 ڈ-, ڈ-, ڈ-, ڑ-, ڈ-, ڈ, ڈ- ڈ-, rough Fire దాస్ల్లుగాన నినిరిలి డార్లులు మ౦దరం. థలెరార్రక ఆరందితునింది థిసిని నూది. న్చర్ ఏస్ంత్స్ాస్ట్క్టి. ఻ారిస్గ్డింి. గాక్చిి ఆరి. అప్রట్చిలిత్ర్టడికాండి. మాన్చిక్సంత్టిర్చి. నిక్చినామలాలిలా. స్ండి కినారిలీావాటిందిజిందాసిం ఇారారిందింద౿నిందారూద్ం దిర్నికారి. పీవంనపచిందాట్లీనూ కంది఍గ౩ిందానిందారి. and once again I thank all of you for joining us, for your information the event is also being streamed live on a Youtube channel which has been communicated to large number of hopefully large number of professional and student members of the society. So let me begin with introduction, the youngest first meat- I meat myself, I am the ఢిియార్ల్ల్ల్లిల్లి. భాస్సి చిచోనాస్వ్లులాడి. చోవంచాన అర్లిసి దాల్ కాపెర్పం స్ర్లి ఆంకనివండ్లనైనిఆంద్చి. వ్ర్ర్ర్స్ల్ల్ల ప్విథాన్నోంల్ందాభరంసంగ్ర, ఇలెవర్ందా ఇలోలూల్త్క్కి్తారంత్తారంయార్క్నందా. ఎాసర్పఢికానిక్ందాాని. వా కింటించె వరె తిటింటె రు the nation not only for all employees of Infosys, but set standards of what perfect professionalism is. బోరాన్లాసిత్రిందాన్యోరండ్మ౎టంది.మ్లోంవ్లూవ్యాకుకుయంది. మైర్లాదాతువ్టత్ల్గస్ం. ఆత్టిమాత్డి. ప్ట్ క్ందోలు నీందలి నరేవూట్క్నత్లురీ చుర్దార్ప్ర్పనాక్లె చ్ప్ప్రడిక్ప్ప్రగునందరిసిక్పరైన క్ప్లురిక్పందరరేసిసిందర్ప This is obviously an added boon for me. Hibak is probably the most popular contemporary academic. He has struggled very successfully, academia, industry and the government in a seamless manner. He is a hero and a role model for me. Digitalization is about providing web access and cloud facilities on desktops, laptops, tablets and mobile phones to applications relevant for customers, employees, vendor partners and other stakeholders of a public or a private organization using Internet as the medium while ensuring performance, reliability and of course to connect the users with their applications. Modern applications use cloud computing, AI and machine learning, big data analytics, 5G communication technologies and of course Internet of Things. India will in the next decade build lots of information systems in the government, in the public and the private sector, in military, in academia, in judiciary and the civil society just to name a few. These applications will span education, healthcare, agriculture, infrastructure, science and technology labs and institutions and various other sectors of our economy. This will result in hundreds of thousands of crores of rupees investment. This society has members who are educators, researchers, industry practitioners and students. Our biggest challenge is to use computer systems to make the life of Indians better. This requires us the professionals assembled here to add technical value in designing systems that perform well not just for the next few years but for the next several decades. This grand challenge translates to several challenges for us in the coming decades. They are developing abundant competent talent with a proactive problem solving mindset, producing computer science research to solve problems relevant to our country and making our software services industry even more competitive and finally helping users particularly in the government build information systems that will operate for decades. It does not matter what technology, what application, what business and what societal and governmental objectives that we are concerned with. We will be developing these computer information systems for the challenges remain the same. That is, how do we develop inexpensive, robust, scalable, performant, available, reliable, maintainable, adaptive and safe systems. I have seen in my own life hundreds of projects fail where these ideas that I will talk about were not adhered to strictly. I will be deliberately non-technical and we will focus on the senior decision makers because that is where there is strategic value. The first challenge is for the top management of the user organization to show full commitment and full electivity to the project in terms of financial time and talent resources. It is to take quick and clear decisions unless the top management demonstrates total and full commitment. Project will see delays, cost overruns and disagreements between the user and the systems developer. It will lead to the eventual failure of the project. The second challenge is to build these systems, to handle the load, adapt to new technology and interoperate with these new technologies and systems across nations. Not just in India, many applications will have to work or interface with various nations in some cases for the next 20 to 30 years. This is why our systems must be built to handle scale, have open interfaces and be interoperable. They must be built in a layer panel so that they can be easily ported to new platforms, new languages, new operating systems, new databases, new networking systems, new users and new computing devices as well as new user devices. The third challenge is to define the problem to be solved correctly, fully, unambiguously and to list out all input and process conditions. This problem definition should have flexibility to include future business rules and policies. They must be adaptable to new business processes and new technologies and for handling loads for the next several decades. Investments may take place in the future but the design must allow for such scaling up. Most large software projects fail because of improper requirement definition. The fourth challenge is to create standards and checklists for processes like design, user requirements, user interfaces, error messages, recovery from error situations, data dictionaries, databases normalized to at least the third normal form, coding, user testing, integrated testing and performance testing. Such standards and checklists make a set of ordinary professionals produce highly reliable software systems. The fifth challenge is to put in place systems for enhancing the quality and productivity of