 Hey there, I'm Drew and you are listening to or watching the anxious truth. This is the podcast that covers all things anxiety anxiety disorders and anxiety recovery So if you're struggling with things like panic attacks agoraphobia or OCD This is the place for you and I'm happy that you're here this week on the podcast We're gonna talk about addiction because I know many in this community are not only struggling with anxiety But maybe with alcohol or recreational drug use at the same time. So let's get into that now Hello, everybody. Welcome back to the anxious truth. This is podcast episode number 254 recorded in April of 2023 I am Drew lince a lot a creator and host of the anxious truth And if this is your first time here at the podcast or the YouTube channel welcome I'm glad you found us and I hope you find it helpful. If you're a returning listener or returning viewer welcome back I'm glad that you're here again this week on the podcast We're gonna talk about something that we really haven't talked about before because I know we need to I know that quite a few people in this Community not only are struggling with anxiety and anxiety recovery, but may also be struggling with alcohol or drug abuse Sometimes this happens because it becomes a self-medicating strategy that sort of goes off the rails and for a variety of reasons You may find yourself confronted not with one problem anxiety But with two problems anxiety and drinking or anxiety and drugs and I know that it's a big problem for many of you And I know that it's a problem that doesn't get talked about enough And I know that it's something that people are a little bit reluctant to talk about because there's shame and stigma attached to that And it feels like having two problems is way worse than having one So today I asked my friend Adam Jablin to join us Adam. I met not too long ago And he works in that recovery space in terms of drug and alcohol addiction because he has lived that experience He's kind. He's knowledgeable. He has been there and done that and there are many parallels Between anxiety recovery and treatment of an alcohol or drug problem and today is the first of probably quite a few conversations I will have with Adam here on this podcast, but we will talk about those things and how they overlap So if this is something that you have been waiting to hear about I'm glad that you're here today and we're gonna start that conversation in an open honest And I hope a kind and compassionate way and before we get into it and bring Adam on just a very quick reminder That the anxious truth is more than just this podcast episode There are a ton of really helpful use useful resources on my website at the anxious truth comm You can go check that out at your convenience take advantage of all the resources And if you're enjoying this work, and it's helping you in some way all the ways to support it can be found on the website At the anxious truth comm slash support financial support is never required, but always appreciated Thank you very much in any way that you do support this work whether it's subscribing to the YouTube channel or leaving a podcast review Thank you very much. I appreciate it more than you will ever know So let's get Adam on Adam's great He is somebody that I trust to talk about this topic And I think he was a great choice to open up the conversation on a thing that we have waited far too long to talk about So let's get to Adam's interview it goes for about a half hour And then I will come back as always to wrap it up in the end Adam welcome, dude My brother. Thank you for having me round two Round two for those of you who do not know Adam and I met on Instagram and we totally hit it off We did an IG live on Adam's account, and it was so much fun that Had him on the podcast it was a blast It was a but and I'm honored to be on your show and mint Did we have a good talk or what? I mean, I got so much good response from that IG live It was it was amazing. Yeah. Yeah, it was great. It was a great conversation. I really enjoyed doing it so One of the things that I want to talk about and and I'll let you get kind of give your backstory for sure But I know that there is a large number of people in my community that are struggling with substance use at the same time That they're struggling as I one came before the other it doesn't matter. Sometimes they sort of stumbled into the self-medication thing and you have such a Positive outlook and you're so kind in the way you talk about these things and it's no bullshit You're straight to the point So this is why I dig you and I thought you'd be a perfect person to talk about those sort of things So that's why I invited you on because I totally trust you to talk about this stuff So can you give us the you know, give me the reader's digest version where you've been where you go? Absolutely. Thank you. By the way, thank you. I feel the same way about you. I told you I was devouring your content for months before even reaching out and and And I just love how you speak about anxiety about how you speak about what you went through with your own personal panic attacks Walk through it and how you walk people through those 10 12 steps that you and I even spoke about when I or when we did off the cup I on July 14 This of this year, I will be 17 years clean and sober. Oh, man Yeah, which I I'm very proud of that day July 14 2006 was the day I surrendered and went to treatment And I didn't you