 We're not gonna call the order of the city when you ski liquor control board meeting if you're here for the city council meeting You're not in the wrong place. We do have like a control board meeting first of this evening So we'll do that business very quickly about 6.05. We'll start the city council meeting So if you're waiting for a gen item on that area, we will be circling back there soon So first I'll call the order of the new ski liquor control board meeting with a regular meeting Monday November 5th at 6 p.m. I said everybody please join us for the Pledge of Illusions led by Deputy Mayor Nicole Mace Okay, we have one item on tonight's liquor control board meeting and that is for consideration our first possible license for Gauchal LCD B. A. Dale Boca or Dalai Boca 20 at 215 Main Street formerly in the photo and Billy So this is a liquor license. We've Heather's met with the business owner And we're excited to welcome them to this vacated property now so dang it's up on the top of Main Street. That's awesome We are very excited. It was cool news to see that they're coming in here Do we have anybody from the business in this evening? Yes We'll just invite you now we're considering your license anything that you guys want to say and most importantly Do you want to let folks know what's happening and when they can expect to be eating your delicious food? If I am with you So we are opening an Argentina cafe We are transitioning from a food truck into so into like in a small space As you probably know the space is going to be turned down because they are gonna read purposes So it was like a move that we wanted to do and see you know what is what I know You know when you see is growing You know really good. We found like a bunch of you know Good support from from the town in terms of you know communication all that some challenges Hopefully We are kind of like a behind the month because we found you know if you think that we didn't know again We had precision improve a food truck And you start have different, you know ideas and different laws too. So we are actually Looking to open on December 5th. We have The fire wash are coming on the 13 and then the health department coming next week as well Just to check on everything they are right now doing the gas the water the electric and everything So we're really excited. We're really excited So For the equal license we wanted to buy because we would like to have some Argentinian wines and maybe some you know Not only have it at the restaurant maybe doing some events that you know, we can show we are really looking to To lead our culture. We're both from Argentina. He's the chef So we're really looking to bring you know, like a more like a Latin flavor, you know So we really really excited. Yeah, that's awesome Well restaurants always take twice as long and cost twice as much open as you expect, right? In time, I mean really, of course we when we first moved there Supposedly we were going to do just cosmetics, you know Which again it takes time money to of course put things time Especially because we only gonna be there for like a year a year and a half top So we wanted to open right away, you know, so we can we can have everything up, but it's it's it's been And hopefully actually our idea was eventually moved to another bigger location in Well, we are very very excited to welcome you it's a really unique food guns up to that's not represented here now So awesome to see it added to the mix and we appreciate your interest in an estimate when you ski We hope it's the first step of what ends up being a long journey here Thank you very much You can't wait to open our stomachs to you Any questions comes concerns from the control board Any questions comes concerns from the public Great so seeing in here and then I'd entertain a motion for approval of the first class of license and restaurants license for So I could motion by Christine second by how any further discussion So you can hear no those in favor, please say aye aye and those opposed motion carries the licenses are approved That completing tonight's look control board meeting and entertain a motion to adjourn Motion to close second by Christine for the discussion. So you can hear none all those in favor, please say aye And those opposed the control board is hereby adjourned Thank you very much And you were an excellent guest man So having 607 we'll call the order of the regular schedule when you ski city council meeting and ask that everybody again Please join us for the pleasure lesion slide by deputy mayor and police One nation under God Hey first up tonight, we have agenda review This is an opportunity for members of council making a request for adjustments to tonight's agenda based on order content, etc Any questions or concerns in regards to the general if you stack it up for guests and efficiency Okay So singing hearing then we'll move forward with agenda as set next up is public comment This is an opportunity for members of the public to address the council about anything that is not on tonight's agenda If you're curious about what's on tonight's agenda, we do have agendas on the back in the podium We also very very much appreciate if folks take a moment to sign in in the back If you could please and if you didn't do it on the way in that's okay You can do it on your way out to just please remember it's helpful for us to have record of who this year may be spoke as well Any items for public comment again on items that are addressing things not on tonight's agenda Great, so we will move on to the consent agenda We have one two three four five six seven items on tonight's consent agenda We have the city council minutes from October the 15th payroll period from the 7th to the 20th October And ending in the 2nd of November as well quest for use of the center see senior center program budget reserves Which was discussed in the previous meeting requests to correct manifest errors in the grand list Which was also discussed in the previous meeting the sharp grant for the DUI equipment support in the National Recreation and Park Association tenement walk grant which we thought in both cases were things Council could manage and reviewing in the consent agenda versus having an open session on and then the Winooski bridge replacement scoping study Preferred option which was discussed and feedback provided To the engineers at the previous meeting any questions or concerns from council in regards to the consent agenda We're missing No, I wasn't here last week. Okay So we will split off the minutes and I would entertain a motion first for the approval of item a of the consent agenda Which is the city council minutes from October the 15th 2018 Motion by Nicole second by christine further discussion Seeing and hearing none all those in favor, please say aye. Aye Those are Those opposed Those abstaining abstain Motion carries I've now entertained a motion for the remainder of the consent agenda. That's item b through g Second motion by Eric second by christine further discussion Seeing and hearing none all those in favor, please say aye And those opposed motion carries consent agenda is approved as presented. Thank you Next up is city update Great. Thank you. I have a number of things As probably everybody knows tomorrow's election day So voting from seven to seven at the senior center at 123 barlow street. So far we have sent out 580 absentee ballots about and received 525 back Which is I think a record for us. We process 70 today alone, which is great People are getting engaged, but if you haven't voted yet come to the senior center tomorrow Members of the council probably saw that we launched the All resident voting charter commission home page today. So it is up and our call for Participants is out to the public the draft charter is up there, but obviously you haven't approved that yet So it's marked as draft The intention is to bring back appointments once the counselors have been able to vet candidates So if people are interested in serving on our charter commission to consider all resident voting Encourage you to go to the website or come in to apply at city hall A couple of updates from the community services department We had almost 600 people come out for our halloween event on a fairly rainy saturday night So thank you all to those who are able to come out and especially thanks to visac for hosting us right downtown As you may remember last year we moved downtown because of the haunted mill and all the things going on in the circle as well And special kudos to ray and alicia finley for all of their coordination of that event Um Ray and his team has have also recently launched a recreation survey to ask the public about programs They would like to see across the lifecycle and across sports and arts and culture and uh different ways for our community to connect So it's linked off all of our social media platforms our website It will be posted on front porch forum hard copies will also be here at city hall at the senior center at the library, etc It will be up for about a month. So we encourage People to take a few minutes and tell us what they want to see from programming in the future Community services is also looking for a number of volunteers specifically to help with Meals on wheels and um the napoli translator As well as lots of other opportunities to get involved and volunteer So if you're interested in that it's winewski vt.org backslash volunteer Or you can contact ray or alivia directly Uh a few updates on the planning and zoning side Eric Warwald and the drb chair dug and the mayor interviewing drb alternate candidates We have a vacancy in that position So we hope to bring you back in appointee at your next regular meeting And then I also want to share that eric Spoke at the northern new england chapter for the american planning association Last month on our form ace code and main street project So I think that's a great highlight of what we're doing And all accounts he did a great job Just a reminder the vermont housing conference is next week november 13th and 14th in burlington The the sears theme is focusing on Municipalities who are focusing