 Oh, we don't know until it's open. I'll be quiet. We're recording so you can go ahead and call to order Michelle. Great. Thank you, Athena. So I'm going to call to order the February 16th meeting of the governance organization and legislation committee. And pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 2021, this meeting will be conducted via remote means members of the public public are able to access the meeting in real time via zoom or by telephone. And let's just see here. Doesn't look like we have any attendees yet. We don't usually. Okay. So, um, we have a lot on the agenda today and I'm sorry, I'm sorry to interrupt. We just need to confirm that everyone can hear and be heard before we get started. Sorry. Nope. Thank you, Athena, for the reminder. Okay. So let's just go through and make sure everyone can be heard. So I'll start with you, Jennifer. Um, yes, I'm here. I can hear. Can I be here? Mandy. Anika. Present. Pat. Excellent. Okay. And you can hear me, right? So. All right. So we do have a lot to cover and I wanted to begin by just giving us a bit of the lay of the land in terms of timing for some of these items so that we have a sense of how we might want to move through this. Um, I was hoping to get a couple of things, easy things, um, taking care of right away, like the meeting schedule and approval of the minutes. So I'm thinking that's where we'll begin. Uh, but with the other items on our list, I wanted to, um, share that I, from my perspective, the list of liaisons is our first order of business to get through so that we can get that to Lynn and Lynn can make assignments or however that works in the next meeting. Um, for the Tibetan national uprising day proclamation, it's my understanding that we have until March 6th. We'll have another meeting between now and then to get that completed if needed. Um, so then that leaves us with the town council rules of procedure. And as Mandy said, last time we met. We have a report due at our next meeting on February 28th, but it doesn't necessarily mean that we have to be completed with the work. So what I'd like to do is get through those first two easier things, move on to the liaisons and then look at the time and decide how we'd like to go forward from there, depending on what kind of time we have left. Does that sound like a good plan? Okay. All right. Excellent. So, um, Mandy, are you still willing to be our document person to pull up stuff? Okay. Thank you. Um, so if you could pull up our meeting schedule for the next two days, we'll have a proposed meeting schedule. And I did my best. I used a template that George had used previously. And then I did my best to check every date against the calendar to make sure there wasn't something else like a, a federal holiday or something happening. Um, so that was, um, I think around the holiday season where we sort of have a bit more time in between meetings. Um, so that was between November 9th and November 30th. Um, and then you'll see the final date is just a proposed date. Um, for the next. Um, I don't know if we'll be able to do that. Um, in that first meeting of the council of that, of that second year. Um, So any questions on this? Did it look. Do a bowl. Look, okay. Okay. And Mandy and Pat, is this something that we'll want to vote, make a motion to vote on? Or do we just have consensus on this? I think we can just go with consensus. Okay. Yeah. So if it looks good to everyone, I don't think we need to go through the vote. We'll just, um, yes. Anika. I think you're muted. Anika. Okay. I'm starting like I did. Yesterday having myself on mute. All day. Um, so this, this looks great. Right now. But like in the event for anyone, myself with this. Not that the nine to 11 during the week day does become an issue. Like how, how do we go about that? I think we'll see it works for everyone. And if it's just. One person, like if myself, like how. Yeah. Oh, sorry, go ahead, Pat. No, no, no, no, I'm sorry. Good. I was just going to say, I was just going to say, I was just going to say, I think if you're talking maybe one or two meetings, that's one thing, but if it's starting to feel like that time on a regular basis isn't going to work, then we would bring that back to the committee and try to determine another day and time that works. And Mandy, I see your hand is up. So maybe you want to add to that. That's what I was going to say was if, if that time becomes unworkable, just ask Michelle as chair. No, no, no, no. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. If, if that time becomes unworkable, just ask Michelle as chair to put on the agenda again, discussion of meeting times. It's happened multiple times in CRC. And not always just at change of. Members. It happens sometimes just because the school year starts or the school year ends and something else becomes available or things like that. But it's not always just at change of the year. It's not always just at change of the year. It's not always just at change of the year. So it happened before. And just take, take it up with the chair and she can put it on a. Agenda item. Okay. So great. So I will send that to Athena and or it's, it's actually already in there, but I'll make sure Athena has it and great. So let's move on to the approval of the January 19th and January 19th. And I haven't formally gone through this process before my understanding from watching other meetings, though, is that. I would first ask the group if there are any, so we'll start with January 19th and I'll ask the group if there are any edits that they would like to make to the draft minutes for January 19th. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I just had a quick one seeing as we are now. You know, we are going to be the fun committee as well. And we will have lots of attendees. I think that. Let me get down. To it. Within the area of the black history month proclamation. I think it's important to make sure that. That it should reflect that that was a collaborative, like a robust collaborative conversation because there were so many that added important me in the sun. Absolutely. I had served in Massachusetts. Okay. Excellent. So now, Athena, are you listening in and then would make that change? Or is that something I would want to send to you. I'm taking minutes now, so it's difficult to take minutes and edit minutes at the same time. Yeah. So if. If you or one of the other members can make edits and then send me the edited version that you vote to adopt, then I can post those. Okay. So. One other. I had your last suggestion. It was where we're talking about Native American heritage months. We also discussed adding indigenous people stay. It was the two. Perfect. So what I would suggest is that, Annika. Oh, Mandy's going to bring it up. Okay. That's great. I'm just working on it here. Let me find the areas. Okay. Okay. Okay. How was that change for the first suggestion, Annika? That's right. Or you could just write that the group. Yeah, I was going to suggest we could just say like on the second one members suggested. That one. Apologies because it might have happened at the next meeting, but we brought up Holocaust remembrance day. And wanted to add that to the list. And I can't remember whether it was at this meeting or the next meeting. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I remember too. Okay. Okay. And then the second one, Annika, that you had was. Let's see. Okay. I think it is going, let's see. It's below here. And that could even include members as well. Because we all input, let's see where it's native. American history month. And it should be and indigenous people's day. Like that. Yeah. Okay. That work. Okay. Great. Thank you for those Annika. Were there any other edits to this? Meeting minutes. Okay. I'm seeing none. So I think we, at this point then we'll move. So my understanding is that there will need to be a motion to adopt these. And so. I probably should have had a motion prepared. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we have a lot of moving parts. So. The motion is. Just to adopt the January 19th, 2022 minutes as amended. And I second it. Great. Any further discussion. Okay. Great. So Pat. What? How do you vote? Oh. Moving on. Right. Anika really sharp. I Jennifer. I. Mandy. Hi. Annika. And I'm a yes as well. Okay. So that passes unanimously. Thank you. All right. So now we will bring up the second set of minutes from the February 2nd meeting. And I will ask the same question. And I think Pat actually can start us off given there might be. I don't remember whether it's in there or not. I read it yesterday, but I can't remember. I apologize. No, we'll, we'll take a quick, take a look here. It may have been when we were talking about next agenda. Yes. I thought we. Well, I thought it was more specific than that. But. Let me look at. It's not a big deal week as long as it gets in the minutes this time and somebody reaches out to. Jennifer, which actually I spoke to Jennifer. Even before we had our meeting. So. Okay. Great. So yeah, I see in my running list of future agenda items that we, I did add Jewish American heritage month proclamation by April 25th. So we definitely talked about it. Yeah. So let's just get it in there somewhere. That's fine. Okay. And is that an apron? Is, is, is that month? It's actually Holocaust remembrance day. Oh, it's Holocaust remembrance day. Okay. That's in addition to the Jewish American heritage month proclamation. Right. Okay. And so Jennifer, you're working on that. Holocaust remembrance day with Pat, the two of you are working on it or is