 This conference will now be recorded. Okay. I would like to call to order the City Council, the South Burlington City Council special meeting of January 29th, 2024, and the first item of business is the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Let's hope that it continues, you know. Item two, instructions on exiting the building in case of an emergency and review of the technology. Jessie? Thank you. So for those who are joining us in person in the room, if there's an emergency, you can go out to the rear of the auditorium on the left or right side and then turn left or right to get outside. For those participating remotely, thank you for joining us. If you'd like to speak on any item on the agenda, please turn your cameras on and the chair will call on you. If you'd like to speak and if you would like to, you can indicate to me that you would like to speak in the chat and we will call, I'll have the chair call on you, otherwise we are not monitoring the chat for content. Okay. Thank you. Item three is the agenda review. Are there any additions, deletions or changes in order of the agenda items? Seeing none, we'll move on to comments and questions from the public not related to the agenda. Oh, please come up. Thank you. And Dave Ulbricht after you. Dan? Or Dan, do I say it's this? Sorry, Dan. It's the light, is it on? Okay. It's very bright. Yes. Yeah. Basically, it's just- Can you share? Yeah. Public. Yeah. Cindy Freeman. One, I want to say thank you for the two straight arrows heading west, route two, that was brilliant because it was always, when it was right toward the highway going 89 north or straight, many people didn't understand that they would move into you. So the two straight arrows were brilliant. I think that another more demarcation would be good for heading 89 south from the Staples Plaza. Many cars, when they turn, they think that they can still go straight when they're turning right onto 89 south, and I'm surprised an accident hasn't occurred yet, because they are constantly moving quickly into the straight lane. So just I would love that kind of demarcation for that. So thank you. I think I would agree. I think that's a challenge. I got caught there the other day, not, you know, I was thinking I was on the other side where you'd stay right. You know, you can get on going north or you can keep going to Dorset Street. So it is even for those of us who travel there all the time, you can. Cindy Freeman again. When you're taking the spare street turn, so you're heading from route two heading toward the hospital, and then you immediately take that turn and you go straight onto spare street and take another turn. There's a yield going this way, but people don't see the people here on that turn. I think the yield would be better for the people who are making the turn, not for the people coming in, because we get to see the people better from that turn than they do. And they're going kind of at a pretty fast speed usually. So it would be better. I think reversing that yield. OK, well, thank you. Dan, Albert. Hi, can you hear me OK? We sure can and we can see. Great. OK, thanks. First off, let's like to thank I know it's you, Gustav. Both of you still have a few meetings left for you officially. Well, you're not writing off to the sunset, but at least I'd like to thank both you, Alan and Megan, for your many years of service. I know we perhaps disagree on some issues, but I do thank you for your many hours. I think you'd be out of all that's a lot of hours there. So thank you very, very much for that. I know your hearts are always in the right place. It's not on the agenda. I just certainly I did want to speak briefly again along the the issue of the potential purchase of, I guess it's now the Bellavance properties along on on Spear Street there and just reiterate some of the reasons and perhaps some some new considerations. So I think this would be a really inappropriate use of city funds. I'll just leave it to leave it at that in the broad theme. But I'd like to put it a reason for why. So the purpose of one of the many purposes of zoning is that it it sets the ground rules for what you can and can't do on your property. And the city is blessed with having or could be a burden to very detailed zoning regulations. And part of that is that it makes it very clear both to an owner as well as a butters what can and cannot happen to a property. And the city has invested many, many hours in coming up with very detailed zoning regulations. And those the interim zoning process is over. The regulations were adopted and it lays out clearly what can and cannot happen on the property and the and the gist of it is contained in the zoning district map, which I was looking at again before I got ready to testify. And it's very clear that, you know, the front, I don't know, every couple hundred feet or, you know, however, call it the front quarter of the property is in the neighborhood residential district. And it's, you know, in looking at the map, it's, you know, it's it's very clear that. You know, that that portion of the property that's in neighborhood residential makes sense because indeed it is bounded on the north by a high density residential neighborhood with a south point drive into the south over one of the cities, also very high dense neighborhoods of the south village complex. And indeed the DRB, which I was a member of and other prior DRBs assume the connection between those two neighborhoods, assume the density. And so, but again, to the larger point of the reason you have this zoning is to take the politics out of land development. You go through a comprehensive