 Hello everybody! Today we are here with Michael, who is a big dropshifter in Autodesk and working with a big numbers rule and we will do this interview to really inspire you and give you some motivation and show you how Michael works. How are you today Michael? Excellent buddy, thanks for having me on. Great. So I prepared some questions really to give our audience some motivation and show them how you work, so from your experience you can share anything that you want. And first if you can please introduce yourself. How did you get into dropshipping? Where are you from? How did you start? Sure, sure. I started dropshipping in 2016. I'm American. I live actually in Europe right now. I have a day job, unrelated to dropshipping, but I've been a lifelong entrepreneur my whole life, besides the fact that I have a day job working for somebody else, but I've had a law-mowing business. I went to college, sold that, did a bunch of things, and ultimately in 2014 I took a trip to Southeast Asia for a couple months, took some time off work. I wanted to travel basically and I was looking for a way to pay for my trip. I met all these people that they were traveling and so I came home and my girlfriend at the time broke up with me so I figured it was the perfect time to figure out a way to make money online. The plan was to make money, quit my job. I had a travel blog for about a year. That was a giant failure. I got into Shopify, high-ticket dropshipping. Not the kind where you dropship from, say, AliExpress, but actually you make connections with actual manufacturers. That was great. The problem was it was seasonal and so then I got into a couple other things, affiliate marketing and also in 2016 I got into dropshipping. I started out without software and I don't think there really was a whole lot of software back in 2016, at least not that I knew of, and that was a giant nightmare because I sold a whole bunch of stuff that was out of stock and then the prices were wrong and I ended up finding a profit scraper, which was a competitor of yours, which is no longer in business. I think I talked to you about that and I started out. I think the first holiday I made $1,500 a month and it was amazing. That was just the idea of going from making zero to $1,500 a month talking about an actual profit. It's the greatest feeling in the world and then from there it's been up and downs, but I had a great last six months. I've made the most money I've ever made really anywhere, but online and it's just the best, I wouldn't say it's the easiest, but it's the best business model to make money online that doesn't take a lot of experience and eBay is the most forgiving platform basically. That's my experience. I run three stores. I'm down to one currently, but it's my main store and it's doing great and thanks a lot for your software. It's been the best software. I basically use them all and I'm not just saying that to kiss your ass. It really is. It's very good. A lot of the other softwares occasionally have or oftentimes will have bugs and this and that and any issues I've had with Autodesk has been fixed in a matter of hours without even saying anything. It's actually really good. Thank you very much for the feedback. It's an interesting story, but how did you study the door shipping? Did you take any courses or just started? Sure. I took a course. It was $20. I'm cheap, so I waited until I got a half offer to be $10. It was Voo, something Voo. David Voo? Yeah, David Voo's course back in July of 2006. I actually looked up recently because I was looking to see when I purchased it. I took that and it was very basic at the time, but the fundamentals were perfect. It was by far the best $20 I've ever taken or I've ever spent. Then shortly after, because he doesn't talk about software. I then went and after I had problems, I went and sought out software. That was my foray and it's just been profitable ever since. I've never moved on to anything else because I just think it's, to be honest right now, and I've spent a lot of time building my business, but I literally spend, I don't know, do you know the book, The 4-Hour Workweek? Yeah. I literally spend less than 4 hours. Now, granted, that's after years of building up my business and I have a team and so it's not, there'll be times where I have catastrophes and I spend a lot more than that. But right now, knock on wood, it's 4 hours, so it's great. I love it. A week. A week. It's insane. Yeah, I know, I know. I cannot spend 4 hours and not a day a week. What's that? I said that I cannot spend only 4 hours a week on not a day a week. Well, I've got a couple employees that have been working for me for years and they know everything in and out. How many VA's do you have in your business? I'm sorry? How many VA's are running your stores? I have two. I just have the one store right now. I have two full-time, one on, one off, so they work one week for seven days and they take a week off. Now, just to give you guys kind of an idea, my store has 60,000 listings. Right now, I'm doing right around 150,000 sales a month. A few months ago, it was more double that during