 And the other main thing that seems to result from minimum wage ironically enough is an increase in efficiency Because workers shift from less productive to more productive firms Yeah, okay, chris farley Thank you. Now what we've seen here folks. Unfortunately is with whatever we implement We're gonna be unfortunately six one-hand half dozen in the other Robbing peter to pay paul. We're gonna add a few jobs here add a little wage here subtract a few jobs there So what you need to do folks the thing that will actually help improve your life Advocate for sound money increase your own purchasing power Fuck over the big guy. They're the ones that are going to have to pay the cost You are going to see an increase in your purchasing power Step on out into the beautiful sunlight of freedom. It's gorgeous out here Wonderful. I'm happy I invested in all that silver jewelry. Now we're going to go into the last topic Which is uh cancel culture. Uh, this is back. Uh cancel culture and and inspector around it I it could be about the dr. Seuss thing. It could be about The recent thing with m&m or a wider topic about the conversation around cancel culture Of course, we don't have time for intros But I know that drone tech was really interested in talking about this topic in particular So I think I'm gonna give it to him first Well, I think it's Yeah, I guess I got a lot to say about it. Um, first of all, it's way I mean, I think we all agree it's way bigger than just the dr. Seuss books and all that I don't know if you guys agree or not, but It seems to be part of a larger pattern of general widespread censorship Uh, you know Just basically shutting down of all dissent Across the board and that's not generally something the good guys are doing and I'm just wondering what you all what your rational is Is excuse me your rationalization is for that Can we just clarify the dr. Seuss situation? His estate Voluntarily chose to take like what six books out of rotation. I'm not sure what they did because after having Why are they doing that? They're being pressured. I thought you guys like the free market This is a private estate responding to the demands of the free responding to threats from a vocal minority Responding to what the market is telling them in no market Valuating and evaluating like with the market on their business, you know, what the best part You know what the best part about the the dr. Seuss situation is to since self-cancelling and removing uh, six books from circulation the Sales for all dr. Seuss books has skyrocketed. So they are quite literally profiting off of self-cancelling And if that's not capitalism and the beauty of it, I don't know what you people want Now if I may As a little aside When people are worried about things being unavailable and people now suddenly can't get their hands on something This is one of the hallmarks of actual english liberty where it's not just the right of the person who speaks to be heard It is also the right of the audience to listen and to hear and to be exposed And any time you limit yourself or limit the speech of another you make yourself a prisoner of your own action Because now you are not exposed to a new idea So that's one of the great dangers of this cancel culture that we face ourselves and when we're talking about What's going to happen in the future? We all of us every one of us hope that wiser people in the future will forgive us our sins and failings As we're going to forgive those who came before us who were imperfect people yet still achieved And if any of you on this panel think that you're cancel free Uh-uh the fucking future generations will damn you because you carry this thing a cell phone a computer That has coal tan in it and other conflict minerals Do you know the untold suffering that has to go down for you to have this little creature comfort? Oh, but we had to live in the world that we lived in So did the people that came before us and that is the danger of this cancel culture and I could pose If I could pose a somewhat if I could pose a potentially high useless hypothetical You're this champion of free speech, right? You shouldn't close yourself off to ideas. We should I can't wait to hear this on that kind of things If someone walks into starbucks and starts like spouting off white nationalist rhetoric like in the lobby, right? They're Echoing nazi rhetoric. They're wearing nazi regalia. They're talking about white supremacist Very their asshole, right? Do you not think that starbucks as a private company? It would be in their interest to make sure that that person isn't allowed to be in there or any crazy person spouting insane bullshit Which happens on a regular basis, which isn't what we're talking about and is a complete deflection from what I asked which was the widespread uh What's what's happening right now is big tech is acting at the behest of government big government to silence opposition They don't like and you guys are cool with that because it's being used to Get the ends that you want so explain that Someone who worked in big tech I can answer me. No, I'm an IT guy. That's the thing. I'm not a complete So I'll I'll be I'll be trying to like I used to work for google and and here's the thing like I think I think it's absolutely valid to critique and question the uh the impact that big tech has On discourse on other things, but this framing is so Dissingenuous there are plenty of critiques If I will let you know and go ahead in it But yeah, like it just seems so misplaced because the way that we think of cancel culture or what it's been labeled as right now Seems to me like it's more consequences culture Because here's the thing free speech. No because here's the things free speech is something that is protected Where you are protected from government retaliation. However, if a private company exactly chooses and sees exactly Exactly like if a private company sees that your speech or your actions or anything are a threat to their profit making And if it's not, you know, that obviously there are protected categories, but like That they have every right to discontinue it or to uh to Terminate an employee or whatever and as someone who's uh a fan of the free market. I'm I'm really shocked that that's not something you support Yeah Many pretty much stole everything I was just about to say the thing is It's okay. Uh, the thing is it's a private corporation and they have it and they have a to s so Uh, the reason you're like a lot of which is very nebulous and used to justify a lot of the reason a lot of right wingers Getting to platformed and the like isn't that uh, there's some big conspiracy to shut them down It's that they don't know how to not violate to us It's because they're too dumbfuck to be dog wistly enough that they don't get like That's very convenient for you and your agenda It's very convenient