know, look, I didn't really know what alcoholism and addiction was Yeah, me and alcoholic was some bum in Manhattan, you know That hadn't showered with a with a paper brown paper bag and a bottle in it mumbling to himself Petting a cat. That's not there. Just kind of delusional Yeah Or an addict was like the if you ever seen the movie new jack city It was like Chris rocks character was somebody always go smoking crack or sticking needles in their arms and Willing to sell their baby for their next fix, right? Those are my definitions. So therefore I didn't fit that right, however, I abused alcohol I abused drugs a lot of it for me did stem from anxiety and Dot dot dot insecurity and dot dot dot curiosity and when you mix those three up, especially as a young young man Not having much fear and wanting to fit in, you know And you have some anxiety and you have some insecurity and you have some curiosity and you put those in a In a nice round tub and a nice course light and you slam that back and it just fixed something inside of me I didn't know was broken Right. I didn't know it was broken But it fixed it and all those old feelings and old traumas from being the fat kid growing up and Still even after I changed my body and I looked like an adonis, you know I was still that class clown comedian Let me make you laugh with me instead of laughing at me Always trying to make the room comfortable But when I drank or I did drugs a different confidence came out. Yeah, and you know, so I would go on this anxiety Nervous insecure. Let me you might let my muscles do the talking because I don't want them to see what where really am inside And then when I would drink Superman would come out So, you know, I pushed as as far as I could take it I go to Arizona State University is the number one party school and penthouse and playboy which it was and I Dominated there and it was sex drugs and rock and roll and then it was right. I come from a My family had a family business and family businesses at least from my generation in the 80s 70s 60s We were like the mafia like it wasn't like hey Adam, what do you want to do when you grow up? What do you want to be it was like this is who we are This is what we do. We found our way. You're the next generation Yeah, and it comes with obviously some security, but it also comes with a lot of emptiness because you don't ever dare to dream and I worked hard. I had to be the first one there last one to leave had to learn every department in Is it 24 hour a day 24 hour a day seven day a week operation number one matte lace Manufacturing plant in the world. Wow over a hundred and ten machines over 200 employees Either three eight-hour shifts or two twelve-hour shifts with a lot of overtime depending on what was going on in the world And I had to learn, you know literally from janitor night shift quality control inventory mechanic knitting Up to design I mean with every secretary was doing what kind of yarns that were pulling in with how the inventory how the goods were going out Yeah, so I could finally, you know run the whole company to fulfill your destiny destiny and it was a work hard play hard and You know, we would drink heavy you would drink heavy and then my ex-wife didn't like the drinking so Xanax came in Okay, and I couldn't sleep from anxiety and worried and I had this going like that going on this I mean, I never really understood what running a full operation with was like this And so I'm thinking ambient to sleep and you know, then before you know it I'm getting a little older and wear and tear and I get an ACL tear and I get you know ACL surgery and MCL surgery and they're giving me oxy cotton and I got oxy's and I got percocets And I got Darvus sets an ambient to sleep. I'm thinking Xanax I'm thinking fat burners before I worked out and caffeine and a bedroom and and do out and drinking all the time And I just became this pharmacist and I truly became an alcoholic and yeah But if you want to know where it really stems from yeah from that anxiety and that insecurity of not being comfortable in my own skin Yeah, take away those feelings. Please. Yeah. Yeah, I get that and you know You hear that often people even if they don't have a substance use issue before they develop an anxiety disorder A lot of people wind up turning to that because it is a self-medicating thing So you hear those stories when people are, you know open enough to talk about them It's a very personal thing. So I don't expect anybody to talk about it But sometimes you hear things like oh, I accidentally discovered that I drink two bottles of wine every night So yeah, and they didn't real it's crapped up on them And then they start to get into that they feel backed into a corner now I have two problems. How do I address that? Yeah, so how do you go from first of all? It sounds like a horrifying ride my friend like you are literally trying to control every part of your body by Ingesting different things to get higher and lower and sleep and wake up and fat burner in the gym man I get that yeah So where did you start when you hit that that point where it's like I can't do this anymore? What that's so there were many many of those moments, right? Where I was like, I can't do this anymore I can't do this anymore, but that next day comes and the obsessions of the mind start And you got to get through the day and you only know that one way Yeah, and then once you put the actual substance in your body