 I am excited about what I saw Tuesday night. I liked Isaiah Thomas and Cleveland had a big impact on the game. First game with the Cavs, I think it's just going to get better and better. And I think it creates some real drama more than we had a week ago at least as to what Cleveland can do against Golden State in the finals and what, of course, LeBron can do against Golden State. And that got me to thinking, who are the best five teammates of LeBron James's career? At number five, Ray Allen. Look, I know he was 37 years old and well past his prime when he joined LeBron in Miami. But still, where would LeBron's legacy be without Ray Allen? Ray Allen hit arguably the biggest shot in NBA history down 3-2 to the San Antonio Spurs, down 3-17 seconds left. Ray Allen hits that corner three pointer that forces overtime and sets the stage for LeBron to have a tremendous game seven and win his second title in Miami. Ray Allen has to be given love as one of LeBron's greatest teammates. At number four, Kevin Love. Oh, how everybody loves to hate on Kevin Love. They look at his numbers in Minnesota, then look at his numbers in Cleveland and say he's not the same player. He's falling off. No, he hasn't fallen off. It is difficult to be consistent, especially consistently great as the definite third option on a team. And that's what he was behind LeBron and Kyrie. But this year is the second option. He's played the best ball of his career. He's one of six players averaging 20 points and 10 rebounds a game. And I think he's played very well with LeBron this year. And I think people will appreciate that more as time goes on. At number three, Chris Bosch. Speaking of third options, I mean, Bosch gave up more offensively than any teammate LeBron has ever had. He went from averaging 24 and 11 his last year in Toronto to 16 and seven his last two years with LeBron in Miami. But one thing Bosch realized as his offense was going down, I can make an impact defensively. And the tradeoff for him will be probably a Hall of Fame induction and two championship rings. Chris Bosch at number three. At number two, Kyrie Irving. This man would probably or maybe be number one if he hadn't demanded a trade. That said, nothing can take away what Kyrie did for the Cavs and LeBron James. Of course, like Ray Allen, he hit what could be one of the biggest shots in NBA history. The three pointer that gave the Cavs the victory in game seven over Golden State in maybe the most historic finals of all time. Only time someone's come back from a three one deficit. The Cavs win their first major sports league championship for the whole city of Cleveland in 52 years. And then of course they beat the best regular season team in history. A lot of people will wonder what would have happened if Kyrie had stayed in Cleveland with LeBron. What I wonder is what would have happened in 2015 if Kyrie had not injured his knee in game one against Golden State. I don't have to stretch the imagination to think Cleveland would have won that series. And finally, at number one, you probably know it, Dwayne Wade. People don't understand and appreciate the sacrifice that Dwayne Wade made when LeBron went to Miami in their second year, particularly when he decided to do it. But how many future Hall of Famers? How many Alpha dogs? David Robinson gave his team to Tim Duncan. But Robinson wasn't really that Alpha dog like Dwayne Wade was. He gave up his team to LeBron because it was best for the heat. It was their best chance of winning. That is rare. Dwayne Wade was a great teammate for LeBron. As you remember, Dwayne's reputation wasn't at stake. Nobody had already proven he could lead a team to a championship. Nobody was questioning whether he had the courage or the heart in the clutch to lead a team to a title. They had those questions about LeBron. Dwayne stepped back, gave the team to LeBron, and then LeBron delivered and erased those questions. Great for his career. Great for his legacy. And I'll even say this, even though Dwayne Wade is not what he used to be. If somehow, someway, Cleveland can win this title this year, you better believe Dwayne Wade will have a lot to do with it. And LeBron will have a lot of thanks to his main man Dwayne, the best teammate LeBron's ever had. All right, I want to welcome my man Jim Jackson into the zone, brother. It's always good to have you here. Ohio thing right here. That's right. That's right. Do people know who used to who? I don't think they know that. I tell them every chance I get. I posted a picture of Chris going to the basket back around the clean on there. Oh no. Well, you, I think they know you were like, I kind of refer to you as Ohio's first LeBron James. Seriously. In a lot of ways, because I was bigger. Yep. And you passed, you had, you know, skills. So that's why I can relate to some of the things that LeBron does. When I watch him play, I can see a pass coming right away because we played, no, he's much better athlete and taller. But I mean, at the time, I mean, that's one thing you know. 6-6. Playing point guard. Yeah, exactly. But you know this about being in the Midwest. One thing we do, we get taught to play defense, rebound, you pass. You know, you're going to do all and score, but you're going to have a complete all around game. So it's not like one thing you do in the Midwest. You get taught all of these different skill sets. So I mean, it worked out for me. Yeah. Yeah. And in NBA, you became this huge scorer. Yeah, I know. I know it opened up, you know. Ironically, it was because, well, you know, my rookie year, I held out. Yeah. But then when I got there, my second year, maybe, and Dallas, we basically had a CBA team, man. It was. Well, now y'all had all that talent. No, no, no, no. You talked about what you first got there. No, man, my second year. Because Jamal came later. He came my second year. Okay. Quinn coached us. We won 13 games that year. No, I mean, that was the idea. Oh, that was with Quinn. Yeah. So it was, imagine winning 13 games. So that means you win basically two games a month. So how'd you and Quinn almost got in the fight? What happened? So we're playing the Clippers, right? We're playing the Clippers. Dominique was playing. Oh, God. For the Clippers. For the Clippers. And we're playing here at the Old Sports Arena. So into the season, we're playing, and guys really don't want to play. I'm like, I'm going to get it. Yeah, I shoot like 37 times, right? So Tony Campbell was on our team, Ohio State guy. We're in the locker room after the game. Imagine set the scene in the locker room. We lost again. I got on a tile and I got on ice bags and I'm sitting there. I'm talking to Tony. I'm like, man, we should have won this game. No way we should have lost. Blah, blah, blah. And Quinn walked by and was like, what'd you say? I said, I was telling Tony we should have won the game. So no, you said something about me or something. I said, Quinn, I didn't say nothing about you. And he got it, got up on me. So we go back and forth. I'm like, Quinn, if I was to say something, I would say it to your face, but he stepped up on me. I ain't know what he's going to do. So I jumped up, ripped off my ice bag, tile fell down. So you naked. I'm naked. And we about to go out into the locker room. You know, but that's how that's what happens in the losing locker room. It's like the little things he misinterprets. I'm upset. Now we're good friends today. We laugh about it. You know what I mean? But back then it was different because it was so much tension from the losing. How often, because I've heard stories. It's not that unusual for a player and a coach to either get in the fight or at least come close to a fight, right? It's not unusual. I'm because it depends. I mean, we got egos, coaches got egos. It's things we think as players, we need to get done, whether I'm playing or especially if I'm not, if a guy is disgruntled and I'm happy, it boils to a point. Now again, it's not college. So within 30 games, you might be done. You're talking about 82 game season. And this could be going on for a couple of years maybe. So it's not, I'm not going to say it's rare, because it's not. Now guys would verbally get into it a lot. Rarely do you see kind of coach player really... It's like fisticuffs. Fisticuffs. But you'll have some exchanges. I mean, because I have exchanges in the family atmosphere, let alone with people that I'm just getting to know. So it's not rare to exchange part of it. Now you play with Jason Kidd, his rookie, his early years. I've been one and a lot of people are comparing Lyons old ball to him. What do you think of that comparison? Is it fair? Well, it's a fair comparison from a couple of different standpoints. One, you got size as a point guard. 