 We're here with Corona watch on a given Monday morning. That's all there is to watch right now And we're trying to explore it from one on one side of the globe to the other This morning we want to talk about Africa because Africa has oil and gas that has been affected and that in turn will affect it It's it's many startup companies and startup economies and for this discussion We have a fellow who is well trained and well expressed in this who has written books about it best-seller books on Amazon And a number of articles and who has had a lot of school And experience with oil and gas in Africa, and that's NJ IU hi NJ. Nice to talk to you Thank you so much. Thank you for having me nice to talk to you. I hope you guys are safe out there Yeah, well everybody has to stay safe now Because the probability is a good part of the globe is going to get this virus. Sorry to say Anyway, I wanted to talk about it Now you wrote you wrote a book about oil and gas in Africa And you spoke about how the US had not kept up with Russia and was in China in terms of investing in oil and gas Let's just discuss quickly that book. It came out in October last year It was a best-seller on Amazon billions of play it was so can you talk about oil and gas as we went into the coronavirus crisis, which was only a month or two after your book came out Yes, I think the Africa oil and gas market had been had been very very exotic One of some of the biggest discoveries in Africa were done by American oil and gas companies and not just to see the big companies that it was Every day Americans from Louisiana, Oklahoma You've seen dollars to set up the distance shows and the and and the people in Africa that you've seen a steady decline In that and I think some of it came with the American share of revolution That American share revolution had done so well. So take for example in 2009 America was producing about 8 million barrels of oil a day today the United States is the largest producer of oil and gas with about 13 million I was lucky to be to be on the technical team at OPEC when they were discussing the price war and Why do you think the negotiations are things the American? Revolution has really gotten the Russian state and And we shall be and so they decided to get the price war Which is really affecting the American oil and gas industry and also affecting the African oil and gas industry right now And then you get corona virus. So you've got these twins these twin evils. I really heard in Commerce and especially small businesses startup companies that I really tried to find different for a To see how they can make they can make a living in this industry Well, how important is oil and gas? To startup companies and to the startup industries and and countries for that matter in Africa It is so important, you know, I I always I always say this word In a lot of people I do around the world with a lot of young people a lot of startups. I tell them if you want A new app you want to have a new startup go to Africa Because you can see a lot of the new problems a lot of the problems you see You use your ingenuity to create new solutions And those solutions are going to target the rest of the world because that's where you are So the oil and gas industry is so important because right now it's not about manpower to automation This technology is going to be driven in that fashion And the technology is going to be the next big game in oil and gas and especially in Africa, which is needed So think about it right now 652 million out of 1 billion Africans 650 million do not have any access to any kind of power All that matter So imagine if you can create something By using a startup with technology to really drive that That's there. That is a billion billion billion billions at play That is exactly where where the students market going with a lot of information with a lot of new things to be done And the oil industry is that drive out because most of the kids get their income from oil and they're ready to pay So what we have here as of the time of your book and maybe even into December was a Great opportunities in Africa Um, that oil was central in all of that Africa was the last great business frontier It sounds like in terms of the consonants And there were all kinds of you know positive prospects So now at the same time the coronavirus got You know got got global The the Saudis had an argument with Russia and they drove the price of oil down Where it is still today How does that reduction from I don't remember where it started from $50 $60 barrel to now in the 20s Um, how does that affect? These countries that are trying to start up these industries and businesses in In Africa wouldn't that be a good thing for them cheap oil? It is not Because what is really important is stable oil if you have stability in the market It's very very good for the start of countries because you think about it the cost of Investing the cost of starting up It sometimes it can be too high And and when you look at the risk they spoil them the risk you have to take some confidence Might just say no, it's not working. But also you have to look at most African countries that actually consume a nation You are going to consume You want no other if you are going to produce you want high oil So we believe that when you have a stable market Yet we really make it really make sense for them. But also if you give us a new chain You really look at the oil and gas market, you know That's cool in the area of climate change You cannot just be all about oil. You've also got to look about gas You're going to look about new clean technologies renewable. We've got to find the whole energy mix So all is not finished. So even when there is crisis you are always going to survive And I think that is where you really see a lot of big opportunities that No matter what happens Every day people can survive because it's not about the big company. It's a big multinational We have a way to play and thank god, you know mom and dad and all of them They love these companies. But today we want you to see small companies Growing up and making sure that we can have this the next amazon and the next six