 Line from Orlando, Florida, extracting a signal from the noise. It's theCUBE covering Pentaho World 2015. Now your host, Dave Vellante and George Gilbert. Welcome to day two everybody. This is Dave Vellante with George Gilbert and we're here at Pentaho World 2015. George, day two. Yesterday we heard a lot about data blending. We heard about the end-to-end data pipeline. We heard a lot of customers. We had NASDAQ on, we had FINRA on, we had MoMix on. A lot of them using Amazon, working Pentaho into the Amazon, into the data stream using S3 and EMR. What's your take on what you heard yesterday and where you see Pentaho fitting into the ecosystem? So, you know, when you look back on all those amazing customer stories that we heard yesterday, I think it's a reflection of Pentaho's maturity having been around now a year longer than Hadoop. They've had time to get customers in production on real applications. And having had that longevity, the critical value that they can deliver is something that, a pipeline that takes data from the source, ingests it, blends it, delivers it, keeps track of what's happened to it and presents it for analytics. And you know, that's not too many people are out there that have had the time to do that yet. So, Pentaho and Amazon work very closely together today. Pentaho's available on Amazon, a number of the customers we talked to yesterday are using Amazon. Eventually, does Amazon start to do some of the things that Pentaho's doing? What do you see there as far as co-opetition? It's a classic sort of platform tool application play where you're in a rising tide, the platform vendor, when they see wide deployment of a certain technology, they say, okay, that's got to be part of the platform because too many people depend on it. And then it's incumbent on the tool vendor, the middleware vendor, to move up a layer. And so I guess we're going to have to grill the Pentaho folks a little bit because a lot of the individual services that Pentaho has, Amazon, I'm sorry, a lot of the integrated services Pentaho has, Amazon has in pieces and it's their probably their next step to start putting them together. Let's talk about the ecosystem. I see HP Vertica over there, I see Cloudera, WebRoot, a security company is here, obviously Hitachi is here with their IoT play. I don't see a lot of visualization companies and Pentaho does their own biz. What do you see as the state of the ecosystem and where does Pentaho's ecosystem have to go? Yeah, that's, I mean, that's their $64,000 question as we sort of did on our recap yesterday. Are they a tool or are they a solution? And the dessert topping or floor wax, kind of both. When you have to deal with that, you have to make some hard decisions because if you choose to be a platform player, you do not want to antagonize your solution, your application solutions coming from partners. And yet if you need to advance the platform to stay above the platform beneath you, you're going to have to do that. You're going to have to take on some of the capabilities of your partners. Right now I think the choice that Pentaho has made is so far we're going to let the traditional business intelligence users, business intelligence tools and the predictive analytics tools vendors plug in at the end point of our sort of value add chain and they're also going to take, for instance, specialized tools, perhaps like Tamer, where you've got to ingest and make sense out of potentially hundreds of data sources. Can't do that manually. But it looks like they want to have this end-to-end integration in between those two points. Yeah, and that seems to be their competitive differentiator, but you're laying out a scenario with the infrastructure as a service vendor that moves up the stack into Pentaho's pace. Pentaho potentially over time to expand its Tam, moves into the domain, the traditional analytics PI domain. Although Hitachi is an interesting angle there. Hitachi in and of itself gives Pentaho a distribution channel substantially beyond where it could go itself. Right, and that is, I mean it's an extremely relevant point which is Amazon does not yet have sort of the domain expertise and the sales reach to go after these industrial use cases. Of course Amazon just announced AWS IoT, so putting that toe in that one. Just the technology piece. Yeah, the underlying infrastructure and substrate, they don't have a presence in those markets. What about, we heard yesterday Quentin Gallivan, I think, talked about GE as a partner. I thought that was interesting. Maybe people don't realize that GE and Hitachi, Hitachi kind of supplying a lot of the raw materials. GE building maybe solutions, medical solutions and the like, but are they, Hitachi and GE, you may not have full visibility on this. What's your gut feel say in terms of, are they partners, are they competitors in this whole IoT thing? I think having listened to that, listened in sort of on that same conversation, I think they're actually more complimentary with each other than competition in the sense that the part that GE is most committed to is built on the Cloud Foundry Foundation to say, here we're going to compose applications from a bunch of microservices and yet the data products, the analytic data products, help me ingest the data, help me clean it and model it and analyze it. They're not as set in