the pandemic, but it's kind of leveled out about 150,000. And I have those two VA's and actually I have a third that works part-time. Right now, eBay has these issues with item specifics, I'm sure you're aware of. And because I have such a big store, I have to go in and I have over 11,000 items that need corrected. So I've got one gentleman that works for me on and off, does projects for me. So that's what he's doing for the next two months. I'm sure he hates me right now because it's terrible. But it's good for work, you know? Yeah, sure. But so you have right now 60,000 listings in your store and one store. One store. And it's on call subscription? It is anchor. I don't have the enterprise store primarily because they make you sign up for the year. And there's one guy I know that signed up for a year and then they kicked him off eBay and they still expected him to pay for the store for the entire year. Which is great. Wow. It's good. So to be honest, it's like 64,000 listings. It's the break-even for the enterprise store anyway. So I'm just a little under that. So. Yeah. So anyway, it's better for you for now to be on the anchor store. And do you pay for the anchor store in the annual subscription? Right? No, I pay, actually no I do. I'm sorry. I do pay the $299 a month. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, because this commitment is much smaller than the $3,000. I can take a few thousand dollar hit. It's just like that 20 or $30,000 hit they want to get you for that. It's just it's not worth the risk. Yeah, I see. So you said that during the pandemic you had $150,000 in sales per month? And no, no, right. I'm sorry. Go on. Yeah. No, I have right now I have $150,000 in sales. During the pandemic it was up to $360,000 per month. Oh, wow. It's crazy. Yeah. I cleaned up. I'm telling you, I'm still shocked. I don't care. I made the net profit. This is after everything. BAs, returns, lost cases just over $30,000 in one month. Now granted, that was during like a world pandemic. So I don't suspect that had to happen maybe ever again. But even now, so basically sales were good and then the pandemic came and they're up here and they're back down to still really good. And because I think people's buying, the way people buy is going to stick online because you had people who always are going to buy online. Then you had older people who didn't really buy online as much, but now they were forced to. And so now I think we have, yeah, I think we, it's sticky. I think those buyers are going to stick. And to be honest, I don't think it's a better time to ever be selling on eBay. And granted, there have been good and bad times. eBay is very fickle. They can be a giant pain in the, you know what, sometimes I'm sure you know this. But right now is by far the best time I've ever had selling on eBay. And it's just not, the sales are just there. I don't know what else to say. They're there. I'm not going to complain. I'm going to take my money and you know, it's great. Yeah, you can see that everywhere. Yeah, you can see that everywhere in the stocks and in everywhere, we also saw like double in sales during the pandemic in other years in general. And like for the users, but right. So, so I guess right now you have like half of this. It means that around 15,000 net profit and like, yeah, right? It's, it's, uh, actually I'll tell you right now, it's right around. I don't give, I know everyone likes numbers. So I want to be accurate. It's it's right around about 14,000. Yeah. Yeah. It's insane. So 14,000, uh, in profits from four hours work a week and 60,000. Right. And I don't, I, I say that at the risk of sounding like those idiots that those commercials about, you know, give us your money. You'll work one hour a week and make 10 million dollars. Like it's not like that. I mean, you have to, you know, to get to where I was, you're going to spend a year, maybe longer building your store. But, uh, usually within, this is what I always recommend. Spend three months building the store so that you learn everything because you can't hire VAs and then just tell them to do something when you don't, because they're going to come back to you with problems and you're not going to be able to fix it. So do it for three months. That's right about the time or you'll be sick of finding stuff to list. Hire some, uh, Filipino VAs or VAs from wherever, um, and then let them build your store and you just work on the store rather than in the store. And yeah, I mean, I, if you work within a year, there's no reason that you can't expect a sizable income. Now I'm knocking against a 30,000 or 14,000. I think I'm probably somewhat of an anomaly, but that's just because I stuck with it. It wasn't because I was, uh, smarter or knew something everyone else didn't. I just, I don't give up. I'm stubborn like that. And that's, that's, it's a good thing and a bad thing, but business is definitely a good thing. So that's a great note for the audience that the results are not coming immediately and you really should stick with the work and stay consistent. And that's the only way you need to go. Um, do we still