I assume that there were real inhibitions on those who were enslaved being able to, you know, read and write and pat kind of record their thoughts and their experience. Well, one of one of the things in looking at literacy during the 17th and 18th and into the 19th century is that the overall population had a very small, literate number. Many people were illiterate for a variety of reasons. So the slave population probably would have less of a chance to do that to read and write. However, there are and not particularly to this study, but there are cases where enslaved people learned how to read and write to help keep records for their enslavers. And so I haven't made any distinctions between about literacy. However, from what I know, there aren't any letters or diaries or testimonials from the enslaved population that are known to exist. And much of what appears in the archives are their names and and some times connections with family members or to enslavers. And so often in church records, people who are baptized would be their tax records, those who are free would be paying taxes. So it's really piecing it together from documents and mentions here and there and really trying to flesh it out in that way. Yeah, thanks for that insight in, you know, brief as it was into the heat. You know what I think all of us would acknowledge is that the grunt work, absolutely essential, but nonetheless, kind of unromantic in a way of, you know, of a historian where you're just trying to make informed speculations and connections between various kinds of documents that exist, but relatively little of it in the kind of personal narrative vein, which would make a certain things much easier. Let me ask you briefly about the the public history part of this project and your own work. I had mentioned before that it would be, it must be nice to be an academic and think that your work can have a direct impact. And I do imagine that the Historical Society and others are planning to make use of what it is that you uncover in how they present the information going forward. How do you see that kind of thing playing out? You know, in what way do you hope for this work to change that narrative that gets passed on through the plaques, through the written materials, through the tour guides, etc. Well, I think that it will enable them to highlight stories that may have been missed before. I will say that I think the Lexden Historical Society has done a good job in trying to present that at their historic sites. And this project is an effort to improve on that and to deepen the knowledge that they have to share. So I would imagine it might lead to additional pamphlets. It might add to some of the signage that's there. It definitely will be figuring the interpretations that are given at these sites and perhaps even on any tours of Lexington as a whole. So hopefully it will help provide a fuller sense of Lexington. I think you're right that because of its role in the War of Independence on April 19, and then afterwards as work of abolitionists and so forth, it took on this image that moved it away from the fact that, like all of the colonies, it had a slave beginning. And so I think by bringing that in, it broadens the story and deepens our understanding of this issue and also raises the interesting juxtaposition of freedom and emancipation. Yeah, absolutely. Well, let me, I think this is the last thing I'd like to ask you about today. And that is who, who the audience for this is as far as you're concerned in your, again, your, your aspirations. The reason I asked that is because to state an obvious fact, Lexington, like Arlington, like conquered, like many other western suburbs of the bot in the Boston area are is a primarily white community. I don't have any idea of what the overall makeup of those who visit these sites is in terms of demographics, but I will say that we live in these majority white communities. So I am wondering whether your hopes are to primarily, well, I should just leave it at that. Who do you hope to be that this will resonate the most for the work that you do? Well, my hope would be that it will resonate with everyone. As a public history really is trying to reach everyone because this is the history of our nation. Right. And this is central stuff. So hopefully for residents, it will be something that will inform both black and white residents. Hopefully, there will be ways to connect with the school system to include this in curriculum. I hope that for tourists who come through and visit that it will connect with them. And hopefully, and those tourists I know come from all over not only the country, but the world. And hopefully it will resonate with them or at least make them stop and think about this broader history and the complexities of this place we call America. So hopefully it will resonate in many different ways with those who come to Lexington because they are fans of the War of Independence. Hopefully it will resonate with them. Those who come out of curiosity, hopefully it will raise questions and resonate with them. Those who come because they just are in Boston and someone told them they should see this historic sites. Hopefully it will resonate with them as well. Well, I think you just mentioned the phrase, you know, at least it will make them, you know, one one hopes it will make people stop and think and what a great goal in and of itself for for to take on with a project like this is just, you know, at very minimum, getting people to question what it is that they they learned in a very kind of wrote fashion, perhaps in a very long time ago, perhaps, and and think these think these things and new as a way to hopefully, you know, change the course that we are on and from an understanding of where we started that is more nuanced and more complex and more complete than than many of us have received up till now. I want to thank you for taking the time today. I really do. And for taking this on. I wonder, is there any connection between the fact that you will be spending the balance of the coming year on this work and the fact that you're just wrapping up your tenure at Suffolk. No, there was no intentionality on, you know, and either of those. It just happens that way just a happy. Okay, happy coincidence fair enough. I would be very I would be delighted to check in with you during the course of the work that you do but I am sure that we will absolutely be getting together when your your work, so to speak is complete. And, and you can share with us what you've learned. I look very forward to that. So thanks again for the conversation today. I have been speaking with Professor Robert Bellinger from Suffolk University who is engaged in a project that we are all going to be the beneficiaries of so with our thanks to the professor for his time today and thanks to you for joining us. I am James Milan. This is a CMI public affairs programming, and we appreciate you being here. We'll see you next time.