there. I was going to work on it with Jennifer Moisten, but I didn't want to work with. Okay. No, I thought the same thing. I was like, really? Okay. Okay. Good. Yeah. And I don't remember anything about Jewish American heritage month, but I don't remember anything about it. I don't remember anything about it. We can. Dorothy Pam is working on that proclamation. Yeah. So we can. Yeah. And I saw an email that Dorothy had sent. To the rabbi at the JCA. Asking for some input on that. And, and I think going to reach out to some other. Counselors as well. So yeah. All right. Does that look good? Yes. Okay. Great. Okay. So I'm going to move. Here. All right. So then. I will move to approve the February 2nd, 2022 meeting minutes as amended. Is there a second? Second. Yeah. Doesn't matter. Go ahead. Okay. Daniel seconds. Let's start. We'll go in reverse order here. Anika. Yes. Mandy. Hi. Jennifer. Hi. And I'm an I and Pat. Hi. Excellent. Okay. So those are approved. All right. So we got those two things out of the way. Excellent. So moving on here to. The list of liaisons to town committees. And this is something that I would like us to discuss and vote on today if possible. And so I'll begin by updating you on the meeting that. Lynn and I had with Paul with respect to this list. So I'm going to move on to the next one. Generally speaking, Paul's sense was that the list as we have it right now is good. And that. If counselors are interested in something they, you know, should. Then there should be a liaison for that particular committee. So I'm going to move on to that. So I just want to share that I, my feeling about liaisons, particularly after really looking at the, how they're, how they're spoken about in the rules and thinking about our capacity. I feel like it's. We'll get more value out of the liaison process. And I think that we should be able to, we should be able to get more value out of the liaison process. And I think that there are some committees that need them, that really genuinely need them for whatever reason in a particular year at a particular time. And that the sort of capacity that we have as counselors can be better spent. If we're not. Spreading ourselves too thin. And I also think that because meetings are open to the public, they need to be open to the public. And they need to be open to the public. And keep ourselves abreast to what's happening in those meetings. So Mandy, would you bring up the, the list. That we've been working on. Thank you. So the other kind of thing that I think we talked about with Paul, which I think is very useful to report is that he is working with. His staff to potentially, and I think he said that it was Angela, to potentially. Create more standardization. With respect to these town committees. So that like, for example, you know, you know, you know, you know, you can feel to them. So when you go to them, the information is easily accessible. And you can see where everything is right now, all of the town committee. Web sites look a little bit different, depending on who the staff lays on is or whatnot. And part of that conversation led to, you know, to the chairs of those committees right from the beginning to really help them to understand what their role is as a chair of a town committee. And so with all of that in mind, these highlighted committees are the ones that I feel would be beneficial for us to have. And of course it's open for this committee to decide if there are any others or if these are the wrong ones. But given that we have this list where chairs of standing committees are interacting frequently with town committees, being the planning board, affordable housing trust, the DAC and the T is it DAC intact? Is that how we call them? There, there are those. Someone correct me. You know, I, I think these are the ones that I'm recommending, but now I'd like to open it up for discussion. Yes, Pat. Yeah, I, I, these are recommendations in addition to what we already have because the disability access advisory committee definitely utilizes their liaison for questions and contacting different people. So I would like to continue to be that liaison, but that's not the issue, but they definitely use their liaison. So I don't. Yeah. Okay. I would hate to see that. Not have a liaison. Yeah, that's great. I wasn't sure if it, you know, and I don't know enough about it here to know, like, I wasn't sure if with this TSO, what sort of interaction does TSO have with that particular committee, but it sounds like that's a strong liaison connection there. So. Well, I don't know what TSO. I mean town services. Well, I guess basically what I'm saying, I don't understand why the chair would necessarily be the representative. As a liaison. But that's, that's fine. And if I don't become liaison for the advisory committee, that's fine too, but I don't, I don't know. Yeah, I think Mandy, would you speak to, because I think this was your list here where it was. If you could speak to that, that would be great. It was. So, so I, the, the area where it says committees where the town council committee chair unofficially serves as a liaison and then those four lists. I am the one that made that comment. And that was based on my experience as CRC chair, where I had to be in regular contact with the planning board. And then as we were doing the comprehensive housing policy with the affordable housing trust chair. For just conversations for coordinating meetings for other things. And then my observations as a council member. Last term. Where the TSO regularly received reports from DAC and TAC and for their, particularly the, the items that they dealt with regarding the public way. And so that made me believe, and I could be wrong that, that the regular communication between. DAC and I assume it was the chair of TSO. It could have been the vice chair. I'm not sure who did those communications, but there was definitely communication between TSO and DAC to facilitate. Comments from DAC and TAC. And in, you know, and recommendations and input in the matters that TSO was dealing with. And so my thoughts are having too many counselors serve similar roles can maybe be confusing. That doesn't mean it has to be the chair of these bodies. It could be a member of those bodies, right? That the body decides this is the person that will be that contact. But if we've got someone. Outside of say CRC, trying to liaise with the planning board while I'm also liaising with the planning board to organize things like public hearings and all. That could be confusing for the planning board. And so that's why I put that there. It's not, it was just a suggestion of mine where I thought these are committees where we already have regular relationships where we might not have to declare a specific. Separate liaison. Yeah. No, that makes, may I speak? I'm sorry. Yeah. That makes some sense. But I still feel like I don't know anybody from TSO that was regularly in contact with DACA. And it's not a bad idea to do that. Listening to what you're saying. So I'm not trying to hold my position because I can attend that meeting anyway. But I think there was, as far as I know, no real liaison work between the chair. And I believe it was Evan. And DACA. And that is problematic. I mean, maybe. Maybe a direct connection there would be extremely valuable. But it would need to be formalized and TSO would need to. Want to take that on. So may I comment? Of course. Yeah. So maybe for those four bodies. Instead of it being a liaison from the council, we suggest or recommend to the council that there be a council liaison, but that liaison be chosen by specific committees from their own membership, something like that. So that DACA has a liaison, but that liaison must come from TSO. So the council could potentially choose the liaison, but they also must be a member of TSO, something like that in our recommendation to the council on liaisons that. Planning board hasn't officially had one ever. Because of the communication that was already happening by the time we got around the liaisons between CRC chair and planning board and planning staff, but maybe that's what we do. Something like that sort of recommendation where we just recommend that it be a member of a specific committee. Jennifer. Yeah, I was just going to agree. I think that's a good suggestion and that it doesn't have to be the chair because that's putting a lot of responsibility on the chairs. Yeah. So I think that's great. And, you know, again, as. Like I usually, I attend many of the planning board. Meetings just, you know, they interest me. So I think. I think that's a good suggestion. Not with all the committees, but I think that you have other council members that probably base, you know, on what other districts or, you know, their interest do tune in to a variety of these different meetings. I mean, I know people that attend the attack. On meetings because. You know, that's relates to what's going on in their district. So I think that makes sense that there be. Like as Mandy said, you know, I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. And I agree with those committees. She mentioned. The council committees and these others. And then. And I also agree with those three new committees that that makes sense to have a, you know, official council liaison. To. The three new committees recommended. Great. Anika. Yeah. So I, I agree as well. