 And Phillip, I'm going to make you cohost. Okay. Thank you. All right. And we will start the HRC meeting here. 629 630. Guess whatever clock you're looking at two of my clocks say a different thing. So whichever one you want to go with. And I will read. Okay. So chapter 20 of the acts of 2021, this meeting will be conducted via remote means members of the public who wish to access the meeting may do so via zoom or by telephone. No in-person attendance of me. No in-person attendance of members of the public will be permitted, but every effort will be made to ensure that the public can access the meeting. So I'm going to go ahead and do that. So I'm going to go ahead and do that via technological means. All right. And with that, we will move to action or not action items. I'm here. I notice that the agenda was a little bit different on there. Are we going to member reports or. It does look different because the CSS JC members, we're just accepted the meeting. So I'm not sure where the other members from CSS JC are at the moment. Yeah, I think that might be on me. I think I had mentioned that we might do some HRC stuff before. At our last CSSJ meets CSS JC meeting and then we'll get to this. I think they're most likely not coming on until seven, I believe. Okay. All right. So then I guess then we will move to. This one join. Nope. Okay. To member reports. Does anybody have anything to report out to. Hi, Liz. We see you. I'm moving you over. Liz, you might have something to report out on. For the affordable housing trust. So I don't have to do it. I was, but you all didn't let me. I raised my hand. I'm here. So, um, Phillip and I met this morning with members of the affordable housing trust and. We are planning a listening session with some follow up with different. Town groups in order to hear from. The town members and not only. Town members. But. Folks that live here folks that want to live here and can't work here. Live here. People that work here and have to live in out of towns because they can't afford to live here. And who am I missing Phillip? But anyway, we are going to try to, we are planning on May 4th, a listening session with all of those entities, all those folks. And again, inviting folks that. Kind of run the town. If you want to say that. In order to hear from. People as to. Their living conditions. Their inability to go. To their living conditions. Their inability to get affordable housing. And some of the stomach blocks, et cetera, as to that. So that's a subcommittee. That we're working on. And if I left anything out, Phillip. Let me know. We met for the first time this morning. We're going to meet weekly until May 4th. Or May 3rd. May 3rd. Okay. Okay. We'll, we'll. Listening session. Great. Yep. So yeah, I think let's hit everything that I would say then that's for members of the agency who will recall. That's into our vote that we had taken back in. January, I believe or something. Well, the other, I'll have to look back at the notes, but of getting together a community listening session with. And Jen and Pamela, I meant to send you that email earlier today, but I just, I have not actually been feeling well today. So I went home a little sick and that has slipped my mind until right now when I'm looking at both of you. But that email will come with the notes there. That's great. I see that CSS JC members are popping in CSS JC members. We're just going over some HRC stuff really quick, but as soon as I think we have a form, then we'll kind of dabble into that conversation. Does anybody have any questions on the listening session with the affordable housing trust? Not seeing anything. And then the only update that I have from CSS JC is that this Saturday, the 25th, we will be having a listening session with press. And so that will be in the town room at two o'clock. Is that what it is? Yes, two o'clock. So if you can just help spread the word, let your groups know anybody that can attend that would be really great. Does anybody else have any other member reports from the HRC? I am not seeing anything. I think that we will go to our first public comment. I don't know if anybody's in the audience, but if we have any public comment tonight, if you want to just go ahead and raise your hand, and we will let you into the room to speak. I am not seeing any hands being raised. So then we will, I think we might have a quorum now for CSS JC. Is that correct? Am I saying that right? That's our four of us. Yes. All right. Well, then. I will go ahead and recognize the chair or the co-chair of CSS JC. Dr. D. Shabazz to go ahead and call the CSS JC meeting to order. Okay. The CSS JC meeting is now called to order. Thank you, Phil. You want to do a call? Oh, okay. Sure. Okay. So, Miss Pat. Yeah. I can hear you. I guess Philip, you're serving two roles. Yes. Dr. Freke. Yeah. Okay. And. You're missing a leg. But maybe she'll join later. Oh. I don't know. I guess we didn't really talk about how to do it, but you know, I don't know how to do it. I don't know how to do it. Send me that text message that you were a little bit under the feather as well. And so, so, um, I will go and say that did members have the opportunity to read. The report. Yeah, I've seen some head shakes. So I think then let's open it up to a general kind of. Yeah. I think that's good. And so anybody at this time can take their, or raise their hand and HRC members. If you also have any. Think that I'm. Am I done? Yeah. Seems like it. Okay. Miss Pat. Okay. Good evening all. So. Hello. Hi, Ronnie. I'm wondering if you could maybe mute one. Mute yourself. Have you hear twice? I have, right. It's because I can see on one and I can hear on the other. And. Okay. We're good. So first I want to. Thank you. Thank the time manager and. Miss Pamela for the report. I read it. Before I go into my comment, particularly about the report, I just want to remind us all. Back. With July 5th incident. We had something done and counselor Michelle. Miller. Recommended having. A joint. Meeting. With HRC CSSJC. And. Reparation group. Additionally. Counselor. Alicia. During the, in one of the time council sessions. She. Proposed made a motion to. Have. APD. To become anti-racist. For some reason it didn't sit well with. With some council members. What ensued. Was there was. Secret private meetings. With the police officers. Ignoring. I miss youth that were hurt. By two police officers. Fast forward. The time council came up with a different proposal. And that's why we're here tonight. Which is puzzling to me. And I think. That we're going to forget or ignore. July 5th. That's not happening. So I like to urge you. Urge us. That we center. Our report. Around. What happened to. Our youth on July 5th. And I want to use this opportunity to. I want to use this opportunity. To announce that they. Amnest 5. BIPOC. Families. They're going to be producing. Actually they have. Their report. Which I would like to suggest that we include. That they've been waiting. For. You know, this report to come out. So we're not going to forget what happened in July 5th. It has not been addressed. We're not going to forget that our time manager apologized. Our chief of police never did. Okay. So that's one thing. The right thing is that. I would like to. Suggest that. In our report. Just ink, you know. Include all CSS. CSS WG recommendations. Because I think that's how to. Address. Institutional racism in this town. Some have started with Crest program and. Di program, but they're still underfunded. And I think that. What I like about the report, however. Is the fact that the town. Is negotiating with Dr. Barbara love. To do the visioning. Project. I want to thank the time manager and the. Miss. Pamela and Miss moisten. That is, is doing this. I have a lot to, to say tonight, but I will stop. But I do have a lot of concerns about the report. While I praise what Chris is doing. But they're still, you know. Evenings and overnight have, you know, not covered. So there are, there are residents who need the services. They're not able to access it because of underfunding. The youth program. I think that on. Our time government need to go back and read the CSS WG. Report. Recommendation. I think that the youth. The seven gen, they did research and they were very clear. That they need dedicated space for youth programming. We also have to remember that most of the public spaces in our town. You know, it's not, you know, some. It's not a safe space. It's not a safe space. And so we recommended by cultural. Center. So all those recommendations, we need to bring it back to thank council as part of our report. I will stop so that I'll give other people. Chance to speak, but. The town has not repaired. The youth that were harmed by the. APD, the victim compensation, everything. Nays to be included in the report will be my, my suggestion. Thank you. Thank you, Miss Pat. Hey, I like right. See that you joined. Now we're just. In the beginning talks about the report. So just any. Numbers from HRC or CSS JC that have anything to say about it. Yeah. Yeah. I don't see another answer. You'd like to go. I'll be polite. Good, Ronnie. I can wait. Did someone else raise their hand? Okay. So I looked at this a little bit differently. Partly because I don't have the history that this path has. I just looked at the report and the mandate of the report, like what the report was supposed to provide. And I did take a look at the CSWG report, which I skimmed only. So the first thing I noticed is that the report is talking a lot about what's already been done. Which I wasn't expecting to hear. And then I looked at the report by section, because there were specific. And then I looked at the, the, the, the mandates that the report was supposed to cover. So then I have comments on each of these sections. Should I just go for them? Okay. So the first one about community visioning. I think that. Although visioning wasn't done by the CSWG. I think. I think it's important to talk about a visioning framework. I like the process in general. Let's talk about a visioning framework, which is the first step. And I think it's really important to. Be more inclusive on the framework. I know that people have a lot of respect for Dr. Love and she has. I don't know her. