 Welcome to this session. Super excited to have Alice and Joanna to talk about her new book, as well as the divin of time, how smart tech and AI can remake work for the better. Alice Avain is among the nation's preeminent writers and strategists on the use of technology for social good. She's the author of the award-winning Momentum Ignating, Social Change in the Connected Age, Matterness, Fearless Leadership for a Social World, and co-author with yesterday's speaker, Beth Cantor, the best-selling networked nonprofit. She's a member of the National Board of Women of Reform Judaism and was the chair of the National Board of the Neural Pro-Choice America Foundation, and a founding board member of Civic Hall. She also recently joined every.org as president. Alice, thank you so much for joining us. I want to talk to you about the book that Beth Cantor and I just wrote and why everybody here needs to know about smart tech. And I hope that coming out of this, what we'll get is a sense of how this next chapter in technology, unlike the last chapter, and I can tell you why, is going to make work so much better than it's been. So my work in tech for good is going on for 20 years now. And the reason why I do tech for good, I'm not a programmer, either is Beth. The reason is because digital technology has the potential to connect us to one another and to actually make us more human, not less human. And I know that feels like an oxymoron for people who are, say, stuck trying to get customer service or spending all day batting back emails and text messages to people. But that's the last chapter in technology. That chapter has us on average checking our email 74 times a day, right? That just put everything on super speed and supersized everything. That's not this next chapter in technology that we call smart tech. And I'm going to tell you what it is. So smart tech is advanced digital technology that uses enormous amounts of data, library of Congress-sized data sets to look for patterns within those data sets to make predictions. And this is the long-awaited artificial intelligence revolution. AI isn't new. It was, we started to really experiment with AI coming out of World War II. But what it is, smart tech is part of a family of technologies, AI and machine learning, voice activated programs like Siri and Alexa and the robots, of course. And this smart technology is automating functions within organizations. And so automation means when machines are taking over tasks that only people could do until just a few years ago. This is different than using a tool to write like word processing. We were writing before, we're just writing now using machinery. Automation is actually doing the job of people. And that's what makes this chapter so fundamentally different from anything we've ever experienced before. So why are we having this conversation today? Because we're at the heel of the hockey stick. Can you see that hockey stick going along the bottom of the graph there? And then it gets to the end and it starts to shoot straight up. We've been here before with technologies. This is very similar to where we were in 2006, 2007 with social media. There becomes an inflection point where that heel is formed where commercial products become much more powerful at the same time that they become much less expensive. So all of a sudden fundraising products, commercial products we can grab off of the shelf have artificial intelligence embedded in them. All of a sudden each one of us has Siri in our pocket or Alexa on the kitchen counter. And so these technologies have come into everyday people's lives, everyday organizational functions in what seems like the blink of an eye. And every organization is going to have smart tech, some form of smart tech coming into every part of it. This will be affecting fundraising and back office operations, particularly financial accounting. No more frantically trying to get the budget reconciled for the board meeting. It's gonna be reconciled in an instant every moment of the day. Smart tech is going to be interacting with the joints and clients on the outside. And we're gonna be talking about that just a little bit. And smart tech is going to have a really profound impact on how we're raising money and how we're finding donors to raise money from. So it's what we call, what Beth and I call an equal opportunity disruptor. But it's different from social media because we can't see it. This is technology that's running in the background all the time. Beth calls it the refrigerator just humming along in the background, which makes it super important that we understand and actually quite dangerous in some ways because we don't see it, right? Social media, you can see when somebody posts something, you can see when something goes viral, you can see when something goes off the rails. It's right there, it's very visible. Smart tech is in the background, which makes it very different from the last chapter. When we talk about artificial intelligence and robots, the presumption from a lot of people is that we're ready to retire all of humanity and the robots are going to take everybody's jobs. The robots are not ready to do that yet. Maybe someday they will, but we're talking decades out. What we call smart tech is not actually all that smart in some ways yet. It is smart in that it can race through mountains of data looking for patterns. But some of you will see in this picture, blueberry muffins and you'll also see chihuahuas. But the machine learning system that was tested on this only saw blueberry muffins, didn't see the chihuahuas. The amount of data it takes to train smart tech technologies is enormous and its ability to really discern differences isn't so great yet. And most importantly, smart tech is not ready to build human relationships, right? It's not empathetic. It's not going to discern sarcasm online. It's not going to be great at