 With a population of over 200 million, Nigeria is the most populous black country on earth. We are diverse, strong, vibrant and mostly young. We are yet to reach the land of our dreams. We can write, tell and be our own story. From the economy, education, security to politics, you name it. We can build the Nigeria of our dreams if we work together. Join us on the run-up to discuss and profile solutions to the issues confronting our quality every weekday. I am Bayo. I am Uchi. And I am Nyamug. We invite you to the run-up, 11am Monday to Friday on this channel. You're welcome back. It's still the run-up and we just talked to the managing director of Daora Dryport, Mr. Ahmed Rabiu. Right now we are being joined by Mr. Obbaro, who is an oil and gas expert. And he will be talking to us about why Nupeng is threatening to go on strike and the issues that are involved. Good morning and welcome to the program, sir. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. It's my pleasure. Okay. Nupeng, a very critical group in our economy, is threatening to go on strike. Can we know more about the reason why they intend to do this? I want to quickly correct that. It's not Nupeng that is threatening to go on strike, but the Independent Petroleum Marketers Association. That is Ipman. Yes, Ipman. And as we speak now, the Independent Petroleum Marketers Forum, which is in the north. They are already on strike, which is for three days, one strike, because of payments. That is what the responsibility of the now default Petroleum Equalization Trust fund has always conducted, which is a logistic cost. They are asking for it. According to them, they have not been paid. The last payment they received was in November, December 2021. They talked to you now. They haven't received any further payment. But the Nigerian Mutestream Regulatory Authority says that they've paid till August. So at this point, we don't know who to pay them. So those are the issues. For the whole threatening in the eastern part of the country now, they're talking about a social, basically too much, the money, the levies from the association, which is Nupeng. But at the same time, they don't put a bulk figure, which is $120,000 per truck. And you know, these fees per liter, in most cases, is actually $2,000 per liter. You understand? It is actually $2,000 per liter. So I don't know if the $150,000, I mean the $60,000 capacity trucks, or the $33,000 capacity trucks, or the $45,000 capacity trucks are the same flat rate of $120,000. That I cannot say for certainty. So these levies that are being imposed on the people are from where? Is it not from the right authorities? And even if it's from the right authorities, why is it so much of a problem? If you are a member of a union, you are entitled to pay levies. And they know that these levies are charged by the union they belong to. And I want to say, because for them, they said that the eastern part of the country is selling between $200,000 and a bulk. Please, it's on record that from February this year, petrol has been selling about $200,000 per liter in most eastern part and southern part of this country. And it's also on record that in March this year, I was in Bayesa, and the governor of Bayesa pleaded with the marketers not to sell about $200,000 per liter. You understand? So for them, I believe that they want to buy public sentiment and emotion, to whip up public emotion against their organization. I don't know the issues they have with them, but I don't think that is solely responsible for them to increase PMS prices in the eastern part of the country. If you just take a survey, I cannot show you. The cheapest we get PMS in the eastern part is around $119,000 per liter before now. Okay, so you're saying it's just public sentiments that is making them to say they want to go on strike and whatever is happening is supposed to happen. Can we quote you as saying that? I cannot say that what is happening is supposed to happen because what is actually happening after the signing of the PIA is illegality. On whose part? Everywhere, across both. It's illegality because if the PIA has come into effect, then there shouldn't be a regulated price anymore. Okay. So we should get that clear. The PIA has come into effect, there shouldn't be a regulated price anymore. Or say there is a regulated price. It is contrary to the PIA. I don't seem to understand. You're saying the levies that are being imposed on these people is from the association they belong to, not necessarily government. Now the government brought the PIA. It has been signed into law. Where is the illegality coming from? From the associations or from the government or where? I don't seem to understand. We seem to have lost that call. We will try to reconnect with Mr. Obaro and get more information from him. We were talking about the strike that has been threatened. I said Nupeng. He's saying not only Nupeng, there is Ipman inside there. There's Nupeng. So we just have a general picture that it is the oil and gas sector that a lot of things are not