on developing affordable housing So if anybody any of the counselors would like to participate And need funding we have funding available to do that registration is still a bit And we will be presenting on On the form on the housing projects underway in muski as well I had previously shared with you that the burlington international airport was going to release the updated noise exposure map In the beginning of december That's the new map that will take into consideration the f35 data and the contour and the revised contour lines That has been delayed and they at this point don't plan to release it until The end of january. I think there was a data point that they were They didn't get in yet. Um, so they're still working on so more to come on that but we won't see anything until january 2019 Um, I want to thank you for your patience with our technology transition You should have seen counselors should have seen the proof point emails in your inboxes So thank you for clicking through all of those to whitelist the emails you want to continue to receive And just a reminder that we will be transitioning to exchange next tuesday the 13th So they're going to flip the switch at 6 30 am gmail will be discontinued and we'll go over to exchange later on this week We'll be sending you a Kind of tutorial document about how to Log on via your web portal. So it's pretty self-explanatory angel and i have been through it a couple of times It's it's very doable But there will be a change for you all We will also have sim quest staff here all day on tuesday. So if you do have any Troubles feel free to call myself or angela or paul and we can get you connected to that staff person quickly Um, just a reminder. We have a special council meeting coming up on tuesday or tuesday november 27th at 7 p.m That's the special meeting to think to consider the Um documents related to the global settlement in the tiff district Um, and then on december 3rd at your next regular schedule council meeting obviously that will be budget night So we'll be sharing the fy 20 budget with you As we've gone through the audit process for fy 18 Which was the first year that the tiff paid back the musky community development corporation Note of which you serve as the board of trustees Our auditors have called to our attention that we have not been convening You all as that board of trustees you have been taking those votes as part of our regular budget process So the intent is there. It's the same humans voting and they're in your respective roles and Being done in a public meeting But our attorneys are saying you really should convene as a trustee board like you convene as a liquor commission So on october 3rd I'm going to recommend that we convene that group and ratify the past votes you have taken With regard to the fy 18 and fy 19 budgets again, you've already taken those votes in public There's documentation of that but just to get us back on in that habit We will be making that recommendation bring a second set of clothes And then just a reminder that city offices will be closed on monday for veterans day And of course november 22nd and 23rd with thanksgiving holiday Like that. Thank you. Great. Thank you very much We'll go with council reports Not a lot to report. I have been coordinating just via email with jesse and paul about communicating out updates from The commissions that we liaise to and he's put together He drafted a really nice plan for how we can all align on that process So I think we'll be seeing that soon so we can all get on the same page there I don't have anything to report There's planning commission meeting progress continues on the Municipal plan. I think again, I believe eric's Schedulality laid out from last time Is the update there? housing commission meeting was very substantive and I think a really really good conversation about where What the goals that council relate to the planning or excuse me the housing commission best fit in from a policy perspective Balancing this idea of a replacement ordinance versus inclusionary zoning and my takeaway from that meeting is that The goals as they were set forth were more appropriately addressed in iz and inclusionary zoning and there's I think a proposal to sort of ensure that that sussed out before anything's thought through in finalizing any kind of proposals for a replacement ordinance and they heard from Again housing professionals that sort of supported that if your goals are that inclusionary zoning might be the Better tool to achieve what you're trying to achieve So I think we'll be taking a deep dive on that as the policy proposals come forward But want to make council kind of globally aware of that And then just the other thing I want to raise the flag about for And I've done this maybe to some of you individually but You know the planning commission is doing work on the municipal plan and this beautiful Strategic vision statement print out. Thank you. That's behind us Just remind folks that was done as an interim guiding document instead of principles that were There to fill a vacuum in which In a time where our municipal plan has clearly aged out and is not a useful document and in my Meetings with the planning commission. I have pushed them and opened the door to say to them That's what that was if you guys think you need to propose some tweaks to that You know where they found conundrums and some of the language or things that they thought didn't fit together That they should feel free to at least propose those ideas back as they're writing the municipal plan So I think we're going to have that and I don't think it's any kind of huge drastic departure by any means But I think some of the language actually does matter that they've brought up and identified as wait a second Is this really what what the intent was? So I think that's something that you can expect We would hear back on as we move forward with that And I just want to also reiterate this city put out a couple of public statements But I know I'm getting questions about it. We remain committed to working with past volunteers to map out the future Of halloween and the festival of pumpkins in particular in the city and want to give just a huge huge Congratulations and and absolute gratitude To the to the folks who for 16 years have worked tirelessly to put that on and particularly sally timpson who really it's a year around endeavor to her The amount of energy and time it puts That she and others and seasons greetings have put into that to make it the event that it is every year And the scale that it is With again nothing but volunteer help and assistance is truly remarkable and amazing and there's a It's just such a great representation of how much people love and care about this community So a huge huge thanks for them for doing it that last time and just want to ensure as the city put out in our official statement We are working to ensure that that's something that's going to continue into the into the future for the community So what it also means is I'll throw that gauntlet down. It means other people have to step up The same people can't do things forever And there's a core group of about eight to 12 people who really made that thing go And we're going to need that as the city too. It's not something where we're just going to go and dedicate Endless staff hours towards and for we want to facilitate the framework in place, but it's ultimately going to take Community participation. So if you really love fall and have a thing for pumpkins Great opportunity lies ahead I don't have anything I attended the community service commission meeting October 24th and There was a good conversation about the need for Putting in place a survey to understand best what what programs should be Supported and and grown. So that's now in place um, and it was a robust conversation about scholarships And um, how to how to approach that and Ray bought in some ideas from other communities to consider And it sounds like they're leaning towards pulling funds And having a process to allocate them based on need So That was that Just just um hearing your update too. Just want to throw into um, how I both attended the Friends of the Winooski Library annual meeting as well And just want to give kudos to that group and remind folks that the Friends of the Winooski Library is a non-city affiliated non-profit entity that raises funds to do target investments in library programming and or materials That are sort of outside the municipal slope or is an additional boost to the library And they are seeking additional members and additional support and event ideas So Friends of the Winooski Library if you google if they do have a website And I think uh social media presence as well. So just want to put that on folks, right or do great work Okay, uh Having wrapped up council reports. We'll move on to tonight's regular items on the agenda. First up We have the discussion the acknowledgement of retirement the police department Chief Pete I know you're going to hate me but I want you to come up here So I wanted to take a few minutes tonight to recognize Pete soons. He retired in september of this past of 2018 Uh after 20 years of service with the Winooski police department Although he was a part-time employee Pete was during those 20 years He was the director of public safety for st. Michael's college Which during his tenure was in charge of rescue security and fire on campus So he touched our community in a number of ways not just when he was wearing a police uniform As the person who was in charge of the schedule for my first 15 years with the police department Pete was always very flexible about when he worked Was just one of those employees I could count on all the time So I wanted to wish him the best in his next chapter, whatever that may be And take the opportunity to say we'll miss him both personally and professionally It's great. I have years called the shadow box in the police world. We like to put these together for retirees and it's basically Years of service points the patches that pertain to when you were here in your years of service Any medals that you were awarded and your badge