figuring out what somebody needs in that moment. What we're looking to do in this next chapter, and this is really important, is we're looking to create what's called a co-botting match. CO-bot, co-bot of making sure within organizations that we have the smart tech doing what bots should do and the people doing what people should be doing. And when we can get that really good match of having the technology, for instance, automating expense reports, I just spent many hours doing that this week. I would like that to be automated. Freeing up people to answer questions, solve problems, tell stories, then we're getting the best of both. And that's why Beth and I wanted to write this book, The Smart Non-Profit, right now. Before smart tech gets embedded in organizations, we want people to be thinking deeply about what does it mean to automate functions and how do we get to that sweet spot, to that co-botting spot so that we're getting the best out of smart tech and the best out of people. So what's really important right now is that we stay deeply human-centered in our work. That is why most people came to social change work in the first place. We wanted to make the world a better place. We want to help people. We want to build community. We want to solve difficult human problems. And to do those things well, our organizations need to stay human-centered. Back to the last chapter of computer technology and digital technology, right? That chapter just made us supersize everything and go fast fast. And a lot of the results of that was making people feel very distant from organizations, became hard to get in, hard to see in, hard to feel like you matter. People feel like they're cogs in the machinery. You're just one email address to an organization. And for the love of God, how many emails do we need asking us to give money? This is why I came to every.org which I'd be happy to tell you about another time. It is incumbent on organizations to stay deeply human-centered internally and externally. And by that, I mean starting everything that we design with fundamental questions about how will this affect our key stakeholders? How is this going to make people feel if we're automating part of their job internally? How's it going to make people feel externally when they're interacting with the chatbot online maybe as their first interaction with your organization? You cannot answer those questions without asking real people real questions. And so everything that we're designing in bringing smart tech into organizations begins with staying deeply human-centered and measuring that over time to make sure that we stay that way. So we know what the technology is. When Beth and I were looking to write the book, we began to find examples of organizations that were incorporating smart tech into their work and were finding that they had distinct patterns in what those organizations look like. They were, as I just mentioned, deeply human-centered, first and foremost. They understood the technology and understood how to integrate it into their work in thoughtful ways that they could scale over time. And then they were measuring that and reflecting on the impact of using smart tech on their work. One example in our opening chapter is an organization called Talking Points, started by a woman named Hiji Lim in San Francisco. What this organization, the problem it was created to solve is that parents of children for whom English is not their first language have difficulty communicating with schools. And the connection between teachers and parents is one of the most important indicators for future educational success for children. So Hiji began with a very small experiment. One teacher, a couple of dozen parents speaking many different languages to translate those conversations. And in fact, they first started to do it literally by hand, having a person make that translation in order to build their smart tech model. And they've been testing that model and building it over time. And one key aspect of smart tech is that it learns over time as more data comes into the system. And since this began in 2016 to this year, they are now translating over 6 million conversations a year between teachers and parents. And they're still checking many of these conversations. They have to make sure that they're culturally appropriate, that they are translating jargon well. And this is really a godsend for those families and these teachers to be able to have that connection. So in all of those ways, we really consider Talking Points to be a smart nonprofit. So what's the return on using smart tech? I've heard this question a lot from people. Number one, we're so busy. Number two, that last chapter in digital tech has felt so dehumanizing in so many ways. Do I have to do more tech? And why should I do it? The question, of course, is yes, you always have to do more tech. It's always developing over time. But the return on investment for using smart tech isn't about going faster. It is about freeing staff from all of the busy work or a lot of the busy work, the grunt work, as Beth calls it, of so many of our jobs that is dehumanizing, that is enormously exhausting, that leads to burnout in many places, freeing staff from those tasks that can be automated in order to have our people do those deeply human things. This is what we call the dividend of time. This is the heart of why we want people to understand smart tech well. So if you are a fundraiser and right now you're spending an enormous amount of time scheduling things and looking, doing research for prospective donors and trying to make heads and tails of all the data that you have. And so much of that can be automated now and they done in the blink of an eye, overseen by people, of course, creating filters that we want to make sure that the technology is doing what it's supposed to be doing. When that is done well, when that co-bottom