 Ladies and gentlemen, good morning or good afternoon wherever you happen to be. My name is David Donohue. On behalf of the Institute of International and European Affairs, I'd like to welcome you to today's talk by the European Commissioner for International Partnerships, Jutta Opilainen. The Commissioner's Talk is the third webinar in the Development Matters series hosted by the Institute and supported by Irish Aid, the Irish Government's Development Cooperation Programme. We're delighted to have Commissioner Opilainen with us today. She'll speak for about 10 minutes, first of all, on the subject of harnessing inclusive multilateralism for international development. And she will then have a few minutes in which she can take questions from the audience. We're delighted to be joined also by the Director General of Irish Aid, Rory de Berke, who will deliver some remarks following the Commissioner's address. And the Commissioner's Deputy Chef to Cabinet Sandra Bartelt has also kindly agreed to answer questions when the Commissioner needs to leave us. Rory de Berke will also be available. Some housekeeping points. The Commissioner's presentation and the subsequent Q&A are all on the record. You're free to pose questions using the Q&A function at the bottom of your screens whenever they occur to you during the event. And we'll do our best to get to them. We welcome also those who are participating via YouTube. And you're invited also to join the discussion on Twitter using the handle at IIEA and the hashtag should mention that the Institute is currently celebrating its 30th anniversary. Let me turn now to Commissioner Opilainen. Her role involves, as you know, providing managerial oversight and strategic direction for the European Union's vast programme of activity in support of international cooperation and sustainable development. And Ms Opilainen served as a member of the Finnish Parliament from 2013 to 2019. She was the first woman to lead Finland's Social Democratic Party from 2011 to 2014. She served as Finland's Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister. And we are honoured and delighted to be here that you're with us today. You have the floor. Thank you very much. And first of all, thank you for the invitation to speak at today's webinar. And congratulations for the Institute's 30th anniversary. The topic of today's discussion is actually very timely. Today's reality sees a post-war multilateral system under pressure. Unilateralism is on the rise. And after the false end of history, we are back to more competitive international environment. We are back to power politics, but also competition between societal models. At the same time, actually, we face a growing number of global challenges that cannot be addressed by any country alone. Climate, environmental and biodiversity crisis, widening inequality, under-regulated migration, erosion of democracy. And now the global pandemic, which has caused huge societal and economic damage. Concerted international action is no longer an option, but a necessity. Yet this is more difficult to secure than unilateralism. Against this background, the EU must revise multilateralism. And not only in multilateral organisations themselves. We need to pursue our ambitions throughout our international partnerships. So dear friends, what does this mean? Firstly, the multilateral system and the EU's place in it. Europe believes multilateralism to be the most effective means to regulate international relations, protect the most vulnerable and promote open societies that leave no one behind. So in other words, to build a sustainable future from which all can benefit. It's in our DNA. The EU and UN were set up at the same time. Our values are the same. Yet there is no place for complacency. The ultimate objective is impact. We want to work with multilateral organisations, but do so in a way that is effective and delivers results. In February, as you know, we published a joint communication on strengthening the EU's contribution to rules based multilateralism. And this communication really sets out our vision for re-energising and reforming multilateralism. The multilateral system needs to be more fit for purpose. This means making international organisations more accountable, more transparent and more results-oriented. It also means developing governance in emerging areas not yet subject to global governance, particularly those where national boundaries mean nothing. For instance, how do we secure the right balance of rights and responsibilities for major multinationals, including major technology companies? It also means building inclusive multilateralism to ensure the full range of partners, private, public, regions, governments, civil society, participate in multilateral decision-making. Partnership is one of the five pillars of the 2030 Agenda. It is an abler for the other piece, which are pupil, planet, prosperity and peace. So the EU will work in an open and excessive way with partners, while being more strategic and targeted at the same time. This also includes partnerships with like-minded partners and regional organisations, as well as civil society. We will work with them at a multilateral level to advance our strategic priorities, which are green deal, digitalisation, sustainable growth and jobs, migration and peace, security and human development. The COVID crisis has shown the value of multilateral action to address shared challenges. So working with multilateral partners, there is an opportunity for real, real impact, an opportunity to shape global responses to 21st century challenges. So dear friends, this brings me to my second point. Being more strategic and targeted also implies speaking and delivering as a strong and visible European Union in a well-coordinated approach with its member states. Europe faces mounting competition from an increasing number of emerging or re-emerging powers. And in this more contested world, we can no longer afford to luxury of fragmentation and duplication. In early