now you created the allergy and the compulsion Right so your body needs more of it. So there were so many times. I swore to myself today. I'm gonna stop today It's the last day. Okay tonight. This is the last pill with this lab This is the last time I drink on a Tuesday night, you know Only gonna be eight nights or Friday and Saturday and I can't tell you how many times I need these false promises and these these ridiculous, you know God if you'll just do these foxhole prayers, you know, you'll just take this away from me But it ended up gained the point that I had to walk into an intervention and Now there's a show and it's very popular and I've friends that are actually on the show as interventions I'm so proud of them. But to tell you the truth in 2006. I didn't know what the hell an intervention was Yeah show wasn't out and what it really is is you're walking into basically the people that love you the most gathering around and saying You have a problem. Yeah, we love you. It's time for a time out. Do you will you accept help? Yeah I accepted the help through but very defensively like how am I 28 day? I can't go over 28 days Like who's gonna be me for a month? I'm running the I'm running the business. I'm doing that. Yeah, mr. Big shot I'm the man. Yeah, it's gonna be the man if I'm not here. Yeah, and they saw it coming So they had they had it prepared and they're like, how about ten days? Wow, what ten days? We'll see if you even had this thing, right? Yeah, and and and all of a sudden I start negotiating. Okay, ten days We can tell people I'm on a business trip and and that was my bullshit, right? My bullshit brahmers. I'm worried I'm constantly anxious about what are people gonna think about me. What is the projection of me? How is this gonna look? How is this gonna feel? I'm not really that concerned that the people that love me the most are worried about my life Yeah worried about the perception and that goes to show you where alcoholism addiction can take somebody. Yeah. Yeah drew I go in and I Really, you know what I went in with this attitude that I'm gonna be the most dedicated Discipline structured rehab patient. They've ever seen and what what they will see is There's really nothing wrong with this guy He's under way too much pressure with a family business with a wife. That's always on him with a new kid There's nothing wrong with this man. You're a and a backfire and Everything I learned makes sense and I learned what a real alcoholic is. Yeah I'm an alcohol and that I learned what an addict is and I learned that alcohols and addiction is a disease It's not a lack of willpower which started to make sense because I have willpower all day Yeah, marathons. I'll squat 450 pounds. I'll make two million dollars in a day. Well, this is nothing to do with willpower It's not it's it's got four qualifications to be considered a disease. You have to be progressive over time you get worse Yeah, be chronic. You always have to be there. You have to be Primary as in not secondary. You're the first cause and you have to be fatal Yeah has to be able to kill you you take one of those away. It's a disorder. Yep You add that fourth dimension back. It's a disease. So the medical community considers alcohol as an addiction to disease And I started learning that I was sick. I wasn't a bad person. I was sick And that's why I got a DUI and that's why I always lied about my drinking and that's why I always was covering up So now you take the symptom away, right? I'm gonna take my baba away. You take the drink and drug away and now we get to the anxiety Now we get to go. Why the hell am I always feeling like this? Yeah, why am I suffering like this? And it's it's the work that you and I have discussed, you know, in my Instagram live It's yeah, although I really think that you could take that protocol and bring it to every treatment center I've ever spoken to what you showed your chair to me, but but it is that inside work Yeah, and I think it's interesting because I claim no expertise in substance abuse counseling or anything like that or even lived experience there But I see there are overlaps the more people I talk to that I do trust with this subject the more you can see that there are some overlaps So let me ask you a question. Maybe can answer. Maybe you can't when you would make those promises to yourself This is my last Tuesday night tomorrow. That's it. I'm clean tomorrow and you get to noon and you haven't had anything yet What do you experience? So it's almost as true. It's almost as if you're like multiple people at the same time Okay, there's a part of your ego or a part of your personality that's kind of proud of you Right and that guy slowly turns into another voice. That's like you see it's already noon Right. You could go another five hours if you had to What's the big deal? You're always you make this into such a thing Have a Xanax. Have a cocktail tonight. Relax. You're not that bad. It's like this. It happened to me in rehab The second I said I'm an alcoholic and an addict the 600 pound gorilla literally came off my shoulders and I could breathe and everything made sense It was like the movie the sixth sense with Bruce Willis at the end when he was dead Oh, that's why he's telling me he can sing dead people. That's why she's eating alone I was like, oh, that's why I cover so much. That's why I spent the night in jail That's why I wrote 30 letters and I'll stop drinking. That's why I have