software development. This is where well proven processes like ISO 9001C, SEICMM, Level 4 and Level 5 Deming and Malcolm Baldic processes and keyword searchable knowledge management systems become very useful. Every artifact that is likely to be reused has to be stored in these knowledge management systems and people incentivize to use them. The sixth challenge is to create a sound maintenance system and maintenance team that keeps the system up to date as and when regulations, policies and business rules change. This team should keep on that is availability, reliability and maintainability as its three main objectives. The seventh challenge is to put in place a good version control system so that the latest revision is the one that is released for production purposes. The eighth challenge is to create a disaster recovery system and a good hot standby for a real-time information system and a quick restart for a non-real-time system. The ninth challenge is to put in place an online system to constantly update the online health and user fora as and when the processes are updated and rules are changed. The tenth challenge is to put in place a sound standards upgradation system which should get updated as and when standards, user interface, new technologies, new systems and new tools are introduced. The eleventh challenge is to surround the system with an up-to-date cyber security envelope and constantly get the envelope updated automatically, probably every hour if possible. The twelfth and the most important challenge is to be open-minded to benchmark development processes, standards, quality and productivity norms with the world's best, learn from them, share our next practices with them and make this a better world. There are many more good practices that I can speak about in the development and maintenance of large-scale systems from my own experience but I will stop here due to lack of time. Thank you very much. Thank you so much, Moorthy. I finished in 13 minutes. Yes, yes. I was noticing that. What is wonderful. And you covered 12 very very important aspects of building and running large systems. I do hope that this small keynote of yours reaches all the major players and stakeholders in such large systems, particularly what you told about the responsibility of user organizations. It is very critical because I have seen many government departments and public sector organizations actually missing out on the first critical point that you mentioned and because of which a whole lot of things do not fall in place later. Thank you so much for pointing this out. Now, Anand, I would like to begin our brief Tata Ted with one question. Moorthy has listed all these important points but to implement any one or more of these, you require an appropriately skilled individual and appropriately thinking individual and appropriately problem solving mindset containing individual. If we look at the professionals, both those who are currently in the IT industry, plus a large body of students who aspire to join this, what would you say about how to get these present and future professionals into the mindset which will actually take care of each and every one of the 12 important points pertaining of course to their individual sphere of activity. So I think it's a very hard act to follow here. I think Mr. Moorthy has given a list of things that are very important clearly. Incidentally, this year happens to be the 20th year of the agile manifesto as well. So in 2001 is when the agile manifesto was set up and in the last 15 to 20 years of the agile manifesto and how people have been building out on top of that. What I have seen is that different layers of abstractions have created an architecture which is more micro services architecture where people are building different components that are being brought together in very different kinds of ways. And what we have seen is the evolution of first as you would appreciate in the last, when we were writing code in the 90s and 2000s, there was this whole concept of requirements followed by implementation and then there were developers and testers and all of those kinds of things. As part of the agile manifesto people kind of first merge the dev test teams into one, then the dev test maintenance teams got merged in. And if you look at modern systems that are being built by some of the largest companies where they are following some of the new principles around site reliability engineering, you will find that because of better abstractions, because of better teams, because of teams being very capable, you are doing a lot more with fewer and fewer people. And this level of abstraction that has changed has really transformed how software is being built. And I think it's important. And in this context, the understanding of individuals to have a full understanding of the solution and the stack becomes very important. So I think what we have observed in the last 20 to 25 years is that the requirement or expectations from these key developers has actually gone up very significantly. Because now today's modern architectures involve building microservices where you are building small components that are getting pushed into the production environment at very rapid times, meaning several times a day and things like that. So when you are upgrading these systems that well, you really need to have a good understanding of how these things are being built out. So your point about an individual for an individual, the pressure on how to build out has really gone up. Sir, you have been on this other end of this training people and I'm sure you've seen the difference. Yes, I agree with you. But I would like to ask you one critical question here. Training youngsters is relatively easy because they have yet to join a profession and you can definitely train them on what is a current technology or what is the current