 Ben, mae'n ôl. Yn y dyn nhw'n llwyddo ag yw amdd gennym yn rhosol. Rwy'n clywed eich bod yw'r broedd. Rydyn nhw'n cael eu fod yn gweithio ar ni. Rydyn ni'n gweithio. Yn ychwanes, ysgrifennu'r llwydd. Rhywethe, rhywethe. Rwy'n cais i chi'n gwneud ymdeg. Rwy'n cais i chi. Rwy'n cais i chi'n cais i chi'n gwneud y pethau ar gyfer y llwyddo. y gallwn ychydig yma, ddechrau i'r bwysig a'r ddau hefyd yn cael ei gwybodaeth. Ie, mae'n ystafell yn ei gydig. Dwi'n da i ddau, ddim yn cyflawni Llywodraeth Llywodraeth, i'r L-8, i'r 1989, i'w ydych yn ymlaen, i'w ddweud yn y L-8, i'w ddweud yn y L-8, i'w ddweud yn y L-8, i'w ddweud yn y L-8, i'w ddweud yn y L-8, i'w ddweud yn y L-8. I was singing in boozes, like, to get into singing, I got into singing by listening to Oasis. Do'n gwych bach yn angen. So a tune? Yeah, that was the first tune I'd heard lad, and like bullies were still about, you know what I mean. And I said to me, I want that tune, I had this like Sony Walkman, you know, that little green one. You know what I mean, like headset with the metal band. I had one of them lad, and we went and got it lad, and then I started singing that. Then I just started singing my boozes in that, not like all the half-fellas. Just to say, get him in here, and I'd just be doing it ach a pelle. And then through the years I would just start writing songs at like 12, 13. And I ended up getting, not, I started like drifting, you know what I mean. But yeah, that's how I got into music mate, listening to Oasis. My dad got me into like all like cruning, you know, swinging that. My mum used to play LP's in that, on that King Cole. Who else? There was Lord Barbara Strazand, Paul Simon and Garfunkel. I started listening to that at an early age. Bob Dylan, The Beatles, Lenin, Bawie. Then I started listening to like Shakakan, Marvin Gaye, Stevie Wonder, you know all of that stuff. Mo Town, and then it just cracked on from there, just, you know. By the time I was 16, 17, went on X Factor. That was the first thing you went on X Factor? First time, yeah man. It was crazy like, cos I didn't know that, you know. When I went on it first time, I was just messing around man, you know what I mean. Who was the judge she's in? Sam and Carl, Louis Walsh, Sharnosh Bourne. Tani Minoglath. Tani Minoglath, Tani Minoglath, yeah. She come out with that song, put the needle on it. I was like, what, I don't know what I mean. And then, yeah, I ended up getting through. But then I was like, wow, that's a big camp. And that was even then, you know what I mean. Even then, lad. Like everyone was, my brother drinking anyway, you know. And like, I went there to try and do something with my life, lad. I was just partying. I was just taking every day to come, you know what I mean. So I ended up getting sent home. And... This was the first time? This was the first time, two times seven. And you got through it at the next stages as well? Yeah, yeah. I ended up going to a big camp. The next time would have been judges' houses. This was the next audition, you know what I mean. This was the first time you went to X Factor, the second time? The first time. So the very first time you got 17? Yeah, at 17 I got to a boot camp, known and mean. And then coming off the show then, I was going into like, you know, college. I got a diploma for acting. And then I ended up going for my second year in acting for a national diploma. But I ended up going to juvenile jail. And then when I come out of jail, I ended up going to acting again in Liverpool Community College. And what it was, I ended up getting a job halfway through the course. And this tutor of mine who said you could do a lot, known and mean. I rang me now, I was inside saying, get him back as soon as he comes out. Get him back here, you know, he's got shot on the bar. So then when I come back out, I went back to college to do acting. And I ended up getting a job, a job offer, you know, cos I had no money or nothing, known and mean. And I ended up wanting to go to do the job. And the tutor who rang me now was saying, he was flipping on me going, you're just going to throw all this away in there. And I was saying to him, well, I want to sing and do this job because I need some money. And he was going off his head saying, get your parts in this. You know, you could do your singing. You know, you've already got a diploma in acting. So when I went to start working again, I just went off the rails, lad. You know, I started drinking all the time. Obviously the party life when you're working in it. And I ended up working in Joseph Paz. Then I lost my job there. I started singing on the buses again. I ended up getting on the Liverpool Docks. I was working in there from 2010 till 2013. Then I got on the railway from 2015. Then 2017 Cwmland, I ended up getting kicked off the railway. Obviously. Partying again. Partying again. How long were you in the jail for? 12 months. I went on six months. See, you've got that likeability factor. So you have Anthony. Everybody can see potential in you. The only thing is, I don't think you believe it in yourself sometimes. And that's where the scary part is when we kind of get success. People come from addiction issues or whatever it is. If we get success, we don't feel as if we deserve it. So we're just going to hide from it. We'll get a bottle of vodka. We'll get some fucking cocaine. We're just sitting and hiding for the world. But you've got so much potential. Everything you've done, it's like, try to people please on it. Try to make everybody else feel good. Happy. Do you know what I mean? And it's not at people or bad, but you can get to that level where you'll sink with them if you stay there because you've got so much to offer. The X Factor, the first time round. And then you've got three all that. How bad for the ages of 17 to the stages you go on to X Factor? The second time. How was your party then? I went way slatter cos... Like the tip of the iceberg, you know, when I went on X Factor when I was 17. And then obviously I went away in October. And then I was thinking to myself, you know, I'm in here for something I haven't even done. Felt you in for? It was a fry and a salt. I was there, you know, but I didn't, you know, we're all in since. Association, you're there. Obviously, yeah. And you know, I got, like someone said I was there, you know, and then when it got to court, it was like, yeah, but he was the one who done all this, done all that. And I said, no, I won't. You know, the judge thought I was lying, so he just slammed me. So it was what it was. I came back out, I went back to college to do acting. How was your family then when you got the jail? What was their reaction? Oh, they were like diswain in the plan for you, son. You know what I mean? Devastated. Yeah, yeah. Like you're trying to be a singer in that, you know? Yeah, actor. But I got told by my family, you know where you're going to end up, lad? You know what I mean? If you carry on going out on the streets in that. But what happens is we think we know everything. Yeah, when you're young. Yeah, we think we know everything. No one knows anything. But yeah, everything you get told. Even everything I was told. Yeah, yeah. It fucking all planned out. Everybody said the exact same things that were going to happen and it happened. But I knew differently. So for yourself, did you come out and it just went