 Ron DeSantis just says whatever he thinks the political base wants to hear in a given moment He doesn't have independent of it. I thoughts of his own. He responds to Twitter and the effects of it So I don't know what Ron DeSantis thinks I just know what comes out of his mouth reflects what he thinks is going to achieve that dopamine hit in Getting a Twitter trend. He is someone who like you has put the sort of fight against So-called corporate wokeness on the front burner. He is fighting this battle with Disney right now in Florida If that is kind of at the center of both of your campaigns Why should people opt for you or take a closer look at you versus, you know a popular two-term governor in Florida? So the popular two-term governor in Florida has been good as an executor in certain respects Not as good as he would make it out to be but I think that's it. That's a separate discussion for another day The question is who do you want in the White House? Do you want a visionary who has their own ideas or do you want a guy who? Executes other people's ideas. I think there's a role for everyone in the system But I think where we when we're in the middle of this national identity crisis in our country I don't think we want a follower in the White House I think we need an independent thinker and a leader and the case I make for effectiveness too is that Ron DeSantis is like a billiard ball. You hit him in a given direction. He'll go in that direction But he doesn't know why he's heading in that direction He's not the one doing the aiming and that results in loss of effectiveness So let's just take the Disney thing for example what he says he is doing It's laughable is that he's rolling back the special protections that Disney shouldn't have been given in the first place I I agree with that. I don't like chronic capitalism I don't like special forms of corporate protections that are the product of lobbying What the media completely missed it shows you how asleep at the switch even the media is is that some of those Corporate privileges and special protections were signed into law just a couple of years ago by wait for it Ron DeSantis Actually, and I can go into the details of what those were those included Exemptions from the political anti-discrimination statute that he passed there was a special exemption If you own a theme park more than 25 acres in the state of Florida That was signed by governor Ron DeSantis And then he strips that after the fact saying that oh, we should have never had these chronic capitalist protections in the first place That's a joke because he was actually the one who signed it in the first place anyhow And so I think that that state action You know argument or that lurking state action piece I think is is is a bit of a farce and I think that you know I think that he ruins the credibility of his own crusade by not knowing why he was doing in the first place And by the way, Disney then gets the better of him in the end by the day before his new governing board takes over completely Castrating that board of having any power. So it's executions missing and we should shift to a discussion of woke Capitalism since that's a big top recurring topic of your campaign and your books the most recent to At least and there's been a lot of comments to that regard one here says just FYI I'm not voting for anyone whose platform includes waging a war with woke ism Because your idea is essentially based off censoring other speech wrong I mean I can kind of speak to that concern a little bit Yeah, you can respond to this because I live in Ron DeSantis is Florida and I've watched him advance things like the stop woke act That's his attempt to stop wokeness from encroaching into the schools and into corporate America and To my mind the way it's been done here is a pretty clear Violation of free speech rights. It's it's I think Ron DeSantis is sloppy I think Ron DeSantis is sloppy because he doesn't have an Understanding of why he's doing what he's doing I think that and it's a shame that he has screwed this up in many ways that have folks like yourselves Maybe in person ask that question Understandably irritated when somebody says they're fighting woke this first of all That's how I'm labeled. I never actually say that I'm waging a war on woke I say I want to crusade to revive a missing national identity. Those are different things. That's what's me versus Ron DeSantis is different Is Ron DeSantis is a call is a troll? Yes And and I named that book at a time where most people didn't know what the word woke does and it woke was and actually offers the most rigorous Definition of what we're actually talking about that a bunch of Republican puppets then take and run with and bastardize what it actually means and so Yes, I did I wrote the book on it try reading the book and figure and I whoever asked the question We'll have a very different impression after reading that book. Yeah, give a quick summary then of how Battling wokeness does not get the government into policing What is and is not permissible speech either in the public sphere or in the in corporate America? So that's the question to ask it's called a woke ink for a reason the ink part is actually what's doing the work so a Lot of this is top-down Government driven in the first place. That's what we need to see. That's what Ron DeSantis by the way fails to see That's what I think a lot of the people who are just going through the motions of criticizing wokeness fail to see Let's talk about woke capitalism ESG movement. That's not the free market. That's an illusion. Don't fall for the trick That is not the invisible hand of the free market That is the invisible fist of government which should make every libertarians blood boil So do not you they are they are trying to use your language back against you and I say you're I mean I have a strong libertarian instincts used to call myself one not that long ago Right, they're weaponizing the language to dupe you into thinking that this is the evidence of the free market when in fact It's lurking state action the entire time. I also tell conservatives I coach them stop talking about big tech censorship It's not it's Government tech censorship because then government is using a combination of threats and special immunities and coordination To do through the back door what government couldn't do through the front door Would you arm wrestle Ron DeSantis if he agreed to sit down with you? I probably would yeah Why not that was the reason live stream with Vivek Ramaswamy who's running for the Republican nomination for president and has just published capitalist punishment a Book-length diatribe against ESG and other aspects of what he considers woke capitalism If you want to watch the full conversation go here if you want to watch another excerpt go here and come back Next Thursday every Thursday at 1 p.m. When Zach Weisbrenler and I are talking to somebody even more interesting than the last week Thanks for watching