 I will call the meeting to order. It is 6.30. Thank you all for being here. We're closing on the end of this round anyway. And we have a request for Mr. No to go first. So Mr. No, I will call on you as you turn on your camera and unmute yourself. Can you hear me okay? I can hear you. Does your camera work? Yes, I think this will work. Okay, I'm not seeing you yet. The video isn't working, but I've got the audio going. Okay, but you do not have the ability to turn your camera on? I can try. Let me see if I can make that one. Okay, you've turned off your microphone and your camera is still off. So let's just go ahead with the audio. Bernard No, we're taking Bernie No out of order because he has a subsequent commitment. I need the password. What's the connection to the Wi-Fi? The Wi-Fi. Okay, that is, I believe it's the same. It's still in the wall behind me, but I can't believe it. I think it's still City Hall 919. Okay, it's 99919. City Hall. Okay, 99919. Thank you for sending the link. And Kenny John is sending you the link right now. Okay, so Mr. No, if you can hear me, I'd like you to turn on your microphone and then we can get started. Can you hear me now? Yes, I can hear you now. Yes. Great. Super. And I'd like you to raise your right hand. Do you solemnly affirm, subject to the pains and penalties of perjury, that the testimony you're about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes, I do. Okay, great. So we have a set of questions that I'll go over with you. But I'd like to start by just having you tell us what the basis for your abatement request is. Yeah, so I own a four-family apartment building on State Street across the river from the high school that flooded with the July flood. There was a foot of water into the first floor. This made three apartments completely uninhabitable. And a fourth apartment is on the second floor, but it has a first floor entryway that got flooded. And there was no water or electric for a period of time in the building. So that fourth apartment was out of service for a shorter period of time. The net result was a substantial loss in income. And as I understand it, the assessment upon which the taxes are based for commercial properties are based rather significantly on the income that a commercial property produces. And since this property produced substantially less income in 2023 because of the flood, I believe it, I hope it would be eligible for an abatement of some of those taxes. Okay, great. And I did. Yeah. Go ahead. I was just going to say, I did formate it, I gave some numbers and some breakdown and a request. I presume you have that in front of you. I do, yes. I can tell you, we have a set of standard questions that we've been asking every person is requested in abatement. We, our plan is not to make a decision today, but to take the information that you give us and the information that all the other taxpayers give us. And then at the end of this process, which has come right up, we will have a deliberative session at which we will consider the facts of all of the properties so that we are sure that everyone is being treated fairly inconsistently. And I'll ask you a set of questions. And if other members have more questions to ask, so they can follow along. Was there a 50% or greater loss of value to the primary structure of the property? No, there was not. That's substantial damage so that has to be raised. Was there a loss of use of the by the property owner of the primary structure for 60 days or more? Yes. Was there a loss of access to utilities for 60 days or more? No. Well, there's no utility. Yeah, probably. It did need that by here, but there was no utility for 60 days, although it wasn't needed. So, I don't know how to interpret that. Right, because, because you have some deliverable fuel, fuel oil or something, and that was out of service. Yes, that's right. didn't experience an interruption of water or electric or telephone for more than 60 days? That is correct. Okay. It was never condemned, right? That is correct. I'm skipping over the next question about outbuilding only. Has there been income loss? And is that shown here in what you file? Yes, it is. Yes, there was. And that's $14,085. Is that right? Let me just let me just I've got that. Yes. Yes. Okay. And you're in here. Bateman request is 1933. Yes. And I just wanted to add that. And I said that my loss of income is 23.5% percent. But that was a gross income. And I'm pretty sure that the tax assessment assessments are based on net income. And the net income is back down to gross income. So it's actually about 47% percent of my net income was lost due to the flood. So I'm not going to now teach and ask for a greater baby. But just when you're thinking of my payment request and the context of it, it's actually substantially less than 23% of my net income. Okay, thanks. I should say I should mention one thing that you have been mentioning your assessment. And I just want you to keep in mind that this proceeding tonight is not good going to result in any change in your assessment just in potentially an abatement of some of the taxes. No, I understand. I understand that completely. That's why I said it was the government of Congress that taxes are based. So yes, I get that. Okay, good. And we should have the total square footage and the square footage of the damaged areas on the property card. Okay, folks, anyone have any other questions? Okay. We got all the information we need from you. So we are all set and we will get you your decision. Thank you. Great. Thank you for your time. You're welcome. Bye now. All