 to all of you that are joining us here live for another episode of The Nonprofit Show. We are really excited because this week is a Power Week and fundraising academy with National University is here every single day this week. So we're kicking off Monday or as I referred, Monday with our, one of our favorites, Tony Bell. So thank you for being here, Tony. So glad to have you. My pleasure. Thank you. Thank you Power Week is always an exciting week. It is. It's really exciting. You know, we kind of launched it after Shark Week to kind of like represent the, you know, the focus on one particular conversation. And today that's exactly what we're focused on is the cause selling education here at Fundraising Academy. So really excited to have you with us. Thank you, Tony, Dana White. It kind of disappears a little, but. I know, I know. Yeah, but really excited to have you again. For those of you, Tony is with Fundraising Academy at National University. And today we're really excited to launch into the cause selling education model. And we're doing that and starting with phase one, step one, and then also phase one, step two. So there's several different phases of this, but it's an eight step cycle. So all throughout this week, we will be going through those eight steps with an amazing representative from Fundraising Academy. Yeah. Well, you know, it's a really, I love this opportunity because it's so hard for Jarrett and I. Sometimes we've just got that 30 minute window. And so for us to actually have an opportunity to drill down with you and really get your team for five days straight. It's an amazing thing. Again, if we haven't met, I'm Julia Patrick, CEO of the American Nonprofit Academy, been joined today by the non-profit nerd herself. Jarrett R. Ransom, which we are so excited to be a part of this conversation. And so we thank you very, very much for being with us. You know, Nonprofit Power Week is an amazing partnership with so many folks. And they include, of course, Fundraising Academy at National University, Bloomerang, your part-time controller, American Nonprofit Academy, Nonprofit Thought Leader, Staffing Boutique, Nonprofit Nerd and Nonprofit Tech Talk. These are the folks that join us day in and day out so that we can do something as innovative as Nonprofit Power Week. So super exciting. Hey, again, this is a really interesting thing because Jarrett, we talk a lot about cause selling with Fundraising Academy and the concept. You were even at Cultivate, their first ever conference in San Diego broadcasting live for two days. But one of the things is this is a really comprehensive look at their structure. So if you wanna take your team and get them up to speed, maybe even your board, you can access all of this week put together and you can do that on our app, on our streaming broadcast and our podcast. Every day we update, but what's really cool about this is let's say next month or in six months or whenever and you wanna pull your group together and go through this consecutive piece of information and training, you can do that. So you can do that on these three portals that we're so excited to be able to share with you. Okay, my friend, Tony Bell, last time we were together, Tony, you had to endure an epic power outage and yet you jumped in and moved forward. It was really, really exciting, but so today's gonna be a little bit easier. I'm gonna witness to everybody that Tony was the one that first came to us with this concept and Jared and I were like, I mean, we were doing some of these things, I think intuitively, but Tony, we weren't doing them in the strategic path. And so- Neither was I. That's amazing. I mean, it's really, it was just like this eye-opener and every time we talk about it, Tony, it's even more of an eye-opener. So Tony Bell, Senior Director of National University Academy's Relationship Center, an amazing, amazing thought leader within our sector. So not to belabor the point, but let's have you introduce the concept first and foremost of this cycle and what that entails before we drill down. And I love this diagram. We used to, I used to kind of levily refer to it as the doughnut, but then someone said, oh no, it's a lifesaver. So I was like, yes, the cause selling cycle is a lifesaver. But like you said, Julia, many of us that have been in the nonprofit sector for a hot minute have done all of this naturally, but it is amazing and compelling when you look at all of these strategies in this type of cycle. And it really is the full cycle of the, again, the prospecting all the way to the stewardship, all about individual relationship-driven fundraising. You know, it's really a fascinating way to go because one of the things I felt, and I can't wait to talk about this even more throughout the week is that, you know, they're jumping in and jumping out points and they're different ways to handle all of these different steps. And so while this wheel looks, and I love that you use the word lifesaver, Jared, that's like fabulous. I know, I was a toss up doughnut or lifesaver, but it has a little bit more meaning, I think, behind the lifesaver. I know we're broadcasting live from the West, doughnut right now, early in the morning sounds good. Maybe not to you in the East Coast, don't, Tony. Yeah, I remember when you brought this to us, Tony, and we were thinking like, where has this been for 20 plus years, right? And yes, maybe some of it is intuitive. Maybe some of it is really just part of, you know, best practice and kind of, you know, the model we follow, but really having this succinct and a strategic manner, as Julia mentioned, the strategy around this, it makes so much sense. So let's start off with phase one, step one. Again, for those of you watching, you can see the cause selling cycle, the education model on the slide, and that helps you for those visual, you know, individuals, but talk to us about prospecting for donors. Cause this to me sounds like the very, very beginning. Yeah, so prospecting, you're right, it's how to find qualified donors. It is