 I started a live stream. Yeah. And it's true. I can't daily live. PJ says it's starting to sound like the opening number of beauty and the beast in here. Um, actually Tom, one cue other bets. Yeah. Other bets like healthcare company, Verily, Fiber and Waymo. In the other category. Other bets is what they call everything that is in Google. So they report their earnings. Here are Google's PNL. Here's our other bets PNL, which combines Waymo, Verily, the Google Ventures, Fiber, everything else is under a category called other bets. Yeah, I did. Verily, I say to you, I should have an opening quotation mark. Hey, opening quotation marks, stay on that line. I don't want you up there on that line. I'm talking about quotation marks and they do what I say. And that brought the conversation to all. Sorry, I'm adding my notes. Yeah, don't worry. I just got to go on talking about my quotation marks and my personal relationship with them. Uh, which is? Which is, you know what, you know what, I don't like smart quotation marks. I really, really don't. Because they always end up being wrong. They think they're smarter than they are. When I'm going back and editing books that I've written, I always end up finding smart quotation marks that are pointing the wrong way. And I'm like, what's wrong with you? That's not right. Yeah. Whereas the dumb quotation mark right up and down. It's never wrong because it's always straight up and down. Pacific time, Eastern time, never wrong. Exactly. Everything in the middle is just. I grew up in central time. All right. I find that offensive. Also, our server, our email servers have migrated successfully. I sent a test message to myself and it's working. So there you go. That's what I think. Well, yeah. Man, I'm so excited about this main topic. Are you? Antique journalism conversation yet? I was going to ask you earlier how your navel's doing. Is it ready for some gazing? Oh my God. I'm so excited. How many angels will dance on the head of this? Oh, good. I'm very glad to hear that. Well, folks, I think we're ready to go. Are you guys ready to go? I think so. Let's do a show. All right. Here we go. All right. Let's go. Thanks to everyone who supports Daily Tech News Show directly. To find out more, head to dailytechnewshow.com. So hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Yeah! Oh, I started recording East meets West. I was like, why did Skype load? All right. Here we go again. Ready? Yep. I mean it this time. Three, two. Thanks to everyone who supports Daily Tech News Show directly. To find out more, head to dailytechnewshow.com. This is the Daily Tech News for Monday, July 23rd, 2018 in Los Angeles. I'm Tom Merritt. And from Studio Feline, I'm Sarah Lane. From Oakland, I'm Justin Robert Young. And our producer, Roger Chang, is here as well. How are you feeling, Roger? I am feeling fine. We have prepared our navels for a little gazing later on this show. Columbia Journalism Review take on tech media, which we think we are interested in. And we guess maybe some of you are interested in since you consume this show. And it's a good chance to just kind of step back and look at how we do things, how the world does things. But let's start with a few tech things you should know. Snapchat will shut down its Snapcash payment service on August 30th. Snapcash was launched back in 2014 in partnership with Square. Interesting that that yet another trend bites the dust. Samsung says in September, it will begin mass producing the 146-inch or 4K micro-LED display called the wall that it showed off at CES. Samsung also said that next year it will launch a thinner consumer version, 30 millimeters versus the wall's 80 millimeters. Samsung says micro-LEDs last longer and suffered less from burnout than OLEDs. For burn-in particularly, the stuck pixel effect. And another CES product that's actually coming. I'm so excited. That's two within the last couple of weeks. Sony announced its 8.0 millimeter IMX586 CMOS sensor for phones with the industry's highest pixel count at 48 megapixels. Sony is pretty much a sensor company. The sensor uses Sony's Quad Bayer color filter array to combine pixels together for low-light shooting as well. So you get an effective 12 megapixels low-light or 48 megapixels high res in one sensor. Sony says the new IMX586 can record 4K video at 90 frames per second, 1080p at 240 frames per second. Hello, slow-mo guys. And the first samples of the 48 megapixel chip will arrive in September 2018. Sources tell CNBC that Pinterest may get near $1 billion in revenue this year thanks to strong ad sale growth particularly in mobile and may go public by mid 2019. Pinterest raked in $500 million in sales in 2017 with particular success by those mobile ads. Pinterest has 200 million monthly active users. And I actually thought that they were public already. Well, will the investors find that they have a high return of Pinterest? Let's not talk about that anymore. Let's talk about my hometown paper, The St. Louis Post Dispatch. What are they reporting, Sarah? Well, Tom, I'm not sure if you're going to love or hate this story, but The St. Louis Post Dispatch reported Friday that Uber and Lyft driver Jason Gargocke had been live streaming his rides on Twitch without passengers' knowledge since March. The streaming was not against Missouri Law, which both Uber and Lyft said at the outset, but