approach. But there are two problems. One is when they join a job, as Murti clearly pointed out, in order to build systems which can be upgraded, which can be enhanced, people have to constantly adapt to new technologies. I would also like to mention that people who are already in the IT profession, many times are veterans in a particular technology but may not have the right mindset and curiosity to learn new things quickly and adapt them. How do you ensure that the future workers in the IT industry will become more adaptable? As we call, as we say in our students terminology or the terminology for students, we want to enhance the learnability of every student so that the student remains adaptive later. What would you comment on the learnability of the large working IT workforce and how to enhance it? It's a very hard question again and let me say the following. I just read recently that technology and companies grow exponentially while individuals only grow linearly. And that is the biggest problem that we see because individuals are not able to necessarily keep pace with technology shifts that as easily as you would expect them to. And that makes it difficult for everyone else. So I think one of the important things that individuals need to do is to stay abreast and keep current on an ongoing basis because if you miss the bus, you will pretty much lose it and it will be very hard for you to come back. And this is where I think one of the things that we need to do together as institutions and academics and software professionals is the fact that we cannot stop learning ever. We need to be learning all the time. And I think we need to find a way for individuals such as us to go back to college and be part of the same curriculum on an ongoing basis so that we can keep our skills upgraded on an ongoing basis. And I think this is going to become even more important because I'd love to get Mr. Murti's point of view on this topic as well, specifically around the gig economy. And I think that as I look ahead at the future of work, I believe that more and more individuals just like it happens in the film industry, the software industry will also hire professionals for a project rather than for a job for a company. And if you're going to be hired for a short duration where you are expected to deliver immediately and instantaneously and completely, you really need to work hard on your own to keep yourselves abreast. And how does one deal with this challenge of the gig economy, people being available, work getting shrunk in some form of the other AI and automation squeezing jobs, and all of those kinds of things becomes very hard for individuals. So how do you, I'd love to get Mr. Murti's take on this as well. Well, Anand, thanks for that. But I'll first attempt to look at what Deepak spoke about. And I'm very, very happy that he chose a word that is my favorite word. I coined it in 1975. It is learnability. How do I define learnability? Learnability is the ability to extract generic inferences from specific instances and use them in new unstructured situations to solve new problems. Now, learnability comes from education. It doesn't come from training. That is where when we build our education research campus in my soul, we said this has to be an education campus. This cannot be a training campus. So what we taught the agency, as you know, Anand, we take students, we used to take students from all branches of engineering, all kinds of colleges, all of that. There are very few I joined us. Almost nobody you can say. Mostly it was tier two, some tier two, mostly tier three, some tier four, etc. These people did not know basics of anything in computer science. So we started teaching them, training, we started helping them in acquire education. It started with algorithmic thinking, problem solving, fundamentals of operating systems, fundamentals of database systems, fundamentals of networking systems, fundamentals of quality in software systems, fundamentals of productivity in systems. Now, I am deliberately going back to the era when I was doing very comfortable with those. I am not very comfortable with the new things, even though I have been involved in the development of some agile systems recently. But I don't claim myself to be an expert. Now, the beauty of why we did this was our youngsters could go one day they would work on Windows, third second day they would work on Unix, third day they would work on DB2, fourth day they would work on Oracle, etc. We said we are not going to train them in using Oracle and DB2 and this and that. That's a waste of time. We will tell them the fundamentals of each of these things, what is process management, what is task management, what is inter-task communication, what is inter-process communication, etc. We used to teach them, we start trees, because what is the impact of saying, read this record, how many disk accesses will be required, what all the factors that define the number of disk accesses. In other words, our whole approach was engineering approach. It was not a programmer approach. In fact, I claim the first person in India to use the word software engineer and I did it in 1977. Nobody had used the word software engineer at that time because we said we are going to recruit engineers rather than programmers. Anyway, so my belief is if we can help our youngsters to acquire learnability as Deepak pointed out, then you can learn any new technology, you can learn any new paradigm because the most important thing is learnability. The most important thing is education. What is education? Education is learning to learn. That is the challenge. That is what I have been focusing on all my life, at least from 1975. Wonderful, Murti, absolutely wonderful. Let me come back and pose another related point to Anand because Anand started talking about the professionals and their activity. I have one