 Can you hear me? Oh, sorry. I was muted, Peter. Hey, how are you? How are you? I'll do great. Thank you. Great, great. You prepared for more wind and rain and storms? No. I don't want it. No, not much we can do about it. I know. But I moved to California in 2017. And if I tally it all up, I'm still net positive with great weather. Yeah, oh, for sure, for sure. Absolutely. Yeah, we get 90, whatever, percent great weather. Yeah, but this year it's just a bit much. But then again, I still don't want to complain because I keep hearing about tornadoes, hurricanes, and then I'm bored. For sure. Yeah, some bad wind and some rain is not the worst of it, certainly. Hey, John, hey, Tracy. Hey, Tracy. David, how are you doing? Good, how are you? Great, Tracy, good to catch up. Peter, good to catch up. OK, go ahead, David. No, no, no. Go ahead, jump right in, John. No, I just wanted to follow up on a couple of things. So, David, are we on onboarding this week, or are we talking about documentation this week? I mean, I think we could do both. I mean, the way I had set up the invite and we could clarify if we need to divide up and separate the invite. I mean, the invite is for both. My thought was you could do 30. And I think that we had discussed this, you could do like half and half, right? But I'll defer to you if you want to have one week be one and the other week be another. You certainly, we can change the invites, but I'll double check the invite. I think it's set up to be both. Yeah, and that's fine. I kind of wanted to just talk about the submissions to begin with. And I see Bobby's jumped on here now. So, I guess I'll kick it off and just start off with the onboarding submission. So, we've got that in and Peter is on that as well. Thanks for joining that, Peter, for the mentorship program there. Yeah. And so, the main thing, David, I wanted to check in with is I had pinged Arun a couple of times now around, you know, collaborating with him and the team that did the start here last year. Yeah. And I haven't heard back from him. So, I pinged, so we, yeah, we both took that as an action item last time. And yeah, I pinged him as well. He did respond to me on Discord. He may be, I don't know if you emailed him or not. He may be more responsive on Discord. He did ping me on Discord. He did say that Niku is still involved with Start Here. And if you see in the onboarding content task force channel, Niku did show up in Discord and say, hey, he couldn't make the last meeting. He wanted to see the meeting notes and stuff. So, it sounds like he may be interested. This may not be a good time for him, but so he's still involved with Start Here. I think he's certainly somebody that we could try to connect with. I think Arun maybe is less involved in Start Here now. I mean, Arun's obviously a busy person and, you know, has had some changes recently. So, he may be less involved in Start Here now, but Niku is probably the right person to reach out to. Either on again, if you've tried to email him, maybe try him on Discord. But, and then just to give Tracy and Bobby some background, if I remember correctly, they weren't on the last call, but I really liked what Peter had sketched out for the mentorship projects. Cause that was my concern. Like I don't, it wasn't exactly sure what we would have that person do, but I really liked Peter's idea of identifying the steps it takes for somebody to come to an entry point in the community, you know, say the Hyperledger website and how many clicks does it take for them to get to the, like how to contribute to, you know, a project, you know, information. And my, my kind of suspicion is that it's going to be several clicks, right? Like I don't, I haven't mapped it out myself yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's, you know, five or six clicks, right? And so I think identifying that and then having the mentorship be focused on reducing that number of clicks. So almost like a UX style mentorship. It kind of makes a lot of sense to me. Like, and then Bobby, thanks for putting that thoughts together that you put on the wiki. Like I think there may be some, just my feedback on kind of the notes you put, I think there may be some gaps in the documentation, but my kind of my initial gut, and I know we haven't as a task force kind of mapped out everything we want to do with onboarding. My initial gut is a lot of that documentation is there. It's just really hard to find. So I think in my mind, this mentorship is less a documentation project and more of a usability mentorship and to helping people find that documentation, right? Like so much exists, but it's so scattered and hard to find. So that's just my two cents, just to summarize our conversation last week. Yeah. And I think you and I are in alignment on that, David. I think we talked about, you know, making sure that the person has strong UI, UX skills. And in fact, you know, if you look at what the mentorship submission was, you know, it focused a lot around that as well. So I think if we can, you know, get that approved and, you know, have Peter engage and I will reach out to Niku right now and make sure that, you know, he wants to join in as part of that mentorship. That'd be great. And then anyone else, you know, on the call who wants to join into it, you know, you're always welcome to do that as well. That's great. And then I think all the pieces are there. We have Peter, one of the project maintainers. We would have Niku