was a violation of Twitch's community guidelines. Gargocke said he had a sticker on his car that notified passengers that the vehicle was equipped with audio and visual recording devices, and consent was given if you enter the vehicle because you would have seen the sign. Uber removed Gargocke from its service Saturday, Lyft did the same on Sunday. Apologies for singing The St. Louis Post Dispatch theme song there in the background. I was like, Tom, you all right? Couldn't help it. The yellow rapper on the lawn was a rite of passage for me as a young man. Anyway, that has nothing to do with the story, which is all about this guy thought, oh, if I just put a sticker on, it'll be like terms of service. Guess what? When you're violating other people's terms of service, that's not going to work for you. And basically what Twitch is saying is like a sticker saying they're under surveillance doesn't mean you get to stream them on Twitch. Yeah. So that is actually not crazy when it comes to a lot of, if you are shooting something for television, a concert venue or something, it is very common to just have a bunch of signage outside that says you will be on camera. If you do not want to be on camera, then leave, you are consenting if you walk in. I would wonder whether or not, if you did something that was a little bit more robust, whether or not he would be able to get away with it. But this was obviously. Yeah. I think if he'd been specific saying, I will be live streaming you, and even went farther to say on Twitch, maybe it would be fine. There are other people who actually do this from their ubers and lifts with express consent. They tell people like, hey, I'm live streaming in here just so you know. But folks were like, ah, but they're not as funny because they're being streamed so they behave themselves better. Yeah. This is a bad look. In fact, I think I might have seen him do it on the IRL channel. Yeah. And it was something that I thought was weird then. It's a strange world, man. It is an evolving world, but I would say. Also sounds like kind of a boring stream. Most of the time, people are just sitting there nicely in the back. Here we are. I will say, I've certainly had some conversations with my wife in the back of an Uber that were probably a little bit that would have been spicy enough to have some bits thrown in an IRL. I could think of an entertaining lift ride I took recently from Santa Monica to my house that would have been made for excellent live streaming. Yeah. Oh, no. There was one. There was certainly one where it was very interesting. But yeah, look, this is an evolution of not only live streaming in general, but also Twitch's IRL culture, which has already run into a few roadblocks in terms of streaming at parties and stuff like that. Qualcomm announced the QTM052 millimeter wave antenna module. Millimeter wave portion of the 5G spectrum is the part that offers the fastest speeds, but it has the most technical hurdles. It has a shorter range and requires beamforming to deal with interference from solid objects. You'll often heard it said 5G can't go through walls. Well, it can't go through a steel wall, but it can reflect and bounce around and beamforming and beamtracking allow it to still work inside buildings, especially with a little assistance. The QTM052 helps beamforming and beamtracking work by combining four antennas in a module the size of a penny for multi-directional reception. And Qualcomm says its X55G modem can support four modules. So that would give you 16 antennas, which you could place in four different parts of the phone. And that way, if your hand is blocking one of the antennas, you've still got other antennas that have plenty of directions to get those bouncing signals that are being tracked and formed, etc. Qualcomm says the first hardware with the new antennas will arrive at the beginning of 2019. This is all good news, if that's what you're waiting to hear. You're not going to have a whole lot of 5G service, but you're going to have these antennas, which are going to make the higher-speed 5G work. A higher-speed 5G practically can get you 1.4 megabits per second. Its theoretical max is around 5 gigabits per second. Wow. Yeah, look, this is a good step forward. And also, we are entering into a world now where 5G connectivity could be very, very useful for devices that are internet connected that just kind of stand stationary. And maybe it's something that can get a faster, more reliable connection with a chip like this. Yeah, there's a couple of different ways this could be used, for sure. This is meant for mobile, though. Yeah. Nintendo has filed a lawsuit in the U.S. District Court for the District of Arizona against the operator of two websites that make ROMs of old Nintendo console games available for download. Loveretro.com has been taken offline, and LoveROMs.com has removed all Nintendo files from its directory. Nintendo's suit claims damages in the millions of dollars and asks for an injunction to give it control of the domain. Contentious sort of situation that goes on online with regard to ROMs. I apologize for the echo. I'm not sure where that's coming from. But essentially, ROM trading was this sort of like, well, if nobody really notices we're doing it, we can get away with it. And now Nintendo is one of those companies who is more willing to crack down on