6'4", Lyons old 6'5", 6'6", okay. J. Kidd a 6'4", but thicker. The ability to see the court, to get their teammates involved, very similar. The similarity of really not being able to shoot consistently from the perimeter. Now the difference being, I said this before, Lyons old ball is more of a willing shooter to shoot it. J. Kidd, we had to kind of get J. Kidd to force him to shoot it. His ability to affect the team mentally because you know you're going to get it. So I'm a run harder. I love playing with him. He's a great person. All those things are very similar. The difference is J. Kidd, he affected the game on the defensive end a lot different. He played the pass and land, got over screen and rose for a rookie. He did some things on the court defensively that separates him from Lanzo and he was a better finisher when he got to the basket. Because at times you see Lanzo right now. He'll get to the cup, but he's not finishing. J. Kidd, I mean get to the basket and one more thing. J. Kidd, 94 feet. When he got it, he was a blur. So he played at a different tempo. When Lanzo plays at that tempo, not only is he better, but the Lakers are better. So he has to figure out how to marry those two things. But you know, very similar, but very different in some aspects. You think, are you one that thinks Lanzo will be a star? I think he'll be a star. Whether he's a superstar, a transcended player, I don't know. But I do know that, Kristen, you've been around this for a long time. What the Lakers need from him is 12 to 15, 10 assists, 8 rebounds. Okay? Since you got Ingram now scoring, now Kuzma scoring. You got Nance that can score. You got Clarkson coming in. So if he can consistently knock down some shots, just get comfortable. Increase his free throw percentage. Now he's able to do this and he's going to get guys to ball. He has scores around him. So we're not expecting him to be. And again, I think you got to change your narrative because the narrative has been Damon Lillard, Russell Westbrook, Kyrie Irving, Laurie, all these point guards that can score. So you're trying to compare Lanzo to them. He's not them. You know, so you got to change your narrative when you look at who he should be compared to these other players. One thing, I just want to ask you this about J.K. because I've had players tell me he was not verbal on the court. Which is, we think, and I know he was a good leader, but talk about that because guys told me he wasn't verbal. He was obviously his strength was getting up and down, but his strength wasn't even, I've heard some tell me, running a half court offense because he wasn't verbal. Well, you know what? The good part, and that's where Lanzo is like it too. Lanzo's not, he's stoic when you see him on the court. But fortunately for us, when I was there in Dallas, Dick Mott at Offensive Jeans. I mean, I was averaging 26. Masters having 25. Easiest 26 ever because the system was built off Rees. Almost like what they- Was it, what talent system was it? Well, it was almost like what they ran in Utah. What Carl Malone and what John Stockton. It was a lot of UCLA cut, rub cups. You hit the wing and whatever side the guard went on off the elbow is what play was going to be. So J.K. really didn't, well, I could run it. So you really didn't have to be as vocal because it was a read. If I hit the wing and I went on the inside, that meant one thing. If I hit the wing and went on the outside, it meant something else. So now everybody else reacted. So J.K. from that perspective didn't have to vocally do this. I was more of a talker. That's just how it was my whole career. I mean, I was the one doing all of that stuff. So it complimented all our skill sets at that offense when Dick Mato was there. You said you averaged 26 that year, fifth in the league. That was your third year. Fourth. Fourth year. Fourth in the league. Just to let me know. And then you had the ankle injury. And I look at your careers. I think I feel like that ankle injury kind of derailed you. Yeah, that was it. Now we're going to get to the cast, but Derek Rose is battling with. He's injured. Although I think really the battle is like I've been a superstar my whole career from the time I started playing basketball to now I think he's having trouble handling just being a pretty good player, but not a star. How tough is that? Because you had to go through that from being this potential superstar to you know, just a really good player. Yeah, average player. I mean, the good part between me and Derek Rose, he got big contracts. Okay, he got the big contract. He's having it right now. So you know what? He can be bad all he wants. But then when he go check that bank account statement, it's like, oh, okay. They still coming in to make it a little bit better. So you don't have to go play for a contract. I would have got after I got hurt and got out of Dallas. I was playing for contracts. So you're so I got hurt. That was before the rookies game. So it was before the rookie still. So I was still on my original six year deal. So this is my third year and 51 games into the season is ironic too. We're playing in New Jersey and back then it was these Hirachi shoes. Really soft that Michigan was wearing. So Nike wanted me to wear them. And I was like, man, I, you know, we're superstitious as athletes. You know that I always wore my same shoes. And I'm and I'm at I'm warming up and I'm like, these shoes are too soft. I need to change them. I said, you know what? I'm going to go through the first half and I'm going to change at halftime. Manya just come off a 44 point game another night against Washington. So I'm saying that halftime I'm going to change my shoes. Within seven, eight minutes of the game is when I tore my ankle. You know, coming across on Chris. We are stepped on, uh, on Jason Williams foot. So now back then too. So it was a third degree sprain. They said it would have been better if I'd have broke it because it, it would have healed. Is that the kind Brent Grant Hill had? Well, he had the pain. He broke his and he had pins in here. But they said it would have been it would have healed better. Bone heals better than ligament. Once the ligament is stretched. Anytime you sprain an ankle, you stretch your ligament. But it's the degree in which you stretch it. So I'm a, I'm a right handed player. I go off my left foot. I have no explosion. So that whole, and this is getting the Derrick Rose. I'm at the cusp of being, I'm at the fourth leading score. I'm the top scoring guard in the league. And again, Michael Jordan went into the league at that time. Okay. So you had Shaquille, Carl Malone, Elijah one, me. You don't, and then mash. Yeah. Okay. So we're right there. And when that happens, you figure, okay, rehab, you get it together. But the rehab back then and therapy, not like it is now. So it took so much longer. And I lost strength in my knee. My, my, my, to this day, I still got atrophy kind of in my, my thigh. And, but the mental part of going from. You're at this high level. Okay. To not playing there anymore is people don't understand it is. And it is a catch 22 too, because I always think about what I never got a chance to play in the playoffs when I was at my best, when I was kind of like in the spot to do something. So I can only imagine what that feels like. Because I never had it. Derrick Rose was at the high. I still to see that dunk when he dunked on, I forget who it was for Phoenix all two feet, joggage, you know what I mean? I mean, it just, that was him. And then to go from that in a, in a period of time where it was injury after injury. And now people question in your game, they're questioning this, you're questioning whether you can still get it done. You have your highs and lows. I talked about the contract, throw it out to window because it don't mean anything. As much as I was joking about it, because internally, you feel, you still feel you have something to prove and you can be viable and valuable, but you're not the same player. So you played against