process like the city did and the city put in a much more stringent environmental protections, the habitat block concept. So as others have pointed out, paying, buying the land or buying a conservation easement is just redundant. It's already protected through the zoning. And yes, hypothetically zoning could change. It's true of any single parcel in the district, but for the city to get involved in this just seems like an inordinate waste of funds. That's part of the purpose of zoning. There was a time years ago when towns and Vermont land trust or others were running around like chickens with their head cutting off, preserving more farms in more areas. But this is just really inappropriate. The other thing that really troubles me is I just were Champlain Housing Trust coming to the city with a project or Ever North or one of the true nonprofit housing developers. Then I could see where the genesis would come from that it was truly gonna happen. And I just, I would worry that even if the city did go through with the purchase of the property that the politics of it and the neighbors already stopped development there once and there's no reason they wouldn't push it forward against and it becomes a political decision when it shouldn't be. And then there's the larger issue of what the city is gonna do this for the bellevances. Why isn't it doing for J.L. Davis Realty or UBM or the Ferrells or anybody else or the Pomerlos who own large properties where the city could come in and those developers could reasonably say, well you bought an easements on the part of the land that couldn't be developed from the bellevances, why wouldn't you do the same for me? So I just think it's a really sticky wicket and the city should sort of stay out of this because it just would set a really bad precedent. And then lastly, as I said previously, it would be nice to see the city putting some effort into open space and recreation areas closer to where all the future growth is going. So I'll just leave it at that. Thanks. Thank you. Bridget, did you want to speak? I did, I wanna ask Dan. So, well actually the city and Dan and everyone. Can you give your name so the public message speaking? I am Bridget Jean Gracia. Our family owns 1336 Williston Road. We've owned it for since 1940 and that corner lot was my grandmother's. It burnt down and we were to advise my mom and I after my dad passed that to tear down by Ray Blair, which the zoning would come in in our favor. And that's our family corner. And it's getting, we're, you know, we're not a pommel or we're not nothing. This is our homestead, this is our home. And it's getting taken. Or every time I turn around there, you can do this, we're trying to sell it. My brother and I and in the estate and it's, and I've never seen anything like it after we're probably, we pretty much are the oldest residents in South Brawlington. My dad owned Gracie's store. My grandfather owned it way back when. And my hands are tight on this. It's like, I don't know. It's heartbreaking. So I, you know, yeah, go ahead. Well, I'm just trying to accurately understand which parcel. It's just the one across from Gracie's. And there was a- Yes, I am where I did Gracie's in Gracie's store. And then the house burned down and you- My grandmother's home. Okay, so the issue for you is that you're trying to sell it and you're not able to or? No, they actually added. So when it, there was a fire, it didn't burn all the way down. Rape Blair said to my mom and I, my dad's gone and said, you would benefit from the new zoning that's gonna come up. So tear the building down. Well, we listened to them. We tore it down and all of a sudden the zoning come to find out. It was in, it wasn't in our favor because, well, I still have a foundation under there. So they said, now you're not grandfathered in. So now you need it to, I don't mind the two store, four storey, minimum two, four, but they all of a sudden, we have trip ins. So I have an unmarketable piece of property. You have trip ins? Yes, the city went and put trip ins. So I can, there can only be a certain amount of cars I mean, this is open lot. Yes, you can. So if I was to sell my parents' property and they told what it's listed as T4 or whatever for, we met with Marty multiple times. It says, all of a sudden they're throwing, well, you can only have a certain amount of cars now in and out. Ray Belair said, no, don't worry about parking everything. It's the best thing. And so we tore the house down. It was a big mistake, which I can build it on there. I still have foundation under the ground, but it's a beautiful piece of property. There's a, I don't know, I'm in charge of it. There's housing issues. I sold off the other properties to give to Habitat I'm all for all that stuff. I don't, it doesn't matter what goes there. We just don't want the city to keep misleading us with different, we were misled. And the trip ins is something you might want to look into. It was, don't Marty knows all about it. They changed all the zoning on us. I mean, after, I don't understand after 1940, owning the property and you change what was there. And we were the only anything in South Brawlington. Okay, I think our city manager would like to make a comment if that's okay. So, Absolutely. Hi Ms. Gracie, I'm glad you've been engaged with Marty. We do, the community regularly does update the zoning. That's one of the primary roles of the city council is to, and the planning commission is to look at zoning changes. Right now, you can't see him, but Paul Connor our planning and zoning director is in the audience. The planning commission is working on transportation demand