this and is coming in hard on these particular sites, saying in their filings, like, this isn't just a couple of people trading ROMs online. These aren't two people who say, well, I have the cartridges. I just, you know, I want to be able to use them in my emulator. This is a website that's sort of making their name. They don't necessarily, as far as anything I read, they don't accuse them of making money, but making their name and getting a lot of audience to come to them and maybe driving some advertising revenue that way on the backs of trading these ROMs, which Nintendo says, we are the only ones who have the right to do that. We own this intellectual product. I, they committed the cardinal sin of any ROM site, and that is to fly above the radar. That is the, that is number one. It's like Fight Club. You don't talk about it ever. You got too popular there. You, you, you know, all the ROM sites make money off a bunch of click ads and a bunch of, you know, pop-up ads and stuff. But you don't, you don't like signal to the world what exactly you're doing. You, I mean, to be honest, more than a half a dozen ROM sites I can go to right now that have everything, either as single files or just a large repository that you can download over a BitTorrent client, and they've been there for the better part of 10 years, and they survive because they don't fly above the radar. Okay. Okay. But, but also let's understand that there is a sea change here when it comes to these companies, Nintendo and any kind of hardware company has had for as long as I've been alive an aversion to backwards compatibility. So it's not like every new system has a way that you can play all your old games on it easily. They've never really been able to do that or they never wanted to do that. They never were really interested because their money was made in selling the new console. There is now both with the love of retro gaming and the fact that Nintendo has really gotten into this on a larger level with their Super Nintendo and Nintendo ROM devices. This has now become a business that they are more interested in and so they're going to protect their interests more. Yeah. I mean, that's part of it. I mean, they've created virtual consoles and emulators that you could play like and they would sell the games as a pack, right? You would buy a disc with, you know, the 25 best of. I think what Justin's talking about is the mini console that has all the retro games and the Nintendo Switch Store adding more and more classic games to it. Yeah. They finally want to take advantage of what is obviously, as you've mentioned, Roger, been a fan demand for the better part of 20 years. Well, that's a way that they can get away with claiming millions of dollars in damages, whether or not that's true. It's because Nintendo is like, well, you're taking away from our business because we're trying to provide that retro service, too. Because we're under manufacturing all these old fashioned game consoles in miniature form that people can't buy because we don't have enough of them. And so, obviously, it's taking away millions of dollars. The BBC reports that developer Abhishek Singh used TensorFlow to train a machine learning algorithm to recognize American sign language and turn it into speech that can then be used to activate an Amazon Echo. The Echo's responses are then listened to and translated into text. Singh believes Amazon could incorporate the algorithm into the Amazon Echo Show, which, of course, has a camera, to allow sign language control of smart speakers. Now, Jeffrey Bigam, an expert in human-computer interaction from Carnegie Mellon University, told the BBC that Singh's project is an excellent proof of concept, but computer vision and language understanding is not yet capable of fully recognizing sign language. So he wasn't poo-pooing what Singh did, but he's like, it's not going to be a perfect replacement. At the same time, Amazon today introduced Tap2LXA for the Echo Show, which adds shortcuts to the home screen as a replacement for voice interaction. This is part of their accessibility push for the Echo Show, and they rolled out captioning to more markets. That's something they'd rolled out in the US, but it's now available in the UK and a few other markets as well. Were you able to try out Tap2LXA? Is it rolling out slowly or...? I didn't try it out. Now that you say that, I feel like an idiot. Like, I absolutely should have gone and started it on, shouldn't I? Maybe it hasn't pushed out to me yet, but I will try it. Well, I don't know. I mean, I don't know anything about sign language, but I know that this is a real... It's a really cool research project, right? Even though there's more to it. But, you know... The same thing is... I mean, I would love if he would work with Amazon. I don't know what his angle is here, but I would love if he would work with Amazon. To incorporate this so that you could look at the Echo Show, have a setting flipped on, do sign language, and have it display text back. And the Tap program that Amazon launched seems like it would work right into that as this could be an extra option you could add to it. And Amazon obviously pursuing accessibility for these devices. Absolutely. Well, I mean, think about voice to text. You know, sometimes voice is just easier. So, sign language, that makes perfect sense. Yeah. It's really cool. I like it. I hope we see more of it. I like it too. You know what else I like? Earnings. Of course I do. You know, good, bad, ugly. Alphabet reported Q2 earnings per share of $11.75 versus, excuse me, an expected $9.59 and revenue of $32.7 billion, which beat expectations of $32.17 billion. Google's advertising business accounted for most of its revenue hitting $28 billion. Other revenues, which includes cloud business and hardware sales, $4.4 billion. Other bets, like healthcare company Verily, Fiber and Waymo, posted Q2 revenue of $145 million on operating losses of $732 million. So, $4.7 divided by $32.7 is 14%. 