work in your daily job right now? I do. And that's actually, here's some irony. Uh, I do and I just got noticed two days, three days ago from my boss that, um, so basically, uh, I was transferred to Europe to work and my boss said, Hey, because of the pandemic and everything that's going on, we might send you back to the US next year. And I don't really want to move back to the US because a number of reasons, one of which I get a favorable tax treatment living outside the US. So out of the money I make, I pay a little no taxes. If I live in the US, I'd be paying a lot of taxes. So, uh, he said, Hey, next June, you might have to go back to the US. And so depending on how the business is going, if it's still staying consistent, I might just quit my job. I'll probably quit my job, which is something I was planning on doing three years ago. But, uh, I'm finally at a point where I think I feel comfortable with it. So it's, I mean, this is going to be my main income. I do have other side investments, but this would be the main income I'd be living off of. Don't you think that if you leave your job, you can spend more time on the business and scale it even more? Well, that's, that's one, that's one of my plans. Actually, what I would like to do is I have my store. I want to keep it the size it is. I have a few reasons for that. But what I'd really like to do is I'd like to get five or 10 other stores, maybe partner with other people. I would run them. I would fund the business. I would do everything. I know it's, there's, there's a big thing, big push right now for Amazon automation where they say, Hey, give us your money. We will create your products and, you know, it's, they get all the money you take all the risk. Something I've been thinking about is finding other people that I can work with. Uh, I would run the accounts. I do everything. I mean, I wouldn't even fund the purchases. So there's really, there's no risk on anyone, except for me. That's how much I'm confident with what I know. And if I quit my job, I'm probably partially going to move to the Philippines. I'm going to hire some more VAs and I would like to build up five or 10, uh, stores, start there and from there just kind of grow because it's, uh, I'm just confident. I mean, the business model works. There is a chance of you losing your account. Um, but I think if you do it correctly, it's minimal. I just in complete, um, uh, transparency. I lost one of my accounts recently, but it was, uh, but it's a long story, but it's rare. I think if you run it properly, the chance of you losing your account is a lot less limited. So anyways, to answer your question, my plan is probably, if I do that, I'm going to expand it, diversify, find other people that want to work with me. The problem is with managed payments. I'm kind of worried about how I could deal with stealth accounts. And, uh, so I'm, I'm kind of, I don't know. I've thought about the idea of just basically working with other people because here's the thing. I know a lot. It's, this is a, it's an actual business. It takes work in some people, you know, family, uh, gets in the way. Some people, the answer is just lazy or, uh, you know, it's just not, or it's not the right business for them. I understand that, you know, you got to deal with people. And so I've always thought, well, maybe I have the opportunity since I'm, I'm motivated and I have the knowledge, and maybe I could partner with other people. And, um, it's an opportunity. I don't know. It's just something I've been floating around with basically. And so to answer your question about expanding, that's kind of, I probably would just for the safety of having multiple accounts rather than just the one store. Cool. It's insane. Yeah. Sure. I will do the same basically if your store is running and making so much profit. So there's no reason to touch it instead of spreading for more stores. By the way, you interviewed me to your podcast that, by the way, we can add below this video. And, uh, you asked me to link you with other people with stores. Did you find someone? Did you start any partnership? Uh, oh, where do I start with this one? Um, to be honest, I don't use social media very much. I think it's beneficial. I think it has its benefits, but to me, it's just a time suck. It's good if it's good to advertise your business and other things anyways. So I did reach out through, basically I went through, um, your, uh, Facebook page and other Facebook pages and try to connect with other people, uh, to basically push my idea. And there's, I don't know if it's just me, but it seemed like there's a lot of kind of sketchy people that I was trying to get connected with. And then they, you know, I would try to set up meetings because I'm, to me, this, this business is professional. I'm 100% legit. I report all my earnings to the government. I, everything's above board. And there's a lot of people when I wanted to get on face to face conferences, just to make a personal connection with them. They didn't seem interested. And I said, Hey, what can you prove your account? What your limits are? And there's a lot of