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that's a good suggestion. I think that the, I think that the process is, you know, as well as for clarity will help. But I have a question with regards to. So the first group. Of committees. And Mandy, maybe the best answer this. Do the committees ever reach out themselves. And say whether or not that they would like Liz. or those choices rather? We actually had a discussion about this at the last meeting with respect to the approach. So should Lynn be reaching out to all committees and asking if they would like a liaison or is it for us to decide and then sort of offer it? And of course, if there's more capacity and somebody does ask for one, which is what the rules of procedures say right now. And I think it was generally the sense that reaching out and asking every committee might not be the right approach because everybody would likely say that they would like one. So really thinking critically about how we can get those committees that do say they would like one, how do we satisfy whatever their need is? It might be adding a liaison but it might be some other way of satisfying whatever the need is. So if you're aware, I think as a counselor, if we're aware of a particular town committee that has been asking for one or would like one, then that's something that we should bring to the table to discuss, to see how and why we might, why and then how we might meet those needs. Does that, and if anyone would like to add to that? I don't think that was clear, I probably just spoke. I meant where the outside committees have they ever or have they been reaching out to request on their own? Separate from has the council reached out to see how many would want one? I don't know. Does anyone have experience with that where a committee has reached out and requested one? No, not particularly. I think early on, in our early in our term, there might have been some specific requests but not recently that I know of. Okay. I'm curious though, Anika, what sort of the where, what maybe where that question is coming from because is there something there that we might want to consider beneath that? Oh no, no, no, nothing behind it. I was just generally curious as to like how the committees, do they usually reach out? Have they ever, and is it like a list like, okay, maybe all of the committees had one of the leads on and that we weren't able to accommodate or they're not reaching out and we're just how exactly that worked. And yeah. Yeah. Mandy? Oh, I didn't, I don't have a comment on that one. I was just raising my hand for something else. Over something different. Okay, no, that's okay. And I do think looking at the rules again, it does say in there and we'll look at that part again, but it does say that something along the lines of if a committee asks, you know, then we should consider, we'll have to bring it up to look exactly at what it says. I, oh, please, Jennifer. So I just wanted to add that, because I have a concern also where some committees gonna feel slighted if they didn't, you know, have a liaison. And I didn't actually realize until the last meeting that there are like 36 different committees. And that's why I think Lynn cautioned against reaching out to all of them just, you know, we don't have that capacity. So anyway, I was shocked to learn that. Yeah. And I think Amika made a great point in her comments that many of them are interacting with Paul, you know, for, and so there is some sort of interaction that is occurring between the, like a directly where Paul is interacting with them. So I think that was one of the points that Anika had brought up. And Paul actually agreed to that when we met. Okay, Mandy. So just, I know you have something else. Is it pertaining to this list here still? Okay, go on. Yes. I noticed that you saw, in addition to trying to draft a motion on this for recommendation, which is what I was typing, I noticed the board of licensed commissioners is not on this list. And I'm torn about this. And so I wanted to bring it up. I'm one of the counselors that said, I believe it needs one. It was one of the places where I saw last term, the liaison actually was useful in bringing forth some potential matters that the board of health needed our help on that if we hadn't had someone following the meetings and their actions might have resulted in no action from the council and therefore then overstepping of bounds by the board in terms of public way matters that we were able to solve because there was a liaison watching the regulations they were adopting and some of the things they were doing. So I actually saw that was almost the only committee I truly saw where a liaison was like, whoa, you need council action here, let's make it happen. I've been in touch with the board of licensed commissioners for a couple of reasons. And the one board member I've been most in touch with is hopeful there is a liaison. At the same time, I realized Alyssa believed that they had gotten themselves on enough sound footing that we don't need one to the board that they're operating extremely well and we don't need it. I am concerned there's certain things I'm actually working on with them that have come through a prior chair and the board now for modifications to bylaws. At the same time, I think we're almost done with some of the stuff they need us for that we've pretty much given them the authority they need for anything they might need. And so maybe we don't need one. So this is why I'm torn. I'm like, I'm gonna still do my contact with them to make the proposals on bylaw changes that they're going to need and that they're looking at proposals for. Yet that's sort of a liaison role, right? I mean, to bring stuff there, yet I'm not sure we truly need one for the next year or two because I think they're almost, as Alyssa said, set and are good. But I wanted to bring that up as to where do people think about a situation like that? Yeah, I'll add, I was really torn on this one too. And so I called Alyssa actually because I wanted to understand where that recommendation she had made on the previous council toward the end had come from. And basically she said what you just said, Mandy. She thought that sort of transition to them having that footing was really important to her. And she now in her mind feels like they are on that solid footing and that they don't need a liaison anymore. But I do think that what you're saying in terms of the things that you've been interacting with them about those things are important. And so I wonder if that can just continue informally and then see how they do without one. And Mandy, I'm sorry, Pat, did you? Or no, Anika, did you have your hand up? I did, but you covered it. I was just wondering if there was some kind of informal type of check-in that could go on. So if there's anything that needs to be caught ahead of time then it would be it or whomever. Yeah, I mean, I will say the things I'm working on with them now will, that will continue whether or not they have a liaison, right? I've reached out to them. I've drafted some language and it relates to fee issues and bylaws. I will just put that out there now. And so that's an ongoing conversation. It's just during those conversations they were like, oh, a liaison might be helpful, right? And so I wanted to bring that forward. Although I'm also torn because I'm not sure after this next set, there's been a couple of things we've needed to do to help the board do its work as a council in terms of bylaw modifications in terms of public ways, authority, granting and stuff. And I think this one thing I'm working on now might actually be the last one as long as TSO revisits the second half of the referral on the public ways issue related to lunch carts and stuff. Cause I think they only got through half their referral. I think those are sort of the last lingering things. And so if they really are the last lingering things then they probably don't need a liaison anymore, right? And if they've got people already in touch with them for that then maybe we don't need to add that as an extra liaison thing. Cause right now if I'm counting, we've got one, two, three, four, five, six plus the four in here, which is 10, which is a lot. Any other comments about this particular board of licensed commissioners whether that should be added or not? I feel like with Doug Slaughter on that committee he's an incredibly experienced because he's been a select board member. I think they're in a really strong position and certainly would reach out if they needed help. So I don't think they need one. So I think the general sense is that they do not need one but that Mandy will continue to serve informally as she's working on these final things. Yes, Mandy. Continue, I had a different... Oh, okay. Yes, I have good. So let's move on and go ahead, please Mandy. So I understand the potential need for a liaison to the board of health because of their regulatory powers and similar to where the board of licensed commissioners was at one point and all. I'm struggling with why the CPA needs a liaison and also why the council on aging does. So if anyone could help me out with those ones because I still don't quite support those in looking at councilor commitments and stuff and trying not to overburden us. Those are two I don't quite understand at this point why they would need them a liaison. Jennifer. I can speak to the council on aging. I think that came about because there is a councilor that wanted to be the liaison to that committee. Now, whether that could just again be informal but I think that may be how that came about. I mean, believe Dorothy Pam has been serving as like a liaison to that committee. So that's my understanding of how that came to be there. And I think for some