spring 2020, so one year ago, all major European development actors decided to come together to help partner countries deal with the shock of the pandemic. And this new way of working in a Team Europe approach combines resources, expertise and networks of the EU, but also from the member states, their implementing agencies and European development finance institutions. So this innovation arose in a grave moment of crisis where scale, coordination and focus were necessary for maximum impact. And I'm very delighted to tell you that we are now using the current EU programming of our funds for the period up to 2027 to develop Team Europe initiatives. So we also are doing this programming exercise in a Team Europe way. These Team Europe initiatives, they will focus on coordinated actions to bring strategic transformation in areas related to key EU priorities. The Green Deal, human development, digital, growth and jobs, good governance and migration. So ladies and gentlemen, securing a multilateral system that is fit for tackling the challenges we face is far from easy. But the crisis has brought home the absolute need for us to work together and not selfishly. And the Team Europe approach with its wealth of skills, experience and partnerships offers real hope for positive change. So let me end by telling you that the EU will be counting on you, counting on you to facilitate our action at the multilateral level and to help us spearhead a true global, sustainable and inclusive recovery that leaves no one behind. Together, let's deliver as one Team Europe. So greetings from Brussels and looking forward to our conversation. David, I don't hear you now. I was thanking you, Commissioner, for that terrific tour of the force on the challenges facing the EU. And I'd now like to ask Roy de Berca to pick up the gauntlet as a word, to take up the challenge that the Commissioners put out. What are we doing, Roy, from the Irish perspective, to respond to this challenge? Yeah, thanks, David and Tito's Commissioner. Thank you. Really useful and I think interesting remarks there. And what are we doing? Well, I think in the first instance, I mean, we are, we've moved to be net contributors. So the amount of money that Ireland is putting into the shared pot has gone up. It's more than doubled in quantum over the last decade. And it's gone from about 16% of our ODA in 2013 to 25% of our ODA today. And I think that means we have to play a better game. You know, we have to ask better questions. And we have to become a much more active member of Team Europe, which has been a fantastic innovation, one which we've embraced. And I think from a smaller member state perspective, Team Europe allows us the possibility of contributing to a greater whole, but also maybe being catalytic, I would hope, in trying to encourage the member states and to work in a more communitarian way in country with the institutions. And I think we need to do better. And I think we're at the beginning of a journey where we try and maximize the highest common factor of our collective actions. And I really would be interested in hearing from you, Commissioner, how you would see a member state of Ireland size try to do better in terms of Team Europe. And that partnership approach that you mentioned that is at the heart of the 2030 agenda that David with Kenya helped us achieve. And the symbolism of the renaming of your role to the Commission of International Partnership is really important. And I think we have to work with you to put life into that, to breathe into it, and to help you take it forward. And I think we're really interested to hear how you see that we can use our voice in New York, in Geneva, elsewhere, married with our actions on the ground to try and maximize that sense of working together to making that rules-based system be as effective as we want as a member state. That's at the heart of our development cooperation policy, but it's at the heart of our foreign policy more generally. There's an Irish phrase, we live in the shadow of others. And I think that multilateral system is the umbrella that smaller countries take shelter under. And I think that's the truth, not just for us within Europe, but more broadly. So really interested to hear your comments as to how we could help you help us on this journey. Thank you. Thanks very much. Commissioner, would you like to come back in on some of those points where you raised? Yes, thank you very much. And yeah, I have a couple of points I would like to make also relating to your comments. And the first one is that I think we have, as I told you, we do this programming exercise now a bit differently, because we have really at the country level to be able to define these Team Europe initiatives through our EU delegation together with the member states, but also with the financial institutions like European investment bank. And we have defined approximately 150 Team Europe initiatives around the world. And what Ireland could do is definitely to be part of these initiatives. So I really hope that you could contribute and participate in these different initiatives, especially in Africa, but also elsewhere. And I think there are several policy areas where you have experience and also competence to provide us and to be part of this journey and joint approach at the country level. So I can't remember now by heart to how many initiatives you are already planning to participate. But I think there are always room for improvement. So of course, you know, this is the one message I wanted to pass. The second relating to multilateral organization, you know, that what we could do more in order to work as a Team Europe in different international organizations. I think this is very, very important question. And I want to give you one example. For instance, education. Under the previous MFF, we funded around 7% of our external funding or financing to education. So 7% went to education. Now because of the COVID-19, I wanted to increase funding to education to be at least 10%. If