with your badge number? I'd like to thank retired sergeant Ron Sheehan. He still does these for me and eternally thankful for that Thank you very much Having bumped into you on the street always Always a smile Always a hello always open and wonderful to interact with I'm lucky enough not to have had Fitting my hands behind the back or something like that But we can't say enough about what you Have done day in day out for the citizens and residents of muski and what that means to our community And also just the way that you've done it and the culture and the police department's been Really inspiring to watch grow and I know each of you have played a huge role in that so thanks for all of your time Commitment and everything you've given in the community through the years. I really appreciate you Thank you No, so the city of muski In june Solicited applications for treasurer and went through interview processes in july and into august as well And following negotiations of conversations The panel put forward a list of finalists Alex hill or alexander hill is a muski resident. We've provided for you today His resume and background as well as his letter that Showed his interest in the position and reasoning behind it. We found alex to be a very engaged I'll say up and coming financial mind. So he was very excited to Get in learn the ropes, but we bring before you this evening alex hill as the proposed Appointment for the treasurer position Um should his selection Be confirmed this evening too We would get him in here in short order to meet with council and have an opportunity to converse with all of you But he's already hit the ground running in conversations with staff too about how they can get up to speed as quickly as possible So I think given the material that we provided to you. I don't know if anybody wants to add anything from Any questions concerns comments from council Any questions concerns comments from the public? Okay So seeing and hearing none. I'd entertain a motion for approval of alexander hill as treasurer for the city wunuski Motion by Nicole second by eric any further discussion Seeing and hearing none all those in favor of this a i i and those opposed motion carries Excited to work with alex All right next up is An annual update from our friends at channel 17 Good evening. Good evening. Thank you so much for having us. I'm lauren glendividian the executive director of cctv center for media and democracy We operate channel 17 town meeting television on behalf of the Chittenden county government access channel trustees So there's some interlocking things there and uh, I'll let everybody introduce themselves Hi, my name is dan logan. I'm the channel coordinator at channel 17 I'm Howard wooden. I'm your representative from the luski Yeah, so um, so we sent a memo in advance in the meeting. I imagine you all had a chance to read it So i'm we're happy to answer any specific questions that we have or that you have And then I can speak a little bit about Sort of the the current financial picture for channel 17, but the overall big picture about the Sort of the the quality and the Quantity of service that we deliver to you. I think you all have first hand knowledge of what we do at channel 17 I think that going live although tonight. We're not live Has been fairly successful for the city and When we look at when we measure that success, we're not really looking necessarily at how many people watch every Meeting, but there is a range. You have I think a growing audience for the live programming but when There's an issue of real concern That's where you see that many people are tuning in not just live but to the archival footage as well So this go-to resource that channel 17 has established to be Holds true as it has since 1990 You know when there's an issue of concern We're here and you're here as well We wanted to so may just pause and say were there any questions on what we provided to you And then I can say a little bit more about the budget request That's helpful. Do you want to ask any questions before we go into the budget numbers? Okay, great. Um, so since 1990 we've been concerned about the declining cable revenue and you know when people say They ask us about this. It's been 30 years that Um That non cable companies have been in the space of providing video services and we're starting to see in the Comcast realm It furlinks telecom is holding steady, but you're served currently by Comcast in Winniski There's been this sort of flat revenue And that's um And in the last quarter for example when you would see a lot of A typical increase because college students are back in town There was a less than a percent decrease in their revenue So we're just sort of seeing this slow erosion And we know that and we've been working to diversify our revenue in a variety of ways As I outlined in the memo But at the beginning of uh, January Comcast made a major adjustment due to their accounting practices, which we just um were able to confirm was a one time Which resulted in a five of $50,000 gap in revenue for channel 17 And um, so this is an adjustment that's that we could address with the help of the member municipalities Of each of the member municipalities increase their contribution And in the case of winniski and the other smaller communities, it would be from $6,000 to $12,000 a year And I don't need to go into the math of the value of what we provide to you because I think you understand the value of what we provide So I won't make that financial justification But we did confirm that that was a one-time adjustment on the part So other than the regular kind of erosion of revenue that we see that we're addressing through annual campaigns Essentially in effect really building up our annual giving and membership base Sort of like from on public Radio, you know sort of in that model. That's the model. We really need to move in that direction as well We're asking if you would consider in your budget process To increase the the very generous contribution from $6,000 to $12,000 So let's start off too by saying we are and I hope you get to see the messages we've filmed here And at other points in time when we've reflected on the value of what you bring to our community in terms of Information access to people to engage on issues in a way that's meaningful that they otherwise would not have It's Astounding to me how many people come up and tell you that they've watched A meeting or that they regularly watched the meetings Some people they'll tell us that, you know, they do it when their baby can't sleep Because of the drone of our voices, but in in seriousness, they're They're there aren't Words to state how beneficial you are as a resource to our community and the value that you provide so First off, we are just immensely appreciative of all that you do. Thank you very much and and We know that you do a lot with a little and the budget is reflective of that. So thank you And to Howard, we appreciate all your time as our representative on the board I hear generally you do a really good job To so we are very appreciative all the time effort energy that you put into it know that you bring a professional Lins to it as well. And we're really I appreciate having such a qualified person to do it. So thank you And for The request it's certainly something we could take under advisement And especially as one time it could be something we could look at reserve allocation potentially for So we'll have that conversation And Absolutely turn over that request And ensure that you receive a response from us Thank you. Yeah So, um, first of all, just thank you for the service that you provide. Um, and I I do think the live coverage is uh Is a great addition to the to the range of opportunities people engage with the government. So thank you I was interested in the fact that in the memo Um, the revenue from concrack comcast in burlington telecom is shared by three channels. So Channel 17 vcam and retn and you said later in the memo that you are looking to sort of coordinate better work. I don't know What what the term you use merging some technical operations? I'm just wondering What where are those conversations at between those three organizations? I would imagine in a time of constrained resources Uh, someone on the school side of things. I know there's a lot of discussion about consolidating functions as as pressure starts to apply be applied for changes in technology and population and so I'm just curious about that Absolutely We've we've discussed the question of merging our overall operations for I would say about seven years And what we were able to agree on was merging some of our technical operations So we built a technical hub at their location In the media factory and on flint avenue and then burlington telecom provided some dark fiber To us to connect from the old north end to the south end And instead of buying our own standalone playback system We are we bought into their playback system. So we're in the process of completing that transition of the playback system But it is contingent on this Technical hub that we built together, which is quite an accomplishment Um, and it it's very promising. It's in the same building as internet too So potentially allows us to connect to the other access centers around the state for archiving purposes So We've been able to manage that we have a shared bookkeeper Channel 17 and retn so we're sort of taking inching little steps to back end And I think that the three organizations are Unique with their own history and so there's you know cultural questions You know, ultimately we're all in the same business and the question of merging our operations must remain on the table Right and in my experience baby steps like this Start to build that relationship and trust where you can actually start to have the bigger picture Conversations if that if it goes well, but it doesn't go well then That needs to be a discussion. So I applaud you for taking those steps. Yeah, thank you for pointing that out Are there things since we've got the public audience are there things the individuals can do in addition to What you prescribe from the