worse for you? More drinking, more drugs? Yeah, when I come back out, I was, I just got straight back into it. Well, I see me mates who were from Rand, Mayans, you know, Rand Bootle. Like, I'd come out and I'd just got straight, you know, it was like, oh, what's happening? You know, straight back out. I started going to college again to a music college. And I was just hanging around with my mates again, you know, having a joint, having an ale, having one of them. And then it was kind of mad because there was a, like when I was partying in the boozes and stuff when I'd got out and I was going to college, that was, that was, you know, all my age group were doing that anyway, you know what I mean? So it felt normal? It felt normal, lad, yeah. And it was like, it was so mainstream as well cos people who I was going to college with, they were all different ages, they were doing it and it was bang at it, lad, honestly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They took everyone's white and white lab but it's not, you know what I mean? And it seems normal, but... Yeah. Even when I was doing it, I just had something in me that I knew that was going to destined to be something, yeah, yeah, I just knew, no, I just knew like something that I don't want to be like this, I don't want to keep doing this. So if I meet people whoever I surround myself with, I put a different mask on for each of the individuals because I know how they want me to be. So I become a totally different person but I just always knew sitting at parties for two and three days, full of Charlie, full of booze. I just knew there's something else that I want to do but I just was too scared to make a transition, it's too scary to come away from people. It's too scary to make decisions because you think it's wrong but yeah, deep inside, you know, it's fucked up ain't normal but it feels normal because everybody else does it. Do you know what I mean? Because did you ever think to yourself, right, early 20s is a difficult time but did you ever think, right, I'm going to try and get my shit together now? Or did you not have anything to really strive for? Well, you know, by the time I was 20, I mean, I'd be singing and I'd be writing songs and stuff and I'd be doing like, having jams with different bands and I'd be going to work. I was working on the docks then, the Liverpool docks and it was just normal for me to work and then go out and get bladded and beat up on a weekend. That was just a normal routine but in the back of my head I was thinking, I've still got time to do something. I've still got time to do something, you know what I mean? And the go-through part where I'd stay off it for three weeks and try and get off it on my own and then when I'd be feeling good and I'd have money, I'd just go right back and just, you know what I mean? Rip the whole ceiling down. Fuck it all on it. You know, stay off it for like five days off work and that. Me ma, throw me out and that, you know? Because it's the same at effects as well. Do you know what I mean? We blame them. Liverpool effects like that. Yeah, we blame them. You're fucking doing my head down so if they throw you out the house that wasn't as good as to go. Yeah, missing for three days, but only person you're really hurting is yourself. So you went to X Factor for the second time 2017. You go through to the next stages again. Yep, yep. I was promised the live shows. I went and promised, but it was looking that way from the critics and that, you know, one of the odds. Soon as you do your first audition, it's like bang, he's got a few threads, bang, he's got all she's got, you know what I mean? It's the people's favourite lad in it, straight away, you know what I mean? In an audition who's got potential, who's one of the others. See, when you've got the like ability factor, like I said earlier, people are drawn to you because you're honest, there's no yard where you see what you get. There's no bullshit, but we've still got those demons. So when you had that chance, that opportunity to break through, to really change your life, to really strive towards your dreams, how did it become about that you fucked that up? Oh, it was crazy lad. It was, because I was going through a mad diet in my den lads, you know what I mean? I had lost my job, you know, I'd split up with, you know, my girl, I was out partying all the time and just being jumped. Someone said, why don't you go back on that factor? And I was like that. I've just, you know, I'm going through the worst times ever. You had a black eye? Yeah, yeah, I had a shanner in it. Got laid out lads, I was snoring before you hit the floor. And I was like, oh, that happens, you know what I mean? And then some, so a friend said, why don't you go back on that lads? You know what I mean? It could be a sick, you know, it could be a brilliant chance, you know what I mean? And I thought I'm in the worst place in my life, you know what I mean? And you know, and he said, no, that was the best time in your life to go on it, you know what I mean? Yeah. So I ended up going on it and I'd just been on a bender for about four days. You know what I mean? I'd been out and I rolled into that audition, sang issues with a black eye and he just went, yeah, and then I was like, yeah, and I was thinking to myself, is this a fachon man? Is this a fachon man? I was thinking, this man had to meet up with you. I was like, and then Sam had said, he stood up and went, come here, it was good that you come back in that. I like you, I like you, you know what I mean? It's great that you've come back. I hadn't seen Sharon in about 10 years, because I was like, I was 27 now, I was like 17 the last time. I was like, what is this? But leading up to that audition, I'd always had dreams in that. You know, I was like, you're gonna hit it up back on that, you know? You know what I mean? And it was always in the back of my head to try and do something I had the ordinary. I'm gonna have to do something like that to try and be someone, you know what I mean? That's what I'm talking about. Even though you were going through all your madness, your drink, your drugs, your fighting, getting sacked from the job, you still had that belief that you were still going to do something. It's not, we've got time, we've got time, so I'll do it for another six months, drink, drugs or another year, before you know it, two year passes, five year passes, then we're late 20s and we're 30s. But you got that chance again. Everybody loved you. Do you know what I mean? Everybody loved you. And then, what was the, so what's the transition then? Some downward. About the x-factor thing. So what happened? All the way when it got kicked off that time. The other second, when you did it, so when you get through it in the next stages, your life is a bit of a turmoil. Could you not handle the success, the kind of fame that came with it? Because mentally you weren't strong enough. Well, is this for 2017, when it came on a second? Well, yeah, I was in a bit of a mess lad, in a, because it all came at me lad, in a way, you know what I mean? It just came at me in a wave lad, just a flash, and I got through that stage, I do audition where the sang is used, and then lad, I was thinking, I can just smash this now. And I just started drinking lad, like daily, you know what I mean? And I was in the busus every day, and