we look at the global architecture, eight architecture of education, there are several players. We know that the many European Union member states are also, you know, providing financial support and aid to those organizations, like also to partner countries. So that actually 50% of ODA to education comes from the European Union member states or the Commission. So we are the biggest donor. But how well are we coordinated? Do we really, you know, have this kind of a strategic vision that how are we able to provide access to quality education to the children and adolescents of the world in Africa or elsewhere? No, we don't have that. And that's why we need more coordination. And I think the coordination is needed also in order to strengthen the visibility of the EU action. Because it's like you said that really, you know, even though we are the biggest donor in many policy areas, people don't know about it. And also from that perspective, I think in order to achieve results, but also to strengthen the visibility, we need to be well coordinated. And that's what I try to do now. Of course, at the UN level, so in the UN family. But also, I would say that the role of the IFIs is very, very crucial. So how do we work within the World Bank as a team? How do we work within the IMF as a team? So I would say that this need for improvement in the name of coordination is not only in the UN family, it's more broadly everywhere where we really are, you know, participating in the international organization. So, but this is the priority. And step by step, we try to also make progress. We should thank you very much. I'd like to bring in a couple of questions now from the audience. So, if I may begin with one of my own, I'm delighted that you are putting delivery of the STGs at the center of your efforts. And I wish you every success in that regard, especially as we move further into the decade of action. But in the joint communication in February, you recognized that COVID-19 is having a negative or regressive effect on delivering the STGs. I mean, what do you think the EU can do to try to ensure that we build back better on the basis of the STGs, that we use the STGs as a positive agenda to get beyond the COVID or to respond to the COVID-19 challenges? Thank you. And this topic is actually very close to my heart because being a commissioner for international partnerships, I really see that STGs and Agenda 2030 is a kind of framework for our activities and cooperation. And definitely, COVID-19 has had a negative impact, we know that. And that's why actually we proposed, so as a commission, we proposed the Global Recovery Initiative last year, where the idea was to combine debt relief, debt restructuring, but also investments, both private and public investments to STGs. Because of course, as a politician, I always need to be honest and I want to do that and I want to be. We are not able to achieve sustainable development goals by the year 2030 without a very strong engagement with the private sector. We know that the challenges are so huge, and they are now even bigger than they were before the COVID-19. So the only way to really achieve those goals is firstly, we need a very strong commitment from the governments to increase their public finances to our partner countries and also their commitment to support debt restructuring especially in Africa. Because their fiscal space is so limited that they are really not able to operate without debt restructuring. And the second commitment we need is from the private sector, so that really they are part of this approach. And that's why what the European Union can do is really to push forward this Global Recovery Initiative we launched last year so that the whole international community buys in in a way and also commits to this initiative. Thank you Commissioner. A question from Porig Carmody who is with Trinity College in Dublin. Porig refers I think to other countries outside the EU and asks whether the commitment that we do see within the EU to inclusive multinationalism, whether other countries outside the EU are similarly motivated. Is it your sense that the EU is acting to some extent on its own in trying to rebuild multinationalism? That's a very good question and I think of course during the past year we have been really in the middle of pandemic and crisis and you know the focus has been you know on the exit strategy how to get out of the crisis. Now we can see that more and more in Europe but also in the US and elsewhere the focus is on recovery but we have to remember that still you know in the great majority of the countries of the world the focus is on the exit strategy. So they are still really struggling with the crisis and that's why we of course need to help them for for instance with vaccines and so forth. But my impression is that whenever we are at the stage of recovery and really we can also think of the lessons learned in a way that you know what we learned from the crisis we are able to discuss a bit more deeply or more in a detail on multilateralism that you know what do we and how do we want to revise the multilateral organization and the multilateral system and we wanted to put to the table this idea of inclusive multilateralism because we see that it's not enough anymore to operate only with you know intergovernmentally that you know the governments are negotiating and then we make agreements and then we either implement those agreements or not but we also need to because these you know the challenges we are facing for instance the climate change it's not enough you know to operate through the governments we need them of course but we also need to engage with the private sector as I explained in my previous answers but also with the civil society. So the idea of this inclusive multilateralism is also to build up a different networks like we actually did in the COVID-19 crisis because first we operate it you know mainly between the governments but then we started to operate also with GAVI and WHO and you