sweet spot is hit, those fundraisers are going to have many more hours to pick up the phone and call donors at all levels to go out to lunch with donors to ask donors questions like why are we a cause that you love and how can we do better and what brought you here and what could make you be an ambassador for other people. It would be so much more fulfilling for so many fundraisers if their time could be freed up to do that much more deeply human work. I hope that makes sense. I'd be happy to talk about that more. I know through the pandemic that work and life were out of whack. The world was upside down, but work-life balance hasn't been great in the nonprofit sector for a while. I know Beth talked to you about this yesterday. Part of the hope we think of using smart tech well is to be able to make work-life much less oppressive feeling for people. That's kind of a strong word, but we see such a high burnout rate in the nonprofit sector and people just buried in paperwork, in busy work, in answering the same questions over and over again from their communities. Automation can free them from a lot of that, and our hope is that being freed will allow work to be much better, feel much better, and people will be able to take a deep breath, and I'm going to show you some examples of that. This is a topic I'm really passionate about. That's a leaky bucket, and this is about fundraising. On average, nonprofits are losing over 75% of their donors from year one to year two. All of that effort on prospecting goes to fill up that bucket, and it's expensive, and those donors are flying out the bottom and it creates this panic and stress to fill up the bucket every year, and it's just extraordinarily front-loaded. I didn't know about you. I have been on boards for many, many years, and I have never had a conversation at the board table about donor retention, and it's because of the leaky bucket, because the focus is so front-loaded, we've got to hit our numbers right now this year, so that means getting those 75% of donors back in the bucket. When we apply smart tech to fundraising, as I've just been talking about, of reducing the paperwork, improving the research, freeing the fundraisers to be deeply relational, our bet is that we're going to be able to plug up that leaky bucket, create more donors, more sustaining donors who give more often, and allow organizations to breeze a bit more. Wouldn't that be wonderful if we can do that, when we do that? Smart tech is a very complicated topic. I don't want to try to simplify it too much. The use of technology, having smart tech doing jobs and tasks that only people could do until very recently comes with real risks. The first, of course, is to do no harm. If your chatbots, for instance, aren't well-designed and you work in an area that could have huge human consequences of not being able to hear something well, not being able to hear when somebody's in harm's way or has a problem or needs help right away, you could be doing more harm than good by having that chatbot in place. If you're using smart tech for hiring, the chances are that product was built with racial and gender biases right into the code, both because the programmer put usually his own biases into the code, somebody has to make the code at some point, and then it was tested on historic databases because that's the only place where you can get the size of databases that you need to test these products, that, again, are racially engendered biased. So you've got a product that has been through two filters already of racial and gender bias before it's gotten to you. And this is where, remember when I was outlining what a smart nonprofit is? This is the knowledge part. You have to know that it is likely that if you are using a smart tech tool to screen potential hires, to screen potential clients for housing or food services, for instance, you have to know what to ask that vendor about how that product was created and how it was tested. And here's something I feel very, very strongly about. If you ask a commercial vendor how their products were tested for bias, and the answer you get is, our tech is proprietary. You can't look under the hood, right? That's what we own. My advice to you is go find another product. There are a lot of products out there because you have a right to know about what biases they've tested for. And if you don't have a partnership with that developer that is willing to talk to you about that, then move on. And then the final part is we are going to be generating even more data in this next chapter. I know that's hard to believe, but we are going to be even more data over your realm than we are now. We need to keep our staff, clients, donors, volunteers, data more secure than we have. For instance, the standards that the European Union have developed, the GDPR standards for gaining data privacy has a right to be forgotten by people. You can erase yourself from somebody's database. Here, in fundraising, our organization allows somebody to unsubscribe, but that is not the same as being as the right to be forgotten. I think we ought to raise the bar on privacy. We ought to be thinking about what our donors and constituents need and deserve from us, and we ought to raise the bar in the nonprofit sector. Okay, so now I'd like to run through a couple of examples of how smart tech is creating the dividend of time and being used by nonprofits. I'm looking at some of the comments. Extra Life is an annual fundraising event aimed at video game players and there are a lot of Canadian participants. So they created a chat bot to answer the question they get all the time, which is my donation being registered in Canadian dollars or American dollars. And there are a lot of questions about transactions that they were getting. And so they signed this chat bot, which was formlessly well received because you can imagine video game players, gamers