 Hi everybody, it's Mark J Parker. Thank you for checking out release date rewind. This is a special episode of the podcast Normally we celebrate movie anniversaries, but this episode is all about a TV show celebrating a milestone anniversary And I hope you enjoy it All right everybody, I am so excited I'm shaking because this is a first for release date rewind Maybe this episode is is a special premiere date Rewind or something if I could say it clearly but in this special episode. We are talking about the first season of Dawson's Creek a very special show in our lives for our generation. I am joined by my cast members my cape ciders I'm joined by Sarah Menekwal and Kit Sheehan who have been on the show before hello my hometown loves Hey, hometown love Isn't this also I'm just so grateful. Thank you guys for doing this. Thank you for watching more hours than you were probably Hoping I don't know maybe but never have to twist my arm. Good. I knew it all over again I mean like and we're missing our our fourth. We're missing our fourth lead Melissa Ward who who is a brand new mom? So maybe she'll join but I mean, you know, we'll give her shit later But at least we have a reunion of three now, okay, I guess I'm obviously Dawson I feel like that makes a lot of sense hit. You're obviously Joey, right? I mean, so then Sarah. Are you Jen? Yeah I believe I'm a Pacey. Yeah. Yeah, I think so too. Well, you took the test. You're I'm a Pacey. Yeah, wait, hold on everybody because Yes, let's talk about this test. Was that the thing I sent you because did you guys do it and I somehow missed the texts? Did you guys also do the yeah, we didn't send the screen grabs through we just like announced I somehow totally I did not receive those. Wow. Okay. So, okay, so you got Joey. I got Joey What did you get Sarah Pacey? I got Pacey. You actually did Wow, I Mean, it's funny now having rewatched. I pretty much rewatched Almost all 13 episodes, which is crazy that I even did that I watched like 12 There was one in the middle that I was like, I don't need to see them go to Providence I'm gonna just skip that one, right? Yeah, but it's crazy rewatching it. I have things to say about that episode Oh good. Please. Yeah, fill fill my brain in because that was when I was like, hey listen I'm watching four episodes in one day. I gotta I gotta speak through but it really is funny how Joey and Pacey I think we can all agree at least after watching most of the episodes of one are the best characters, you know Do you agree? 100% I also did not recall that the writers kind of clocked that chemistry from as early as season one Right. Yeah in my mind, it's such a season two season three plot line Well and beyond but yeah comes to a head in season two and three I was I totally forgot They had like a whole standalone episode by themselves And Pacey made a move and like I'm so happy that the writers saw what we could all see. Yeah. Yes Well, also, maybe I'm totally behind. Maybe I'm 25 years behind Did you guys know that I didn't realize they actually dated during I guess shooting season one or two because there's a quote from Katie Holmes saying like I met someone in 1998 And I like absolutely fell head over heels for him and like so the writers could also see They're growing chemistry and that apparently it was never really part of the plan to make them such a Like leading couple. So they were using like life and adding it into the show. I didn't know that. Did you guys know that? No, I knew that they dated I okay during the show I also I could be fabricating this but I feel pretty confident saying I think he's someone who helped get her out of Scientology, I'm pretty sure he was like a part of like the rescue crew really now Can I just say real quick? When are we going to get a lifetime movie just about Katie Holmes's exit like getting in the car Driving to her parents house in Ohio from I assume la. I don't know where they were living at the time Right. It was yeah, it was and then you filed in New York for divorce. So that shoot because New York has more mother Laws like California. It's 50-50 is the like you have to prove one way or the other to get more than 50-50 But New York it's still like 60 40 tops like Why hasn't she monetized this story like I she must be under a crazy and must exactly Her career's in the shitter So like go make a buck off of this story people want. I'm still curious. It's a decade later And I still want to happen if anything I need to know more now that I did when it was happening like give us more give us give us more Yeah, but the justice settled like what the fuck But I think you're I think you're sorry. I feel like she signed so many things before she even married tom cruise that She he's a notorious NDA like he's notorious for making you like sign an NDA if you're gonna attend a party with him Like oh god, and it's like who wants to who wants to sign something before entering a party I mean, I guess if I'm really desperate, but I'm like, I'll just Turn around and also like all of his maids and like cooks and stuff are like people who are in the church They're essentially enslaved. Oh my god. Seriously. Let's we forget yet The guy pops on screen He's still sadly. I know it's he does He's a witch he put he has us on the rise to the top of cults. I'm no one is saying they're not charismatic Problematically charismatic The fact that I'm still like oh top gun maverick I'll watch a little bit of cruise And is it me or does it feel like Since their breakup like every leading