14% of Alphabet's revenue comes from not Google advertising. Like, we're not even talking about Google Cloud. It comes from AdSense. It comes from ads. If there is a criticism of Alphabet, it's that it's still overly dependent on advertising for its revenue, but this is generally good news for Alphabet. Yeah, well, it's because it is advertising. It has eaten everything. Go ahead and, for all of our New York listeners, the New York Daily News laid off 50% of its staff today. Yeah, part of the reason why is because ad sales are down everywhere because Facebook and Google have eaten all of it. They drank your milkshake. Yeah, and they are full of $28 billion worth of milkshake right now. I wish they would break out a few more. I'm looking forward to the day that they break out, let's say, Alwaymo as a separate line item. I know it's too early to do that, but maybe Verily is pretty close to that because I'd like to see how some of these other Alphabet businesses do. Because you're absolutely right, Justin. They are not hurting in the advertising business, but looking down the road, looking longer term, the decade-long thing, somebody's going to come out and start drinking their milkshake if they're not careful, and they need to have some diversity to survive that. Certainly so. And I would say us as tech journalists need to continue to put pressure to see exactly what these companies are doing if they are going to be covered with the kind of breathless anticipation that many of them are. I would like to think that maybe what's happening is we should move towards us as tech journalists covering things in a way that helps people understand for themselves what's going on, instead of trying to sway them one way or another. But that's our main topic. If you want to get all the tech headlines each day in about five minutes, decide for yourself what you think about the tech news. Subscribe to DailyTechHeadlines.com. All right, we got a good one here. James Ball has an article in the Columbia Journalism Review, a respected publication. I have had my picture in it, so I like it. It called, We Need a New Model for Tech Journalism. He alleges that the press has treated tech too lightly for too long, treating founders as heroes and tech stories as light kicker-style stories, avoiding the legal fights in the dark side of founders getting kicked out. He says, and I quote from his article, the bootstrap narrative remains, with CEOs still treated as celebrities and the media acting more as a cheerleader than a watchdog. For most of the past decade, these companies were untroubled by media incidents. And he uses that to paint a picture where tech companies can't be held to account easily because they have this 25-year head start of not being treated with scrutiny, and now they're the biggest companies in the world. He uses examples like hyperloop coverage being all over the place when traditional rails can't get funds, breathless Bitcoin and blockchain accounts, leading readers to get caught and get rich quick schemes. Journalists being more excited about 3D and VR, the consumers and with 3D in particular, proving not to be successful with consumers. He says, ending technology journalism as we know it won't save tech, let alone the world, but it might be a good first step. Now, I have my own criticisms about this article, but let's start with you, Justin, because I know you're chopping at the bit. What did you think of this? I think it's stupid. I mean, to put a two-fine point on it, there's nothing that I love more than a pedantic conversation about journalism. I always love it when we as tech journalists or journalists in general can get to the real story, us. So here's my two points here. On to bolster his argument, I do think that one thing that I've noticed tech journalism effectively to me is the combination of two very, very different traditional styles of journalism. A very dry engineering kind of journalism, which is founded by about science and engineering and where the breakthroughs are going to come through. You're a nanotech. You're extreme tech, that kind of stuff. Yeah. Exactly. And then business journalism, and specifically this very weird form of business that has been incubated largely in the Silicon Valley area, but also all over the world at this point. And when you are overloaded on one side in a way that I do think that we are overloaded on one side in terms of the vast majority of our narratives when it comes to tech journalism is on the business side. It's who's getting hired? Who's getting fired? Who's getting merged? That kind of stuff. It's less on tech literacy in a way that I think would give to Ball's point maybe a little bit more of a sobering, okay, well, what exactly is this doing and how does this affect us kind of stories instead of just, wow, isn't it exciting? 