book and the next instagram And the next new new technology the new companies that are really going to provide solutions in this continent Come out of the continent because there is there and walking together with americans We can be big opportunity for us. I was lucky to be in school in america And I know what american education and american engineering can do if it works for me And I think I work a lot more out african Now let's let's talk about you for a minute if you don't mind nj You have you have university of maryland. You have graduate degree New york technology You have you've been associated with a lot of international organizations You have you have written and obviously written a lot about oil and gas in africa I take it that you are one of the leaders in oil and gas in africa and in the subjects We just discussed you are a voice in the development of africa. Am I right about that? That's um you you you you they're very kind. I think I believe in what uh so much jefferson's mom told him and said be useful So I think I have a chance to be useful Okay, so that that's that sort of sets the stage for our discussion today nj So at december january all of a sudden a new element on the world stage a new element in the national and global markets coronavirus Now coronavirus at first was limited to china And then little by little it became clear that that was not you know going to last very long It was going to go all over the place and the world health organization began making noises like yes Maybe this is a pandemic and ultimately it got to africa And the concern in africa was the health infrastructure was insufficient to carry a significant number of cases um, so tell us how Uh, how coronavirus is doing so to speak in africa and where and how is it affecting business in general? I think it is affecting businesses in general around africa The continent is seeing I think about more than a dozen countries are going to have a shutdown I was in Equatoria again And the day I left it had a shutdown I went to nigeria for a speech the day I left it had a shutdown and I came to South africa with my family And right now the pregnant announced it's going to be a shutdown from from a third day So I think the second very drastic measure I think one of the one of the key benefits of Actually, there's no benefit of corona But for africa has been the last story where the virus is now attacking It's that we have seen the Um, the mistakes of many other nations and we can see some lessons mine. So I think leadership is saying listen Attack is issue very strong Have the right kind of quarantine self-isolation Have the shutdowns and it might be painful for 14 to 21 days But he would he would save a lot of lives because right now With africa much having a lot of infrastructure health infrastructure and everything We don't want to be the burden of the world We don't want to be the ones that are begging all the time And I think that is really something that we have to look at look at even We have uh, you know, universal health care is the best way to come But it's getting deep so we thought maybe shutting down And containing this and really eradicating this in a very fast in a fast-track manner Might be good. But when it comes to the business community, yes business is hurt I think a lot of world's reworking business think about it. I have people working offshore oil and gas in a lot of platforms offshore They can't even come because airplanes can't move. You can't retake people That's everything has been shut down. So you have to do this or walking 28 days Then go back to Louisiana, Alabama, Hawaii or new york You would have to be there for 60 days non-stop and you have that going on and on and on and on And so it's it's it's it's a great new world, but we have to also look at The opportunity I think my generation sometimes a little bit spoiled and I know it's people my age that complain about shutdown But I think when I think about my father and grandfather and some of the grandfathers and fathers that met in america This was world war two. That was his shutdown and it was very difficult. It put lives at risk If you went to vietnam, it went to korea and some of our friends He went to the gall to fight that was our thing So if we can be patient and sit at home and the quarantine or self isolation for 14 days To be a very dangerous virus that that hurts our seniors more. I think it's what's doing You're a lawyer and so you'd be I take it that you support the the shutdown support the isolation orders and the quarantine orders um But the question I have is uh, it's a number of countries involved It's a number of countries that have issued shutdown orders in africa As there are a number of states that have issued shutdown orders in the u.s And not all the not all of them are the same not all of the people in those countries react the same So from a legal point of view country to country You know, and I'm speaking about your law background now Um Are these orders being enforced are people Listening is the government are the governments involved taking actions with force enforce these orders You know One thing I learned the state developed being a country lawyer So you try to be humble on that given legal advice, but What are you looking at that governments are enforcing it People are taking it serious because there's a thing what has happened in the west You've seen what has happened in china You've seen what has happened to business For one, I am people are taking it very serious I mean before maybe the shutdown There was some tough quarantine But then you have you have you have and you have some people who decided to go out there and party and not respect Some of the safety rules, but it's also the other thing also that we I have advised both states Is to ensure that the basic freedoms people's human rights and people's civil liberties And not for directly infringing upon when it comes to the shutdowns because it is we we're walking a fine line Which in the sense of corona virus In basically infringing on all kind of civil liberties though There is um to the credit of some of the government they have actually reached