right. Next up, you can go back to the top of the list. Yeah, Kelly Sullivan. Come on up. Why don't you come up here. If you saw any firm subject to the pains and penalties of perjury, just testify you're about to give us the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I do. Great. Now, you kind of know the drill because you just watched what happened. Do you want to give us a brief overview of the basis for your claim? Sure. So I owned, okay, I sold in December, but I owned 68 Main Street. And that is when Notion Dabrick was. And so come the flood, Mary Margaret from Notion had paid me for the July rent, but then after that I didn't ask her for August rent, obviously. And then it continued on where she ended up leaving the space because I couldn't find workers to do the work that was needed. So the loss that I experienced is rental loss that is averaging about $8,800. Okay. The performance that I owned it. And go over all the questions. Did you have a 50% of greater loss of the value of the property? No, I did not. Was there a loss of the primary structure? You lost the use of the primary structure for more than 60 days? Yes, it was. And mainly because you couldn't get workers in to get a v-hat. And do you know what the time, when the place became usable again? It became usable in December, right as the buyer was buying the property for me. So that was my goal to get it done. Did you lose access to utilities for 60 days? I did. And which utilities did you lose? Well, my renai heater was lost in the flood, so we had no way to heat. Can you speak up a little, please? Sure. So we had no renai heater that was lost in the flood, so the lesbians replaced that. But that was after 60 days. And we did have power after about 30 days. The property was never condemned. It was not. And the income loss you said was $8,800? Yes. And we'll have the information about the total square footage. Okay, any members have any questions? What was actually damaged in your property? Well, the floors and the walls were severely damaged. We had to pull out the floors. And as we were pulling out, we just had to keep going and going because the layers of floor that was there, we went right down to the beams. And the walls and the doors, both doors, and the heater and the water heater. And I'm sorry I missed it, but how long did it take to get that back in order? Well, my goal was to sell it by December 1st to Lucky Boardman, and so I was able to get it done right before. That being said, the fire that happened at Mad Taco, it did affect my space because they had to go in and cut open the walls again. And so still one of the doors is not replaced from that fire. And what is the door of access to? It actually accesses into Jesse Jacob's space upstairs. So the front door was axed down, and I had to replace that door, and then the door going into Jesse Jacob's space, and then some walls. Seems to me we should consider the fire as another disaster in this case. Yeah. My assumption though is that the fire wouldn't count for the state abatement. Yeah, that's what I would say. Yeah, part of the reason we're asking these specific questions is that there's legislation going on over state streets to enable the city to get reimbursed for some of this stuff that we're doing. But that's related to the flooding after the fire, of course. Donna. You referred to some numbers. I didn't see any cost in the paperwork I got. Is there some cost of your repair? I can submit that tomorrow actually. Did I submit anything that was a few months ago when I was told I should come to this? It's pretty limited. Okay, so I can add to that. Okay. We'll accept that. Thank you. Any other questions? Are your utilities like your electrical panel and your water heater? Are they all out of the basement? Yes, they are. They are. Okay. And we have moved all of the outlets up four feet in the space. But at the time of the flood, the panel was above out of the basement. It was like on the first floor. Well, the water heater was in the basement. So that was damaged. That was, yeah. And the electrical panel. And the electrical panel was also, no, it was on the first floor actually. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Nobody else has any questions? I think we're set. Okay. Thanks for coming in. Next up, we have Kathleen Sweeten. Okay. I was going to say, you don't look like Kathleen. Kai, do you solemnly affirm subject to the pains and penalties of purchase at the testimony you're about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes. Okay. So why don't you tell us who you are? Sure. Peter Tucker, I'm here representing the Vermont Association of Realtors that owned the property at 148 State Street. You know, just kind of a brief description in the July flood. We had 23 and a half inches of water on the main floor. The basement was completely submerged. And we cleaned it out. And it just hasn't been used since the flood. And why has it not been used since the flood? Is it usable? I mean, we four feet up on the walls and, you know, all the utilities were in the basement. We did get power reestablished. It was around 60 days, temporary power. We had to put in a new service and move the box up. The decision was made not to, you know, it's a word, we're owned by a board of the board of realtors. And, you know, the board of directors needed to contemplate, you know, what is the future for the building? And so that took time. And, but, you know, we've basically been out since July 11th. Okay. And since we're talking about making a choice about whether to reoccupy the building or not, do you