 A little bit about me. UC Berkeley graduate from California. And I study economics and history. Has nothing to do with tech except just live in the area and have a bunch of friends who are all engineers. And then ended up in tech after about five years of working experience in marketing and project management. And then so I'm now in a company as you're familiar with if you shop with us, called Guilt. So basically we were the pioneer of flash sale in the app world. At noon you will get a reminder that the sale starts for designers that are at really, really great prices. So I'm here today to really talk about how fashion has evolved over time and how product management has shaped the forces of that. As well as opportunities for the future to come. Okay, cool. Yeah, so that's my hashtag SHH233. And you can also contact me by way of email if you have questions later on. Guilt was acquired by Hasan Bay Company. So I actually, when I joined the company a year and a half ago, I started just working on Saks Fifth Avenue. And Hasan Bay Company, have you guys heard about them? I literally have not, except if you study history, they're the original Canadian fur traders with America. And you know, New York being close to Hasan, they were the oldest company that ever been in America. So that's really interesting. I work in tech, but for the oldest company in America. Cool. So with that being said, is there anyone here who doesn't enjoy shopping? Okay, I'm not sure why you're here. Do you want to tell me a little bit about your needs or what you're looking to get of the session? My personal needs. Yeah. Or why are you interested in this session? Okay, okay. Or how about a few others? It's okay, like I do not shop all the time. And I don't quite enjoy shopping all the time because sometimes I get lost and spend too much money too, as I'm going through user design problems. So please let me know if you're not so interested on the fashion retail side, I could talk more about product and tech. So perhaps a show of hands on, if you guys want to listen to more on the product technical detail side or the more fashion retail trend side. So first raise your hand if you want to hear more technical details on working in product management. Okay. And secondly, if you just want to learn how fashion is evolving with technology. Okay. Okay, the first one. So I'll go towards more detailed oriented approaches because I've known from my past talks that a lot of people prefer to not go into too many details. Sure, sure. Yeah, that's valid. So I woke up on April, 2017 and came up, and this article popped up in my Facebook feed. It came from Atlantic. What in the world is causing the retail meltdown in 2017? And then you see all these sort of store closing signs, everything's on discount. And just seemed like there's a meltdown. And I think it was also the time when Amazon acquired Whole Foods and Jets actually got sold to Walmart on the other hand. So you have this like big giant Amazon acquiring brick and mortar spaces to do logistics and actually reach out to customers. On the other hand, you have Jets which is purely digital play, commerce retail leader being sold to a brick and mortar traditional retailer. So it was like mixed signs of what's going on with retail and technology. So I encourage you to actually read the article. And there are three forces and three elements that were identified shaping this. The first and foremost is just really, everyone is going online in terms of shopping. And it's not just apparel but all goods that share commonalities. So including electronic goods, including anything that has really detailed products that are shared. I think like toys, if you have easy substitutes then you can really shop online without feeling the texture and the detail seeing it in front of your eyes. Second trend that was taking forces was just in general, Americans have too much mall space per capita, per person. So in Suburbia, where I came from in California, there's this great mall of America near Silicon Valley and literally it was gigantic. If you go on Black Friday, you have to wind up for six hours to go into any mall, any store you want. So it's just, there are too many malls and not enough sales to support all the capital that's put in there in terms of investment. The third trend is really how many of you guys are part of the millennial generation? I assume majority of them. I think we're in New York City. We're much more interested in acquiring and going for experiences than travel, dining out, hanging out with friends on epics, going Airbnb on the weekends. And we spend much, much less money acquiring cars, houses, and just like durable goods. So those are the trends taking place and it has an effect on consumer behavior and how we think about using retail and technology. So the growth of fashion and apparel category within e-commerce is really interesting. Within the entire category of e-commerce that's currently growing, fashion and apparel and also computer goods are rising the fastest. It's experiencing from 2013 to 2015 a 40% growth that's literally trending up. So we understand that actually fashion retail as an industry is growing and expanding. Then we look at the entire retail trends in general. So where is it expanding? Is it expanding online or offline? Because offline are the brick and mortar stores. So take a look at the 2014, 2015, 2016 multipliers. The light pink one is the total retail that's taking shape and online is actually at 2.3 multiplier of the total retail of goods. So you're actually seeing year by year online taking more and more out of the total retailing sales and volume and it's only exacerbating and also accelerating by year. So there's definitely an increase in consumer trends spending online because of conveniences because proliferation of access but also just it's so easy to return goods. It's almost free and you could buy anything and