out for credit guidelines not to infringing on civil liberties But it's also and it's often moral appeal to people to really know that we are in some We are facing some unchallenged water I just told you about a lot of young men and women who walking offshore oil and gas That is them going home in 28 days. You would have to be for 60 days So we all have to cheat in we all have to be part of this and it's going to be a little bit uncomfortable But we all have to know that The end of it is going to be good. It's going to be good for us But government has government has to be very warned We have to pay a lot of attention not to infringing on people's civil liberties Because it is not right and we shouldn't the Africa that we want should not be that Africa that That we are allowing stuff because we are valid in human rights in the cross as well Mm-hmm, nj. You're more than a oil and gas leader. You're a leader in general. May I say You know a few days ago. There was a story on Lagos uh, and ebola a few years ago And uh, Lagos, I mean, I don't think people in this country realize how how populated some of these cities are Lagos, I think was a 21 million people 21 million people right now And the story of ebola and Lagos is very interesting because it got from a smaller city it got into Lagos and had it had Had it expanded from Lagos had it gone anywhere in the world and and it could have Lagos as an international hub at that size Uh, it would have been a global epidemic, but somehow they stopped it in Lagos. Are you familiar with what happened? Yes, I am. I think that there is the good news is that this comes with some of the basics, which I think even American society could learn from Africa In some places when you put the education at the top No matter what happens People they might not have all the means but when they have that education they would know how to do some things, right? They look at it the Nigerian Teaching hospitals have been well trained a lot of really Educated doctors some of them were lucky to go to school in the united states and great Britain and Germany They were back just back in the attic in Nigeria walking and they were quick to intervene and really engaged in very good public health Training and they stopped the ball after the spread and I think I actually see the difference In Nigeria when I went there with how we were all checked for corona. They had five I mean you you don't even see that in the united states They could test for five minutes and to be quickly Very engaged and quality and people who who had who had symptoms and they were very professional and I think from having had the experience is dealing with this disaster in the past They are very very very prepared and I think Some of the good things just think that when you look at you when you in hawai or anywhere in the united states You could actually look at some good things coming out of Africa and think about it Let me not switch you a little bit into technology Some of the best case system When you look at this calling Tesla M P E S a Mobile money pay system. We look very in Africa out of Kenya and it works so well So sometimes we go this day to go to Europe. We like these guys are so behind when it comes to Mobile money and and payments with securing everything. So They are some good things to look at to look at there because I mean think about a grandma in the village You don't have bank accounts. So you you're looking at one billion people only about only about 160 million according to the world bank data have bank accounts Now most people your bank account is on their phones They use their phones as their bank as their bank payment to do to have only transaction because they're moving in a far more capital society And I think we are we are using a lot of data for failing That's why you see some of the guys in silicon valley Most of them spending a lot of time around african cities Looking at new things to understand communities and say we can really develop programs and projects for the future And and I think one of the key things we have seen is always been really important in old health care We have to look at things of the future and tend to be stuck with today And I think Africa offers that challenges new challenges They hope that also if people that are vibrant that know they can be something and they can divide up That's really what makes it makes it unique Now here here So can you give us a snapshot of how things are doing in other words? I don't think it was reported early on that there were cases in africa And that of course everybody knew that there would ultimately be cases everywhere But what's the status of those cases? How many cases are we talking about? Where is it popping up? And how successful is the is the containment? It's popping up in south africa. There are 400 cases right now I have a friend of mine who got tested positive for the virus And so South Africa is in a shutdown. Cameroon has about 100 cases And we are also going to do a shutdown. Equatoria Guinea has about six cases We're going to be a shutdown. Senegal has about 200 Nigeria has less than 20 So if they're not that small which is good So it's really important to contain Quickly and move and take drastic measures But it's also an issue of leadership I think what we have learned is that in times of this crisis We need leadership to be able to look at the population and say we are all in this together You know, so maybe sometimes you might have to stay away from Grandpa or grandma a little bit But sometimes we all just have to wash our hands If you don't have the border and actually the cases are popping up We have we have received a lot of support from the united states From europe from the world health organization There's sometimes the lack of infrastructure is also a problem Some some some communities are building mobile mobile support centers to really support those who really need help And we hope that with the lockdowns we might be able to contain it And we also have to we just have to be disciplined We have to try to be useful and that I think That would really help us to be described to because it's global It's not