have a date in mind of when the building would have been usable again? I would have, let's see, because we did get a quote from a builder. And, you know, I think that it would have been January, February, you know. So it's not usable yet because you haven't done the work, is that it? We didn't do the work. Okay. Yes. And just, I mean, what we did do is we did actually sell the property at the beginning of January, you know, without the repairs being done. Rosie and then Donna. It looks to me in front of the paperwork like they're just requesting personal property abatement. Are they also requesting? Thank you. Yeah, that's so nice. Okay. So all you're asking for was the personal property that was lost in the flood. I wish Kathy was here to tell you what we're asking for. Yeah, but at this point, I believe that is correct. Yes. So computers, office furniture. All the furniture. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's not the building. If you think this is what happened with someone else, they thought they were doing the building and we had them retroactively fill out. So I think we're along with people recently in it there. Yeah. So that's something you want to talk to the landlord about the former owner to see if she wants abatement for the building herself to. Yes. Yes. We are the former. I mean, we are, you know, but there's, but Kathy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because it is possible to request an abatement for real property tax too, based on the damage to the building. But if someone wants to make a motion to make the personal property tax. I'll make the motion. $361.77. Is there a second? I'll second. Any discussion? All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Aye. Any votes? Okay. I need to abstain, yeah. Yeah. You're probably a member. Do we want to go ahead and ask the other questions so that they don't have to come back in if they decide to? If you don't mind. Do you know the answers to the other questions? Yes. Okay. Thank you. And then we'll look for that for documentation after tonight. Right. So was there a 50% or greater loss in the value of the primary structure? No. Was there a loss of use for 60 days or more? Yes. Was there a loss of access to utilities for 60 days or more? Yes. Not condemned. No. Was there income loss to the property? We had a tenant upstairs, so we did lose that income. And do you know how much that was? It was $1,100 per month, so I would say that August to December would be the claim, you know, $5,500. And we'll have the information about the square footage on your property card. Yes. If you could get me another, you can contact me, but we would need another one of those forms filled out, but with the real estate. Understood. The property. Just give me a call or something tomorrow. Gotcha. Great. I actually need to look at the record, so maybe I'll stop by and... Okay. Anything else? Okay. Thanks for coming. Okay. Well, thank you guys. Yep. Appreciate it. As we've been doing, you get more efficient than making it less painless for people. So, we're less painful for people. Less painless. Katie Swick. Hi. Would you solemnly affirm subject to the pains and penalties of perjury with the testimony you're about to give? Is the truth the whole truth or nothing but the truth? Yes. Okay. Why don't you tell us a little bit about you? Yeah. I live at 127 Elm Street and I had 32 inches of water in my first floor. And that's where my daughters and I were living at the time in the first floor. And it's a substantial damage list, so it's waiting funding to be raised up. So, nothing has been worked on in the home. The electricity hasn't been moved. There's electricity in the upstairs, but there's no heating system. Yeah. You know, what happens in this case doesn't depend on your answer to this question, but are you planning on going for a bio or elevating the property? I'm waiting to see what happens with funding. Yep. So, okay. So, I will go over the questions. I probably know the answer. 50% or greater loss in value. Yes. 66%. Loss of the primary structure, use of the primary structure for 60 days or more. Yes. Loss of utilities for 60 days or more. Yes. Not really condemned, but you've got the substantial damage and it's not a commercial property. No, but I do have a loss of income. Okay. What's the loss of income? I had a rental upstairs and that's like $12,000 or so, gross, right? Since July, I haven't rented it because there's no heating system. Anywhere else had any other questions? Rosie. I should just note that Katie is a friend of mine. I feel like I can be impartial, but I wanted to note that conflict of interest potential. And I also wanted to note that last meeting we talked about treating the substantial damage folks differently and making a decision today because property taxes are due tomorrow. So, I just didn't want Katie to leave without us having that conversation in front of her. Yes. We had talked about that and we did that. We did. We rented some last week. No, we didn't actually grant them off. Because we had more. And we have at least one more. We wanted to, but we thought we should. We would have done a report if we had any. Mary, the laboratory is also on that list. Yeah. Mary is also on the list. So, yeah, so, okay, so I think what's going to happen is if you're going to get a vote on that tonight and you can say or not. Okay. Okay. Any other? We've been in your favor. Yeah. Karen, so we're set. Thanks for coming. Do you solemnly affirm the subject of the pains and penalties of surgery? Testifying that given