know with other stakeholders of the international community so this is the idea of the inclusive multilateralism and personally I'm very optimistic that we are able to get support also outside the EU and especially now looking at the US and the new administration in the US I really hope that this could be one of the topics to cooperate and work together with them. Great thank you Commissioner there were many many questions I know your time is limited but let me try and get to some of them. Donald Cronin who is with Irish aid asked to what extent are the STGs being followed through by the other European commissioners by your colleagues in the college and what are the challenges of ensuring coherence across the EU's action in support of the STGs? Yes actually this is of course I'm a new commissioner so I don't know what was the tradition in the previous colleges or commissions but I can tell you that we really try to work in a holistic and comprehensive way within the commission so of course we know that now you know for instance STGs are part of this semester European semester procedure and Paolo Gentiloni as a commissioner for economics is responsible for that but you know also with with other DGs and commissioners we try to work as a team and of course this programming exercise I was referring to also earlier this gives us gives us an opportunity also to to look in a holistic way you know the green deal digitalization human development all those policy priorities which are in a way part of the sustainable development goals but also they are priorities for the current commission and we do this programming exercise together with the different DGs within the commission so even though I'm the you know the the commissioner who is responsible for NDG Global Europe this new financial instrument for my portfolio countries we do this programming exercise together with my colleague and other DGs also within the commission and that's also the way to take taking into account of course their expertise and really have this kind of a holistic and comprehensive approach also relating to STGs but David thanks for this opportunity it was great to be for a while in Ireland and have a very nice spring and somewhere actually and looking forward to outcome of this great conversation and my dear deputy head of cabinet Sandra is then replacing me thank you very much commissioner we really valued you giving us your time this morning it's terrific to meet you this way we hope you can come physically to Ireland at some stage and in the meantime we wish you every success and I know that Irish aid will be working very very closely with you and your team thank you very much indeed okay so Sandra can I welcome you to continue the conversation on behalf of the commissioner let me ask another couple of questions which have been coming in Sandra do you think that a stronger cooperation on global health will be part of will be achievable over the coming period in response to the pandemic is is it something where you think team Europe will be able to make a contribution yes thank you very much and also good afternoon afternoon from my side to Ireland so definitely global health will be a policy area in which more multi-level and which we will see more multilateral cooperation and also more team Europe approaches so we have already seen how it has started it has started with the COVAX initiative that commissioner Opeline also mentioned and now we are also working very closely together with member states to see also how we can roll out and distribute vaccines to our partner countries and this can be done preferably through COVAX or other bilateral sharing mechanisms so there are a lot of practical examples here so COVAX is maybe the most known but then we are also now looking very much to Africa and the African Center for Disease and Control that is also a bit under the auspices of the African Union and or the Pasteur Institute in Senegal where it is multilateralism but with regional partners or regional organizations and we are also trying to do this of course with our member states in a team Europe approach where it is always possible on the other hand you can see that for instance now in Geneva they are negotiating or they are looking at the possibilities to negotiate this new international pandemic treaty and this is of course another dimension in a way because this then really goes into an international agreement legally binding and here I think the cautiousness is maybe bigger than when it comes to just coordinated cooperation that can deliver concrete results in terms of policy financing and cooperation activities so we need to see but here of course also if it was to come the international pandemic treaty this would also be something where the commission would be mandated by the member states to negotiate and to be representing the union and to coordinate with the member states in this of course. Thank you very much Sandra just still on on team Europe a question from Ashfa Quresi who asks whether South Asian countries will feature on the agenda for Team Europe. Yes definitely what we are looking at in the programming exercise so we are trying to have maximum two team Europe initiatives per partner country not more because we want to ensure that the team Europe initiatives that they are consistent and coherent with our programming priorities and normally we only have three priority sectors that is coordinated and based on the partner countries poverty strategy and so we do not I mean we do not want to lose focus here and we want the team Europe initiatives also to fit into these priorities and this is why we are saying maximum two team Europe initiatives per country but so far what we have seen I mean now it is still work in progress but what we have seen is that we have a really one or two team Europe initiatives in relation to each country. Thanks Sandra coming back to the issue of more effective modularism what can the EU do to strengthen or to improve its own representation in the IFIs