a DUI That's an alcohol but then within that minute it was a but now how do I watch football with my dad? How do I go out and entertain customers? Yeah, how do I go and do that? How do I go and do that? Because alcohol and and substances were such a part of my life So what I'm trying to say is it's it's a it's a very sneaky city is voice in my head that when I would make it to 12 o'clock I would want to reward that I made it to 12 o'clock with the actual thing that I Substating from so it's like it's like you're crazy Oh, well, I think a lot of people who are listening even if you are I appreciate you sharing openly like this man I really do but that there are a number of people who are listening right now that maybe don't have a substance use problem of any kind But they understand what you're saying because it is the same thing that happens when somebody enters a disordered state of anxiety Like okay, I have to tolerate these feelings today and you get into it a little bit and then all of a sudden that voice starts to say Well, you know you did a good exposure today go rest for a week. It's fine. You get you deserve a break So yeah that other side chimes in you're describing a very similar process here the context is different but the process is quite similar I think yeah, that's why I think you and I to talk to many people because what I found is people have that issue with food And people have this issue with gambling obviously anxiety is true, you know When you suffer from anxiety you can't compare that to any to me personally anything I'd rather have a broken arm that they have that internal the internal But what I'm saying is that I do think more people understand that voice than don't understand it Yeah, you're probably right whereas I think it's amazing that you had to be told oh you have a you have this problem You know it's interesting and the parallel in the anxiety recovery world would be that's the psycho educational part like no Let me explain what's going on with you. You're not broken your brain isn't broken like this is what's going on But only knowing and I hear these parallels here that I can bring out as you talk Knowing is great and knowing lifted that weight off your shoulders, but knowing wasn't enough What had to go on top of knowing So after you know what you are it takes radical radical action For me I was very blessed that they showed me the path and they showed me the steps in a way to get clean and sober It was going to be a new way of living it was going to be a new blueprint I was going to have to change many things friends people places I go you know entertaining customers It was going to be a whole new blueprint But this way of life I could be clean and sober and in being clean and sober I could actually find joy I could actually be free and when you have those two eventually find true happiness right because happiness is fleeting You know you could be happy when you get a new car a week later that's just your car You could be happy when you fall in love but a year and a half later that's just your girl Yeah or girl or partner whatever but but joy and freedom are completely are two complete other things Like a little joy for living a joy that I could talk about anxiety with you Yeah Compared to trying to show that I'm some superhero and that nothing bothers me You know there's a freedom within that and I had to change you know I had to change a lot But everything I did was in such a beautiful healthy way for my for my lifestyle Yeah I love that you're talking about joy and freedom and it's interesting because again in this community of people who are listening Everyone's trying to shoot for I need to feel happy again I need to feel joy and need to feel gratitude again They're trying to create experiences because they think that's the opposite of being anxious But really the opposite of being anxious is is contentment or neutrality And what I hear you're describing and you tell me if I'm off base here is joy and freedom don't equate to nirvanic happiness They basically I'm going to guess that they equate to like hey whatever state I'm in at the moment is the state I'm supposed to be And I'm good with that and I'm going to let it all come and go I'm not I don't have to self medicate to create a particular state I can handle life as it is And that's a joyful state even though it might not be the technical definition of joyful of like yay you know or whatever But there's a contentment and a confidence I'm guessing you must have found in that I think the word I love the words that you use I like confidence I love neutrality I use the word joy because it was actually because it was taught to me Sure It's not even it's not even like but I like your words better there's a there's a confidence in facing the day No, I could be cleaning sober and there's a neutrality. I can I can make a mistake and come back to neutral not oh I'm so grateful. I made that mistake. I know but like I I learned I learned how to miss a shot Like Jordan and Kobe and take it again. Yeah old Adam was not the old Adam missed a shot now I'm just gonna pass because I saw I don't want to play anymore and this is too hard and you know Yeah, I mean but I learned how to come back to neutral Yeah, and some of those lessons I'm guessing come through I mean when you're going through what you had to go through that radical change in living Not an easy task man not an easy test but my hat is off to you That's