then I went down to boot camp, and I stayed off the air for a week, and then once I got down to boot camp, on the way down, on the train, I was drinking and everything. Nervs? Yeah, it was nervous, I was shaky. I don't let it be, the wall of music, I don't let it be. I was in the shambles for that, knowing what I mean. Then I done running, I got through that stage, then I got through the 60 year challenge, and then I come back home, and like I bought a suit in it, for like the 60 year challenge, I don't know why lad, I don't know what's going through me yet. I was speaking to people in the car, and they were like, why don't you wear a suit in that stand out in that? And then I took that back, and then on the train home, I was getting blitched, you know what I mean? I had already ordered something, I was chilling with a few of my mates, saying lad, I've just smashed the 60 year, I'm going to the judges' houses mate, I'm going, you know what I mean? Going to, you know, I could smash it here, you know what I mean? I could go through to the finals, and then when we were meant to go down to the judges' houses, I went down there didn't I, bladded, I've been on a bender, and he just said, flip pan eich, you were the shambles in boot camp and that, we want to help you, you know what I mean? So I went to see a doctor, and the doctor wouldn't put me through, cos she thought I wasn't stable enough, you know what I mean? So... Did you get drug tested or anything? No, I went no drug test now lad, it was just, cos I went into the doctor, bladded, and I was like, she wanted... She wanted to... And I was looking at her photo, so I was like, off you go kid, you know what I mean? Like that, and like, it was crazy, she was laughing at me, and then she was saying, you're a good kid in that, but you're just a bit crazy at the moment, you know what I mean? Not crazy, you're just partying on that. So what was going through your mind then, when you know, there's a good chance you could have run the live shows, that could have changed your life? Well she said to me, you could be in the live shows, you know what I mean? But if we put you through the live shows, off to the judges' houses, and you have a drink beforehand, you know what I mean? The timing or anything, trying to pull your side, did any of the judges try and pull your side, or was this before you went to the live shows? This is before I went, you know what I mean? How long is it for... The first edition to the sixth chair challenge, how long was the wait? About a three month. By that time, your stuff is... I was drinking every day, lad, up towards the boot camp, I was drinking most days in boot camp, lad, you know what I mean? Like most nights, we were getting to know Canyway there, everyone was just, you know what I mean? Not saying everyone was partying on all that, cos everyone was sad, you know what I mean? It's sweet, but I'd do an audition, I'd get through, and then I'd just be in the bar on my own lad, drinking Guinness, thinking, what the... What am I doing? I don't know what I mean, I should be fresh, I should be in the gym. Did you know what you were doing? What was wrong? Yeah, but I couldn't stop, lad, you know what I mean? And I never had no... Self-control? Self-control, but I weren't doing the meetings, lad, but the first time I went through when I was in 2019, when I just lost my job, you know what I mean? Cos mi'n madd on the meetings I had, you know what I mean? And mi'n... a woman yw yn awr, Nora, ac o, you know, she took me to a meeting on Tuesday, and this was when I was 19, lad, but I didn't want to know, lad, you know what I mean? Em, because I was young, lad, and I just didn't want to know. At 19, so you had those... I'd been to a few meetings, you know what I mean? Yeah, you kind of had that personality, people could see at that young age that you had a problem with alcohol. Yeah, yeah. And then, by the time, like when I was 27, and I thought I could pull them all over everyone's eyes, you know what I mean? 2017, they won't get on to I've got a problem, even though I knew deep down, and I was just drinking every day, lad, and I knew I had to come back to recovery, you know what I mean? So when you get kicked off the show the second time? Yeah. What was your mindset like then? Em, well, I was in the papers in that way, and I obviously, like had knees being on drugs, to join a big camp and all that, shooting and that, well, on a family show, and I was like, it's bullshit, man, you know what I mean? I was just a ratter, and I, you know, I'd say right now if I was on drugs, no, because I wouldn't have got it, yeah, you know what I mean? He would have blatantly said, no, you mad, you know what I mean? So it was just booze? Yeah, just booze overnight, you know what I mean? But when I come back up to Liverpool, mate, I was bang at it, you know what I mean? I was in booze, you know, and it was just an everyday thing, lad. How was people's reaction to you because of the X-Factor, because you were so high profile at the time, was people what a PC? It was just two times, 17. To have told the second time. Yeah, people weren't that bad, like, oh, you fucked it up, lad, look at you, some people were like, oh, you're niddy, you're a napo, some people were like, they're still out, lad, you know what I mean? Did you believe it at that time? Yeah, I don't know why, bro, cos the people were saying, you know what I mean? We want your back on it, you know what I mean? Even people from the show were saying, you can come back on that, cos they've even said, we're not going to ban them from coming back on, you know, the producers wish them the best of luck, they're all dead fun to them, so don't ask me what's happened, no one will mean. But can you see that now, that people like you, people are rooting for you? Even myself, I'm rooting for you because you have got that likeability factor, you've got that, you've just got that something where, when you speak to people, listen to people that want to see you fuck up, do you know what I mean? You've got so much potential to be great, to do massive things, man, do you know what I mean? But thankfully this time round, you're in a good place, which we'll touch on in a bit. So the second time you get kicked out, yeah, yeah, head up your ass, on the drink, doing all the mad shit, to hide all the pain, third time comes round, which is unbelievable that you actually got a third chance, if I'm honest. So you went on it for the third time. What was the mindset like then? It was like, hey, I'm sorry lad. That's all right, were you in a better place, or were you thinking or were you still 2017 mentality? Yeah, well lad, obviously Louie wanted to help me, Louie Tommel. Tommel's in film, One Direction, he took a big shine to you. He did, as soon as I'd come out with the audition, issues, he was rooting for me, and so with the country, so then, as soon as he knew I'd been kicked off, and the people were like, what are you gonna do now then? He gave me the chance to go to rehab, you know, he said I'll pay for you, I'll help you, I want to help you. So obviously I said yeah. So Louie Tommel isn't paid for your rehab? Yeah, yeah. That's unbelievable. And second he got in touch with me, I thought yeah, obviously I'm gonna go for it again in it, so I went to rehab, and I come out, and I still weren't the same person, I