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know if it seems odd to just have the DEI and an outside consultant. Develop the framework, which is quite important because that's going to guide the rest of it. It's in stage two. I had a little bit of a concern because a lot of. The key stakeholders mentioned were town departments. And then I was thinking what about. Other residents, everyday people. And there was reference to. Quote along with some community members. And I don't think that's enough. I would like to see a lot more community engagement and involvement outside of these official departments of the town. And then there was a reference to selecting members. From round two. Which was predominantly people from departments of the town. And I would like to see a lot more community engagement and more input from. Everyday people. Then there's a draft strategic plan. And I feel really it's important to. Share that kind of thing with the people who provided the data. Before going to town council in a formal. Complete sense. So I would suggest some kind of. Here's what we heard from you all from our visioning exercise. What do you think about it? And maybe giving people like seven days to comment on the draft. I don't know. I'm making this up. But that it needs to have that legitimacy. In order to be accepted leader. So that's number one. Most of my thoughts are on the resident oversight. Ford, which was also recommended. I see by the CSWG. And here it's really that. I really do appreciate. The importance of understanding some of the constraints of community action on police. Because they're guided by their own. There are all sorts of state rules that guide their actions. And you can't just jump in and say, Oh, I don't like this. I don't want you to do this. I understand this from being involved with. Changing local police behavior where I lived before I came here. So I think that's important, but I would like to see also that. The resident advisory board have a deeper understanding of power relations. And how these are played out in every day. Exchange. So. Yeah, we do need to know about post and so on. But we also need to have people on the board who have sort of a non-technical. Non-rational. More that fits with the experience of people on that. Advisory group. Yeah. I had some more thoughts. I won't go on and on. I can see other hands up and I'm taking up all this time. And the RFB process also. I feel like there's a lot of data. I didn't read it in detail, but. So much data in the CSWG group. I think somehow all of that. Has to be brought into the analysis. And, um, yeah. As far as the press is concerned, I'm really impressed by the accomplishments of press, but I don't think the report address the mandate, which is. Continue to improve protocols. That was quite impressive record of what they've achieved. What needs to be done in my mind. And I think that's something that I think is really important. I think that the details are received by the police department and how a determination is made about. You know, does, is this something crest does, or is this something that police. Do. And I know that's a longer process, but I don't see that it started. And I think a recommendation that would help me a lot is. You know, how, when is it going to start? And how is it going to start and happen? And, um, I'm not sure. I think that's a very clear approach. I know that there's a lot of evidence for success. Again, I'm just want to be sure that the right people. And a broad base of representation. Is included in the two O T group by fear that with 17 people are already town employees. Well, part supposed to be part of the two T. I'm not sure if there will be enough. Room for community members. arguing to have, I would like to see much more broader community representation and involvement in the, in these processes that are being proposed, which I think are good processes. I just would like to see more of everyday people in it. And I believe that the capacity does exist in this town. Thank you. Thank you, Ronnie, for that. I'll see Allegra next. My tardiness. So I think for me, the part one of the report or the bullet, I don't know how we're defining it, the thing about the community visioning, I feel like that was the place where I had the most positive feedback for the report. I certainly like that the visioning has kind of a clear outline and I do agree with what Ronnie has said that we want to make sure community stakeholders who are not town employees are involved in that process as much as possible. And I did like the train, the trainer model that was discussed because I think that that's where some of the stronger coalitions with communities, members can be built. It seemed like to me. And I just wondered if there would be some sort of stipend for people who were involved in the training program, because that again would probably bring more people to the table. In terms of the Resident Oversight Board, I was wondering, because to me it seemed like in Phase 1A and 1B that a lot of that work and research was already done by CSWG and Seven Gen, and I just don't want a person to be replicating research that's already been done. And this might be controversial, but I worry a little bit about some of these things seeming to be more pro-police than pro-accountability. And I do have concerns if we're trying to promote trusting confidence in the Amherst Police Department when people are coming and saying, no, we have a problem with them, and I know ultimately the goal is to solve the problem. But I guess for me, the way that I read through it, just something about that jumped out at me as perhaps if this is the place where you're bringing a complaint against the police department is the goal to have trusting confidence or is it to have the police be accountable for their actions. So that was, I think, my main feedback around the Resident Oversight Board. I guess I just, I had a lot of concerns on number three, that that was just deferred to the Resident Oversight Board, when again, I feel like the LEPA report really covered at least five key areas where policy changes could start. And I don't know if there is some hesitation to start with policy changes, knowing that a new chief will be coming in. But I think that we obviously have seen things haven't worked in the past, and there's still been no resolution really to the incident from July for the families. And I think that having some changes to the policy in the way that police interact with the community is important. And I don't want to continue to see things getting kicked off, kicked down the road until something new is in place. And then we'll look at it. And I just, I get concerned about that. And again, because there was such strong research done by LEP around the areas for policy change. Under the crest, I agree again with what's been said that it is great to see the accomplishments so far. I have a problem with the wording that they're fully funded in staffed departments. I think if we're looking at what was recommended, it was recommended that crest would be a 24 seven program. And that's not the case. And I think that even hearing from Earl that, you know, in a few CSS JC meetings ago that they were perhaps going to have to start declining to respond to calls that makes me feel as if they are not fully staffed. And, you know, I think DEI department has also had a lot on their plate and could really benefit from additional support even even just administratively. So I took issue with that wording. Again, A, because it's not in line with what was recommended for those programs and B, because we're already hearing that they are overwhelmed with the amount of calls that they're responding to and might not be able to respond in the future, for certain things. Under the Youth Empowerment Center, I had a question about why it had been moved under the recreation departments