municipal standpoint in terms of our contributions and support Do you want to add anything at this moment donations are always very And also getting involved in some of our program would be great as well To get more exposure to more people in our studio and on our channel. We have a pretty open door policy Anywhere between 9 30 and 4 o'clock any weekday we will film the show and put it on So it's important for people to have that platform And that would be a great way for the public to get more involved in what we do That's great. And I think also programming ideas So i'm not sure did we do anything with the one iski Halloween? No, so we've been busy this month. Yeah, no, we've been super busy this month But that's a good example of a kind of unique community event that you know, we can't go out cover everything But those are don't hesitate to let us and dan in particular know that there are these programs and these things happening because we're happy to know about them and promote them And you know This community is so vibrant and is it's like a snowball And there's just so much happening here. It's it's very exciting and I just think we would like to see More programming that reflects the remarkable civic life of this city Do do you cover school board meetings in town? RIT and RIT and so RIT and does all the school board RIT and is the educational access operation V cam is the public access And then we we are government access and you know someday if you ever want to know the unique history. I'm happy to CCTV as kind of the mothership of public access in vermont Celebrating 35 years in june And that star right at the video cafe at dan higgins. So when a ski was born in when a ski I do want to share my appreciation for you luring land and your team You just mentioned the erosion of the Comcast revenues that obviously have an impact on the fees that they pay you Going forward. Do you see that erosion growing and is that of concern? Yeah, I think it will increase because I think people are cutting the cord so to speak So I I don't think it will be as precipitous as this five percent gap adjustment that they made Which was resulted in $50,000, but it's just little by little And um and that has an effect on staffing. I mean think about v cam r atn and channel 17 all having a $50,000 gap I mean that's two people So that's very foremost in our mind and that's why I think we have to really build our annual campaign at the same time Um, I didn't go we didn't go into detail here, but you know the technical needs and the technical Infrastructure of channel 17 is only getting more complex and more expensive. You would think that might not be the case but it is there's no You know, we use equipment as long as we possibly can we really sort of just take it to the limit and stand nose But it's not like there's cheaper new cameras. They're always expensive and the um the infrastructure to maintain going live, etc, etc It's just it's a capital intensive business and it's a personnel intensive business. So It's pretty remarkable actually as you said that we're delivering the The volume of content that we are for the price and that is a huge credit to the staff and the board it's a remarkable group of people and I think you know that We're going to be waiting for those winnisky and ward one results. So you're going to take a really long time And So Good luck tomorrow Any questions comments concerns from the public Thank you so much. All you do. We really appreciate you coming in. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks very much Okay Next up on tonight's agenda is an indeed which is the musky valley parks district annual presentation So going low tech tonight Thank you So i'll do a quick intro for these folks and then Let them jump in but uh Nick moran director and moran chacote and one of your program director Both folks that we work with a ton throughout the course of the year As you probably see in the materials, they don't presently Formally manage any spaces in the city, but they've been a huge resource for us as with our department Coming up four years ago We've started to take a more focused look at the the parks and trails and how we're maintaining those Areas in particular are sensitive natural areas like cassava and memorial parks So they've been an enormous resource. Nick and I speak quite frequently throughout the year about various issues Tim who works there Does all that the trail work for them has been a big resource and moran is great on the programming front I want we need to bounce ideas around so really Pretty instrumental for us as a department. I'm pretty excited to hear the report tonight and I'm turned over from there Thank you. Appreciate the time and I'll try to keep it swift because I know you're tight agenda And for those of you who are not familiar Our district has been in business since 1972 as a Incorporated municipality And we have seven member towns of which blue whiskey has been a member for a quarter of a while Also incorporated as a nonprofit back in 1985. So we're kind of a hybrid We take advantage of both designations You have a trustee erin dupuis not here today, but I can tell you she's been very active and engaged I think she's enjoying it too Our trustees meet monthly and we're very much hands on And I know this presentation. This is a PowerPoint that I traditionally give I think probably the biggest news for us this year broadly is we get just acquired a new park or an acquisition mode It's a two and a half acre parcel near the river mouth On the Burlington sites the former rivers and marina and we just closed on that in august 28th and we're in the process of Finalizing the FEMA grant we have to announce the buildings and naturalizing it would be a new canoe kayak Access which would be open to the public. So we're pretty thrilled about that We also have a property in the Williston that we're taking a close look at we've made a pitch to acquire I'm meeting with the conservation board this week on that There's also another property In Burlington adjacent to the homestead that we're focused on and a property in Colchester Another one in Jericho that we're going to be meeting with the conservation board out there in december So I heard some things from LG's presentation which really relates us, you know incremental growth. So This is I'm going into my I've been doing this for about four and a half years Our growth with the city has been pretty substantial in that, uh, you know, Gnuski's history of financial history and our Relationship with the city. We used to manage Casper. We used to lease it and we didn't lease it A lot of things that happen. I think where we're at now I think we're described pretty well and that we really worked on building the relationship and understanding expectations And work with Jesse and Alicia We've had a very strong relationship for quite a while on the programming side with JFK And also have found that our ability to Raise revenue is really based around the two leads that we've identified once on the programming and after school side The other is on the contracting side. So we've been doing More work. We have a contract with south Burlington. We also just did some work for Williston We've done some work for when you ski Both on a contracted basis and then as you know, geez to come over and we'd like this drill basis. So We felt that that was a really important thing to build up and most recently We've had some conversations about memorial park And interestingly and raise honor to speed on this we met with the folks at redstone last week And there is a willingness to help us create a new canoe kayak access We had initially talked about a spot near the ccrpc building and Larry suggested we'll have you looked at the the old carpet plant the dr Building and they owned the property between the river in that building So we're going to take a look at that. I think it's fair to say in public domain that they've been incredibly supportive of that so our hope is within The next calendar year that we have a site identified And you know our approach might my board is great that we have a very generic approach to conservation, which is As long as there's a good outcome we consider a property that's that's a win. So we partner with most most land trusts and land management organizations Since we're not a membership organization that competes with various land trusts and conservation groups It allows us to have a very clear cut in relationship. Frankly with these groups as they help bring this fun And the old easements for a good example being With what the former rivers and marina vhcb provided some money burlington conservation legacy provided some money in the lake shampolyn land trust these are partner and vhcb in Lake shampolyn land trust will co-hold an easement on the property And then we will manage it only for the long term. So that's the model that we work in and We're finding ourselves Really interesting spot. We know a lot of flood plain wetlands and given the current water quality issues We're we're finding ourselves front and center And I think my board realizes that over the next decade it really Exists to lean into those types of acquisitions you repair in flood plain type properties So I've moved around a little bit. I'm not going straight through a presentation here, but I've been here before for a lot of you folks Financially you've got the you've got all the documents. Okay, so We were able to keep our allocation flat for the last two years Um This year we're increasing by We're asking the towns to increase by four point eight percent So we're pretty pleased about that because the difference is made up through our program and and contracting income Which is something that we're growing over time So our stu has increased By seven hundred eighty four dollars last year to this and Uh That's that's the financial side The other towns have been I always get this question. How about the other towns? Well, we're actually in pretty good shape this year with everyone We've already got at three or four towns. We already said we were just going to put it right in our budget So we're feeling