for me. So I don't have to listen to you guys bullshit. And you can just broadly you can just broadly judge All speech People have a choice to buy or Give give me a moment. There's a big difference. How can you not see that? Like I really wonder Okay, so Please everybody. I know this topic is as I get heated right off the bat But let's try to do this in an orderly fashion. I have lu tried to talk earlier, but was stopped So I want lu to go I'm gonna go to drone tech because he was trying to respond And then we're gonna go to hutch. Okay, so we're gonna go in that order. Sound good wonderful Okay, I think I think we're kind of talking about a few different issues They might be kind of related, but I think we should still try to focus on one thing at a time here We're talking and started with dr. Zeus. I don't think that's really a cancel culture thing I think the issue there just just for some background, which you hadn't really provided There are some dr. Zeus books And it was found that some of them have some like kind, uh, you know Images that you wouldn't put in the children's book today They're a bit on pc and I'll admit that like some of them are like something something should be done about that I I'm a question whether they're in I don't think they're intentionally racist, but they're they're, you know adhering to sort of social norms of Bygone era. So what should we do about that? I I'm uncomfortable with the the those books being Taken off out of publication entirely if people want to stop reading those books to their kids For that reason or we want to like change the images in the book to sort of, you know, modernize them a little bit That's that's more reasonable But having them it seems weird to me that they had to be taken out of publicly You can't even buy those books anymore and that's a bit a bit scary to me and seems completely unnecessary so, um Is that I mean does anybody disagree with that like shouldn't we at least be able to buy those books? Before before before Tiffany when I talk nobody talks so I'm going to for the sake of chat read What was in some of these books because like just talking about racist imagery without like knowing racism? Does anybody object to me like just racist? Okay, well, I'm gonna I'm gonna read them An asian person is portrayed wearing a Conkel hat holding chopsticks and eating from a bowl if I ran a zoo includes a drawing of a two barefooted african Man wearing what appear to be grass skirts with their hair tied above their heads Um, there's two. There's a few others, but there's what explain to me. What's wrong there? Do you think that's not racist? I love black people. I have no problem. I love black people I have no problem about that has nothing to do with whether or not this is racist No, no, it does because that's what you're gonna come at me with So I'm just telling you explain to me. What's the problem there? That's all I asked you not to call me a racist. What you're gonna do Tell me what's wrong. You're racist. I'm asking If you genuinely believe that that is not racist that that depiction of an asian man I think it's meant to be leo. I appreciate it that racist So this is one of the pages This is one of the pages from mckele gets pool that is supposedly gonna get this this book marked off Some fish from the tropics all sunburned and hot might decide to swim up. Well, they might might they Racing up north for a chance to get cool full steam ahead ahead for mckele gets pool This is why this is book is getting banned because there's a gentleman sitting on an island Looks like he's drinking like a martini or something, but he's wearing at the time racially Uh, I don't even know what the right term is to use anymore because i'm afraid I'll get you burned banned Dylan so that's why this page is getting banned I don't I think it was more than that. What was the name of that book? Yeah, it's cool. I can read the other one too If you want, I just want to ask you guys something. Have you got are you guys in the mystery science theater? 3000 um, I'm just gonna say that I'm looking at the images That was just sent to me by uh, lu And I I don't know if I can show these on twitch actually Can I am I allowed like these are Twitch might be tough, but I don't know this court. You could just lean on the YouTube discord and I'll and I'll link it in chat, but just to be safe. I will not be showing it on stream I'll probably leave a link to it for all the youtube viewers Uh, okay, so for another page for mckele gets pool. Uh, this is a man that's in tebet He's got a pointy red and white striped hat with a really long beard. That's racist So this image like is it racist though I think the most charitable interpretation You're looking at it Show it to me again. Show it to me again. I didn't see it. I didn't see it. I like how Look at the I put it in the discord chat if you want to look at it I like how dylan said I probably shouldn't show these images and the turks over here showing those images He's like here. Oh, no, he's showing a different image than the one i'm talking about But is it still appropriate though? I guess No, this one So it's just an artistic Interpretation of people. I mean you could do you think that's really turning kids racist or something like against black people I mean, it just seems like now it's getting more that it's turning anything We're just saying this thing is a racist depiction. Look here. Here's my thing. Can you differentiate? Come on At the time when you're reading these books to kids You're reading the words and they're not even listening to you and they look at pictures They don't even look at the pictures man If young kids if the most of what they're being exposed to or if some of what they're being exposed to a really young age Exclusively plays into stereotypes and troubles here. Here's like the only thing That they're being exposed to then they're gonna have a really warped image of those people in their minds This is okay. Then you need to go talk to the obamas and have them call out publicly that the doctor Based on what you just said based on what you just said then Our society is being taught to violently hate white people. Will you agree with that? No No, of course not. No That that picture that picture is in is making people hate black people But the daily drum beat of white people being to blame for everything and if you're if you're not a white trader You're a white supremacist. No, that's cool. Holy shit. Well, there's a lot to unpack it. Yeah, let's get into it Let's get into it. We don't have the time language cultural norms cultural Okay, is that done? Okay. I'm back on screen now. Okay language cultural norms evolve over time Like we can all agree that we if we use the sort of language that was typically used in 1950 We would be rightfully admonished in 2021. Correct Yes, so you're