 His games are timeless. His positional understanding unmatched. He is one of the greatest players of all times. He became world champion in 1975 and went on to dominate the chess world with his super tournament winning streak for over a decade. I'm delighted and in awe to have with us here at the Gibraltar Masters the 12th world champion, Mr. Anatoly Karpov. Welcome. Thank you. Anatoly, first let's start with what it's like to be in Gibraltar, your first impressions? It's an interesting place and I think chess players are delighted to play here at the corner of Europe and for many years already Gibraltar became one of the most important chess centres in the world. Right, and now you started playing chess when you were four years old. Right. It's been a long journey which continues. I have to ask you, what is it that you love the most about the game after all these years? I was growing up as chess player and at the age of 11 I became a candidate master in Soviet Union and then I was the youngest national master at the age of 15. I just like to play chess and to produce some ideas and results became important but much later. First I just love to play and to compete with people. And growing up were there masters you idealised who had a very big impact on you in your growing up years? I think Kapavlanka was one of the most important world champions for me and I studied his games and a book. It was a good book about Kapavlanka games written by international master Vasily Panof, Russian author. Yes, it was quite strong influence of Kapavlanka's time. The most exciting is all the world championship matches that you have played and I want to start with the 1975 match with Fisher which did not happen. Do you remember the first time you heard about Bobby Fisher and what was your feeling about it then? Of course I knew his name and his games when I was very young because I followed candidate tournament in Yugoslavia and that time it was very long competition, 28 games with the joinments so it was like 45 days, very difficult to play. Fisher played this candidate tournament when he qualified when he was 15 and that time he became grandmaster at the age of 14, very young. Not in the history but of course the weight of the grandmaster title was much more important than nowadays. When Fisher was going into the 72 match with Boris Pasky how did you feel the match would turn out, what were your predictions for the match? Fisher achieved fantastic results in candidates matches against Imanov and Larsen, 6-0, 6-0 and then against Petrosyan with 4 points advantage which was great sportive result and of course everybody was impressed with that result and Fisher dominated, he was very strong personality and these players I think they missed most psychologically that games and when I had to play Fisher I prepared, I made big job and I think I had chances, I can say I had better chances but still I had chances and so I consider that it will be tough match. Was that a bit disappointing for you after Fisher's demands were not met and the match not taking place, was it bittersweet to be world champion without a match? No, I prepared as I said, I prepared for the match and I was ready to play but of course I couldn't force Fisher to play if he didn't appear so he didn't appear. I wanted to play and to defeat Bobby and it was my personal aim to win that match but the leaders of my country they didn't like the idea because they said you are world champion why you have risk to play Fisher so you are world champion, what you want and I said I want to play the strongest player of the time and I want to beat him, I have chances and then they asked are you sure you can win I said I have good chances but in sport how can you be sure that you win and then that's why I had problems to negotiate because they said no if you guarantee I said are you crazy I cannot guarantee I win but I have good chances to beat Fisher. Talking about good chances there was a lot of mixed views on this the cast profile that you probably would have won that match considering that you were very active, you were at your toughest you were peaking while Fisher hadn't actually played for three years after 72 while Spassky said that maybe Fisher would have won that match but you would come back and win the next cycle. Okay, Fisher had a big supporter as Spassky Spassky admired Fisher very much probably because of this admiration Spassky missed his chances to play more successful against Fisher in the match if you analyze that match, Fisher won with big gap but in the middle of the match they both lost energy and so they were playing like boxers fighting in the last rounds of the battle and from game 11 or 12 I think 5 or 6 games both sides could win and so much could continue in different direction and game 13 Spassky was winning almost by force and he missed it in the middle of the game and actually I got a lot of respect among our top players when I showed that during the game I analyzed and then I showed Petrosyan carries how Spassky could win the game Were you at the venue at that time? No, we were preparing for Chess Olympiad in Skopje and we were together and then I just analyzed and I showed that Spassky missed a clear advantage a big advantage, almost winning and then he lost that game at the end it was Alekhine defense and then he missed chance and he lost opportunities to win After you became world champion you went on to play many tournaments you were a very active world champion so to say Was there some sort of motivation to prove that even though match did not happen you were the best in the world? No, I played always a lot but not too much I had norm around 80 games a year but I played of course much more than any other world champions and probably because I accumulated a lot of energy and preparation was very serious which I made for Fischer and then I could play almost without preparation any tournament with any list of the players So you wanted to make the most of that preparation so it doesn't go waste? Yes, I used all my preparation of course Now you played these matches with Kortschnoi then with Kasprove and even the ones later with Kasprove were very close matches 11 and a half, 12 and a half and it was very tough 12-12, yes, in Sevilla Which world championship match do you think had the biggest impact on you? I don't know But Kortschnoi reached his peak in 77-78 which I didn't expect but I was sure I had better chances in the match 78 was almost repetition of our match of 74 I won 3 games in 18 games Kortschnoi didn't succeed to win even one so it was a big huge advantage 3 points before the end we needed to play 6 games and then suddenly I lost 2 games almost in a row I lost game 19 and I lost game 21 and then suddenly Kortschnoi recovered and it was a big competition in the last 3 games but I had 2 whites and 1 black so I succeeded to manage 3 draws even the last game was completely winning for me but of course in special conditions Kortschnoi had to win to equalize the score so he played a little bit risky and then I offered him draw in winning position because I needed just draw and so I didn't make mistake just to try to win because