really want to talk to a chat bot to get an answer. And not only did this save the staff an enormous amount of time answering these questions, it freed them up to be paying more attention to the game itself, to their fundraiser, and to celebrating what was going on in their fundraiser. So chat bots are really the first way that we're seeing a lot of organizations engaging with smart tech. There are a whole bunch of products for creating your own chat bot. You can do it through Messenger on Facebook. I don't recommend it, but a lot of people are using it. And it's just a really easy way to make sure your organization is answering the same questions over and over again automatically and at a time and a place that users wanted answered. When people complain about chat bots, like I didn't get my question answered, that isn't a technical problem. That is a human problem. It wasn't designed and tested well. So that's why you are going to be a smart nonprofit and you're going to become super knowledgeable about chat bots. And you're going to test them well before you roll them out to make sure that they really are answering the questions and problems that people have. This is one of my favorite examples. This is the National Aquarium in Baltimore. They had a development team in-house that was accustomed to working in a ridiculous amount of hours during the week and almost weekends and a very high burnout rate. They incorporated some smart tech products into donor prospecting and the first communications out to donors that can be customized to the interests of those donors based on what they have in their database. Other products are scraping data off the web to match people's interest to those first communications, which never go out without a person looking at them first. So you're not just automating that communication, but that combination of reducing time on prospecting and helping to get those first communications out the door did two really important things for the National Aquarium. One, increased their success as fundraisers. Hurrah, that's fantastic. But just as importantly, changed the culture of that department. They are no longer working 14-hour days. They are taking weekends off. People can breathe a bit. And when you're not as frantic in fundraising, when you have time to pick your head up and look around the world, you become a much, much better relational fundraiser. You get to know your donors better. You understand when somebody is beginning to lapse and you reach out to them more and you can hear what their interests are when you breathe, not just what you need as an organization. And we know that feeling so well. It's just pervasive in the nonprofit sector of fundraisers who are just always sucking the world in. For what they need. And because the job is so difficult and they are so super stressed. And we need fundraisers to be able to be in conversation with their people out in the world. So that's what the National Aquarium is doing with Smart Tech. We love the Trevor Project. They are providing online counseling for LGBTQ plus youth who are in trouble or feeling stressed. And what the Trevor Project did was they identified their exquisite pain point. See, Smart Tech is like hot sauce, not ketchup. You just need a little bit. You don't want to pour it over everything. And so what they found their exquisite pain point was that they had a lot of potential clients at Trevor Project, a lot of potential volunteers, but not enough help to train the volunteers to do this very sensitive work. So they created chat bots to help train the volunteers. Not alone, they're always people supervising the training, but by using the bots to train people and then allow people to practice their interactions with the teens before going live, so to speak, they were able to increase the number of counselors by a very large amount. And so Trevor Project has just done a beautiful job of identifying a very specific need for Smart Tech to allow their human assets to come fully into play and allow the trainers to engage with the teens in need. It's just a beautiful case study. As I mentioned, hiring using Smart Tech is quickly growing as an area of software development, but also is quite fraught in terms of racial and gender bias. This organization, you include, was started by two women of color who have created a product that takes into account all of the different ways that hiring is biased against women and against people of color. So they've created a Smart Tech product that is anti-biased by definition, by design, and they are growing very quickly. So if you're looking for Smart Tech to help with the hiring process and then with HR, we would strongly recommend that you take a look at Uinclude because they're just doing a beautiful job of making HR Smart Tech deeply human and creating that co-botting sweet spot. So how do you get started? That was a lot of content. I hope that you'll have a chance to read the book. It's full of stories. It's a nice, fast read. And that you will be thinking about how to begin to use Smart Tech to make your organization a smart nonprofit. In order to begin to get ready, you need to dig in the entire up and down of your organization. The C-suite needs to be intimately involved in this because automating services is, as you've just seen, I hope, a really difficult process that has to be done well. So this is not something... Smart Tech is not a software product to be sent down the hall to the IT guy to figure out. The organization really needs to be engaged in this conversation of what's our exquisite pain point and where and how could Smart Tech help us with that? The set in this equation is identifying vendors and products that meet your values, that are willing to share how their product was developed and can help train and support your staff. And then the go is to create a small project to learn how it's working, to