 I'm Marsha Joyner and this is Community Matters. Today I am joined by my dear, dear friend Beatrice Contelmo, and we're going to co-host this show. We have just, we are commemorating 100 years since the end of World War I, and I think that in, let's take a, we're going to take a step back, I think, and look at the last 100 years that have brought us up to this point. For those of you that know, I hope you do know, that Dante wrote a poem many hundreds of years ago, and in it he takes a journey into hell. And there's several rings as he descends into hell. And there is one ring where he says that fraud is worse than violence. And what does that mean? Why is fraud worse than violence? Because fraud always comes before violence. You always have to tell people some crap. And in, and that's just what our governments have been doing to us. And in the 20th century, 177 million people were killed because of the governments in the 20th century. Governments use fraud against their own people to get them to support wars. So there, that's where, and he goes on to say that in these rings, you find politicians and government officials and what have you are all in these rings because not across the country, across the world. So Beatrice, let's start with the Spanish Civil War. Before we do, I want to thank you for being here, co-hosting this show today of Community Mators. I want to thank all of the men and women and their families, whether they are heterosexual or from the LGBTQIA community for their service to this nation and abroad. Because it's quite remarkable what they do. Let's talk about fraud. Yeah, and, you know, my great, great, great grandfather was Civil War General, Confederate Civil War General, John Bell Hood, and there has not been a generation in my family since then that has not been in the military. So it comes from a long line. In fact, I don't remember a time when I didn't have an ID card, when I wasn't someone else's dependent. They changed that so you're no longer a dependent, but nonetheless, it's the same thing. So he paved the way, not only for all the members of your family to feel inspired to join the military, but the identity in your family connected with the military is very strong. It is, except, of course, from a place of pride, too, I assume. Except that he was a slave owner. Okay. So let's talk about that. One aspect of deceit, which, by the way, in Dante's, I think, the word I think got translated into English as fraud, but really I think what it means with Dante Alighieri's Inferno is that actually deceit comes before violence. It is deceit, yes. So fraud is part of the deceit, yes, it is the deceit, that they sell this war and that you've got to go to war, yeah. We're still doing it, 2018. We're still doing it, yes. You know, look here, we are at war, and though the biggest war is for war for peace, when are we going to get to that point where we don't sell the idea that we need to be at war and instead work more towards and diplomacy and peace building and peacekeeping? Does that have to be war? Do we have to be... Well, you know that at Christmas time, I don't know why we only do it at Christmas, we sing, let there be peace on earth and let it begin with me. So if we sang that every day, if we really internalize that every day, that peace begins with me, then we, because as long as peace begins with me, we have to be conscious of what we're saying and is that fraud or deceit? Yeah, and is it true, you know? And I think part of peace too, like when nations decide to go to war too, and the justifications, which I think is the part of the deceit, you know, it's so hard when you think about Syria, for example, and what's happened with the people of Yemen, was it really necessary that we would go there the way we went, and what are we doing still, and how are the people, are they better off since we started the war, or are they worse off? Well, if we look at now, of course, World War II, because of the Nazis' final decision to do away with the Jews and the Gypsies and the Gays and anybody else that wasn't pure Aryan, I think then we understood, we thought we knew who the enemy was, but most of the time we don't know who the enemy is. And the parameters were very different. I think World War II was quite justified, even though the sacrifices were so great, you know, we were fighting for freedom, democracy, injustice, and dignity in human rights, which, you know, were all stripped away in that period. And we understood as a child growing up during the war, we understood exactly what, now I wasn't quite so sure about Japan, but we were really sure about Germany, about Europe, and there was this feeling, it wasn't said out loud, except that if we did not defeat Hitler, who was killing the Jews and the Gypsies and the Gays and all of those people that didn't, the more impure Aryan, that we were next, and if we didn't defeat him, we were next. And that was what I was taught as a little girl, and this is why we are fighting, that is why we are in this war. And you know, you have what you described, but it was also a fight for the end of nationalism and the Nazi regime, which, you know, has no room for democracy, discourse, it's all sense, it's all very militant, a little