reason, Paul suggested keeping that on there and I don't remember why, but is there some new work happening and help me remember there's a new initiative that's happening with older adults and I'm not sure if the council on aging is working with, is part of that initiative that's just a little more information. I see Anika and Jennifer both have their hands up. Jennifer, did you wanna just add to what? It's the reimagining aging in Amherst. I think that's the initiative. And is that happening through the council on aging? Yes, it is. Okay, Anika. Have, let's see. Have these committees requested a liaison, do we know? Yeah, I don't, I, council on aging, I think Jennifer hit the nail on the head. I think Dorothy really wanted to be a liaison and has been a liaison to that committee. And not sure about any requests. Mandy, maybe Mandy knows. As far as I don't know, but again, you know, not too, Dorothy has been the liaison to council on aging. Kathy has been the liaison to CPAC. Kathy has regularly reported CPAC's progress on their recommendations to the council while she's been a liaison. I'm not sure I've ever heard a report from Dorothy on council of aging on anything. So while there's been a liaison there, it's a lot of times we never even get a report. That's not to say Dorothy's been doing anything wrong. It's just part of why I'm not understanding why a liaison ship is necessary for that committee. And with CPAC, we obviously deal with their recommendations every year, but they're so well established that I'm still not sure we need a liaison versus people who just wanna follow the committee, right? Like they know they need to submit a report to us. They submit their report. When they're done with it, right? And so I just, again, thinking about our own time and commitments that these recommendations if followed then require of counselors, I'm just not sure those two make sense. Would it make sense because sitting through finance yesterday and now for two meetings, reviewing the CPA committee's recommendations, there have been some really interesting things that have come up that need further kind of review and evaluation. What it makes sense to do the CPA committee like we're doing, the planning, affordable housing, DAC and TAC to have a person that's on the finance committee be that sort of, because that's where it seems most relevant, right? Is they bring it first to the finance committee. The finance committee discusses it and then makes recommendations to the council. Would that feel more like a better way of recommending that one? And Jennifer, you have your hand up and also Anika. So Jennifer and then Anika. Thank you. So I think since we do revisit this, seems like annually or at least with each new council session that I think if we have a counselor who wants to serve as a liaison to the council on aging that I don't see what harm there is in that and we could ask her to make regular reports. She also, talking about Dorothy Pam represents a district with a large elderly population. So I think that's also a part of her interests. And there is a large elderly population in Amherst. So I don't see what harm there is in having a liaison for this council session. And it could be revisited during the next term if we have, yeah. And if there's an interest in, I think, a need. Thank you, Anika. Yes, I think that probably Amherst in general has a large aging population, right? But so also with, so my question with Michelle, so seeing as you are already meeting with the committee, with the committee preservation, is it necessary to have that additional liaison or is this something that just the finance committee could report on when they're giving their reports, just including that in, to lessen spreading people out since you're in any way that it could just be. That's my feeling. I mean, the finance committee has to report out on those, you know, on that, on their recommendations to the full council. So if we're wanting to make this lean and really be able to focus our capacity, I don't see a strong argument for keeping it myself. If it was gonna, you know, the only, I highlighted it because sort of the finance aspect of it. And so my only suggestion would be to have it be one of these sort of like to have someone like Kathy who's on the finance committee continue to serve, but have it be indicated that the reason for having a liaison to that committee is like these other ones, how it interacts with finance. So that's my feeling on that. Does that, does that answer your question, Anika? It does. Pat, do you have any thoughts on this? Well, I was thinking if there is going to be a liaison, it would be to CPAC, it would be good if it were a finance committee member, but I don't see the need for that liaison, but. Jennifer? This is the little jumping around. I guess I just also wanted to add in terms of the council on aging, that since the interest is also from the councilor who chairs the TSO, that that also makes sense for her to be the liaison. I guess I do see council on aging as being an important part of services, you know, to our elderly population. Absolutely, yeah. I just wanna make sure that we keep our conversation centered around the actual committees and less around the individual counselors. Not that I don't see that as an important connection, but just to sort of make it equitable for all, because there might be, I think Pat expressed that disability access advisory committee was important to her. So I just, if I wanna keep our mind focused on what we think are the committees that most need it and how to structure it so that we're getting the best value out of that relationship. I guess I would put in a plug for the, you know, I think the council on aging, you know, again, because we have such a large elderly population in the town is one that is deserving of a liaison, especially since we have the chair of the TSO would like to put, you know, serve as that liaison. So it's not taxing somebody's time who doesn't, you know, have the time. Yeah. Mandy? Yeah, you know, I respect that we know of someone who wants to serve on it, but we can't assume that's the only person that might want to serve as a liaison to a specific committee or that they would be appointed by the council to that committee. There are probably other committees that we don't know about who would, who have counselors who would love to quote be a liaison to those committees. I don't think the fact that we know of a counselor that is interested in being a liaison should, should factor into whether we recommend a liaison for that committee, that the council formalize a liaison role for that committee. I think we should be concentrating on does that committee need a liaison? You know, I just during this meeting said, hey, I'd be willing to be one for the board of license commissioners, but I don't know whether they need one or not, right? And we determine maybe they don't, right? And just like, you know, I haven't mentioned the recreation committee, the liaison who, I'm not even sure who we had as liaison to the recreation committee. I don't think we ever received a report from the liaison to the recreation committee on the council for three years. Just like, you know, so it's not just the council on aging that we never did. And I want to make that clear. It's not one particular person that didn't make reports. There were many, many of these committees that didn't actually formalize that a liaison never reported onto the council. And the councils on aging is one of those that I see is I don't understand what that liaison would do because I'm not sure what the council on aging needs the council for. And that's part of the late liaison role is to facilitate that conversation for things that the council will need to act on. I'm just still struggling with why the council on aging needs a liaison for that facilitation. You know, I could make the same argument with I guess the campus and community coalition in terms of a quote liaison versus a representative to report on contacts and conversations, right? You know, if we're going to say because there's a lot of aging people in town and elderly people in town, we need a liaison there. Well, we absolutely then need one for the CCC because there's a lot of students in town too, right? You know, and maybe, you know, I feel like the CCC one is necessary because I feel like we've had strained relationships with the university. I'm not sure that same necessity in my mind applies to the council on aging, which is why I'm really struggling with that recommendation in particular. I'm going to go to Anika, but before that, I just want to ask, would it be helpful to look at the charge of the council on aging? Just to remind ourselves what that council, or I'm sorry, what they're doing and how they might, because I see your point, Mandy, about, you know, what do they need the council for? And I think that that's an important thing for us to keep in mind as opposed to how we're thinking about someone who wants to be a representative to just make reports. I think those are different things. Please, Anika. Yeah, so even, you know, going back to, if I understood clearly that Paul had pointed out that if someone wanted to have, the council wanted to have interaction with these committees, they could do so. I'm also concerned that we think TSO, there are quite a few vulnerable populations in Amherst. So if we just as TSO come out and say, okay, council, if aging to Mandy just point, I mean, we have a lot of vulnerable people there. There's a lot of students, I'm homeless students. I