no, no, just trust me. And like, that's not going to work for me. I've been around the block. And, but I know there's a lot of people out there that I just have to figure out a way to make a connection with them. So I haven't had, I've spoken with five people now, and none of which it's worked out. I don't know if they're not motivated. Maybe, maybe I'm seeing the, I'm the one that seems being sketchy. I don't know. Maybe it's me. I don't know. But I've, I don't know. If you have some ideas, please tell me. Make some connections. Cool. So first I will link you and connect you with some friends who have a lot of stalls. And I hope it will help you. And also, we will think about it later, but maybe we can put a form below this video where people can leave their details to reach you or something like that, with, you know, screenshots of the store or something like that. We will try to think about it later together. But cool. It's a good way to expand. And you're really confident with what you know and do so. Yeah, I mean, I mean, that's like, I have, I have no problem using my own money, put up my own, you know, doing everything because I know, you know, yes, there is the chance of, you know, eBay shutting your store, Amazon shutting, I mean, there's risk everywhere, anywhere in business. But I think you can minimize it. And like I said, my, my biggest value add is I don't give up. So, you know, eBay in the last three years has changed four or five years, whatever it is, has changed a lot. They have demoted drop shippers listings, they have given us promote listings, they have taken away promote listings. And so sales, you know, do go up and down like this. But the good thing of that is when that happens, people get discouraged and they quit, which I'm sure is one of the problems you see with, you know, being the owner of a software is, it is just normal. It's not, it's not that there's anything wrong with you. If you do that, it's just a normal way of, I think I maybe I'm a freak, you know, it's like, to me, I'm like, this is great, because I know some people will quit. And that just if I stick around long enough, I know my store will do better. And I think that's why it's done so well. And the people I know that drop ship their stores, it's the same thing. So, you know, for those of you guys starting out listening, I promise you, you'll have a time where eBay kicks you in the teeth, and you just want to quit, take the day off, go out drinking, go on a date, do whatever you do. Then, you know, come back and just know that there's very quickly eBay is a, I'm sorry to ramble, I'll be really quicker. eBay is a $90 billion, they did $90 billion in sales last year. Of that, 80% of that is new items. So call it, say $60 billion is new item sales. Of that, most of those are drop shippers. So say $55, $50, $55 billion a year are drop shippers. I'm through, I go through, and these numbers come from somebody high up in eBay. So I know this all, all this is factual. If a business, the number two website in America does 55 billion, maybe 60 billion of drop shipping sales a year, if you think it's going away, you're crazy. I'm your creative, we are their business. So, you know, they might punch you in the teeth once or twice, you just get back up. They can't kick us all off forever. It's just, it's just not realistic. So, you know, people that say is eBay drop shipping dead $60 billion. So I have to say, you know, yeah, I agree. Even drop shipping is like any business. It's a roller coaster and basically you just need to stick with it and, you know, the app will come. That's how it works. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm sure that after people will listen to this, you will motivate them a lot, which is amazing. With which suppliers do work? I only use Amazon. I used to use Home Depot. I use Home Depot for a while. And then when eBay did the update back in April of 2018, they kind of screwed me. But I used to have a connection with discounted gift cards actually from the company that makes the gift cards. Actually, I guess I still do. There's a company that actually produces gift cards for Home Depot. So you're not buying it like through some sketchy website. You're actually, it's a Fortune 500 company. So I had negotiated discounts through them. In addition, they do it for some others. But right now I solely use Amazon because there are some issues with Home Depot at one point. Amazon just works. I've got, if you're an American, you can get big discounts with certain credit cards, and then you can use some tricks. And so it just, Amazon is the easiest. It's the most competitive. But there's so much traffic. I don't really worry about it. I mean, it's just, I know a lot of people say don't use Amazon because there's a lot of competition. And to me, if you're going to stick around for a while, I think it's just the easiest. But a lot of people use other companies and they do well too. Yeah. Basically, you have around 600 million products on Amazon. So I don't know if people say that there is a competition or not a competition, but you have 600 million different SKUs to use