50,000 users. Hooray. However, the one thing that you can't get away from is that this has been a rapidly growing niche. And the industry itself has pushed back on stuff that is deemed too salacious. It's a small crowd and it policed itself very, very well. There's a lot of evolving stuff here that I think does need to continually be shaped, but to say that it's poisoned and the entire thing needs to be ripped down, I think is just silly. And to be honest, even as examples about Hyperloop and Bitcoin and stuff like that, I think is one of my least favorite journalism arguments, which is that journalists need to be guardians for the readership instead of journalists need to be informing the readership, that they should be knocking down bad ideas that they know. That to me is a gatekeeper argument and I've always hated that. So there were a couple things about this article that I took to shoot with and I also thought he may make friends. Sorry about that. You guys hear that? As far as his point about celebrity treating company founders and CEOs as celebrities, I don't think there's a bigger celebrity than, I don't know, the founder of Facebook. I mean, as far as cultural impact, that's a bigger celebrity to me than my favorite actor, for example. But that's sort of a strange argument. I actually think if you're really defining celebrity, then that's probably a pretty credible celebrity and people are going to do that. I would also say that the celebrity machine for Zuckerberg might have been making a movie out of his life. Like, be the bigger proponent there. Yeah. And he made another point in the article, kind of like a fandom thing. Like, Gadget is live vlogging and people are waiting outside the Apple Store. It's like, I don't think disdain for fandom is a bad thing. I think you let people like what they like. People get, you know, fired up about all sorts of stuff. Tech is no exception. In fact, arguably tech has more of value to our lives than a lot of the things that other people get fired up about. So like, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I do think that page views and quotas are a thing, having worked at many publications in the past. I mean, that's definitely true. But his point that the sort of rush to be first and to publish all the articles means that journalists are spread too thin, that really depends on where you work. I mean, I've worked at places where people had a certain beat and that's what they did, because that's what they were good at. So this kind of churn and burn thing isn't always the case. My overall impression of this article is not that he's wrong. He makes some really good points, but that he's talking about a different tech press than I've experienced in the past 10 years. And I wonder if he is heavily weighted towards, this is what The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Washington Post, or maybe The Times of London, The Guardian, because he is a UK-based reporter, have been doing. And if that's the case, then yeah, I can kind of see what he's saying. But he doesn't distinguish between that broad press and the tech press. The tech press, in my opinion, have been overly critical sometimes of the wrong things, going after people for small things that are like, hold on, that was just a change in a form. Why are you vilifying? And that's been going on for 10 years as well. So I get the feeling that somebody who has followed tech journalism very closely, whether as a reader or a participant, has, is going to have a way different impression than the one ball describes. He also suggests some solutions that are already in place. He suggests entry-level reporters write up launch events and conferences and assign beat reporters to companies. There are several organizations that already do that. That was happening at CNET when I was there. From inside DTNS, I see the press pouncing on critical stories about big companies, often without bringing in the broader understanding as a bigger problem than forgiving them these days. I see a culture that is quick to accuse, and ball seems to kind of want to throw gas on that fire. However, I will say he hits on some big problems like access journalism. Because of the rooted history in product reviews where you have to sign an NDA, there's a huge culture of secrecy where you can't even visit a headquarters without signing an NDA, which is one of the reasons that I don't do product reviews and I don't visit headquarters because I want to be able to talk about the things that I'm talking about. And we need a more critical top-down broad perspective to help people understand technology. He writes, people who can sit back and aside from the tech industry, Melstrom, and try to see the picture from above. That's kind of what we're attempting to do here. There are other people who attempt to do it in other places, both print and podcast and otherwise. And yes, I think we could use more of that. A hundred, 110%. My favorite thing, and this is, we're really going to get inside the kitchen here. Whenever Tom and I have talked about stories, because I've always been fascinated and appreciated your news value as to what is good and what is bad, your guiding light, and correct me if I'm getting this wrong, has been this is about the consumer that is