management strategies in order, we hope to address the trip end issue along Williston Road because you're absolutely right because of that trip end issue, we are curtailing development in a way we don't intend. So I didn't, I don't have your contact information, but if you want to shoot it to me in an email or call my office tomorrow, I'd be happy to connect you with Paul and he can describe the timeline of that transportation demand management strategy process. Okay, in your name again. I'm Jesse Baker. So it's Jay Baker at southbrillingtonvt.gov. Thanks, Jess. Yeah, it's all, I mean, selling real estate and everything, I always worked with, you know, Todd and Martha and everybody in our family for a year. I mean, we're from southbrillington. We are southbrillington, but thank you very much. It's a little bit of hope that we're looking for. Great. Okay, thank you. Thanks for being here. Thank you for sharing that with us and hopefully you can work it through, Jesse. Thank you. Thank you so much. Absolutely. Okay, are there any other people who would like to make a comment on an item not on the agenda? Okay, seeing none, we'll move on to number five, which is the counselor's announcements and reports on committee assignments and the city manager's report. So Larry, do you want to start? I can start and I have nothing to say. Okay. Well, no report then. No report. Well, that's okay. Megan? I attended the Forelaw Housing Committee meeting January 17th and they were working on their work plan for the year and they were talking about how they can support climate related quality of life improvements. For example, how to connect historically and served residents to resources, to weatherized homes, access renewable energy and switch to low carbon transportation options. They also are looking into ways to collaborate with other committees, such as the Energy Committee, the Bike Ped Committee and the Economic Development Committee, as well as the various city departments. So I thought it was a really good plan that they're working on a nice way to really work with the city plan in place, but also work broadly with everybody else. Great, thank you. Tim? Well, of course I was here last Monday for the steering committee meeting, like other people were, but that's it, there was one CCUD meeting. I couldn't get into the team's meeting. I'll have to talk to Ann-Jan about that, but there's another one scheduled this week. And then the Board of Civil Authority was canceled because I think it was a lack of a... A lack of quorum, yes. That's too bad. So hopefully we'll get that together, yeah. That's all, thanks. Okay, great. Actually, two weeks ago, I guess I had a airport commission meeting and I brought up both the issues about the Striping Machine. I don't know if I mentioned that at the last meeting. And so potentially that's at least being discussed. And then also I asked about the path and whether that was gonna go through the Picard Circle. And it is not at this point. The path plan is before the DRB in March. But that portion of airport property is not included in that larger path plan. Has there been any movement with the community gardens in that area? Do you know? I don't know that, yeah, okay. They also, I just to bring you up to date on sound mitigation, there was testing since I said next week, it must have been this week for the sound mitigation efforts for the new homes and they're working, no, I'm sorry, for the homes that have been undergone the mitigation and so they go in again and test to see if it is effective. And what they've heard back from residents have been very favorable. Everyone has said the construction workers were really good. They cleaned up, they were thoughtful and polite and they kept people apprised if there was going to be a delay. So they weren't sitting around waiting to see if they were gonna show up on a Monday. So they were very positive about the experience. So that was helpful. Helen, could I ask, did people have to leave their homes for that work to happen? I don't know what's required. I guess it depends what work is being done. They have to move a lot of their furniture. They have to move some of their furniture. Get to the windows. Yeah, yeah, that I don't know. I noticed a lot of activity on Kirby Road and I just wondered if the people were still living and they were still staying there as they were doing that work. It was quite extensive. Yes, it is quite extensive and it probably depends on the individual. I mean, some people, I've lived through construction and you can do it or people move out. So I think probably it's a preference and certainly there's be affordability or a place to stay while it's being worked on. There are 50 new ones and that they're going out for the next round and homeowners are currently signing up. They're also going door-to-door so people know that they can sign up this time, be part of the next 50 and this also includes some multifamily units. I think that's the first time. So the project or program is moving forward. Okay. Jesse. Thank you. So biggest news of the night is that the timeline has closed for people to submit petitions to run for office. So this is all in the council's inbox but just for the community, these are the candidates that will be on the ballot. So for the school board, there's one candidate each for the three, two and one year terms. In order that's Chelsea Tillinghouse, Elaine Sistai is I believe how you pronounce it and Tim Warren running for the remainder of that one year term. For the city council, for the three year term, Lori Smith and Linda Bailey are running. For the two year term, Mike Scanlon, Julian