happening the way they should happen. According to him, PIA has been signed and so many things that are happening now should not be happening. We're trying to establish where the fault is from and what we need to do or what the relevant agencies need to do. We'll take a short break and try to re-establish contact and get back with you. Stay with us. We're glad to know you're still there and watching the run-up on Plus TV Africa and we're glad to also tell you that we've been able to re-establish contact with Mr. Ogadi. Welcome back Mr. Ogadi. We were wondering what happened. But before that break, you were trying to tell us where these illegalities, as you called them, were really coming from and maybe also tell us what needs to be done at this critical moment because we cannot face another strike from the oil and gas sector when we've just gone through the one in our educational sector. Here in Lagos, we're already facing a one-week warning strike from bus drivers and other stakeholders. It's becoming more and more difficult. So where, like you were trying to tell us, is the illegality coming from? Let me say this. When I say that the marketers really want a public sympathy, is this? On the issue of the levy, which is 120,000 per truck, without telling us expressly if it is the 33,000-liter capacity, 45,000-liter capacity, or 60,000-liter capacity. These are the trucks' capacity that we have. They just gave a blanket statement that it is 120,000 per truck. Who are they? Who are these they? The association or the government? Yes, Nupeng. Who is Nupeng? They are members of Nupeng themselves. They are members of Nupeng downstream because petroleum marketing is actually downstream in the petroleum industry. They are members of Nupeng, so it is their own association. In their own association, which did themselves, they are members and they decide to take the decision and treat this pricing as overcharging them. That is an internal issue for them to deal with, not for the government. I want that to be clear. Then on the issue of payment, which is the bridging cost, basically for logistics, for uniformity of price across the country. That is the reason why, because it is a regulated market and government gives price band, which is lower limit and upper limit, that you should not exceed this price because it is regulated. You are paid for government credit under recovery. Do you understand? So if government hasn't paid them this money, then it is a fault of the government. That is a wrong hand. But on another hand, I am saying that for them to say that the cost of PMS will be about $200 per litre. And since February this year, I can tell you that every cost of PMS in the south-east and the south-south has been between $200 and the lowest you will get is $189. Do you understand? So I don't really know if you get what I am trying to stress. Okay, just let me not say I understand all the time. But if you are saying in the east, they have been selling fuel for over $200. And now the body is saying that the fuel will be sold at $200 an era. Is that not an improvement? Just so I understand. They themselves, each man, the independent petroleum marketer, cannot be absorbed of complicity of the pricing and corruption in the oil sector, in the gas-stream sector. I want not to get that clear. And why do I say this? They themselves, okay, who is monitoring them? I can tell you if you go to the south-east and the south-south, as we speak today, hardly do you will find a filling station that will dispense one liter of fuel for you. One liter and it is one liter. No. They adjust their meters in a way that they reap the people off and nobody is checkmated. They're not saying anything about all these ones. You understand? So their internal issue should not be a button on Nigerians. That is what I am against. Because NUPEG is their own association. It's no government control. Do you understand? Okay, let's just digress a bit. Well, this is not a digression. You mentioned the PIA and you said there are some things, because the PIA has been passed into law, should not be happening. Can you tell us what the provisions of this PIA are that have not been followed to the letter and how they should be followed so that we shouldn't be having this kind of problems in the oil and gas sector? Section 240 of the PIA deals with this issue. It clearly states that after the PIA has been signed into law, six months is a window given. Then after six months, the petroleum downstream sector is fully deregulated. And when it is fully deregulated, then it means that there will not be uniformity of price again. Every marketer should sell at how much he buys. And I want to clarify this. In the entire South East, the NMPC depot are not functional. So when they get the PMS from independent depot, if it be a bit higher than the NMPC depot, that is one fact. Then two, because of these independent depots, who are those who own these independent depots? They are still made by some people. You understand, they want to make profit as well. They will do