power. It's a different role of military, where the military is used to instill fear and to sustain the system, you know, and the order, you know, through abusive measures. And, you know, that was very necessary to fight against, because this was spreading all over. Oh yes, the fear was real. It was real. Yeah, and it is continuing in 2018 to be real. Yeah, because like I said, in the Spanish Civil War, 1936 was the first time that the word fascist, which is, comes from Italy, as you know. To control, yeah. To control. And that was the first time that it was really public. And when we, of course, read about it, then it spread all over Europe, fascism. It had different names in different countries, of course. But here we are today with nationalism, and for those that were watching, Macron, the prime minister of France, made it clear about nationalism. And I don't think that our president understood, or maybe he did understand. Maybe he does know what nationalism is. Well, I think that it's nice to have world leaders in the same place talking about, we need to criticize and question that nationalist rhetoric that's being used here in the United States. And in all the countries too, because like Italy right now is going through the same thing, Philippines, North Korea, Brazil, which has elected Iron Man, who is openly and outright, you know, supura. And with that, also that culture of teaching nationalism in very similar ways that people during the 30s and 40s in Germany were indoctrinated to where, you know, like in America is make American great again. What that means is not America first. It's what people first. And we all understand that is what he is saying. And it is the same as it was all those years. So the techniques used also to start slowly implemented this regime, which to me is more of a, it's almost a hybrid between fascism and the Nazi regime, because there are a lot of similarities with both regimes. And what I see are the similarities is that they're both heavily militarized under control through force, you know, it's used. Censorship is right quite there on top because you cannot have dissent and speak up against this regime and so for it to work. So you have to get rid of it and you have to silence the voices of people of the press or dealing with that, right? But I think where the difference is that both regimes were based on nationalism, but like in Italy, the shape that it took with nationalism was more like economy and the politics where you support Italy faster and only before you start thinking of, you know, your colleagues from all the countries. In Germany, I think nationalism took that shape but further, which is the part of identity where the Aryan identity have chosen, you know, a prime of Germany. So that gives the excuse to, you know, not include any of the minorities. So that's why the Jewish were persecuted, why the Gypsies, why people from Islamic countries were also persecuted, the Gays were persecuted. So because they didn't fit that role. They didn't fit the role and but in Weimar Berlin before, you know, during the depression right after World War I and Hitler blamed the Jews for the depression, you know, it wasn't for them kind of thing, you know, and then people were suffering. So he had to have a scapegoat and that was it and the Gays were the entertainers and in the and the artists and in that art and they had a voice and a platform and a different narrative. Yes. And that's how they were telling the rest of this is what's coming. So he had to get rid of them. Yes. And it's also, you know, this connection with the moralist, you know, narrative that comes a lot from that religion aspect of it. So being gay then and now does not fit the norm of morality. I think in most countries, there are no progressive and get it differently and have the separation. So you also have, you know, that additional layer, you know, to consider. But I find this very interesting that we're talking about this because I know we're talking about a hundred years. So I think we can go back and forth in 2018. If we look at the United States in the first year of Trump administration, we had, you know, big impact and threats for LGBTQIA laws, especially against the transgendered individuals and the transgendered individuals in the military. So that's always been, you know, like one point that they're always saying it. So that's like it's abnormal and that we can't include, we can't immigrants, you know. Well, now we need to take a break. Okay. Well, we've got 60 seconds. And then, yeah, let's talk about immigrants and what that means. Yeah. Aloha. I'm Wendy Lowe and I'm coming to you every other Tuesday at two o'clock, live from Think Tech Hawaii. And on our show, we talk about taking your health back. And what does that mean? It means mind, body and soul. Anything you can do that makes your body healthier and happier is what we're going to be talking about. Whether it's spiritual health, mental health, fascia health, beautiful smile health, whatever it means, let's take healthy back. Aloha. I'm Jay Fidel, Think Tech. Think Tech loves energy. I'm the host of Mina, Marco and me, which is Mina Morita, former chair of the PUC, former legislator, and Energy Dynamics, a consulting