Keenan and Lydia Diamond are running and for the one year term, Elizabeth Fitzgerald is running. So those are our candidates for elected office in South Burlington. Thank you for, I see several of them on the screen. Thank you all for volunteering and giving of yourselves and service in this way. We will be inviting some of them to future leadership team or inviting the city council candidates all to future leadership team meetings for to kick off their orientation and make sure they are well-informed candidates. Also wanted to share that in front of you council tonight is our FY23 annual report, Andy Broombar, New Communications and Outreach Coordinator did a I think really exceptional job on this report. It's also linked on the front page of our website. So we encourage folks to check that out and thanks to the leadership team who put a lot of time and effort and the committees into putting together this annual report. We are also working with the school department to finalize the FY25 budget book. We hope those are up online tomorrow as well and copies available towards the end of the week. Both of these documents will also have hard copies available at the clerk's office and in the library. We have a couple of different events coming up to talk to the community about Town Meeting Day and the items on the ballot on Wednesday morning. I will be doing with the leadership team a presentation to the South Burlington Business Association. On Thursday evening, Tom DiPietro and I will be doing the budget presentation for Town Meeting TV and that will also be recorded and we will push that out through our communication channels. And then Tom and I continue our road show on February 25th at the senior center. So hopefully folks will tune in and get engaged about what is happening on the ballot on Town Meeting Day. And then finally, I mentioned this to the council but for the committee, we have a really exceptional deputy city attorney, sorry, Steve. He is exceptional. He is exceptional. That's true. We have a really exceptional deputy city attorney, candidate who's accepted our offer of employment and as soon as they notify their current team we will notify the community of that but we're excited about that hire. That's what I can share. Okay, that's great. And I was happy to see that all, no, there's some action on all the different openings both for the city council as well as the school board with the school board news with EC1 27 and the CLA, I was concerned that someone would be listening to that and say that sounds too complicated for me. I'm not gonna jump in but we do have three people who two returning in a new one and I think that's very positive. Next item is the consent agenda. We have one item disbursements. I'll move that we approve. Second. Are you ready for that vote? All in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. So the consent agenda is approved unanimously. And Andrew Chalnyk will not be with us tonight. He is en route from Florida. He's in a plane right now so we can't even call in. Yeah, well it's good until you get caught, I guess. So item seven is the morning for the, our second public hearing on the charter change proposals. So I welcome everyone who's here for that tonight. We will be holding our second public hearing on a possible charter change that would expand the number of school directors from five to seven. Prior to this evening, we've received an update from the charter committee on their work been provided, proposed charter change language, warned these public hearings and received process recommendations from the city's legal council. The purpose tonight is to hear again from the public. We won't be responding to individual comments, except perhaps to ask a clarifying question to make sure we understand a commenter's point. After we close the public hearing, we'll take all that we've heard tonight and last week together with any correspondence we received and have a council discussion. Following that discussion, we may vote to place this item on the town meeting day 2024 ballot. Procedurally tonight, we'll have comments from folks who are in person and folks attending remotely. If you're in person, please walk up to the podium and I'll call on you for those attending remotely. Please indicate that you'd like to speak in the chat function and our city manager, Jesse Baker, will keep a running tab of those wishing to speak. To be fair to anyone, to everyone, I'll attempt to mix in both person and remote attendees and if you are participating remotely, turn on your mic and your video if you wish when I call your name. And lastly, I just asked that everyone keep their comments brief and succinct and to the point. And I ask that you not be redundant with your comments if they've been made by others. And if there's time remaining for everyone who wants to speak, who has spoken, I'll entertain a second comment if it's new information. So I would open, I'd like a motion to open the public hearing. I move that we open a public hearing on a charter change proposal to increase the number of South Billington School District Board members from five to seven. Second. All those in favor? Aye. So our public hearing is open. Do you wanna say anything? No. Okay. Is there any public comment? Bridget, do you? Oh. Nope. Okay. We have your voice thing on, so I thought. I'm sorry. Okay. So is there anyone in the audience? Nobody? All right. Well, then I'll entertain a motion to close the public hearing. So moved. Second. All in favor? Aye. So the public hearing is closed on the charter change proposal. Is there any discussion by the council? No. No. No? No. Okay. Well, then