 Welcome to the wide world of eSports, the show devoted to all things eSports. I'm your host, Catherine Norr. Today, my guest is Reginald Nassaua, joining us from Ghana. Our topic is eSports in Africa, creating jobs and opportunities for you. Welcome, Reginald. Thank you, Catherine. I'm happy to join you on the show. Now, you are the first guest I've had from Africa, so this is really exciting. So I'm sure a lot of people really have no idea what's going on in eSports in Ghana. So tell us about eSports in Ghana. Wow. Thank you for the opportunity. I want to say hi to all those who will be watching or listening to the show. Yeah, so eSports in Ghana, yeah. What I want to say is that all over Africa is full of very young people. I think with all the continents around the world, Africa has the youngest population. So eSports, it's something that even older people enjoy. So eSports is growing rapidly, especially with the advent of mobile, because growing up sort of, it was for the rich or middle income to rich people who could afford to have consoles in their homes. So let's say in the whole neighborhood, you had a friend who belonged to a wealthy family who would obviously go to his home to try and get a round of mortal combat or Mario to play. But with a lot of mobile phones out there now, everybody who owns a phone can now take part in the eSports. And also all over Africa, we have these game centers, which are sometimes in one little key of down the corner, where you go and then you pay some money, and then you're able to use a console, you know, play with a friend, and there are so many things. And yeah, so it is, it is exciting now. But now we have more people owning consoles, more people owning mobile phones. And we have people who have established, there's even an eSports academy in Ghana now. Yeah, so it's exciting and it's growing all over the country, yeah. You answered a really important question that I had, and that was about whether the games were played on mobile versus consoles versus PC. And, you know, it's interesting because I have had a guest from Africa, and I've had people appear from other parts of the world. I'm not Africa, I'm in India. And they have mentioned that they use mobile phones a lot for gaming. Now, you mentioned the young population gaming using mobile phones. Does this go up to older ages? I mean, are like their parents gaming at all, or is it just the young people? Yeah, I think some of the parents are also very, very good. Also interested in gaming. In fact, you know, the whole idea of gaming is also a little bit in African culture. So there were several, you know, type of games with rocks and other things. We had our own form of chess and board games and the rest. So the older population who grew up with these things as kids, now that they saw, you know, animations and video graphics and everything, it also got their interest. And a lot of times with families, parents also spent time to play games with their kids. And for the people who grew up in the 80s and especially in the 90s, coming up all got exposed to Nintendo and we used to call one game. I don't know how you guys call it in America, but we called it a family game. Yeah, we called it a family game. And, you know, so yeah, across all ages, people enjoy games, but it is mostly, you know, from, let's say, people in their 40s and below, they are the main category of pure gamers. Yeah. So you mentioned the Esports Academy. Tell us about that. Yeah, so some of our young people in our crowd as a capital came up for this Esports Academy that is providing training for people to become professional gamers and to create, you know, to get jobs and opportunities and build careers out of gaming. I must say that, you know, let's say 10, 15 years ago or even 20 years ago, a lot of people, young people who are in games, who are playing games, especially for boys, were seen as, you know, rascals or rowdy people, you know, because people will not go to school, they will go to the game centers. Some of them will, you know, go there and then the money they are supposed to use, you know, to buy food in school, they will take it to the game centers and all that. So people had this kind of negative perception about allowing their kids or their children to go to some of these game centers because they saw it to be gambling. And then they just saw the negative side of it. Yeah, right. But with time, with things like the Esports Academy, that notion is changing. And even there are places where families can hire, companies can go there for team bonding exercises. And so many other things that, you know, that one can do. So there's a lot of awareness. I think that's the word. Awareness that is growing, that's seeing esports as something that, you know, has a very, very good positive and, you know, social impact, if utilized, right? Yeah, so the awareness is growing about esports and thanks to organizations or set up like the Esports Academy. Yeah. So what kind of courses do they offer at the Esports Academy? Yeah, so from game design to setting up tournaments, you know, how to set up an Esports tournament, how to manage a tournament. And also, they also provide avenue for people to sharpen their skills. Because like I said, a lot of people who are interested in gaming may not necessarily have the right consoles or equipment. So when you go to the Esports Academy, these equipment are already made available. So a lot of people can have the chance to practice on some of these things and get coached by professionals or, yeah, let me say, experience the gamers. So what kind of job opportunities are there in Africa for people who are interested in having a career in gaming? Yeah, I think I must say that right now in Africa, the biggest challenge is jobs and unemployment, future unemployment. That is what is the biggest because we have a very young population that with very limited opportunities. So Esports is one area that is addressing that. And even though it is still growing and we are not there yet, but there are several opportunities