from start here, you know, we'd have us, you know, and then I think, you know, I think we would be able to do, have a pretty good project. Yeah. Okay, perfect. Bobby, you want to talk a little bit about the other submission that we did for the documentation side on the mentorship program. I see Bobby puts on the chat. No, I don't hear you, Bobby. I see that it looks like you're, oh, you lost her. Looks like she was unmuted on the, maybe she just joined. Yeah. Yeah, no, no problem, David. She's got me with the microphone trouble. Yeah. That was last week, Peter. From now this week, she's sound great. Thank you. Yeah. The week changes. Yeah, next week, it'll be my problem, right? That's how it goes. Kind of a round robin deal. Yes. Okay. Well, we'll give Bobby a couple of seconds to jump back on here. Anything else that we want to cover around the onboarding strategy for now on the task force? I mean, maybe while we're waiting for Bobby to come back, just if Tracy has thoughts on what an onboarding mentor should look like. I mean, I think what you said sounds good. I think there's, you know, what are the end improvements that we want? And I think that's pretty much, I think what you guys said, right? Like, figure out what it is that it takes today and see what we can do to improve that. Yeah. And that seems very, Makes sense. Yeah. And it seems a very quantifiable, tangible thing that a mentor or mentee could point to. You know, it's now fewer steps than it was before for somebody to find the thing. Yeah. Yeah. I guess my question to you there, David, is, you know, a lot of time from a search engine optimization standpoint, if you go too deep on the levels on your website, it's harder for Google and the search engine to find an index. Yeah. So I guess my question around that, just, you know, from my perspective is, are we open to maybe restructuring the URL, directory structure to make it more SEO friendly as part of this as well? Or is that not in the cards? I am Matt, I mean, I can't, so that's a Ben question since he owns the website, but, and I can't speak for him, but I imagine he's open to it, especially if we can present some sort of a case. Hey, if we do this, we'll see this benefit, right? Yeah. You guys hear me now? Yeah, yeah. Yep, thank you. You're loud and clear now. You're chatting. I did listen to the recording from last time and I've been trying to catch up. So I'm just gonna share my screen because I did just write some notes down, if that's okay. Sure, sure. Hold on. So this is the Wiki page. I have all of the Discord pages open and everything else linked to on top, but basically so far with the task force, I think we've accomplished two things. We set out that survey for people to say what time they wanna meet and it doesn't seem like anybody really has an objection to this time. And so I think we should just keep meeting at this time. I don't know if we can get more people involved. I know the mentor will have to come and we wanna change that depending on who the mentee is, but we'll work on that when that happens. So that was that survey. And then the mentorship program, here's a link to the program, which again, I was trying to get my head around like the tasks, so I wrote those down and then what we determined our audience was. So if you go down to starting here with who are we doing like keeping that in mind? Who are we doing this for? Are you this person, this person? You know, maybe color code this. So if the documentation we're developing or the path we're suggesting is for these people, you add that color code or their initials or something to it. But again, we were talking about where it comes in and the first three spots that I noticed from again, analyzing the first test was to like kind of go through it was in the first page of the web is learn. And again, I don't know what all the case studies are, the white papers or the training, what all that looks like. But again, if I was learning that would be the first spot I'd go to. And I think that the mentee would be well to make sure that what, and I know they're redoing the website and rebranding. So whatever the new website looks like, I think the mentee should work closely with that learn button as well as the use button. That's more for like the maintainers and that's a little bit a step deeper. And then the participate button. And that's where you have the videos and... I'm going backwards, Chris. The videos. So these are like the first three buttons with all that information. And I don't know if, again, you want to gear it specifically. So, if you're a chair and you're cutting, I don't know if that's the place for that, but I think we need to have a good look at what these links are attached to and if that information is relevant and enticing even. And then again, the next was the wiki page with the start here. And again, that's what that looks like. It is, you know, a lot of information, getting started, frequently asked questions. I don't know if this can be more streamlined for directing people who they want to go instead of reading all this information. You know, maybe have it more card-like or landscape-like, something like, rather than just lines of... Agreed, agreed. And that's where like somebody with some UX skills could really help, right? I don't think it's, yeah, yeah. I don't think throwing a lot of information to people is necessarily the right way to get them where they want to go, all right? And then this, David, I