buy everything and just return whatever you want. So we actually see the return rate of e-commerce buyers much higher, about 50%, more so than people who pay the subway ticket, go into the store, talk to the associate, pick out the good and went home. So where is the growth in terms of online shopping? It's actually all majority contributed by mobile shopping. If you take a look at 2010 all the way to 2016, mobile as in mobile app as well as mobile web is started from just 2% of the entire e-commerce world in terms of the share and now it's really taking an entire ratio of 20% and more. So for Saks I can tell you we're currently trending, this is offline by the way, we're currently trending from 17% and really going to 21%. And same time last year we were only at 8% of the entire total business revenue. So majority of growth is really coming from mobile app and mobile web. Probably have to do with saturation of mobile phones everywhere. So how does the future brick and mortar business look like? Now that walk you through a good sense that online retailing is actually increasing and expanding, but then offline isn't really moving. So how do we use technology and product management to shape the future forces? I bet you guys came in or went through some really fun shopping experiences and one person came up to me to talk to me about AI and AR. Have you guys personally experienced any of those really great in-store experiences? Yeah, yeah, so shameless plug. Saks with Avenue Avenue in the Midtown location on the second floor. You could do a salt spa. You could go to the gym and do yoga there all for free. And also just a lot of AR is happening on the second floor because they're doing renovation. So they want to experiment with in-store space imaginations for the customer. So take a look there. We're trying to develop some concept from there as well as I know for girls, Reformation is really fun. I don't know if any of you guys are fans. Reformation store in Los Angeles, when you walk in you could actually pick out the clothes in the tablet and then have it delivered to your dressing room situated for you and you can even pick the lighting inside the dressing room to look at how that dress will look like in front of you. So that was a really good in-store experience that I thought was driven by technology. And another one that I really, really like is Rebecca Taylor, just in SoHo. You could go into their dressing rooms and create outfits of how you could first create a profile and then create outfits of how fashion and certain pieces will look like in terms of curation. So those are- Where is that? Saks with the neon? Saks Fifth Avenue is the one in Midtown and then there's a Rebecca Taylor in SoHo. Yeah. Yeah, so I'll just start going into some of the forces that are taking shape in terms of defining the future of brick and mortar. There's a lot of innovation that will be happening in the few years to come. First and foremost for Saks at least we're thinking of Omni Channel. What does Omni Channel mean? It's basically at every single touch point in which the customer comes in, whether it be voice activation, so like a Siri or Amazon Echo or Google Home, or through some kind of interface like app, like all your phones, we want to deliver the best experience to you in terms of goods, the physical goods that you're shopping for. So on Saks.com we started this merging of online shopping experience, but with offline merchandising pickup. You can now go to Saks.com, find if the goods is in your local store and then buy that good and then pick up in any store that you select offline. So you can imagine the use case that you're a customer and you're going for a party late at night and you need to find a dress. You don't know what dress to order and you just buy a couple, pick up in the store and try it on. So those were the use cases and sort of personas that were targeting and we understand that it's actually a huge advantage of having brick and mortar because currently Amazon and a lot of fashion retailers don't support the offline and online integration of merchandise. There's also Saks at your service which means that even if you cannot shop online or even if you cannot come into the store you could request a fashion truck. We'll deliver all your goods that you created online or you're interested in to where you are and this is free. So it means that really creating and meeting the customer where they are versus asking the customer to come in to where you are. So it's a really customer centric product driven approach that we're looking at and so these are the online experiences we're looking to innovate in. So I actually work on some of the project. It's a personal shop for service and we have fifth avenue consultants doing a due diligence on you. So for example, looking up your trend, Instagram profiles, Pinterest, if you have those and understand who you are and then they come to meet you at your door. So they will pick out outfits wardrobe based on your nature of the request and come to you. You could also request makeup sessions and tired makeover grooming anything you want at your service. Usually you so probably at this point you guys are like, oh, that costs a lot. No, it's actually all free because on average the people who request a service spend at least $3,000 or more. Yeah, so SaaS with Avenue, I don't know what type of people they are but the average order value is around $800 per order. Yeah, so as a product manager you notice that throughout my presentation I like to give data. Data is one of the weapons of product manager and you're gonna have a lot of people come to you in terms of ideas, oh, let's do this, let's do that. And then usually they have some fancy job title and you don't know what to do. So I always arm myself with data and I memorize the data and understanding the customer we're serving and I use that as sort of negotiating power and leverage