I'd entertain a motion to have this added to the ballot. I will move that we approve a charter change ballot item to increase the number of South Billington School District Board members from five to seven and place it on the town meeting day 2024 ballot. I'll second that. All in favor? Favor? Aye. So that passes. Thank you. They should all be that great. Number eight. That's what we just did. Okay. So number nine, we're right on time. Oh, I'm sorry. We have to approve the warning. So you have approved once the warning for the town meeting day ballot after you approved the budget, but that was before these public hearings on the charter change. We needed that warning in order to put it in the budget book, et cetera. But now that it's official, we need you to approve it one more time with gusto. I'll move that we approve the 2024 town meeting day warning. Thank you. Second, with gusto? Second. Okay. All in favor with gusto? Yes. Yes. I just mean we need you to do what you've already done again. Thank you. All right. So now we get to go to item 10, the warning for the city plan. I think I'll just quickly go through. We've had prior to this evening, we've received several updates from the planning commission. We've held council work sessions. We've hosted two previous public hearings. We've provided additional direction to the staff and finally warned this public hearing. The purpose tonight is again to hear from you. We won't be responding again to individual comments except reps to ask a clarifying question. And at the close, we will take all that we've heard tonight and over the last many months together with any correspondence we received and have a council discussion. And following that discussion, we may vote to adopt or amend the 2024 city plan. So same process. If there's anyone who is in the audience who would like to speak on the city plan. Oh, we have to open the public hearing. Excuse me. I move that we open the public hearing on city plan 2024. Second. All in favor? Aye. So the public hearing is open. Do you have any comments, Paul? Just briefly as is outlined in your memo, the draft in front of you incorporates the changes that the council requested on January 8th. So it has all of those in there. Following the public hearing tonight, you have the ability to adopt the plan if you choose. The current plan will expire on February 2nd. So the end of this week. So if the council decides to make additional changes tonight, it will need to warn an additional public hearing. The current plan will then expire, which will mean that there are certain actions that happen, the city will not be eligible for grants. In the meantime, there may be implications of Act 250 and you will not be able to amend your land development regulations or your capital program while you're in the time during which you don't have a plan. So, yeah, just providing that context for you. Okay, thank you. So we are in a public hearing. Are there anyone who would like to make a comment? I will acknowledge we got a email comment from Dan Albrecht. Would you like to speak, Dan? Yeah, sure. So I was thinking about, I'd submitted written comments before throughout the process. It sounds like you made some tweaks to that first page of the, I'm not really gonna speak to that regarding the issue of a climate resiliency or whatever. I do wanna, I sent you a link, put it here in the chat as well for the benefit of the public. There was a nice article by the New York Times about the climate impact of your neighborhood and basically what they're doing in that analysis and that article is looking at, it's done by census tract and we have four census tracts. So it's, you know, a lot of our planers know this well. You go to drill down and you find out that your town is one of five towns lumped into one census tract just because of the minimum amount of data points you need. But the climate impact, this climate footprint map neighborhood really shows sort of like the two sides of South Burlington as it were. And when you look at the map there and you can play around with it to what's nice. It's sort of auto-loads figuring out based upon where you are. So actually Burlington, South Burlington show up right away. What's really fascinating but also very troubling about the data is that it very clearly shows that the district of the Southeast quadrant is has greater, higher than average greenhouse gas emissions. And it's not hard to figure out why it's because it's all single family homes with very little commercial, if any. And so as I put in my testimony to you guys I really, really think you need to put some language in the plan that encourages, to put it bluntly it's almost like it's a rezoning of portions of that part of the city to encourage some commercial development. Because right now everybody in that entire area has to get in their car to go anywhere and do anything. And that's why it has such higher than national average. And then you can also look to see that the other parts of the city are doing their job. And just so as I pointed out it's inconsistency in the city plan to preach climate resiliency yet one portion of the neighborhood of the city does not have to make any changes. My neighborhood makes the changes. We're right next and Proctor Avenue we're right next to the high density commercial zoning district. And the city about a year ago maybe, maybe longer changed the transfer of development rights to potentially quadruple the density if somebody had transferable development rights. We're taking all the high density apartments as well as city center and the Williston Road corridor. Yet this neighborhood