purview as opposed to staying in DEI, which is where CSWG had recommended it. And I guess in terms of the working group, the town managers forming, I'm wondering why students aren't on the list, high school and or middle school students. Unless I missed it, it looked like there were a lot of adults talking about what the kids need, but where's the representation of the youth. And they again had concerns around investigating feasibility of establishing a Youth Empowerment Center program because I think that leaves the door open for there not to be one at all. And I think that the way that it is written in terms of ensure any proposed infrastructure improvements can be met by local sources unless additional funding is found. While I understand wanting to be realistic about the budget, I feel like this report is just setting up barriers for things to actually happen. I was excited to see about the different workshops that have been provided. And the different events that have been held so far by DEI is impressive for just a staff of two that you have done so much. And I thank you for that. And finally under the communications plan, I just wanted to put in another plug again for including translation plan in that. Figuring out how translation services can help with the communication plan so that it's reaching non-native English speakers can make up a large portion of our population. So thank you for listening to me. Yeah, thank you, Allegra. I'm going to see Tyler and then I'll go to Deb. So, Tyler? Yeah, I agree with Ronnie about the need to have more community engagement in all of this and especially with the recommendations and the report to hire consultants. And it seemed to offload a pretty substantial amount of the process of setting up the oversight board and other new institutions onto a outside consultant. I don't think that that's really a viable option as the be all and all because while a consultant can come in and provide all sorts of outside experience and advice and perhaps even institutional knowledge, they can't really sculpt a plan specific to the town of Amherst in the way that Amherst residence and the government of Amherst is able to. And without the continuous and substantial input of Amherst residence and the continuous and substantial involvement of the Amherst government, then it's going to be much harder to produce any actual results. And I also did notice what Allegra was talking about with the crest section of the report where it spent quite a lot of time discussing the demographic makeup of crest and sort of patting itself on the back. But yeah, is a little bit of a dearth here in information about how crest is going to be moving forward and able to expand to 24 seven responses and make sure that it can meet the load of calls that has been receiving because this report definitely seems to reinforce that there's a demand for crest and I think that the appropriate measure to take given this evidence of a demand and evidence that crest is able to be successful is to start looking at where crest might be able to be scaled up and moved up to this 24 seven capacity and perhaps even where it might need to be scaled up urgently in order to meet his current call load. Since now it's not really as much a concern of whether it's viable but more how we take this viable program from its infancy to a very sustainable actually fully staffed and fully funded and fully equipped department. Thank you Tyler. Doug? Hello everyone. So yeah, I wasn't at the last CSSJC meeting so I wasn't sure what time I was supposed to jump on. I was figuring you know I was told that this was around the time. So if Phil if you can kind of say what you all are looking for I think I have an idea but if you can just be clear since I missed that. Yeah so what we're just discussing right now is kind of general fills of the report what you liked about it what you didn't like about it what we want to see proposed to count council as our piece on the advisory piece of it that's the overall goal that we're doing as together as a group to get the report and be say this is what CSSJC this is what HRC views as both positive negative advice type deals. So then are we going to so based on what we say are we putting something together and then we're going to be sending it out to who to the town manager to the town council because I know we're going to be going to the meeting but I guess I'm just trying to figure out the lay of the land. Right. I believe both town council and town manager. Okay and just sending that pre pre the April 3rd meeting. Correct. Okay okay. All right yeah I do have I do have a variety of thoughts a lot of I agree with a lot of what people said already and just will probably be echoing or adding to a little bit in terms of what folks said in terms of number one I did agree with a lot of you know in terms of the visioning you know I agree with a lot of what was said there especially if let's say the consultant is someone like a Barbara Love then you know that would be some of that knows the community and you know it has been a long time Amherst resident and is social justice focused you know and obviously if we could have you know they could be a lot more input especially from groups like us and other groups but also outreaching right outreaching me one of the main things that I didn't see in the number one the visioning was how are you going to outreach to the populations the marginalized populations that needs to be there right it can't be the same characters it can't be just us right we already we already have platforms you want to give a platform to those that don't have a platform that don't have a voice right so how are we outreaching that I know like these group that we had hired during CDSWG to do the work that we needed they were able to go into the community and get people's feedback and things like that so we need to be more kind of thinking along those lines in terms of how are we going to get people's voice and messages around the visioning because that's going to be critical we can't just have the same old same old voices at the table it has to be the ones that we do not have at the table to take part in the visioning they're the ones that are the most impacted around the police and are impacted around what happens when when policing goes back right so how are we going to do that you know including obviously translation center translation services but you know who are we going to use to make sure that we're getting right there's a lot of people that are already involved in a lot of different communities so are we going to use those community leaders to get in an outreach to folks that can act that actually needs to be sharing information around the visioning for me that's going to be critical if not it's just going to be a superficial visioning and what's the point right so that that would be my first part in terms of that in terms of the resident oversight board yeah I mean I'm sorry like the the the first the RSP in terms of one two and three that's that's just delay tactics and nonsense you know you know it we already did all that work at CSWG right now it's about putting this in place this is delay this is delay delay and delay it's about let's let's put the the you know what CSWG I didn't see that and I think someone had already shared that a lot of what CSWG did pay consultants to do and so on so forth and research countless hours of research to do I didn't see here so it's basically rebuilding and re-going and then when is this oversight board going to be put in place we need this in place yesterday right so so you know that whole first part one two and three is just a waste of time and and it's just going to delay everything and we need to make sure that that does not happen and we're clear about that that is a delay in a waste of time um number three two yeah why can't we stop reviewing the public safety protocols now why do we have to wait for the oversight board to do that you know that we had the incident you know as was stated that hasn't even been fully resolved in terms of July right incident with our youth and hasn't even been resolved and so why are we going to wait you know and like I said if we if we end up doing what's stated here for the oversight board who knows when the oversight board is going to be in place and so that means then we're going to wait for them to be in place then go look at at the safety protocols no you know we need to look at that now this there's an urgency in terms of that happening because if not you know these incidents these incidents with five pop population is going to continue to happen so um that's you know again delay tactics to me um and then in terms of crests yes you know definitely agree with with that this they've done a lot you know a lot of work and a lot has been accomplished however you know as as everyone was saying and even Tyler just just spoke about how are we going to increase right increase the budget increase the staff uh and make sure that it's a 24 seven um you know outfit right a 24 seven organization and