outside of the Bay Area bubble. Not to say that there's not plenty of people here in the Bay Area that also love this show. I know there are, but that this is not about the Game of Thrones of what VC is leveraging this person and they're kicking out and somebody's sleeping with somebody else. That those stories are often, they're business stories, they're important business side things, but really it's about the tech and it's about getting tech literacy right. And if you focus on that, I think a lot of these issues are very, very clarifying. And as a kicker, I think you're right. He's focusing on the big platforms while there is, down here, a fine underclass of journalism that serving its audience very well. I would say ours, Technica, The Verge, TechCrunch, they all have great examples of people doing exactly that. And I'm leaving off way too many because we'd be here all night. But there are a lot of tech blogs and publications on the web that do this well. And he's kind of missing those people there. I also, I think Sarah and I should deserve a little perk for bringing in echoes into a discussion about an echo chamber. I know. You thought that was an accident. We really overthink these shows. Very meta. Yeah, exactly. Glad you pointed that out. It's always good when you point out your cleverness. That always helps. You know who else is clever? Everybody who participates in our subreddit. You can submit stories as well and also vote on other stories at dailytechnewshow.reddit.com helps us understand what you want us to talk about. Facebook.com slash groups slash dailytechnewshow is another place you can hang out. Or you can just send us the electronic mails. What do we have today, Sarah? Oh, glad you asked Tom. Chris wrote in to thank Tom personally for his Jack Conti interview from last week. Chris said, I only really knew that he started Patreon. That his company had that announcement about some changes back in December, walked it back after a week. Wouldn't be the first company to do that. Chris says, at the time of the announcement, you made statements to the effect that you knew the people at Patreon and they were good people. Still, it was hard for Chris to internalize that with the actions that he was observing as an outsider. Chris says, I want to say thank you for putting a voice with the name. It's easy to see oneself as the victim when something goes wrong and it's easy to see a faceless company as a profiteer when it hits you in the wallet. So it was nice to hear Jack as a real person who's trying to make the world a better place, which is actually a kind of nice dovetail from our discussion conversation from the second half. No, absolutely. And thank you, Chris. That was very nice. Very nice. Also, thanks to Justin Robert Young for being with us this fine Monday. Justin, what's been going on with you? Oh, man. Well, I'll tell you what. Folks, you can head on over to freepoliticalnewsletter.com. We have migrated it to MailChimp. It is a good thing. It actually gives me a lot more options. I can embed videos and stuff now in a way that I hadn't before. So get ready. We debuted today on the free political newsletter. I'm going to have, because in our great discord, we have just a running tally of crazy political ads that come in around this time of year. So it is a fresh harvest season for lunacy and politics. And you will get all of it if you sign up for the free political newsletter at freepoliticalnewsletter.com. Of course, you can support this show in loads of ways. There's perks if you support it directly and become a member at patreon.com.slashdtns or, and either one, you can get some stuff from our store, dailytechnewshow.com.slashstore. Big thanks to Prigshaw over there on Twitter who sent us a picture on Twitter of him sporting his DTNS hat at the KC Key Fish House this weekend and looking good at the same time. Thank you, Prigshaw. And if you would like to join him with a little DTNS on your head, dailytechnewshow.com.slashstore. It's a great hat, guys. I wear mine often. Our email address is feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. We're also live Monday through Friday if you'd like to join us 4.30 p.m. Eastern, 20.30 UTC. Put it on your calendar, say every weekday. Find out more at dailytechnewshow.com.slashlive. We'll be back with Patrick Beja on the morrow. Talk to you then. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. All right, men and club, hope you have enjoyed this bro work. Sure did. Good show. Good timing today, Roger. That was great. The last picture threw me off because the Bud Light in it is the right way. You know what I mean? Like the DTNS cap is... Because the Bud Light's actually backwards because you're seeing it through the bottom of the umbrella. That's funny. I didn't even think about that. I didn't even notice that. Well, you know, a backwards DTNS hat is still a good hat. Oh, that old saying. Classic for a reason. Yeah, you can see that again. A backwards DTNS hat is still a good hat. Amazon Echo, show me how to sign. The Amazon Echo Chamber. That's pretty funny. The Echo Chamber. Ha! Good times. Who likes smart quotation marks? Full of milkshake. My milkshake brings all the tech journalism. When's the last time we've seen There Will Be Blood? On the titles or the movie? The movie. Oh, I don't think I ever saw it. I was thinking of Drink Your