just a chinese problem or an american problem or your pink problem Yes, it's an artisan problem as well and we we we are part of that problem Yeah, but you have any thoughts about the american solution or maybe the american delay in a solution I think you know america is its country The there is there is nothing like america I think sometimes, you know We we always I always make fun of my friends. I say When americans look at solutions you get in the room, you know americans are there They either loud They the voice trust and sometimes we start That's when you look at uh When you look at your william united has responded. I give a lot of credit to the governor They have really seen At the strong line the mayors We are really trying to look at because these people work every day with the communities the federal government In the united states, which I think a lot of people expected them to do more. They're waking up There is a lot of things which you look in which you are congress going to put about Um, you know about two or three trillion dollars with the market and everything But at the end of the day, it's not just all about money It's about really responding to these things and really seeing how you can take some decisive action agency people But right from the top Sometimes you need to send a message That really calms down a shipping mission the america people are shipping Because they've never seen that we need to see leadership on the top And if you see folks people and this is time for people to come together and really say we buy everything We can be here. This is the country that puts people on the moon. This is the country that That stays here from from the masses. This is the country that turns turns turn itself around and Be the evils of sergations and had a more free society. So there's nothing I don't think the americans can be I think if there's one country I never felt against is that it's america Well, that's right. I think giving the best education in the world I've never been worried and being america knows how to speak itself. They always find a way to get it right And anybody who gets against america Is a fool and bring the day and is a fool at night because you've never said against america Thank you, renche I just you know something you mentioned in fact in many things you said here today it suggests that The leaders are important obviously make yourself useful from jefferson. That's very important But you know, it seems like this may be an opportunity for countries and leaders And people to come together And I'd like to know your thoughts about whether that is or could Or will happen in africa because a lot of the countries in africa are not necessarily tied together very well Will this improve the bonds among them? I think it has it is improving the bonds because a lot of them because of the Infrastructure gaps and shortage in health and facilities They are having more conversation and more communication than I've ever seen They are really reaching out to one more than say, how are you doing this or what are you doing? And I think both lines of communication Lines of communication have Have opened and I think there is now going against even barriers that exist that where people like either they have People wars or they've had political crisis With one another now they're actually talking together and I think you know when you sit on the table There's nothing you change things when you're on the table and I think they are getting the table Yeah, I want to continue more more connected and one of the things I got the biggest crowd About africa is that we have not We have not still ties anybody You know most of their corona cases They're first 200 cases that came around the continent. They came from europe and china It was it wasn't assistant It was european tourists and european migrant workers that were coming into Work on high-profile jobs with a like a peace cause or working as teachers that came in corona And there's nothing stereotype and I think that's that's that's that's that's you know You have this for joy when you see that because what is it is always easy is to Change the this to the to update you in this field among us So why is that really good for us because we've been in a lot of solidarity and we have been one another and reaching out to one another We're calling people that would even talk to for a while We want to talk to them on birthdays and and and everything that also We are reaching out twice to our european colleagues. I mean my son We've done it at $50,000 to the city of berlin because during difficult times in the past this supported us And I we are doing a lot of charity work Not just within africa but also with american cities Because this supported us i mean I wouldn't be here without america or american cities If it took it took me and they gave me one of the best indications the world a train you to show me how To be a man and live life So when america is in crisis in crisis and we have to support them and actually that is what people are really shocking Is that taking us back to our roots and say we are in this together because this crisis Can erase us as a people if we are not careful and it's going to change our relationship going forward because Going forward we are going to have to think about creating opportunities Finding skills thinking about the future and this is really where the tech community comes in They really have to think about the future so that they can see these things coming and stop it because the human race It's a challenge for human race and we are we can do better and this generation with all the technology and all the gifts we have Is this same these things like you can think about this in future? Then we then we're missing the point in jay ayuk Leading light in africa a statement of africa's future And when we get through with corona virus, and I hope that soon soon we'll hear more about him We'll read about him. Thank you so much nj. It's been wonderful to talk to you aloha Thank you, aloha. Thank you and uh, i'll be in july to hawaii 15 years and i promise i'll come back with my family All right deal. Thank you so much