also um you know just making sure that anything that is nonviolent is being responded to by crests right and I think we had even there was something maybe you all discussed about it before around the dispatch you know because we at CSWJ I said that we didn't think it would be a good idea for it to be this dispatched from the the police department they need to have their own dispatch and things like that because they would allow for more people to um to phone in and get help so there's a lot more that can be done so I didn't see any of that here it's touting crests and obviously all of the wonderful work that crest has done that's great and and and what you know what I'm saying thank you and what right what's the next step and what what else we're going to be doing uh and especially around the budget I want to see some hard numbers to increase the staff and make it a 24 seven um let me see here yeah a number five in terms of the youth empowerment the same things CSWG we have done a lot of work around that and had stated in terms of of you know the vision for for the youth empowerment and the key members the youth why are we talking with the youth right they're the only ones I want to hear in terms of establishment of youth empowerment center um they're the ones that we need to focus on not it you know it's like what do they want and then we make it happen right and we put and we put the plate the um we pick the place I think there's there's already different options for that and let's you know let's let's work on the budget and let's put it together but they're the only ones I want to hear is young people and especially BIPOC young people you know people um um young people who are marginalized you know some you know LGBTQ you know different able young people all of that right that's who I want to hear from and that's who we need to be talking with in terms of creating the youth empowerment um anyone else that there's really you know they're the adults are there to just make it happen whatever the youth you know um um and then uh yeah you know DEI has been doing a lot of workshops definitely agree with that um you know they probably need some more funding too to to to continue to to level up and to be able to do a lot more um and then I agree with with Allegra in terms of the communications with the translation and outreach and you know just making sure that those who are marginalized and don't have a voice are the ones that we're actually communicating to as opposed to the same voices um so those are my main points as of right now thank you for that dub I'll see Dr. Shabazz yes I'm gonna remain off camera uh thank you and thank you for everyone's comments I can you all hear me yes um so I agree 100 with what um everyone has said um I just want to make some points um round two of the coming together meetings and it says these meetings are uh at the heart of the work for visioning well if it's at the heart of the work for visioning and you have 17 staff members that is clearly problematic right um because what that as someone who who does you know intergroup dialogue what that sets up is an echo chamber and so they're all the staff members you know not to say they're not thinking out of the box or thinking creatively or what have you but you need the resident's voice at the table or you're simply talking to one another and it it borders on talking to one another to reinforce the status quo or whatever the town policies are and that's not to say it won't you know veer out of that but but that is what the setup becomes in how that visioning process is outlined uh currently okay um I do believe in it but it absolutely needs residents as a part of that dialogue it's about the residents right and their needs and so then the resident oversight section it also borders on becoming a means of justifying the the new police standards right things that are already mandated instead of using a model such as LEAP as Allegra referred to and we've been referring to it since CSWG to create policies that are community and resident center all you're doing is rewriting a playbook to make sure that the current policing structure remains in place okay so again that's problematic and just because you write it up in a report and it looks pretty that doesn't mean it's actually going to serve the purpose and we're going to be back here again the other thing is that there's no clear complaint process for residents written into the resident oversight board structure this is something from research with my group and research with CSWG that we have pointed out even before that it was the the main blarney blowout that happened a few years ago and we brought in an outside consultant a former chief from Boston and that was his point Amherst does not have a clear complaint process where residents feel safe to complain and that when those complaints are heard and that they need to be actionable if they are credible that is not written into that process okay so same thing again and then when we get to press simply put you know you have this great program because of and not to say it's just because of the novelty of it Earl Miller's a great manager so with the limited funds that he has been given to work with he has done a great job the thing is it is a novel program in the state of massachusetts and in the united states so whatever kudos he is getting and crest is getting it is because it is unique that does not mean you are creating a sustainable program and so unless this program is supported and funded eventually it will burn out and fail so it has to be funded if we see this is a good thing and they want to you know the town manager touts it all the time as look what we're doing in Amherst with great town manager CSWG is glad that they helped you create a program that is stellar like that but then if you want to make sure that you can you know 10 years down the road still brag about it it has to be funded and you cannot just stop at eight o'clock in the evening particularly on a weekend where when we most need those services and then lastly youth empowerment this youth empowerment center should be looked at this BIPOC youth empowerment center should be looked at as the other side of July 5th so we can complain some of some folks criticized these young people you know you can complain about what these young people are doing or not doing but unless you have a space and a place where they can feel safe and themselves and that they have some self-efficacy we're going to have the same type of situation or worse and those stakeholders must be the you it is ridiculous to have this whole conversation without those youth at the center helping to decide how this will look how it will work and then it's never lastly but that's how it comes in terms of the town's budget if we want inclusivity as an ongoing process in this town and folks to feel like oh you didn't forget me we must have translation services we absolutely have to have translation services it cannot be an afterthought it cannot be um oh well let's do a little survey and see who's going to attend no you like I said at the last the SSJC meeting you build it people will come if they know someone is there to translate for them if they know they can be included in the conversation folks will show up so that's that's my critique yes DEI y'all are doing a tremendous job we we need to get you more funding because the the things that you are coordinating you know is eventually also cost per doubt so we want to keep you there and we want to support you that's what I have to say thank you thank you DEI does anybody else from HRC or CSSJC that has not spoken yet want to raise their hand and speak not seen any hand I will just echo a lot of what everybody else has said in terms of funding and community representation of both the resident oversight board and the government so I won't go too much into that to say sometimes I'll also just echo the wording of fully funded funded and staffed I I did take a little issue with that just seeing both departments of Crest and DEI it does very much seem like to whom is it fully funded and to whom is it fully staffed to because if you look at the CSSJC report that was definitely not the recommendation of the way that it's structured right now and funded as well as the CSSJC has brought up as well as both departments kind of has brought up in their own budgetary requests for the town we have to bring on a consultant to get the resident oversight board kind of moving in a quicker way than just with the staff of the DEI as and having Crests have limited hours and hours of operations of critical time and critical need for communities especially marginalized communities that have issues past eight o'clock and so that I think really needs to be centered in that and so I think both departments are doing amazing work and to these point it gets boasted about a lot in newspapers and nationally and so if we're going to boast about it let's let's make it last longer let's really be you know we could be a town that put the Crests department nationwide in