see what the impact is internally and externally before rolling it out even larger. So that is what I have to present to other Allison. I would be delighted to take any questions that folks have. I know that was a lot of content. Hi, thank you so much Allison. That was really meaningful to me and I was just, I kept on thinking about how organizations could use Smart Tech to really strengthen trust and empathy with their stakeholders, whether it's their own staff or volunteers, but also externally with donors as well. If I just see a couple of questions on the Q&A, and I can address those first, I also have a couple of my own. Stephen, I think if I can just, should I can pull up the Q&A from Lisa? I'll hopefully do that. Thank you. So Lisa asks, this is a very specific question, but handling legal requirements while using GDPR, for example, with IRS, legal archive requirements, employees can request payroll information 30 years after employment. So this is a very specific question, but wondering Allison, if you have any answer to this. This is not my area of expertise. It really does apply only to organizations that are doing work in the European Union, but that is a place where you're going to need some expert, legal and financial help. Thanks Allison. I do have a couple of questions on my end. As you mentioned, fundraising is a very strong source or strong element for where smart tech could be of use. I think thinking of where we are at the end of October, we're really close to giving Tuesday, wondering if you can speak to a little bit more on the fundraising, since it was just brought up briefly, but I wonder if you can dial a little bit deeper there. So this is a topic I'm really passionate on Allison, and that's why I joined every.org, because we're going to be expanding into helping organizations pivot from being transactional to being relational fundraisers. So we have 30, 40 years of emphasis on everything going faster, as I mentioned in that last generation of technology, and what it did for fundraisers was emphasize acquisition over everything else, right? And acquisition is really expensive. If you are immersed in that spray and pray, prospecting, right, that's buying lists and sending out those emails and direct mail pieces, or not having enough good data on who might make for a major donor, how much to ask people for. It just becomes this crapshoot. And what happens is those response rates are so low, like you're looking at 3% is a good response rate on an email acquisition campaign, and you've just lost money on that acquisition campaign, right? The premise that all of this was built on was don't worry about losing money in year one from that acquisition campaign. Because those people are going to be with you for seven years, right, and you're going to make up that money on the back end. What we're seeing with the leaky bucket is they disappear in a second. And this panicked response is so painful to see. I've been doing this for a really long time. I don't think I've ever met a development department that isn't in a panic about meeting their, you know, their near-term revenue goals. It's just a broken system. It's just fundamentally broken. So what SmartTik can do is it can give you a much better picture of who your donors are, right? What they like, what they respond to, what they give to out in the world. All of those pieces of data that exist, they can identify prospects in the blink of an eye, which would take somebody weeks to do. And they can also customize those first communications to donors. So the Rainforest Action Network, use SmartTik to customize the thank you note and then the first communications to somebody. So it was a thank you that was personal, right? Thank you so much. We know that X, Y and Z is meaningful to you, right? Because you've exhibited that before. And then a story after that, again, that was customized to that person, right? The number of those first donors, Allison, that became monthly donors was eight times their usual number. I mean, that's just astounding, right? Just from that little personalization. Now, free up development staff time to pick up the phone and call people at any level and say thank you and say, why is this meaningful to you? And how can we do better? Think about what the potential is for keeping donors over time then. It does remind me of the engagement points and touch points you want to create with your donors. And that's, I think, the strategic and fun part for your fundraising stuff and how they would execute it, whether it is a phone call or an SMS text or other ways to really engage in the ways that the donor themselves, every donor is different, how they would want to receive that type of message. And in a way that the messaging is aligned with your brand, your narrative as in the mission of your organization as well. I think that's right. Let me just add one more thing to that, which is I mentioned at the end of the presentation right, development staff always breathing in. How much money can we extract from people? And my hope is that in this next chapter of organizational life and fundraising, they'll be able to not just breathe out, but really become very curious about donors. Who are you? Why is this meaningful to you? How do we make you feel? That's the question I want organizations to be asking that I haven't been able to find anybody willing to ask yet. How do we make you feel? Do we make you feel like a cog in the machinery? Or do we make you feel like a valued human? That's where we can go. I think of a lot of the AI, the big data around sentiment analysis. How do you ask the questions in a way and gather those metrics and get a better insight of your donor community? That's right. I'm also thoughtful around in terms of your, like in terms, because when I was just listening to your presentation, I've got to read the book and I'm going to purchase it today. But