Jordan and Cope. Yep. How do you compare playing against both of those guys? I mean, the prop, see the thing is in the league, when you're that good, you can't guard anybody one-on-one. I mean, it's impossible. Even with the rules is back then when you can be physical, that you got to have good help. I don't care. When I was scoring, I was going to get my points. Because I was going to have volume shots. I was going to get to the free throw line. So my whole thing was, how can I make you less efficient? Because I'm like, you're going to touch it too many times. What I love the bottom was they made you compete at a high level because they brought it from the beginning. The aura around Michael when I first played, I tell you, when the first time I played against Chris, it was funny. Because I've known him before then. Okay. So you knew him personally? Working at his basketball camp when I was coming out of college. He actually called me before when I was getting drafted, trying to get me going the day before. But it was funny. I played against him because my rookie year, he was gone. Okay. Well, by the time I got there, after holding out, we had already played Chicago. Okay. So my second year was the 93-90, I mean- It was his first retirement. First retirement. So when I finally got a chance to play against him, on the court, that's what I got, man. It was like, I wasn't scared because I can compete, but it was surreal. It was like when nobody else on the arena, you couldn't hear no noise. It was just me and him. The crowd was gone. It was a weird moment because this is somebody, you looked up to what you saw and you finally got to get on the court and play with them. And at that time, the Bulls just seemed like they were different. You know what I mean? That was, was that the year they won 72? Yeah. They just felt, when they walked in the building, it just felt different. Wow. You know what I mean? It was their NBA and then it was ours. Totally different, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Did he, now when you went against him, did he treat you like- A rookie? I know you, but so what? Did he just go right at you? No, he went right at me. And we used to have epic battles of talking back and forth. Really? Yeah, oh, epic. So you were a trash talker? Oh, big time. If you talk to me. Okay. So ironically, when we got traded to Jersey, me and Sam could sell the 96-97 season. We beat him. Was that the year in the playoffs? No, no, it was the regular season. John Calipari was the rookie coach. We beat him in Jersey. I had like 25, 20, Sam at 20. You know, we talk it. We go back to Chicago and we plan and I'm guard Mike and we talk it. So he is a nice little fader where he's running to the corner and Steve Javid, the official at the time is talking. Mike was like, man, why you didn't call the foul? You should have called the foul. Steve was like, and we're standing in the corner. Steve was like, well, I thought you was going to blow by him. I said, blow by who? I said, I didn't guard him. He said, JJ, you can't guard me. You can't guard me. So we start going back and forth, but I ended up with 33. He had 28. I think we lost. But after the game, we're walking out the huddle and Joe Klein, who played with the Bulls before he was with us in Jersey, said, man, leave my young fellow alone. He said, no, me and JJ cool, but tell him that's why he wearing my shoes. Were you playing in Jersey? I was playing in Jump Man at the time. I said, yup, and I'm not changing me. Yeah, but it was the best, man. And Colby, Colby, and I don't think, I think, what do you think about Colby? What do you think he ranks? I did my top 10 when he got his Jersey retire. I had him seventh. Now I get my top 10. At 10, I had, I'll go into the other one. I had Jordan number one, LeBron two, Kareem three, Magic four, Wilt five, Shaq six. You had Shaq before Colby? The reason, the way I picked between those two, because I had Colby seven, was if I had to start a team, I would take Shaq. Eight was Russell, Bill Russell, nine was Bird, and 10 was Duncan. Duncan, yeah? Here's the thing about, and I see this about Colby, or we say the greatest player. When you talk about the greatest player, Kareem, his name gets brought up, but it's not with the same fervor, not with the same energy. Colby the same way. And my take on it is this, is that they're two very similar people, personalities. Colby and Kareem. Because during their tenure, during their career, he was contentious with the media, and people didn't really like them. So when you don't like a person like that, you're not going to really pull for them, or give them the benefit of the doubt and certain things. Because there's no way that you, talk about the greatest winner ever, is Kareem from high school, college, to the NBA. Yeah, most MVP. Most MVP. You changed the game of no dunking in college because of him, okay? The most unstoppable shot in the history of the game was Kareem. All-time league, but yet and still, we don't hold him in that same regard as a Jordan or Braun. Because he didn't have the fascination, or he didn't have the likability factor from media, and a lot of fans. Same thing with Colby. Colby, you think about what he was able to accomplish. Five championships. He only had one MVP. Should have got it in 06-06. Yeah, that's crazy. He should have got it back to back years. Yeah, and him and Shaq only got two combined. Now, I played with Steven Nass when they got it back to back. When Colby, that second one, Colby should have got. He should have got. He had 30 plus points. And he wasn't even, because I think Shaq finished second in the voting that year. And Colby, did they make the playoffs? Was that the year? I played on the team. We lost. We were up 3-1 on Phoenix and lost. That's a whole other story. It sounds to me like you got Kareem 1 and Colby 2. Well, no. No, it's going to be tough to deny LeBron once he's done as to me. Over Jordan, you think? Really. See, I think what LeBron, I don't think he's just going after stats right now, but I do think part of him understands I'm not going to get 6. And even if I do, I've lost a lot of finals. Yeah. So I'm not going to equal Jordan in terms of winning, but I can endorse him in terms of individual strength. Here's the thing though. If LeBron plays, let's say his prime goes 17 or 18 years, and he's only got three rings. At some point people might look at it like, well, you played all these years in your prime and you still only got three rings, you know? That could rank against him. Kareem got 6. He got bunch. I just think that's a part of it. I don't think it's just about the rings. I think that's a part of it. It's just a part of it then. What's going to be the separator then? If you take Mike's 6, let's say LeBron gets one more. Okay. So that would be one, two. Four. That would be four. He's two behind. But he holds all the other records. He's been able to take multiple teams to a final. He has had the best talent all the time, you know, early on. Yeah, yeah. So what's going to be the separator? What's going to make you skew towards Michael or skew towards LeBron if it's not just built on champion? Because the argument on championship, you're going to give it to Mike. But everything else? We ain't seen what we see with LeBron. Yeah, not like LeBron. Not like LeBron. Now it's, it's, so where you got Kobe then? I got, I got Kobe in my top 10. I got him around for what he's accomplished, around six. Okay. I mean, I still, I love Duncan. Duncan is different because Duncan has to rely on, the centers are always hard because you've got to rely on somebody to give you the ball. You know, with a guard, you can go get it. Center, you're so relied upon. I need to get post position. I need to get this and you need a good guard. And you need a good guard with a, you know, so it's a little bit different. But I, I mean, I play with Kobe at his attitude, man. His, the way he approached and attacked the game was just crazy. What was it talking about being his teammate? Because, you know, you hear so hard driving. Okay. So it was different for you. So we had to, matter of fact, he still owe me $500 for a shooting game. And I told him that last year. And, you know, but I was older. So I, he had a different level of respect for you. But I could tell, you know, people, teammates walked around on eggshells around him a little bit