still didn't want it lad, I still weren't strong, you know, I was still messing about, knowing what I mean. When you came out of rehab, how long were you in rehab? Three months. The first time I went was in, over October. Were you cleaning that the full three months? The three, yeah, the full three months when I was in the rehab, yeah. And then I'd come out, and the auditions were down in London, the third time, you know what I mean? And I smashed the first audition on the third time, but I got a good friendship going on, you know what I mean, with Louie. Saying I want this, I want to do well in that, you know what I mean? So I went for it again lad, and I still weren't strong enough lad, I don't know what it was. You're not believing yourself? I don't know, like I still wanted to have a baby lad, you know what I mean, and still wanted to use, and then going through the show, obviously I was doing my eye meetings in that, proper in recovery, having a gory, and I just knew I had to stay in recovery lad, but I was still fucking up, there you know what I mean, still relapsing. And this was when you were going through the third stages again? Yeah, yeah. So you get through it, you get put through it at the next stages? Yeah. Were you still drinking then? Yeah, yeah. Through the live shows as well? No, no, no, no, not through the live shows. So you obviously changed then to obviously go right, this is a proper chance. How was Robbie Williams in that? Good, Robbie Williams was a big part while I was on that show, cos he's done the drink, the drugs himself. And he understood, you know what I mean, and he was just real, you know what I mean, he was just real with me, and after he'd started showing that, I'd be smashing it, and he'd come up and say, just keep doing it, you know what I mean, he won't do it at the time and that. Was that giving you inspiration? Yeah, I was like, oh my, you know, I've got one of the legends here back on me, you know, I had Louie Tommel back on me, you know what I mean, and it was real fun while I was on the live shows, but it was like trying to keep everyone happy then, cos I'd be on the live telly, and my phone would be ringing, people would see me on live TV, but still phoneing me. I said, I'm going to go on the live TV, what's up, lad? I'll see you soon. You know what I mean, people would be like, where's the tickets lad, I want the, you know what I mean? And I'd be like, I've got to get the tickets, I've got to save them three spaces for this, you know, I've got to do this for that. Yeah, yeah. And I was just, I was just a shambos lad, you know what I mean? Cos I was only early in recovery. I'm not saying it was the wrong time for me to do something like that, but I was only early, so I was fragile, you know what I mean? If you want to start talking about being solid in recovery and being, you know, going for something that big in the early stages of recovery, you know what I mean? Because people with a good frame of mind, and strong mentality getting thrown into that fame would can break anybody. Never mind if you're still fragile and still working on you and still try to figure out what life is about, try to figure out your path, your journey, what you're good at and try to believe in yourself, getting that self-belief, that self-worth, that you are good enough. I'm telling you now, you are good enough. You're going to be something, you're going to be massive things. You got to the final. Yeah. Which was, what do you think you were going to win it? Did you think you were going to win it? Well, they said to me, what do you want in that, to sing with? You know what I mean? I said, just give me someone wrong, someone upcoming. You know what I mean? And I see in the stats, obviously, I was singing with the Kazatiefs I was made up, because growing up, I listened to them, you know. But I kept on getting the song going on in that, on the vessels, and I was like freezing, you know what I mean? I was like, oh! But then I was singing with Tom Walker as well, you know what I mean? Yeah. So I was singing with Rick and the whole band from Kazatiefs, you know what I mean? And I sang with Tom Walker, who's absolutely killing it now, you know what I mean? And the Kazatiefs are killing it. Too big, you know what I mean? Inspirations, who I'm singing with. Did I think I was going to win it? I don't know, man. Nah, I was thinking, because obviously they were working with people who'd won on the show, you know what I mean? Yeah. And like, I'm not saying it's not bad or not. And they got big hype, you know what I mean? The week coming up, like big promotion on that, you know what I mean? Do you think that on the show they can set up for who wins? Kind of publicise it a wee bit, more people get better publicity? Yeah, I think it is lad, yeah, it is what it is with that. When you look at it, you know what I mean? When you're on the outside, you know what I mean? But I was listening, I was grateful, man, because any one of us could have won that night, you know what I mean? It's an entertainment show. That's what I mean? It's produced for entertainment, but they obviously want to make their money. They want to get a return as well. It's a great show because you've got to think about that. They're pulling people from the streets and people in the Mawians are watching it. They're not spending any money really. That's what I mean? And it's like, be careful what you wish for, because you know, if you want to do something and you want to go for it, you know, it's on you, if you audition for that show and you want to do your best, it's on you, you know what I mean? And if it does some work out, you know what I mean? You've just got to keep going lad, innit? The thousands of people that go on that show, there must be over, I don't know, hundreds of thousands of people applied. Yeah, yeah, that's what I mean. The game's after still flying. Exactly. It's not a meanie. It's compact. It's not a meanie. You know, you've got, you've still got people like, you know. Leona Lewis, is she still kicking about? Yeah, she's still smashing it, obviously. You know, you've got one direction who was smashing it. Ollie Mears, he's killing it. Yeah. You know what I mean? I like Ollie Mears, he's a good guy. I've got Shalewyd, he was killing it over in the US, you know what I mean? So there's always opportunities. He's massive, he's doing everything. You know, but I don't want to, I want to be someone who's writing songs, who's raw, you know what I mean? Who wants to do bands, you know, bands type of stuff in that, you know what I mean? I don't want to be singing pop in that. All right, if you're in mainstream music, you pop. You know what I mean? It doesn't matter if you're like folk, you know, indie or whatever, because if you're in the charts or whatever, you're popular aren't you? So you pop anyway. But like bringing back to where like, like it's a good show in that, the extra factor, help me lads, you know what I mean? You stop by me, they even offered me treatment when I got kicked off the tour, you know what I mean? On the tour, they said you want to go back to the thing that you want to do. You can't knock people who's trying to help you. The team was brilliant, they put a good team next to me. Did you make money from the shows then and the live shows going through? Did you get paid or anything, no? No, no. But