almost every city and be a kind of epicenter for it to go into reflect back in the blueprint of how did it happen what did it need what were some of the things that needed to be fixed of it and I think this is a great opportunity to recognize that it is not fully funded it is not fully staffed and so let's make sure that that happens as far as procedure wise how we're going to do this go about it both co-chairs of the CSSJC and co-chairs of the HRC received an email from an increase more stating kind of agenda wise for April 3rd and that it seemed as if there were kind of two folds to April 3rd either we go on at 8 30 or Allegra or D jump on I forget what the other option was I feel like it was super early 5 p.m yeah yeah I think it would even be off work yet yeah same as well there was another option that came in later today that we delay until the 24th and so I guess more so in a group thing and to have kind of majority wise what what do people want to do what is feasible also because whatever reports back we get to the town council if it is on the 3rd it will need to be in by the 29th I believe and so that's a quick turnaround as well just to recognize that go ahead miss Pat so process wise I think you already said what I was thinking we cannot be taking orders from the town council if it's not feasible for us I don't think April 2nd you know makes sense anyways it's not enough time for us to put a report together the second thing is the scheduling agenda items I like to propose that on the date that we agreed to me with the town council the joint meeting it has to be this has to be only one agenda plus public comments that's it the the town council president needs to make time for this report I don't want checking off the box one hour is not enough to go over all this if town council is thinking well we ask the town manager to do a report we got the HLC and CSSJC to get a report then they put it away now that evening the joint meeting will only be this agenda so I'd like to suggest for the co-chairs of both committees to send an email to the town council president that April 24 make more sense for us and we would like it to be just that for that meeting two to three hours and um advertise it because whenever it comes to issue of racism and equity and all that stuff it get rushed we cannot be rushed let's do what's just WG did sometimes we cannot be let's not be pushed around please thank you thank you for that miss pat debora um actually it is a question for miss pat which I agree with everything you said miss pat but I'm just wondering though when should we really say for the meeting to happen because when is the budget though do because well some of this is like May 1st so if we have it towards the end if we do it towards the end of April though is there going to be enough time for the turnaround time you know what I'm saying because you know they're going to say no they're going to be like you know so it's just kind of like so we need to think timing wise so too like do we get our report into them then saying you know in terms of like the you know what what our recommendations are for the budget before we meet with them so all I'm saying is just like when you just need to already did that we did that I think deb miss okay we already submitted it submitted so okay yeah priorities we already did okay so that submitted them yeah so they know that so this is just a conversation then uh we're supposed to this two committees supposed to do a report joint report is not I get it I get it but I don't think I don't think we'll be ready with report on the second it's my thinking when I read when I read the report I don't think that's enough time for us to do that I could be wrong with people said busy schedules no that's fine it so then I'm just trying to get like an understanding so okay so the budget which is obviously the most important part that's okay so now this report that we're doing on the recommendations is just to kind of like substantiate type of thing in terms of what you know what he was saying that that's been accomplished and and the path forward yeah it's to give it our advice piece on the plan of the path folks forward is my understanding of it is that Paul put together and I don't know how much the DEI department had to do with it but um put this report together of kind of the path forward and what they want to do and so we're giving our advice piece as to what we liked about it what we think could be added more about it what what these two groups have to say about it basically okay so also the way I'm thinking about it to be honest with you I'm not thinking about it as to what the charge is from tank council I'm looking at it as what cswg cssjc has been recommending um to be more uh global more expansive than narrowing it to the report that the time manager put forth we can include documents that the tank also already have because sometimes people forget so I'm hoping with our report it will be a robust report to include the information they already have because some of them will pretend like it didn't exist yeah even the budget thing that cssjc submitted I will recommend that we include it with that report if it's repetitive that's fine so that would be no question at all that it you know they didn't have it they don't know and I know you know everybody's busy thank you yeah I think that makes sense Steve so I agree with miss pat that it'd be comprehensive the uh the budget the report from the july 5 uh group um you know any other documentation we could include once again the leap uh recommendations I mean I think they need to be reminded so that when we are when we do submit the report our report the report and then we talk about it that all of that is in the packet they don't have to go look for it it's right there now that's a good point definitely oligra everybody has said I think the 24th makes more sense time wise in order to actually produce something that we want to pretend that we feel reflects the importance of this work um I don't I was just thinking about kind of ways to divide and conquer and I don't know if it would my my thought that popped into my head was maybe a member of hrc pairs up with a member of css jc and it tackles like each group would get like one of the items to delve into I don't know if that would make sense because I I just feel like otherwise two people end up stuck writing the big report and no meeting law and all that stuff so I don't know if that gets around some of those concerns or or if that even makes sense but that was just the thought that popped into my head right yeah just uh before I go back to um the hands race is everybody in agreement to move it to the 24th like you just get thumbs up from people whether virtually or not yay yep I'm seeing yeah I'm seeing a bunch of guesses all right so we're moving it to the 24th so uh co-chairs from css jc and hrc will figure out who's responding back to lin I don't really um have a preference on who just as long as someone does uh this part so I'd like to suggest that all the wonderful um feedback tonight if people will remember what they say tonight you know write it up it will make the load easy um not easy but lighter you know for the co-chairs and then submit through um is moistin or something like that to compile you know um for us to go back to the document and do our critique suggest your recommendation and then maybe have two people from each uh committee you know put put everything together rather than having the co-chairs write everything and perhaps the minutes from tonight could help us too if people forgot what they what they said tonight it's what I'm envisioning we should go about it yeah that makes sense I did take yeah without breaking the open meeting law we just you know pass things on through miss moistin did that make sense yeah that makes sense and I did take notes too and it um notes from this meeting will be good uh Jen or Pamela I'm gonna look to you both for guidance knowing that it's definitely a tricky thing to open meeting law what are we allowed to do as a member from HRC and a member from CSSJC allowed to meet offline and put something together without breaking open meeting law so I um I think that the suggestion to have um one or two members from each uh commission work on the document is fine um Phillip you're probably the tricky person because you have representation on both so it might um I think uh uh so your presence might tip the scale towards one group having um a quorum um and I would suggest maybe that we have a a talk with Athena our resident expert to to finalize it but I think the concept is a is a good one I don't know Jen do you what have any thoughts I don't see any issues necessarily with an individual from each group connecting well then from that then I think that if everybody is okay with that proposal we will get an individual from both groups to kind of summarize what was said tonight and if you have anything else to add send it to Pamela and Jen so that way it can be sent out to those individuals and then that way that report can be