question. If I am an individual worker or an individual person in your company, it is apparent from what Murti describes that I will go through several transitions. What would you advise the professionals? How should they handle various parts of their career such that they remain extremely productive for building and maintaining such systems on one hand and they also remain true to their own personal aspirations? So, would you like to describe parts of the journey of a professional through this maze and what is your advice to the professionals? Yes, Professor, let me explain a little bit on this topic. This is a topic I have been working on for the last several years. And this came about because I find I meet a lot of people in the middle of their career who find that they are lost and don't know where to go. So, you wonder at 40, 45, you say, okay, I don't know what to do next, and I'm feeling whatever dejected. So, what should you have done early on your career so that when you reach that point, you can be successful and you don't feel that lost. So, having studied a lot of these things, I've come to the following conclusion and I'm going to give you the headlines and we'll do another session necessary to go through the details and on that. So, my recommendation to people is that in your first 10 years of your career, your focus should be on learning and networking. Okay. And the reason that is important in my opinion is not saying that you don't need to learn and network after your first 10 years. But if you don't figure out how to do learning and networking in your first 10 years, you will have great difficulty in learning beyond that. So, in your first 10 years, you should be learning as many things as you can. And one of the things that we have talked about this in the past is the pie architecture for programmers. So, pie architecture basically means the horizontal bar says that you should be broad and depth on the fundamentals like Mr. Murti just mentioned. And you should pick two verticals, one depth on technology and one depth on some domain or some area that you're working on. So, as an individual, you should be learning along this pie where you build horizontal expertise which is broad, not necessarily restricted to software, but fairly broad. So, learn as many things as you can. And then in your second 10 years, it's very important that you become an expert at something. It is no value for someone who says I have 20 years of experience but cannot articulate what that 20 years of experience has done for me. So, if you cannot say after 20 years that I'm an expert at something, then there is something wrong there. So, you should be able to say that after my 20 years of experience, I'm an expert at something. And it should not be just you saying it, the world should say it. And this is where I think the Computer Society of India and all of these things become very relevant. Because how do you get people to, how do you get the community to brand yourselves? So, these kinds of things become very effective ways of sort of creating your personal brand in a non-organizational centric way. So, the second 10 years I recommend to people is to become an expert at something and let the world say it. The third 10 years in my opinion are most critical and very crucial. So, here what you have to do is by the time you are in your third, the beginning of your third 10 years, you are in your early 40s. So, now you are thinking where do I want to be and what would my corner office be, which would be my end goal of where I want to be. So, you have done whatever you have done at 40, early 40s. You are going to, the CEOs and most companies are hired at their early 50s. If you want to get to a city or whatever, your corner office is going to happen in the early 50s. So, you have 10 years to get to that and now you have to be very realistic about what are the steps that you need to take from what you know, what are your expert at, what are your gaps, what are you missing and how do you get to that corner office very effectively. In my opinion, you have three steps to get to this point from 40 to 50. You cannot take more than three steps to get to the corner office and if your path takes more than three steps, you should readjust your corner office. People are happy when they achieve their dreams. When you have expectations that cannot be met, you are unhappy. So, it is important that you adjust your goals to be realistic and of course you want to strive hard to get to them but having crazy goals that cannot be met and you don't have a path to it, you are never going to get to it. I highly recommend to people that they should write these things down. Now, I am going to come to the last 10 years. In the last 10 years, it is of course important that you need to mentor other people and look at it. And one of the very interesting articles I read recently which has kind of influenced me is by this fellow called Arthur C. Brooks and he talks about how your professional decline may be earlier than you think. So, by the time you are in your early 50s, you should assume that your professional decline has started to come and you better figure out other things that you can do which are more effective so that you can still stay in the game. And there are many such things and there are some nice examples in how he describes it. And by the time you come to your 60 or early 60s, that is when you will be forced to retire but you will still have 20 years of work beyond that because people are going to continue to work. And one thing I want to point out and this is something that I am observing now that I am sort of closer to that age is that unless you set yourselves up to do things beyond 60, after you retire nobody is going to ask you to do anything. So, if you expect that after I retire I am going to do something, sorry that doesn't happen. You