lady in a tom cruise movie, which there haven't really been that many I feel like in past years They all kind of like are in that katie holmes umbrella like jennifer connelly who I love You know is you know in that katie holmes umbrella michelle monahan and the mission impossible movies Basically a look alike for i'm just like yes I don't know. That's just my tangent over there. It's like to constantly repair publicly repair to be like look how much fun we have Yeah, me and other poonettes. We get along great. It was just that one very normal I have to actually tell you guys. I think I don't know if i'm being crazy Joshua jackson is an awesome actor. He's great and I knew that and I remembered that well But you know katie holmes. I forgot actually I'd say 90 of the time. I really actually loved watching her rewatching her again in season one I actually think she's quite good for this role I know every now and then you know we talked for years about the crooked smile and like god Some of those looks later on in the season. She's But you know, I think she delivers a lot of her comedy really really well that sarcasm and yeah, no, I I Fell in love with her again. Actually. I have to say more so than michelle williams. I found her Bit of a wet blanket. Oh, see I I've I was Restruck I was like well, this is why michelle popped. This is why she came out of this her scene with gramps like the The tears and the hole but I was I've gone back and forth with katie holmes Like I used to think she when we were really young I used to think like she was like the height of like just naturalistic like to be natural and I'm like no, that's like insecure That's like a tick. That's like a nervous tick. It's not a choice Not a character choice. And so she like so then I like went full I was like I could do that and she's not good at all and I'm very jealous and I'm gonna Like funnel that jealousy into misplaced rage And now I've come back to be like, you know what? I see how she got cast though because she's so she does have this mournful quality There's so much she gets for free. She has this mournful quality with her eyes She's beautiful and she is like she's good in terms of like she is she's always doing something like when her character is walking She's thinking of something or reacting to something someone says or playing with her jacket And I'm like, okay. She breathes life into this like this could be worse I am I remembered it worse than what it was. I did too. Yeah, I think you know for whatever reason my mind Went back to a lot of the cheesy stuff And rewatching I think this is at least season one I haven't rewatched any of the other seasons and I know we were talking a little bit offline about the college years I know sarah enjoys the college years I love that you love them I can't I I can barely remember them by I just remember watching them live and being like why every Wednesday, I guess it was on Wednesdays the first season it was on Tuesdays Then it lived on Wednesdays for the rest of the run. I just remember every Wednesday night being like yeah Buffy moved to Tuesday, but I just remember being like, why am I still watching this show once they were in college? But you know at least season one is a really great show There's a lot of great storylines like I said a lot of good comedy that I completely forgot Yes, you know what I mean? Yes, totally agree. I think I'm I think I fall on a different side of okay How I feel about katie in this rewatch. Okay, you know that she is always doing something and I don't always need her to be doing It's not about you I wrote like she walks She's clearly using her walk to show us. I'm a tomboy Oh, yeah, it's as if they told her like don't forget katie like you're supposed to be a tomboy. So really give me that energy And like a lot of that Yeah, awesome. And like on the flip side gen is always Michelle Williams is always you can't really see but she's always got her hands on her hips And she's always uh, and she does this like Yes, the nurse. Yeah, the my back hurts hands She and bessie She yeah, she and joey's sister bessie have the same posture. It's always like Bessie was heavily pregnant As a woman named bessie should be Right, exactly. I know every character. You're like, we'll have a pregnant character and we shall call her bessie But or gen she's either doing that or she does this thing where whenever she's walking Oh, let me see if I can kind of reenact it. It's kind of like a You know Dawson it's this almost like mel jody foster mel swaying Yes, like it's just kind of like And she could be happy or sad. She's just like, yeah, you know what? Let's go to that carnival or it's you know, Dawson, um I just it's just this weird swaying that would take me out of it sometimes, you know, or she'll go backward Yeah And then yeah, what's the hurting back with the tired nurse out of the main four the the person that had the most kind of like The least awkward physical presence is joshua jackson for me. Yeah, you know what I mean? Which which is I guess also his character even though I know matter what and I'm looking at it as they close up They zoom in and and I'm like he does have the skin right here is so soft But god damn if that man doesn't look at He'll no day younger than 35 but the very is like I'm just I don't know freaked out because I'm like Yeah I feel like he changed his voice to be higher like that was the thing that caught me most about his performances He's like hey joey, and I'm like no no fucking chance that shit is