what you're calling? Dumbo needs to be self-canceled by Walt Disney. They need to retract and take off the market the video in the movie Why is it every time left wingers get power? They want to censor and shut up everybody answer that Hey, hey, hold on. Hold on. Should James james gun have been fired from disney Should cat the griffin had had lost her uh cnn spot on new year's eve james gun was that's Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. How about the Dixie chicks? Hold on. The Dixie chicks have been canceled in 2004 For one the Dixie chicks weren't canceled for a second You act like this is something that is excuse exclusive to the left. It's different when you do it. I know politics have been engaged in Cancel culture for fucking decades. You want to talk about gangster rap music in the 90s? I grew up on it. I grew up on it. So fuck off. Okay. So who was trying to cancel that at the time? The conservative right, I know I'm Why is it different when you do it? I'm not a kid. I know you think everybody who disagrees with you is conservative That doesn't mean I am You keep trying to attach that to me You did kind of stumble on something that's been But you have stumbled on to something rather interesting hutch that I've noticed that in the 90s The folks who were humorless and couldn't take a joke were your Over-the-top right wing christian conservative and now weirdly enough we've had this switch where it's probably far Leftists who are unable to take a joke and I even made that Hey, if I may I even made the comment on the tom foolery show one time that it's really unfortunate punk rock does Ain't the same. It's a bunch of pro government boot lickers who can't take a joke All the spicy memes are right. There are a bunch. What are you talking about? How many subjective is it you all think that one chick is funny the rape chick Gabriel question for the panel. Who are you? What? Should this should this book be banned No, my my boys read this book. I would love for them to learn how to go to the bathroom I cannot wait for that. I know I'm like don't don't blame your don't blame your sons for having that book Yeah to help him potty train This is the consumers of all stripes left and right exercise their voice and try to influence big companies To uh capitulate to their demands all the time. It is not something. How does that excuse what's happening right now? I'm not saying it. Well, I don't know what you mean by excuses It depends on what we're talking about but my point may my main point directed at you Is this is not something that's like left a left wing issue in this country right now it is Okay Josh josh howley groups like blm uh Josh howley is a senator from israel. He just tried to Push to have credit card companies stopped doing business with pornhub. This is in the past year. He tried to cancel pornhub um Trump also tried to cancel nikey at some point like today today So your excuse for what you're doing is that somebody else did it? No, it's not No, but i'm what i'm saying is that this is not just simply like a left wing issue This is something you're just deflecting across the political. That's all you're doing I am setting the A major platform. This is kind of an issue for the right. That's why don't forget when they tried the boycott curing We're gonna let's go slow. That's why i'm not a christian conservative. I'm not christian We're gonna slow this down for a moment. Okay So, um, does anybody want to speak? Please raise your hand. We're just gonna slow it down for that process Okay, turk with the first and koe Then tiff Okay, so turk you can go first. Yeah, so my you know, i'm pro free speech I think people should be able to say what they should be able to say My question is the slippery slope question if today dr. Seuss is getting six books self censored At what point should we expect walt disney to retract and erase stuff from their archives at what point do we start to see major Probably cornerstones of americana start to self censor or get You know taken off the market because a radical mob whose mind changes by the day Demand certain actions at what point does it stop? What what is safe content? Is this podcast safe content? At what point does this end? it won't I mean this podcast is clearly too hot for youtube too hot for any of the major platforms But it is the essential question. We all have to ask ourselves unfortunately with this canceled culture and It's is there Anybody in the audience or anybody within the sound of my voice that feels that they're not grown up enough To handle some rather unpopular works and some rather unpopular opinions and some things that might actually provoke you And some things that might actually be uncomfortable Is there anybody in this audience that you could think of that you would like to decide for you? What you are allowed to read and what you're allowed to know and what who you would like to decide for you Whether you can decide whether you can hear something you might need to hear like i've honestly I'm oh, oh, sorry. Honestly after the foreign policy discussion. I mean, I don't know Is there anybody on the panel who'd be against for the people who are okay with these dr Seuss books being unpublished wouldn't wouldn't it be strictly better if they were continued to be published But there was just some kind of Disclaimer or notice somewhere that says hey by the way, there's some imagery that you know some parents might not want to show their kids Um today just keep that in mind if you're a parent Um, wouldn't there be a strictly better Better for society, I guess At least adults could then choose to buy these books and read them if they want like At least access that's perfect But what we're trying to do is pick a nominee to decide what's best for everybody to read and everybody has very different tastes And there is no one fit to decide for you or you or you or you out in the audience What is fit for you to read that person does not exist Nobody has the foreknowledge and we have no idea what the negative consequences could be and furthermore You have to be suspect of the motives of anyone who would try to do so So one of the things that I like to think about in these contexts is what policy What policy would y'all like changed if you don't want to see books like this canceled? What law would you change and what would it do? I don't think this is a legal issue Like I I think you have every right to not publish any book that you don't want to publish I don't think I have no rejection to that But the reason that they didn't they unpublish these books is in response to a culture Which would um, which would be very upset with them if they continued to publish it or Implemented the solution that that I proposed probably so and that is what I don't like. I don't like I don't like that culture Um, and that's