I was also really thoughtful around being able to invest in your staff. Like you said, having a breather for them, but also allowing them to be able to navigate the smart tuck in a way that's meaningful to them. So train in and being able to either train existing staff or attract new staff that have some sort of existing skill that they can share with you, with your employees. Can you speak on maybe how to navigate that a little bit or I don't know if you address it in your book. I haven't had the opportunity to read it. This speaks directly to Beth's talk yesterday about creating happy, healthy nonprofits, right? It is one of the enormous ironies and deep secrets of the nonprofit sector that our organizations have had. So many of our organizations have had toxic work cultures for so long, right? It's not something that anybody out there won't really want to be talking about a lot. People come to this work to do good in the world and too often they enter cultures that are underpaying them, expecting them to work ridiculous amounts of hours, be super stressed, have no equipment. It's dreadful, right? And it's heartbreaking. Smart tech is a really good fit, Allison, with the next generation of nonprofit leaders who want healthy work cultures, right? When we can free people from so much of the paperwork that they're just drowning in, right? So much of the mindless, rote work. We can be freed from that and we can focus on being deeply human internally and externally, you know, work changes and the ability to create happy, healthy cultures becomes much more doable for people. And that's really our hope is, and that's the irony, right? People here, Beth and I, coming with smart tech and people who had bad experiences with tech and bad experience with, you know, work life and imbalance are backing up and saying, no more. Don't come near us. No, no, no, that's not what this is, right? This is a chance to fix all of it. I don't see any other questions in the Q&A. So if you folks do a question, please pop it in. I'll kind of continue my list of questions if you don't mind. I do. We're a little bit over time, but we'll continue. I'm just brimming with questions a little bit here. In terms of the one thing I also thought of, as you were talking about identifying the right vendors and products that share your values, that you're able to ask them questions, are there any kind of not quick frame of mind that you would advise nonprofits when it comes to evaluating tech in a way that it isn't going to be the end all be all. It's not going to be the most perfect solution for you. So you have to meet in the middle or unless you build it your own from the bottom up. So I was wondering if you can speak to a little bit around evaluating smart technology tool and software, and especially as a part of an organization's digital transformation journey, especially during the pandemic. Yup, yup. So there's a lot in that question. You know, Beth and I have been writing about thinking of organizations as social networks, not as standalone fortresses. Then we came out with a network nonprofit over 10 years ago. And the one huge difference about thinking about your organization's social network Allison is that any expertise you need is in the network. Right. You don't need to have it on staff and so many organizations because they're so scarcity oriented. Just think of the people who are on staff as they're only available resources, right? So you have really smart people in your networks who can help you to figure out pain points who can help you to assess what kinds of technologies you might need. And smart tech really does require the C-suite to be involved. I can't say that often enough. You cannot outsource automating functions within your organization just to your IT contractor, right? This is so fundamental. If you're changing somebody's fundamentally what they're doing in their job. If you're changing whether people from the outside can talk to a person or not, right? Like applying for services. All of a sudden you're talking to a chatbot. That's a huge disruption in your organization. And the C-suite needs to be really deeply immersed in figuring out how to make that work and how to stay human centered. Staying human centered is so much more important than automating tasks. So that's what always has to come first and that's only going to stay front and center when the leadership is fully involved in this process. And also just remembering too around your point around embedded bias and the opposite of which is where can smart tech help organizations look to achieve their social justice values or the racial equity values that have been spoke upon a lot in past reviews. A very small question here. I'm going to take a look and see if there's any other questions. But I wanted to ask about because you just joined every.org as precedent. It also may be about if in your book or in your research, if there's quick smart tech tools or things that you're thinking about as you're going in or as you started doing your role. And the other half of my question be, are there any examples you can think of around smart tech as relating to maintaining a relationship with your board or ease your ways to kind of have that transparency or visibility that I think a lot of organizations just face when working with their board. Alison, you're the first person to ask about boards and smart tech. And I don't know that I know the answer to that. I'm going to have to think about it. Part of me worries that the last thing we want to do is push boards further away from organizations. But maybe if the leadership of an organization is not drowning in their work, they have more to climb to speak with board members and to share. But this is so fundamentally a leadership question that so many organizational leaders, I'm just going to say it. They're just so brittle when it comes to their board, they're