I didn't need it and then Kortschnoi realized that he was losing and when I offered draw he didn't take chance to lose again the last title I won against Anand so this was a very exciting match for the chess world this was also a very big moment for how rich the world championship matches were the ones with Kortschnoi and then in 84 the match with Kaspro which after 48 games which you were leading was stopped you lost something like 10 kgs is what was written in this we both lost weight but still we had to continue according to regulations so it was big pressure of Kasparov supporters at that time they took very high positions in Soviet Union and so Kampamanas couldn't resist he made crazy decision which separated the world in two parts actually if I would win that match especially 6-0 I had chances then Kasparov would never become world champion this quietly he will be completely destroyed psychologically destroyed and because he is very emotional so I don't think he would become the strongest player in the world everyone who studies games from whether it's the world championship matches or the al-Qaeda memorial that you won or the leader s tournament you want to see the game again to understand what really happened your opponents have this feeling of helplessness recently I think it was Yannik Pelletier who said that he was playing against you many years ago and he has never felt so helpless in his life on the board how would you describe your style of play and what was it that left your opponents so helpless I was playing for win the whole game even I had some problems to defend but still I was looking how to defend and then how to counter attack and I could find additional possibilities how to create problems to my opponent in chess but also a very strong positional style it was an aggressive positional style yes yes so probably this is part of my style and not only positional because Petrosyan played positional chess but this was different this was different and he played let's say he played Karakan defense just to make draw and I played Karakan defense to win so there is a big difference to play very passive opening but to play for win and I won many games and then this discovery that I did with Kamski playing with black I made move king 8-7 without castle in the middle of the game with queens and all the pieces so this was a big surprise and all the players of the tournament in Dortmund were coming looking what happened how do you assess the work of this new fide under Mr Arkady Dorkovich now consider this like a positive change and he is working a lot and he succeeded to organize already many top level official events and he saved situation with Saudi Arabia he moved that championship to St. Petersburg and then this year, past year in Moscow and then he made decision which decreased possibilities of corruption and chess politics because they made decision in the congress to exclude proxies which was big part of of corruptive system which Kampamanas and Lomzhinov created in chess world so I consider this change as a very important change and very positive you are also involved with a lot of work in Russia as a member of parliament tell us about that that must take a lot of your time yeah, this full time job so that's why I am playing less and less but now I play only rapid chess or blitz tournaments very seldom classical chess because classical chess tournaments they require longer time but even now I am playing quite good in blitz and only last years for instance Karyakin who became world champion in blitz two years ago before that tournament I was almost equal with him playing privately in blitz oh, you had some training games with him yes, we have friends so we play from time to time privately before I was let's say six years ago I was stronger than him so you are a specialist in shorter time controls yes, since young age I played always with blitz even now I play quite strong in blitz you are also part of the organizing committee for the candidates that are coming up the tournament tell us about yes, tell us about that involvement as an organizer what expertise will you be bringing in I gave them advices how to organize things and I believe this will be well organized candidates tournament probably one of the best because we have top level hotel and we made agreement already we signed agreement with the owners of the hotel some participants will stay there and they will play in the tournament hall in the hotel so with the climate this is not so easy but if they don't want they don't need to leave the hotel they can stay there and then they have of course fitness center and so everything so they can stay there without any problems fortunately we have a governor who is supporting chess and I know him for a long time and so we got support of him and his deputy is chairman of organizing committee I'm sure it will be very well organized well the chess world is definitely looking forward to it and one of the stories around the candidates recently in fact Alexenko will be here at the Gibraltar Masters do you think that in the world championship cycle there should be a wild card? so it was difficult decision because we had Vashel Agraf who was the main candidate for this place but that time Russia didn't have even one and I don't think I'm in favor of wild card for candidates tournament but I can hardly see organizers without their representative in the candidates tournament and so that's why it was difficult decision for Fide but that moment Russia didn't have representatives and then they had two already and then at the last moment we got another two right now you Anatoly have played so many different formats of the world championship the one that currently exists the world championship cycle as is right now do you think it's ideal do you think there's room for improvement? I don't like the decisions about changing time control and I'm not in favor of this and it brings closer classical chess to rapid chess and then I don't see the reason why we have two championships then make one but still I believe that world championship match should be maybe 16 games longer and also many times this world championship match is going into tie breaks which is then decided on rapid and blitz actually I'm strictly against this because you can combine classical chess and blitz world championship title this is so important you can decide it with blitz games but what do you do if the match is a tie how do you go forward let's say if it's even 16 matches and it's 8-8 how do you to play till first win simple but it should be classical for a classical world championship it should be classical okay now no conversation about the world championship matches complete until I ask you this question which is that who do you think will challenge Magnus Carlsen in the 2020 match this time I think Dink has better chances so he showed his strength last year and I believe he's favorite but still I believe Carlsen will continue to be world champion you do? at least yes at least another time it's an absolute pleasure to have you here with us thank you so much for your time and thank you for inspiring us thank you good luck