have to make yourself ready enough that people will invite you to do something when you retire because if you don't set yourselves up you won't make it. Sorry a long answer but since you asked it and this is a topic that I have been working on for a while, I just couldn't resist being short on this. Thank you. Thank you Anand. Let me ask a final question to both of you which will be actually a question which merges the aspects that you both have elaborated in your description. And that aspect is about mentoring individuals because the systems that Murti describes so passionately which have to be built without any doubt by this nation to become a recognized entity in the world cannot be built unless individuals are not just good problem solvers or good technical people or good engineers are well learnable. But they also need from time to time some hand holding, some mentoring when they are students in an institution it is the primary job of teachers to mentor them and enhance their learning. But when they join a job this mentoring has to happen and let me confess I have seen a whole lot of HR organizations in all over the country. Most of them are most worried about increments, assessment and such thing. Who does mentoring? To my mind mentoring is done by your immediate managers, by their managers. Their behavior, their commitment actually mentors me indirectly. But is there a method of introducing discreetly but importantly this notion of mentoring as an important step for every professional? Well Deepak if it is okay I will take it first. Yes. Yes. You know as you know Infosys was the first company in India to start a leadership institute. Yes, yes. We said that an important responsibility of an institution is to develop successive generation of leaders from time to time. That's how it enhances its longevity. And one of the important aspects of leadership is to provide mentoring. I will come to that. What we did was we selected 45 people below the level of the internal board of directors. Then at the next level there were 135 people and at the third level there were 405 professionals. In other words overall there were 485 leaders selected at the three levels. Now this was a very elaborate process. So we realized that these leaders do need mentoring platform. We also realized that mentoring has to be a voluntary activity. It cannot be a forced down activity. Then it is not mentoring. Correct. Only the mentee should go to the mentor when he or she has a problem. Not the other way round otherwise it becomes a reporting activity. So at Infosys we said that mentoring is a voluntary activity. It is the mentee that chooses the mentor. Now we also put a limit of 6 mentees per mentor at certain levels. Because we estimated that each mentee would require about an hour a month of mentoring activity or mentoring consultation. So we said the leaders can use 6 hours per month. The mentees chose the mentors on a first come first serve basis. The third thing that we did was we said we do not want these mentors to be the immediate bosses of the mentees. Because that already brings certain bias. For example, I report to you and I am not doing that. Then when I go with some problems, you would say, you may not do that but there are some who do that. So we said that we will ensure that the mentor is not the immediate boss. We said in most cases he was not even the skip level boss. And the fourth thing that we said was that the mentee can bring any issue. Technical, personal, official, whatever issue he or she has. And the mentor will use the distilled wisdom of his or her experience to offer suggestions to solve the mentee's problem. Only suggestions because these are not algorithms. Correct. I think what you are saying should be a lesson to a large number of people. Definitely certainly anybody who is running a large organization because I have seen such mentoring happen in our hostels by seniors. Exactly. Who are not the bosses of anyone or something like that. The first year or the second year student naturally goes to a final year student or a master student asking for help on any issue, personal or technical or whatever. And what you are saying is that exactly such a relationship, such a bondage must be built even in the industry. That is a very good point. Anand, would you like to add something concluding because we are exceeding our time. I am going to take the liberty of sharing a few thoughts on this topic which is a topic that is very dear to me as well. And you have been my mentor on this for 30 years now. So I have a slightly different point of view on mentorship in the following sense. I believe that every individual is responsible for their own career. And the organization is not responsible for their career. The organization is only responsible for assisting them to be successful at their career. But the responsibility does not belong to the organization but belongs to the individual. And this is an important thing from my point of view. And this word we have turned around within the company and we found it to be very effective. And we started to say that you are responsible for your career and not the company. The company is only going to enable you to make that happen. So we are going to have many things available to you. But what you do is your responsibility. This is true for everyone across the world. And this is becoming even more important. So this is the first thing. Second thing I want to mention is that I find that mentorship, everyone needs to have mentors. And they need to find their own mentors and their own ways to find mentors. So I find there are four kinds of mentors that I have found in terms of how I look at things in the past. And I am going to use some very divine analogies. So excuse me for that. So the first mentor I find is this Eklavya Adronacharya style mentorship. So the mentor doesn't know that