to talk about why you're saying no or maybe you're saying yes. But even data really speaks volume because it means that you understand the brand DNA and you understand the customer profile. Which other tools you are using, is it analytics? Yeah, we use a bunch of analytics tools and it's a shame to say I'm actually using Omniture which I detest. The last time we use, it's only for SaaS. For Gil, we're actually pretty advanced, we're using Looker. But SaaS, there's a lot of data warehousing issues in terms of consolidating all systems. So we're currently in progress in terms of migrating from Omniture to Looker. But you could actually use Looker, L-O-O-K-E-R. Yeah, it's a really good tool that you should definitely be acquainted with if you want to become a product manager. Secondly, this one is really fun. Have any of you guys used Amazon Dash buttons? Yeah, so at your kitchen or somewhere in your bathroom, you have a button for automatic replenishments. It's almost as if these buttons are on autopilot and you're actually bringing the retailer's stores inside your homes and removing the human interaction layer. So it's really just buttons being an automatic replenishment, which is really interesting because you take out the human factor and you bring everything that you imagine and store into the homes of your customers. So these ongoing replenishments in terms of toilet paper or your dishwasher, detergent, all of that, it's quite fun. As well as Birchbox, some of these ongoing subscription-based models are really fun because it allows retailers to create productions and send to you on ongoing basis. Also allows for shopping discovery at a convenience and at a space that the customer is at. No longer do you need to go to the store, you could do it at your home, at your office, and socially share the box that you have. I really, I'm working on a service that's really comparable and competitive to Trunk Club, which is essentially having a personal stylist at your demand. You can have a personal shopper that really creates wardrobe and pieces or occasions and looks depending on your style or your sort of needs at the moment, any time. And it's quite fun, yeah. So I'm currently working through that. I'll show you guys prototypes. This one is the one that's the buzz of the artificial intelligence. I'm not the product manager for this. I had to pull these slides with another product peer of mine, and we're doing really, really innovating and exciting things. First and foremost is, for example, this is Anna Winter. She's sort of the fashion editor of Vogue, also the person that devil wears product is really based on. And she's a really fashion model icon in the world. So a lot of people aspire to what she wear. So now we're integrating this visual search technology where for anyone that you take a photo, we can help you find that dress online and shop. So it will, for example, I'm wearing this sweater, black sweater, you can take a photo of me and then we'll be able to pull up all similarly black sweaters for you to buy on your phone at any given time. So it's really a visual search-based algorithm that we're empowering and we're crunching through tons of data sets as well as machine learning models to get visually similar as close as possible. So we have an internal team of data scientists and that work heavily on this. Another thing that is currently already out on guilt, I don't know if any of you guys have shop with guilt, at the bottom you have visually similar items. This algorithm is developed internally. So we developed the algorithm based on a couple of things. Because you clicked on this dress, we analyzed that, oh, you might like black and white sort of patterns. So we look at these patterns and search it and then recommend it for you. We also hypothesize that you like soft textures, something silky and something soft, not something stiff, so we also recommended all of that. So this algorithm takes into account a couple of things. The silhouette, the texture, the cloth, the pattern, as well as the way the neckline lives and sleeveless. So quite interesting algorithms that you're able to do with data-driven approaches and machine learning. And this could really help inform retail because you can imagine with visual search, no longer do you need to be in a store to sell anything. Would the store space still be relevant if you don't need to have dresses there anymore? You can sell on the streets as well because any customer could now take a picture, check out an app, and they're done. So it's pretty, mm-hmm. I think it's determined what factors usually go past it. Yeah, yeah. So there are technical terms, for example, called entropy and likeness and probability rates in which we measure them. And I'm not the best probably manager to talk about it because that did not work on it. But yeah, we have an internal team of really capable data scientists that are crunching them. It's not a link to sales data, it's just linked to all the merchandise visual data that we have, which is quite hefty, yeah. On the back end, guilt merchandise merged with sacks-offit. So now you can shop all the sacks-offit merchandise on guilt and really expand the category. It also means that we have more data to make the algorithm more robust. Because guilt had limited inventory given that we're sort of flash sale provider. So things run out really quickly. Yeah. If the trend is coming or a change in trend, are you able to identify a fashion trend? Mm-hmm. And then integrate it with your technology or- Yeah, yeah, they're also doing that. Yeah. I mean, I sit close to them. So does group works, so you have a trend following group and technology work together or how do they, you know? They're part of this team called personalization. Yeah, personalization is a buzzword now. So most of the machine learning, artificial intelligence and visual search all come from there. Yeah, it's everywhere. Yeah, I mean, we roll out on web because that's where we can make the most business impact given that web is about 50% of the business or more. Web meaning desktop? Like, yeah, guilt.com. That's the way to upload this. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And then we're gonna roll it out to the app as well. Yeah, so it's called phased rollout because sometimes you do, in product management, you do wanna test. So for example, as a business owner, if you're bringing in 100 million and then you launch something and all of a sudden one day it tanks to like 50 million, your business owner that you work with, the partner you work with would probably be really, really angry at you. So to control for that scenario, we have a gateway floodgates to launch in terms of doing testing. So we will launch to 20% of the audience. And if the data metrics on conversion rate add to cart checkout is good enough, robust enough and significant enough, we roll it out to 80 and then 100%. Yeah, so it really depends how you think about launch and how you control for A-B testing and experiments. Yeah, it's pretty standard now. Yeah, but the visual search is the one we're pretty excited about. And there are a couple of things also, we're working on natural language processing, chatbot that I'm actually gonna work on later, yeah. Can I play this? So this is a little bit gimmicky, but it's AR experiences that it's kind of in concept. So you walk into the SACS store and then for all the items you see, there's a way to just feel it with those glasses. It's a little bit gimmicky and then checkout from there. So I honestly think this is a good concept video, but it doesn't really illustrate the ideal customer experience. And then you can imagine that one thing AR is really good at is generating buzz, but how does it generate continuous sales and also repeat customer visits? So I can imagine myself going through something like this and then telling my friend, oh, this is awesome, you should definitely go see it. And then you only visit once because it doesn't stick with you. It doesn't create those memorable moments of wonder and magic and then actually helping you solve finding that dress or that pair of pants later on. So AR is really great in terms of all the trends gathering forces is still at a stage where it's gimmicky and experimental and doesn't quite deliver in terms of the business value we need, which is the customer actually making a purchase and they're happy with and they check out. However, conceptually, as an organization, it's great to experiment. Yeah. So when you wear that glass, you can see the price of the product and everything. So it's a concept that they're working on. Yeah, we're not quite there yet, but it's always great to have innovative teams doing research and development. So you know what applicable learnings you can take away. Yeah. This one is the one I'm pretty excited about. It's a showroom concept. So come future state the day where you don't need to buy things anymore in the store and what is the source space still good for? It's good for the things that are like pretty expensive. That it's good for the things you want to feel the texture for and really get a sense of how that creation aspect come together as well as interacting with associates. So maybe I'm just imagining myself a little bit too much into the future, but if we really have a retail concept that has no human interaction, would you guys still enjoy the social aspect and like giving second opinion on each other of shopping? So yes, we still want you to come into the store, but it's really a showroom concept. We really only wanna bring in the best highlights of certain durable goods to show you and including we're gonna stock the stores with the best associates that are styling experts that could really create to you versus a salesperson. So that's sort of the concept that we're gathering steam. For example, in New York City now, you can go online, select a store and book appointments to talk to a style expert. You can meet with them and they will talk to you, understand who you are, and then try to have a relationship with you over time versus a one-time transactional sale. So those are the relationship-based hypotheses that we're looking to develop. And that's how we really imagine the future of retail to be. This is the Saks Fifth Avenue in Midtown on the second floor where they're waiting for a year of innovation. So they create this Saks Wellness concept that I talked about. You could do some salt spas, you could do gyms, yoga classes, a lot of fitness things that we saw the fashion coming together. And we're really launching to experimenting with concepts there. So coming all together, retail is really exciting in different ways. Retail will be very different 10 years from now versus the past couple of years we have seen. As I was preparing for today's talk, I saw a really, really interesting concept where retail, they start to imagine all their driving cars and that being a space of its own. So CVS, Saks Fifth Avenue, just like the Saks at your service truck, will stock everything in those trucks and they drive by to your neighborhood and that's how they deliver retail. So no longer, you can imagine the roads being congested and you can imagine retail being everywhere. You don't go to stores and there's no longer stores for you to go to. In fact, stores will only be showrooms where you cannot check out. Have you guys been to Bonobos, Warby Parker, Casper? So those innovators are that type of concept. They don't even allow you to buy and pick up things at the store. You have to wait a couple of days, order it there and then go home to try on. So those are type of concepts that I think future of retail will be coming together and it's really driven by technology. All the experiences that just shared are all technology-based and enabled and driven. Yeah, so I have some previous