 We're glad to know that you're still there and watching The Breakfast on Plus TV, Africa. Right now we're being joined by our guest, Mr. Tunde Kolaule, a legal practitioner who is here in Lagos, and we're looking at some of the papers that some of our national dailies and we have The Punch, The Guardian, and The Nation newspaper this morning, and we could also bring headlines from other papers if we have the time. Good morning, Tunde Kolaule, and welcome to the program this morning. Good morning, Mr. Gorgonis. We're starting this morning with The Punch newspaper. The Punch newspaper is, I don't know how I can, The Punch newspaper leads with a tenable panel, okay, multiple taxation. Tenable panel asks governments to drop 190 taxes, OPS blames states, okay, that is the leading headlines there. Let's begin with that, Mr. Kolaule. Well, the truth of the matter is that all the banks that we have done in the past, we are waddling work because they are unable to kind of police our borders, and also the security agencies are finding it difficult to ensure that things are properly done, okay. Then because the people are missing, let's hope that this time around the government will be able to get it to a light. Because if they don't get it right, the consequences can be catastrophic. But the number of taxes that they have been asked to drop, that is really a big number. So how will that work when this government wants to mop up everything to make sure that they make money? The government can be seen as even law. It's effective in this respect that it is realistic, you know. We have the situation in which most of the citizens are now in a lot of poverty. The companies, too, are also in love. And the revenue that we get from particular products are also not as forthcoming as we used to be. So it is near the economy, by and large, that are productive activities. That is where this transition came from. In both the multiplication from companies that are now that have been affected, the answer is no. So the companies that may pay their taxes, if they are doing well, if they are making profit, if the business environment is conducive for them to be able to thrive. Because today the people of the United States, the economy is in jambos. And so corporate taxes, corporate taxes, attachment and contractions are really difficult to enforce in this kind of an environment. So if the economy doesn't want the way they do to work, I don't see all the tax policies by regime of the government. They are going to be taking their work. I doubt it. So we move to another headline that we have here. Senate Probes 11 trillion Naira refinery repairs summons Kiari. We are going to look at why we are going to look at this. We are working to do new contracts. But we are only looking at the refinery. And we are not going to realize why we are doing that at the end of the time. And why does the government not need that to be incoming at the session? So as to ensure effective supervision and work on this. But the government isn't listening. And the ones there are aware that I'm aware that they come to us. And I think the issue is the deadline in which the refinery is prepared to be completed. These are the same Naira firms. They are fast. And those refineries are still not working. I think the Senate will be right to introduce on the proof of what happened to the three years of Naira, a thousand times, to overhaul this refinery. But the bigger truth is that people want to remit it ourselves. The very time elections are coming, or the government needs money, or the individuals and government needs money, or something like that. That is when they remember to repeal to overhaul the refineries. That is when they also remember to maintain the Tasmanian beach in Lagos. But remember when the methamo is ready to have another election, they are ordered to give a jimbo contract. But they repeal to the Tasmanian beach in Lagos. So if we are left off it, some other government has come after him and also awarded contracts for the maintenance of that beach. And we will return the idea that if we continue to go, the present government will also change the jimbo maintenance from the Tasmanian beach. So it presents us in the era of the refineries in Lagos that we see all these beneficiaries with top accords for millions of our lives in which contracts are awarded and they are never executed. So the question we want to ask is if we make it ready to work in stock, is it ready to be a contractor? Is it ready to grow the MNPC? The other MNPC is connected to the contractor that was awarded for the maintenance of that refineries brought into the MNPC. If it is the citizens of the MNPC, it can be the National Assembly. If it is the constitution, it is ready to work in stock. Remember, it was even when the present MNPC was I think a rich amount of MNPC or a rich amount of MNPC development commission that was an issue of the water that was happening in that area. And then there are two new shops that could be built now for somebody to work in MNPC because the MNPC now has these other things for the MNPC to start. But if it is the MNPC it will be the one commitment of the contractor that will come into the MNPC, MNPC, MNPC but also in the MNPC sector. So if the MNPC is also a member of the MNPC it will also be involved. So this time around MNPC and some of these refineries coming to MNPC I don't see how this MNPC will be able to get in to MNPC from the repair of the refineries. It's a complicated issue. Which means Nigerians may just say goodbye to that probe because we're also wondering why they are just talking about the refineries now. Everything is just interwoven and NDDC was chaired or was led by Akbabiu who is trying to probe like you have just pointed out and you have said that they may not do a very thorough job. We also are wondering what happens to the airlines, Nigeria Air whose logo was contracted to a foreign firm that did the logo and they spent millions of Naira on a logo that could have been done in Nigeria. We're also wondering what they're going to do about that. Well, they've already been asked in the past to off the mic. I don't know how many more mics they're going to off right now and the people will forget about it. But we have something that you know some people are saying well it's a good start, a good sign that the future might be good because the EFCC chair has ordered the staff to declare assets. That