written up and then the report can be sent back to the CSSJC as well as the HRC to kind of just finalize like a thumbs up approval we captured or whoever's right in the report captured what was said does that plan sound good to everybody yeah Dee I guess I was just saying yes okay got it I just want to be clear so you're saying for instance if Deborah and Juliana were to work together whatever they create get sent to me and Pamela is that what you're saying and then we take everybody's everything and merge it into one document and then send it to both commissions no I was thinking that if in that scenario if Juliana and Deb are working together they would compile kind of the report to send to you to then send to both groups for the overview kind of thumbs up from both groups okay all right now I guess we just need that representation and I will admit and acknowledge that my involvement is a tricky one for that since I am a part of both groups so someone from CSSJC I can say what I'm willing to work on I'm working with the MS PhiFox so I'll be responsible for getting their reports to Ms. Moisten if that makes sense so in that case that report cannot be edited because it's coming from them it is the way it is correct that would just be attached just like the leap report or the CSWG report yeah yeah it will be final report report it cannot be edited well it seems like we would have like a list of appendices that would yes CSWG's previous reports the leap reports the nine report our you know CSSJC's budget letter and whatever else we feel like needs to go in there I guess one thing I want to maybe clarify with Lynn would be okay so we are pushing our meeting back so when's our next when's our actual deadline now just in terms of when we would need to get something yeah yeah definitely let's get good packet materials are due the Thursday Friday before the meeting all right I think it's accent five days prior to the meeting is that no okay that's what they're asking five days right did I did somewhere like that or am I imagining something yeah so I agree with with Jen it's generally the Thursday I think before the meeting because the posting what has to be like 48 hours and so if the I haven't I don't have a calendar in front of me but if the 24th is on Monday then it would be due that Thursday yeah so and there's there's no open meeting law on the packet materials the reason why is so that people can get through the materials over the weekend typically so it's typically the there and I say Thursday Friday because that's when Athena starts sending it out and and uploading it so so quite um still on the process um how is this I am thinking we probably need to do one more joint meeting I mean how are we going to come together and agree on the final report do we like send feedback to miss moisten or go Jen um I think I'm I'm missing the point of so there's all of these people are sending all of these sections of their recommendations who's compiling all of those right yeah and then we're not there yet you're not there yet yeah okay and then I mean yeah you both of you have both committees have meetings prior to or could in theory no css jc does it no until May the meeting that we have scheduled is the April 2nd the joint meeting our next meeting will be in May May 10 something like that HRC will have another meeting on the 19th and by the looks of the calendar the 20th would be when the packet needs to be done so I think if we want to come together and just I guess have a joint meeting on that time let's do that if that's okay with people let's do that that makes the most sense and we don't have to screw them let's do that if that's okay with HRC yeah I think that would make the most sense for that all right so working on it I mean I I will say I don't mind working on the report again though I don't want to be the person that's the problem in the room so I think that needs to get cleared up first yeah I don't necessarily think that you would be a problem working on the report it just is like originally you guys had you had said like two members from each committee and there that's where I think the numbers might be tricky because you might sway one group or the other by your presence there were four people but I think it's perfectly fine for you to work with one other person and we can ask Athena for specific clarification tomorrow and and email the the co-chairs Dr. Frake perhaps I misheard Allegra but I imagined that your suggestion was a person each from the different groups or was it two people from the different groups so I think my original suggestion was that if one member from each group were assigned to each so one eight one HRC and one the CSS JC talking about crests one HRC one CSS JC talking about resin oversight board and then all of that information being compiled but I think that there was a second proposal that was just that one or two people from each group come together and synthesize all the information that has been said tonight and any other comments that get made there are sent to those people I think I prefer your suggestion but of course whatever is preferable to others holds thank you I mean given I'm looking at the practicality of working with each like one person from each committee it seems to me I like to think things like in a linear way it seems like a lot easier if there are topics that people are passionate about and I'm one of those that I make sure that those points get in I submit to Ms. Moisten you know I'm sure each of us have you know areas that they feel strongly about to submit you know if I work with somebody and all issues are important but what am I trying to say if I work with somebody and the topic that is chosen is not really something I want to work on I don't know how effective I would be it's what I'm thinking so we are about how many people 15 of us how many 15 I don't know how many for both for both groups if we can submit our paragraphs whatever you want to call it to Ms. Moisten I think it's a lot easier and they maybe have maybe three or four people compile it or two people compile it they're not writing up anything it's just that they're putting all the documents that they received putting it together and then we meet on the 20th you know we read it before the meeting and then approve it and then send it off to the town council president no D yeah I think that's feasible it's just that um there there has to be one to two people kind of putting it all together in a readable form we will definitely have uh you know hopefully as soon as possible the recording of this meeting um and you know you can transcribe it uh but you also have panelists taking notes other people are taking notes and as you said Ms. Pat people can submit their comments I think it's just to figure out do we put that in one master document and does that all go to Jen and then including the recording and transcript and then someone is able to compile that and put into a readable form I guess is is the real question I mean Philip has volunteered himself so we need one more person right this volunteer would be for a fellow compiler compiler exactly yes um I'll be glad to join with you Philip on this thank you awesome yeah so then let's move that so anything that you would like to add or really like to say um send an email to Jen and Pamela so that way you can get to Dr. Freke and I so that way then we can compile all that we'll compile a document get it out to everybody let's say if you can get your comments in by April 3rd so that way then we have time Dr. Freke and I to write it out before April 19th and then on April 19th we'll meet again and have it ready to be sent off to town council for that Thursday so then that way on the 24th that Monday that we can meet Philip what was the date that you said that you want everyone's version at April 3rd anything that they would like to add in just maybe suggest that we all try and follow like the one two three four five six seven numbering so that for the compilers they're not yes please thank you for that suggestion yes though I don't have to make guess work that you're talking about the Rob report or the youth and medical center Ms. Pat you have your hand up yeah I do suggestion uh Allegra but I also think that we should leave room for miscellaneous because that's where I come in with the July 5th incident I do want it I'm not I'm even thinking it shouldn't be an appendix it is the impetus why we're here tonight even though the the the report we're working on has been watered down to confuse and distract but we're not you know we're not stupid here we're not stupid adults we know what we're doing so not that I think about it it should not be an appendix it should be you know part of the report if it's okay with everybody yeah I think it makes sense I think that's why this kind of even happened right it's in because of the November meeting that we had with them in result to the July 5th incident and everything else that you're inspired so I think highlighting that I think makes perfect sense to yeah it would be painful yeah it would