is untouched and it's really, really frustrating to see that. It's just a sea of single family zoning if it was ever to be done now and you were starting over from scratch that would never happen. Planners know better now that that's not the way to go about things. And so it's really frustrating to see that sort of status quo for those folks. They get, yeah, I'll just leave it at that. So that, it's not just me saying it. It's the media pointing out the obvious. So I just encourage you to put in some language which I put in the email to encourage that rethinking of the zoning there. And people may scream bloody murder but because it's change, oh goodness. Well, we all have to change. My neighborhood's changing. We've got plenty of traffic. We've got plenty of density. Right, 100 yards down the road from me and it's time the rest of the city chip in as well. So thanks very much. Thank you. Yes, just Gracie. Yes. So Dan. Your South East. I'm sorry, this is, would you identify yourself for the public? I'm Bridget Gracie. Bridget Gracie, my owner of 1336 Williston Road and also some other properties there. I was just curious, where is the Southeast? You're talking about Quadrant. It's not Kirby Road. Are you talking Kirby Road from Williston Road to Kirby Road then? You know, I think this is a public hearing really for the council and not a dialogue actually among residents. All Connor can answer your question, the rough boundaries of quote unquote, that zoning district as well as the census district. Well, the only reason I say is cause Kirby Road, which I had family members and everything, that is, I've been selling real estate for over 30 years, is a very high rate on. So you're, you know, it's, I don't think it's your commercial, anything to do with emissions or anything. If anyone tested the soil and everything down there, my family members all died from it. It used to be an old, we don't even, I don't even, I won't even sell on those down there. Right, not down there, but it has the highest, there used to be an old, old back in the day, dry cleaning. Sorry, I don't need to bring up old stuff, but I lost my aunt into it. And it's all the, they pull P card avenue, right on the point, it's not a good area. And it has nothing to do with commercial, anything to do with traffic. It's the soil, but just saying, being born and raised there. Friend porch forum today, the state posted an item for free rate on testing for residential households in Vermont. Absolutely. There's an email. I beg my, thank you. I beg my uncle to get it done for his home. He didn't, my aunt never smoked. My uncle, nothing in the eight out of the garden in the backyard on curvery road and they all died of cancer. But it's, it is there. There's a lot of people. And I wish someone would look into that area. But yeah, sorry, didn't mean to bring up something, but yes, thank you very much. Are there any other comments on the city plan 2024? Hi, Ryan Doyle speaking. I've spoken to you a few times in the past about transportation related issues. And I, I know that at this point, you're not going to change anything about that in the plan and that you're going to adopt it as it is tonight. I will reiterate the importance of doing more than just an active transportation plan. I know not many of you will continue to be on the council next year as some of you are retiring, but the active transportation plan will basically do half of what a complete streets policy would do complete streets is supported by the federal highway administration. It lays out 10 really important principles for making places more livable and also safer to bike and walk. One of the principles that's missing from our active transportation plan is element number six, which is about adopting very good multimodal design standards, which we do not have here in the state of Vermont. And also a mechanism for updating them as best practices evolve through research and understanding in this country. It's something that I want to keep pushing for and promoting. I know that last time Jesse was really satisfied with the MUTCD standards that the state of Vermont has. And then we're at the Safe Roots to School Task Force meeting two Fridays ago. Hoyle and Tanner gave a presentation and they suggested crosswalk treatments, which aren't allowed by MUTCD. Hoyle and Tanner is very proud that they do work across New England and they've even in our active transportation plan, the promotional material itself from CCRPC, Hoyle and Tanner points out that they have experience with the mass dot multimodal transportation standards. That's where their crosswalk idea came from that they gave in our presentation. Of course, we can't do that treatment here right now because we haven't adopted design standards. We are beholden to what Vermont has. V-Trans has given optional standards, but they are completely optional and we don't follow them. They give really good guidance about how much spacing, for example, a sidewalk should be from a road, but you see with just the work we've done on the traffic lights for Dorset Street, we took out a sidewalk along Williston Road by the North On Ramp, which sees just the on ramps. It sees over 7,000 vehicles per day. The whole width of that road sees over 30. And we went from having a wide sidewalk to a narrowed sidewalk that's curb type. Even the 20 year old V-Trans standards would say put that eight feet away so that there's place for the snow to go. That's still an outdated standard. With three lanes, you would actually go to 10 feet now. That would be best practice, but you can see how, I know Tim's comments last week that the steering