pretty strong going in to fiscal year 20 It's been a good year in terms of our visibility and our ability to Expand other resources a bit more than we have How do I do so far? It's great Any questions? Well, I want to say as a new newer member up here. Um, yes, it's nice to have you guys come in and present this Relatively new information to me. Um, so thank you for coming um, I did want to ask for Is there something you're adding to programming or adding to your workload That's like driving the increase so that you'd want to share with folks that will be new in the next year Well, the things that always cost more money are personnel insurance utilities and We've Frankly As I look at national standards for our kind of organization. We're underfunded By about 150,000. So I actually feel like we're each year pushing up against The ceiling but we are increasing our land holdings which You know means extra maintenance extra time And we are increasing our our programming that tends to It's an initial investment that tends to come back in the form of revenue in the long term We've added one hourly Employee running Cretol who's been with us almost as long as I've worked here started as Doing a senior project. It was an AmeriCorps and it was a summer camp counselor things on the crew The man does everything So he actually his presence in the organization is creating opportunities for new revenue. So He's an investment that we've made so It's a long way to answer your question. I'm actually quite thrilled that we've been able to keep the costs as low as we have And that we're we're constantly pushing up against That financial ceiling And a good thing about having a board that is so involved is it really keeps you Disciplined in terms of how you spend money in our you know, our treasurer who is very experienced and So it's just it really is the cost of doing business that has caused the race Thank you for that information. Yeah, we're four years in Nick four and a half years First of all, I Have a question. Yes the In the Memo you cited the well, I think it's important just That there are no Plants our park facilities or parks it within windows keys foundry obviously many of our residents access other parks within the within the district but I think that's often come up in the past is that we don't have parks That are managed through the windows key valley park district within this within the city, but you mentioned other Activities that are occurring in windows key. You also Referenced contract work. So I'm just wondering I thought that's what I heard. Yes, so I'm just wondering were there additional Um with with those fee for service contracts and Um, so I mean, I guess I'm trying to differentiate what is included in terms of the services for being a member of the district and paying their providing an annual contribution Versus contract work. That's a great question because that's that's the balance. So We provide technical support to all our members and I think where we Kind of draw the line is, you know, if the crew has to show up and spend a day and do physical work on a site That's where we say, okay. This is a fee based thing if it's not within our parks um Tim our our park superintendent has 17 years of experience Yeah, so He gets deployed to our member towns to Supervised crews to help out with volunteer days And that is something we do pro bono within our organization um We also like to team up with towns to help on, you know, thinking through park design and grant applications and so forth So there is a balance, you know within we have a contract with south berlington. They have a bond issue So we actually have a pretty robust relationship with them on the contracting site and we also maintain parks in south berlington So they're kind of the example of what the future could hold for us Um, I'll be honest with you. We're really interested in big memorial park It's preliminary to have that conversation in the spring and on you guys, but everything we've done Is to sort of test that assumption to see if it makes sense I think it's fair to say that amongst us and we there's a I think very rightly with all the issues you folks have in front of you in the swimming pool and you know, uh, that we've sort of eased into that discussion But this uh, I think this canoe and kayak launch could be a really interesting catalyst because if you look at the property map Redstone owns the parcel land that's right next to memorial And we just heard last week from one of the principals that yeah, you could put a right way through there It's fine. You know, so I I think There's the potential that that area could become a really exciting asset if it does You know, then it would require our level of management and then maybe you know, we might be back in front of you folks saying We'd like to test an assumption and I think as it is with that parcel I mean you you probably recall we did a pretty significant cleanup down there last year And certainly on the front end and the back end of that in terms of keeping activity keeping trails maintained Park district has been instrumental. I mean, they were really critical in helping us get through that pretty significant project And keeping things going. I mean, I think that's been a big part of it is making sure that There's positive traffic through that space to avoid some of the challenges that built up over time I'll say Lauren alone, I think is like our number one customer down there based on social media posts But it's it's great to have like positive traffic through there more people using the park in the right way, frankly Um, so again, I think there's an interesting groundwork late for some future work around this and and the canoe launch in general I mean, I think we've seen With the current launch being in sort of varying states of repair and disrepair based on the water coming up and down It's an asset that people really look for, you know, whenever it gets washed out or getting emails and phone calls about when it's going to get fixed So I think this could be an interesting opportunity to move it to a space It's going to be a little bit more protected and um a little bit more consistently accessible for users So that was my pleasure. So we didn't we didn't work on the coming launch not too long ago? And is that that now been wiped away? Yeah, I mean there was literally 100 feet of shoreline that was carved away in 2011 and then there was Sort of an access path at it And we repaired the steps a couple of times and then we just realized that it was a safety hazard And so it was pulled out several months ago. Um, that was our crew and your crew. We have a lot of team efforts here And then we've been on a wasn't better location get closer to the dam The danger from the water is a lot higher for inexperienced paddlers. So we're looking downstream We first looked at a spot that's that's next to the cc rpc building probably presents some brownfields and engineering challenges uh, but Like I said, redstone seems to be open to talking about that other location and uh, So we're following up on that. Um, that would you know, we're all establishing right away and so forth The part the other thing we'd sort of bring in is you know, we do have an attorney who works a very cheaper pro bono for us And he gets involved and helps us Provide model agreements for towns, even if they're working on projects that we're not involved with so we try to Both do what makes sense for organization and keep it fair between the member towns at the same time provide a certain level of The technical support So that's a great question because that's the balance This isn't so much a Specific really your efforts. It's just sort of a global concern that I have shared With our neighbors in burlington too is everywhere else In this entire region actually across country the word recreational economy is huge from a buzz standpoint and It feels like something in chitney county that we're missing from a coordinated Campaign an effort scam point and You know, lusky's the most insid-populated community in the state and I think over 25 percent of our landmass is still green or In a natural state. So even here We have those assets And I I just want to express I I do think that there's a space for somebody And it's happening in rural communities where they're struggling economically to try to reinvent themselves You know places like berk a lot of places in koas county, new hampshire invested a lot of money time and effort in creating A line to to people who Better communication about what transactional benefit quite frankly exists also for maintaining these spaces Not just preservation and maintenance for the sake of preservation and maintenance And I I think from a tax-based perspective. That's some somewhere where municipalities can always use a little additional help In explaining our investments In a very coordinated just quite frankly financial manner to folks Right. You speak to conservation economics is you know, you can literally if you want to house next to a conserved parcel It's actively conserved your house is worth four to 20 percent more than If you're next to a consultant, it's not being managed or it is is, you know its ownership isn't doubt and You can attach dollar values to every linear foot path, you know, I get I get that That's that's a really important message and what's unique about muski is you know the Casablan park area and Catalan island and the sd island parcel across which we got donated some land Is actually one of the most important conservation areas on the muski river is astonishingly high value So you guys are in possession of a very important ecological asset It may not seem like it but it You know that and the whole riverfront From from the dam all the way down to the To the river mouth is is highly value And relatively stable. So doing acquisitions along those that whole corridor is something that's a real priority for us And I guess I would also point out that we're sort of uniquely positioned to take on the smaller projects You know, if you're going to donate us 3 000 acres of land probably doesn't make sense for our organization, but