 Okay, so this is the question I was asking, what you made fun aggravating? Biopic, Mark Mara biopic, who plays you? What's the arc? You can be a self congratulatory. I just don't, I don't know actors. I don't know the spectrum of actors, of the young actors. Shia LaBeouf, let's go Shia LaBeouf. Well, he'd have to tone it down a little bit, but I think he could do it a little bit. What's the arc? What would I like? Yeah, what's the, what was this? Like, I think there's something about whatever was going on at the comedy store in the 80s with Kenison and the drugs and stuff. And, you know, cause like I recently put on Instagram, these two pictures, there's a picture of me at the store with Sam lit, I'm out of my mind on drugs with my arm around him and he's like, eh, and you know, there's a little Polaroid. Did you have an actual relationship with him? No, I wasn't on the inner circle, but I was certainly a drug buddy for a while. Okay. Cause I lived in Crest Hill. And that's where I was like, he'd just go up there, he used it as a party house. And I was the guy that he'd give money to to get things set up. I mean, I was, but never the inner circle. And, you know, but there's a picture of me and him. And then I put that next to the picture of me and Obama in my garage. And I'm like, that, that arc is pretty good. Yeah. What is it? What's the story? What's the arc though? You, you have a want, then you get a need, man. Touch and go, dude. I don't know that that's it. I think what happens is, you know, I'm running on this sort of like angry, insecure swagger. And I'm, you know, and I'm busting through and I think I'm getting somewhere, but ultimately no one can quite get a handle on me. And you kind of know you're not breaking through. Like it's not like- Well, I'm just like, I know that, like, that I'm not myself. Yeah. The tone isn't quite right. Yeah, exactly. But everyone's sort of like, oh, you're the cranky guy. I'm like, I don't, this is who I am. It's not a character. Like I have no control over it. That was the weird thing- You don't even believe you're the cranky guy. No, of course not. I'm like the, I'm just me, man. I'm telling the truth here. Yeah. So the arc is like, how, you know, just what it takes to humble that fucker. And what is it? It was just a process of sort of failure of not, you know, of not, of having, you know, people knowing who I am fighting to get known, but never building an audience. And then ultimately, you know, ending up, you know, having to sober up, ending up having to give up on life a first time. But then meeting a beautiful woman and having to get sober and then ruining that relationship. And then sort of like the comedy opportunities keep coming, but no, nothing happens. I'm scrambling to make a living. I do air America, I do a fucking radio show. You think that was like my dream? I mean, it ultimately ended up, you know, teaching me how to talk on these mics. But that was a, that was a default, dude. I had nothing going on. And they had a lot of money that they were throwing away to get people to do this. I, it wasn't like, this is my passion. It was like, I don't think I have a choice. You know, I just got married. I'm living in LA. I got nothing on the table. These deals didn't go anywhere. So anyways, the humbling of that second divorce. What's especially humbling about that? She just left. And, you know, and she, she should have. You know, I was a dry drunk, you know, emotionally abusive fuck. And, you know, I didn't know how to be in a relationship. I was totally afraid she was going to leave me. She was stunning. And, you know, and I believe I loved her, but I was just horrible. I was possessive and crazy. And I was trying to be good, but like, and she got out. And I'd never had that happen for me, to me. You know, I just, that was just devastating. Cause she got Allen on up. I think she got, you know, involved with somebody more emotionally supportive and proper. And she left and it was for good. And it was like, it was devastating. It was just mind-numbing and heartbreaking. And it was the finally thing like, oh, it's me. Well, I don't know if I quite realized I was still fighting to get it back. And, but that sent me spiraling. I mean, then she, you know, kind of really hired a lawyer to destroy me. And I didn't understand how she deserved the house. You know, I bought the house. We weren't, you know what I mean? And I ended up, you know, you lose. You always lose. You learn a lot of lessons. And, and I get it all now. But no, at the time, I didn't know, I didn't know it was me. I was trying to be better. But then I almost went broke and she just, yeah. And that's out of that came the podcast. And then- The podcast is like a rock bottom. Totally. It's like a rock bottom that ended up being like- There's nowhere else to go. It was, I was looking down the barrel of, you know, a life as a hustling B-room headliner or a real barrel. Gun, you know. And I just started, you know, talking on that. You know, then, you know, it all came, you know, I'd gone back to Air America to do a streaming video show with the agreement that they would give me enough money up front to stop the hemorrhaging of the divorce. And, you know, I got more skills and it just, it timed out right. So then there was that and that starts. And then like, you know, then, you know, then there's the next humbling of, you know, Lynn dying. So like, you know, which was- What was the humbling of that? Meaning like there's, it's not a career one. What's the- Well, it's just like, you know, like, I don't know. Like I don't look at it as punishment, but, you know, Meshna leaving me was like, because I think I might have been a little borderline personality, you know? Like there was, it was very black and white thinking. It was, I was very sort of like, why me? How can this, you know, like, what do I, how do I? You know, and it was just, it just destroyed me for a long time. And so then when Lynn died, it was a whole different thing. Like that's a different kind of leaving. And it's like, you