organization in energy. Marco Mangostorf is the CEO of Provision Solar in Hilo. Every two weeks, we talk about energy, everything about energy. Come around and watch us. We're on at noon on Mondays, every two weeks on Think Tech. Aloha. I'm Marcia Joyner, and this is Community Matters. And Beatrice and I are reliving the 20th century. Whether that's good or bad, I don't know. I think there's good, bad and ugly over there. I'm 46 years old and I go, okay, I don't have much of the context of like, well, perhaps you might have lived, you know, like, because you saw these regimes coming and falling and now resurrecting in some places. I felt, I experienced some aspects of it. Like, for example, in Brazil, I was... I was going to say, yeah, coming as an indigenous person from Brazil, you... So, and it's very interesting because I was, I'm a Brazilian national, I'm an Italian national by default because my grandparents were from Italy, but my grandparents, you know, and a lot of family members of Italy moved to Brazil during the fascist movement because... They were generated from Mussolini, yeah. They did not want to deal with this. And back then, there was no United Nations. There was no refugees, resettlement programs. And the part of having descent against an authoritarian, you know, government like my grandparents had and all the family members had, there was automatic persecution and that. You can't survive in this kind of situation. So, I had this background, you know, from like my upbringing, but until the age of 12, I was raised in a military dictatorship regime in Brazil. So, I was tailored, I was groomed, you know, to grow up to not speak up. Well, that did not work because now I speak up to the world, but, you know, we had say it's like, you know, walls have ears, meaning you have to really watch out what you're going to say and where because the military will come and they will beat the crap out of people, send them to jail, torture them and kill them. And that was for adults under the war, you know, just doing things that you and I do that we take for granted is like democratic society that you can be an advocate for democracy and that you can do social justice and political discourse and dissent against the government when they mess up. I can't do that under these regimes, you know, I can't do it. So, I had a little taste of that, but then I had the taste of the birth of democracy in Brazil, which was fabulous because I actually saw the rough drafts of Brazilian constitution being written and introduced and passed. And that was just like amazing for a teenager to who's also learning about different governments, you know, but before it was hidden like under military dictatorship, you only follow and salute and honor that regime. You know, if you teach anything different, well, you know, then you're supporting, you know, you're a communist, you are supporting, you know, you're the enemy. You're the enemy, yes. You're the enemy, but I just so happened to have had that exposure growing up at home because of where my family came from. But then, you know, when Brazil became democracy, well, then you really have an opportunity to really have it in the open and then moving to the United States 25 years ago, where it's been like the vacuum of democracy, where most countries in the world would mirror themselves, you know, to become a democracy. And now we're dealing with what we're dealing with, both here in the United States, where democracy is really at stake and under threat. And in Brazil, after 21 years of being in a democratic regime, 55 percent of voters in Brazil elected a president who is going to reinstate military dictatorship. And it's devastating because you can see the parallels between what's happening in the United States with talks about changing legislation that impacts environment, indigenous people and immigrants. We're going to deal with the same shit in Brazil. I'm sorry to say it the way it is, but that's the word, because it is. And so, and if you move back and you look at what fascism regime did and what Nazi regime did in Germany, it's the same thing. So we're back in the same loop. Back in the same loop, yes. And in fact, now, of course, the Americans kind of pretend like none of this happened, but this eugenics, what Hitler did, was created in America, funded in America. And he thought, oh, well, I can get rid of people too. America even had what they called the ugly laws. And they were getting rid of people that were handicapped. They called them, it was the scientific rationale that drove killer doctors at Auschwitz to create, to copy what was then going on with America. What began as an organized campaign at the start of the 20th century was financed by Andrew Carnegie, the Rockefellers and the Hermans. And that was the eugenics movement. So anybody, it didn't matter the race, but anybody that wasn't perfect, they forced sterilization, put them in institutions and what have you, just get rid of them. Anybody that wasn't perfect. And eugenics, I think in 2018 in the United States, has a different shape. If you think about the gun crisis that we have in the United States and who it primarily impacts, so if you think about African Americans and minorities, they are