 My name is Kylie. I have a special guest with me today, David Foss. Hi. Good afternoon. So David and I were actually guests together on a program last week, the Affordable Housing Show. And we had a lot of interesting conversations there, which I think we're going to be able to continue today and also talk a little bit more about the way that people can use different art forms in hard times, like poetry, photography, painting. And so I just want to start with a poem. This is a poem by Mary Oliver. She's a, I think, a pretty well-known American poet. And I'm going to read what I believe is probably her most well-known poem. A lot of people have found a lot of comfort in this poem. It's called Wild Geese. You do not have to be good. You do not have to walk on your knees for 100 miles through the desert, repenting. You only have to let the soft animal of your body love what it loves. Tell me about despair, yours, and I will tell you mine. Meanwhile, the world goes on. Meanwhile, the sun and the clear pebbles of the rain are moving across the landscapes, over the prairies and the deep trees, the mountains and the rivers. Meanwhile, the wild geese high in the clean blue air are heading home again. Whoever you are, no matter how lonely, the world offers itself to your imagination. Calls to you like the wild geese, harsh and exciting, over and over, announcing your place in the family of things. Very nice. Thank you. It's funny you read that one. I went down to Addison in the south of here yesterday. Me and my worker went down. And in Addison they have the goose management area. Oh really? And it's kind of fun starting now and more when the geese migrate. They stop there every year. It's just funny how they seem to know where to go. And there's all kinds and colors and people just tend to go down there and draw them and do a lot of photography there. It's amazing sight, thousands and thousands at one time. That's really interesting. I didn't know about any of that. I'm just talking about them flying. And they go down there and it's kind of a summer home for them or something because they're enjoying the water over there. So they're always swimming around and playing. And it's very relaxing for a human as well just to watch the geese have a good time and settle in. Yeah. I think that's a lot of what Mary Oliver's poetry is about. I think as a poet she spends a lot of time in nature. Like she goes out walking for entire days and just kind of finds her inspiration in those beautiful moments and in those painful moments of nature and draws comfort in them and then is somehow able to put it into these beautiful words that give comfort to other people and calmness and peace. I agree. And what's interesting is we've been doing a lot of getting ready for Art Hub coming up and which is coming up in September about a month from now which is going to be fun. And we're learning about all the different kinds of art as well and poetry is part of it. The shadow art which you again go back to nature and whatever you see in that other see maybe a little bit different and bring it out and draw and color. And I do the photography and I see a little different stuff as well but with Art Hub we're going to have a chance to see all the different forms with people looking at nature and like Mary Oliver was talking about so it's a real nice connection between art and nature. I want to just step back a moment and let everyone know how David and I met. We met at a meeting at Dekker Towers where you live about the Art Hub and something really exciting is happening at Art Hub this year. BHA residents will have a chance to show off their art at the Bob and Mill which is another BHA property. And so David you're a photographer. I am. So I'd like to hear a little bit about that, about your photography practice. Well I've been doing it since I was eight years old of all things. I went to Williston School here and Williston is definitely a little progressive which is nice and while going to regular stuff I was also throwing in the photography and basket weaving and cooking so by the time I was nine I was able to start doing stuff in the dark room and my grandfather just taught me basically what to look for and he had a beautiful garden so I've just been basically shooting ever since and then I've been lucky I run into people you know writing and I shot a record album covers which were kind of fun and what this Art Hub project we got gives a chance for drawing and photography pull out some folks that make jewelry I mean it's just the gamut of art is just amazing. Yeah could you talk about the kind of artistic talent that you see from your fellow residents at Decker Towers? Yeah that's a cool place too. Decker Towers is basically a BHA, Burlington Housing Authority apartment complex. There's elderly, there's folks with disabilities, there's folks that do photography, there's several folks that are amazing at writing and doing some interesting poetry. There's folks that do oil painting, there's folks that do pottery and make jewelry and there's so many differences at that place but all the differences come together it makes us very strong community and a very active community and it's just nice it's finally starting to show it to other people and get involved with each other with it which didn't happen for a while we're starting to show each other's photos and paintings in the building and at our hop have a chance to do it