to show you on the product I developed. Do you guys have questions before I do that? Do you guys have questions for me as a product manager? How my role was in all these concepts and what I have been doing part of it. Uh-huh, uh-huh, mm-hmm. So what's your balance for Warby Parker? Yeah, yeah, that's a really great question. So the way I approached it was with data. For SAX, in general, I went to Omniture. I pulled all the data of all the sales happening, all the stores geographically. And then I learned that New York, in itself, consisted about 20% of nationwide sales. So naturally, New York, sales strategy will be really different from somewhere in Dallas, not like, you know, no offense, or like somewhere in Denver. So those are type of ways you need to think about product strategy launch. First, you understand your customer, where the sales are being driven, and then you align your product strategy to cater to those customer needs. And you wanna put money and effort and investment where you could have the most impact. Of course, the best retailers are gonna be defined by the perfection of 20%, but let's get to the 80% first, yeah. So those are the, if I had that question as a product manager and if I had a sell for that problem, that's how I would, that's what I would do. Look into the operational data and then craft a strategy to understand the customer base, based on the location. So regarding NFC and coupons, how do you look at it, you know, when somebody comes, do you do any post this thing when they are in that vicinity? We haven't really developed that much in-store concepts of like the local positioning of just the person in the store or around the store, but the reason why I was able to pull location data was purely based on the app locationing with the zip code. So all accounts have zip code, as well as on the web, we have your IP address, yeah. So we track everything, right. I guess as a senior product manager, it makes me sense to look at the industry, if you're looking at a more enter-level junior, who you'd be looking at similar things or would you be more focused on like very specific parts of the product? Yeah, so that's a really great question. Junior product managers tend to come in and work mostly around data or design aspects or like user experience research or marketing first. And for example, I myself mentor another junior product manager to assist me, but it's not like she doesn't perform at the same level I am it's more like I craft the high-level vision and roadmap and make sure it aligns with our cross-functional stakeholders in business, technology and design and operations because I have an in-store concept, so deals with all the operations on the ground level. And then we really work together on the technical details. So if we're thinking about phase launch, okay, let's start with New York, what's the second city, what's the third city? And then I'll show you guys the concept. For me, I'm actually building a two-sided platform. We can launch a service to the customers, but we have to train the associates. So I'm working very, very closely with the stylists to make sure that they have the right expertise, knowledge, device to sell through digitally because these personal shoppers, believe it or not, are not very tech-savvy, but they have expert knowledge in styling services and they're really good about customer service. So in order to launch a two-sided platform, you train the stylists and then you understand the customer experience. Yeah, so I don't know, I'm not sure. Go ahead. So when you have an invasion to have one of your banners like built and then you build one of your banners, do you guys think how to apply to another banner, for example, at the store in Taylor? Yeah, that's a great question, yeah. So... Sure, so her question was about if we have cross-learnings across different banners, different brands. So we have Guilt, we have Saks All Fifth, we have Lauren Taylor, Hussin Bay, and Saks Fifth Avenue. Saks Fifth Avenue is the stake in a house commands the most attention and drives the most revenue. Guilt and Saks All Fifth is on the similar footing in terms of brand identity because they're kind of off-priced, so we have shared inventory. And so the product managers are the same group structure as well. So at Saks Fifth Avenue, we have a team, I think of 15 product managers and for Guilt alone, for different banners, we have a director level and then we have senior product manager and junior ones to support that. So five directors for all top-level banners and then that's how we do shared learnings in between the banners. Having the directors talk to each other on that. Moderated user testing in person, so we offer you incentive, you can sign up today if you want. $150, which is quite a lot of gift card, you can spend with us if you come in for an hour of user testing. There are some screening requirements, so we do a lot of moderated user testing. I'm running some of it. And we also do user testing.com. To be a really, really good product manager, I would encourage you to sign up. You could do user testing for app, website, any brands out there and really learn what's good user experience design. You get paid, I think, $15 or 10 bucks for every user experience you complete. And then we also have a core SACS advisor panel. So these are ready-based community of users that love us and we reach out to them. So they're kind of the power users and they see how the product evolved over time, both the continuities and the large shifts of change. What's the product marketing team? Like, what's your leading with that team? Yeah, I do, but in fact, in my current role, I'm playing everything, yeah. So I'm actually... I don't know, like, distinction as much, like... Yeah, so product owners are in general, you could think of it as the drivers of the business. You kind of own the business, right? So if the product marketing team doesn't