 This is the SF Productions podcast network TV signals in Kansas seven four-year time Remember some old 2d shows of course. I was before President Turner put that a false colorization law through in the 20s He's so sure about that. There were some great shows back then Wait see back before all the video is put directly in the computer memory in the com net people used to tape shows Let me see Let me let me hook this up here. Let me see what we got With us to the 60s and 70s dwelling place of the lost generation an era whose heroes role models and very lives were molded and formed by weekly installments of favorite television programs Welcome to the place your parents didn't understand. Welcome to the vast wasteland. Welcome home Adding episode of vast wasteland. I'm your host Mark Schmidbar along with Wilbert Neil and Marty Wiley And we're here to talk about 60s and 70s television and tonight on vast wasteland. Yes It's Norman Lear and we just couldn't be more pleased and proud but well maybe more maybe a little bit But well, let's see. We've got we've got a helicopter Anyways here on vast wasteland we're gonna have It's our third big season. We're going into now and what I think I think we figured out actually 20 episodes This is the 20th episode of vast wasteland hard to believe we've gotten this far. I know well, maybe that's for the 25th episode Coming later this season. Anyways before we jump in I just want to tell you we're on Tuesdays at 6 Wednesdays at 10 and Thursdays at 3 p.m Here on ac tv cable 21 And if you want to write into us just write into box 15 15 26 Columbus, Ohio 4 3 2 1 5 and now onto Norman Lear certainly one of the giants of 70s television Pretty much pretty much kept cbs afloat there for a while Pretty much single-handedly, but What do you what do you what do you get to start off with tonight Wilbert? Oh, I know you don't Norman Lear of course was doing a lot of working the 60s in films And he was getting kind of tired of all the stuff where he was He wanted something topical and something that Yeah, yeah, well Something topical that he could actually See something in the in the newspapers and like weeks later have it on tv And he just can't do that in a movie obviously, so He had a actually another big reason. He had a string of movies that made no money. So He said maybe I'll maybe I'll go do a tv show and he was looking at a at a British show called till death do us part Um And He said this would be a great idea for an american tv show except for the fact that it was very controversial and and of course everything on then was like, you know get smart and And a girl from uncle and mr. Ed that kind of stuff and Beverly hillbilly so If not for the fact that cbs had to pretty well empty out its schedule of all of its Rural programming there in the late 60s Rural is that when good smoke died? No, not gun smoke will went on for a while But Beverly hillbillies and and uh green acres and petticoat junction and he ah They all got pretty much dropped off the schedule because a lot of people watched them But it was the people who weren't spending any money. So the uh advertiser said boom get him out of here Watching tv. We've got no money. That's right. So they uh, they accepted this strange show which of course was At the last second called all in the family and like, uh All it seems like all great, uh television shows and movies This series never just barely got on the air because there was like two pilots on abc And abc was like well, we're third place, but we're not that desperate So they didn't catch it and a young fred silverman said over at cbs. Hey, we like that So we're gonna put it on yeah, and it just farmed more and more. Yeah, it certainly did Um, but didn't didn't you know everybody on all in the family? Wasn't there didn't everyone have an archie in their family? Oh, yeah And a mike and a gloria and a eta and I think that's the appeal right the fact that everybody on the show Was someone in your family Yeah, if you didn't just live with that person, you know, you knew him anyway Oh, yeah, that wasn't a george jefferson in your family, huh? That I knew uh, I never watched that show either so, um Show was certainly a groundbreaking the fact that uh, I think not only The the thing that everybody focused on was like, oh bad language and Relevance and all this but the other thing was the fact that it was Like you were saying it was a realistic family More than anything the language being so bad for for 70s television was horrible. It was pretty bad, buddy. Damn Oh, I heard worse around the house Well, maybe not around the house, but but for television that was uh, that was especially then it was uh, just unheard of and almost almost like on the episode of star trek when they were in the You know the city of the edge of forever there. They leave and correct. Oh, let's get the hell out of here Oh And they showed bathrooms went on the family too. That's right Toilets and and showed couples actually in the same bed that together sleeping or not sleeping The same great well So, uh, it really was a groundbreaking show and of course it just spawned uh, just uh, uh, a road A plethora plethora. Thank you. Um, let's see the jefferson's mod. Yeah mod. That was the first one. Mod beget good times Um, okay, and then also well, let's see from all the family directly. We can see jefferson's jefferson And then and then archie bunkers play right? There was loria, but off of the jefferson's there was the there was a very short show called checking in Yeah checking in with marlee gibbs as Who's the housekeeper? What's her name? Well, we don't know It was nothing Well, anyway, it was kind of