because he was so demanding in some aspect. But I think, you know, the ironic part is that you come to this sense of reality of finalization. Whereas you get older and that your career is winding down. And you start to look back at who you were as a person and you mature and you do things a little bit differently. When I was on the team, we would be on the team playing. We sit up front and Kobe kind of would sit in the back, kind of separated. So it's tough to be a leader when you're not really interacting with the group like that. You know, after practice guys mess around in locker room, Kobe be out. So during a tough situation in the game, when you need, it's really hard for somebody that's disconnected on a social and personal level. I'm not saying you got to be best friend. Bird and Mikhail weren't best friends. But you have to have some kind of interaction team-wide. I think as he got older in his career, he realized that's the part that probably was missing for him. You know, and I say this too, he was dealing with a lot. Think about this. And I said this, his last game, when he scored 60, what was it? 60 on 50 shots. Yeah, I was at the game. I was about to leave in the third goal. I was like, hold up. Last game, and his retirement celebration. He had the Jersey Refinery. Did you notice anything that was missing? His parents. That's right. Yeah. And that was around, was that around the time when you were there? They did. Yeah, I mean, because you had the issue with his mom with the memorabilia, some of the stuff, you know, some riffs going on in regards to the father. I knew his sister really well. And at the beginning, they were always at the game. So imagine the career he's had. You deal with the incident of Denver. You got the incident. Now you got the whole family makeup. So you, last game of your career, no acknowledgement. Nobody's there from your family, your retirement Jersey, your retirement celebration. Nobody's there. So you never know what a guy is dealing with internally, or why he may isolate himself and be secluded. Kobe came from Italy, came to Philly, didn't fit in. Basketball was his refuge. This is how I'm going to get it done. Didn't relate to the neighborhood guys that much. So what do you do? Seclude himself. You go right to the NBA. You don't have a chance to go to college to kind of get that broadened perspective of team. You go to the NBA, the 18 grown men, you have no relate relationship with them or how can you relate? So what do you do? You isolate yourself. So people don't really look at it like that in regards to his path and why he did things. And I kind of understood it. I was fortunate to spend time with Kobe. We go out to eat and talk. Bodyguards look at me like, you know, Kobe, don't do this. You know, I'm like, man, I'm gonna, I love going on my team. But I got a better, not that we talked about everything in depth, but I got a better sense of why and how and the thought process. So I look at them a lot differently. Well, that's good stuff. Man, let's get to some of the modern current NBA. What's going on? Isaiah Thomas made his debut Tuesday against Portland. You know what? A lot of people say they're surprised that he came back and played the way he did. I'm not from the perspective. You got so much enthusiasm, energy that you will call him play hard. Now, how do you play after that? How do you, how does your body respond? Okay. To the more wear and tear. Once that adrenaline level comes down. If you're playing on straight adrenaline. Yeah. Okay. And plus guys haven't seen him play in a while. So they, oh yeah, I remember, but I ain't seen him. So now the Scouting Report ain't there. Okay. They know what he wanted to do, but it's a different situation here in Cleveland than it was in Boston when he was the primary ball hammer. So I was happy for him because you could see that sense of relief of finally, I'm back on the court. And I think you saw the good body language. You know, from the cat. Yep. Oh, we got another playmaker. Now how he moves forward, especially on back-to-back games is going to be important because your body has to go through that transition of getting acclimated to playing that hard, that fast in a short time period. But I thought the debut, come on man, you could, what was it, 17 points in 19 minutes? Yep. Yep. Plus 17 with him on the floor. That's what I'm saying. So it's, again, I'm pro players from that perspective because I've been hurt before and I get it. You know. What do you think will be the biggest obstacle to him and LeBron excelling together? Or you think it'll be simple? Well, never simple when you used to handling the ball. You play point, right? Yep. Okay. Imagine the ball being out of your hand. Okay, in situations where last year in Boston, which was tough because it was easier to guard Boston last year because you knew Isaiah was the playmaker. So you can, that's why, you know, Cleveland, you can take him out of it. Yep. Because he had no one else. But he was so used to having to do this, get guys in. This year, it's going to be a little bit different. But I think he's ex, I don't, we don't know yet, but I think he's accepted his role in regards to he knows that at times he's going to have it. But at times I can be as effective on the wing after LeBron swings it to me than I can catch and go. So that's a different mindset. I think they can be better. Now Kyrie was the best player in that trade. But I think when you add in Jay Crowder, I think they could be better than they were last year. What's your thought on that? The team is much better. So you think Cleveland's team, they obviously the bench too. Think about the manipulation, the lineups you can have. If you really want to go at Golden State and force them to have to guard you, you can have five three-point shooters. You can have LeBron, Isaiah, Korver, Kevin Love, and who am I missing? Maybe J.R. or Crowder or J.R. Or Crowder or J.R. So now you've got five guys that you can spread out. And Jeff Green can... Now if you want to go a little bit bigger, more physical, you can have D.Way. Say LeBron is off the court, which was an issue at the time. But you've got D.Way, I.T., Tristan. Okay, you can have J.R. in there. You know what I mean? That can defend and do something. And Jeff Green, so you've got more lineups depending on what you want to do. If you want to play more of a bigger physical and have LeBron get some rest, you can still have enough score and punch to do something without losing them. But now we can be more physical and rebound. If you want straight shooters, I can go with this lineup. So I think this year they've manipulated it enough where now they're not just stuck with one. I'll tell you who benefited the most. Well, Isaiah being out is Kevin Love. Yep, exactly. I mean... So you think... You sound like you think they got a decent shot against Golden State. I do. Because when they beat Golden State, they were able to be more physical. You think about the lineups I talked about. These guys can be physical and the playoffs, as you know, they're going to let you get away with something, in particular, off the ball. So where they were physical with Golden State, it wasn't when Steph got it a lot of time. Steph and Clay, when they had to fight off the picks and disrupt the timing, that's when they kind of threw Golden State off a little bit. And now, I think Cleveland has the players to do it. You can stop Doran, bro. Some dudes, you just not go stop. But the other guys, I think you can make them less efficient. And again, you got to think about how you go, always think about this, Chris. How can I win in a seven game series? It's not two, not one. How can I win in seven games? And they kind of built the lineup. I think if they say healthy, that this could be real intriguing. You feel like it's definitely Golden State versus Cleveland. In the finals, no question. Because Houston, Houston doing the same thing that we figured out they'll do. Defense go fail. I love Chris Paul being there. He's going to be at a guard a lot better from the point guard position. But because the emphasis for Dan Tony is not on correcting the little things during the course of the year, that it comes back to haunt you later on. Again, one game, Houston got to watch out. Two games. If it was a five game series, like it used to be back in the day in the first few rounds. Two out