be painful to read it would be some of them would be controversial but you know if you want to heal we not we need we will need to you know hear the truth from the people who were impacted so I want it to be really central with everything we're doing in addition to what Allegra suggested so July 5th will be the first stuff that we do then followed by the like you suggested Allegra yeah all right that sounds good Ronnie Ronnie we cannot hear you you're muted and we can see this report that you're talking about Ms. Pat would it be sorry the report will be I will send it to Ms. Moisten on the third that's what it's doing right so I was just wondering if it would help me to see it in terms of the comments that I submit but that's fine uh because we're submitting comments right on the right our our comments so I think should be reflected of the report the report is itself from the families and so yeah I would say that our comments would be from as a body of the HRC and not from the Amherst 9 so you so our comments are about the DEI the town manager's report or is that what we're saying I just want to know what to submit to you right that's that's kind of the what we are doing I I know I think any comments would be that want to be added into the report I think we we can find a way to add it in but yes it's it's in regard to the report that the town manager sent off that's what I'm commenting on and sending to Jennifer I'm seeing a bunch of hands and I don't know who went first so Allegra Allegra can go Allegra helpful to frame our response in a reminder as the introduction of what happened July 5th and what didn't happen afterwards and say you know we received this report following the November whatever it was motion by town council instructing the town manager to do these things these things that should have been implemented or you know these things it should be in place to help avoid these situations from happening again because I do think that it I think that there is there should be a link between July 5th and all of the suggestions that were made I think that the specific suggestions related to July 5th were purposely left out of the motion and I think that I think that you know I I I understand what Ronnie is saying too is if if we're talking about this family's report you know the families who have come together and written a document it would be helpful to see it but but I also kind of hear Philip in that you know part of what we're doing is responding to this thing from town manager DEI initiatives so I think I think for me I would want to see the report prior to to knowing what or how it was completely being included but I think that town council needs to get that on their desks like it needs to be a part of our report whether it is embedded in the body or as an appendix but I think the framing of our response can be July 5th happened and nothing happened as a response and these are the the points that were made by the town council these are the points that were left out and or we can say you know this was the the coming the producing a report was stricken from their initial motion but we did it anyway and here it is maybe that's a way to get it into the report you know these are the things that we wanted in the motion that were deleted from the motion but just because you deleted it didn't mean that they're not important and we're not going to do them exactly so I just went around a lot of circles there but I am I'm hearing you all and I I completely agree with you all and I will just add too that we are going to have the benefit of meeting with town council as well to state this all in in public to be honest alongside with the report so definitely I I will just acknowledge it's going to be some tricky word play but it will happen is what I will say so I think we should also consider history okay I'm thinking more of future generation who knows one day 50 years to come when some of us are not here anymore myself included who knows my great-great-grand whatever pick it up is this what mine you know did wow you know so history we can donate that that this documents to our local libraries because what happened last year if the town has responded accordingly appropriately we will not be sitting here tonight because they decided to ignore it and that's why that's why we're doing this and we will have to see it through because the families that have been talking to them they've been you know sharing how they're composing their document is going to be comprehensive is going to refresh everybody's memory every single fallout on that incident will all be put together everything all the role roles that different people played every single actors will be included in the report sunshine is medicine so did you say for me to go film yeah so I mean I think what we want to do I know we when we're not going to have the benefit of like looking at the report before we submit our comments but I guess we do have to find a way to kind of like include it in a seamless way in terms of what Allegro was saying right some type of of kind of intro about it in the beginning and then including the report right including maybe yeah like what we said some of the recommendations that we had made which was not taken up by the town council and then you know saying that we're supported supportive of the report you see what I'm saying so I think that that you know if we're going to put that as the first portion we have to kind of weave it in and then address the DEI town manager report but like miss Pat has said I think we also want to add whatever else we want to add I don't think we need to be constrained by you know just addressing what what the town manager and in the I kind of created in terms of the report we need to kind of say whatever else we want to say in terms of like a lot of the cswg recommendation that weren't included you know anything else around the you know Amherstine you know any other issues you want to include in it so so for me it's like when I said my comments I'm going to be kind of talking about you know anything that I feel is important is and impactful so that we can include in this and so that then yeah I think it's going to be good I'm going to talk about it but as we know a lot of what times we talk they just kind of like you know take us on this wild goose chase so I think we need to have it documented okay definitely right yeah another lingering issue for me is then what we submit this report cswg the submitted report is only Cress and DEI program that was implemented so we submit you know we have this meeting on the 24th then what yeah but I think that that's the question at hand that you had brought up even at last meeting kind of what CSS JC's role is what the HRC role is I think of that that's for sure the bigger question of pass this report because yes we can hand this report into D and everybody else's comments is that how much of it will be listened to and what will happen afterwards so yeah I think that that's something to definitely think about yeah it is my it is my struggle that's my struggle like we do all this exercise another performance show what commitment are we getting from the decision makers the time council are they going to fully fund Cress this fiscal year is oversight but really going to happen all that stuff we need to know from them so how do we go about doing that after the report or before the report I've struggled with that I just don't want report that will be collecting dust and I think the time council did this to put pressure off of them then you know and no action Ronnie I wonder if we could just ask as part of the communications about dates and whatnot I wonder if we could ask I have the same concern how is this report going to be used and could we suggest please that you take a vote at the end of this discussion because we're all putting a lot of time into this you take a vote about whatever but I would really like to see a concrete outcome from this I just you know it just seems like from looking at the previous reports it's just more of the same I think the message has been communicated and the question really is what is going to be done if the town manager has gotten involved in proposing something will there be a budget allocated to this and what will be the oversight of that budget you know will DEI oversee it and make sure things happen and I don't know what but we do have to ask them to decide on something and for me I would need to see the document to be able to say one thing but if we could pick a few items and say we're asking on this date because we are putting all this work into it that the council take a vote and say what they do they support this or not yeah definitely Deborah yeah I agree with that um because that's what I was thinking and I remember some of the town council members you know which I won't name the one that brought it up um remember they were like oh you need to be very specific you need to really kind of you know showcase you know by bullet and I don't know if we have to do smoke signals I don't know what it is but