something that I feel like you and I bonded on Yeah that shared that's shared experience of that was having hard It's radical. Yeah It's radical. You know you can't live in that space too long It's like something's going to shift. Yeah, and you and I you know because it's it's hard. It's really really hard and And you and I found a way out. Thank God. Yeah, I mean I'm grateful for that and it's interesting I don't know if you would echo this but to me I always use phrases like there was gold forged in those fires like yes At times I felt like it was on fire and walking through fire to get better But it was gold forged in those fires and it came with me on the other side and I don't know if you share that experience like Yes, yeah new Adam learned the things that you learned going through that experience stay with you So what did you call those gold? There's there's I always say there's there was gold you feel like you're in a fire right now you're on fire but there's gold forged in those Fires like that's gold. Yes. So so we would say so you see gold. I love that gold forge in the fire We say our dark past is our greatest asset. It's the same Same Same Exactly the same road just two different ways of saying totally and I think they're complimentary too I would think because a lot of that But let's talk for a second about I have so many things we can do like ten of these. I'm sure I would love it I love your vibe. You know how we can yeah, I love yeah, it's funny because we went on the phone for a while afterwards It was just just connect, you know But I think one of the things that people in my community struggled with is they realize that oh maybe they've started to self-medicate And maybe it's gotten out of control a little bit and it's making the anxiety worse now instead of better And now there's that I have two problems and there's the shame of the first problem the second problem now There's the shame of oh, I think I also have a drinking problem now I can't imagine and maybe you didn't experience that I guess the shame the stigma that comes along with that the judgments that come along I did experience that But I had somebody a great mentor I told you about and he explained it in a way to me that hopefully you and I could explain to To our to your audience that we can maybe lose the shame if that's okay Yeah, right look first off it's normal for anybody to want to feel better and and Media society billboards movies, you know Alcohol pills that they're everywhere, you know, so you were finding it's not like you're just some maniac that you were being Taught in some way you were just trying to find some relief but When it if you're an atom have a friend that's very very sick And we have to bring into the hospital something's really really wrong himself and when we give to the hospital the first thing they notice is Oh my god, listen, he has a hundred and forty three fever. We need to attack this first before we get to what's causing the Yeah, first thing they're going to do is put an IV in him put a bunch of Tylenol on him bring the fever down So now they could diagnose it That's all that's happened right when they started doing alcohol and drugs. Okay now let's just take let's take the fever Yeah, let's attack that Let's let's bring the fever down now the body's in a neutral state. I love that word that you use now Let's see what's actually causing the person that want to make them want to yeah to make them want a drug So rather than you know, of course, yes, they're dealing with two things But if they can look at it as it's a part of the process in anybody Yeah, right when I had a friend and they're sick and the fever went up you lower the fever first then you find out what's caused the Yeah, that makes sense. You can't you can't do the cause I'd love to do the cause right but I have a fever It's funny one of the therapists that I had for a while and I loved her curiously not a an anxiety specialist But nonetheless, we had a good connection She was also an e earners for the first part of her career and she told me and no uncertain terms The first thing we would do if you come into the you know We have to stop the bleeding before we could fix anything if you're bleeding we got to stop the bleeding So I love how you say that we got a first. We got to break the fever Yeah, right. So what we'll do is look we're gonna take a look at the drinking world detox real fast We're gonna figure this out You know, but bear with us, you know, all you did was add three to five days of detox and and And we're gonna get to you know When the drinking started and the causes of conditions but the causes of conditions are gonna lead us to also the original anxiety in the original Yeah, I get that so now you're being asked to do things and I think that it's there's really a you know these these Concepts but heads so now I'm gonna ask you to do really hard things which is change the way you live a whole new Way to engineer your life now you they have to take this thing out of it and that's difficult You're going through the physical issues of withdrawal and the detox and all those things you're breaking habits And you are forced to confront the very things that drove you to the behavior to begin with So that's a tough one. You how do you fix this by doing hard things? Well, what hard things do I have to do this stuff that made me have to do hard things? Yeah, so you nailed it you nailed it So it's you know so