of three. You know what I mean? Oh, but a seven game series. I got to rely on my mind to say Houston is going to be disciplined enough in seven games, in a seven game series. Now, what do you think about Oklahoma? They've turned 1-12 in their last 17. You think they can be a threat in the West? Just imagine if they're the fourth or fifth in the West. I think they beat Minnesota 4-5. That's what I'm saying. But that's perfect for them. Yeah. Okay. That's perfect. Now, if you're a golden state, you really don't want to see them at four. Second round. You see what I'm saying? You got to exert a lot of energy in the second round. And it's going to be its emotional energy because of Durant and Westbrook. So you're going to have to answer these questions. Forget about the game part of it. Anything that goes on between Westbrook, like we saw before, you're going to have to answer it. So not only are you dealing with the physical aspect of just two teams that got 10 on going on, you got to deal with the mental part of it. Okay. And that wears you down. So you rather, not to go and say the scared of it, but you rather have them be in that fifth position than that fourth or bump up the three. I mean, Houston could get the one, the one seed. So you play with Iverson, who's been compared to Westbrook. I think there's some similarities. How challenging is it to play with a guy that's, you know, like that? I had a ball playing with AI, honestly. The challenge is that he thinks he can do it by itself. But it goes back on the organization too because the organization, think about how they flip the script. They traded Tim Thomas. They traded Jerry Stackhouse. This is in Philly. I got traded. So they surrounded him. And this is not knocking any guys. You had Eric Snow, Aaron McKee, Tyrone Hill. George Lynch. George Lynch. You had Joe Smith in there, but you had complimentary guys that didn't need the ball. They did all the dirty work and they let AI be AI. Again, the game was different at that time because you could be more physical. The three point shot wasn't as prevalent, but they built the team around AI that complimented what he wanted to do. What were you mentioning, Iverson? What's your best AI story that you can tell? Oh, man. I mean, I got, I mean, I'll tell you what, AI used to come to the game with McDonald's, man. I mean, in a lot of French fries, big man. I mean, and after every game, he'd love to go to Fridays too. Yeah. I'd love to go to Fridays, right? But I mean, I'm like... City road. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The blue line and everything out there. He just, he can go hang and do what he wanted to do, but one thing AI never did, he didn't miss games, man. And if he was tired, it didn't matter. He was bringing it, you know? So I was just like, man, this dude is different. No, seriously, I mean, the way he competed, you know, and I used to go back and forth with him a lot of times, like, though, you and Larry Brown, this thing, you're not going to beat him, but figure out within your game how you get your game off. Don't pick more picking roles. Do this. You ain't going to win that battle. And it was headstrong between the two of them. Yeah, yeah. But eventually AI, once they figured it out, he always talks in reverence, high regard to Larry Brown now. This is his best year. What's more important to guys? And I know it's different. It depends. It depends. It depends on who you are and where you're at in your career. When you're young, you feel like you've got to prove yourself. And being a man, meaning I've got to prove myself. You know what I mean? Which you do, you want to get that max deal. Yeah. You want to become an all-star. All-star, yeah, yeah, yeah. So winning is balanced with I've got to make sure I get mine. My thing is you've got to be selfish. Trust me. To be good. But you've got to be selfish in the right way where it doesn't hurt your team. That's the difference. We all selfish in some aspect. You selfish in your career as far as broadcast. Listen, you want to be the best. You want to see yourself in the top seat. What's wrong with that? In order to be the best you can be, you've got to push yourself and be a little selfish to say what you want. It's no different than a basketball player. So when people are talking about being selfless, come on, man, stop it. There's no way you're going to be the guy you want to be without having some selfishness. But it just can't spill over and hurt the team. What about LeBron? Best move for him this summer? My best move would be Sadie Cleese. Because he got so much control. And they're close. Are they close? They're close. Go beat them. You're talking about Boston still. With Tatum and Brown, young. Bring Gordon Hayward back. That's fine. They're still young, especially this year. If he goes where? You going to Houston? Trust me, he'll play for Mike and be upset about the little stuff. No, seriously. Yeah, because he made LeBron, he said. Come on, man. Because he's not going to settle for mediocrity. And that's what Mike gives you from a defensive perspective and execution. And he doesn't hold anybody accountable. Okay, great to play for. So where do you go that gives you the control? He won't go to San Antonio. You don't get a control. At all. Now I've said, I think if LeBron had played for Pat Riley, a Greg Popper, or Phil. Early? Probably early. But to be honest, at any point in his career, I think he'd have more ranks. Because I think they would have been able to really coach you. What do you think about when he came in? It was Silas? Yup, Silas then, who was it? Mike Brown? Mike Brown, afterwards. So Silas was kind of on his way out. Mike was coming in, so he had to adhere. Yeah. And Mike was more of a defensive minded coach. He got this unbelievable talent. I haven't coached at a high level. He doesn't probably have the respect for me. So yeah, you're right. I think he would have been more disciplined. They would have probably formed the team a little bit differently, too. Those early years in Cleveland. You know what I mean? I had a chance to, and I know playing for those coaches, what it's like being held accountable. Pat Riley, just going at Alonzo. Some debate now seems to be between who's the best player in the world now. Is it LeBron, or is it Kevin Durant? Stop it, man. I'm with LeBron by hair, though. I think it's getting closer. Yeah, because LeBron getting older, too. Yeah, true. Of course, it should. It should. If LeBron is in his 15th year and KD, what is this? 10th? 10th or not? 11th? Okay, it should be, because KD is that kind of talent. We should be saying it's a 1A and 1B, but it's ironic that that 1A is in his 15th year. Exactly, that's unbelievable. Can you imagine this? I can imagine I never got hurt. A significant injury. Where am I? I'm not going to say I'll be LeBron or something, but I can just imagine. In my mind, I'm LeBron. You know what I mean? In my mind, not being hurt. That is, in today's game, how hard they play and the training aspect. Yeah, it gets you better, but you're training a lot more, so you're putting more wear and tear in your body at an earlier age, too. Come on. You haven't had significant, and you're still playing. No, he does have a quick first step. Sometimes he has the problem finishing at that time, but that's 15 years. Exactly. But you're still saying that he's slightly above KD. Is the other best player who's really in his prime? I'm with you. I mean, and I love KD. And people say, well, because he came out of high school. No, because there's a lot of guys that came out of high school, and their careers end early. They might have played 10 or 12 years, but no, they ain't like McGrady, Eddie Curry. Eddie Curry. Al Harrington had a long career, but you know, a lot of guys come out. But even on the back end, give Kevin O'Neill. Give Kevin O'Neill. On the back end of his career, he slowed down. You can see the difference. Yo, Garnett. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can see it when he was in Boston near the end. You can see the difference even when he went back to Minnesota. Yep. But this dude is still at a, I think he might be from Jupiter or Mars somewhere. Seriously, man. Seriously. It's unbelievable. I mean, and you can have that debate. I just love it because what he's done for the game. And again, you don't have to be a LeBron James to understand the impact on what he's done in regards to the social content that he's brought, the awareness, the ability for players to say, I can be an entrepreneur in my space and still play. Whereas when I played, it was taboo to want to do something else outside of the sport. He's opened up all these avenues for people to be able to emulate that. You know what I mean? In their own way. And they are. And so, and I tell people all the time, if you're listening to this, watching this, you take greatness for granted until it's gone. Okay. Because we're seeing this, we're so accustomed and we're so used to it. And now it's like, well, LeBron, I'm tired of, now can you be tired of greatness? You get tired of it. And when it goes away, you start thinking, that's why we relish to Michael Jordan years. Because we're so accustomed to that greatness. And we took it for granted. And now that it's gone, we wish we could relive a lot of that. Well, enjoy it. The Golden State Warriors, how they play. That's greatness. You know what I mean? LeBron James of what he's able to do. Stop knocking this hustle on other stuff and enjoy what he's doing and appreciate it. We're going to miss it. There's no question. I mean, fortunately, it looks like it's going to be here for a little while longer. It's going to be here for a little while longer. Jim Jackson, man. Great job. Yes, right. OH10. OHIO, I should say. I'm embarrassing. All right. Peace. All right. Here we are. Once again for Knock Down Jay with my man, Jason Mack. It's our happy new year, man. Happy new year, Chris. Good to be back. You're looking better in 2018. With a little fly this year. You looked a little sloppy in 2017. Now you're looking better. I'm trying to step up my game, man. New Year's Resolution. That's the resolution. Yes, that's one of them. You should. The other one should be to try to hold your own in Knock Down Jay. Because I've been knocking you down. You have been. But I get back up every time. Okay. All right. What you got for me? All right. So I want to get started with Isaiah Thomas. The big story this week in the NBA. Cavs at Boston. Isaiah returns. And the big story was the tribute video for Isaiah Thomas. Chris, I got to say, this was puzzling to me. One of the most storied franchises in NBA history. Most titles in the league. And you're giving a tribute video to a guy who spent two and a half years there and didn't get to a championship. Didn't win anything. Wasn't the MVP of the league, Chris? I like Isaiah Thomas. I know he's revered in Boston. I don't think he deserved a tribute video. Well, they didn't give him a tribute video, but they will. They said they plan to in the future. He didn't want it because his family wouldn't be there. I get it. In most cases, you wouldn't give a tribute video to a guy who's only been there two years, especially if he didn't lead you to a championship. Especially in Boston, whereas you said, it's all about titles. However, looking at what he did last year, basically 29 points a game, second most points per game in Boston Celtics history behind Larry Bird. When you consider the great players they've had play there, he was second. That's something to shout about. Okay. A nice innovation. Fifth in MVP voting last year leads them to the number one seed over LeBron James in the Eastern Conference. Leads them to the Eastern Conference finals. Plays one day after his sister is tragically killed in an auto accident. Scores 33 points in that game. Then, not even a month later on what would have been her 23rd birthday, drops 53. I remember that game. And he's five nine. Yes. So I think all of that plus the emotion that he showed when he was traded. I mean, it hurt him. He loved being in Boston. It had become his team. The fans loved him. I think all of that conspired to lead the Celtics to do this tribute video. I'm with you. Look, don't retire his number. That would be ridiculous. That was going to be my next thing. Are you going to retire his number? No, no. If this was a retirement, Jersey retirement or something like that, I'd be with you. But a video tribute. It's not a big deal. Kyrie Irving get a tribute video. Well, Kyrie demanded a trade. Kyrie Irving hit one of the most clutch shots in the organization's history in game seven of the NBA finals. He won it out. He demanded a trade. Like that's a totally different thing. Isaiah Thomas loved being in Boston, didn't want to go. Kyrie demanded a trade. OK, so Paul George spent six or seven years in Indiana, got to two Eastern Conference finals. Demanded a trade. I mean, come on. So that's where you draw the line. It's the difference between you broke up with me. You dumped me. They dumped their franchises. Kevin Durant had an amazing run in OKC. If you dumped me, that's what happened. So OK, so if you leave voluntarily or ask to be traded, no tribute video. And if you get traded, you'll get a tribute video. When are we going to see that Zach Levine, Zach Levine, however his name is pronounced, are we going to see a video tribute for him in Minnesota? He won two dunk contests. Are you comparing? OK, so you're comparing winning a dunk contest. I was kind of joking. Yeah, because you got nothing left. Jimmy Butler. You ready to move on? I'm not ready to destroy your argument. Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler, does he get a tribute video in Chicago? He may. I don't know. Have they been back? They've probably been back. I'm sure. I don't know if he did. I guess he didn't. That's a fair question. I would not. I would not give. You know, if they gave Jimmy Butler a tribute video, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. It's just it's a video. It's again, it's not a Jersey retirement. It's not giving him a trophy. At the same time, Isaiah is being very petty about this. Like, how's he been? You guys kicked me to the curb. He could have come back tonight. His first game against Boston, but he said, oh, no, I'm going to come back against the Blazers and I'm going to skip the Boston game. And then the next time, although I think it's more on the Cavs than it is on the next time the Cavs go to Boston, it's the Paul Pierce ceremony. So they can't do Isaiah. Then it just seems like Isaiah is making too much out of this. Maybe it's me and I don't. It is you. I'm not hating on Isaiah. It is you because I think it's more on the Cavs deciding when he's going to play than it is on Isaiah. I mean, look, this is a guy that, as I said, played on the birthday of his sister who was tragically killed. This is a guy who's five nine and has to overcome all those obstacles to be a great player. This is a guy that played through a hip injury that was far worse than anybody knew. And you're going to question his mental toughness because that's what you're questioning. You're questioning that he couldn't go back to Boston. Well, he couldn't face him. Well, he's already said he cannot stand Danny Angie. He may never talk to him again. But that's got nothing to do with your mental toughness. You don't think it's being petty? He should want to get out there and battle the former team. I don't care about being petty. I care about, are you mentally tough? And this guy is shown time and time again. He is mentally tough. You're making me out to be an Isaiah Thomas hater. And that's not true. I like him. I just have an issue with tribute videos. And I draw the line at two and a half years in Boston, not winning Jack squat. And let's move on. They had the number one seed. Oh, Kyrie, how about Kyle Lowry? I hope you got a tribute video. I hope your next argument is better than your first. All right. Let's get to the next one. Um, knock down. I know you are. Get up, Jack. I know you're a Cleveland guy. You are Mr. Ohio. I live there. You know, you listen. All city in basketball. All city. Wow. I did not know that. Can we look at it? Can we get the research team just to confirm that? I know you love LeBron. I love LeBron. I enjoy watching him. I said, I believe last time, this is the best season LeBron's ever had. But right now, Chris, right now, he's not the best player in the NBA. The better, better, the best player in the NBA right now is Kevin Durant, the better offensive player. Kevin Durant versus LeBron. Kevin Durant, the better defensive player. Kevin Durant versus LeBron. Kevin Durant, the more clutch player who dominated in the finals, in the fourth quarter when