what I'm criticizing. I'm not criticizing the law or posing any change in the law What about a culture that you know pressured? establishments pre civil rights to serve Blacks and whites together like what I'm like, like I don't see how that's analogous to this at all Why no that those are like mark. I think you can critique good. This is just a why should these book? Why shouldn't why is it good that we're not even able to buy these books that adults are not even able to buy these books to see No real good reason. I mean all I was gonna say is like if an adult was really dedicated to getting this You you can obtain these books on certain websites very easily I mean you have to pirate but you're that's kind of Yeah, I mean this seems like There's a never-ending cyclone of anxiety because this is we're trying to play whack-a-mole to try Was anyone in here like reading dr. Seuss books night and day and it's just like really anxious that they're If it was your literature, you would have a completely different opinion Have some self-awareness, dude Yeah, we Well, no, I was talking one moment Tiffany. You've been waiting for a while. So I want to throw it over to you Honestly, it's been going so long. I kind of forget what I was gonna say, but I'll try um The the point was that uh The dr. Seuss books were stopped Not just because like a small fringe of people who didn't agree with it Pressured them to it's the majority of people recognize that This is bad for business and this is not acceptable. That's why a lot of companies will Have months dedicated to marginalized communities or lgbt people because you know, they have virtual signaling but they know that there's a lot of people who support those movements and Not a lot of people who support, you know racist books Uh In regards to what the last username is saying it you can make that argument about a lot of stuff Why can't you go down to the local bonds and noble and buy your copy of mine? Come on the uh, the rack Why can't you go to why can't you target? I don't think you can look at all the anti white books you can buy They're all over Wait, can you actually buy mine come? Yeah, I wouldn't but yeah, I wouldn't either Uh, why why can't you go down to walmart and buy your uh, why can't you go to the walmart and buy your discount clanhood and uh, You know tiki torches in the uh, the uh No, the point is why can't you why can't you sell these things and it's because they're not popular in companies realize that And if you really want these books that bad you can get them But that's not the point of not releasing these books times are changing and if you can't change with them That's your problem Additionally, I like how people are complaining about cancel culture when literally during the trump administration. My rights were under attack uh, they were trying to I'm trans and they try to they wouldn't let me uh go into uh Homeless shelters. I wasn't allowed to get served by certain health care providers, especially depending on what state you're in There's a lot. I couldn't join the military There's a lot of reasons I got attacked and that is way that affects my life way more than your god damn dr. Seuss books So when this book get no, I don't I disagree with you actually because Those dr. Seuss books are just a symptom of the larger problem that we're seeing in like uh, last username said in our culture We used to be a culture of openness and free discussion. We could we could do this. We can't anymore We can't even talk anymore because a culture of openness How do you think it felt to be like a black person or gay person or trans person like 50 years ago? We're 50 years ago I agree We can we can have that kind of moral progress and still and still have access to books that that are Even if they're incompatible with those those more The reason that I focus on policy is because to me this seems like the market functioning And so the if you want the market to start functioning Yeah, I the market being strong. We can't change. We can't change. Um, the culture like on our own Yes, the question is how what do you mean? Why not? So you can take Okay, we're a bunch of extreme culture changes. Can I ask a question quick? Okay So I heard a few times like some people think is the market functioning I heard drone tech say that it was that this is strong armed Uh, so this is actually I think an interesting discussion actually from this, right? Um, is this the market functioning or is that being manipulated by outside forces because Um, it is a boycott. For example, people would have boycott the estate for selling these stuff Would that be the market functioning people just choosing not to buy products from this service are good Yeah That would be People like to talk about the Dixie checks is never moving in the direction of freedom ever This happening isn't people's access to information of any kind you're less free by that much So code do you therefore oppose intellectual property rights? Give me a second. Give me a second Joan nobody heard what you said because like other people were talking for a second. Can you say that again? I'm sorry. No, I was just saying people kept bringing up the Dixie checks But the big huge difference there is that it had nothing to do with like mass media and And things like that it was just people deciding they didn't want to buy from Dixie checks But they got huge anyway. So it's kind of like the doctor It was absolutely And amazon are refusing to sell those books It was a hundred percent mass The reason why it got so much cover is because it got picked up in the media and then it caught fire like amongst conservative evangelical I agree, but people just decided not to buy it People didn't stop selling it because they were afraid of backlash Really the boogeyman you think it is I'm sorry How is that different afraid of backlash? How is that different than a publisher? Too many people. Wait, wait, wait. Okay. I didn't hear anything of what was just said Because there was two people yelling at the same time So Let's do the whole go back to handraising because we have 18 minutes left in the show So I want to make sure everybody gets time to talk So can people just raise their hand if they want to talk I see multiple people raising their hand Okay, it's going to be I saw turk raise it first then Tiffany then hutch, okay Yeah, so mine's mine's going to be pretty quick. So basically what I would rather have happen here is Read me knowing how the society works right now I would love to take my book Miguel gets pool and read it to my kids and go and say hey guys You know this picture here? This is not how there actually are in the world I would love to teach inclusivity to my kids with a actual reference of how things used to be and how it was Bad and how we can make it better going into the future. I don't need it to be