the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth. I do. Great. Thank you. Okay. Well, it's 24 State Street. My business was there. We got 25, 26 inches of water. I lost about $53,000 of inventory. It's been, I moved across the street because I knew it would be quicker to reopen because I really need to get open to, you know, generate funds because I have talked to somebody actually about, they finally came back to me with an estimate today about how much it's going to cost to fix it to be, it's about $200,000, so. Yeah. So, it'll take a little while, but I want to get it there because I don't want an empty space, but I also, yeah. And this is kind of a, the flip side of one of the other cases. I don't think we got a request for personal property tax abate. It's not personal, it's a commercial space. So. But the inventory is personal property. Do we tax inventory as personal property? That's, yeah, that's, I don't know if she would have meant that, because it's mostly shelves and. Well, the. A little bit of computer. The, there's no, yeah, that you're talking, your inventory that you talk about is the one that I fill out every year that's not really much because it's, it diminishes, I don't. It depreciates. Yeah, depreciates. Yeah, okay. Correct. Yeah, I lost about, that was like 15 grand, but yeah. I mean, it's really, yeah. So. Okay. Well, again, it would be helpful to have some real numbers now that you have some numbers to pass on to us. Okay. I know. I don't even know what I've filled out before. I can't remember what that was. I'll show you what you filled out before. It was a while ago. Okay. Yeah. Right. So. So the cost inventory damage to your building would be helpful to get cost. Right. And do, is it also loss of income? Is that okay? Yeah, of course. Yes, it is. Yes, okay. And so overall, the question's good. Okay, sure. All right. Was there a great loss of 50% or greater in the value of the primary structure? No, I don't think so. Okay. I'm sorry. No. I don't think so. That's a no. Yeah, I'm. Because it was also the upper floors. Correct. Yeah. Plus the condo. Yes, it's like, I think it's the only condo unit in downtown. Yes. Okay, so you're. I'm like, I'm 11% of the building itself. So you only own the first floor? Just that one spot. Yeah. Carlo Pasapai is next to me. And he's got, yeah. He has two thirds. I have one third of the first floor. Okay. Yeah. And then Rod Sherman and then the Bromotsky Association. Okay. And they're also condo units up there. Yeah. Didn't know that. Yeah. Thanks to your expertise. They had a hard time. I'm good. Okay, so you're configuring the taxes. Yeah. Was there a loss of use for 60 days or more? Yes. Yeah. Is it usable now? No. Was there loss of access to utilities for more than 60 days or more? I replaced, had to replace all the electric. It was actually not on tube still. And so had to replace that. Then even the meter, even though it was outside, it was up like two and a half feet, they requested it go up further. So we, I put that up as well. So had to replace all the electric. That was done by mid-September. I think some of it was done in August and some in August, yeah, September. So, and the heat, yeah, the furnace was, I don't think they fixed that until October, November. I think, yeah, mid-November. So? And then, of course, December flood. Yeah. So, yeah. Okay. Income loss, you're going to get us figures for that? $192,000. Okay. Oh, that's, what, the 50% of the value? I know how much it was. Because I, yes, that was the loss of income for the year. Okay. Anyone else have any questions? Thinking kind of a sense of what's going on. Is it, you see it being open before June 30th? Being usable? Or is it not? Because I don't, I don't have the funds. I can't, I can't come up with that much money between now and then. I'm hoping it'll, you know, maybe in 12 months. I don't know. I didn't accept the FEMA loan because it was about 25 documents, eight pages long, signing my life away. And I really didn't. So, yeah, I probably have to go through the bank. I also don't think that I can get workers to do the work that needs to be done. I mean, but I am working, we're starting it next week. We're supposed to start this week. But just putting in the, replacing the bathroom and reinstallating the back wall and the windows is going to be about $30,000 just to do that. So, yeah, just that's a one step. So, yeah, so maybe, but I don't, I'd love for it to be, you know, usable by then. We're just, again, abating taxes. I, yes, that's. It's not going to be functional. I know. I'm sorry. Yeah. Wish I could give you the answer. This is just a little peripheral. It's unusual for me to know about a condo building. So, were the other sections of this structure that are the other condos, are they also? Well, Carlo, positive pie. The same back wall. He's got, I mean, we had to replace the wall in between the two of us with cinder block because it was, you know, just taking it out just completely. Yeah, we could see into each other's spaces. But the back wall that I'm doing, yes, I mean, it's different than what he's got going on. And then the furnace, which personally, I want to, I want to do a heat pump in my space because I think it's stupid to keep putting muddy into the furnace, but it's difficult for every, you know, I, as I said, I only own 11%. So I don't have that big of a say, but I'm going to put a heat pump in. So. Anybody else? Okay, thanks a lot for coming in. Thank you guys. Mary Ventara. That's who Mary here. She is. Oh, hi Mary, good. I saw your name on screen earlier. So, and I just forgotten. So would you raise