in your business, which is crazy. You need just 60,000 to make 15,000 in profits. One tenth of 1% of their items or something? Yeah. So it's a ridiculous number. And I'm, I probably don't even have the best items. You know, I'm sure there are plenty of other items out there that are just as good if not better. Yeah. I'm not sure if you're fine with sharing, but if yes, how do you find your products and strategy that you can share or? Yeah. Look, my opinion is real simple. Like I said, call it $55 billion of drop shipping sales on eBay. I'm not worried. I mean, I've been abundance mentality. So yeah, I'll tell you exactly what I do. So if I can remember off the top of my head, I actually haven't done it for forever. I have my employees do it, but I'll go in and find an item. Well, let me tell the easy way and I'll tell the hard way. Basically, I just go and find an item on Amazon or I'm sorry. Yeah. I go to Amazon, find an item with a lot of sales that has a very short title. And this will make sense here in a minute. So you just go to Amazon item that has a short title and I search at eBay, just in the search bar, and then those products will pop up. And the reason I do this is because I'm looking for someone that uses Amazon and as their source. And then I'll go in there and I will then search that product. Shoot, I just totally said it wrong. Well, I'm getting on mix up. Basically, I go to eBay. I find sellers that I know are using Amazon as a source. And then I will just simply find all the products that they've sold. And if you're starting out, I would say find products that have sold say five times. I just find any product that's ever sold and I take that I match it with Amazon product. I use that title. And then I use that ascent and then I upload it into auto DS. And so most of my products have optimized title. You can simply use the Amazon's title, but you're going to get, I did the math. I think it's you're going to get a third as many, you'll get three times more sales if you use an optimized title. So you have optimized title for 60,000 listings? Now, well, 20,000 of them. Wow. 20,000 I do. And then the other 40,000 I use your auto finder for the other 40. When I switched over to your store, I had 20,000 listings and I use your auto finder for the next 40,000. So it's, I know it's a lot more work. And I know people are going to try to find the easy way, but if you want this to be a long term business, find sellers on basically the easiest ways, find sellers on eBay that use your source from the Amazon. And then just find their sole listings and just take their sole listings, match that product with your Amazon listing and upload the title with the, the optimized title with the ASIN, which you can do an auto DS. And just do that. And while it takes a lot longer and sometimes you're going to have trouble, actually I left one thing out. Find someone that find a seller whose profits are larger than yours. So I mean, I'm not going to say what my margins are, but, or my markup, but let's just say your markup's 40%. That's a little high, but find a seller who has products, you know, just find a seller that's, that's the way I just said, and then take five or six of their items, see what the margin is. And if it's higher than your margin, those are the ones I take. And I basically scrape their titles and their listings. And after a while, once you get to the point where I have like 20,000, it takes a long time, but that's where your VA's come in and you can just pay people. You pay them well and they do a good job and it just bills over time. Like my store took me, I think a year, year and a quarter maybe to get 20,000 listings optimized. So all of your titles were built by your team or you copied it from other eBay setups? 100% copy. 100% copy. I haven't optimized one title myself because here's the thing. Most of the way the way eBay search works is it's not as intricate as Amazon. From what I can tell, it's largely based off keywords in the title. And if you find eBay seller that has sold listings, you know that titles worked at least once. People have used, because most buyers use the same words to find a product and that's the one that popped up with a reasonable enough, not too high of a price. So you can then go in, take that title, you know it sells, you know that that price is, is reasonable and yours is probably going to be a little lower. So you undercut them. Now, I wouldn't undercut everyone really low. Just find a good price that works for you. When I start out, I would keep my margins fairly low just to get velocity of your account. And then you can raise your rates a little bit. And that's all, I mean it works. That's what I did in 2016 and it works just as well in 2020. Amazing. Cool. Yeah. Nice. What are the issues that you faced in the beginning while you were scaling your business? Like now it's really a huge, but in the beginning I guess that you had some hard times to scale it. What, what was the, you know, the things that you didn't remember that was the hardest for you? The hardest? Yeah. Well, again, when you start out for the first month, you'll