in your chest Oh, I do like no chances your is your voice that high pitched. Yeah, so sorry That's a really interesting point sarah. Yeah, because there are moments where he's like Hey Jen, uh, you want to go and it just feels like put on I totally I totally hear you But also showing greg because greg only ever saw the hurricane episode which I can't wait to talk about that in a few minutes Wow, but um, I showed him today the scare aka the friday the 13th I've always loved that episode. Wow. Wow. Wow. But he said about james van der beek's face That yes, he's looked so much older than them and really he was only I think like maybe 2021 scott foley was like 25 And and greg delaney said like no that guy is an adult. He's out of college He's and I was like, yeah the next year he was in felicity in college As an r.a. That's like Right. Yeah, so like everyone's like no, that's a man everyone else sure But even dawson's face his and it's funny because I was trying to figure out a way to say it And james van der beek is perfect for this role. I think I think he's doing just exactly what we need that neurotic Goofiness, but his emotions his like, you know, he's just so kind of like elf like at times that it is a little off putting Right. Yeah, the features just yeah, it's like the face is big and everything's big I don't want to He can't control this but my god the size of the dome on that guy Whoa, that was not a real figure that too. I was like it's it's not It's just like there's so many They did a zoom in on him at one point and it cut off literally like Like Well, and that's why the oopa-loopa joke in the detention episode really kind of Oh, I feel like I'm Living through it with him because I felt like that was they took that from his real life. Maybe that that insult I don't know. Well, should I be offended because people said I looked like dawson. Do I not have the domes? You do not have. Oh, okay. Thank you. It's already if I did you can be honest, but no It would tell you you do not okay I missed the dome James van der beek did kind of grow into now that he's not having the cascading hair It kind of like looks just if that looks normal Yeah, and you know the cascading hair was beautiful But then by the end of the season when it was also cascading down here It's just like oh, we got a really, you know, it just he and I mean Really, it was great casting that all four of them are so opposite You really had the opposites with the girls you had the opposites with the guys You had pacy with as joey says in one episode of julius sees her haircut and like, you know Very simple hair and then dawson's got these flowing Locks that are kind of silly, you know There comes a time in all of our lives You're dawson dawson. Yeah, I know um we met before Wow, you look different Puberty. Hi, I'm joey. I lived down the creek and we've never met but there's the end of something simple Are you and dawson a thing? Oh, we're just friends and the beginning Oh my god Of everything else. Do you think I could help you locate a video? We're gonna find the graduate Were we supposed was dawson supposed to be the male heartthrob? No And i'm glad you bring that up because I saw maybe you guys saw this too if you were doing some, uh research I saw that um So joshua jackson was one of apparently the first to like audition and kevin mulliamson and crew like new no matter what like Oh, this guy's gotta be something so he was originally in the running for dawson But but kevin mulliamson and especially the network. I guess the wb themselves were like, hey, he's great But he's not the dawson that you've written like we need someone that's a little bit more neurotic a little more everyday Normal, which is really because joshua jackson is of course extremely attractive such a cute guy then and now But I guess also he's kind of to me Sort of like normal. It's not like we had like a major beautiful guy Yeah, it wasn't like tom welling He was a super man guy The wb had like other more chiseled men You know in the years to come that luckily this cast was never in my opinion like the hotties Which I think Is good for the show. Yeah, you know what I mean? It's more believable We can take it we can we can take it more seriously because another teen soap like this would have You know, I'm trying to think like like the river dales, you know, how everyone's like so Chiseled yes, you know river dales like trying to be euphoria, which is like a fever dream that we all had like one time We got drunk in high school like It's not like this. I'm not saying it was great or safe or legal all the time, but it wasn't that Oh, I know. Yeah, this makes euphoria look like an absolute nightmare. I mean I mean euphoria is the uh upside down in stranger things and when you when you're in capeside. Whoa, right? Yeah Yes, gen like came gen transferred from euphoria new york Yeah There you go. Yeah gen gen was the um, why can I not remember her name sydney sweeney of Of her old life. Maybe I don't know Cassie Yeah, supposedly. Yeah, which All right, well since we're talking about the actors, why don't I set the scene guys? Let's set the scene and then let's nerd out about the first episode and let's go through I want you guys to tell me all of your thoughts, you know, what it was like rewatching So let me set the scene. We are going back 25 years everybody. We are rewinding to january 20th 1998 that is when it was a tuesday night the wb tuesday Dawson's creek premiered at 9 p.m It's lead in was buffy and so it was interesting