I could go to deal lads, you know what I mean? If I would have been like producers and stuff in that chain, it's looking promising and I just keep doing what you're doing. You know, they're looking at, you're looking on shining, you know what I mean? Keeping your spirits high. That's it lads. So you went for the UK tour after that, kicked out again. Obviously lads, I mean. Kicked out again. So the UK tour, how much were you getting for that? Were you getting paid for that to do a UK tour? Yeah, we got like 40, I don't know if I meant to say this. No, don't say it, interesting case you're getting trouble. But do you get paid for that? Yeah, yeah, we got paid for that. You get kicked off that? How did that one come about? Well, one of me meets four of me. I've got a show here, it's one of me get kicked off. I said, yes, I'll make the papers. This could be a good sound job. Oh, yes, lads. Oh, that one came about lads. That was heavy because the show, the tour was in the space of three weeks. And after the live shows, I went to rehab again lads and no one knew me because things weren't going so well. No one knew me and I was slipping here and there. And you built it? Yeah. So they actually paid for me to go away again lads to... They'll be fucking bankrupt to me if you go back on that show. But it just shows you the fate that they had in me and I've got to thank them for that lads. Definitely. Saved your life basically. Exactly, lads. And my family were all good to me. The people who have got around me were all good friends. And Yes, so I started the tour and I came back off off tour and I came back off to rehab again. I started the tour. But I was still mischievous lads, you know. I was thinking. I didn't feel worthy of the help lads, you know what I mean? I thought... You can't force the help upon people you need to want to do it for yourself. You've got to want to do it lads and that's what I've done now. I've come back to the pool. I was doing two meetings a day lads. You know what I mean? So 90 and 90. But I was going on to two, three meetings a day with a good sponsor. You know, I'm still now. I'm not much now. You know what I mean? I do shows and I go straight home. You know what I mean? You're doing well, but when you... Like I say again, through that third time, what were you feeling then? Oh yeah, after the tour. Sorry lads, yeah. I keep on going off. Sorry, I'm on that. That's not a good one. With the tour lads. And obviously we were doing shows and lads I won six times. You know what I mean? And I was coming second at Birmingham. I came second at Wembley. I won at Bournemouth. I won at Nottingham. I won at Leeds Arena. I won at Cardiff. You know what I mean? And you're singing in front of 10, 15,000 people? Yeah, 25,000 people live lads winning. You know what I mean? Or coming second. Were you enjoying that experience then? Yeah, really. You know what I mean? This is what I want to do. You know what I mean? I'd be standing and jump off the stage into the crowd. You know what I mean? Cos I was wanting to be like the next Brit. You know what I mean? The next thing to come out, even though I come third. Even though anyone could have won that. That doesn't mean shit. You know what I mean? That doesn't mean shit. Fodd finish and fodd. People have finished second and fodd have been bigger than the ones who have won it. Yeah, yeah. Do you know what I mean? So how did they kick off then? Well lads, flipping it. Lads, I'd won. You know what I mean? And obviously I was chilling with another geezer of the tour. You know what I mean? Obviously people could get. You know what I mean? If you want something, you can get it. And if it can be good. You know what I mean? Obviously. And then. Yes, so I was drinking and I had won. And I was just looking in the mirror thinking I'm smashing shows here. I'm winning. And I'm just going for it lads. You know what I mean? I won after the other. Listening to a weisys. You know what I mean? Think I'm on tour. You know what I mean? I'm chilling with backing dancers and that. I'm like, you know what I mean? Just like in the hotel room on Instagram. Just you know what I mean? Do you want laughs? Oh, you know what I mean? And like. I don't. I've got to get myself straight. I've got to get me head down at three o'clock in the morning because I'm on it. You know what I mean? I'm on one. I'm on the flapsy. I'm. You know what I mean? I'm on the power. I'm flying. I've got to get me head down. If these catch me and it's over, you know what I mean? It's fucking hell to say on the clock. Comes round the next morning lad and I'm still here. Bandanna round me head. Music blast me. You know what I mean? Back and dancers at the moon. We's all on the snap. Someone comes through me door. You know what I mean? Yeah, we's all on the snap. Everybody. Well, yeah, yeah. And then, obviously, I don't know what I mean to our manager. You alright? I said, I'm alright. Yeah, you alright? And he went, yeah, we're alright. You know what I mean? I was all over the land. I was going, you know what I mean? And then, obviously, they were like, people come up and we had a meeting and I had to get lunch, lad, cos you know, it's a show in it. And it'd be alright if I was on guns and roses to all the people like that. Well, I don't know. If it would be alright. You know, I'm not saying no one does anything on that. Well, you know. Yeah, I know what you mean. It's not the right place to be doing that. Do you know what I mean? It's still, you're still working under them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you found out for being on it again, third time out in your ass. How are you feeling then? I was thinking, right, right, sweet. If I'm still getting paid, I'm going to just go for it. No, I'm just going to go home and just go for it. I'm just, you know, it's over. I've done what I can. I've had exposure, you know. I'll get work here and do stuff in buses and that. Forget about it. You know, I've let my city down. I've let myself down. You know, I've let my family down. My daughter down. I might as well just go for it. And then I found too close with the man. Good meets Matty and the girl on it. Ew, I was working with her while I was on the show. You know what I mean? And I'd said I'd been kicked off the tour, you know. I want to come home. But that'd be right. Coming to yours, you know what I mean? And I remember getting dropped off by a lovely lady who looked after me while I was on the show, Jane and I. I was calling her Auntie Jane because she was always with me, helping me, staying with me and I was keeping positive. You know what I mean? I had a good routine, you know what I mean? And I was winning shows, but I was staying devious in my addictive brain lad. I was, you know what I mean? I was devious, yeah. Like when I got left to my own possessions and my own thing lad, I wanted to, you know what I mean? I have a binge lad, you know what I mean? So when I'd come home, I had two choices. I already had a bit of money in my bank at all. You know what? Fuck this. Let's do it. Let's go on a mad one. Let's just, you know, I'll just mask into everyone and say, I've got this coming up and you know what I mean? Oh, I can go to my friends, you know what I mean? I could start again. Now, I'm going, I'd been dropped off. I was at Lam State, I was with my bags. We go meet