everything to ensure that their patronage will continue. Do you understand? Even if it means that the NMPC will not work, do you get that? I want to get that clear. Do it again. Come into the PIA. The PIA itself, the PIA is not price uniformity. But it also states another thing. It gives importation of petroleum products to only three individuals. Number one, then go take. Number two, BUA. Number three, NMPC limited. These are the only bodies empowered to import PMS into the country. Do you know why? Because it states that entity that does not have local refining capacity, I'm not talking of modular refineries, so please. Local refining capacity cannot import a refined petroleum product into the country. I know EAPMAN, inside these three bodies that I mentioned, has a local refining capacity. So they themselves, they cannot import the product into the country. They will only buy from the one NMPC import, or these other two individuals import into this country. So we must get that clear as well. Let me understand. We're about to wrap up. Let me just understand. You're talking about refining capacity. Refining capacity for these three people, or three entities that you have mentioned, the NMPC, the DANGOTE, and the BUA. The refining capacity that they have, what does it translate to? Because I don't see, I don't seem to understand what they mean by refining capacity when nothing is being refined in Nigeria. Just put me through. Let me understand. They have licenses now. They have what? They have licenses. They have licenses. They have licenses. They are not refining anything. So what makes them different from the people who are not refining? I'm not a one who tries to be, but please note it clearly, that even if madam said they fought against this provision of the PIA, they didn't say they are against it because they want to import by themselves. Do you understand? That is a wrong hand. But the provision clearly states that those who have local refining licenses are only those empowered by provision of the PIA to import PMS and other petroleum products into Nigeria. Okay. Do you have the pathway please? I see now what you mean. Anyway, because of business, yeah, just... Majority people, if man, they cannot import by themselves except the NMPC or any of these individuals or entities can get the contract to import on their behalf. Interesting. So if you were to advise the government, now you had the opportunity, just briefly, what would you say? Because our economy, our entire economy, I would say, hangs on oil and gas and when we keep having problems like this, whether it is from infighting, whether it's from inside saboteurs, whether it's from whatever place it's coming from, the individuals, the citizens are the ones who suffer. So if we were to advise the government or whoever is relevant to that sector, what would you say? Briefly, please. We have been advising the government but the government never listens. Full and total deregulation. Not to worry about it. Nobody is giving you price bands. Oh, it's going to be $200. It's going to be $400. It's just wasting its time. Two, the government should let his hand off refining. Three, open up the entire petroleum industry and let Nigerians who are interested come with their money and fund their operation. Four, the kind of support the federal government of Nigeria has given to the dangote refineries to also be extended to other Nigerians who are interested in the downstream sector of the petroleum industry. Or even the mainstream, which is gas or the upstream, which is exploration and production. Without this, governments, okay, where is the NNPC now? Where? Can you tell me where you can find NNPC? Before now, it has never been like this before. Before now, the NNPC remits to the federation account. But I can tell you. I can tell you. NNPC is declaring profit but they have not remitted one Kubo to the federation account in the last eight months or even more. Okay. Okay, Mr. Ogadi. There's a lot more to talk about but this is where we'll have to wrap it up for today. We'd like to thank you for giving us another perspective to what is happening in the oil and gas sector. Thank you so much for being a part of the run-up today. Yeah, it's my pleasure. Thank you. Okay, we've been talking with Mr. Ogadi, an industry expert there, telling us some of the things that are happening in that sector. We will take a break and take the news. After that, we will conclude we are third and final guests. Stay with us. With a population of over 200 million, Nigeria is the most populous black country on Earth. We are diverse, strong, vibrant and mostly young. We are yet to reach the land of our dreams. We can write, tell and be our own story. From the economy, education, security to politics, you name it. We can build the Nigeria of our dreams if we work together. Join us on the run-up to discuss and profile solutions to the issues confronting our polity every weekday. I am Bayo. I am Uchi. And I am Nyamug. We invite you to the run-up, 11 a.m. Monday to Friday on this channel.