and jobs that Esports have created. So now we have showcasters, we have commentators for Esports events. We have we have reporters for Esports tournaments. That is also a job, you know, people writing articles and telling stories. That's also one one one big job that is creating. We also have photographers. We have photographers, we have videographers who are producing these, you know, tournaments and then even the streamers also. People who are streaming these Esports tournaments, then when it comes to events, organizing the events from ticketing. Even, you know, Jesse's people who are producing a Jesse selling a Jesse. So there are so many. We also have team managers. So there are so many opportunities that is coming up. We I belong to the Esports family, then the Esports Association of Ghana, and we have a lot of members or everybody doing something in the Esports industry. So it is really creating avenues, both for for boys and girls, you know, everywhere. Everyone is is getting a bite of the Esports cake, if I'll say it like that. Yeah. Fantastic. That's a great cake. It's going to be hopefully any layers of cake anyway. So let's talk about different countries in Africa. Is Ghana like more evolved in Esports? Are there other countries that are, you know, moving forward more rapidly? What about South Africa and Nigeria? Yeah, I think when it comes to Esports, South Africa is undoubtedly number one because of their exposure, their infrastructure. Of course, there are more companies and more brands. And a lot of people who come to Africa, you know, say when they've got South Africa this year, but if you want to really come to Africa, you should come to South Saharan Africa. Yeah, so South Africa is doing great. They are great players and teams and brands. And that's that's a whole that's that's in the industry is well developed in in South Africa. Also, when you look at North Africa also places like Egypt, Morocco, they are also, you know, well developed. And then for South Saharan Africa, Nigeria is they are doing very, very well in in Esports. They have a lot of gamers. They they are a lot of Esports startups that are coming. That's even a Nigerian startup gamer that organized an Esports championship across Africa. So Nigeria is also a very, very big space and also Kenya in the east of Africa are also doing amazing with a lot of great players, great teams there. Yeah, so there's a lot of activities going all over all over Africa. Yeah. When you mention competitions between African countries, is there a problem with ping or delay and servers? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think most of the servers are not situated in Africa. So, of course, there is. And then also the internet infrastructure isn't that great all over all all across Africa. So that poses a challenge for these online games. So sometimes what happens is for the competitions, all the gamers meet at one place, one venue to overcome that. But moving forward, we are hoping that, you know, the infrastructure gets better. And we do have a lot of investments in, in, you know, in pinks and, you know, get get that set up because it will really, really help and give the teams an opportunity and give the players an opportunity to become competitive, you know, globally. Yeah, sure. And how did you get involved in E-Sport? Yeah, so, well, it's it's kind of an interesting story, but I was a gamer myself growing up. I didn't have a console, but I used to cry every day worrying my mom to get me a console. So, yeah, so I started with all just like how every typical Ghanaian, you know, started playing games like Mario, Mario Kart, Sonic and then we moved over more FIFA and, you know, those kind of games. And I've always had the the heart of the spread to be an entrepreneur. So to get out with a friend who came up with a startup called Tickets My Lours, a ticketing company. And then we decided that we were going to support E-Sports. I provided a means by which E-Sports Tournament organizers could mobilize revenue when they sell tickets for their events. And also my good friend from Bear Bank in California, Tom Leonard, also reached out and then brought me on the E-Sports Change Lives Project, where I I currently work with him as the producer, networking, E-Sports in all developing countries, even outside Africa. Yeah, so that's how I got into E-Sports. Sure. And Tom Leonard tells me that you are find some amazing guests for for that podcast. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, it's been a great experience. It's been a great experience getting guests from all over the world. I mean, we've covered almost everywhere. We've been to the Philippines. We've been to Greece. Yeah. Yeah, we've been to Indonesia, everywhere. And then I and in India. And what is happening is that it's given us a lot of confidence that E-Sports, no matter the language barrier or race or whatever, E-Sports is able to bring all of us together because we all have in developing countries, you all have the same similar challenges with infrastructure, with financing and everything. But everyone is innovating, you know, to to overcome these challenges and and open the industry wide. So I'm very happy I joined the the GameXChangeLive project. Yeah, you know, being on an island, the most remote island chain in the world, the Islands of Hawaii, we have some of the same problems. And we're seeing some of the same things happen, like, you know, people getting really excited about E-Sports and developing it, even though we are not really in a place that, you know, we're so far away that there we have that thing issue. And and, you know, we're kind of behind the mainland US, but, you know, we're working on it. So I think that that Hawaii people can kind of relate to some of what you're talking about. So what game when E-Sports games are most popular in Africa? Yeah, the E-Sports, well, I think most of the popular for me, OK. What I see is that FIFA is very, very popular. Because soccer is a big thing in in Africa. So you have a lot of FIFA players in