it mattered. Kevin Durant. He's playing fewer minutes than LeBron, so don't come at me with points per game, okay? He's playing fewer minutes. He is right now, Kevin Durant, the best player in the NBA. So are you saying Kevin Durant's better than LeBron, period? Right now. Because you said this is the best season of LeBron's career. And it's the best season of his career. He's not even the best player in the league. Then that must mean you think Kevin Durant's better. The best season when you take into account his teammates and his age and his durability. But when you're just saying the best player in the NBA right now, Kevin Durant's the best player. First of all, it's not LeBron's best season. We've already talked about that because defensively he's not close to what he used to be. He's actually a negative defensive, real plus minus. So clearly he's not the defender he used to be. It's close. I'll give you that. Like for the first time in about a decade, it's close. No, seriously. I mean, LeBron's been the best player in the league. Unanimous MVP, Steph Curry. Sorry. MVP, is Russell Westbrook the best player in the league? He wasn't unanimous. Still. It doesn't matter. Proceed with your argument. Try to try to not upset him. Nobody thought Steph was the best player in the league. All right. He was MVP. There's a difference. Here's the deal. It is close for the first time in about a decade. But I think it's their neck and neck, but I would give LeBron still the slight edge. Here's why. But first, let me give you Durant's advantages. He is a better defender at this stage of his career. Leap most blocks in the NBA. Third in the league in blocks per game. I give him mad credit with LeBron's age and Durant stepping it up on the defensive end. He is a better defender. He's obviously a better shooter. There's no ifs, ands, or buts about that. And while LeBron, you know, his statistics bear out that he is a clutch guy, I would rather have the ball in Durant's hands. If I got a last play, because he's just a better shooter. Unstoppable. And LeBron likes to take a three at the end of the game. And I'd rather have Durant taking that three than LeBron. However, here's why I would take LeBron James. Number one, LeBron still controls the tempo of a game unlike anybody in the league. Period. The end. Look at the score of that game on Christmas Day. 99-92 Golden State. Low scoring game. One of the Golden States' lowest scoring games of the year. Curry didn't play. Curry didn't. But still, they were running up, tons of points even without Curry. The difference is that against LeBron, he's the one player in the league, player. Spurs can do it. Grizzlies have done it. But one player in the league that can slow the Warriors down and make them play a slower game. He did it in 2015 without Kyrie and Love when they almost won that finals. He did it in 2016 when they did win the finals. So Durant cannot control the tempo of a game like LeBron can. Secondly, we know it's not even a question. LeBron is a far better facilitator and passer. Now Durant did do an admirable job of kind of running the team when Steph was out. I think he's averaging five assists per game. That's better than admirable. Okay, LeBron is averaging nine. Yes, LeBron's a better person. LeBron for his career average is close to eight. So again, he's getting more guys involved, more of a facilitator. And while Durant is a better shooter without question, LeBron is far, far more efficient. It's not even close. LeBron James is shooting 56% from the floor with Kevin Love as his second option. In other words, without any other teammate who can create his own offense, LeBron is shooting 56, 57%. Durant, check this out. Without Steph, Durant was shooting 46% from the field. He shot over 50% or 50% or better in only four of the 11 games without Steph. I was at the Lakers game where Durant hit the great game winner. But prior to that, my goodness, it was eye-opening how tough it was for him to get his buckets. And he got dunked down by your boy Larry Nett. Yeah, for him to get his buckets. Durant has always had the luxury of playing with another appoint guard who is a tremendous shot creator, Westbrook. You got to pay attention to Westbrook. Steph, you obviously have to pay attention to Steph. So Durant's had that luxury without one of them, i.e., in LeBron's situation, he's not that efficient of a score. 46, 47% is good, but it's not tremendous like LeBron. Finally, Durant's per P.E.R. I know you're a big P.E.R. guy. I'm not a big P.E.R. guy. 24.9, I think. What's LeBron? 30? LeBron's 30. LeBron's second in the league. Durant's 12th in the league. Second on his own team. Steph is fourth in the league at 29. I would make the argument. Now, Kevin Durant is the Warriors' best player. Best player. But I would say their most important player is Steph Curry. Because of the way he stretches the defense, they play that fluid ball movement, player movement offense when Steph's in there. When Steph was gone, they weren't playing that way. There were a lot more ice or a lot playing like everybody else. So for all those reasons, You still give the extra line. I would still give the slight edge. Just close. But I would give the slight edge to LeBron. And I think after what I just said, you would too. No, I mean, I would agree it's close. But I just want to go back. I've never heard you that quiet. Well, I mean, that was a lot. That was about three minutes. That was a good three-minute argument. I guess I want to go back to your second point was, you know, listen, LeBron is playing with vastly inferior players. Okay. He's passing to Iman Shumpert and Jose Calderon is his point guard. So from that perspective, I would agree. But when they go head-to-head, Chris, game three, Durant torches him in the finals. He's gotten the best of him. Christmas day, head-to-head, end of the game. Maybe there's a foul. We can argue that, but Durant locked him down. Well, no, we can't argue that. That's definitive. They missed the call. The ref's admitted. That's a foul. Wow. I mean, come on. I mean, it was a foul. It was a foul on every play. It was two fouls on that play and a third foul with a minute 10 left. I just feel head-to-head right now. I give the edge to LeBron. He's gotten the best of him. Clearly got the best of him on Christmas day. And I do give Durant credit for taking the challenge of guarding LeBron. Because Dremy is your best defender. That's like me sitting in this chair. Nobody wants to battle you on NBA. And I'm like, I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. All right. Let's move on to our final topic. Heavy on the Eastern Conference this week, Chris. You know, we're looking at what's going on in the East. And I think without question, there is only one threat to the Cavaliers. One. Not your wizards. Not your 76ers. How's Joe L&B do to it? Is he all right? I'm just checking in. He's the man. He's doing it. He's the best big man in the league. So the only threat to the Cleveland Cavaliers in the East is the Boston Celtics, led by the best coach in the East, Brad Stephens. The best player outside of LeBron in the East, Kyrie Irving. Really? He's buried in a dead of Combo? Yes. What is a two to Combo done in a place? Playoffs. Let me finish my argument. Best coach, best player, best bench, number one defensive efficiency team in the league in the Boston Celtics. And I believe when you add all that up, they are the only threat to the Cavs. There is no threat to the Cavs in the East. None. I'm sorry. No. Boston is not a threat at all. At all. Not a threat at all. They will get waylaid in the playoffs. What? For three or for two? At best for two. At best. It will not be, the series won't be in question. There won't be a point where we're like, oh my, they might beat the, they're not, who's the best player in that series? LeBron. Okay. Who's the second best? Kyrie. Okay. Who's the third best? Jason Tate. Jason Tate. He's Brandon Kevin Love. I'm kidding. Okay. Kevin Love. No, no, what's the question? Who's the biggest threat? Or Isaiah Thomas, right? The Cavs have three of the four best players in the series, right? Right. And they got the best player and that player has a better supporting cast. So how are the Celtics beaten? I will. Because of Brad Stevens? But that's a horrible argument, Chris, because you were here saying the Houston Rockets, going at it in a