your data mining, right? And so data mining in terms of data that you currently might have, there's a lot of donor data, right, within your organization, but it's also the data mining externally as you prospect for individuals that are going to, you know, fit the mission of your organization. And again, it's all around developing those one-on-one relationships with a donor. So, you know, it's qualifying, it's looking at things like approachability, capacity to give a desire or the decision makers. So it's really utilizing all of the tools available to us to create this great list of potential donors for the organization. So again, whether you're data mining internally, you're data mining externally, you're doing that through focus groups with existing donors for referrals, whatever that looks like, but your prospecting really is your investment in time and resources to create this great list of potential supporters for your cause. I appreciate that you mentioned internal and external. And I just have to do a call out for that internal because I forget which guest it was recently, Julia, but they really talked about how like your next major donor is already in your database, right? They're in the house. It's already, they're already there. And I feel like that's a constituency base that we take for granted, right? Like it's there, but we don't really uncover and turn, you know, turn the rocks just enough or at the right time to really see the potential. So I just so appreciate that you mentioned this is prospecting not only for external new donors, but those donors that we already have in our database. So thank you for that. Yeah, no, absolutely. You know, Tony, I feel like I hear from a lot of nonprofits not necessarily fundraisers, but nonprofit like C-suite and especially board members that are like, we're going back to the well too often. We keep asking, you know, more and more, we need, this only works if we get new people. And what I hear you saying with this is that not necessarily you need to under, you know, your internal database, it changes and the lives of your donors and prospects internally change. So I think that's kind of an interesting thing to wake up to, if you will. For sure. And not to get too off track with these first two steps, but you mentioned at the beginning of the conversation, the various ways or points to onboard or kind of off-board, right, in the cycle. So when you look at LAPS donor or donor retention, there are different places within the cycle that you might look to re-engage folks. So especially when we're looking at again, you know, LAPS donors, you know, how to kind of move existing donors to larger, you know, giving amounts, there are different places within the cycle that you would start that process with, again, with an existing donor. Okay, cool. I'm glad, I'm glad. Super nerdy and so much. Yeah. That's awesome. Well, thank you, thank you for sharing that. So, you know, we've taken the first step in phase one and we've started this prospecting piece, which is so critical. It's an ongoing thing. I would imagine it's not just like a one and done. It's a growing living piece of how we do our business. But then you talk about moving us into the pre-approach and qualifying our prospects. And when we look at that, that's something that we talk about in for-profit sales a lot, like, are they a qualified buyer? But I think what is interesting is this flip, like, are they a qualified donor? And what does that look like? It's not just financial, right? No, it's not just financial. I mean, when, so the pre-approach is all of the stuff that you're going to do before you ever even meet with the donor. So, like you said, Julia, it's all of that kind of qualifying that takes place. And I think that we have a particular kind of qualifying strategy within cause selling called the Madden Approach, which I think Jared is a bit of a fan of. I love that. But yeah, so there are tools. And again, you can go to mylearningportal.org and have access to a lot of the resources, to take a deeper look at things like the Madden Test, which is a great qualifier to help you kind of recognize your ABCs in terms of where you're going to invest your time and effort. So it's that. But then again, when we say pre-approach, it's all of those things, learning about the donor, where's the right place to meet the donor? Really just thinking about all of those, not necessarily qualifiers, but all of the things that are going to make for a more successful kind of first moment of truth with that potential investor. Tony, for this one, do you also start to identify the capacity of gift? Like, are we also identifying between this range and I mentioned this because I was recently in a location that had a donor walk, not a wall, but a walk, right? And it was, I'm always fascinated. And I find myself, of course, staring at all of the engraved bricks to find the names of these individuals, right? So like during this pre-approach, are we also identifying that potential ask amount? Yeah, yeah, we definitely are. We definitely are. So, you know, we're looking at things again, like capacity to give, capacity in terms of a decision maker. So, for those folks that are interested and want to take a deeper dive into that Madden test, you know, the Madden test has these very specific qualifiers, but I encourage you to think above and beyond those qualifiers and even change them if one of those qualifiers isn't necessarily relevant to your organization. So really think about that test and those qualifiers and make sure that they're super relevant to your organization. But all of those things, yes, Jared, capacity to give, you know, being a decision maker, alignment to the mission and the cause, alignment to ethics and transparency. So, you know, you wanna make sure that, you know, again, your donor ethics align with your organizational ethics. So there's a lot of great qualifiers. Cause again, this is all about attracting and building relationships with the right individuals for your organization. And