stripped from the Anals of history. I can teach my kids stuff is bad. I'm not an evil person Tiffany Uh, first off before I get into what I was going to say I agree turk You can't teach your kids what's right and what's wrong But you don't need a doctor's who spoke to do that You should be able to do that uh with a variety in a variety of different ways not needing a book to reference Uh Secondly it was in response to Dylan Burns uh in his question about whether boycotting is a viable response At least I I don't think so on either the right or the left especially the right They tried boycotting nike nike sales went up. They tried boycotting curing their sales went up And even a lot of uh left uh leftists in uh pro lgbtq and uh communities tried to boycott chick filet Didn't happen chick filet is more popular than ever So I don't think boycotting is as viable as people make it out to be you'd need a significant amount of the population to join in If you want to get anything done there Okay, um next is going to be hutch then socialism done left I just want to throw out a pitch for the three albums by the dixie chicks called home fly in wide open spaces They make music Worthy of angels. It's beautiful music and they decided to speak out against george w bush because he was a fucking idiot Isn't it no longer dixie chicks you guys love him now. I thought that's right I thought you guys loved him now record And again, you don't know I've always loved the dixie chicks. I have been They're called the chicks now. They're called the chicks. Oh, that's right. Yeah, he's saying that though I know It's not as catchy the chicks They make beautiful music and they spoke out against the president and the right wing of this country fucking Cancel them. Well, that's pretty much all we get is speaking out against the right wing of this country. Don't you agree? No Absolutely Take a look at the top 10 performing posts on facebook any of the last like fucking 100 weeks And you're gonna see it dominated by right wingers right wingers have a space in this media They like to pretend like they're persecuted and they don't have a voice while writing In the washington post about how conservatives don't have a voice in this country. It's such bullshit. Like they're being demonized In the media every day in mainstream media Like the dixie chicks were demonized and they make beautiful music. They're talking about bombing them and Deprogramming them and shit like that really? It's not at all the same. They're talking about doing this stuff to 75 million exactly the same Okay, I don't think so. We're talking about dehumanizing like 75 million americans talking about deprogramming them and drone Literally drone striking them sir the lead singer of the president president was not allowed to communicate with voters She received multiple death threats from conservatives that were fucking I've received death threats. Who cares? Badmouth George W. Bush and somebody's got to stick up for her All right, do I kind of throw it over to a socialism done left that's going to be maddy afterwards All I wanted to say here is that I think this conversation is really interesting because the suggestion that like Certain firms that like publishing books which are perceived as racist the idea They can't make a choice based on whether it be like forceful pushback activism like free market Presumably these will be all the features of the free market people organizing to do like like causes are parts of consumers doing things freely Presumably so all these should be So the question is simply If you don't like this if you want to change it, how should you go about opposing this is the same thing that people do on twitter Oh, well twitter will ban you. That's just the market. That's a firm doing so if you think just the market like So Like I Believe I think free markets are good I do not think that free markets solve all problems and that once there's a free market It's impossible to complain about anything else And so then you need to stay in intervention. So the question is what intervention do you want? Do you don't need intervention? We can solve problems without If you know way, you know, honestly when you look at websites like google and twitter and there's still problems Then I guess we can't have a free market. No Don't have anything to do with the free market. We solve those problems in other ways I think we can solve I think this is a problem not of the lack of free markets It's a problem with with culture the problem is that the market is these people are responding to the market pressure And the market pressure is coming from a culture that I don't think is healthy And I think we could change and I'm trying to change that by encouraging people like don't be don't freak out If a book exists that has stuff you don't like in it We should have access to to to bad to information even if you think it's bad Okay, can we explain maddie because can we I'll give you the chance because you've been trying to get in for a little bit. Okay Okay, I was just about to say that if we're gonna really look at companies like google and twitter and You look at the massive amounts of taxpayer subsidized bandwidth that they consume In a single day just to keep themselves going It is a little cute to call them purely free market. Just because that was the one little point I wanted to throw in there You know, they can't even go a single day without the massive amount of taxpayer subsidized bandwidth that they consume from day to day So it is just a little cute to call them strictly free market But just a little setting up i'm a farmer just planting seeds in the minds of all of you beautiful people Do it over to maddie Yeah, so when when The here's what I think is happening and here's why cancel cultural is all of a sudden made its front way to the front of headlines to um Make its way to the 24 hour news cycle on fox news um It's interesting that that they went all in on it now that trump is out of office And all of a sudden this is what they've deemed the most important that the public needs to know about um And and cancel culture really is just this boogeyman that people have come up with to explain away bad behavior And then when people empower experience consequences So I almost like to think of it as consequence culture Because when you make a mistake and we all do By the way There should be consequences now There's there's debate over whether what those consequences should be but like this isn't like And it's just it blows my mind and I mean I get it The g.o.p. Had a lot of time to fill with the recent c-pack um conference So of course they had to find new things to get their geriatric audience outraged about And it just it feels like so convenient that these things happen all of a sudden When there are so many other things that are far more