then more people have a chance to see it and I'm just looking forward to it. So are other people getting excited about the art hop? Yeah they are. What's nice we've been having the drop in art sessions where you've come in and Corinne, Corinne is another lady that does some fantastic paintings and you'll see that art hop in September and we've given a lot of the residents down and we've been learning about painting, we've been learning people have been able to draw with pencils and crayons and everyone's excited and they're getting excited the whole idea was to get these drop-ins to get people a little bit pumped up for art hop and they're going to be able to show some of the things at art hop and I think people take pride when they do something and then other people see it there's a little bit of pride in there and I don't know it's just going to be a neat experience for everybody. Yeah I think you're right about that the pride that comes with showing off your artwork I remember when I was in high school there was this program and I believe that it's ongoing it's still happening that was sponsored by the CCSWS Chinning County Waste District Solid Waste District there we go basically like the dump so they sponsored this thing called the Recycled Art Project and high school students were invited to make art out of recycled materials and then submit it to the contest and then those pieces that were accepted were put in the Frog Hollow Gallery on Church Street I love that place and it's usually a gallery reserved for fine artists but to be a high school student showing off our work in this beautiful gallery space really built up our confidence and gave us that sense of accomplishment and it's kind of fun we were kind of talking about it earlier that in times where it's a little unsettling both Burlington and nationally it's so much everyone doesn't know what's going to happen I mean people are concerned about war and not being able to find a place to live and a lot of medical issues and I think art and music and poetry gives a way for people to both communicate about it but also do some protesting about it I mean when times are rough music tends to start out maybe a little down but then there's a groundswell and people start pumping up and it's just a way to bring people together and I don't know I'm finding more and more especially in places like Burlington that people really want the same thing they just want good housing they want something to eat and good medical care they don't want war I have friends that live in Russia who used to write pen pals used to write them all the time they want the same thing we do it's kind of governments they kind of mess it up for people I think you brought along a poem written by someone else in your building we have some folks that are really quite good as far as their writings and their beliefs and we had a fellow one of our residents passed away early last fall and she was able to come up in just a day or two of a nice poem, nice story and between writing it and using a little photography to accentuate it a little bit so that's you this is the photo that you took paired with her poem so I haven't read this poem before but I could try to read it now hopefully I won't stumble on the words too much I don't think you will so would you like me to read it? sure okay so this is by Dekker Towers resident Melissa Verdone is that how you say it? okay and it's called Oh to Mark just who was our affable friend who answered to Mark? I'm not sure I can fully answer on my part what I did know about him I'll proudly say he was a man who lived his life most each and every day he was not a man with many limitations in his head if you saw his affection for his kilt little more need be said a life of his own beckoning questionable or not he surely led from his mouth astonishing facts and intelligence often bled he was always polite, friendly and fair I'd often see him rocking to music hidden by the headphones in his hair my Clarice the beast of a dog showed him a special kind of affection animals know genuine kindness of this I surely reckon he was always inviting happy and willing to share he did what he wanted seeing some of us wouldn't dare the point he was our friend neighbor and known to so so many the last years of his life spent at Dekker Towers surrounded by family his departure was swift sudden and surprising but I have no doubt his soul ascended quickly rising he's now in the arms of the afterlife forever glorified let us not forget his spirit and lay to rest how he died very nice, nicely read thank you that's really beautiful and I don't know shows a lot of I didn't know Mark but it shows a lot of love for him we find in where we live a lot of folks again we all come from different factors there's folks that had quite well off lives and great jobs and then they ended up at Dekker Towers there's folks that end up different kind of handicaps and disabilities and folks like Mark who just was community bound a lot of us we just all over downtown Burlington homeless a lot of times and we end up in a place like Dekker Towers and we start becoming family which we become make our own family and that's what we really have become and we've been able that's why Melissa is able to write a poetry that's on you know all to Mark because we do really get to know each other and folks they do come and cry on our shoulders we help each other we've garden over there and then