many people it's such a cool time for us because like you know what we're talking about now is mainstream We're not guys that are like, you know in churches basements and having secret rooms You know we we could actually grow audiences and help a lot of people and be proud of what we overcome So I've heard you know basically you got to choose your heart You know you got to choose like both ways are hard like suffering with anxiety and drinking and And and and popping pills and doing drugs and hiding and lying about it and constantly saying you're here when you're there And being restless because you don't know when your next fix this is irritable and mad because you need something in you and discontent What is discontent? It means when I'm here I want to be there when I'm there I want to be here You're restless irritable and discontent you have to either that's your heart you're going to live like that You can be lying and manipulating and possibly going all the way to stealing because alcohol and drugs start costing you a lot of money Or this heart which is you have to find a different way a peaceful way a godlike way a spiritual way A you know a healthier way of life There's a there's a sort of a I mean we're familiar with each other's a woman by the name of Allegra Caston she's an OCD special And she's she started saying suffer in the right direction and I steal that all the time from Allegra suffer in the right direction So in the same thing would apply in anxiety recovery So if you're dealing with both of these problems at the same time I do say pick your heart What it's really hard to face the things you're afraid of you know what is also really hard is not facing the things you're afraid of Because the consequences of that are for you they were hiding they were deception they were financial they were self-esteem For people with anxiety disorders it's a smaller and smaller and smaller life full of restrictions Either way you do it it's going to be hard so which hard gets you to a better place You know what Joseph Campbell's the hero's journey I familiar with it I tell you that I read it Yeah I mean still but it's it's it's very cliche right it's the the call to action and so if it's it's it's Mr. Anderson who's going to turn into Neo and the Matrix or if it's Luke Skywalker and he you know he has a dad And he knows as his Jedi hero of his old man his old wise mentor takes him on this journey There's a call to action and you have to learn a set of skills be at the force or you have to be downloaded into the Or if it's you know Bruce Wayne and he has his call to action you want to want to avenge his parents or if it's you're from Krypton But the hero's journey is the same all the way to the story of Christ But one of the reasons I want to bring this up was and it's a great illustration this one is in Empire Strikes Back Yoda is training Luke and Luke one of the things he does has to do is he finally has to face his heart He has to face his problem and Yoda has basically a setup where he faces Darth Vader And in this training protocol he chops off Vader's head and he looks down in the helmet and he sees his own face The real the hero's journey is you have to face yourself eventually You have to face yourself you really you think the problem is that dragon you think the problem is that kryptonite You think the problem is the anxiety you think the problem is the alcohol and drugs but really it's something internal That you haven't faced not that you're not going to get anxiety again not that you're not going to want to have a glass of wine again There's something within that you have to face Yeah and that's that you know for us we talk about in my my realm we talk about the fear of fear just I can't handle it it's too much It will overwhelm me I can't do this I have to run from it and you you're forced to face that and go through it and learn that Oh wait I was more capable than I ever knew I was Which I'm guessing you're probably lessons you learned along the way wait I maybe I didn't have to start drinking to begin with but this is the journey I was on So the journey I was on and this is the path I chose you know I mean I was like listen I was that kid that chose Arizona State University Because it was the number one party school so I always have to look at it knowing who I who I really am Yeah yeah wow I mean we could do a bunch of these and I'll probably have you back on because I know If you're listening and you will comment on the YouTube video or whatever if you're in my Facebook group We'll get some questions going because I know that people are struggling with this and they feel how can I possibly do both of these things at the same time How can I go through detox when I'm afraid of my own heartbeat right now and it seems like a tremendously daunting task So to have somebody who can hold up a light to say listen I was there and I know it seems impossible but you can do it You know I welcome the voice so Both of us both of us you know Joanna I you know my podcast will be starting soon but aside from that Obviously I'd love to have you on as much as I can because my audience you know your audience may dig me My audience will love you because I I've never met one alcoholic and addict that didn't suffer from anxiety I have not one Yeah Really Cormoran Cormoran there Yeah, not one not one you know because you know obviously it starts with fun right it always starts with fun Yeah There was