make, you know, a dollar or two and you'll be very excited because you made money online and then you build the business. And after a few months it becomes tedious and that's where a lot of people quit. And the key here is when you get to the point where you're like, man, I don't want to scrape any more sellers and, you know, match up listings or, you know, you're sick of dealing with customer service, that is the time where you then hire a virtual assistant to then take over the monotonous tasks. And that's how you grow because it will get, after a while, it will get tedious. It will get, that's why I give my employees a week on week off because I don't, you know, it's a tedious business, but everyone would want a week on week off. That's a great schedule and I can afford it. And, but in addition to that, when I was scaling, the problem is, is, you know, in the past four or five years eBay, they'll change the algorithm and your sales will go way down. And so you'll be making, I remember one point a few years ago, I was making $10,000 a month from one store and then it went down to a thousand profit or 2000, something like that. And it was discouraging and ultimately had to lay some people off. But again, like what I, I realized when I went through, I went to rebuild my store up some, I want to add more listings. I took all the eBay sellers that I had scraped before to find their listings. And I was like, I want to see if they have new listings, two thirds of them had quit in a year, year and a half, two thirds of them had quit. And so what that told me was, if I stick with this, you know, that my competition is leaving because eBay will change the algorithm. eBay still wants to have sales. So someone has to get those sales and they can't, you know, demote the listings or punish all eBay sellers, because most of the listings for a certain product are just eBay sellers, dropshippers, I'm sorry. And so the problem I had there, you know, it's just, you know, to answer your question, it's just pretty much sticking with it. And when you get upset, when you get, you know, you're just, you're fed up, it's time to hire on help. And you can do that for, if you, you know, if you're not making much money, you can get a good VA for $500 a month. I mean, you get for less depends what you can afford. I would personally, what I would do is I build up my business till I could afford a VA. So once you're making $500, $600 a month, net profit after everything, I would instantly rather taking that money put in your pocket, I would hire VA and just put off delay gratification for a while and build your store because I promise you in six months when you're making big money, you'll be happy. The promise most people take the money instantly, they spend it and so they don't have the money to hire VA and they just don't grow like they should. You know, I saw so many cases, I saw agree with it, because I saw so many cases of drop shippers in other days who were really successful, they started to make profits and then they just decided to take all this money back home to their pocket and then their businesses crashed because they didn't spend it back to grow and improve the business. Right. And, you know, and that's kind of what we're talking about before with how I want to grow and run other stores. I want to run everything. I don't want the people that, whether I get a store, whether I partner with someone with their store, I want to run everything because I know, I don't want too many hands in the pockets. I just, if I do it, I know it'll be, well, I can't guarantee it'll be successful, but I don't want to partner with someone who then wants to take the money and spend it. You know, I would rather just run everything, you know, pay them their share and if they want to spend that part, great, but we will always have money to hire virtual assistants and, I mean, I'm a business person through and through just like you. And the truth is a lot of people aren't, there's nothing wrong with that. And it's, but, yeah, I think if I give advice, take that first thousand dollars you make and hire someone. And you're giving someone a job too, so it's great. They'll be thankful and, you know, if you can delay that clarification for three, six months, you know, you'll trust me, you'll thank yourself. You really will. I agree, really. That's how my development today has also grown. Like in the first year, I didn't do anything back home. Everything was spent to improve the business and go forward. I think that's the only way to go in the beginning. Yeah, yeah. I will not take a lot from your time also. I will ask some final questions. How, like you moved to Autodesk around half a year ago from what you said, right? Yeah. And what do you use in Autodesk to help you automate your business? Like, what does it do for you? And maybe we will have some tips for other people how to save more time using the tool. Sure. Well, like I said, when you start off, Autodesk says, is it Autodesk Finder, I think, or is that what's called? The Product Finder? Product Finder, yeah. Yeah, Autodesk Finder. Yeah. So I would, I use that