mean, we have homeless residents. You know, we have people struggling in many different capacities. So, you know, especially with TSO and we're talking about people and you know, services to many vulnerable and underserved populations. And will we come across that we're singling out and saying just a council of aging and why is that? So those are just my questions there. Mandy. I just shared the webpage for the council on aging, which has this one blurb on responsibilities. Yeah, see. Pat, please. Yeah, it does seem like it's directly connected to the town manager. And it just seems the executive director, but it just seems like adding a liaison, an official liaison is not needed. And certainly Dorothy can attend these meetings. And it's like I can attend DACA meetings even if I'm not the liaison because there is some benefit in it becoming from TSO, which is not a committee I'm on. So that's kind of... And I think it's important to remember that in our, during our town council meetings, when we get to councilor comments, we can, if we are like, Jennifer, you said you attend planning, I mean, there are, there is that time where we can make comments. I think it's sort of like a free moment to make a comment or comments about something that is going on for us as counselors. So that might be an opportunity for somebody who's informally providing that relationship to talk about it, but please, Jennifer. No, I just wanted to say this, this is not like they want to die on. I just thought if we had somebody that wanted to be the liaison, there seemed like there were, I guess those three Xs were that was the number of people on the council that listed community council on aging as being when they want to have liaison. So it's fine if Dorothy is just an informal liaison to that committee, whatever it's, you know, I could go either way on this. Okay, okay, good. Should we bring the list back up one more time, Mandi, just so that we can, or are you working on emotion? I did have one additional committee that I wanted to ask about. I am wondering if anyone has background on the Human Rights Commission with respect to whether it was ever discussed for them to have a liaison, whether they've ever requested one, whether anybody sees a need for that commission to have one. It just, it's sort of, it seems like, I don't know why it came to me. So if there's no other comments than it probably means there's nothing super strong there, Mandi. So I will say it probably came to you because many of the proclamations GOL deals with are technically situated and come from the Human Rights Commission, right? There's a lot of things that we do that technically is proposed by the Human Rights Commission. And so that might be why you were like, huh, maybe they need one. Yeah, I think so. So that's what I wanted to say. I don't know, you know, they don't do a lot other than proclamations in terms of interaction with the council. I will say that. And Jennifer Moyston, I must say, has been a fantastic sort of, staff liaison between the Human Rights Commission and that council on those issues related to proclamations. Yeah, you know what, I think you are absolutely right that that's one of the reasons. The other reason was I was thinking somehow about the DEI department that's getting started and the DEI director that's coming on. And for some reason, I thought that that person may be interacting with the Human Rights Commission. I'm not sure if that's true or not. But that sort of is what felt, oh, is this year going to be a year where the Human Rights Commission is going to have more sort of work in front of them and some new territory given there's a DEI committee or a whole DEI department that we've now brought online. That feels, may I? No, Rika, if you had your hand up, please. Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead. I was just gonna say it seems to me that the DEI director and associate director would have direct contact with the Human Rights Commission and I feel like that would be enough of a bridge. I mean, I would like, yeah, I don't know. I had a clearer statement, but I lost it. But I feel like that the DEI director and the whole department would have a direct line to Human Rights Commission. And that actually may be facilitating change in growth in the Human Rights Commission. But I think it should come from there. Anika. Yes, I was just gonna say, would the director coming on, I think that they would actually have more support and more interaction that would, I'm not sure exactly where their workload would increase. Yeah. Where the Human Rights Commission's work would increase, but I think that they would have more support because there is going to be a whole department. Okay, good. Yeah, so I'm not strongly advocating for it. I just wanted to sort of bring those things up as potential. I think it's great that you brought it up. Yeah, to do. Okay, so let's see. We have some potential motion, a potential motion that Mandy has crafted for us. So maybe we just wanna take a moment to look at that. I did it based on the conversation, so. I just, something is striking me here. And I'm the one who highlighted the CCC and really feel strongly, I've sort of informally been sitting in that role. I think it's really important. I'm just, I'm a little bit confused given it's not a town committee, can we actually, it feels like the better recommendation here for that one would be to say where it's relevant, like for counselors who are in a district that are impacted by the university or for whatever other reasons to have, to recommend that that has representatives that attend those meetings and then report back some reporting, but that it's not an official liaison because I just don't really see how that can be possible given it's not a council, it's not a committee of the town. So I was gonna say something similar not because it's not a committee of the town, but more of the, when Michelle, you said, hey, if people attend meetings, they can report stuff during councilor comments, right? And that's what George did with the CCC over the last three years. He just during councilor comments would say, hey, this interesting thing was talked about at the CCC meeting I went to. He'd do that for other meetings too and others would too. So I was leaning towards saying similar of like maybe we delete that bullet point from this potential motion and say, that's up to the counselors that are interested in it to then say something during councilor comments. Michelle disappeared, but Anika. Maybe we could work something out with like surrounding districts and at large where we can make sure someone's attending. At least meetings. So it's not too much on any one person. So are you? Jennifer? Well, Michelle, I was just, hey, I agree with Anika. And I forget what I was going to say. I'm sorry, I had a knock on the door. I stepped away while you were gone. We pretty much decided to delete this bullet point, I think. Yeah, is that I didn't even get to read that one. I didn't even get to read that one, but if it was the CCC. Okay, so we're going to just, are we going to make any recommendation with respect to the CCC? No, okay. Yeah, so then a CRC member to planning more. Looks good to me. Well, not that, that's not what you all needed. So we need to read the patent. We need to read the motion and then get it seconded. All right, I'm going to read it. Okay. To recommend the town of Point Laisons to town committees as follows. A CRC. Oh, it should be the town council, sorry. Yeah. Yes. To recommend the town council of Point Laisons to town committees as follows, a CRC member to planning board and the AMAHT, a TSO member to DAAC and TAC and a counselor to board of health, CSSJ and ECAC. Is there a second? I'll second. Yes, I had to turn my mute off. All right, I think was it low, was it Anika or Mandy that seconded it first? Jennifer can have it. Or it was Jennifer, whoever. Yeah. I heard Anika's voice first, and then. I think I was just laughing. Oh, okay, so Jennifer seconds it and then any further discussion? The only further discussion I would add is, does this need to come with any recommendation with respect to the rules? And just saying that we are continuing to review the rules as it pertains to Laisons or can that just be kept as a separate? Does that not need to be included in this recommendation? I think that's a separate report. Okay, perfect. All right, any other discussion? All right, so Pat. Yes. Yes. Jennifer, how do you vote? Yes. Okay, Mandy. I. Anika. I. And Michelle is an I. So that's great. Excellent. Okay, so I feel really productive now. We get one report is done. So Mandy and Pat, this I assume comes as a separate memo to Lynn outside of the town council report that I would do for GOL. Is that correct? Or can it can be? It's part of that report because the council as a whole appoints liaisons. So I would potentially send Lynn the motion earlier maybe then the report because she might choose to then send a memo to the council requesting people think about and, you know, ahead of this recommendation, she might choose to do something else with it, but it can just be in the report. Perfect. Okay, great. All right. So I said I was gonna go ahead and look at the time when we finished that. And so it's 10 08. And I'd like us to be finished by 11 to honor the time commitment that we've made. So we could, is there any strong feeling one way or another about whether we should do the Tibetan national uprising day proclamation and just, and get that done and then see what time we have left. In that case, we