I am his mentee. Like I like following Mr. Murti. I like following Nanda and I follow Bill Gates. So they don't know I am their mentee. But I rubber them and I read what they do. And I have a whole bunch of them that I track. And they are my Dronacharya mentors in that sense. So that's first kind. The second kind I think I find is that if I want to go to a mentor and I need the mentor to tell me something. A mentor needs to have context. Without context they cannot give me advice. So if I just show up and say you know can you give me advice. It's not very effective. So you need to have a small number of people who are your mentors who have different kinds of concepts. Who you talk to on a regular basis. Who have context. So you've been one of my sort of mentors in that category. And if you remember that I've been calling you up on different times traveling with you from your home to the airport and this and that to give you the context. So that you know when I need help I can come to you. So this way I find my kids, my wife. There are a lot of other people. They don't have to be seniors, bosses, whatever else. But you need to cultivate your group of mentors. Just like you have the Bhagwan Panchayat in your house. You have a Ram. You have a Lakshman. You have a Ganpati. You have Shiva. So you need to have a set of mentors who have different capabilities who deliver different value to you. But you have to nurture them. And it is my responsibility to do that. Not someone else's. The company cannot do this for me. I have to do it myself. It is very important to do that. The third kind of mentorships are the ones which are the, you know, I would call them the Narasimha mentors. So you need the Narasimha to come when you need them. You don't want them all the time. So when you have that critical problem, when you have to do a specific job, you need the right person to be available to you. So you need your mentors to have the connections to bring you the right person when you need it. You don't want to, you can't maintain these kinds of relationships with hundreds of people at all the time. So when you need that, you need to have in your network the people who can bring you there. And finally, when you have the Dharma, you need to be able to bring the Krishna to your table. And so we have had that issue and I have come to you and you remember the story where I will write this someday. But it is important to have these mentorships within your network. And I think everyone should nurture their own network of mentors. It is crucial and important that they do this. And I think this needs to be, see, we are all ourselves individuals. We find our own growth. We are responsible for our own life and our growth. And we are responsible for finding our own mentors. And to converse on this, I would say that mentor-mentee relationship cannot be just there. I ask you to mentor me, you mentor me. When I come to you, you should see value in my coming to you as well. If the mentor doesn't provide value in the mentorship relationship, that mentorship relationship is incomplete. So if I am going to you for my mentorship, I need to feel like what am I contributing to your relationship so that you will find this to be useful for me. So this mentor-mentee relationship is not a one-way street at all. It's a grand relationship where we work together and we think together. You solve my problems for sure because that's what you do. When I'm coming to you, I'm not just acker of your time. Thank you so much. We can talk on this another time, but I know I have this great relationship with you and I just couldn't miss this opportunity. So let me, because we have overshot the time, but let me conclude with just this point. I would like to point out, Anand, that what Murti said and what you said are not mutually exclusive things. He was describing the need to build a mentor-mentee setup within an organization. What you are talking about is the need for such mentorship at different times in life spanning your entire career from entry to exit kind of thing, long-term relationship. I think both are extremely important and crucial. Unfortunately, we don't have time to further discuss and debate on this, but I will leave it to the stalwarts of the Computer Society of India to consider the following. We will summarize. I will personally summarize the entire discussion that has happened here, extremely critical point mentioned by Murti on the need to create, build and operate maintainable, sustainable and adaptable system for future, very critical for the nation. And on the other hand, the people who are going to build such systems for us, how to improve their learnability, how to handle them, how to educate them, not just train them. These are extremely important concepts. I believe that Computer Society of India has a possibility of contributing a very, very important, what should I say, inputs to the whole process, starting from student to the professionals. With that, I would like to once again personally thank Mr. Murti and Dr. Hanan Deshpande for sparing their time. At the shortest possible notice, I mean, I don't know how grateful I am Murti for agreeing to come at the shortest possible notice. And Hanan, thank you so much. I must thank all the viewers who have connected online and of course, thousands of others who are hopefully watching this event live. And we will make the recording available, the link available, YouTube link available for even subsequent. Thank you so much. And let us make this society to contribute to such building up of professionals and systems in coming years and decades. Thank you and goodbye. Thank you, sir. Thank you. And thanks Hanan. Thank you, sir. Sir, do you mind off now? Is it okay? Yes, yes, please. Sushant, you can stop the live feed. Yes, sir. I can see a lot of friends who have connected live. I hope they are benefited.