Anna and Matty. You know what I mean? Pick me up in that. And I was in the back of taxi and I was thinking lad, I was saying to Matty, I want a bottle of brandy, I'm having one more and then I'm going to start again tomorrow. I want a bottle of brandy and another one. You know what I mean? And he went, just chill with us lad. You know what I mean? We're watching movie and we'll get here in your meetings tomorrow. And I was itching lad that night, you know what I mean? And the fucking hell we ended up watching Halloween, Michael Myers, the fucking new one. You'd have been trapped, you fucking mask. You'd have been trapped in bows, man. You'd have been shying yourself. I'm like, it was crazy because it was just, it was mad I was thinking and I was listening to the tunes what I was listening to on the tour when I was home in the first week and the shows were going by and people were getting on it and he was also being on this tour why, what I mean? And then obviously I threw a post up in what I mean. Sorry, I won't be doing the tour. I've got something's happened with myself, me else, you know what I mean? When I promise you I'll come back and obviously the shout start coming out then, because people aren't stupid lad. On the lemaw again lad. You know what I mean? And I'm like, I'm like, oh no, man. They've won, man, the haters have won. That's the scary thing mate because when you're successful, you're doing well, people are waiting at the sideline waiting for you to fuck up. People were saying, I told you what he was like, I knew it. And that kind of situation where you just kind of want to hide it all. Shut the curtains, ounce of gear, bottles of vodka, bottles of brandy, 10 hookers, fuck it all. Do you know what I mean? It's easy for that to do that. But the good thing is, you realised that you'd fucked up again. You went and got help and today you're nine month clean which I'm going to shake your hand for which I'm proud of you. Really proud of you. You've got a twinkle back in your eye. You've got a new single coming out, man. You know what I mean? Fuck it, get a gear it. Nine months long enough. So you're fucking doing great. Thank you very much. I'm back to you. So now you're clean. Mentally you're in a good place. You're laughing, you're smiling, you're writing music, you're doing what you love. Yeah, man. How's things now? Can I just go back to like, what was saying like? Let's go. There was a big, a good friend of mine, Lea's name was, and he said, I think you need to go back to your boot slot. And just concentrate. When I got kicked off, you know what I mean? I had this talk when I was getting kicked off. Look, we're not in bad terms or not, because they were still lovely to me. You know, I give them an og in that, you know what I mean? The producers in that. And they said, you know what I mean? They said, we think you just need to go back to your roots and just start your recovery, you know what I mean? And just do it a day at a time. If you're not going to take treatment, just go home and just go to your meetings a day at a time. So I had to come home and then I started just doing 90 and 90, you know what I mean? And I'd seen different people in the streets and they'd be like, what happened that? You know what I mean? I'd be like, ah, you know how it is, lad? Any of us are going to do it. I don't know about you mate, but you know what I mean? I was thrown wheelies mate, you know what I mean? Backstage. So when I'd come home, I'd realised that, you know, and I just started writing and I just started doing my meetings and like, obviously you get digs here and there and that comes, lad. And you've got to accept it, lad. You want to be someone and you want to do it. And it gets given to you. And if you fuck up it's on you. And it was, I did. I fucked up lad and it was on me. You know what I mean? Back to the drawing board, back on Liverpool streets. But this time I've tried to be the real me lad and just stay sober a day at a time. And that's all I can do. People want to call me a fuck up or my life's so bad. You know? I'm trying that. That's all you can do. I'm not saying please let me fuck, you know? Not like that, it is what it is, kid. You know? I'm just writing, staying hungry. And you know. But that's all you can do. That's all I can do, lad. You don't know anybody anything. Don't prove anybody anything but yourself. It's only you. Stay throughout you, stay in the path and big things will happen. Big things will happen. They're going to happen for you. Like I say, to get free chances and keep doing it and let them back. One direction, Llywydd, Thomas, I'm paying you into rehab. Bobby Williams giving you guidance. There's massive names. People will be happy with that. But you're still hungry. You've got a new single coming out. When's that December next month? Yeah, it's around about next month. It's coming out. Yeah, well this is November. So we'll drop this podcast in December anyway round about that time. Cool, man. It's a happy day. Plans for the future then that we've got a new answer in the Russell in the past. Fuck that. It's done. What have we got for you now for the present moment in the future? The present, I'm just working with a band and working with some good lads who have known most of my life. I've got a single coming out called Skars. I worked on it with a lad from down London and then I've come back. I'm releasing that. I've got another two singles that will be coming out as well because we all need somebody a mother. And I'm writing with the corner men a good band Thomas Donoghue. I'm writing with Thomas Walsh who have been writing songs with and doing videos out with. And I'm just staying with the lads and bringing an album out probably next year, probably May, somewhere like that. We're just recording an album now so I'm going to be doing, going to be bringing three singles out in the next three to four months leading up to the album don't know what I mean. And then just seeing our goals lads. Just trying to get to the top. Sound quite personal. Those titles, Skars. Yeah, we all need somebody a mother. Is that recovery songs? Yeah man, well. Fherry piano? Yeah, well I've wrote them early in recovery lads know what I mean. I mean that month's early days know what I mean. Two years still early days. So what's Skars about? Skars is about temptation you know what I mean and after fucking up still keeping your head high you know what I mean. Being up all night, you know. Like the lyric goes now I'm down and out I'll be up all night. Going for a walk on these cold streets I try to get away from darkness in my mind because the demons that I have they play for keeps. No one can tell you who you are. No one can know what you seem behind the broken barriers of your heart you got these Skars Skars know what I mean. Yes bro, yes. I'm just like you know what I mean. But it's about yeah that's what the that's what the lyrics are about lads just you know fucking up and trying to come to turnsway. How can I just carry on like this? You know what I mean? Yeah but see the beauty of life brother see all the shit that you've done in the past this is what's going to shoot you into the fucking stratosphere because all that shit is going to learn you and drive you and give you lyrics give you songs that's what's going to make you. You could have had these songs five years ago