would definitely need to report to the council that we're not finished with the rules of procedure or do we wanna go to the rules of procedure and hold off on the Tibetan national until next time, Mandy. I would say do the proclamation to get it over with because I'm not sure in 50 minutes we're gonna get through all the rules anyway. And so we can potentially, if we get the proclamation over with, free up more time at the next meeting to really concentrate on rules. I think that's great. Pat, did you have- I agree with that, but I also wanna get in here somewhere today, the review of the committee organization, the proposal of reducing the number of people on committees and stuff like that. I think that's a fairly important issue. So I'd like to see it addressed soon. Sure, yes. So the Tibetan national uprising day proclamation has to be completed by the end of our next meeting. We've been working on the rules of procedure and haven't really made it through very far. So I really feel like that needs to be a priority, but we could certainly dedicate, maybe what we'll do is we'll do the proclamation and then we could dedicate whatever time we have left to having a first sort of broad discussion about the committee structure before we end. Does that work? Okay, does that work, Pat? Yeah, yeah. Okay, great. Yeah, the other thing is the proclamation is the same proclamation that's been used for a couple of years with date change. No, what was changed, Mandy? I'll point that out when we get to it. Okay, because when I read through, I didn't notice it. Yeah, no, there were some small changes. I would say as long as we start next meeting with the rules, I'm okay with the plan to talk about the committee structure today because I think we might be able to get mostly through it today with the time we have, but I wanna make sure the first item the next agenda is the rules then. Great, I would like to ask, is it possible for me to turn over the chair for five minutes, I have to take care of something to either Pat or Mandy, who have experienced- Well, Anika's the vice chair. Oh, that's right. That's the way to do it. Thank you for that reminder. Yes, Anika, would you be so willing just to chair us for the next five minutes? I just have to take care of something really quickly. So I think Mandy's gonna bring up the proclamation and you guys can just start working on that and then I will be back quickly. Does that, is that okay, Anika? You need to unmute, Anika. Okay. Okay, I'll be right back. Thank you. And looking at it. Anika, would you like me to go through the changes? Yes, please. So I don't know who's sponsoring this on the- I am. Anyone else, Pat? Not that I know of. Okay, cause there was a whole list last year. I honestly don't know. Sure are, I'm hearing you in the background. There are other folks who would like to sponsor this, including Lynn and Shalini. I was gonna say Shalini was probably one of them. Yeah. Yes, and I'd also like to add my name to sponsor this, please. I think I got everyone now. Anyone else wanna be on the list? So that's the first change. All of the rest here, the whereas as I bolded. So basic there. Last year there was a comma after culture. We do the Oxford comma tend to. So, and then I think that's all that's showing on this screen. So unless people- Oh, last year it was also a comma and not a semi-colon. That might have been a transfer thing. Any other changes that aren't showing in the first four paragraphs before I page down? I'm just gonna page down. Yes. Okay, so let's run one, two, three, four. So the next ones are the next three. No, the next two were in last year's proclamation. And then there were some that were not in the proclamation last year. And Pat, the proclamation last year also had some that were deleted from this year. And I think that's in an attempt to sort of make it similar year after year or get rid of some of the things that happened within the last year so that those don't be changed year on year. I apologize, I didn't look at this carefully. So a comma after Asia there. So a lot of these are that way. Commas and just wording there. We like to keep it one sentence per whereas in GOL. So this whereas was actually all of those sentences that I've highlighted the two. And so I couldn't figure out how to make that one sentence. So I split it and made each one of them one sentence. And then the next one was again an attempt to make it one sentence instead of three. And if people are having trouble reading it in this marked up way, I can show it non-marked up. Now the marked up way helps, at least it helps me. I don't know if it helps everyone. No, it's great to see the changes. Yeah. Shall I page down further? And then the only other changes other than the last whereas always gets a period fixing our standardization of the voted this blank day of blank. And in here, we don't, this is a Alyssa holdover. Alyssa needed the word hoisting of a flag. So we're attempting as we get through these this year and last year, we missed this one last year to change it to raising the flag instead of hoisting the flag. The memory of Alyssa will live on in the way Thank God. flags. Absolutely. At the Black History Month flag raising, I, there was a lot that went into actually getting the flag raised and everything is interesting. That's because it's hoisted. That's what I'm saying. I'm gonna have to become a liaison to the pro hoisting committee. That's funny. So those were my recommended changes. I'm just gonna check to make sure there weren't any other counselors that I missed in terms of sponsorship. No. Okay. And it's still sponsored by the Regional Tibetan Association. Yes, it is. Do we know if Sering Dundup is still president? I would have to check that. I'm sorry. I know he was president, but he may have. Yeah, that might. I can try to check quickly. I pulled that from last year. So that's why. Yeah, it may. I think it's a different person this year. We can leave the president out and just say Regional Tibetan Association of Massachusetts, which means then every year we don't have to check who their president is. I'm fine with that. But if there's no reason that it has to be in there, the registered agent is, no, that's not it. Okay. It's easier for us if we just refer to the association. Yeah, I think so. And potentially. There is a new president. Pardon me? And more consistent, whenever we refer to like the Human Rights Commission, we don't say who's chair. Yeah. And this, there was a change because I met the new president at a Tibetan dinner. But I am frustrated with myself right now. It's okay. Yeah. We're going to be consistent by not naming the president or chairs of these community sponsored organizations. Any other changes? So I think we can make a motion then. I move to... Go ahead, Pat. Yep. To recommend the Tibetan uprising, proclamation as amended. Clear, consistent and actionable. Yep. Thanks. Sharpa, Nika. I'm never going to forgive you for that comment. I stand by it. Seconds. Okay, Jennifer seconds. And Mandy, how do you vote? Any further discussion? Mandy? I. I'm an I, Nika? I. Jennifer? I. Pat? I. Great. Okay. We are getting some work done. This is great. All right. So yes, it is 1020. I think the, I think that what Mandy suggested is good. The rules of procedure are certainly a little bit, there's some lifting that we're going to do with that review, I believe. So just to be clear from my end, I will let Lynn know that our report is that we're not completed with the rules of procedure. And I will include that in my report. So let's move to, we do have to have a public comment period as well. I'm not seeing anybody in the attendees. So let's pull up, well, actually before we do that, I wanted to point out, we're moving on now to our presentation and discussion items, town council standing committee structure. I wanted to point us to the rules of procedure 10.2 D, which I don't think are surprising to anyone, but so the prop, the 10.2 is the process to establish council committees. 10.2 D says the council shall review its committee organization each year. And as a GOL committee, we're tasked with doing that. So we also had a counselor, Pam, who has sent in and I've included in the packet, her ideas about restructuring. But before we take a look at that, I'd like to just sort of open us up into a broader discussion to share our thoughts on this. And Pat, do you wanna start since you had? Sure, I think the thing that the question about proposing committees be reduced to three people, I feel really strongly opposed to that. I think it limits the range of opinion that that can exist on a committee. And I think that range is important. So I would hate to see any committee reduced to three people. Was that on Councilor Rooney's recommendations that you're referring to? Yes, it was. Okay, okay. Jennifer. Well, I just wanted to respond to, I guess following on what Pat said. Yeah, I mean, I don't disagree about that. When you reduce it to three, you do have a smaller range of points of view. I think that maybe the recommendation came about not because it was a desire to have fewer people, but that if we were going to create, have some committees perhaps have not as, had so much on its plate that if we were gonna create another committee, would we then have to reduce the number? I think that's how it came about. And this may be, this is just a comment and there's probably, it's maybe I'm sure too late and maybe would be confusing to the public to change committee names. But as someone who until a month ago was just a member, you know, changing