we need to kind of really be succinct in terms of what we're looking for but I think that's what I think when we meet prior to submitting the report we need to come up with okay these are some of the main kind of points that we want you all to vote on or to decide on or whatever the case may be as opposed to kind of doing the whole laundry list I think we want to put everything that we're talking about and and and things they need to change but then we need to kind of really bullet point okay this is what we're looking for and we need you all to make a decision now so that then if they don't make a decision and they continue to you know just delay their delay tactics then we can take it to the media take it to wherever we need to take it to to continue the pressure because really that's the only way we're gonna be able to get anything done but um but yeah we need to be very succinct I agree yeah definitely agree okay well if if no one has anything else to say I think that the joint part of this meeting it is done and oh what is Jen did you did you guys or you're gonna do that offline to figure who's working with who me and frekka are working together and the individuals are submitting stuff to you and then you forward it to them so each individual's forwarding something so I thought the individuals were working in teams no no that was an early on proposal yeah so anybody that has anything else to say we'll send it to you and Pamela who then if you could just pass that informational along to me and frekka and me and frekka will compile the report and send out to the overall group and all of our comments need to go in by April 3rd yes to you to Jennifer so we send everything to Jennifer April 3rd and then you forward it Jennifer and Pamela and then you forward it to um Philip and frekka yep so yeah sorry well I was just gonna thank CSSJC for being here and HRC members we just have a few things to go through but I promise we won't go that way can I just say one last thing yeah so very quickly I will get the MS5 report to miss moisten next week Friday so that you guys will have time to read it you know it looks like it's very important for you guys to to say it when you do your own submission yep okay next week Friday not this week next week yeah sounds good thank you CSSJC really appreciate it thank you for having us thank you for having us thank you goodbye all right HRC next item that we have is uh bylaws it's a pretty quick update Tyler Ronnie and myself have all kind of submitted um individual report type of things and it has not gone to Pamela and Jen and they will compile uh full kind of change to the bylaws and once that happens and we will get that out for approval for all members um a PI month celebration uh someone's gonna have to remind me I don't have good notes on that who was taking that on I'm gonna defer that one to Juliana she's been a rock star in this awesome yeah um so so far I just told um the people that we co-united a club at the high school that I'm a part of I just asked them to submit some things uh I'm still in the process of getting like a schoolwide daily announcement thing for student participation on it um we decided on a date May 7th uh Sunday uh it's an important day in the Asian American Pacific Islander community there's I've been I'm gonna reach out soon to like Amherst College clubs and organizations and UMass clubs and organizations to see also kind of looking into anyone any craftspeople in the area who have anything to input and also Ms. Moisten has just as long of a to-do list in terms of like getting things you know a rain date at the banks community center again the the town common reserve for an outdoor thing things like that but it should be should be pretty cool yeah awesome thank you and that was May 7th you said for the event yes yes what time uh I think it's going to be around one or 12 because you know it's going to be a Sunday and also there might be services going on so it's going to be like mid-afternoon if everybody could possibly mark their calendars for that that'd be great and any um help that you need day of or even leading up to um let people know when we can use our resources to help out uh what is the next item here human rights youth hero awards I believe I signed up for that and I will admit I have not done anything so I don't really have much Jen um so I I think that the folks last year who participated from the Julius Ford Harriet Tubman healthy living community still want to continue on with their basketball tournament old versus young in combination with the human rights commission so I think that's a go I thought we had found a date Philip did we not say I thought we said June 4th did we I don't I don't have that in mind I think I haven't confirmed it otherwise you know right is June 4th or Sunday yes yes the day of the senior prom okay so the third did we say the third then can we actually I can't do the third can we do the 10th isn't that is that graduation Liz graduation is the night okay so the time to could possibly that works because it gives us a little more time okay all right and I'll connect with you on that but that's good to hear the basketball is going to be a go because that was a big crowd drawing in yeah you know am I grilling that day I just need to mentally prepare myself for that again well I think we might be able to get someone to help with the grilling this time like like we had a lot going on that was a lot of grilling that day yeah we had a lot going on that date so um and you know I think Philip as you and I work together on it we can break things down into shifts for people because it's really not fair to have one person at the grill the whole entire time right yeah so we should be able to break it down into shifts yeah definitely miss hey good are you gonna emcee the awards there and not make me speak that day tag man I wrote up everything you needed to say right now I think that date is open for me so sure all right all right and that I think is the last of our action items um we are I don't know if there's anybody still here in the public but we do have one more um public comment period if anybody would like to raise their hand to speak from the public please do so now we'll recognize you to come in I'm not seeing any hands being raised so unless anybody has anything else that they would like to bring up from HR oh actually um damn I don't really want to but I just kind of wanted to get uh update on um complaints filed with HRC I know that there was one is there any update on that or no so the we're still in the process of investigating the complaint um so there's uh we've spoken with all of the parties locally but there is a um state agency coming next week to to weigh in okay thank you for that update brownie you have your hand up I just had a quick question if it's not quick let's forget it but it's a thought that came to me when I was reading the notes about a complaint process and where the human rights complaint process fits in all of this like we're trying to set up something new for the police review board and I'm just wondering is the human rights commission or more independent I don't know and it's also confusing for people to have two processes so that's something that I think at some time it will be helpful to discuss to have one process and maybe we work with the police review board or something like that but yeah so that's just something I'm throwing out when we're going forward with these different um on these different lines so um I can I I'll just try to quickly answer that the that the way in which the by-law is written it's written very broadly and in theory someone could bring a complaint to HRC and in fact HRC wrote a complaint about the July 5th incident that went to the police department um so the the by-law is very broadly and basically anyone who feels that they've been discriminated against or any violation of the law could bring a complaint here the problem with bringing a complaint to HRC is that we have no authority to adjudicate a complaint even for individuals who are who are you know like the complaint that we're currently investigating um where the most that we can do is to mediate and try to um to come to some conciliatory agreement between the parties or direct the parties to the appropriate state and federal um uh agencies yeah and I think that when the resident oversight board does get made I think that the review process of that by-law should be looked at but it could have its benefit as Pamela stated that if someone felt more comfortable coming to the HRC to raise a complaint that then the HRC can then raise a complaint with the um resident oversight board so that way that gets done if that is somebody's preferred option to go through but that is a good point Ronnie thank you does anybody else have anything all right I am not seeing any hands or anything so then I am going to say that the HRC meeting is adjourned at 8 12 thank you everybody for coming and looking forward to the next month here and the work that we have bye everybody see you soon bye bye