important and it's interesting again That a dead man's family's trust Who chose to remove his books out of circulation? These aren't even it's not cat in the hat. It's not like his more popular works either It's not like they're removing dr. Seuss entirely They just made the decision to remove some problematic books, which is within full well within their rights So I just find it interesting that this Specific is anybody denying it within their rights? So there is rumors around that the cat in the hat is actually someone that's uh playing blackface So yeah, I wouldn't expect that in a couple of years that this also could be banned because it depicts someone He's awful wise It's on the internet. It's not What site is it on I I don't know google it. That's a good defense I'm right.com the most reliable website the desire to censor thing has been near universal It's it's not like a new thing and I have little to reason to believe that it's what do you mean near universal and in the past Like you I don't think that's true. Look at literally any time here and you'll find people trying to censor the writings of their It goes back to fucking good. We're whole wars about so first of all You're suggesting that this has never changed ever. I find unlikely second of all just because it's been around a long time Does that mean it's a good thing? No, the argument is that it's somewhat im malleable about human nature is the argument Why is it im malleable? Because it seems like it's Literally all societies that people want to censor things they don't like so the question is if there's something im malleable Why can we buy mine come? Like some at some point it was decided in history that that we should be able to buy that book even though There's like no debate that it has some horrendously dangerous stuff And but there was a culture that said the dad book that we should be able to buy that book I think if if mine comp was published today It it wouldn't be published and like it would it would be unpublished the way that dr. Seuss And dr. Seuss books have led a lot of children to happiness and learning a lot of family values that prop up The attitudes of younger children one moment hutch has been trying to say something over and over hutch After hutch, please the mind comp issue like this. We're talking about one of the most impactful and consequential historical leaders in the history of the world that is that is Perfectly plausible reason why people would have access to his personal writings while he was imprisoned Okay, can I say something like so kind of consequential too, I guess Not as much but I keep saying like we're hung up on this book and it's everybody knows him like why shouldn't I think people are curious to see the things that that he did in the past that are controversial Keep this bat baton and pass the drone. Okay. No, I just want to say like There are it's I've been saying this over and over it's bigger than the books, but look look at the monuments. Okay. We had these Confederate monuments that were like, oh, yeah, it seems like an obvious thing. Yeah, let's take these down There's these horrible symbols and let's take them down fine And trump actually said if you guys remember during that infamous Charlottesville press conference He said that next will be thomas jefferson in washington and he made an argument And if you guys remember the media went off on him at the time and they said, oh, you're you're crazy You don't need to open a history book. Hold on. Let me finish and a costa Acosta did a couple of pieces where he's like the president This is white supremacist lingo to compare the confederate statues to Washington and jefferson and he needs to open a history book Guess what trump was right because that's exactly the next target and rush towards the target And eventually the american flag will be the target all of america will be the target So this is an obvious like slope. It's a real slippery slope that we were really on Can you guys defend it a personal one if if you don't want me to I am the host I'm not supposed to but can I ask you a question? Yeah, go for it So would you say that the mount rushmore situation is a little difference as it has to do with Native land and tribes who think that that it's disputed with the federal government. It's a little different That just like cancel culture. It's just no I'm sorry. It's not because it's not because it's just part of erasing american Culture and replacing it with something and the people that are driving this are all marxists and communists So what are they replacing it with? I don't know. Isn't isn't that what we did to the to the native mountain? Yes, it is. Well, no, I think there it's I'm not a hundred percent on the history of that site, but I think it's a little bit more complicated than that But uh, yeah, in a sense we did but if we acknowledge that that's wrong, why would we do it again? To me it's destroying art. You can't do that. You can't destroy art like that This is our connection to our history in our past whether it was right or wrong. There's giant statues made of very precious of the ancient pharaohs of Egypt But we keep the statues nonetheless because that is how the art of the day was created Okay, yeah, what's ISIS do they blow showed up I gotta go to the list because we have six minutes left Then sdl Then tiff. Yeah, this is this is quick. Uh, so the whole reason why dr. Seuss is in the news right now is because uh He was not being showcased in the read across america anymore Which happens to be held on march 2nd, which is his birthday And the reason why they have the re read across america today is it encourages kids to embrace books and foster a love of reading That's why people have celebrated dr. Seuss. That's why president obama and his first lady liked reading their books because there are a lot of good values that dr. Seuss has brought to the world Yeah, there people can misinterpret some of the stuff in the in his pages But everything could be misinterpreted given enough time Next is gonna be sdl Yeah, I mean, I think this conversation is like as usual with most like culture like culture war conversations just utterly unproductive We're talking about things which are very hard to quantify hard to prove have any real world impact It's hard to actually care about any of this whatsoever That's why I keep trying to pivot towards like policy or other issues that are broader Like should there be intellectual property or anyone be able to access these books? If you want to talk about like general cancellations and general like how the market functions Then talk about those don't talk about fucking dr. Seuss and don't talk about like marxist destroying Like our culture by eliminating it like a statue or something. It's all part of the same thing Yes, they could be it absolutely is come on my