come to you with ideas, you still have to drive the activation of your service, right? So that's where I'm at currently. I'm actually coming to them with a plan and proposal and asking them if we can work together, yeah. And it's really fun. I'll show you guys. Maybe... Oh, go ahead, last one, and I'll show you guys three prototypes. So I had a question with regards to the AR. And why don't you show us a little bit of a demo? Yeah. And, like, I saw in the video, it's like when you wear a certain pair of glasses... Yeah, yeah. ...you can, like, see all these, like, augmentative realities versus the sport. Yeah. I'm curious, like, is, like, Hudson Bay, like, partnering with, like, any of us? Mm-hmm. Not that I know of, yeah. I mean, recently, there's a large piece of news you guys might have heard. We partnered with WeWork. So the Lauren Taylor marquee locations now being sold to WeWork. And Lauren Taylor is folding, collaborating with Walmart. So Retailer and Retailer actually collaborating on selling, which is quite interesting. But I don't really quite know much about the AR, yeah. Not part of that team. And a lot of it, we contract out to this other company called ThoughtWorks. And they have some expertise in that, yeah. So it's really for demo and experimenting more so than revenue-generating model already, yeah. So, I just wanna talk to you guys about having a more customer-centric approach. Sometimes at organizations, you get a lot of pressures from different stakeholders you work with. You can imagine the CEO, CMO, blah, blah, SVP. And a lot of the product decisions are actually very business-driven. But sometimes you lose sight of the customer, which is the end person that will use your product, tell other people how much they love your product or hate your product, and then create loops of evangelism or feedback from there. So I just wanna make sure you guys understand having customer-centric approach is super important. And that's really how Amazon has thrived this far in terms of Retailer. So we created this concept video, which is essentially allowing, did you guys see that? Should I replay? Actually, let me just skip to your. So this is a service I worked on, which is about personal shopper at your demand in the app. So it's through chat. You're chatting with a stylizer. So we created this video to train stylists. Basically, high-level concept is we wanna expose the ability for you to chat and check out and talk to a stylizer any time at your choice and shop at a time and convenience that you want. And the stylists could create to your demand as well as help you with putting together a look. You saw that dress, and then the stylizer picked out the shoes, blah, blah, so forth. So you could have a continuous relationship that's based in chat. So it's an extension of the iOS app. If you go into chat right now and tap on the, I don't know if you guys can see this. If you guys go into chat right now, there's a blue icon, which is the app store for iMessage. This blue icon right next to the camera on iOS 11. Tap on it. If you have a Saks iOS app like me, it will pop up and we invite some existing customers of stylists to participate in the program. And they will start chatting, selling things with each other and create wardrobe looks with each other. This is really part of the effort to help stylists in stores to have more revenue. So all associates are paid by commission. However, you're fully aware, not a lot of customers are visiting the stores. So we created this concept and it's now in the market. You can download that for associates who sell to customers more easily, chat with them more easily, and meet them at a platform where everyone is sending emojis every day. This is available right now as a customer. You could create a gift list with each other. For example, you could ask. For everyone right now in the public, you guys don't have access to a stylist yet. You can talk with each other, customer to customer, peer to peer. Great question. So we are currently doing IP targeting and only targeting New York. We're gonna do nation one launch later on. But as I have said, I pull the data of all in app sales and we noticed that New York in itself, three stores or four stores in New York, Downtown, Brookfield, Midtown, and also Walt Whitman in Long Island contributed 20% to stocks overall sales volume. So we're launching with New York first and we'll gather learnings enough that we scale nationwide. Yeah, so one aspect of my job, which I absolutely love is that it's not just software development, it's also operations. So I'm helping out with the training. We're creating Google site and a video as well as webinar workshops for all the associates to participate. And I personally am traveling to all the stores meeting with all the associates to understand their pain point, their needs, whether they find this useful. So we could iterate on the product later on. And it's quite fun because sometimes you produce software and you don't know what impact you're making. I mean, you see data, but you don't see people. So the operational aspect is quite fun and to hear the life of the stylist. So for example, the other day I was downstairs and a stylist told me, oh, Kendall, Kendall Jenner, reach out looking for a unique piece. That was like something $10,000. So I was like, oh, interesting, you're actually texting with Kendall. I was like, oh, okay. So things like that don't come by easily and I find it fun as part of my job experience perks. Also Fifth Avenue Club has a bunch of associates that work in tandem with fashion designers. So the other day, Alexander Wayne came in with a preview and private trunk show for a million dollar customers. And that was quite fun too to understand how the stylist would sell digitally versus in person. So we can think about it for future iterations of the product. That being said, I hope that was insightful for all of you guys.