if it's 50 acres and it meets active management and has direct value to the community Better to serve So it's a certain niche that we feel Yeah, you make a good point in terms of how we express our value. That's somebody to do a better job with Other questions comments concerns from council Take this opportunity to see if there's any questions concerns comments from the public Thank you for your time. We appreciate it. Thanks for all the work you do and the value add to the region and Just we always have that conversation about there's not something located You know physically in the city from mass at standpoint, but I want to make it clear that we do recognize what a regional um The regional importance and how interconnected we all are so that's that's obviously very very much acknowledged Respected and appreciated the work that you do Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thanks Next up is item So next up we have discussion of the non-union fire competition policies and plan So i'm gonna talk slowly Um So we have talked about this a couple of times obviously this uh Doing this wage study compensation plan was an operational priority for us during our goal setting session um This is really a key step we feel to as we professionalize the non-union portion of our workforce Obviously, and you'll hear more of this from julie. Um, but a significant portion of our workforce is unionized and then a significant portion is non-unionized and we Believe going back through the records that are we have not done a comprehensive study of our competitiveness our competitiveness and our equity across positions on the non-union side since um 2010 2011 so this was long overdue and a real um, I think what you'll hear from julie is a real, uh A real, um attempt towards that level of professionalization um I'm going to stop talking because julie Has spearheaded this effort and done a huge amount of work with angela's support and chief audi's support as well So the credit really goes to the three of them for putting together these proposals So i'll try to go through this Efficiently and briefly. I spoke to the staff for about half an hour and I will I will truncate my My comments for you um As jesse said, this is a redevelopment process that we've been working on for a couple of years when I first started with the city of Winooski This was the first thing that the then city manager said we've been working on this We don't know what to do next take this project over. So this is sort of the culmination of that work Um to give you sort of a sense of who we are as a city We have 102 positions in the city of Winooski 56 of them are full time In Winooski full time is 30 hours and above Part time is then 29 hours and below We have 65 regular positions. Those are positions for which there is no planned timeframe or end Versus, you know attempt seasonal or intern position where there is a beginning and end to those positions We also have a designation called on call or per diem. That's our fire department is primarily on call and per diem staff and then we have a number of Dispatchers and police officers who fill in gaps in our schedule that are on call and per diem They work specifically only when they're needed to fill in a gap in the schedule We have two contract employees We have a nice balance of leadership supervisory and non supervisory staff And the majority of our staff are actually covered under a pay plan other than the non union wage plan So they're covered under a collective bargaining agreement or under the fire pay plan that we'll talk about in a little bit There are 35 staff then that are covered under the non union wage plan And that'll be important when I talk about what's currently in place So currently we have in place a steps and grades chart. This is not the whole thing. This is just a portion of it That has 15 grades across 30 steps Employees are placed in the steps and grades chart at the time of hire and then they increase Annually they go up a step every year at the beginning of the fiscal year and the whole chart is updated by kola annually The steps across are about 1 percent between them And the way we've placed positions in the steps and grades chart up to this point is by looking at and you can't really see it on this but The left column there has Position titles so when we create a new position we look at the position titles that we have in The steps and grades chart and say well this new position looks kind of like an administrative position one So we place it in the same Great and then compensate it based on that range The personnel policy references classification, but it doesn't currently provide us any guidelines or specific definitions on how we place Positions in the steps and grades chart and new hires have been placed In steps for their grade based primarily on budget availability So if there's a person that leaves and they're at a grade 10 When we hire the new person we negotiate up to a grade 10. So we've been using vacancy savings Sometimes to meet the market need So as I worked in this for the last couple of years i've Identified some concerns that I have about the way we execute our wage plan now For one we have far too many grades for the population that this serves We have 35 positions in 15 grades and so that coupled with the way that we place the positions in the steps and grade scale We've ended up in a scenario where we have Some grades with a number of positions in them and some grades with no positions in them at all So clearly we don't have the right ratio of grades to the number of positions that this plan serves Um, not all of our non union positions are currently compensated within the steps and grades chart that we have There's no policy that explains why that is at this point Um, and the placement of positions in steps and in the steps and grades chart We currently have is definitely open to interpretation and some um Making assumptions in biases because we don't have a A standard criteria that we grade these positions by There's no policy right now that guideline that Guides us in terms of placing positions at the time of hire or at the time of promotion And no guideline in terms of when we add a significant change to a job description How we handle that as it relates to compensation compensation and as jesse said it's been 10 years or more since this this steps and grades chart has been looked at And reviewed and I don't know that it's ever been compared to the market. So we have not done that We've also had a scenario where we've treated our part-time positions and our full-time positions differently So there was an assumption or a A school of thought before I came to the city of wenewski that if it was a part-time position It was valued less than a full-time position even if the work was the same So we have had scenarios where we had two people doing similar work at different rates of pay Um, so as I sort of identified these concerns over the last couple of years I set some specific goals to try and To resolve those one of course is to look at state and local comparative data To develop a system by which we place positions using a common tool and standard definitions Um consistently in our pay scale We want to consider internal equity And then evaluate positions in such a way that compensation is equitable and without bias to the extent that we can do that And then support our recruitment and retention Efforts we've spent a lot of time over the last couple of years Trying to professionalize our Recruitment process so we've brought in really good people and now we want them to stay So You know as I consider those goals. I reviewed alternate plans. I have a lot of conversations with my colleagues Both in the private sector and in the public sector We gathered wage data from the vermont league of cities and towns and the bureau of labor and statistics And then I began to develop policies based on the best practices And my goal was to develop to develop policies that clearly define how we address wages Throughout the employment cycle from beginning to end through promotions and right through someone's retirement if they stay here that long Um, and then of course to really define How we place the positions in the steps and grace charts. So that's not consistently So then um, I went out to my Co-workers and asked them to participate in this project by going through a citywide job description update So we updated the format of our job descriptions We created common standards that tie the job descriptions back to the strategic vision plan Include diversity and equity Language include teamwork and customer service language So that that's included in all of the job descriptions at every level across the across the city We also created Uh equity language as it relates to minimum skills and um Education in each job description. So if a position requires a bachelor's degree We added language that said bachelor's degree or Equivalent combination of years of experience. So to intentionally to open the door to folks who may not have a Formal degree but have the same skills that they've obtained in other ways Um, and then while we were working on the job description review, Angela very diligently Updated our steps and grace chart and we'll talk about that a little more in a second so, um Just to kind of run down all of the important parts of the plan that's that's proposed before you First we define classified versus non classified positions So classified essentially just means classified into the non union reach plan So it was a way of defining which positions were in this plan versus which positions are covered by some other plan within the city And we've included that in the job descriptions. So if I win the lottery tomorrow and go away The next HR manager can pick up this information and know how this particular position is compensated um This plan also directs the process for placement of positions in the pay scale So we developed 10 weighted categories. Each of those categories has between three and five levels and each level has a point Associated with a point value associated with it. So to grade the positions