the ones who are always shot at. And the poor communities are the ones they're always at risk. If you think about indigenous people, how many indigenous reservations have been completely destroyed and reorganized, not with the intent to empower, but to take the very little that they had from 40, 50 years ago, how much of the resources are not shared to continue to support and empower them. So you look at the prevalence of illness and substance abuse and poverty in Native American tribes. It's across the nation, including in Hawaii. If you think about what we don't do in terms of honoring and revival of and pride of Native American heritage language, people don't speak both languages and they're not exposed to it and learned it. It's one of the quickest ways to cure culture is to get rid of the language because you get rid of the history, the traditions that's passed orally. Most indigenous cultures, they are storytellers. It's oral traditions. You cure a lot. They don't even, you can't even, your dream in the conqueror's language. Exactly. Yeah. So you have that. So, you know, I mean, it's so hard and I want to talk about immigration. Okay. So now we are against, you know, Central American and South American immigrants, Latinos, and, you know, immigrants, they're refugees or even they come from Africa or from shithole countries. They don't want them here. So the immigrants there, we are aspiring to have the Northern European ones, the white ones that we're talking, you know, the people who already are educated in this country and to fight. Yes. And then now the largest group of immigrants are Asian. But so it's, the president is looking at these brown people from Honduras and it was the Americans that screwed up Honduras. Honduras was doing fine until... The droga and all of the transferring, you know. So there is a lot of that and reparation that needs to occur, I think, from the place of the United States with regards to centering South American countries. But it's also a moral obligation, I think, as a fast world nation to, you know, respect human rights. I mean, coming to the United States to request asylum, it's not a crime. The crime is to prevent people from, you know, doing this and to label them as being, you know, thieves and dirty people and unworthy people. These are people who, like, maybe a hundred years ago who came on the ships of the United States, you know, as Irish, Polish, Italians, were welcomed. They did not have a war and they did not have the military coming, you know, to say you cannot come here. There was not an immigration process that has so many difficulties like we are having now in 2018 in the United States and across the globe, too, because we're not the only ones. Yes, no. Yeah, and it's really, I found this article. Take a look. That is written by Scott Simon, who is for our audience that may not know who Scott Simon is, and he is one of the producers of PBS. And he talks in this article about the president and his praise of strong men. And so while I'm not going to read the article, but let me tell you, he likes, let me read this, of course, is Putin, the president of the Philippines, the president of China, and Kim Jong-un, North Korea, and it goes on and on and on of all of the crown prints from Egypt. Yes. And I call him BS. Yes. I'll never go to Egypt, so I don't care. And Saudi Arabia, yeah, all of those people, all of those dictators, and now Brazil. Yes. And we're doing the same thing in Brazil. So one of the things that Bolsonaro have said in his campaign, as he was trying to run for president, was that, well, we're going to use military to bring back order into the country. So Brazil has some issues with violence. It has a lot to do with poverty. It has a lot to do with drugs. It has a lot to do with disparities. But the way to resolve it is, let's arm people and have heavy military army to be on the streets. And one of the things he says, well, in the dictatorship times, the problem was not torture. The problem was that we didn't kill enough people. So part of his discourse in 2018 was, well, we're going to kill a lot of people, maybe 30, 40,000 people. The indigenous people of Brazil, he already have said very clearly, either they adapt to the new order or they will, it's eugenics, they'll disappear. So Amazon is about to be, you know, open for grabs. So more logging industry, natural resource and all of that. And so we're seeing very similar discourses by these leaders. But to wrap it up, I think the part of the deceit, they pick the brain of the people and they try to convince them that this is not the way it was, but it is and it's actually worse. It is. And so we're back to Dante. It was right. He is right. Yes. But I'm hopeful because for every system that falls, the people organize and that system breaks. I think with this election that we saw a change and it feels good. And that's what sustains me. I think, you know, as a woman and as an adult is that there are spaces for changes and we need to continue to fight that. And so people know your history and be educated because if you don't know your history, it keeps repeating itself. And we gotta go. We gotta go. So that's all we had. Aloha. Thank you so much and we'll see you next time.