looking at the tv schedule Buffy was on monday nights after seventh heaven. Buffy was airing season two seventh heaven was also season two Um, so this was still very early in the wb. I was looking thursday night friday night saturday night the wb just had nothing on i guess it was repeats or just like like so they didn't even have a full Schedule that's how early this was right But so buffy aired at 9 on mondays, but this week with dawson's creek premier week They had a two parter. So it was funny. Buffy aired both monday night and tuesday night So I I didn't know that I forgot that but you know, I was glued. I'm like, okay Give me everything now kit. I know loves buffy sarah. I forget you didn't really watch buffy, right? I have I've only watched the first episode of it. Um, and I support people who support buffy. It was I think you would really like it So, uh, jen you a virgin? That's mature It's mine Summer 42 is officially reserved in your name My mom knew that dawson's creek was about sex Yeah, and as like a kid when I finally was allowed to watch it in seventh grade from seventh grade onward I remember thinking like this isn't about sex at all But now it's an adult looking back at it. I'm like, this is all about Oh my god Yeah, my mom didn't even see the The teacher Oh, oh boy. Yeah, honestly, you know comparing it to euphoria, which we know is also all about sex and all that But I feel like dawson's creek these characters are talking about sex way more than you I mean euphoria just they just do it. They're not talking about it. They're just they're just doing all this shit But wow so many conversations, you know, how often do you walk your dog? How I mean My god, all right, I'm constantly talking about masturbating in a way that teenagers do not And might I say the nexus of all of these conversations is one joey potter She is the horniest person on this show because her parents are in a I know And I guess besi and bodi are like just doing it all the time. Maybe so she's like well like my sister Right, I mean, I guess Yeah, her dad had an affair Right Kevin Williamson loves a parental affair. Isn't that crazy? There are so many rewatching it. Oh my gosh There are some lines literally taken from the scream scripts, but ma cheating mom cheating dad I mean that popped up in so much of his stuff at this time. It's so Like you okay, buddy? Yeah, I have his parents must have had something like I know I have a book about him that I should have reread that I did a book report in seventh grade It was called from scream to Dawson's Creek all about his rise to fame and I should have reread it for this, but I can only I can only research so much everyone Well, that'll be for another day, but um, but so okay, so that's interesting. So I watched live I I was into it. I was I really loved the poster of all them You know, this was the heyday of like floating heads looking kind of seductive on the poster So I was like, okay. Yeah, let's do it over the creek. So I watched it live I can't really remember what I thought of it. I kind of knew half of it, especially at that age We were like in fifth grade. We were what 10 going on 11 ish So I was definitely aware of like, okay, this is so corny, but I also love so many elements of it So I think from the start I didn't hate watch it, but I definitely kind of You know kind of watched it with a half critical half loving eye. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah Okay, so this is what was going on at the time. Okay So teen tv shows up until this point, like I said, Buffy and seventh heaven were airing. They were season two 90210 Beverly Hills 90210 not the reboot that came a couple years later. That was still airing That was airing season season eight Melrose place was in season six and party of five was season four So that's kind of the the landscape of teen dramas um, let's see on the news side the country was starting to hear about bill clinton and monica lewinsky and Fun fact, I saw this. I think it was episode two um Was that was the same night all the networks were airing bill clinton's Like emergency live speech saying I did not have sex with that woman, but the wb wasn't they were like, no No, we are airing episode two of dawson's creek So sorry where a teacher abuses her position of power and has sex with a child I know right. I was like, whoa, that's crazy that that was breaking Yeah, yeah, it's different when it's an older woman. Yeah, right You'll never get it. Yes. So I thought that was crazy timing on the music side We were just talking about it truly madly deeply by savage garden was the number one single for a couple weeks all the rage You're still the one by shania twain and getting jiggy with it from wil smith. They were about to be big singles They were they released later in january and then of course popular movies titanic was number one It had just come out around the holidays goodwill hunting and as good as it gets were also very popular and spice world Had just come out in theaters this same week So yeah, check that out. We'll talk about spice world in a different episode So that was all what was going on, you know popular stuff And I thought this was interesting promotion wise. I never knew this. I mean, we all saw titanic in theaters I think right. Oh, yeah, I was allowed to see titan. I was like not as good as it gets That's not good. Well, oh, yeah. Yeah, those were yeah little little more mature, right? But I don't have any memory of this whatsoever But the wb was the first tv network to