people are really excited again about the art thing they want to they make photos for people there's one lady that paints wheelchairs and stuff different kind of paints on wheelchairs or paints pictures of wheelchairs no on the wheelchairs oh wow so that's kind of fun are there a lot of wheelchair users at Dekker Towers? there's quite a few folks that have lost limbs or just getting unfortunately starting to get a little bit older and they need the ability to get around and Dekker Towers what's nice about Dekker Towers it is on the bus line a lot of ability to move around with you know wheelchairs and other devices and folks are there to help too so I'm kind of curious about the wheelchair painting is she painting her neighbors wheelchairs? yeah she does she will like paint on the seats you know walkers and things like that she likes to do like cows and things like that so she's an older lady really a lot of these folks have a lot of energy and a lot of spunk a lot of these folks do live alone you know in their own apartments but we've all become friends we've all become basically uncles and aunts and sisters and brothers and it's so fun when she does something like that because everybody sees it and they're like wow and you know it does put a smile on your face yeah it's really cool to hear the way you talk about the residents there because Dekker Towers really is it's such a huge building is it 11 stories? it's 11 stories it's still the tallest building in Vermont and it was the tallest building in the whole state for a while I think it still is and you often hear how buildings like that in cities high-rises and all can create a feeling of isolation for people and people don't end up knowing their neighbors so it's really nice that you're avoiding that at Dekker Towers the fourth part yeah it doesn't always Dekker Towers hasn't always had the best reputation and I think folks there are trying to make it better and make people understand the situations there and I don't know and through one of the things everyone's starting to do things together stories to drop in art to do the projects what we're going to do with the art hop and I mean it's the place is changing people, some of them do tend to stay in their apartments and stay a little isolated but more and more people are sharing their lives so what would you attribute that to do you know why that's happening it seems like people are reaching out a little bit more we're lucky, Burlington Housing they have a lot of different they have family housing situations they have strictly elderly housing they do have the places where folks with disabilities can communicate and live a productive life and not feel isolated or something like that and we have SASH Coordination people that help bring art and entertainment and help monitor your health issues and those are good and I think we can all use a little bit more of that I think people want to feel like other people care about stuff and that doesn't always happen I think people in this building I think people are starting to realize there are people that do care about their situation through these art things we're doing they're able to share them we learned last year some folks we made apple pies and sold them we had folks show us how to do little stockings like booties kind of things little kiddie booties they were kind of fun they're really cool and everyone's like wow that's fun and people are laughing and instead of feeling isolated they come out I've been lucky enough to attend the past two art drop-in sessions at Dekker Towers I was really impressed by the energy and the way that people are interacting with each other it's so simple so these were organized by Corinne who's the artist we mentioned earlier and me so it's nice having that community energy come into a place like Dekker Towers and then you meld together and you learn both from the residents and you learn from you guys how do you get together bringing the yeah well it's so simple like Corinne got together I think six colors of paint blue, red, green, yellow, black and white and everyone uses those colors in their own way some people lay it on really thick and create this beautiful textured abstract thing other people water it down and use it almost like watercolor well I thought it was funny we had one of our folks there the first time she made a t-shirt she kind of made it with a tie with a paint and twisted it and made it tie-dye kind of thing and that was fun when it was done it was funny because the colors didn't come out as bright as we thought they were going to but it was still really interesting people love these ideas and go for it well I remember at first she asked me is anything happening with these cups of dirty water and I thought she wanted to know where to dump it out and get fresh water and then she said no I don't throw anything away I use everything and she does yeah she brought down a couple of sweatpants and white t-shirts and started knotting them up and putting rubber bands around the tie right there with the dirty paint water and you're right they came out great yeah they did it's that kind of energy that motivates people it starts out in a small community like that and then it spreads other places and hopefully between the poetry and everything it's kind of isolation a little bit from the real world maybe yeah art can be it can be kind of a way to to either deal with the real world deal with these