your right hand? We saw only a firm subject for the paints and penalties of Persia that the testimony you're about to give is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Thank you. Okay, great. Want to give us a brief overview? Sure. My home in Langfields flooded in July into the first floor and the city of Montpelier has deemed my home substantially damaged. So I have been in limbo with an unlivable space, no kitchen, no bathroom, unlivable home. I have been displaced and I'm living elsewhere. And like the others, you're waiting to find out what's going to happen. Yes. Okay, and I think I know the answers to all or most of these questions. But I'll go over them anyway. Was there 50% or greater loss in value to the primary structure? Yes. Was there a loss of use of the property for more than 60 days? Clearly, yes. Yes. Loss of utilities to the primary structure for more than 60 days? Okay. Is there any commercial property in this property? There is not. Okay. I think that answers all the questions we need to have answered. Does anyone have any other questions? Is there a formula for determining the amount of the remit or abatement? Well, that was one of the things that we were going to discuss at our last meeting. One of the questions that was raised was for properties that have been declared substantially damaged. What do we do about the land proportion of the tax? And I don't think we came to a decision of that. But that's part of the conversation. That sounds like an unanswerable question unless you convert it to an extra level. Well, every question has to be answered whether it's unanswerable or not. I do have tax bill information with me if the bill wasn't included but I think most of them have been included. Yep. And it's included here. Anybody have any other questions to raise? Okay. We are set, Mary. I think our intention is to make a decision on all the substantially damaged properties tonight. Oh, wonderful. And then how would we be notified? By the clerk. I'll send something out. Okay. Great. Thank you all so much. You're welcome. Thanks for coming in. And Robert Walker. Hey, raise your right hand. Do you saw him lay firm subject to the paint and penalties of perjury if the test is one you're about to give if the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Thank you. Great. Why don't you tell us what your request for abatement is about? Well, I'm like anybody else. I'm not asking for any money. I've got quite a lot of coming from efficiency the most and the credit union down here. But what I've questioned is the value of the house and to repeatedly be paying taxes on what I think is overvalued. So I guess I would like some kind of a reappraisal if that's possible. Considering the conditions have changed. Okay. What I can tell you is that the purpose of the authority and the purpose of this body which is the Board of Abatement is to consider requests for property tax abatements based on a whole list of reasons set forth in the law. There's another body which is almost all the same people called the Board of Civil Authority that every year hears appeals from people's property tax assessments. And every year the city publishes the assessments of everyone's properties and when you get that assessment you have a limited time to file a request, file your appeal and then there's a there would be a hearing held on that. That's not this body and the time to do that for the current tax year has already gone by. So we don't have the ability to do what you're talking about this time around. However, every year when you get your property tax bill you often get a new chance to appeal. Yeah, I understand that and I didn't question it and the reason being it was before I had seven feet of water in my basement and I think that changed the whole well the whole outlook it did for me in the end. I can't imagine the house being worth as much now as what it was before. And which I questioned whether it was councilman he and he tried to sell it if you remember but a few years ago how many bids did you get? That was a long time ago. Same house. Yeah, in your market then. And that sure do what I'm going to do is that since you indicated here that you believe that you are entitled no matter what you said here what you filled out on the form is that you believe that you're entitled to an abatement because your property was lost or damaged or destroyed during the tax year. And so what I want to do is go over the questions and see if you may be entitled to an abatement even though you came in here thinking that's not what you were asking for. And so the same questions I've asked the other people tonight do you think there was a 50 percent or greater loss in value to the primary structure due to the flood? No. And did you lose the use of the primary structure for 60 days or more because of the flood? I didn't lose it but I didn't have any heat until well it was 28 degrees inside Thanksgiving time rather chilly 30. But you never moved out you never stopped living there? Well no. Okay. Did you lose utility service to the property for 60 days or more? Well I didn't have any heat for 60 days or more I didn't have I had electricity but they were moving it upstairs but it took longer than 60 days but I did have electricity and I had a hot water unit. But it took more than 60 days to get the electricity back on? Not the electricity the heat it took more than 60 days to move it it's now up in the first floor. Gotcha. Yeah I've got a new box it's just a junction box downstairs. Was there any commercial use in this property? It's just your home? No