and to speak with one voice there given the various challenges posed by the treaties and the starters of the EU there. Yes this is also an area that is addressed in the multilateralism communication and you might have there are also currently council conclusions actually in preparation for in preparation of the UNGA this year that is also dealing with multilateralism and here first of all it is the coordination through the boards so with the European board members in W in the World Bank and in the IMF so and we are already having this kind of we are inviting them once a year to Brussels and now last year was virtually but and then we are trying to coordinate and we try to talk about our priorities and objectives in working with the IFIs that's one thing but the other thing is then of course to speak with one voice and to be also able to represent the EU and its member states at the multilateral level and here you know of course that in at the UN for instance here sometimes we were not able to speak because we require this common accord or unanimity which is nowhere really stated in the treaties for these kind of statements but it is a practice and here from the commission side we are told we are actively promoting the qualified majority approach so that we are not really weakening our representation in international bodies and that we are able to speak on behalf of the EU and its member states with one voice so to also be a truly geopolitical actor there yes yeah there are various questions on Team Europe Sandra one of them asks really whether the Team Europe approach can lead to better outcomes on migration given the lack of solidarity in relation to EU migration policy among member states yes so this is this is of course a very important policy area that we will have to address so under the new funding instrument that the commissioner also mentioned and the global Europe we have a spending target of 10 percent for migration and here I think also that the expectations from member states are going to be very high because so far under the last MFF we always had the European Union trust funds on for instance the emergency trust fund in Africa and they foresee possibilities where member states are very closely involved in the different projects through the operational boards of these trust funds but they will now be discontinued because now we have the new MFF we have sufficient funding and we should be able to roll this out whatever however we have committed to also address migration at the regional level to be able to top up for instance national programs when it is necessary and here we have also seen already a couple of interesting Team Europe initiatives on migration for instance Spain for western Africa they are thinking about a regional Team Europe initiative there and that we are looking in with them great let me turn Sandra to EU Africa relations I mean how how can we use the the closer cooperation between the EU and the EU to strengthen multilateralism within Africa or on the issues facing African states this is I should say something of great importance to Ireland and when you have spoken I might just ask Roy de Broca to come in on that from the Irish perspective but if how do you see the EU-AU dialogue as a way of achieving more effective multilateralism yes this will also be a definitely an important actor in particular now in the run up to the EU summit that we are likely or that we're going to have probably another French presidency then and here we already see emerging events and high-level conferences and like you know the the finance financing for Africa on the 18th of May in Paris and so here we really see that the cooperation is accelerating and the African Union will be a very important actor in this absolutely so and how this is going to be done in concrete I guess that when we're coming a bit closer to it that there will be also a roadmap towards the summit that we have such a roadmap we will be presented with such a roadmap and there are then the different member states commission will have their respective roles there in but if I may also mention that also my commissioner she has been chief negotiator for the commission for the new post-scotland agreement with the with the organization of the African Caribbean and Pacific states and here we managed to close the negotiations the initiative the agreement and as compared to the previous agreement there is also language on international cooperation and that we really also want to mobilize this group of state in order to foster international cooperation and to coordinate our positions in view of forthcoming big international conferences so as such as the COPS conferences this year and indeed I suppose the food security summit that would be another one coming up in September yep Rory could I ask you to intervene on any of those points yeah and thanks David I mean and thanks Sandra I mean I think specifically on on on the EU EU summit I mean I think I think this is a this is a really important structure that we have to engage with and I think it's the it's one of those classic foreign policy dilemmas where where I think we can all see the importance of an EU dialogue that's really rich and functional but I also think that trying to bridge two different structures and I think sometimes there's a challenge to us you know in we're not the same the EU structure is much more integrated than the EU structures and I think sometimes we we miss the politics in it and I think that's a challenge to us as we move forward because the real issues that are on our shared agenda Europe and Africa you know ultimately have a lot of politics in them whether it's migration whether it's climate whether it's food and whether it's development but we know that we have to have you know the defining relationship for Europe in this century will probably be with Africa as it becomes you know the biggest continent in the world by population over the next 40 50 years so it's really strategic and I think that brings us