committee meeting and the last time we discussed this topic were about making changes to the land development regulations. And that is a part of it, Tim. We really do need that. And Complete Streets Policy does advise that too. But what the city does, separate from what private developers do, is even more crucial. And we do need to move towards having design standards. So for those of you who are going to persist, it's Tim and Jesse next year. And for those of you who will be more alumni to the council in the future, to keep being aware of these issues as infrastructure is not the easiest topic. But we really do need to, as a community, move forward with those things. And if it's not in this plan, it will require constant advocacy to actually get us there throughout all of the other political changes that come with municipal elections. So I want to encourage you again to keep learning more about that. And even those of you who are retiring so that you can help us move that direction in the future. Thank you. Thank you. Any other, oh, yes. Cindy. Cindy Freeman. Yeah, I just want to say thank you for both you, Helen and Megan for your service. That was great. I read up to just page 31. I know there's a whole bunch of pages I didn't read on the city plan. I have a hard time because I know this is going to sound awful, but having everything directed through the climate action or climate change is hard for me because when I think of Vermont, Vermont has the lowest carbon dioxide emission out of all 50 states. So I feel like, won a lot of committees presented ways for the ARPRA funds to be used for the community and that those ARPRA funds went to a new climate change job. I just feel like I'm not sure that we're looking at what Vermont is and also that our our electricity is pretty clean. You know, I mean, we have the energy mix. We're very fortunate in Vermont to have such a clean energy mix. And I feel like a lot of money is being put into this and not really benefiting the community. And when I think of, you know, just the how far we are in Vermont in general. And then I think that in general, it can be a weapon. And we're seeing that used in the Southeast quadrant was 63 acres. And, you know, putting those aside, putting the unclear properties aside for conservation versus development. I'm just not sure we're seeing our people. And that's that and it's me because I feel like I know that, you know, we only have so much information we can absorb. I mean, I only read to page 31. But I think that as a city council and all the other committees, I think that looking at the fact that Vermont is very clean should direct us more so than climate action plan. So that's my little thing. Thank you very much. Are there any other statements or comments? Okay, see none. I'd entertain a motion to come out of public hearing. So moved. Second. All those in favor? So now's our chance to have any discussion that we wish. Well, do you want me to say something first or? You can do whatever order you want. Yeah, so I mean, I recognize that the document has a heavy emphasis on the city's future responsibility to take action, to take some action on climate change. And we have worked over the last three sessions to modify that opening paragraph because there was some concern that there was too much emphasis, right? And I, you know, I don't disagree with that. But I just, I think we've struck the right balance in this document about a whole lot of forces that are descending on Vermont and on Chittenden County and on South Burlington, right? You've got pressure from development, pressure from, you know, loss of open space, pressure from loss of habitat, forest blocks, pressure from climate change, pressure from lack of housing, pressure from transportation needs, right? So, and this is our attempt to try and deal with all that. To make a comment about the fact that Vermont emits, let's say, the least carbon dioxide, I think if you look at the per capita number on that, you might be surprised because we have a lot of rural areas people have to travel long distances and transportation is like one of the number one causes of, so we burn a lot of fuel. We also burn a lot of natural gas to heat our homes today. But I think that everybody has a responsibility to take some action to decrease burning something. So when your furnace goes and you end up getting a heat pump, that'll be an action you can take, you know? When you decide to buy a new car and you get a pluggable hybrid and 99% of the time you don't put gas in it, that's an action you took. And these are actions when they're aggregated through your community or your neighborhood, your community, your county, your state. They make a real difference. And if we see that spread across the whole country and across other parts of this world, it will have an effect. It's got to start at home. So I think this document does a really good job of setting and putting that model in front of us so we have an opportunity to take those actions. So I appreciate the document and I plan to support it tonight. Okay. Other comments? Go ahead, Larry. Thanks. I think that the draft that we've received, I agree with Tim, de-emphasizes to the extent that we heard criticism for too much emphasis. And I think the opening, the edits that the team made, I think reflect that sentiment that was expressed so well from at the last meeting. So, and I agree that supporting this is important. I think the timeline, we've sort of run out of the timeline. I think there's probably, we need to recognize that as Paul mentioned earlier. So I do plan on supporting it as well. Megan. Yeah. I'll also address Dan