was done yesterday and some people are optimistic that if he has done this because he even said that he has declared it and the secretary has also declared it. So everybody from level 17 downwards needs to declare their assets so that they can live above board. What is your comment? Well, it's a good directive that all staff of the EFCC should declare their assets. There is nothing that if any of the people remove the logo and some other people say fine if you remove this logo it's false and we also say that if the president is able to enforce public elections I think it will be a good policy it will be a good direction to live to do. So that when some of these staff has had issues we have a benchmark that needs to be made to declare assets that they may have a community before the declaration of the asset and after the declaration of the asset. But our experience has shown just like the group we are talking about the leader of the group but people in this country have a way of manipulating the asset declarations we have seen this in the past we have seen so much in this country we have managed to have declared assets in the administration of properties and services and moving to end the case we might be acquiring people and people are smart enough to be doing an integrated declaration of assets sometimes with a deeper what the declaration of assets leads to sanity leads to integrity leads to corruption in some of these public places. I think in fact the declaration has become a new editorial in the public office made to do that also satisfy all the journalists and I do know how many people have been convicted taking to the code of conduct brought to the regular courts who I mean have been convicted based on the creation of assets very very few the events of my knowledge but I'm going to let you be done so that in case there are issues in future to reach any visit whatever assets some of these women the criminals are fired to the future these are some records of what they have declared I don't know how they are going to do that because if I go to my village now and I'm buying land 500,000 Naira and I want to declare my asset I could decide to give the price that is obtainable in Lagos state maybe that same land of 500,000 Naira I will say I will say it costs like land in Banana Island or there's no way of catching me well my worry and the worry of a lot of Nigerians is that as we've said several times on the show and elsewhere we like setting up panels to probe some things and after that we get very beautiful reports that never see the light of day we've had so many examples that we cannot even begin to mention here right now the question is how do we begin to get results from all this probe that we've been doing what can we do differently apart from just setting up panels to mitigate and it never sees the light of day is a very bad idea and that is why we want to comment if a good country can be chosen because there are going to be people that are using the snubbing badly implement it other than put everybody in the same bad place in the future the future that we've done in the very sectoral manner we could ask the universities to implement a good country that can give us a better result and we would like to do this because we don't have a kind of a very good example because it is very difficult for everybody we can do this we have to in our case in the face of this But no matter what the program is, I take that to good and bad. Human identity is something that can make a lot of people. As soon as you want to be able to create a kind of balance, you don't have to come back with me. We should be prioritizing big groups, the only thing, and then continue to encourage the children of the youth to see corruption as a matter of fact. And that in big groups is very important. If you're doing half the thing out of respect for the rule of law too, in some of these big groups I know that the government, the government policies are more than two feet of ground. You'll never be taking the wrong time to circumvent these things. Those days I remember when primary secondary school and now that the youth have been both of teachers, civic education, and with the property being, everything, honestly, and what we are taught. And not to show that those things are the civic education. We've been taught in our schools again, not like the people we used to. We've been behaving like people of no part. We've been taking civic education also out of the curriculum of our schools. We've been giving those things and know that. And then also ensure that the policies of some of these public spaces are not as lucrative as they are now. We have new rules, health and sovereignty in some of these areas. Okay. The House of Representatives has faltered the CBN's Forex Ban lived and NECA is kicking against it and saying that these things were not banned in 2015. But the fact of the matter remains that 43 items that had Forex Ban have been cleared and now the Forex Ban is no longer there. So they can access these Forex and import the 43 items. And people are asking if this is being done, how is it going to help in the campaign for the consumption of made in Nigeria goods? That's a very dumbing question that I've asked. Do you remember that in the past? I don't even know whether it's also to give us a now-now-and-still adaption time that saw this policy of indigenisation from the city federal government. The state also copied. Adaption time. There are certain businesses, there are certain goods and services that were supported to these localities. And we cannot access all in exchange to buy from abroad. And with that, a lot of local industries, local labour, thousands of labourers and workers can go for that building time. But surprisingly, some people also saw the idea to the federal government at the end time to keep indigenisation policies. To collect. But when the indigenisation policy was in there, all those holy countries like Cadbury and World of Turnip and World of Europe, they were headed by Nigerian CEOs. And with that, the country had to leverage for what is being done in some of these companies. So the immediate need to access indigenisation policy was to do that and know that. The expected CEOs to come and then know manners of people now should begin to engage with businesses that ultimately may should be desired for the Nigerian people. So for example, what business has somebody from India