We look at the job description and the content of the job description assign those point values and at the end We have a total points and that total points equals a step or a grade excuse me in the um step and grades chart Um, and we've truncated the step and grades chart to be more appropriate for our size So we've um narrowed it down to eight grades across 15 steps with the um, so The previous steps in grade chart had 30 steps We have the same increase in the 15 step grade chart But we've front loaded it with the assumption that the years that you are Your earlier years in the city of windows gear the years in which you're learning the most So we're rewarding the years in which there is a steepest the steepest learning curve um, this plan also addresses um How we'll use compensation as part of recruitment by setting Some structure around where we place new hires in the pay plan and setting limits on that um, it continues to recommend annual step increases And has parameters for how we'll evaluate positions when job duties change And how we'll handle compensation when someone is promoted to a new grade or voluntarily demotes to another grade So we've outlined all of that the idea here is to Level the playing field as it relates to salary conversations to remove as much bias as possible So that the compensation is based on the work that's done and the skills required to do that work um, so once we had the Job descriptions updated in the tool built and the plan built out Angel and I went through and updated or graded all of the positions in the city of windows gear Well that are in this plan anyway with the exception of our own. We did not grade our own positions And as we did that we constantly Um Went through a checks and balances process So every position that we graded we went back and looked at the previous positions that we graded to make sure we were treating them Similarly if they had similar Qualifications or budget responsibility or what have you and then we checked Where they landed in the current wage plan Against what we knew to be the market for that Position to make sure that all of those things lined up once that was complete We took it to jesse and we did a city-wide Looked at every single position and did an internal equity review Um, then we compared where those positions landed to where the current staff salaries were And found that 16 of our positions were below the pay range developed in the new plan Five of them are six percent or more below the new range Five or five percent or less and there are six positions that are Five percent or less below the new range, but we're adding making additional changes to them and those are our thrive positions So we've treated those as Seasonal positions so that folks have reapplied every year for their position You know and they reapply in the fall for the school year. They reapply in the spring for the summer Um, and we've had some good retention with that staff And we we don't want to ask them to continue to reapply for the same job So we're looking at those as regular positions rather than temps and seasonals There are 14 positions that are within the range and five that fell above the range So from there, we looked at the contingency line on the salary contingency line and made a plan To propose to you on how we would address Adjusting these salaries so Employees whose current salaries are six percent or more below the new pay range Our recommendation is to adjust them at least 50 percent towards the minimum for fy 19 And then place them in step one of their new range for fy 20 employees whose salaries are below The new pay range by five percent or less We're not recommending a change for them for fy 19 But recommending placing them in step one for fy 20 and then for employees who are within their range We've figured out where they would fall on the pay scale and they would just continue to move up a step each year Those that are at the top would receive a cola increase Only after they reached step 15 And there's no plan to To reduce salaries as part of this process So that's the non union wage plan and then John and angel and i did quite a bit of work related to the part time and per diem firefighters Actually the the creativity around this plan all came from the chief Do it Do you want to ask questions about the non union plan before we move on to the All of them anybody want to pause for questions? Yeah Good evening. Good evening. We've got the time chief's fiddle with me Little support So um kind of by not knowing I was working on Internally with the officers and the membership At the same time trying to figure out a compensation plan for Our part time firefighters and per diem folks And it happened to kind of cross with what the city and what julie was doing So made sense to kind of roll it all together. Obviously. They've earned all of them with angel It's pretty instrumental in doing this the old wage plan for the fire department was at times non-existent Kind of initially was done on a stipend per call type Scenario angela worked with chief bergeron to Create a five-year plan that assured minimum wage And they put in years for service. So it was zero to five five to 10 10 15 And that was the end of the plan. Um, this is a last year of that plan. So this is kind of all lining up When folks come into the fire service particularly here in manuski You know, there's a set of standards in which training standards in which we have to assure people have That essentially we require them to go get for us. That's 80 hours Of we call it the counting class. It's a basic class And we don't require the state mandated or the state not mandated the state recommended firefighter one We're not a full-time department. So we don't have to have Firefighter one, although we highly encourage it So we looked at our current budget what's allotted for part-time salaries in It's a reward system. So we assure that there's minimum wage And then as people progress through and get training they get the counting class. They get a little more an hour They get hazmat. They get a little more an hour They start to drive our equipment. They get a little more an hour. It goes out to Where I feel we feel Makes the most sense for manuski to place its money And reward these folks and that's up through fire instructor firefighter one and two People can go on and on and on through their Get training and certifications. We certainly want to encourage that but there are Limits to our budget. We can't You know for me to send someone to firefighter one and pay them as a part-time employee is about 300 bucks So if we had four or five of those a year That's pretty significant. So this is a step in the In a significant significantly different direction of we will reward them It's their own time We will support them in doing that and on the back side We can give them more an hour because they're bringing some value back to the Back to the city If I can interject or second chief So this is very similar of if for those of you who are here when we ratified the ask me contract of how we looked at Buying a better product for the taxpayer dollar. So If you remember in the ask me contract, we said if you get your cdl You can go up to an eo2 so in theory We could have all eo2s and no eo ones with the thought that the more qualified staff We have the better able we are to deploy our resources In a variety of more efficient ways same principle here, you know, the chief is talking about rewarding staff It's also a way to build up skill sets across staff So when there's a call and there's only two or three people responding Those two or three people are as trained in a variety of things as possible and therefore the residents are getting the best service It's kind of in a nutshell what we what we've done We've spoken obviously the membership about it Some other pieces defined in here and that's our You know, we now have a pretty specified training program the state requires 24 hours of research hours We will provide 72 hours Through our plan and that's that will be done on three wednesdays You know history is we people would arrive on wednesday and And then be told what the training is or in some cases the training would be put together at that time So we've front loaded it and created modules for the training So that if you're on if you're a member for this wednesday, we can send it to you on global group You'll understand what what's expected that night Just try to front load and become more efficient and effective of how we're delivering the training So our models through this incentivized plan will will support people with 72 hours of training And we'll pay people to go to the county class because we require it the 80 80 hours And then they can progress if they have other aspirations to really get some Some further training or if we in the future want to move to the firefighter one model modules We can expand the program And this addresses your coverage concerns for this station Because we've developed two types of firefighters for part-time So there's two classifications of firefighters in this plan. There's part-time firefighters, which is any interested Community member or someone in the area who wants to to come and join the team and we'll be provided the training That the chief talked about and then to cover more station hours There's per dean firefighters who are active with other agencies Get permission to come to work for the city of wormsky during their off hours Because generally they work 24 on 4 to 8 off so they can spend some of that 48 off with us And we're seeing some huge benefits of that. We know from for Any afternoon to our part-time staff get back from their jobs You know six six to seven that night. There's a huge hole for us And that's one of our higher call volume times So we've intentionally got them here saturday sundays to help alleviate some of the part-time stress and then also four to eight during the weekdays And we're seeing some benefits to that so the Proposal to implement this would be along with the change in minimum wage for january first Because it continues to be based on minimum wage. So minimum wage is