everybody's got a story the great thing about you is you don't hide from it we all fuck up and that's like I've got a story but what about you? Are you wired and wired right? I had a story coming out each week on that x-factor lads everyone else was just like you have a man on me you know what I mean? Snow wings everywhere yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah Welcome to Disney you know what I mean? Yeah yeah yeah Honestly she's like oh lads Are you still in contact with Louie? Yeah man I speak to Louie you know and he's been honestly he's been like a rock in my recovery he's had me back you know I still speak to the producers and some of the producers and they're still sad with me and it's now it's it's not bad bad things or not on lads you know I was fucking with real life things you know and people couldn't understand it because it's the real world that we live in here lads you know what I mean? It's not some fake social media thing like we act on social media things were happening in real life and it was what it was you know what I mean? Came on top but again everything's a learning curve listen 100% of people over here took drugs and though someone who's taken drugs it's just a thing that's there we're not going to shy away from who we are we can be in sad places, dark places but we can all get out of it and that goes for anybody watching or listening your prime example now you're 90 days clean you get a man put out you get your new single you'll miss next month nine months with ASSE that's three times night so fucking you're doing you're flying so it's good to see you back how's you feeling for the future? I'm feeling good I'm feeling positive and I'm going to go place man you know I might have egg Maethwch, nid ydym yn gallu gwybod, yna yn mynd. Mae'n taffen, mae hefyd. Mae'n gweithio'r gwahanol. Mae'n mynd i hopi gyda gwahanol yn cael cael ei wath. Mae'n gwybod... Mae'n gwybod. Mae'n gwybod. Mae'n gweithio'r wahanol sy'n gwybod. Mae'n gwybod. Mae'n gwahanol i yna hwn. Mae hynny'n gweithio yna'r diwyllun penydd. Mae'n gweithio'r diwyllun. Mae'n gweithio a'n gweithio. Mae'n gweithio yng Nghymdd. Dwi gyd, mi ddim yn gweithio bod arbennig am y bwysig. Dw i ddiddorol yn y byebifau gwahanol iawn. Dwi ddim yn ei gwneud. Ond mae'n ddim eisiau yn gwneud. Rym ni wedi mynd allan yn gyran ac rwy'n geisio. Mi rydw i'n mynd i'r gerdd. Fe ddim yn y bach o bobl gwneud tro i ddiddorol. Rydw i'n gweithio bod mi'n ddim yn gweithio. Dwi ddim yn gweithio. People still had me on the shows, people had me still working, at the gaffs, I was still working, you know what I mean? But I liked to party, you know what I mean? I could graft hard, but I liked to party. Unfortunately, it got the better of me, and I started doing it every day, you know what I mean? But not now, not now. Yeah, not now, I'm doing things, I'm going to meetings, I'm trying to help other people who are in my shoes, you know what I mean? I'm not taking a stand or not, I'm like with a flag or not, and saying, look at me, because if I can do it, they can do it. People who are from the streets or people who are from my shoes, I mean I come from a good family, you know, a good loving family, a good family who've got morals, you know? I've got good people by me, I've got Francis Conlon there, who's helped me through the years. Shout out to Francis. Shout out to Franny Conlon, you know, shout out to Matty and Anna. Yeah, they sound like a couple of diamonds. Yeah, honestly, they have been real diamonds, shout out to my family, my mum, Jane and my dad, Tony, my daughter Nola, you know, my baby's mum Emma. You know, she put up with a lot of shit and she's a star, she's been a great mum, you know what I mean? And you know, I've let them down and I'm just trying to be the best I can today. I've got some good mates there, you know what I mean? I've got two women, Linda and Maria Baker, who've helped me over the years with singing, you know what I mean? They were lost touch with, you know what I mean? And I really didn't mean to because I was just fucked, you know, on the drink. I was just drinking, just trying to get to the sex factor, you know what I mean? And then, like when I was on the live shows, I had the wrong peat, I was... I'm not saying no one's a bad person or not, but I just went a whole thing about the wrong, you know what I mean? I'm not saying, you know, I just had the wrong... It was just mad away it all came about, you know what I mean? I've got to get these tickets, them, tickets, them, tickets. And none of them who I ever got tickets were bad people, man, cos they're from my ends and, you know, everyone's got... Everyone's from somewhere, lad, you know what I mean? It's just that way, it's... You want that people to enjoy that experience with you as well, you know what I mean? You don't know how long it was going to last, but you try to help everybody out, but sometimes you've got to look after you. Sometimes you've got to be ruthless and go fuck everybody else because look where it's got you, you know what I mean? Now it's to focus on you, now this is your chance to really be something that you believe you can be, and everybody else watches you, believes it also. So what's your daily routine like now, when you wake up in the morning, as you said, you go running and stuff? Yeah, I do. Sometimes I go to Coster, have a coffee, write songs and that. I'm speaking to people who I'm close to, I try and just keep it positive. I see my daughter, I'm in the studio, I'm always re-acing, and I've got my meetings overnight, you know, four or five a week. Cos my head goes, lad, you know, if I haven't got the meetings, my head just goes. Is your medicine? Yeah, spiritual injection, lad. No jam roll, lad, no parole, is there? You don't get a break. It's fucking, you never know when you're coming back, lad. It's a jungle out there. And if I'm doing a show, lad, someone will come with me, you know what I mean? Like I've got my mate Tom, he's my guitarist, he's a brilliant guitarist. Tom's on a Hew-what-that-n-son from the corner, man, he's sick, he's a producer. And, you know, I'll bring someone out of fellowship to come with me, you know? And then I'll get my wages and then get out of there, lad, you know what I mean? And try and get something on the way back, you know, like, mach, he's all sort of, all just have something to eat in his and have a coffee, you know what I mean? And biscuits, that can be my treat, like, cos when I'm on stage in Narawe, I make that my party time, you know what I mean? I might see everyone who's having a drink, who I've known from way back, and they're all, like, why are you tighten that? And it just makes you think, you know, off this, let's have a vodka then. You know what I mean? Let's go to the box and smell the bleach and the toilets and the whole thing, lad, isn't it? It's all like, you know, fucking hell, it just gets you, though, don't it? When you go to the box and you think, fuck, you know, and people in the next bog and they're like, what's happening to you? You're having one of these kids, you know what I mean? They're like, it's a scam, lad, you know? You know what I mean? It's fucking nuts just to bin a toilet all night and sniffing off a toilet seat and go back to a gaff and... I'm sorry, I was fucking 11 o'clock before, fucking four o'clock. Yeah, there's just all men in a kitchen, try