got to do to come to Nigeria to break bread or to start disability confessionaries? What business of this biennial could possibly be done in a sense that somebody wanted to import too quick into Nigeria? The key of the matter is that there must be one form of restrictions of the other if the economy is going to work well. You don't throw everything into a way and manner you have to be taken. Especially when the resources are not there. Look at the count of champions that is being important to this country. You need to know some of this in the final history. Some of the people that decide in Nigeria today have been important on my part. You need to know that they have cast restrictions. Cast restrictions are important to this country. What? If the ban has been, I agree with you Neka that the ban should not have been the same as in the ban in India because it would have been better to extend the ban to so many things. The meeting of the ban that they have done now doesn't pay. So now in good opinion we hope to meet you and meet lots of all manner of things. Not only may we shouldn't be locating, we can't fall in the same to the point of the country. One good example is the tip of it. Which means now comes from abroad now. When I'm not very comfortable in one of the small corners of this country with the positions that we have parted in it. I'm just going to answer in the details of the matter when we are back in the country. I'm just going to say to the people to the rest of the world that we have all of the difficulties. The problem is from this policy that they have now in bad opinion we have to meet with the countries as it has a direction we don't want to put in a general environmental. And if they are confused they are not clear what the other should be doing. Then that would be very difficult to be worked on. If we go to the nation newspaper it's almost the same headline we've already talked about. Federal government unfolds forex, tax, jobs, investment policies. And the rider is 260 taxes to be slashed to single-digit merging of BDCs forex, albs, dealers into official effects market and all that. But we have this I don't know how disturbing it will be to you because it is very disturbing to me. All thieves deploy CCTV motor lunches along pipeline routes. All thieves are the ones now deploying CCTV which should have been deployed by our security personnel and all that to watch and see how these people are vandalizing or stealing our oil from our pipelines. But the thieves now are the ones deploying the CCTV to look out for the security personnel that might be in one area or the other and know how to avoid them and then to steal our oil. How do you feel about this? For me it's really disturbing. That's like I said the last topic I think before this one that the media people are very creative to their geniuses that media people are blocking only the tool to be able to create another one. This only absorbs the very good example of that engineering that community weighing the media people are doing in fact too. The truth of the matter is that whether they deploy a CCTV or a motor luncheer or they take up more time to deny that data to the media to steal oil and water it is through the government and the security people in the country that we should be in. Of course when we steal oil either delivered on the runway or package on the pipe that is supposed to be delivered to a ship that is battered in the application. When we take this on guys in India we take it through some talks on the way to be able to really reach the end of the earth on one point together. So that is the case and we have all manners of security where there is no complement of security and we don't have any effect of whether the media is there the media is there the civil defense is there because the civil defense is created to protect the country from the sector and all that. So through all this is actually happening because of the layers of the layers of security that we have in that place we should know that something like this may be individuals are behind some of these things and that the government itself is not sincere about ensuring integrity in the earth sector simply because there are not a lot of people benefit from these massive chances of taking place in those in those places. The people in the camera the mental manager are not leaders that cannot be easily seen when they are being installed and the citizens also have the right to go and start to do the camera that is happening and most of those who are going to take the leader what I am going to ask among the pipeline leader and Laura people to talk to the citizens they would have reported something to the government, to the police to the security people when they are being asked for being recruited for being asked to come and install those things but the country is a no more land everybody don't do what they like where we see the political reports to that are also that we see around them to turn the blind eye from the dead pair to some of these things forgetting that whatever happens in the land sector in the settlement sector directly accept all of us as the people of the nation because of the lack of 200 million leaders because we are going to all of us we will not have our authority to report medicine giving the clearance taste the lives and work of you to make a mention that cuts down news in order to describe themselves to be strategic but if I were the president I would see you as the security chief the country for this kind of thing that she said that the people are reported to now find in the United States or in the oil area the next question you want to ask is what happened to the leaders of non-advocacy pipeline protection and wayward protection the contact that were awarded to some of the United States Americans could it be that they know that the United States are managing it that they get contact to protect the pipeline and the oilways and all that and also maybe the police called the leaders directly involved in the feeling of the war all these things boil down to this issue because of the people across the world whether from the level of citizenship or from the level of the senior or leaders in the different types of government from local government to state government because in some of these places I see the cameras are being installed and both our mentors are being deployed there is a local government in India there