like It was like the marlee gibbs show basically I didn't watch and they moved on to that and that was so, uh, well, I just wanted to hit george jefferson I I think he was just so angry all the time. He's just angry. I'm like, have a heart attack because you're so angry No, I would have hit him she had him she had him out way. No come on Oh Check him out. No problem No problem but you had um had the first spinoff mod from 72 to 78 I like mod and uh, of course, uh started on uh An episode where the uh, all the bunkers are sick And so mod has to come in to take care of them because uh, he just tried to take care of him She's sick and this has been working out and so this enormous, uh, verbal battle goes on between archie and Archie the ultra conservative and mod the ultra liberal It was like those two people run 60 minutes that used to call each other names all the time that she and alexander and in what's his name Because no one ever listened to what he said anyway, right And uh, actually this is this is a really tenuous spinoff But off of uh, also off of mod there was a show called hanging in and this was another, uh, another Norman Lear show this was kind of interesting started, uh, bill macy, of course mod's husband on the show who didn't play This is the same character But in the original version, this is really strange. There was an original version where they decided that Uh mod was going to replace a congressman who had just recently died And so they're going to move the show to washington They did this for two episodes on mod and they were going to rename the show whatever they were going to rename it Um And after two episodes b arthur said no, I don't want to do this and left and that was the end of mod And so they said we really like this idea though about this congressman. So we're gonna have a show with Uh, I mean it goes on there's like four different versions of this show Uh, there's there's a version where what it eventually ends up this hanging in show is actually a, um Uh bill macy is running a university. I mean It's really strange. There's like four different versions of the show. They said one version had john amos in it And which was a pilot up on good times and that never went anywhere There was another version of the show with cleavon little And that never got on the air and that was pulled at the last second and finally this bill macy version this show And this is the amazing thing the show had virtually the same script For the pilot of all four of these pilots virtually the same cast except for the the lead character The final version of it that took like three years to get on the air was on for five weeks. It was canceled I heard interesting stories about bill macy when that show was on I heard he was in the original old calcutta I think he was I think you're right and he didn't think anything of uh Say he had to do a scene in a towel. He didn't think anything of dropping that towel and showing the audience There wasn't anything there Well A real stage actor But I like mod a lot I even had my mom make me long. You remember how mod used to wear the long vest That was just so cool. I had my mom make me long vest because those were so cool to wear to junior high There you go. There's just cool So let's see it in it was mod Okay, who played the first okay adrian barbo was probably best known as carol. Yes, but she wasn't the original carol No, you're right. You're right, but I can't remember and I see the actress in in the pilot thing in the in the pilot That was an episode of all in the family Uh, let's see if I can find this here Oh Doot-doot-do. Oh, they don't listen in here during these people Anyways, there was another actress And she pops up on tv all the time All over the place and that guy that um Conrad conrad bane played the the rather somewhat drunken doctor Yes, I mean he's always had a drink in his hand with his name arthur arthur And boy did he go down Yeah, well And ruma clan a hand was his wife right So there was a lot of people on that Oh darn it doesn't say anywhere in here Well anyways, um I'll I'll come to back, uh, find it eventually hit us in the middle of the night. We'll wake up screaming that woman's name Well, I want it. Well, who knows you guys do well okay So let's see so let's let of course mod begat good times good times JJ dino might walker He's still ugly Of course, we all ran around saying dino might then yes, it had that influence on us At least once that show went through a lot of uh changes changes because it's like They were all together and you got this real sense of family unity then Dad goes off to alaska to work the pipeline and then mom disappeared. Yeah, yeah, and then mom disappears And then summer got married. Yes to a football player that tore his leg up. Yes And jenna jackson got on the show An early appearance by jenna jackson. Yeah, it was like one of the No, no, no, she was a she was the adopted daughter of whenonah the woman across the hall. Oh, no, not another dodie I'm adopted kid. Oh, no She was like the adopted child of lona across the hall. Okay Okay It's like she took her He's he's like gets this whole concept for some reason I Go ahead Anyways, uh, by the way, we did just find marsha rod played the Original part of carol in the in the pilot for there's a name you don't hear off Russia rod went on to fame and fortune another thing. I think on like a couple episodes of bob newhart show or something I mean, I've seen her face. Yeah Commercials. Yeah, that's possible. I'm saying the Burgess Meredith narrate Speaking of Burgess Meredith and certainly not getting into the last last episode fiasco, but Uh, I can mention gloria