Africa. Also, Call of Duty is popular. You have PUBG is also popular in Africa. You also have games like Mortal Kombat. It's also very popular. Tekken, there's fighting games. Yeah. So these are all popular. And then, yeah, so these are some of the the popular games around, but all across Africa. In Africa, it's about 54, 55 countries. So there's a lot of diversity and interest in there. But FIFA runs across. Yeah. So how did the pandemic impact these sports in Africa? Do you think? Yeah, so I did really have a big impact because, like I said, because of paying an infrastructure and all that, a lot of the tournaments are organized in person. Right. So they all need, let's say, at the national tier, or in the hotel conference room or in the school and then get these tournaments out there. So when the pandemic and the lockdown, it didn't enable that. So a lot of these tournaments had to be held online. And because of internet, it did bring some challenges in there. But on the other side, on the flip side also, it got people to bring out their consoles because they have more time and practice and practice and perfect their skills and train more so that they become more competitive when they show up at tournaments. So that is why it did. Yes. But after that, you know, I think most of us in Africa, we came out of lockdowns very early on. Most of us in Africa, we came out of lockdowns very early. So after that, there's this renaissance because people really looked at it, you know, looked at what they wanted to do. And people are now confident and bold to say, I want to consider eSport as my main and my main source of income or my main profession. Yes. So people are more convinced now and then they have more convictions about eSports and the potential that it has. When we talk about youth, you know, we have to consider what parents are thinking about eSports and gaming these days. And you mentioned some challenges about that. Do you think that perceptions are changing as time goes on in Africa in terms of how parents feel about their kids gaming and even taking on eSports as a profession? Yeah, I think, yeah, it is changing. Though there's a lot, there's still lots of work to be done, because, you know, most times parents here would prefer their children to do something that the society recognizes. Like, let's say you're a nurse, maybe like a doctor, you work in a bank. Those are the traditional work that is going on. But what is happening now is that we have a generation of more educated people that the generation is behind. And with that education, it is bringing up the opportunity more. Now, some schools are including eSports in their asset. I was recently at a university, a new university that had, you know, PlayStation consoles at the lounge, right? And then they saw that it's a way for the students to release relief stress, you know, in school. So that perception is changing, especially with mobile gaming, you know, because now it's how the parents also get involved in the game. And also one key thing is that it is being attached to STEM education, right, because a lot of now people want to get their kids to learn how to code at a little age, to get them to learn how to understand computers at a little age. One of the fastest way to get your child interested in computing and graphics and user interface and all those nice, nice things is to get them to go into eSports. And with that, you can tell them, OK, if you take the code and understand seriously, you can end up as a game developer and the kids are excited about it here. Sure. So what is your day job? Oh, wow. Yeah. So the day job of the Air Force in Ghana was as an engineering officer. Yeah, working on I manage a team of technicians to make sure things are running smoothly at the Air Force base and at the Air Force in Takari. But Takari is a beautiful place. And I would invite all your listeners to come and visit us one day here in Africa. They will love it. Yeah, absolutely. That would be fantastic. So, you know, early on I interviewed I had a couple of shows where I interviewed people in the US Army eSports team. Does the Air Force in Ghana have an eSports team? Officially because we we we we compete among ourselves a lot, especially when you move to a place and eSports is part of military life. I remember anywhere you go on any operations, as soon as you get into the mess you get there and then it's all eSports, unofficially. But I think it's something that the eSports Association of Ghana is trying to do to get, you know, everything formalized, but unofficially among ourselves. We know we know the players and we play among ourselves. But it's not it's not official. Yeah. Oh, well, maybe maybe in the future, you'll have an official eSports team. They use the US Army eSports team to recruit members of the crew people to be in the army. And so that's their tactic. Get them interested in in joining the eSports team and then and then they'll be interested in joining. So that's a potential tool for you and the future now that you know that. Yes, yes, I love the I love us to have one. So what do you think the eSports, the future of eSports is in Africa? Yeah, I think it is a very, very big future. I think the world hasn't really paid attention to it. But I think people should get ready to see a lot of African gamers. Sorry, it started happening, you know, getting more noticed because the talent is there. We are building the opportunity. And, you know, yeah, it's great. It's a great I'm so excited about the future of eSports in Africa. So so excited because it's it's it's really great. Well, you have young people who are passionate, ready to learn and talented. Anything can happen, anything is possible. Fantastic. Well, Reginald, thank you so much for being with us today. And, you know, we'll look forward to watching what happens in Ghana and in Africa. Thank you for having me. All right. Thank you to our viewers for joining us today in two weeks. My guest will be Maika Maderos, the founder of the Empire Team and two of his players. See you then. Mahalo.