there is eventually an underlining symptom that that's there and it's fear It's always fear and anxiety Yeah Your anxiety and resentment so I'm gonna have you on a but uh I'm very aligned and I think there's a lot of good we could do Yeah would be great we can continue this conversation for sure and next time we'll talk about I think what happens now You know we talked on your Instagram You said we'll give you a little teaser next time we have Adam back on come back and we'll talk about this but You mentioned you were having a really anxious day that day or a really anxious days what now you don't have the old I'm at 17 years. It's been a long time But you know the usual coping mechanisms aren't there you've had to build new ways to deal with that when it happens And I'd love to hear about that we'll talk about that I'd love to and by the way I love that we that's how it started because it was you know it's not like you Even when you get to know the path and you get to know who you are. It's not like you get excused From ever feeling it again Yeah, yeah 100% yeah weather and see and there you go when you said before it's not like you're never gonna be anxious again It's not like you're ever never gonna want a glass of wine. I'm sure you do sometimes Of course Yeah, yeah, it doesn't just go away. So that's the realistic expectations we have a lot to talk about it's gonna be great But thank you for coming on I mean I try we can go for another hour, but I try and keep them about 30 minutes We'll just yeah for sure But so tell us where if somebody was more interested in finding you and they can go to the anxious truth comms This is this is episode 254. I don't look on the screen So go to the anxious truth.com slash 254 I'll put all of Adam's links, but where would you send people to find more about you? Yeah, I try to make it as simple as possible. So I'm at Adam Javelin and all platforms, you know So that you know if it's Instagram Facebook LinkedIn, you know we're developing a TikTok But just you know look me up and and I'm you know I'm here to serve Yeah, Adam has a very friendly voice just you know for sure There's I had a little bit of trepidation when you first asked me to go on I'm like oh no it's another influencer guy But very genuine very down to earth very kind. I appreciate all that stuff Thanks for coming on if you guys hit the show notes I'll come back and wrap it up in a second and yeah, we'll see you next time Okay, we are back I could have talked to Adam for probably two or three hours today because the more we speak The more I can see the parallels between what he lived through to deal with his addiction issues And what many of you are working on today in terms of anxiety recovery And if you're struggling with both anxiety and maybe an alcohol or drug problem of varying severity There is a lot of overlap there and there are lessons to be learned in parallel when you're working on both of those problems So I promise I will have Adam back on and we'll have more of this conversation because I think it's one that needs to be had And I hope you found it helpful and useful in some way even as a starting point And as I said during the interview if you have questions about this or things you would like to hear Adam talk about By all means comment on the YouTube video or if you're in my Facebook group leave a message there Or leave a message on the Facebook post wherever you see me post this podcast episode And I will do my best to incorporate that as we continue this conversation of future podcast episodes So thank you so much to Adam for joining in and for contributing his voice and his experience to the community I really appreciate that if you want to find more about Adam you can just look for him Adam Jablin On any platform or if you go to theAnxiousTruth.com slash 254 which is the show notes for this episode I will have all Adam's links right there so you can easily follow and check him out And that is it that is episode 254 of The Anxious Truth in the books you know it's over because You're going to hear Afterglow by Ben Drake Ben wrote that song a couple of years ago inspired at least in part by this podcast And I appreciate the fact that he lets me use it the way he does for the last several years You can find more about Ben and his music on his website at BenDrakeMusic.com If you go there tell him I said hello because he's a really good dude and a great musician And as always I will ask a couple of favors if you're listening to this podcast on Apple Podcasts or Spotify Or some platform that lets you rate or review the podcast take a minute and leave a five star rating And even better maybe write a review of the podcast if you haven't already Because it helps more people find it and then we get to help more people which is why I started doing this to begin with If you're watching on YouTube like the video subscribe to the channel hit the notification bell so you know when I upload new content And leave a comment a couple of times a week I circle back and interact with people on YouTube which I really dig And I just love the support in the community over there So that's it again I hope you have found this helpful I will be back next week with another podcast episode Don't necessarily know what I'm going to be talking about but I will be here And remember every step forward that you can take today is a valid and an important step forward no matter how small it is I'll see you next week