is a council over there there are a few fields of politicians in those places I know that there are problems in some other places in some of these places where are all these people and all these things and people in this and I've come back to this idea before that we need to we need to in kind of invoke in contrast we need to all the leaders who shine in monotony and corruption and certainly we are not enough of this because the country is not going to change we are not all doing things right because the Indian people do not give up and it works for them all the leaders of all those who matter as leaders among themselves as they are not engaged in any of the recent parties they take because they tend to undermine the economy and the quality of the Indian nation and then from here they began to move forward and the economy began to go they also went back on their commitment to those monotony and corruption there were few policemen that were speech to them when they are caught from breaking the work they are taking not to engage in any recent practices that affect the economy that affect the mentality and that undermine the nature of their citizenship that's my take ok so very funny it really is very funny when you see that the thieves are the ones doing what they should do it's like you have a house and then instead of you buying a a guard dog it's the thieves that are now buying the dogs to come and drive you away from your house it really is funny and scary it's very disturbing to some of us these are things that the security should do they are not doing, the thieves are doing instead now to political matters more or less US court rejects requests for FBI's report on Tinubu these are very interesting times the numbers you can read is as well as those of us who are who are lawyers to be trained from commenting on these things and I don't know if I can say something that can be heard and try to be in these kind of situations to be understood and to be able to hear from the authorities and to be able to understand these other situations and to think that there are I thought whether it's going to have any effect on the consequences, on the case that if a person is before the Supreme Court, they will be able to do what the court has before you start to put your name in that keystone wall of yours. It's also a reminder that the law in America is different from the law here in Nigeria. However, like I said, the President, in terms of the absence of morale, they're voting to bear. If any other media report is released about him, I don't see it as a very serious consequence. I think that's the word which people might come up with in the opinion that he's not before the Court of Justice announces that I'm very serious and moral defeat. It's what they call a, is it a fearing duty or firing duty, victory rather, when you have a victory that costs you more than if you had even lost the battle. Okay, we'll move now. Okay, before we move still on the national newspaper, we've seen one of the headlines there and it keeps occurring. The Senate defends, the Senate defends the 160 million Naira purchase of the SUVs for senators. The senators are defending it. Directly, it is read, it reads, Senate defends 160 million Naira USV for national assembly members. 160 million in this time. Please, let us know what you think. And also to the place of one of the 20 of us who, when the people are rioting that there were no beds to eat, to lose their fans, the wife of the Emperor Semejan Grand, which cake? We forgot that it is a flower that is used to making bread that is also used to bake the cake. The truth of the matter is that the people in the National Assembly are the regular politicians paying panniers to the people of our people because they know they don't depend on us to win elections. And that's why they are smoothing themselves or even turning to office. We are powerless to call them back up to the motion. He picked up in the National Assembly that we are living their own devices ways are made and we are powerless to call them or remove them from there. Why would they be difficult to use and cry? Of the other politicians, not so the people back on themselves, very pleased with one of our 15 million Naira. They are happy when the other politicians, when we have not been able to provide them with other politicians, the bag of life, for others, for others, we are living them with the one on top and then expecting that to be a little bit younger and then by Mr. Baty in our midst. Well, like we said before, now this is going down to discipline. It's also going down to this for I don't care what they say. Let them make noise from now to eternity. That is never meant to have anything of consequences or damage for other people. To look at this, that in some other countries of the world, some very great like this would be enough to bring down a government, especially given the challenges that they were all facing and they're making now. Every day you open your hands, you are going to pass. You find people hungry themselves because they are making to feed themselves. You find people sending their own children, sending their own babies because they couldn't be out of it. You find those guys now, making of iron, making of their lives. For some other people to see this, some of them believe that whatever they're able to get from the mass, they need to take care of the houses and all that. Our people, our people that deliver to that level, are trying to now get in the country. Like you said, the best thing about accountability is that people don't be left to deliver to the United States, to the United States or to the police or the men to report and ensure. If politicians are not doing the right thing, no matter what law, people can not just be given to protect, they can come back to the national assembly, to the national assembly, or recall them. Okay. Sometimes it's really difficult to talk about these things because you can just flare up and be angry about the way things are going. But it's unfortunate, this is how much we can go today, Mr. Akola Wale. I would like to thank you for coming on the program this morning. Yes. Okay, we've been talking with a legal practitioner, Mr. Tunde Kola Wale. He talks to us from Lagos State here. We'll take a very short break and after that we'll be joined by Nika Gule to be talking about the problems of housing in Nigeria and how to solve them. Stay with us.