not everyone is the right person for your organization. So in those scenarios, you can go through the approach, the approach, even the needs discovery and come to a conclusion that this just isn't the right individual for your organization. So then what you do is you celebrate the fact that they're philanthropic at all. You celebrate that they want to give and maybe you make recommendations to other organizations that might better align with their values or their passion points. You know, I think of the great Terry Axelrod who created Raising More Money and she uses that phrase, bless and release. You know, like, say, wow, we're grateful you're in our community, but this is not gonna be a right fit. And I think we all know along our journey of life when things just don't seem right. And so rather than try and make them to be right, sometimes you do have to say, this is just not a good fit for right now. Absolutely, absolutely. And I think that because if you're making this investment and putting so much energy into this process and you get to that point where you're thinking, yeah, this isn't gonna work. I think it's really, I think it's vital to be honest to say, yeah, we need to move on to something else. And I'm wondering that's really before we get to this next step, the approach, which now is moving into phase two. And even though phase one only has like two points, it seems to me, Tony, that that's the heavy lift. You invest a lot of time in these first two phases. You really do, you need to. I mean, it's why it's called development, right? Is that, and I say that sarcastically all the time because folks just need to be reminded constantly that it's a reason why it's called development. And you need to, as a fundraising professional, you and your senior leadership need to accept that time needs to be invested, quiet time at your desk needs to be invested in prospecting and continuously making sure that there's a robust pipeline of individuals for you to connect with and kind of start them on this call of selling journey. Cause again, once we get to step four needs discovery, we're really going to know at that point whether or not this is a good fit for the organization and for the donor. So, yeah. Let's talk about step, you know, we've moved into phase two, step one of phase two, which is the approach. So we're starting a new level and we've done all this homework and research. And as Jared said, you know, we've done it internally. We've looked at external issues, the Madden test. I mean, this is not just if wishes were fishes, we'd all have a fry kind of concept. We've been thinking about it and we're pretty educated about what goes next. But now we need to look at the approach and what does that mean? Yeah, so again, step two is all about getting yourself ready for the approach. You're doing all, you're putting on your Sherlock Holmes or your Nancy Drew, whatever it is, right? And you are really, you know, investigating, if you will, the potential of this individual. So you're going through all kinds of checklists, Julia. You know, again, I mean, I have some notes just like, again, are they a decision maker? What other types of organizations have they given to? And a lot of this information is out there. And I think for a lot of newer fundraisers, so let's say newer professionals in the industry, some of this kind of sleuthing, if you will, doesn't come natural and might even feel a little uncomfortable. But, you know, embrace that uncomfortable feeling because the information that you're going to receive by going through this process and going through these checklists are gonna be really important when you move to step three for the approach. All of that information is gonna help you when you go for the approach, right? When to set up the meeting, you know, what's the best way to navigate the gatekeeper if there is a gatekeeper? You're gonna have a good understanding of the other organizations that this individual may have contributed to. So how can you celebrate those other kind of contributions as part of your initial kind of, you know, connection or conversation with the potential donor? Yeah, and it's discovery, right? Like you are looking mostly, I would say, at public platforms, right? Like finding this information, also your own donor database. Hopefully that is chocked full with previous conversations of other individuals. Although I know they're not always done that way but they should be, right? Really looking at that information as way of, you know, qualifying that prospect. And then you're able to really, I wanna say like celebrate them for all of the support they've done for the local community, greater community, whatever that looks like. You know, we had a guest on Julia, Claire Axelrad and she talked about being a philanthropy facilitator, right? Like clear to help facilitate the philanthropic support, the gifts, the investment of these donors. And so all of these little breadcrumbs along the way that we pick up during our sleuthing, right, Tony? Like it's all just data and it helps us to really identify, you know, what does this donor like? Where have they really been involved? Maybe even to the recognition, right? It might even take us to how does this individual prefer to be recognized? So there's a lot of information there. A lot of information there. And in the actual textbook, and folks will see this also on the learning portal as we talk about kind of a deeper dive and more information. Part of your pre-approach also is, anticipating what this particular donor may ask you, right? When you have that first meeting. So we offer the top 10 questions your donors, you know, may have. And the number 10 question is, why should I trust you? So, you know, so there's a list of these, you know, these 10 questions and we could have come up with 20. We probably could have come up with 50, right? But there's at least 10 there to help folks really think about in your pre-approach what questions might I be asked? You know, when I finally have a meeting with this