because Burgess Meredith was on gloria. I'd forgotten all about that He was the veterinarian technically was an 80s show. So it didn't count. So that was like the last gasping breath of the whole Of the whole continuity pretty much archie's place kind of hang on there Yeah, I hate I hate to even count archie's place because by that point the show it just Lots everybody was gone except him and the little kid And it was like so nice and modeling and and it just said a lot pretty much all of it's it And yeah, it was this old guy sitting around a bargain drunk. Yeah, and then cheers came along Anyway, I'll buy you drinks in there. Anyway, well Of course, I don't watch that show either Other than the whole archie bunker universe there was a lot of a lot of other shows that got into of course, probably the I suppose the other the other big one had to have been Well sanford and son is is kind of a I consider kind of an iffy one because normally or wasn't really involved in He was kind of an executive producer But I you get the feeling that he was really never involved in it that much Based on step tone sun, which was another bridge show. Yes. Yeah, British comedy. Yeah, but bud. That was bud yorkin really So that's so there's that show and then of course there's mary hartman mary hartman I'm doing the big shows No, right ahead mh2. Yeah, I don't mind me. Yes mh2 Well the mh2 So, um That was a big favorite. We had that at where I lived. We got it out of Dayton on channel seven Like three o'clock in the afternoon for a very long time And people fussed about people complained about it and oh, this is such a horrible show All the kids are coming home from high school watching this show. Yeah, we were And then just for no apparent reason like overnight You woke up and it wasn't on and Channel 19 had picked it up was running at like 11 Yeah, that's what that's when I think Dayton ran at 11 30 for a while And then it was just like two did channel 19 At most markets showed it late at night because of everyone said oh, it's such a radical show Started off in the afternoons though because they thought it was just pretty much a soap opera And it was just right on Well in Columbus here it was on at um it was on the afternoons also for quite a while and people um it was like People some people watched it and other people, you know, they just passed it by they thought it was another soap opera Until people started talking about it. Yeah, then they went to turn it on and found out what it was about and then It's on after fritz tonight Not just before fritz I think 11 was about the latest it went on down where I lived because it was so stiff He'd get the 11 o'clock news in 11 30 Well the merry heart music would come up and louise lot Last year Too much cocaine. No, I think so There were a lot of neat people on that show But there were a lot of neat people on that show grandpa larkin Yeah, what a guy victor what was his name victor killian there killian and dodie goodman Oh, dodie goodman. You just don't see enough dodie goodman. You don't you know, she's still popping up on she'll every time you turn That's right And deborah lee scott all these raisins deborah lee scott was was kathy the sweaty sister Well loose loose loose loose. That's right. This is before you were allowed to say slut on tv Hope we dug in but First time for us Let's see. We had uh tom poston was on that wasn't it tom poston wasn't it? No, I think you're taking a tom or husband. Tom or husband was on there. Who was his name? Greg mullaby. Actually, Greg mullaby was on the show. I didn't watch that much. Oh, okay Oh now I watched mary hartman all the time the all uh rg bunker universe, which you didn't watch All right, of course mary hartman Let's see who else was on there jimmy joe jeters. Yeah jimmy joe jeter little tv evangelists They got fried in the bathtub. Yeah, because his dad just not who was who was dabney colman Yeah Joe dabney colman he he pops up every night all the time, but you just can't see enough Mary k place not only did mary hartman, but she also wrote some of mash and she was on an episode of mash She also wrote for that show and her husband was uh I just forgot his name. Graham jarvis. Yeah, Graham jarvis charlie charlie boy and um Who played jimmy joe though? I'm trying to think it was that little kid. I want to be sparky marcus But i'm not sure Little big-eyed kid. I know what you mean. He's this little kid Little Jimmy joe jeter and sparky marcus sparky marcus. Okay. Well, there we are. I didn't watch the show Well, that's just the name didn't settle with me. I don't know. I didn't watch the credits But I think probably the person that got their biggest start Off of that show was like one of my favorite comedians I actually bought his record because I saw him on the show martin maul There it is. Yes, who who was killed on the show as um, he was killed as Garth gimbal and his twin brother barth came back. Yes, because it wasn't barth and then garth It's barth and then garth Which ever barth is the one on the talk show Is it? No, that's garth. Let's check and make sure Anyway, it was so cool because he was like this abusive husband And he like beat his wife up and he got He got into he she shoved him in the closet and slammed the door and the christmas tree stabbed him in the back But I see people like martin maul so much that they wrote in It said we want to see this guy some more So they created like the evil twin was dead. So they brought in the Not not as evil twin. Not quite as evil. Well, the other one wasn't much better This one's more sarcastic. The other one was just downright mean. He wasn't just down right mean he was Twisted