Milkshake. You've never seen that, really? Oh, my goodness. I know that quote from that movie. But I don't think I ever actually watched the movie. Well, you know, I thought about it when Justin said that because I was like, ah, what a disturbing movie that was. But it's been a while. Like most Paul Thomas Anderson movies, once is enough. Like I can read a Paul Thomas Anderson movie, except for like Boogie Nights, which is like. I've seen, yeah, you're right. Magnolia, I've seen a few times. Boogie Nights. But that's also disturbing. But they're also long. I mean, that's the thing is I think the only movie he's made that was like actually regular movie length was Punch Drunk Love, which I think is is really good, but it is kind of a sad movie. He doesn't exactly make movies that I'm like, ooh, man, I got some extra time. What am I going to do? You're right. I love that. I love that. That's feel good. That's the vacuum today. Let me put on Boogie Nights in the background. Boogie Nights, though, I would say at least at the very least has very fun characters. And yes, they're sad. And there's then sad things happen to them, but you have characters that you kind of want to spend a lot of time with as great as some of his other characters have been. I don't know how much you really want to spend, how much time you really want to spend with them. Well, so what are we calling the show? Just out of curiosity. I was leaning toward Amazon Echo Show me how to sign. Show me how to sign. I like Echoes in the Echo Chamber. I like that one. That's good. All right. Echo Echo Echo in the Echo Chamber. Oh, Echo Echo. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So there will be blood. You should watch it, Tom. Maybe you and Scott can watch it and talk about it on our future. You know, I should look it up and see if it's in our top 200 films. I mean, it's a real sort of like opus of a movie, but not fun. No. And it was what I wanted to see at the time. I just never did. Yeah, it's also one of those Daniel Day-Lewis acting clinics. There will be blood. Yeah. In fact, I think I don't remember who I saw it with, but I definitely was in the theater and I remember us kind of like walking out afterwards and being like, let's get some ice cream or something. Really fun and lighthearted. Sometimes those movies, it's kind of just like watching somebody do something really impressive. Like if you watched like a one man band and a full symphony like came out of what they were doing, you'd be like, oh my God, that's amazing. But then the end of the day, you're just listening to some classical music, whether or not you were naturally a fan of it. So you're impressed by it. You're glad you saw it, but it's not necessarily something that you want to pop on again. And let's do like a film student. Film people, I get watching it over and over again if you're like into it. Deep remaining and yeah. He's obviously like just an insane craftsman. Yeah, it's one of those Daniel Day-Lewis performances where you're like, are you okay like after the movie? Like, are you out of character now? Are you good? Yeah. He really seemed like that crazy person. You know, method, I don't know. I don't know how they do that. Yeah. Well, yeah. And he's like, he's like the alpha of the I do, you know, I'm the method guy and I'm only going to. Yeah. Don't speak to me at Craft Services. Yeah. I'm in character. Oh, what was that? He famously, he actually only wrote with his left foot when he was preparing for Michael Day-Lewis. Daniel Day-Lewis, yeah. Huh. Like, so it would look natural. Well, it seems like the right thing to do. Yeah. Good for him. I don't remember that movie at all. That was a bit ago. I just remember the wheelbarrow. Yeah. I would love it if somebody like a basketball player, just to see if he would be able to like hang on like a court, like if he was so good of a method actor that he could like actually become. You guys, I had to, you know, I did a lot of research. Now I'm an NBA basketball player. Here comes George Plumpton. Yeah. I don't know. We actually got into throwing knives during gangs in New York. Like that character threw a bunch of knives. So I don't know. Yeah, that's right. I thought he had an axe too. Well, he was the butcher. So we threw all the butcher thing. You know, I remember. I didn't like that movie as much as I thought I would. No. I've tried to watch it a few times and I'm like, eh, what a gangster movie. I don't really like that movie. I saw that movie and I really liked it. I was just annoyed. Like I didn't, I ended up not caring about anyone. Like normally in a movie, you care about someone. And I was like, I don't care if you all fall into the, fall into the hut too. Kill each other. Yeah, I think Scorsese in general had kind of hit this point around like the 90s when nobody was ever going to tell them to cut anything out of his movies. And so he just, he kept making good movies that were probably 45 minutes too long and gangs in New York. I still think you re-edit gangs in New York. You could probably get a really, really, really good movie because there are really compelling performances like Leo's performance is really, really good. But it's just, it's funny because it's one of the instances where you have a really good cast, but it just seems to be shackled with a very plodding like movie. Well, guys, it's something