to add 40,000 listings. I would not use that to start. I would use my method. It's slower, but you get a lot better listings. The way I do it, there's no way, there's no way to automate the way I do it. You just have to do it manually. But I would start off with that. But I would start Autodesk from day one, just using it to for your stock quantities, to monitor your stock, to monitor your price. And then once that, once you build up your listings, then you can kind of switch over, if you want, and get more automated as far as defining products that Leor's software does. As far as, I also use the auto order. I won't use any service unless they have an auto order. And for me, I'd say it probably gets 95% of my orders right, less than 5% fail. And oftentimes, that's not really Autodesk. It's because there's an address issue or there's some issue that's not related to Autodesk. So I also use it for auto orders. There is, I know there's things you can do in Autodesk, like messaging people and all of that. And it kind of, it segregates your, maybe your employees from having to get into your eBay account. I trust my employees, they just, they've always run it through eBay. So I always have, I know the option is there. I don't have much experience with that, but I definitely, it's very important to have software that properly monitors your stock and your prices frequently. And that is one thing. There's other softwares out there as well. But I will say all of DS is the best that I've used. I haven't used them all. I've used probably five of them. And that's, it definitely, the stock monitoring, the price monitoring, the auto ordering, special auto ordering, and that works well because prices change, stock levels change, and you need to get in there and you need to order quickly. And that's, that's basically what I use auto order for, to automate the business. Cool. Thank you so much for the feedback. Okay. So what will be your best tip for beginners? Last tip that you can give them, people who just starting, like you gave during the interview a lot of them, but one that you would focus on and really start from there to scale and, you know, improving the business. Little, little steps. So, like I said, this business at times can be monotonous. At first, you're going to have the adrenaline. So it's going to be easier. But if I would say, you know, set the hour aside every day, say I'm going to do five listings or find 10 listings or 20 listings, whatever the number is, and set that time and make small little goals. Today you'll set up your eBay account. Tomorrow you'll set up your AutoDS account or whatever software you use. The next day I would say I'm going to find 10 listings and then 10 listings the next day. And so if, if you're like, hey, I want a store that has 60,000 listings and it's making 15 grand a month or 14 grand a month, it's unrealistic because you'll end up quitting because that's going to take a long time. So if just, you know, take, take five days a week, take maybe two days off. If you've got a family, if you're a crazy crackhead like me, you'll just work every day. But take an hour or two and set aside and tell your spouse or whoever it is that's around. You say, hey, I really have this business. I want to build it. Please support me. Just give me an hour a day. And that way you have that time set aside. You're not overwhelming yourself when it does, when it gets boring, you're not, you know, you're not going to quit. And then commit yourself. I say the year, but at least, at least three months, three to six months, at a very minimum three months, six months to me, everything I do is for at least a year. But give yourself at least three months, one or two hours a day, five days a week. And if you do that, I think it'll be hard pressed to not find some level of success. Again, I'm not going to promise you, you'll make what I'm making or, you know, I'm sure there's people make a lot more than I do, but you will, I think you'll find the level of success enough to where you're like, this is great. Now I'm making $1,000. I hate doing listings. I hate customer service. I can hire someone else. You just do it step by step. It's manageable. That's not just eBay drop shipping, but any business you do. It's a lot better if you set up that way. I think you'll find success a lot more often than if you just have one big goal and you expect to reach it by the end of month. It just isn't realistic. Amazing. Amazing. Thank you so much, Michael, for all your knowledge and all this inspiration that you gave to people. And we will share below this video the link to your podcast for people to hear. And if you want, you will share your contact if someone want to partnership or any Google phone, we'll talk about it later. And again, thank you very much. And everyone who wants to be interviewed also to this channel, you will have a forum below this video where you can share your details. Don't forget to subscribe to our YouTube channel, like this video and comment down with any questions that you have about the video. And again, thank you, Michael. Thanks, buddy. Appreciate it. Bye.