channel. Let's argue good Sdl, do you think policy is the only thing they don't get the broader discussing Pretty much worthless. Yeah, like do you think there are problems? There are some problems that are best to solve culturally by just changing social You like to hop in right after last when it's always my turn so All right. I just wanted to build off what uh, sorry Well, well, I will say that when somebody goes that doesn't mean it's like as perfectly Or if somebody wants to respond to a statement they can but he said it just generally used to move in this order So last season they can if he really wants to quickly I just do a brief response to last I'll Yes, sure you can do it and then we'll go to tiffany Sure. So last as you say some issues are social I certainly agree that some issues are social the question is what can we change and so culture I'm suggesting here is probably pretty immeasurable because the desire to censor things the desire to have books published Which you don't agree with um have those like cut down. This has existed for all of history It doesn't seem clear to me that you can end those just by like changing culture or to make it more virtuous or something Because these things existed 10 20 30 40 50 50 a thousand a million years ago I'm sure they existed It's very hard to think that we can just eliminate them because we make the right culture It's not hard to think at all. I can easily imagine that I don't understand like There are a few things I want to say first I want to build off what sock done left said earlier in that when you sign up to Any social media platform be at facebook or twitter, whatever you have to read and agree to their to s if you Break to s and you are suffer the consequences that is on you So that that if you don't like it you you have to take it up with them secondly I do like how the right wing always tries to play the victim where they're getting Way more crap than the left is right now. We get Six books from dr. Seuss taken away. They get a majority in the supreme court We get some statues of uh traders to america taken down. They get tax cuts for the rich their priorities are skewed Bees All righty. Well, is everything okay continue I think that's it Good I would I would honestly say that you're going to closing statements, sir Might as well turk you want to be starting closing statements because we got to wrap it up. Uh Sure. Yeah, I just like You know the company has every right to self censor their own books They've gone through their own procedures to take the stuff down the only problem I have is that just because something's unpopular today Doesn't mean that that goalpost is going to shift in the future What was not offensive like this bathroom book, you know, there's a it's all white people in it It's a loving family. They're trying to teach this girl to go to the bathroom When is that going to be deemed offensive because the majority of uh under privileged people don't have a nuclear family They're you know, they're not the right color. Maybe we need to have uh a double Dads in the book instead when when are we going to start changing everything across the board because we can't just be selective on how We're enforcing this outrage. We need to be uh all across uh america expecting these kind of things So I demand everyone that's uh in favor of dr. Seuss self self censoring I want them to Go to disney tell them to get rid of dumbo get rid of latin get rid of all sorts of different types of stuff And it it's got to be universal guys. You can't just selectively censor people If you love orwell, it's becoming real It is real right now Yeah, he thinks it's hilarious because it's being done In his favor if it was being done against him, this dude would be raging Okay Everybody it was closing statements that we started It wasn't we're not back to open form. Okay. The thought of this works So drone, do you want to do your ending statements? No, I have nothing smart to add at all to this But uh, I did have fun and I appreciate you got inviting me dylan and uh and meeting all of you. It was fun Yeah, wonderful. We're gonna move it over to last username Yeah, so I think um This this conversation has been like derailing all over the place. I think this is really about um a culture Culture of censorship. It's not about law. It's not about rights. Um, it's about Do you if you don't like the content of a book? There's something wrong with it Let's say there's something really is wrong with it. Should it be Are would you like it to cease to exist or would you just like it to I don't know? Put it put a disclaimer on it or something like that Should we have access to to information like that? I think the answer is pretty obviously yes Um, I don't see why you would want information to just be to be removed from existence have books Just removed from existence. That's a very strange attitude. I don't think it's a First of all, it's not a universal attitude lots of people disagree with that now It's definitely a malleable attitude to something that's changed throughout history and across different cultures And it's something we can easily change in the future and the suggestion that oh well people just censor That's what people are going to do can't do anything about that. It's just so absurd Of course, we can change that especially coming from a socialist or usually quite optimistic about the ability to of culture and norms to change the whole reason these books are Are problematic now is because norms change, right? That's what made the things that were acceptable back then not acceptable now Why can't we change the norm of like, you know, we'd rather see books just Just sort of properly labeled or disclaim or rather than cease to exist that of course we can change that Okay, next is going to be kaoli Well, thank you one and all for joining us for this amazing evening on dylan burns tv Before I start getting into who I am and what I do one closing statement I'd like to say to you folks When dr. Robert johnson the compiler of the first great english dictionary at one point Met with the ladies of london after he had done so and they said him dr. Johnson We are pleased to see that you did not include any unfit or obscene words in your dictionary And he said ladies I congratulate you on being able to look that up And for those who do get that joke, I'm pleased to see that about 10 of you can You get the idea of you must always be suspect of the motives of those who are determined to be offended Of those who will go through a treasure trove of english in search of filthy words In order to just act as though they are offended and be appalled you always have to be a fed Suspect of those motives folks always remember that but as I'm known to say around here All that being said, thank you for joining us this evening on dylan burns tv the hippie