back to the team Europe point you know and team Europe I mean I think there's the projects that the commissioner mentioned that you know we're currently planning on a deep engagement in about 20 but I think it's also about a state of mind I think it's more than just just just coming together to work on projects I think it is about how we how we work politically in a very engaged way as member states as 27 plus the institutions are in smaller groups and then feed it back up and there are going to be real challenges to us in that because the tensions between member states will play out for example in the discussion on you know coordination the IFIs you know that what's good for us collectively brokering that as we all navigate our national positions is going to be a challenge and I think this is where you know it's really good to see the commission take leadership and pushing a team Europe approach I do think we're at the beginning and I think in that effect of multi-lateralism that we've been talking about today and that sense of a world that's becoming more challenging you know the tectonic plates of global power are shifting we are going to have to come up with new and smarter ways of working together that's intensely political intensely practical and much better coordinated over the decade to 2030 and I do think you know we're at the beginning of that at the moment and I think there's a journey to go but but it's a good beginning and I think we can take take a lot of hope from that so that's just a reflection that I have from the very from the conversation so far with that David back to you thank you worry another question here Sandra it relates to the challenge of getting bigger financial flows for the least developed countries and fragile states currently only about 6% of development finance which is mobilized goes to the LDCs what can we do for example in building on the NDICI regulation in the MFF what can we do to increase the flows available for LDCs yes so here I mean I don't have now the full figure but it is also in the objective of the NDICI that they should be treated with a priority so that those should be looked at financially with a priority and if you see the financial allocations in the NDICI this somehow also matches with these objectives because we have most of the LDCs in sub-Saharan Africa and this is where most of our funding is going so here we have 29 million and here we have most of the LDCs already by definition we have this amount of funding that needs to be dispatched among the sub-Saharan African countries thank you very much Sandra I mean coming back just to the general issue of inclusive multilateralism you know clearly there are forces within the EU who are which sort of act in a different direction you know there is nationalism there is populism in some member states how competent are you that we can keep a consensus going within the EU in favor of of multilateral approaches I mean how can we keep the entire number of member states on our side in relation to that well I think that for the European Union as also being an international organization and so by definition being in way part of the multilateral system as the commissioner said it's part of our DNA it's part the values on which the union is founded are the same values and the values of the united nations for instance so and and this is something very important to have better participatory approaches and the rule of law democracy human rights as the underlying principles of this reinvigorated multilateral system because I think what we have seen in the past is also that big players are using the multilateral system in a way pretending there are being multilateralists but pushing their own national interests and we want to move away from that and reinvigorate it also on the basis of the values that they are sharing so this is a very important point for us and I think here a key point will also be how to work together with like-minded partners and as the commissioner said now we're also having high hopes on on the US and coming back and being willing to engage into the multilateral system again we will have the EU-US summit on the 15th of June and I think also there that democracy and multilateralism what we can do together they'll be high on the agenda yeah I think that the the return of a US administration which is committed to multilateralism is obviously very encouraging dare I say a good friend of ours Samantha Power is now the head of USAID so we touch particular hopes to Samantha's arrival that you mentioned the UN Sandra you're absolutely right the EU and the UN are grounded in similar values are there sort of synergies that can be pursued between the the EU and the UN at country level if for example in in relation to delivering the STGs are there ways in which the EU and the UN can work more closely together at the at the country level yes this is actually what we are also trying to do now with this programming period because now for a couple of years the UN they have undertaken this very comprehensive UN development assistance reform and an important point of this reform is the UN resident coordinators that are in country and so for us it's also important to work together with them in country in order to really be aligned on the achievement of the STGs and yeah if you are also working in using the same frameworks in a way to see a bit what each donor is doing and how we can be complimenting each other so this is for us an important element and even more so since with the NICI we are following this principle of geographization so we have most of the funds that have been shifted to actually the the national levels and the regional level so that the cooperation with the UN for us will be very important at the country level thank you very much Sandra we're coming towards the end of this conversation there I mean there were many issues that one could take up for example the the whole area of climate multilateralism what the EU can do to ensure a really strong impact