public, I always found it confusing the name community resources committee and town services and organization committee, which seemed that names have very little to do with what the committees do. So if you were someone in the public that was interested in zoning and land use and economic development, it wouldn't probably occur to you to go look up the community resources committee. So again, that's, I just put that out there that I think it's again, it's like these, those two committees, their names have like nothing to do with what their charges are. I don't know if we can do anything about that. Just a comment. Yeah. Pat, did you wanna respond to something with that first? Yeah, I just wanna thank you. I just wanted to say that we used to have five committees and the thing that we looked at said five but there are only four committees listed. The fifth committee was OCA outreach, something. Reach communications and appointments, but that was when we had an audit committee as a formal committee too. Yeah, the audit committee, which it was a very small committee got put into finance, which where it belonged and OCA got divided up. So I guess what I'm really saying is I'm not afraid if there's a fifth committee. I think that that could be handled rather easily because we've worked with that structure before. Mandy? So I wanted to comment on the potential to reduce to three members. I understand the desire in terms of dealing with counselor capacity, right? And I know I'm always one that says we have limited capacity. How do we do this, right? Because it's not just our standing committees that counselors serve on. We have three on JCPC. We have two on the school building committee. We have one on the library building committee. Some of those will go on for more years than others but there's other committees in here that we've got counselors serving on in addition to the standing committees. But I'm always concerned at three because any two of those members can never talk about any committee business with each other because it would be an open meeting law violation. And that we already have so many concerns about open meeting law with a group of 13 and seven and five, right? And I mean, how many times have three of us on CRC already been together and been like, oh, we got to stop a conversation. Now imagine if it's two, right? And you're trying to talk about agenda setting without ever talking about substance. It becomes much more problematic. And so I get concerned about anything that says three. Unless it's a committee where it's unlikely to have conversations on those subject matters outside of committee. But I'm not sure there's any committee like that except maybe audit when we had an audit committee. That was probably one of the ones that I think could have truly handled three without an issue regarding open meeting law. But I'm not sure any other committee of our council can do that. I'd be willing to consider name changes, Jennifer, despite the people are starting to do it. I actually think town services and outreach communicates what it does okay. Unfortunately, it never dealt with outreach. That's part of the problem. I think what Pam Rooney was sort of indicating with the potential for a fifth committee, community resources committee, I'm not sure what we would do it to, but if you've got suggestions, I think I'd be open to hearing them. I don't think that committee names need to be set in stone at this point in time. They're only, CRC is only two years old at this point, I think on committee names, you know? I don't, to respond to Pat and then I'll be quiet. I don't know about numbers of committees, right? I read the potential for pulling outreach out, which has a potential desire, right? Town services didn't deal with outreach. OCO when we had it didn't deal with outreach. One of the reasons GOL restructured was in hopes of figuring out how a committee could find time to deal with outreach, right? And the committees have yet not done it. I don't know whether that's a committee if we just stuck outreach to a specific committee, whether that one could have three, that might be possible. I don't know. I do get concerned again with capacity with five. I'd have to look at specifically numbers. And then I also get concerned not just with capacity with meeting times, which is another issue, but we've already struggled with our committees this year figuring out when they can meet without overlapping with other committees. And so I think we have to be cognizant of that. The more council committees we create, the harder it is to find meeting times for those committees. But I'm not opposed to considering a fifth committee because I think we've short-shifted outreach and this might be a solution to not doing that. Yeah, I will say I support both name changes potentially as well as having a committee that focuses on outreach. And that could include economic development outreach, which I know Anika has spoken about, that could include anchor institutions like UMass and Amherst College. And so I think that that would actually be a very beneficial committee to have and one that would allow for focus on some really important matters that I think are sort of falling through the cracks at times and that could, if we put some real work into could really be a huge benefit throughout the whole town. So that's my feeling on that. And yes, Jennifer. I agree with that. And I do think, because I believe now arts and culture and economic development are within the CRC purview and those might be more appropriate, might reduce some of CRC scope and would be appropriate in an outreach committee. Yeah, arts and culture, economic development and perhaps town and gown could be sort of in that umbrella. Anika. Yeah, so was the consensus that so arts and culture, town and gown and then economic development would be too much to put over to TSO and have that outreach be activated? Was that the concern coming from this that that would be too much to put on because I know that outreach definitely needs to be or at least my outreach definitely needs to be like top list or like have bigger presence with TSO as it is one of the initials. Yeah, are you on TSO Anika? Okay, who else is on TSO here? Okay, yeah, I think my understanding is that there's sort of a running joke that the O in TSO is non-existent in some ways or has not been fully realized for whatever reasons, because town services takes up a lot of the runway of the work, so yes, Jennifer. Yeah, I mean, I always associate TSO with transportation and actually when I wasn't on the council almost for a while I just thought the T was for transportation. So yeah, I don't know if the transportation and parking issues are taking up so much because they're huge, so much of the TSO focus that the outreach has kind of gotten lost. I didn't have a, I'm sorry, can I go ahead? No, yeah. I didn't have a similar experience where it was like what are the concerns and it was like, okay, people, you know and working in the people because you know, how, even if we're just how are we discussing town services without people? You know, without outreach, so. But I definitely agree that there needs to be a commitment to it. Yeah, and I wonder if it could be a subcommittee. I mean, given the fact that parking is gonna take up and a lot and transportation is gonna continue to take up a lot of time I think in the next, in the next period of time. Does a subcommittee make any kind of sense or are we, I guess, Anika, yeah, I'm curious what you. I agree because if you think about it even with TSO you would have some members that would probably be more concerned or more focused on, you know parking and sidewalks and that when we're all there then maybe is it possible to split, you know or to have something, whether it's in TSO or does it need to be separate, you know where that focuses more on the outreach and working with appropriate organizations. Jennifer. Yeah, I was just wondering in terms of capacity and if you were to form a fifth committee, how many does anybody know how many council members now are only on one committee? I know Pam Mooney is on one committee. So I mean, I'm just wondering if there's enough counselors only on one. So there are 20 councilor spots for council committees which means in theory seven are on two, right? We have four council committees, five members, five counselors each, that's 20, we have 13 counselors that means half of the counselors are on two. Adding a fifth committee would require nearly every counselor to be on two council committees. And then there are three JCPC counselors. There are two building, school building committee. There's one library building committee. So that's six additional committee assignments there BCG has some committee assigned has the three people on it, but meets so irregularly that it probably doesn't add much commitment to it unlike the school building committee and the library trustees. JCPC is a very concentrated eight week every week for eight weeks and then done. But school building and library building are going to be as intensive as a council committee. So that's an extra three. So we're looking at right now we have 18 plus three JCPC sort of commitments. So that's 21, we add five more, we're at 20. No, we have 20 plus three plus three, which is 26 commitments already we add five more, we're at 31. So there would be some that need to be on three. There are already some on three. I don't know whether I'm the only one I serve on GOL, CRC and JCPC. I don't know whether there's anyone else. Well, Anika's on the library