don't have to tell you because this is your video, is the video about getting involved with these main points of the first things that you see is, you know, learning about Hyperledger, which is great and it's right there on Participate. So again, I don't know if you want the mentee to look at that, gearing it for these. And I know that we've done some work. Now that was the other video we've done. Oh my God. Some work again. I can never find... I think it's under the main team's guidelines, some user guides for them, I know Tracy was working hard on those to get that working. And again, here's a little bit, I put all this on the Wiki page again, finally, with the contributors' guidelines. So again, the mentee, here's the project. I think that that would be a good, you know, because there's milestones in the mentee project, you know, they can complete some of these tasks, like, you know, identifying the areas that can be improved or update and streamline this documentation by making, you know, not creating, again, like David said, not recreating it, but just making sure it's up to date and accessible from one of these points. Yeah. And I really like your focus on looking at the website and the Wiki. My only comment is we should build on what's already been done here. I don't know if people are familiar with the last years onboarding related mentorship project, but there's a nice summary of what that person created. And it does involve some mockups and some suggestions on how to rethink some of the pages on the website. I wouldn't want to, like, ignore that. And it would be nice to, you know, build on that. So I think everybody, if you haven't looked at that, at what that mentee did last year, take it and spend some time, there's a page on the Wiki with a bunch of mockups and a presentation. So, you know, I would say let's, we should be familiar with that. And then whoever mentee we pick should also, you know, start, you know, not from scratch, but see if we can build on stuff that's already been done in the past. And I think this last year's mentee project does have some pieces for us to look at. Yeah, no, I agree, David. I don't think reinventing the wheels a way to go either. And I think, you know, build on what's been done and have a keen eye toward what's really going to make a difference here. You know, which one it was called, David? I dropped the link. Yeah. I dropped the link in Zoom chat. Thank you. Save me time. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, this is great. Thanks. Sorry, I was being slow to load, but there's some content down below. So sorry, Johnny, we're going to say something. Yeah, I was going to just weigh in a little bit, Bobby, could you just navigate to just wiki.hyperledger.org, just the main homepage. And I just kind of kind of discuss this a little bit when we talk about starting here and, you know, onboarding. So you see in the upper right corner there, it has a getting started call out. And one of the things that I think would be good here is also to link to the start here page. You know, not sure where to start. Check out start here, you know, we can just kind of bring it into the homepage here to really get that engagement because a lot of times when we have somebody new to the community, they're probably going to hit the homepage more than anything. And I'm sure, you know, that's the most highly trafficked page and that's where we really want to try to drive in. And we did embed the start here coming the content and that trending community activity is from start here. Our thought was instead of linking off to a different website, maybe we could bring content from the website in here, kind of like a one stop shop. But yeah, you can certainly, yeah, this is, I'm not a UX expert. So I'm not sure at the right rate of present or get people to the content is so this, the way we set it up may not be ideal, certainly. I really like that the attend the workshop right up front. I mean, I think that's fabulous. Get people in get away to get people involved right off the, off the bat. I like that a lot. Yeah, the promo spot. Yeah, yeah, that's really, you know, because that's what we tried to do at the learning materials working group was give it a place where everybody could, you know, where are the current events that are happening instead of going to the home, the website events, meetups, and then finding it that way. If you're on the wiki page, you just, oh, there's a, and that's the, yeah, and that goes to where the traffic is. Like John said, the main page of the wiki gets the most traffic. Yeah. And that's what I'm just saying too, David, you know, when you have something that's above the scroll and in that upper right corner, you know, that's valuable real estate or, you know, people's eyeballs looking at the website and, you know, being able to dive them in right from there would be great. But that's something we can do in an analysis. We can talk to Ben about his thoughts on it and, you know, just work on that. But, you know, my thing is always, you know, just like you said, David, less clicks to the valuable content and put the best click in front of somebody's, you know, first look on the page. Okay. Bobby, any other thoughts on that? Do you see what I'm referring to? Yeah. I'm going to get back to. I'm just lost for our tasks. Okay, so. I just would make a suggestion that maybe each one of us take one of these and spend some time this week just doing these clicks