to save the world and talking shit. How can you take advice for somebody that's full of Charlie for fucking three, four days? But you're listening and you're going... I've been a jammering with you back in 96. We were fucking kids, fucking that lolly, I just thought, what's his name, Steve? I'm not sure. You're all like, you know what I mean, you're all fucking crazy. We've got to go through all that shit. Now we're sitting here. Now we're focusing, goals for 2020 and ready to smash another year. This is your time, brother. I've got faith in you, I believe in you. Thank you very much, mate. And we'll be friends for a long time. Anything you would like to finish up on, anything. For anybody watching, maybe on the Struggle also, any advice you got for them? Yeah, thanks very much. Don't follow me on. Yeah, not a problem. For anybody that's on the Struggle, that... If you're having a struggle, just, you know, find someone, if you know who's connected, do I or just come or, you know, it's... And the door's open. You're not going to be judged by anyone in their rooms, man. It was the answer for me. And you don't have to go round what you do. You know what I mean, start getting yourself together, saying, I'm going to this, I'm going to that. People will know. People will see the change in you. You know what I mean? Everyone's living a mad life. And I think more people than what people let on. I've got this kind of thing. You know, problem, lad. You know what I mean? Because it's mad in it, lad. It's more mainstream than you think. Cwch chi'n yn drync hynny. You know what I mean? It comes hand in hand. And everyone's on it, lad, from all walks of life. So it's not on to be ashamed of. You know, if you're struggling and that reach out. You know what I mean? I'm speaking to people every day on Instagram. You know what I mean? Not about how can I get work, just about how can I help people. Just a little message or just about to link up and have a coffee. You know, and just try and start something to invest in themselves. I mean, just reach out. It's difficult because we all have a lot of pride. I get so many messages. The same from Twitter, Instagram, Facebook. People struggling, people want some guidance. And all you need to do is... It's so difficult. The first step is going to a meeting. Reaching out with someone and saying, look, I need help. But once you actually get that help, you'll see that results yourself. The last nine months that including myself, what can be achieved? I fucking... I sit to myself and go, how the... What is that? How the fuck am I doing that? I shock myself. I shock myself. I mean, three times I went to rehab, lad. And I fucked up every time. I've come home and I've set myself a little goal and went to meetings day to day done 90 and 90. I don't know why I'm staying sober, lad, on my own. I have money to myself and I've been lonely with money on me. You know what I mean? And each time I've wanted a drink, I've been able to pick up that phone before I pick up a drink. You're not acting on the phone. It's crazy, yeah. I take someone straight away. I had a thing out and they'll bail me straight away and say... You're becoming aware of it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I went a lad my money at first when I come off talk because I was just... You couldn't leave me on my own. But I can go out my way now and meet someone. I have something to eat. I can have money on me. I can go to meetings. And it feels good. I'm fine to myself a day at a time. I'm not perfect. I'm not special, man. I'm just trying to find myself in this life, lad, one day at a time and trying to become something better. Have I made mistakes in my life? Yeah. Have I wronged people? Yeah. You know what I mean? But haven't we all, lad? If we're all living in this world and you've got people who were on chat talking about each other, gossiping about each other. If we're trying to make something better of themselves, lad. I mean, it's mad, innit? Because everyone's going to hate that. You know what I mean? The specialist people in the world are going to hate. But I mean, yeah, going back to it. I waffle down. I'm sorry, brother. That's alright, mate. If you're struggling, just try and get to a meeting or pick up the phone to whoever you're now. You know what I mean? That's how it starts, innit? Yeah. I mean, deep down people know. But it's the pride, innit? You know what I mean? Anybody with an addiction? No, I might have to go back to work, lad. You know, if they're singing to somewhere else. But it will work out. It will work out. Obviously, I'm a singer, songwriter, and I've been off for years. But you know, it is what it is, life, lad. Whatever is happening, lad. For anybody in addiction issues, trust me, they want to quit every day. They want to quit every single day, you know. You're fucking up. You're feeling like a failure or a loser. You know, deep inside. But it's just to find that courage. But it can be done. It can be done. I'm a prime example. I'm a prime example. People can change. People can better their life. But it ain't easy. The demons are still there. The demons still arise. And get a wee chap at your door and say, you want to come out? Yeah, yeah. And I fuck that. I just slam that door shut straight away. And remember what I've done. I have foals up my wall to remember how far I've came. That's what I mean. I've got a relationship with my family. You know what I mean? People are looking at me. You're not lying. That's what I mean, lad. It's mad. You're not devious. And people know when you're telling them the truth. You know what I mean? You can look them in the eye. Your eyes are cleaner. You know what I mean? And it's not giving them that worry, lad. You know what I mean? Because it's you that you fuck on with. But the misery you're putting everyone else through, lad. You know what I mean? I can go and pick my daughter up from misery. You know what I mean? Instead of getting someone else to do it. I can help me add up high. And know to myself. Or item trying my best. People are starting to turn again. And give me trust like my ma. You know what I mean? My dad. And my family. You know what I mean? I'm starting to get relationships with friends. You know what I mean? Who stepped away. And thought fuck, at least one of the rails him. You know what I mean? But we're here, brother. You've got your single out next month. And for coming on today, mate. And telling your story. Listen, I've got every faith in you. And it's good to see you on the path. Proud of you. And all the best for the future. Thanks very much, mate. Good luck, brother. Thanks a lot, brother. Cheers. Thanks very much, man. You're the best. And we are alive. I'm going on my own misery. Thinking of dreams of yesterday. Nothing but temptation comes to me. It's so hard, I feel I'm going off the rails. And every other problem that comes alive. It's so hard to keep my head up and smile. I wish I could just hurry with this life of mine It's so hard and I feel like I failed No one can tell you No one else can know what you've seen Be a heart of broken barriers of your heart These scars Now I'm down and out I'll be up all night Going for a walk in these cold streets Try to get away from darkness in my mind Cos these demons that I have, they play for key No one can tell you No one else can know what you've seen