just my home. Okay anyone else have any other questions? Donna. Again you've mentioned your furnace and your oil tank and your water heater but there's no cost so Well Donna they were doing You would like to use some cost that would help? Yeah the whole coalition took care of it I'm not that was We just want to I mean for me it's important to know what you actually expended expended for this. The only thing that I spent actually was to get the hot water heater Well I forget what they call it refurbished which was a little over $300 but I'm not too worried about that. But you didn't have out-of-pocket expenses to replace the furnace and that kind of thing. No that was also being carried by this Well it was basically a whole foundation through the efficiency of a month I guess it's very complicated. Yeah. I don't know where all the money came from but it basically came from the credit union down here it is. And was that a loan or a grant? No it was a grant. Well that's great. Yeah I remember when I suggested you might want to look at a statement it was before some of that money came in that's great news. I had no idea how it was going. Well I didn't have any help at all on that. I think the capstone was worse and worse by one percent. Efficiency for month I got hold of the whole coalition it's called and they working through efficiency for month and somehow the money comes out of the credit union down there by the high school. Oh that's great. Great. So. Well okay well we will uh even have any other questions I think we're set. So it was just a basement. Right. Is that my understanding? The first floor wasn't impacted but the basement was impacted. No it is. Yeah. And it's just a basement. And do you have living space in the basement or? No I don't have anything in the basement. No more. Previously. Was it? No. There's nothing but the utilities which are okay. Okay. Well thanks for coming in. Okay. We will get a decision to you. Okay thank you You're welcome. Sure. What will happen with managing the taxes we are taking if you let us know how that all plays out what state already is here? Yeah I think we will get a refund. You get if it's more than what you already paid you get a refund. So okay. So we are to the point where we're ready to take up the substantially damaged properties. And do we have a list so we can make sure we're covering all of them? Oh we don't have a list of all of them. Should have gotten one because they haven't all shown up here. There's also the question whether you all want to include Lisa Nouveau who spoke to us and did not get that substantially damaged designation but sure sounded like Lisa she did. She did get the designation. She got the designation and so did Ed. Oh Ed I know that. An historical house on State Street did not but it was also substantially damaged. I don't have that list. Should have gotten that one. Michael Rueh Miller had one. Mike would have it. Mike's the one. I probably have an email. Me too. I may have a list at one point. You know if we're able to do that quote unquote class action thing. Does he have like eight promises? There were five that were residential right here. Yeah and then there were some commercials at one empty building. I just rubbed a little bit. Check my spreadsheet. No I can't check my spreadsheet. We'll see if we can. Yeah because not everyone has come. Do we think there's some who have not been in yet? Yeah. Don't very certain of that. The ones we can find out. But I don't know if it's in my place too. Well the names are not. Sure if it includes all the properties that are on there Tyson Brown Alex Knott Luke Bernie Knoe Christopher Coppin Ed Haggard Me Sig Lord I don't know Brent Curtis Mary Sinterra And Catherine I don't know if I don't know. Those names aren't familiar? Some of them do. Ed thinks of Bernie and Mary all in a row. And then the historical house is in that same row it stays. Do but we don't have the ability to evade anybody who hasn't who hasn't been here yet. Yeah they need to make a request. Do you think there are some that are substantially damaged that didn't even file? Oh yeah. I'm no question of that and I'm not sure why can try to reach out to them. Maybe we just did not get the word out loudly enough about abatement. I feel like we were saying that we continue to say it every time we turn around I talked her way back when because when I went to visit the houses and that's when I found out the weird category for historical structures even though they are substantially damaged they don't get categorized so it's weird. So I've seen three of these Sinterra, Swick and Hager and then and then I had down that Nouveau was not substantially damaged but functionally for all these times that's why she has to raise her house. Yeah. Oh no, she's wiped out. She literally she's the one that has literally a sink on two by four. I mean, yeah, no. Okay. So we've got four. So there's four, yep. And I can't think of any others. Nouveau. Anything else on Elton? Besides Katie? Was there... They have Katie on Ellen. You see on the house. They're all historic. I think the rest were historic so they didn't have to do it. Yeah, I don't think so. You know, except we had Paul LaFalle but that wasn't substantially damaged. Right. And it's a commercial property anyway. That's not like Bertie and Elway's I mean, we just heard tonight they're kind of the same thing. I have an email from Mike saying there are eight properties that were determined to be substantially damaged before that we have. Lisa just said yes. She was substantially damaged. Oh absolutely. Okay. Of course. She