and make a little table somewhere, whether I'm hoping it would all be on that wiki page, just put a table in there, you know, I did. I did use, I did participate and I found that this information was wonderful. This information was at a date. Is it, is there any way that anyone wants to volunteer to do a section on the website to use, learn or participate? I can volunteer to do use and learn. Okay. Thanks. I'll put that down. And this is where we can bring Ben in. And if we put together some recommendations for each of these pages, we can bring Ben in and see if he's, you know, open to, you know, adjusting things. And again, I don't know what he has in mind necessarily for the new version of those pages on the new site, but yeah, it's good to have a conversation going with him. If we have a point of view on the pages. Yeah. And Bobby, if you want me to do the participate one, I'm glad to jump in and do that one. Awesome. Thanks. And now I have to say the documentation. I am not ready to go through that because I have to spend the day going through the task for the mentee applications. At which point I'm going to sit down and see if I have any recommendations for combining or in any ways, synergies between the documentation mentee applications. Before we just jump into. I'm really saying what that task force should be focused on, because I think both these task forces are going to use the mentee application as, as getting the stuff done. So, again, there's a pit mentee application is right here for the one that I applied for, but that's going to more be an umbrella one for the ones that, you know, we're going to figure out what, in fact, the community needs are through the mentorship application submissions, if that makes sense. It does. So I need this week to go through that stuff. So if anybody has any, again, this is the tasks like envision for the different mentee or mentee forces that work on this, but it's very broad right now because I haven't really thrown myself in. So that's, I think, And then on that submission for documentation, Bobby, are you looking for any additional collaborators on that? Well, absolutely. Well, that's the thing like there's a submission for Cactus is documentation. And then so what we're going to, I'm going to try to do is try to read through them all and see if we can get that done. So that's just like evaluating some of the submissions. So while I'm doing that, I'm going to make a mental note of which ones are documentation. I just don't know if there's anybody from the community that you wanted to bring into that. Anyone who wants to come help. But I can't really. You know, you start to ask for the specific mentor yet, because I'm not really sure the umbrella of the documentation project. Are you still with us, Bobby, or did it drop the audio? Yeah. Yeah, your audio seems to be maybe a little laggy. John. Yep. Okay. Did you guys hear me? Yeah, we can hear you now, Bobby. Okay, good. So that's, that's it. I was just, um, again, the documentation, uh, initiative for the mentorship program might have more than one. Yeah. So I'm going to go back to the, I'm going to go back to the mentor. I'm going to go back to the mentor. Menti because there's multiple documentation projects. So again, we'll kind of figure out the. Focus of those this week. Okay. Is there anybody else that's in particular? You want David to help you with reaching out to you to. Get engaged with. Being a mentor for that project. Again, once we know what the projects look like, we'll have a specific. Um, I'm just going to make sure that. We have the right people working with you to make sure we get that going. Yep. I'm on it. So that's my, my initiative for the documentation is to see where the. Like minded projects are in the mentorship programs. Perfect. Okay. Peter, do you have anything else that you'd like to cover around either one of those two mentorship. Or anything else related onboarding their documentation? Just wanted to apologize for one more time. I know I've been very slow to respond. Uh, I got the updates done in the. Document very last minute, basically the evening before the TLC meeting. Sure. It's not about that. Oh no, no problem. Peter, you know, we're all super busy. You know, everyone on this call has plenty to do. I'll guarantee you that. And we can just, you know, try to participate as much as we can. So that makes perfect sense. Thank you. Yeah. On that note, the other thing is I do have to drop at nine 30. Yeah. No, no problem. I think, you know, we're pretty good on a half an hour call. Unless Bobby, you think that we should extend it further. I'm fine with wrapping it up at a half hour here. No, that works. And thanks Peter for putting that together. I think it's interesting to see the, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, I put on there about the currently the number is five clicks for each project, but to your point that you add on there and assumptions, that's assuming the user knows where to click. I think it's not necessarily. Could be five. It could be five or more. Right. If user has to hunt around a little bit. Yeah. At least five. At least 50. Yeah. Could be. But yeah, but no fewer than five. Certainly. Yes. Okay. And we'll plan on catching up. Next week at about the same time. And then I'll take care of my stuff. Peter, thanks for working on the other stuff. And Bobby, great to catch up with you as well. Thanks. Thanks, John. All right. Take care. Bye. Yeah.