run trailers of a show in the movie theater They were putting the trailer for season one of dawson's creek with titanic. Isn't that interesting? Brilliant marketing, right? brilliant Then diagram Like what a time to be alive for like us 10 year olds and all these hotties and you know teens We're like young adults. We're like ruling the world of entertainment. So there you go, right? Are you a horny child? Well, guess what? Yeah Something for you. We have a creek for you. Yes So kevin williamson created the show it is inspired by his life in north carolina, which is so funny guys I knew they shot in wilmington, north carolina Which I still would love to visit someday same as I know what you did last summer which kate was on this show talking about that with me But all these years since the show ended I I guess I forgot I knew it was capeside, but I thought capeside was in north carolina But it's in massachusetts. So they keep talking in the first episode. I'm like, why are they talking about boston? I'm like, there are other cities closer to you in north carolina. I'm like, oh They live like, okay, interesting. Yeah, apparently the network I know because he he was all for it takes place in north carolina very much mimicking his life But the network said can you make it massachusetts and can they live like outside of boston? And he was like, do I have to change anything? And they're like, no, god Yeah, so the decor don't change the foliage the trees are the same the reeds on the Do not change a goddamn thing about that creek. Let me tell you every coast is the same. Keep it So he had just had success of course with scream to it just come out I know what you did last summer scream, of course So he was like literally the screenwriter like to get in your team. He it's funny later this year It's funny how everyone except james van der beek had then their breakout movie role Of course joshua jackson. We know was already in the the mighty ducks trilogy So he was probably the most well known of the group But later in 98 you had michelle williams was um in halloween h2o Which kevin williamson produced and steve minor producer and director of this show and he directed the first episode He directed that movie so funny a lot of crossover You had her in that you had katie holmes in disturbing behavior that summer and then you had joshua jackson in urban legend So it's funny how teaching mrs. Tingle. Yes teaching miss tingle calling that one like teacher mrs. Tringle Yep, exactly. I was just gonna say there's a moment in another episode a follow-on episode where joey Is faking her pregnancy And she calls her mrs tingle Oh They just changed it. Okay. Well, that was promotion because katie did that movie with kevin williamson The year after right and it's funny because james van der beek did not do the horror thing like the rest of them And he didn't do a movie until the following year with varsity blues And then rules of attraction and then rules of attraction Which was him trying to get it back into that disturbing behavior I don't want to make that young disturbed dean money and that was at a time when like I remember he and like jessica bill like everyone on the wb wanted to do like a role that was not so Cookie cutter sam michelle galler did of course cruel intentions with joshua jackson So, you know everyone then like had their their like i'm gonna be a bad whatever, you know Yeah, so he based this on his life He had to write a 20 page outline in one night because apparently when he met The other producer of the show this executive named paul stupin paul was like, hey, we know you do movies What what tv show ideas do you have and he didn't have anything apparently so he just was like well, there's this Teenager who loves steven spielberg and makes movies with his friends by the water and he's like, I love that Can you make an outline so we can pitch it to the networks tomorrow? And he he literally had to write it that night. I thought that was funny So that's kind of how the idea started. He said this is a quote from williamson He says he pitched the show as some kind of wonderful which is an 80s movie meets pump up the volume I don't know that one meets james at 15 Meets my so-called life, which we know meets little house on the prairie Familiar with that as well. Yeah Is it a dance element or I yeah, I don't know that I was like the little house on the prairie joke that they added into the script in the first episode Oh What is the joke now when she says like, oh, hey, it's nelly, right? Isn't that her name? She was like, hey, I'm like nelly and she goes like little house on the prairie. She goes. Yeah, I get that all the time So do you like to party? Yes Um, do you mean by party do you mean have a good time or do you mean in just various substances? Right. It's like what I like to have a good time substance free. Wow. Maybe we should call you nelly Yeah, isn't it funny? You just made me remember kit that nelly is in the first few episodes and then we don't see a peep from her Ever again, what is that about the world closes in around these? I mean, because obviously they're in debt. They're they've all been dead for some time and it's like lost Like or sartras no exit. I could just them torturing each other I mean, I do feel like the first few episodes. It's clear that they are throwing everything at the wall To see what sticks Yep Thanks so much for watching next week We'll be part two of this discussion and in the meantime, please follow release date rewind on instagram