Jones library building and TSO so Anika's on three too then GOL, TSO and library commission. Kathy's on three JCPC school building and finance. And that I want to counsel and one you've got you've got the non-council one, Michelle. Yeah. So there's a couple of us that are already on three. And there's someone one and there's someone one. Yeah, I think Anna is only on TSO. Is that right? Or OK, my understanding it was at her request because she's VP. And yes, and that makes sense. And Lynn, I think is Lynn not allowed to be on finance. She's on finance. That's right. She is on finance and president. So that's like the equivalent of the committee. Yeah. And then the question was if the outreach could have three people, I don't know, maybe it couldn't because they would be they would be discussing outreach issues. That would be a problem. So I see that Pat had her hand up and Anika had her hand has her hand up as well. I do want to bring up the charge for TSO so that we can look at it. But let's go ahead and Pat and then Anika, please. Yeah, I just wanted to comment. We were talking about maybe outreach being a subcommittee of TSO and and that really is up to the committee. It's not up to GOL to say to the committee, you have to have a subcommittee. So that that made me uncomfortable. I'm not saying that maybe there doesn't need to be a whole new committee, but determining subcommittees is not our charge. You're absolutely right. Yes. Can you make that bigger? Yes, I can try. And Anika. Yes, so I'm not speaking for TSO, but I do know that there are conversations around that. And perhaps you could have the counselors that really are focused on the outreach or have interest. Like I know for myself, my entire background is pretty much economic development, arts and culture and outreach. So it's just something that I'm naturally passionate about. But I'm also I'm also passionate about, you know, retaining my capacity to be, you know, to function at my best. So, you know, maybe there's that possibility because I think especially when we all we all are spread out, but if you have maybe some people that's just naturally what they do or background, it could be, you know, easier, not you wouldn't be as as spread out as much, you know, just going that out as an option. So I'm just reviewing this quickly. Can everyone see this bat? Can you see it? I can see it now. Thank you. OK. Anika, from your perspective, how much work is being done with the community participation officers? Is that is that something that has come up in meetings? Well, we are just structuring. We actually had a questionnaire that came in terms of, you know, similar to what we did here, but what are those priorities? So I expect that the next meeting will have that. But I know at the top of my list was, you know, outreach. And, you know, outreach and community participation. So I would expect that, you know, after this next meeting will move forward, we had a little elapsed with DSO, some of the meetings accommodating, you know, trying to fit in Thursday is around other committees meeting. Yeah, and that's a problem that Mandy was referring to, which is, again, the scheduling problem becomes that's a real problem in adding another committee would certainly add to that. Does it feel like sort of to the point that you were making, Pat, you know, which I think is really well made about it's not our, you know, it's not our purview to decide on subcommittees for a particular committee, but is there any cons consultation? We're lucky to have Anika here. But would sort of the whole committee want to be consulted if we were going to go and say, hey, we're going to pull this out. And, you know, or is that a larger council discussion, Mandy? So that was actually one of the things I was just going to suggest is it looks like we're talking about potentially removing duties from both TSO and CRC and creating another committee and putting those duties in that other committee. And so reaching out to both of those committees and asking those committees to discuss that potential removal of those duties into a new committee would be polite from chair to chair. Obviously, I'm the chair of CRC, so I can take that direction from you, Michelle, in a meeting here. But I know last time GOL did this reorganization and essentially renamed OKA to something else and completely changed its duties. We had a lot of pushback at the council when we did it and proposed it to the council without having prior consulted the committees separately. And I could be remembering wrong, but I believe there was some pushback of why didn't you talk to us before you made this proposal? So we don't obviously have charges for the new committee, but I think we're sort of discussed what things would come out of each. So if Michelle talks to the committee chairs of each committee and says, here's thinking of removing from the committee and here's some of the reasons we'd like your committee's feedback on whether they would support such a removal to a new committee. That could take us to, you know, getting that feedback while also drafting all of the changes in charges and new charges. I would say two months, two meetings from now. I don't know whether it could all be done within the next before the next CR, the next GOL meeting, but two meetings from now on GOL, we might be able to have all of that to be able to potentially vote on a recommendation for with the actual documents and the changes to the rules that would need to be made and all of that drafted. OK, and we also talked about name changes, which is sort of a separate possible matter. Yes, Anika. So when this last restructure happened, many were counselors moved around as well. The restructure happened at the time of a complete council restructuring. I think the council voted the new committees right about the time right around January. And so it happened at the same time. All committees were being reappointed by the just elected president or she was reelected, but where they so. So there was I mean, there was moving around, but there was not. I think most of the people that had been on the outreach communications and appointments committee moved to the TSO committee. And also, I think there was a lot of overlap. But it was done at the sort of restructuring time in January, February, I believe. Yeah, and it seems it would make sense that folks that are on that committee, there would be a lot of overlap already. OK, so it's 1045 and I'm going to stop the share on this real quick. We do have somebody an attendee, so I would like to move to a public comment period, unless there are any other any other comments on this discussion for right now. OK, so just to reiterate, I will reach out to the chairs of TSO and CRC and ask for their feedback with respect to this. And we will see how far we get between now and the next meeting, but potentially in two meetings from now, we'll be able to discuss in terms of name changes. I would ask for you to send me any input you have in terms of name changes that that we could work from a list and start looking and brainstorming on that between now and the next meeting. All right, so let's see here. Sorry, I just want to get my general public comment. OK, so public comments on matters within the jurisdiction of the GOL. Residents are welcome to express their views for up to three minutes at the discretion of the GOL chair based upon the number of people who want to speak. GOL will not engage in a dialogue or comment on a matter raised during public comment. To participate in public comment, please use the raise hand function now. And I will call on you and bring you into the room to speak if you'd like to make public comment. OK. So it doesn't look like we have any public comment today. And so see here. We may just end a little bit early. I want to do a quick review of our future agenda items to make sure we're all on the same page about that. So it sounds to me like we're going to focus our energy at our next meeting on getting through the rules of procedure. If we have the information we need after doing this outreach to CRC and TSO chairs and getting some names brainstormed, then we'll use our meeting next week to continue that discussion. I'm also looking here to make sure we don't have any other questions. So child abuse, awareness, proclamation needs to be reviewed by March 21st. So we have a little bit of time on that one. And. No, I don't think that's coming here yet. So we can wait on that one. OK, are there any other agenda items that members would like to add? Yes, Pat. You had brought up last time developing an equity lens to review as a review process, and I think that's pretty critical. I'm not. So if that I'd like us to be looking at that. Sure. And what I was hoping to do is provide some other models that I have found to the group so I can get those into the packet so we can start reviewing and looking at those. And then I mean, we'll we'll go from there. And then you could just to fill you in on that. We talked last week about the GOL developing a process for reviewing everything that we do through an equity lens throughout the council. And so that's something that we are going to work on as a group here. Right. All right. Are there any other questions or comments? Let me see. I don't have any items that were not anticipated, and I do not have any additional announcements. So if there are no other announcements from members, we can move to adjourn the meeting. And now, OK, so 1050, Athena. Thanks, Michelle. All right. Great meeting. Yeah, thank you all. You know, bye bye.