stone on their direction there and that would make for a rather easy integration. What do you make of GE's $100 million investment in Pivotal? What do you know about how that's progressed? Does the Dell EMC merger change anything there? Let's talk about that a little bit. Let's start with, what do you know about what GE's doing with Pivotal? Well, from what we do know, there's this platform called Predicts and I actually don't know how many layers up the stack it goes, but the objective is to take an industrial product that you sell now, like an airline engine or a turbine that generates electricity from a dam and rather than sell it as a product, you put sensors all over it and that allows you to do things like figure out when it needs maintenance and so there's less unplanned or even planned downtime and then you sell, not the product, you sell the service, you sell uptime, you sell flight hours and presumably because you know your products and you analyze the data better, you can sell this more profitably than just the product. What does GE use from Pivotal? Is it using the big data platform? Is it using Cloud Foundry? Originally it was Cloud Foundry as the sort of application sort of platform as a service and the services were like the original idea I think was like Green Plumber Hawk and Redis and JemPyre, the in-memory database and it was meant to be, you know, here's a suite of data management products that goes from super high capacity on one end to super, you know, high speed on the other end and that on top of that they would sort of leverage Pivotal's machine learning expertise and that's where you get the predictive maintenance and things like that. We've heard that any enterprise software takes many, many years to harden the teething process and Pivotal is making progress there but it's not as far along perhaps as some of the alternatives at that database layer. Do you think GE buys Pivotal? Do you think Dell will spin that off or is that based on what you said it maybe doesn't make sense? I think it's at the bottom of the priority list right now because they have a lot of bigger fish to fry and there's basically some things that just need to get fixed there. Last week at Big Data NYC two weeks ago Peter Goldmarker, we had an interesting segment with him and he said what happens when the funding dries up for these open source companies? What he described is it appears that the nose of the plane is up right now and a lot of that's illusory because of the huge amount of VC funding. I've called it overfunded, the big data market. So many companies are losing altitude even though the nose of the plane is pointing up because they're spending two or three dollars to make a dollar. What happens he asked when the funding dries up his premise was that the nose of the plane is going to tip down, there's going to be a shakeout. What are your thoughts on that? Pentaho obviously cut in under the wire in a fairly big way, great exit for the company. Where does that leave others? Well, how many chairs are there when the music stops? And Peter also made a good point about something that's sort of well known in enterprise software which is data infrastructure software and applications for that matter that need to get sold. They're not just bought and if they get sold you need an enterprise sales force. You can get the developer now in a way that you could never reach before the design win. He downloads it, he learns it, he evangelizes it but he doesn't have budget and he doesn't pay for keeping it up and running. So Peter's point which is very insightful and I hadn't really considered before is that Oracle has given this immense price umbrella to so many other vendors and you know I call this the rest of it the slow motion price collapse in infrastructure software. So given that you're going to need that sales and marketing expense somewhere it's going to probably have to be shared across many products and that means someone or few vendors are going to pick up a lot of these niche products who can't afford to continue sort of burning cash at the rate they're doing it. Yeah, of course the other point there is that the traditional software companies fund their sales force, they fund their distribution with upfront perpetual licenses and that's increasingly go away. In the case of for instance Hortonworks there is no upfront license. Many times you're seeing a cloud like model paid by the drink. So the other point he made, I wonder if you could comment is that a lot of the large companies are going to be sitting back waiting. Yes, that was his point. Like customers may not like dealing with Oracle for Oracle pricing but Oracle's in a really good position to be able to pick up a lot of these vendors at a fire sale price. I suspect that it may not be Oracle necessarily but there are other vendors, especially cloud vendors who might be able to pick some of these database vendors up because it might fit their pricing models better. Oracle might be conflicted selling MongoDB at 1% of the price of an Oracle license. A lot of customers coming in. We have Pentaho Day, Quentin Gallivan's coming on. We're going to geek out with some of the developers. We're going to go through the product roadmap so keep it right there everybody. George and I will be back. We're live, day two, Pentaho World. This is theCUBE.