hard things or it can be a kind of respite from them you know when it gets too much yep I think a lot of it poetry is one of those things they might you know see something like flowers or something and they start writing about it and then it turns into descriptions or whatever and so a lot of times I think the poetry part of it becomes leads into other art forms leads into the photography and the paintings people have words and they want to they have an idea in their mind what they're thinking of and so they put that on a paper or you know on a bag or something and then it just grows from there I think and it's funny how art has really become more of a tool activist tool because words motivate but I think pictures do a great job explaining the situation a little bit better instant media now is just you can't hide anything politicians and stuff can't lie anymore they used to but with the instant cameras and leaks and stuff people find out about everything right now and that's a that's good for our art and our poetry and our photography and our creates new truths and yeah um yeah I think I don't know art does have the capacity to like tell those truths that might be hard to say in a more simple way or maybe art is the simple way of saying them um sorry I got a little lost there it's very true yeah and you mentioned the the instant media and the social media and like how everything is moving so fast and I really appreciate it when people use it to share their art and share like something beautiful they saw in the world um and you know instead of just using it as I think Facebook started out as a way to like complain about something or other and well you know they've done it in such a way where they've shown a lot of negative stuff but somebody always finds something positive out of the most negative things and that just those kind of things could take off like crazy that's where you get the main likes I mean animals and flowers and you know something good happening in a pile of not so good things so that's really um I did bring along one other thing to read so it feels like it fits our conversation about the importance of art in everyday life so this is from the bread and puppet theater are you familiar with that? I've actually never been down I've seen in crossberry they come they um wander down here a bit they've been in many states they've been down to Mardi Gras in Burlington a lot of different things and they've been down to Washington they've been in all kinds of events the worldwide so the bread and puppets so they have the performance aspect of it the big puppet shows and then they also have the cheap art thing so their whole idea is like art should be for everybody and um so I want to read this this was written in 1984 um and it's called the why cheap art manifesto uh people have been thinking too long that art is a privilege of the museums and the rich art is not business it does not belong to banks and fancy investors art is food you can't eat it but it feeds you art has to be cheap and available to everybody it needs to be everywhere because it is the inside of the world art soothes pain art wakes up sleepers art fights against war and stupidity art sings hallelujah art is for kitchens art is like good bread art is like green trees art is like white clouds in blue sky art is cheap hurrah hurrah that's very very much goes with what we talk about and hopefully folks will get that idea when they come down the art hop stop in at bobbin mill see what residents are doing see what you're doing learn about community learn about history yeah and just enjoy the weekend yeah see that art really is for everybody and you'll be able to read with poetry we will hear things you'll be able to smell things and yeah I'm really excited about the art hop um we don't have too much time now just let everyone know that what we're talking about the art hop is September 8th, 9th, and 10th in the south and arts district so what we've been talking about here the Burlington housing authority residents involvement with it that's all going to be at bobbin mill community room which is a BHA property we're going to have people from bobbin mill decker towers warf lane buildings showing their art so if you're on the art hop route it's directly across the street from the space gallery and the soda plant there so it's right in the heart of everything and you can come to check out the art come to a couple of presentations I think there's going to be a reception it's friday night yep there will be a reception friday do you know what time that is 6.30 and 8.30 okay so there will be some snacks listen to your presentation hmm chance to meet all the artists and get to see the importance of art in everybody's lives yep it's good and listen to poetry there will be some good poetry there too you think so people will be reading that's awesome I'd be excited to hear this poem by Melissa it's beautiful so I'd like to see what else comes out of decker towers and all the other buildings there will be some memories for sure well I don't want to start anything new I think we're right out of time here but this was a great conversation David yeah and hopefully people will keep the conversation going among each other and remember when you have these lives at 5 things like that oh yeah read your poem read a poem you like ask us a question create a little controversy that works too yep well that's it for the poetry show thank you