different way. If you go down the roster, the Warriors have like four of the best five players in that series. So listen, the Celtics have the best shot. I'm just going at it a different way. You don't want to look at the numbers, the defensive efficiency. The way to slow them down is number one. So it's the most fifth in the league in defensive efficiency. And who's number one? The number one threat, the Celtics, and they have the better coach. Brad Stevens versus Tai Lu. Okay. That's a no-brainer. Stevens is better. By the way, who's saddling it? The players. Last year when they were going head to head and the Celtics were vastly inferior last year. I don't even think it was close. Kyrie on the left. It was vastly inferior this year. So they win one game without Isaiah Thomas. He didn't even play on that one. Marcus Smart went off. They went and the next game. Do you think the Cavs took that game? I mean, seriously. The next game. They let Sorano get two games a year before. I'm a couple. What happened in the game after Boston won? It was neck and neck in the fourth quarter. Who took over? Who went bananas? Not LeBron. Kyrie Irving. Okay. The Celtics have the most clutch. I would argue the most clutch player in the NBA. I believe he's number two in the clutch points so far this season. LeBron, you're guys number one, obviously. But I... But you would argue he's the most clutch player in the NBA. So who's the biggest threat to this? Who's the biggest threat to the Cavs? You want to edit that point out. No, no. That stands. He just nullified his whole statement. Kyrie, the most clutch player in the East, is going to lead the one team that can challenge the Cavs. The Celtics. Look, I love Kyrie. So you're saying you can't even name a team? They aren't that good. That on the Cavs' jock? You won't even name a team? I'm that down on the Eastern Conference. I'm sorry. It's a conference of pretty good and mediocre and bad teams. There's only one elite team in that conference, period of the end, and it's in Cleveland. Without Kyrie yet still, because Isaiah Thomas, I liked what I saw. Oh, 17 minutes. Hold me back, Chris. No, 17 points. So 17 points in 19 minutes. Oh my goodness. 19 minutes. Holy cow. Isaiah Thomas could be out the rest of the year, and I still would have said the same thing. Cleveland is just better. LeBron James is still in his prime. He's not losing to two, a 19-year-old and a 20-year-old, being the second and third best players, or two of the best four players you want to give out. We need the staff here to charge the time on this argument, because I'm going to revisit this in May, when this series is heated, and it's 1-1, or it's 2-1, I am telling you. Let me get to some of the points. I will ride with Tatum, Smart, Brown, Kairi, Brad Stevens. That team is going to give LeBron all he can handle, because remember, I believe it's a toss-up right now. Here's why, and I have argued this. Let me tell you something. When LeBron, hold on, it's your podcast, but I need to interrupt. LeBron will have to go through, I believe, the Sixers, which is not going to be easy. Embiid, you love Embiid. I'm not going to be easy. Let's throw a birthday party for Embiid. I'm not going to be easy. Ben Simmons and Embiid's going to give them some problems. Then Yannis and Round Two. Newsflash. Rookies don't win. I know, but it ain't going to be a cakewalk. And then in Round Two, Yannis, who I believe is the best 23-under player in the league, and then when they're a little worn down, this isn't the Hawks and the Joker Raptors. This is real. Young, good, talented players are going to push LeBron in the first two rounds. Boston is going to be there to challenge them. I think it's a toss-up. First of all, you have no idea how the seeding is going to play out. Well, I mean, in a perfect world. Philadelphia is Philadelphia not even in the playoffs. They're going to get it. Who knows if Boston will get the first seed? Can we do a segment on Detroit? Stan Van Gundy? Can I? I mean, so that argument, come on. Look, here's the deal. Boston got hot, started off 22 or four was great. Since then, they've been eight and six. They are closer, they are closer to the eight and 16 than they are 22 or 40. If I've got to pull out a gun and put it to your head and say who is the number one contender to the Cavs in the East, who is it? There is none. Oh, stop. Now, I will say this. Boston, Toronto, Washington. They're all on the same level. Toronto's got one of the best defenses in the league. Fifth, I told you, defensive efficiency. A better backcourt. Kyle Lowry is a very good defender. And I hadn't been great in the playoffs, but he will give Kyrie, you know, he'll make Kyrie work. Come on, think about this. When you see Toronto take the court against Lebron. These guys wet their pants, dude. And Boston didn't. They got so embarrassed. And Boston didn't. I'm just going to be most of them. I'm going to be most of them. A game that Cleveland basically gave away. And even getting the game. Warriors gave away a game in the finals. Five. There you go, Lebron. Here's some charity. That's fine. I mean, don't tell me a game. Don't brag about going five with somebody. That's what you're doing. Toronto has been to the Eastern Conference finals with this crew, with this backcourt of DeMar DeRosen and Kyle Lowry. They went to the second round last year. They are playoff experienced. I'm just saying they're on the same level as Boston. They won 14 of their last 17. Have played better than the Celtics for the past month. You're so trying to come lately. Washington just beat the Celtics. Celtics 8 and 6 in their last 14. Those two teams have the best backwards. What about the Rockets 1 and 5 in their last six? What are you bringing that up about your boys? Huh? Huh? Look, I think Toronto and Washington are right there with the Celtics. They're all three. They're all three on the same level. Washington, yeah. What? They're all three on the same level. Because they got a better backcourt. They got a very good backcourt. And then both of them got a couple of solid role players, or now a couple of few solid role players. OK. I'm not saying they beat Boston. I'm just saying they're on that level. Just to put a button on it, can you give me your pecking order, Boston, Toronto, Washington, in order? I'll probably, right now, I give Boston a sign. Boom! Well, no. This is why I'm here, people. But I'm not giving them. They're not a threat, though. If you want to say they're the second best team in the East slightly over Toronto, although Toronto's very close and they're charging, and I want to see how it plays out. And then Washington is fourth. I'm fine with that. My problem is saying Boston is a legitimate threat. Saying Boston's got a, it's neck and neck, and they got a shot. They don't. OK. They don't! I'm going to walk you. I haven't mentioned them at all. I mean, what? Yanis, Bloodstone. They could be a spoiler. One of the boring parts coming back, you know, sometime 2019 or something. All right, look, man, we might find out tonight, at least something. You know, maybe your boys will play them tough, you know. I didn't hurt you there, did I? No, no. You got some guns, though. I'll give you that. You know, maybe Boston will play them tough tonight. Maybe they beat them. If Boston wins tonight, do you think that means they're better? I will never beat that guy who takes a December or January win and puts any stock in it. Sorry, that's not how I- OK, well. You'll take two December wins, though. No, please. All right. But anyway, good job, man. Look, you're looking good in 2018. Thank you, thank you. I hope this is a new trend. It's a new trend for 2018. You're addressing better in 2018? Yes, yes. Because you were whacked. I'm going to wear an NBA jersey next week. That's coming to 2018. Next week, throwback time. I was about to take you off the zone just based on the way you dressed in 2017. Who are you going to replace me with? Ain't nobody want to sit up here and challenge you. Somebody with some better gear. True, true. But anyway, thanks a lot, man. Great job. Thanks for having me. Another episode of Knock Down Jay. And in the zone, in general, remember, go to iTunes, SoundCloud, Apple Podcast, subscribe, leave us a comment, leave us five stars. If you like what you hear, and we'll, of course, be back next week with another episode of In the Zone.