at COPS but the commissioner has touched on that a little bit the role of the private sector the commissioner didn't really have much time to go into that I mean if one is talking about inclusive multinationalism the private sector's contribution for example to achievement of the STGs is clearly vital are there particular initiatives which the EU can take or is already taking to mobilize the international private sector in support of of international development well um so for us the private sector is in the first place or I mean now I'm distinguishing between private sector and civil society organization of course I mean just private business private yes yes but because we're also doing a lot with civil society organizations and to have more to create more space for civil society you know shrinking space and here we are also thinking about having partnerships through our funding with civil society organizations now with private sector private sector I would see the private sector first and foremost in the context of our EFSD plus the financial arm of the NDICI and because here they can be among the illiterate counterparts and of course when we are for instance concluding the contracts with the big IFIs or European financial institutions then this is cascading down and the private sector is a very important element in there and for us what is important is to foster and mobilize investment also by mobilizing the private sector here so and this will be an important point I don't know whether you have heard the announcement of our president at the global health summit that we are looking now also into this team Europe initiative concerning manufacturing in Africa this would of course also be an example where we will need the private sector and where we'll also need to create an investment climate for the private sector to invest like pharma pharma industry and here it will be important also you know to think about the transfer of technology and now how training technical assistance measures and all all these kind of things to really make a careful analysis on how we can best roll that out so this would be definitely now also in view of the of the global health crisis and what we were saying that this is also a core area of engagement multilaterally that this would be of course a flagship initiative for as a team group initiative no that sounds very interesting very worthwhile direction to go in Sandra thank you very much for being so generous both in your time and in the replies you've given to the very diverse questions we were really really grateful I found it fascinating and now I'd like to ask Rory to work out to just to say some final words really reflecting on both what the commissioner told us and the the Q&A session Rory over to you thanks David thanks thanks Sandra I mean it's not much to say I think because it's been said and look I think this is a really important discussion it's really important to have have both Sandra and the commissioner here partly because you know the as I said earlier on the the commission you know spends more of Ireland's ODA than any other actor in the world but I think much more importantly than that because the EU acting as the EU and the EU plus the 27 is the biggest development actor in the world and as the commissioner said you know if we can coordinate effectively we can be really really effective and that is a challenge to us I think in a more complicated world and the theme of today's discussion is around effective multilateralism how can we make multilateralism more effective and when we heard Sandra and the commissioner talk about the EU itself as a multilateral organization and that's true and I think and I think there is you know if you look at all of the positions that member states occupy in multilateral organizations I think it's clear we can do better collectively than we are doing and today's discussion I think is a reminder to us in Ireland that we need to think about how we coordinate more effectively and better to maximize return on our own investment but also to maximize you know our influence and our kind of collective safety and so I think you know just like team Europe is I think at a beginning I think this conversation is going to be one we're going to have to return to and I think today was a really really useful introduction to a theme that we'll have to take forward again so with that David I'll hand it back to you. Thank you very much Roy. One final comment from my own side is that I think in your earlier remarks Roy you referred to the interesting change of title for the commissioner and I agree I think it is quite significant that development is now presented explicitly in terms of partnership the commissioner herself referred to the fact that partnership is one of the five P's in the 2030 agenda and as I would say modestly I had some role in drafting those five P's but we were consciously trying to provide for partnership as the concept which will underlie implementation of the STGs partnership between all countries but also within individual societies between government the private sector civil society academia and indeed international organizations like the European Union so I'm glad that the commissioner's title has altered in that sense and it sends a very important signal I know that partnership has been a central theme for Irish aid for many years so let's just say that the commissioner's talk I think has brought all of these themes into focus for us and it is very very helpful and interesting to hear that presentation and Sandra renewed thanks to you for very ably answering a whole range of questions for which you wouldn't have had any advanced warning thanks a lot we really benefit from it we look forward to seeing both you and the commissioner on on future occasions the meanwhile the best of luck with your vital work okay and on behalf of the IIA I thank everybody who took part in in today's event and looking forward to the next events in this development matters series thank you all