so worried about board members coming in and micromanaging, which of course we don't want them to do. But we do want smart board members in to help solve problems. So if the leadership of an organization has this dividend of time, perhaps they can feel more confident about appropriately asking board members to weigh in on problem solving. Every board meeting ought to have a really significant problem that the board is wrestling with and helping to solve. And I forget what the first part of your question was. Oh, I was just thinking about, it's your new role at Every.org. Yeah. And the things that you're looking to implement or review. So I love Every.org. If you haven't seen their platform, please go look at it. It's a place to make fundraising super friction free for donors and for organizations. It's all free except for credit card fees, but we can move crypto and stocks, take care of all of the legal requirements, all of the financial requirements and get that money moving to nonprofits. And my hope for the future is we'll be able to help the nonprofits on our platform use smart tech to become deeply relational fundraisers. And I hope Beth will be helping us as well to have some cohorts and find some experiments. We're not quite sure what the, what the combination of technologies needs to be and the relationship between those technologies and the CRM. It's all complicated stuff, as you well know. But there are some models there. There's some putting of the jigsaw pieces together where we can help organizations do what the National Aquarium is doing right now and get their people being more deeply human in their fundraising, much more relational. And that to me is super exciting. Awesome. I'm also just scrolling through our chat and our Q&A again. Oh, this is a great question from Barbie. How do you introduce this to your resistance staff in terms of smart... This is all about change management, right? So every change is going to hit some staff members who are going to say, hell no, no more. I'm done. This is why we don't want to lead with the technology in our first interactions with staff. We want to lead with identifying those exquisite pain points because that's what people are feeling every day, right? So the exquisite pain point might be I can't get anything done if I'm, you know, front office person because I'm answering questions by email and phone all day long, right? And that could be where chatbot is enormously helpful or the accountant who is having to deal with little tiny pieces of paper all day long, right? If you started with we're going to automate part of your job, you know, most people are going to run away. If you start with we're going to release you from the pain you're feeling every day of being buried by paperwork or, you know, wrote tasks, then you have a chance of people coming along. It's also really important never to go whole hog in on a new technology. You need some baby steps. You need some piloting so that everybody can get comfortable with what you're doing and then grow it like talking points did. So you should anticipate you are going to have resistant staff. No question about it. But it's super important that this is why you are human centered in your approach to this. It's not replacing the function of them for you. It's evolving. Yeah. A great example, Allison, was some food banks, particularly in Boston during pandemic, the real height of the pandemic incorporated robots to stock the shelves, the food pantries. And to me, you could take that as a, well, after pandemic, we've just put all those volunteers who were stocking the shelves out of jobs or what else would those volunteers perhaps want to do that would be meaningful to them and helpful to the organization. It's an opportunity for a different kind of conversation with those volunteers. Like what beautiful for some of them. And I know it wants to everybody, but maybe some of them just pick up the phone and call people who are regulars to that food bank and just say, how are you doing? That's it. Just how are you doing? We're thinking about you and we know it's hard. How lovely would that be? You know, it's awesome. I mean, as you think of, you know, in terms of volunteers with disabilities, physical disabilities, you may not be able to do that one function, but this evolved function of a volunteer is now accessible to them. And when you move from that scarcity model of we're putting volunteers out of work to an abundance one of what might be possible for humans to do for other humans right now, right? Then we have a whole abundance of opportunities for people. I think I'm going to try to wrap up here unless I see any other questions. I don't. Thank you, Barbie, for that question. That was a great question. I'm going to pick up your book. I think it's available on Amazon, but it's also available. It's available on Amazon through audio book as well as through Kindle and bookshop.org. Oh, yes. That's right. Bookshop.org. Yeah. Thank you so much. We're going to give folks an applaud today. And of course, if you learned something, I've learned so many meaningful things, but please do share it with us on our Twitter hashtag future of work. Yes. Thank you for plugging that your love bookshop.org. Thank you for having me. This was great fun. Awesome. Learn so much. And please, everyone, do pick up a copy at bookshop.org. It's going to be, I think I'm going to pick it up just so that I can learn and think about more about organizations, especially smaller ones and how they're going through digital transformation. But it's so valuable. The request will be shared by November 4th. And as we said before, please do let us know through the survey that's pinned in the chat on your thoughts about this session and also just let us know via our social on Twitter as well. Thank you so much, Allison, for your time. It's been so great. My pleasure. Enjoy the book.