know, I'm older and I know we're fragile and I know I've seen people die, but you don't expect that. I really didn't expect my wife to, you know, when I came home, you know, sit me down and go like, I want a trial separation and never saw her again, really. And I certainly didn't expect Lynn to get sick and die. So it's just the depth of heartbreak of those two different types. I mean, fuck dude. So I don't know what the third act is. But who were you before Lynn died and who were you at? Like in terms of what was your outlook? Well, I thought like, you know, it worked out. You know, the career worked out. I met this woman. You know, she had respect. Well, that's what's funny from the outside end. I was like, fuck he had it. Yeah, right. Like this is good. I'm going to be good for the rest of it. Yeah. And we have respect for each other. Yeah. To work and you know, we can work together even and you know, conversationally and all this stuff. You know, she was, you know, a grown ass woman. Yeah. I had hope for the future and was excited about the possibilities and proud to be with her. And then, you know, you know, and yes, so you grieve like whatever the possibility. So who am I after? I don't know. I'm not, I'm not great. I, you know, I'm pretty, I don't feel like I'm actively cynical but I've certainly might still be numb somehow. Yeah. Cause you don't seem pessimistic. You don't seem... I didn't ask why. You know, I, you know, I didn't see it as personal. I didn't, you know, there was no why me. I was very clear on that. Like I didn't want to be seen as the victim. Yeah. And which might be bad in getting back to... No, I don't think it's bad. I, that's, I don't think that's bad. It's like... She was the victim. And, you know, and, you know, and I've, and I felt, you know, terrible about that. And, you know, and I was leveled but it has something to do with the love for, and, you know, what was it that like I'm comfortable with people loving, not caring about you but not caring for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But she cared for you and cared for me. Oh yeah, yeah. But I'm just saying in the aftermath, you know, I kind of, you know, I definitely couldn't keep it together and I was happy to be supported but I just wanted to be clear that like there was no reason it happened, cosmically. You know, I was not angry at God because I have enough practical sense of death after losing, you know, several of our peers and, you know, and knowing that, you know, it's all sort of a gift somehow or luck but I certainly didn't see it coming. And that was what made it just terrible. It was just a similar feeling of the type of loneliness and the type of pain of being that out of control. You know, like she died. I mean, and it was during the COVID, it was all, it was just terrible. But I don't know who I am now but I'm, I'd like to say that I have a deeper appreciation of life in a lot of ways and an acceptance of death in a lot of ways. Yeah, it's a weird compliment but you handled it well, you grieved well. But you didn't seem to make any like unforced errors about the interpretation of it or what it meant because it doesn't always mean anything. No, like I really had to manage my brain about that. I had a lot of things to do. I didn't know her family, you know, and I had all her stuff and I had the keys to the new place she had just rented and nobody was traveling. There was a lot of responsibilities that had to be dealt with to be in touch with people and to get things places and to, you know, her car sat in front of my house for weeks, you know, and, you know, her clothes and like it was, there's a lot of practical stuff that had to be dealt with. My brother came out and then I tried to get out of town and, you know, tried to have some sort of, I tried to keep myself in her eyes, you know, in her gaze, you know, because I think I was probably, like I was at my best, you know, in terms of, you know, the way she saw me, you know, and what she saw in me was really the best of me. So I tried to keep hold of that, but I think it might be slipping, but that's all right. I don't know. I don't know if that's true, man. I mean, I don't know what it's like inside you, but it's not, there's also something to be said for my sister's husband died. And she said, I didn't know if I would be able to care for somebody and I could. And that's what I thought when you were saying about, like doing all this stuff. Oh yeah, well that's where the codependency comes in handy. No, I mean, like, you know, you want to help. And it was genuine. And I think I can care for people probably more now. You know, because I think the one thing you left with is like, did I do the, you know, the short time that we were able to be together, you know, was I really the best that I could have been? You know, so like that, if anything, it's not a regret thing. But you know, she just, you know, got sick and I thought it was the flu. And you know, that week, you know, I was sort of like, oh my God, when is she going to get better? You know, like, what is it? And then like, she gets sick and died. I think it kind of feels shitty. Like, all right, I'll bring you some cereal. You know, oh yeah, right. But that's how we are with people who get sick, you know? So like, there's that little stuff. So like, I don't know, it made life very clear. And it also, you know, made me more attentive, I think, of myself and others. But it's like devastating. Yeah. We'll see what happens. It's like, here's some more. Here's a little something for your empathy engine. That's right. Like my producer said something along the lines of like, well, that's it. You've got your stripes somehow. Yeah. Like nothing is going to be this bad. Yeah. Again. I have a theory that like, by the time life is over, you will have been every person. Yeah. Like, oh, now I'm the fucking widower. Widower? Oh God. Now I'm the cheater. Now I'm the, sure, sure. That's like, you know, the spectrum of the flaws. How does this wrap up? I mean, that's the great question, isn't it?