Aldrich's comments because I, like you live in an area that is going to be prioritized for that dense development. And that does not mean that the other areas in the city are not candidates for infill, however. And it has to do more with a timeline. In order to get public transit on more sure footing, there has to be kind of a critical mass of a population. And so that's why there is some prioritization in the timeline, but any part of the city that is not natural resource protection can be a candidate for infill. So I just want you to know that there is not my neighborhood and all other neighborhoods are not being given the same treatment, just to use your word. So I think that timing is everything sometimes and that's something that I wanted to share with you, Dan, that I read the document very carefully with that in mind. And you aren't the only one to have made that comment. And so I was very sensitive to it, not only for you and me, but for other people as well. With regard to transportation, we all need to advocate. I agree with you completely, Ryan. So I will continue to do so. With regard to the climate action, I think that we have really been responsive to concerns in those members of the public who have come forward, just like you, Cindy. And I would say that on the whole, the breakdown of where climate change and climate action needs to occur, what I heard is 50% industrial, 25% residential and 25% municipal. So we're part of that equation and every municipality is a part of that equation. And we all have to do our part. It doesn't sign us up for anything other than we make a commitment to do our part as well as we can. And I think that's a fair commitment and I'm proud of the city for making that commitment. So I too plan to vote for this document. I would just like to start by really thinking both the staff and the planning commission and all the public that have come forward with attended their meetings or sent them emails or suggestions on all the different committees have weighed in. And I think it's a pretty daunting effort to take all of that information and come up with the city plan. It's aspirational. So I guess with a cynical lie, if you read through it, one could say, well, this is crazy. They're never gonna get there. They're never gonna do that. So why even put it on the piece of paper? I think it's important to have that kind of plan for a city that looks ahead is even visionary in a way. That helps lead us to good conversations and decision-making changes in zoning or our daily activities or as a community how we even interact and congregate with one another. So I think it's a really well-written, well-crafted statement about this community. And we all can find something, I suppose, that we would like worded slightly differently. But I think overall, I'm very supportive of the work and I really thank all the people, especially Paul and Kelsey who put the words together. It's hard to do. And I think they were very careful and sensitive and also willing to make the changes that the council and the planning commission suggested. So it really isn't their vision. It's really, they reflected with really good language, I think what, I don't know if it was hundreds of people, but it certainly was 30 or 40 people who were very active in putting this together. And so I think it's a real accomplishment and I strongly support it. I like what it says. I hope we can be as successful in attaining some of the goals as possible, but I understand that life can get in the way or the economy can get in the way or just, we can't make people develop where they don't wanna develop or people sell their land for development if they don't want to or businesses to come and if they don't want to, but it's always, has to be a really a collaboration of ideas and conversations and agreements. And I think this is a, I'm very proud of what this says about this community and I support it wholeheartedly. Unfortunately, Andrew's not here and he can't vote on it, but I think he certainly is would be supportive as well. So if there's no more of our discussion, I guess I would appreciate a motion to adopt this. Did we come out of public? Yes, we did. That's why we're having the discussion. You made that motion too. Fuck you. Yeah, we've had a few meetings this month. Yeah. And quite a few public hearings. When did we get a break? This has been going a long time. So a motion to approve? I'll move that we approve the city plan 2024. I will gladly second that. Okay. Is there any further discussion? Ready for the vote? Okay. All in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. So we've approved the city plan 2024. Nice job. Well done. Thank you. I guess both you will take this year. All right. Time to start working on the next one right now. Thank you. Is there any other business to come before us? All right. Seeing none. What are we going to do next Monday? Oh, that's right. That's right. We have a meeting. That's right. We have a meeting. And it overtures over. I just had to make sure. Well, you almost had me. I thought, oh. But it is February coming right up. Is Vince planning a candidate forum? Or a debate, so to speak? He is. I believe it is February 5th. Is that right? No, that's not right. I will, he is planning it. Andy's working with him. I will circulate that date to you. And the same for the budget review on the night before. Yep. Okay. All right. So we have a motion to adjourn. Second. All in favor. Aye. Okay. Is that a record? What are we going to do with ourselves? That's pretty close to a record. I don't know. I mean, I could have had dinner. Well, there are people here, of course.