where you're ahead of the story almost the entire time. Like everybody, like it's like, oh, I want to kill this guy. All right. Well, you're going to get in close with him. Okay. Remember the movie he made? Was it Waking, Raising the Dead? Or where he was at Nicholas Cage? Was the ambulance? Oh yeah. Bringing out the dead. Bringing out the dead. I wanted so much to like that movie. I liked it. I just like, I can't wait for the movie. Not caring about anyone. Bring out the dead. Although I liked him in, what's the one where he's just an alcoholic and he's drinking himself to death in Vegas? Leaving Las Vegas. Yeah. That's not Scorsese though. No, that's just Nick King's. In some ways, there's this similar feel that I get, but like I didn't care about anyone in Waking or bringing out the dead. I mean, that's, that's another, that's, I mean, Nick Cage is somebody that could be regarded as one of America's best actors if he didn't spend $13 billion per day and needed to do every movie on the planet always. Like Wilde Art was the first thing I ever saw him in. He was fantastic in that. Well, he needs to do it because he owes so much money. Yeah. I mean, like, look at like adaptation. Adaptation, he is brilliant. He is so good in adaptation. And what's that national treasure? So good. Journey to the center of the earth. No, no. So, so this is a thing. Oh wait, I'm going to get confused with Brandon. Sorry. They saw him. There was a literally like he would not turn down any movie role because he needed the money. Remember, it was the whole thing. Is that at Wives Tale or is that like? No, but like there was a point where he, he blamed it up on the mismanagement of his CPA or account or whatever. But he had to sell off a lot of his properties because he just basically owed a lot. I don't know that we know that that's all true. That's true. I just remember around that time, there was just a lot of movies with Nicholas Cage in them. No, he did have a famous bankruptcy that a lot of his over expenditures kind of came to light after. Who among us hasn't? Yeah. I've been bankrupt like seven times. That's how you become successful. But I had a jag one time. Yeah, I remember not to get political, but the bankruptcy of Donald Trump in the late 80s was the eye-opener for me like, oh wait, going bankrupt doesn't mean you're ruined. You can go bankrupt and still be rich. It's a way to keep your money sometimes. That's why you get good lawyers to make sure you move your assets. No, that's when I learned all about chapter 11. And it's like, oh, so your company goes bankrupt, but you're protected. And yeah. Let's see, file for chapter, is it chapter nine? There's chapter seven, chapter 11, chapter 13, I think. Yeah. What about chapter one? I don't know about that. We'll start at the beginning. A very good place to start. So here we go. This is a CNBC article about the craziest things that Nick Cage bought. He owns 15 residences, including the infamous LaLaurie mansion in New Orleans, which I heard in another interview he moved out of within 24 hours after he went on a ghost tour of his own property and deemed it too haunted. Wait, didn't he get it de-hantified before he bought it? Nope. He moved in because he was shooting a movie around there and then moved out. That's got to be a contingency, right? Yeah. He bought shrunken pygmy heads, a $450,000 on the late shot of Iran's Lamborghini. What? Another $150,000 on a pet octopus, another $150,000 on the first Superman comic. See, that makes sense to me. And he outbid Leo DiCaprio for a 7 million-year-old dinosaur skull at the price of $276,000. The artifact turned out to be stolen and Cage had to return it to the Mongolian government. Oh, Jesus. Why couldn't he just, you know, in the U.S., it's actually perfectly legal to dig out your own dinosaur fossils. You could just hire a group of people to go out to Montana. Why was the octopus so expensive? I don't predict the future. Very special octopus. It actually was like a tarot card reading octopus. That would be cool, wouldn't it? A great story, and that would be like your plot line. You would always look at the octopus. You would talk to it like a magic eight ball. Like, well, I'll be lucky tonight at the casino. And it's like, it would lay out the cards. It lets you know somehow. Isn't that what the... Was it Nicholas Cage sort of also, or is like, and has an Elvis obsession? Right? Isn't that like a thing about him? And then he dated Elvis. It was in that movie. Or was married to her. Is that maybe why he dressed up as Elvis? I think, I don't think I'm making that up. I think that's real. You mean Iran, Shah, man. He bought a deposed leader's Lamborghini. I guess if you have the money. Yeah, you get real bored. I would buy myself a cup of ice cream and celebrate. Well, ice cream last night, I didn't have to... Why aren't you special, Tom? No, that was kind of my point. You can just have all the ice cream you can afford. It's not that expensive. Well, Wikipedia says that Nicholas Cage's second marriage was to singer and songwriter Lisa Marie Presley, daughter of Elvis Presley. Cage is an Elvis fan and used the start as the base of his performance in World at Heart. All right. Well, thank you, video folks, for watching. I hope you had a lovely time. And we will see you again tomorrow. Audio folks, stick around. There's more to come. Bye.