hippie podcast I am the devilishly handsome outlaw himself your king of extreme fill koe you can find me at koe nation on youtube also the revolutionary wrestling and big bucket Why I'm so sorry and I make occasional guest star appearances on the tom foolery show Dad's worldwide and yanked up podcast folks. I love every last one of you raise the glass to yourself Thank you for joining us. Thank you for being here. I love you all Who doesn't love koe we're gonna throw it over to sdl Sure, so I think that human norms can change the question is how much I point to like the vast majority of human history across enormous changes in like Economic systems like social norms and it always seems like people want to reduce the power of those that they disagree with The question is how can you mitigate that the reason that I focus on policy is because we can actually change policy here We can reduce the impact of intellectual property rights on the ability to publish if these books were public domain It wouldn't matter if the publisher wanted to stop publishing them because you can just download the goddamn PDA as you can if you just look it up Similarly if you moved towards more of a like publicly funded sort of like I like the idea of like media vouchers sort of approach where there is like public funding of these sorts of things rather than leaving entirely up to the market Then a lot of these issues also are mitigated There's a whole lot of evidence that public funding of media enormously improves the quality of media in general Leaving the control of information up to just to the market Just to these cultural norms is not a productive or efficient way to run society There's literally studies that like npr pbs and in general publicly funded media around the world is consistently the highest trusted and the most informative And there's a reason for that. It's because they aren't motivated by profit They're motivated by in in short trying to inform people This is an argument. I think for a diverse and broad set of public funding and reduction of intellectual property rights Okay, next is gonna be tiffani star Uh, I wasn't really prepared for this topic because I didn't intend for us to make it this far I thought we were just gonna do the first three. That's how it's usually gone. Uh I I have to say is I love how the right talks about cultural censorship When it's primarily the right fighting against marginalized communities including women's rights LGBT rights and brown people Church said will they add two dads to his book as if that were to race his culture? What's the problem with that drone is upset? They pulled down confederate statues even though confederates literally fought against america KOE I don't know what the hell KOE was talking about. I know he likes silver The point is it seems like a lot of their ire doesn't stem from us like taking away their culture, but us implementing ours I resemble that remark I don't care. Just so we're clear. I don't care about the confederate monuments. It's about the overall trend. That's what I care about Yeah, I mean like one of the things I love about this country is when you when you think about just how far we have progressed And especially in the last 20 years the internet is something that is making this issue much more Um relevant and potent than it was just 30 years ago or 40 years ago The reason why we're having so many of these discussions is because we're all talking But I for one really love the fact that we don't use the same kind of language that we did 30 years ago 40 years ago 50 years ago. It indicates that we culturally are moving forward That's not a bad thing But there's bound to be growing pains while that's happening at an accelerated rate because of things like social media um that spread ideas and arguments a lot faster than they did before um And uh, I just want to throw one final pitch out there the Dixie chick. I'm sorry the chicks home fly in wide open spaces Incredible albums. You should listen to them. Thank you Okay, now I'm gonna throw it over to matty Hey um Yeah, I mean overall like this was a super fun panel to be a part of um As far as cancel culture is concerned, um I feel like that term has been weaponized by the right as instruction tactic. They seize on it Um, it's my statement, sir Um, and like the the dr. Seuss debacle is a case study in the right wing grievance industry that refrains normal age old processes like removing books from circulation as some sort of sinister suppression um, and they I mean listen 24 hours of a news cycle on fox news anchor to fill itself So I appreciate the hustle. I don't love it, but I appreciate it. Um, and I think this is something that we're seeing, uh being brought to the surface again because It's now all of a sudden people who are in power being held accountable for their actions versus how it's historically happened Where people in power are the ones that are quote canceling Those who dissent from them and all of a sudden now that you see any sort of opinion counter to the powers that be And people using their collective power and influence to call them out on it All of a sudden that makes it a bad thing. So, um, I agree with hutch that I I think I'm glad that we don't use the same language from 30 years ago It's encouraging to see that our society is moving forward in that way. Um, and I hope to see more of it and I I mean For me at least I always look for opportunities to make sure that I'm being more inclusive that my language Um is is always evolving so that I'm not you know, I can be part of the solution not the problem Um, so that's what I have to say on this but otherwise again, dylan. Thank you so much for having me on here I had a really good time and this was fantastic. Oh and ko e is is doing prop comedy So I just kind of carry nation of you two I am never above some shameless self promotion. I am wonderful I will of course in the youtube video everybody stuff will be linked below if you want to check them out And I want to thank everybody for coming on. It was a blast. I'm really happy with this round table Even if I reached at some parts for personal restraint. I I thought that I think this was a really good round table I think it was it was a good mix of entertainment policy discussion, etc Thank you, uh, so much for everybody coming on. I'm gonna head out You're all free to stay in here to chat if you want to for whatever reason Uh, you all will stay okay. Thanks for inviting me dylan. I had fun later dylan. Thanks for having this evening dylan All right, I had a nice evening all y'all. I need to get to bed. Hey, same with all you guys. I am dead tired night I need some dinner. Have a good night everyone. Stay safe and all that Pleasure meeting all y'all. This was fun. Oh wait if hutch is still here feel free to play call of duty with me sometime No