mean funny. Well, I mean, but he was mean though, but then he went on to do fernwood tonight, which was just Absolutely hilarious, which I still watch. It's just of course now on nicked nights I think I probably liked it a lot because fernwood was rumored to be norwood And I didn't live far from norwood And you could draw the lines real close there Of course that went on uh Switches name to america tonight when they moved to was altacoma altacoma. Yeah, the unfinished furniture capital of the world They went from fernwood to altacoma fernwood norwood And uh This is great. Oh, you could buy this if you paid for it It's on mary hartman denis was we see his face all the time Oh, wait a minute. Okay Because it was so sad if you never saw like the beginning and end of mary hartman It it started out. She was scrubbing the floor trying to get the yellow wax off of it And it ended the same way She was like scrubbing the floor tom comes in pulls a beer pops it And ended the same way except it was no longer tom. It was denis. I was his last name was denis foley Well denis foley he was sergeant denis foley started off bruce solomon bruce solomon He doesn't have a bruce solomon anymore There was another character That you see all the time now I best remember this guy because he was a comedian he used to do a character called duggy duck And he was on he was on mary hartman too. It was like one of the first places. They ever saw him Okay, but I can't remember his name except that i remember he used to do a full character called duggy duck He put a baseball hat, but he didn't do that on mary hartman. He just stayed up late and watched tv Well, let's see martin mull now back to him and I um Had been hearing a lot of his comedy stuff. They'd played on the radio And that was before the mary hartman thing before he was on there really and uh Then by golly there he was on there and he got finally got to put a face with the uh the voice And he didn't look a thing like what he sounded like He just got on to do more Movies and the history of white people in america In fact, he's probably the most prolific person from the show to go on to I know you still see louise lasser But she's Well, let's take a look at some of the other shows that didn't quite do as well in the norman lear area You just you mentioned one earlier Look what an enormous cast this show had is just stunning. I mean what is about uh 15 people there? It looks like exactly An enormous cast for a show For a show that was only on like a very few number of episodes all the way from march to april Well, let's see we had um Pablo Not much of a vehicle didn't take him It was enough to just get his face on the camera and now you can't get out He's like a comedy channel uh standard filler guy there now Then we had this very strange show that uh the norman lear didn't actually develop but he did he took uh Tried to syndicate called the backsters. Yeah, and this was a very strange show The idea was half of it was a sitcom, but it was some sort of relevant all-in-the-family kind of thing and uh What happened was the first half of the show is this sitcomy relevant deal and the second half Local hosts kind of like phil donahue types I guess like walk through the audience and get people's opinions about and they have a debate about it And they did this at its local station and it was a big hit and so norman lear bought it and tried to syndicate around the country And it flopped That's because you just can't get local people. I mean, you can't get the same feel right so Let's see. We had um, let's see. We mentioned hanging in the hot l boltamore. I loved it Now that was a great show, but great show But when when you when you look at that when you look at that though, you got to say What chance did that really have of making it in 1975 a great show though? It was a great show, but there was no chance for that making on broadcast sellers in 1975 As as our granny bean said it was the older lady that lived next door She watched the show and you would think someone Of her age was oh trash garbage. No, she loved it. She said, you know It's one show she could turn on and everyone was friends And no one was fighting and no one was trying to hurt each other It was very much like it was kind of like a bernie miller kind of thing really very similar Wacky, you know these the the story kind of comes in, you know, just like just like there, you know Right down kind of hotel right found one of my most favorite actresses on there can chat a feral Who you see on lots of things now? and The other fellow whoever played bill he was in a lot of things you seem a lot tall fellow thin names cromwell Okay, him or richard mesur also and yes mazer. I guess it's major. Yeah Al Freeman jr. Oh, I was I was sad when that show went off because I really That was my friday night Yeah, that was a good baby sitting job watch that show put the kids to better watch it was great Well, let's see. I had two more shows here I just wanted to make a real quick thing before we were about to be thrown off thrown off for this the end of the show Nancy walker show, which stuns me that norman lear had anything to do with that as as this It was it was just a bad show. We'll just leave it at that and a year at the top Which was about two aspiring rock musicians who the devil was trying to get them to Decide this contract so they'd be famous and it was the two rock musicians were greg avegan who went on to my two dads and paul schaefer No, so you can see you can certainly see that norman lear certainly went from from really uh From great stuff to really bad stuff. So it's so that anybody can do really bad stuff Too much