got the letter. Of that eight somewhere there's a commercial on there. There's a vacant house on Barry Street. There's the old Humane Society building on the island. Yeah, that's nice. There's 146 State Streets which is a very good commercial building and the Casella Administrative Building. That's the eighth that he listed when I asked him. And this was... So the ones that come to us... Not too long ago. January 9th. And who's Lisa? What's the last name? Kate. Yes. Yvonne. Oh, Kate. We have four. I understand. Yeah, great. There's four homes that people are living in. So we go ahead and take action on those four. Yeah. Because we've heard them. We have the information. And we've determined for sure those qualif... The home value qualifies for the state reimbursement. Do we know if the land value qualifies for the state reimbursement? I do not. Do we want to make a decision to grant that and take the risk and the city will absorb the cost of it? Yeah, I'm in favor of that. I'm the worst of the worst. Yeah. Yeah. So 100% of payment for all of them? Yeah. Yeah. Through June or just through the first two quarters? I think we need to go through June. Yeah. I would think the whole year. I make a motion that we obey their taxes for the whole year starting July 1. Is it July 1 is the new year? Yeah, July 10th. July 10th. Whatever the date of the flood. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the entire tax bill... No, starting July 11th. Starting July 11th. I'm sorry. I will start July. Just started, yeah. And we're just going to be the new year. It's a little bit we can do. Yeah, the whole year. That's a... My motion will see if it... My motion will see if the second is that we obey the whole 2020 by tax bill. It's the 23 to 24. Yeah. Yeah. In July. Yeah. Yes. Is there is a second? June. Next June. No, I'm not seconding. No. No. Can we list the four properties in the motion? Yes. And the four properties are 189 State Street, 127 Elm Street. Haggit is... 197. 197. And Miu... State. 195. 195. Okay. State. Okay. Is there a second? State. Second. Okay. Carried. So just so we're clear that I think that if we abate the taxes for the first 10 days of July, that the state will not let us off the hook for that portion. So we will have to pay the state education tax for that portion would be my assumption. Well, the motion got changed for it's the tax bill, the 23 to 24 entire tax bill. So rather than which begins at the beginning of the fiscal year. So it's a fiscal year based bill. Right. That's right. I know. But I think that the states, you know, covering the education part, the state, it's tied to the flood damage. So I don't think the state's going to say, well, you just decided to abate the first 10 days of the bill. But that's, yeah. So just that we will still be on the hook for that as the city. It's not very much. I'm not saying we shouldn't do it, but just to be clear that that's what we're doing. It's going to be very hard to process. Yeah. Well, we can do it. But I don't think it should be hard to process it all. It's just math. Figure out what the rate per day, yeah. Yeah, I guess you figure out the rate per day and then you got it. Yeah. I also wanted to, some of them had income sensitivity. And so I, do we have to abate the tax bill less the amount of income sensitivity or abate none? I'm not sure about that. Well, I'm assuming we're abating net tax, oh. Okay. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, because some of them aren't here. Right. The state, they went to our batement. They had income sensitivity. But they didn't have income per se. Can we amend the commercial problem? Oh, no, no, no, no. I was talking about the state's income sensitivity on the property. So the city has already received payment for the income sensitivity portion. We're not abating that. We're abating the motion for the bill. Great. The net bill. I understand. Net bill. Okay, put that net in there. Can we amend, yeah, amend the motions and say the net tax bill? Net tax bill. Probably this is not a question, but some of these properties are paid by escrow. That's, do we have to consider that? Sending the money back to where it came from? Or we don't? Huh. I think that's an administrative question more than anything else. It's going to land on your lap. He'll go back to the council. It's a Sarah question. You let her make a decision. My thinking is that even if it's, it's paid out of an escrow account, then the money comes from the, the property owner. Yeah, it goes back to them. Yeah. So, yeah. Is everybody happy with where we are on this? Okay. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. Any opposed? Okay. Good. Good. Did you, I think you just said this, right? It was the, the vacancy of families. There's all the humane, you know, people. Oh, we are the four of you? The other, the other one was the active commercial living, Castella, and then the vacant commercial at one place. Yeah, we have a, we have a, tonight we're, it's a pressure meeting next week. Okay. And it's because of the way it worked out. Jack, can we get a written statement of what the motion was? I'm caring. Move to evade the entire net tax bill, or tax bill on net tax owed, excuse me. For these four houses. For these four houses. So yeah, so that'll come out. John, I'll write that out. It'll be in the minutes. Yeah. And, and I'll, I'll get out all those reports for folks tomorrow. Do I need to be for the insignia? I have it set up so I can sign it. Okay. Just thought might as well. Yeah. All right. Well, in that case, I'm sorry, I thought you were joining us. I