individual. Tony, one of the things that I never thought of until this very moment, talking with you and Jared, it seems to me as a fundraiser, and man, I sat in a lot of these meetings where as a community volunteer where I asked for money and I think I would be a lot more confident if I had moved through these steps that it wouldn't seem so frightening or arm-twisting because I would be armed with the information that would help me have a relationship versus just I've got, you know, 20 minutes left in this lunch and I'm gonna ask you for a million dollars, which is like stupid. Well, yeah, I mean, and it's very rare. We, you know, we make and ask the first time we're meeting someone, right? So, and if we are, then we have done all of those other steps or somehow organically we got to a place and there's a comfort level where that, you know, that ask can be made in kind of the first meeting. The curriculum is designed, you know, primarily for emerging professionals in our space. So one to five years. So you're right, Julie, I do believe, I feel very strongly that this curriculum helps build self-esteem and helps empower, you know, emerging fundraisers to really be prepared for those questions and for those experiences that they're going to have. And then, you know, for folks that have been in the industry for a while, there's just great refreshers and great reminders. And again, you know, you both have said like I've always said, wow, I wish I had this when I started fundraising. I did a lot of it, it was, I learned it just organically, but to have had this and to have been better prepared, I definitely would have been more successful and raised more money earlier in my career. You know, before we let you go, I want to ask you, you've referred to your portal, there's so much information, there's so much free information, online.fundraising-academy.org. Can you talk to us a little bit about what this portal does? We're going to spend the week talking about specific actions across this wheel, lifesaver, if you will, but talk to us a little bit about what we can expect if we go onto this amazing resource. Yeah, so one just, you know, applause and much gratitude to the Fundraising Academy team. This was a big project to digitize our curriculum in this way. In my very humble opinion, it is such a great combination of style and substance. It looks good, it's user-friendly, and a lot of really awesome content. So you'll find a lot of the content from our textbook available in the portal, free of charge, it's totally just out there. We want folks to raise more money for the causes that they support. And so we're really excited that, you know, at this moment in time that these resources are absolutely free to anyone, board members, volunteers, fundraisers, you know, anyone, entrepreneurs, anyone that's seeking to raise funds for a mission or cause that they're passionate about. And it does take a deeper dive into all eight of these steps with a lot of the tools that are available through the curriculum. I love this so very much. And Julia, I know in the beginning of today's episode you mentioned this entire Power Week, of course, will be archived on many of our platforms, right? Including the app, the streaming of the broadcast, and then the podcast. And I cannot echo enough, right? Like the need for the entire team, I think to learn about this model, you're bored to learn about the model. Because I would go out on a limb to say like, I really think all of your board members could be a huge, like, you know, in-person people to really help, especially with this phase one, with the steps in phase two. Yeah, there's so much there. So when, you know, when they bring their, you know, network of individuals, like how are they thinking about their connections? How are they bringing them to these, you know, different events? And are we asking the right people? So, exactly. I think it's been amazing. Well, Tony Bell, you are a wonderful, wonderful part of our community. National University is certainly very, very fortunate to have you and your wisdom and your leadership. I'm fortunate to be a part of an incredible team. And I'm so grateful for National University. I really am just one of many ambassadors for this, you know, I didn't write this curriculum, but I certainly see the value and we hear it from folks that have really dived deep into it, the outcomes and just how they're raising so much more money. Yeah, it's amazing. I mean, Jarrett held up her book. I know my book. It's like all dog-eared. But, and Tony's got his book. I can't say it. Yeah, it's super cool. Hey, again, we are here today for, or I should say this week, for a non-profit Power Week with Fundraising Academy at National University. We're also supported by Bloomerang, your part-time controller, American Non-Profit Academy, Non-Profit Thought Leader, Staffing Boutique, Non-Profit Nerd and Non-Profit Tech Talk. These are the folks that are with us day in and day out, especially during this really amazing week. Now, tomorrow we're gonna move more into this cycle. We're gonna talk about how all these different pieces fit together so that as you are on your journey of building stronger relationships with your donors, you can be confident, you can be effective, and you can really be strategic in a way that is healthy for everyone. The organization, the donor, and you as the fundraiser. So please join us again tomorrow. And I love what Jared said. Man, once this week is done, that's gonna be a really wonderful time to gather your team together, including that board, and let them watch this because I think it's gonna help so many organizations. Tony and the team at Fundraising Academy, thank you so much. Thank you so much. It's always an honor to be with you both. Thank you. It's been a lot of fun. Hey, everybody, as we like to end every episode, we want to remind everyone, including those board members and fundraisers out there that are joining us this week to stay well, so you can do well. Thank you, everybody. We'll see you back here tomorrow.