was just going to use your, so I'm sorry everybody. Oh, thank you. Well, I'll give it a little. That was insanely fast, you all. It had been like this every other meeting. We, holy crap, that was amazing. Yeah. Wow, these were just dancing dances. Yeah. So, okay. So now we have four more on, for next week. And then we need to decide when to do the deliberative session, right? So we're going to do it next week. How about right after? Everybody okay with doing the deliberative session next week after all these? Recognizing that, that we just go until we're done? I'm not going to make it. I'm going to remote for that one. How many weeks do we have? I don't see it on the agenda, that's fine. You mean how many total do we have? No, how many total do we have? Four. Two of them are the same pellets, and at least one of them does not have to do with the flood. Okay, so where is that, where would I find that? It's a distinct stack of papers that John brought in tonight. Yeah. If you didn't, it went out electronically, but if you didn't get one. Well, go on, I'm sorry. They're going to go electronically. We have this one out there. I don't know if you're going to be able to do that. Right, right, but there was another one out there. I don't know. A long, a ways, but I don't see it. Oh, God. I'm sorry. I have plenty more to. I think these went out like a while ago, so we're going to get lost in the shuffle. Because the shuffle's been big. Yeah. I don't see any other. So what this means is that we do these four next week, and then do the deliberative session under other business, or convening a separate deliberative session, which probably doesn't have to be more because it's not public. I think, I mean, I think we can go in under abatement hearings and do a deliberative session just under the hearings. Okay. Yeah, I mean, it'd be like doing an executive session under another. Everybody have to look through it. I don't know if you guys, so Tim's not available next week, and I'm going to be remote to do it, but. Now, Tim, not being here, will that be private of our council forum? Not if all four y'all show up, and we're still good. Okay, I'll be there. Okay, four out of seven. People that may be coming in later on, too, because I think we're sitting down more. Yeah, well, we were, yeah, talking about, we've already got at least one big one who would have to be on the 28th if we, if we do the next one on the 28th. But they still haven't been. They still just haven't been coming in. Is that a good birthday? Do we, since we're here tonight, and it's 7.30, does it make sense to start some of the deliberative sessions tonight? Or do people want to get out of here? I was going to prepare some forms for y'all that might make it important, so you have reference to the answers to the questions. I think if I get the forms out and we make sure everybody's got a copy of the property cards, then you'll have the answers to the questions, their tax payments, you know, before and after any pre-bake, and the square footage all there. Are you missing the property cards? I think I've made copies. I think everybody's got it. I think I've got it. If not, we can get it. I think I've caught up. There's been so much of this paperwork. You all have been great. I'm starting to lose my mind with it, and I can't imagine. I was also going to make a little bit out of the book we had for appeals. Is this a point where we just recycle everything? To turn in the notebooks to you? I need a new storage cabinet for all the notebooks. But yeah, I mean, you can bring it back to me. I don't have this. I don't know who it came from. I don't have an email from Sarah that has it. You have one. So good. Next week, you will have all those forms, and so we should be able to just look right through. Just go right through, yeah. As far as trying to organize in a notebook, if I put everything back alphabetically, will we go through them then alphabetically? Yeah, it'd be more or less alphabetical. If somebody jumped out of line and moved, then that one would be probably off, but I mean, we have to chronologically, that is. Yeah, and we don't have any, all the ones that related to, I can't afford it, or the weird things like the water claims, we dealt with those on the night. So the only things we're left with are the flood damage ones. I don't see how we can go alphabetically. We have to sort of, I mean, we're doing in a group, or if we're going to have them all laid out, we're going to look at all the issues and see how they intersect, right? I mean, otherwise. Otherwise, there's no point to. There's no point in doing it as a group, yeah. Yeah, but I think we'll do it. I mean, then we can go alphabetically. Once we decide how we're going to treat it, I suppose, but they're not all the same, right? I mean, we want to make sure that we treat the same issues, not so much that we treat it in the same way, but well, one thing about these is they seem to mostly at least have one criterion under the bill that we were looking for. So that might make them extremely easy if we just go through and do a couple quarters of, based on the assumption that the state's going to help us out. The state's only helping out with crack with education, though. The city's still on the hook for the, so we should make a decision whether we're still going to abate fully for the municipal portion. Yeah, right. That's one big question, right? Are we abating municipal taxes at all, given the fact that it's coming directly out of city pockets? It's supposed to save pockets, but yeah. Reset. Okay, we can adjourn. That's 7.33 pm.