always the base rate With these add-on amounts for certifications So really the request for you tonight per the personnel plan and the charter as outlined Your action if you so choose is to adopt the two different policies In one step and then also approve the updated job description Purposes funding sources and classification Which is again as outlined in the personnel plan and we're happy to answer It's a lot of information. So I have to answer any questions Let's open it up And chew on this longer than others have seen it. So first of all, I just want to commend you guys for A Really tremendously professional process that was clearly undergone here that was very thoughtful and thorough and at a level of sophistication that With no Malice towards, you know past Um times in the city, um, you know, we certainly were not capable of without You individuals in place and the support of angel. I thank you so much and all the Um directors and staff from from everyone up and down So just want to say thank you very very very much for that process And I think that regardless of what conversations unfold or reflections of people I think we all recognize that the city's greatest asset Is the humans that come in and out of these buildings every day and provide the services and the work for the people That We can fund stuff, right? We can put money into bins to be used But it means nothing if it's not being Executed well and done in a professional manner and we're incredibly appreciative of that work every day And that there's been broad recognition as a city that this is something that's been overdue. So thank you for Putting together a really great product that was easy to follow from a process standpoint and With clear reasoning and rationing for conclusions that you came to Julie I've I guess I'll just kick off questions. I I'm curious as to A lot of step programs that are more accustomed to seeing have Steps for a couple years to acknowledge Need for retention of folks early in their career And also for the quick advancement that they're likely making in terms of their contributions to the organization And then tend to have multi-year holds On those steps to then start to encourage longevity And the reason it's weighted that way of my understanding has always been is to then value the fact that the retention of you is Part of we've invested in getting you capable of doing the job, right? And then after that is to reward longevity because that's the next piece because just from a cold hard number of perspective The biggest expense now is not necessarily you doing the job a little bit better or worse But actually having to replace you as an individual. Sorry to talk about people that way, but that's probably the deal, right? so what's the What's the thinking between One year one step I'm interested in that So i'm kind of going along with what you're saying we front loaded the steps and grade charts So the increases are larger in the beginning and then they taper off for that same reason The reason for a one-year one step is to make sure that we maintain that market value So that we're within the market range for those positions and don't fall out of that before we do our next market review I mean i've wrote it i've written into this plan that we would do that every three to five years But you know that could be someone else's responsibility. It may be something that happens. It may not be so at least this plan is built to Um be sustainable and continue whether or not the city goes out and does that market review in a couple of years Uh, I have a similar question. Maybe um How might these new policies impact employee retention So employee retention is the number one reason for putting these policies into place When we have a pretty high turnover rate for a public organization. I think our 2017 Turnover was somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 and we're trending upwards of that for 2018 So by having something clear consistent that the employees have access to that they can look at they can look at their jobs They can look at where they're going in the organization And to some degree they can also look at the steps and grade chart and then the other job descriptions that you know may Help them plot out where they're going to go next within the city All of that helps with retention all of that helps reduce the the turnover that we're experiencing Turnover is my primary concern because it's expensive. It takes between 30 and 45 days to refill a position and The hr metrics that that gets thrown around is that it's 30 to 50 of the salary to Is the cost of replacing someone so if you look at our salary costs and having You know 20 percent of our employee population turnover. It isn't concerned Thank you I have a question about the cost impact chart. I just want to make sure we get the right way so F in particular f y 20 costs with no plan implementation versus with plan implementation And in the memo there's a few different Numbers i'm just so i'm just confused so are those is it 71 1,667 dollars on top of the 79 748. Yes, okay, so we're adding it as we Correct. That's a confused. That's a confusing way. I think to to display that So and then it says in the memo With full plan implementation f y 20 the general fund additional impact would be 50,167 So so i'm just not clear how those numbers short. So um the cost across all funds is across all funds So many of our salaries are split between the general fund the water fund the wastewater fund the cdc fund the parking fund so the So the budgeted numbers in the chart are across all funds and the 50 167 is the general fund impact. That's the tax rate impact Okay, and so but the f y 20 I just want to be clear that the f y 20 cost with plan implementation Is almost double what it would be with no plan implementation correct right? Yes. Thank you So it's 140 150 across all funds And that's the really driven by the implementation Decision to to not we were trying to stay within budget for what we knew we had for this year Um and adjust people who are below that six percent percent are below the range And not touch the people who are zero to six to five percent below the range So once you actually start adjusting everyone to be equitable at step one of their grade That there becomes a bigger impact. I think it's important to note for tonight's discussion what we're asking you to adopt is the the Policy in the framework, you know, how we're valuing positions how the positions are talked about what grades they're put in etc It is still our obligation to bring you back an f y 20 budget that meets your financial goals So while this is currently our intention and certainly what we have talked to staff about Um, it is still ultimately the leaders my responsibility and the leadership team's responsibility to bring you back a budget that's according to your Previous goals Does that make sense? So that plan could change pending other budget decisions I you were not asking you to vote on that dollar amount tonight She's having no wheels in motion I think that's important to acknowledge with the goal of this works With that level of investment makes sense with that level of investment. So it's Agreed, but I think if you're taking one step, we should be prepared to take the next right, which is why we laid out the full impact right So I have a couple of questions um But first I want to say like reading through this It's very impressive to see all of this put together at once That the goals slide that you shared about you know, taking out bias having pay equity for staff is really important I think also having Something for staff to reference to understand their their role in their expectations Is really helpful When you were talking about the job descriptions um, and like how you Figured out what great folks should go into Is there like a sort of a standard profile or rubric type like to your Your illustration about should if you want a lottery and you weren't here tomorrow You know and you have a Someone's role change or a new role open up like how would that be evaluated against this? So if you look in the packet that you have there's an evaluation tool and that's the standard I think i'm answering your question That's the the standards that we use to evaluate all of the job So those are including like the types of tasks that folks would correct So if if I went away tomorrow the next person could pick that up and use that to to grade another position within the city okay, um I had some questions about the Front-loaded learning curve situation, but I think those have been addressed to um I had a question about the For the part-time staff for for fire department You know as you had said there's like multiple Like incremental increases that one can get for skill building and I just wondered if you all had been able to take the chance to Like see how that plays out and like if somebody like went all out and Really built themselves up would that still be feasible within like what you typically budget for? The answer is yes, um, so Historically fd has had a part-time budget and a number And this is has peeled that apart and You know there's instances where we've taken assigned You know admin time and been very pointed about where we're putting that and this is just another step in that um We were able to do This within this year's budget July or January 1st to June 30 just by Adjusting in You know fd historically has had a large surplus at the end of the year to the tune of sometimes 40 grand So this is part of our desire to be asking for money that we don't need And it's an investment for me. It's an investment in our people and our our model that we're providing the services with Into the question. Yeah, that's great to hear. Thank you How do you measure if this is successful or not? Our attention our turnover would go down Money isn't the only thing that keeps employees at a job, but it certainly is among the top two or three that And I do know I guess it's anecdotally that of the you know Staff that I've interviewed when they left they Not all but a number of them left four positions that paid more In another city or another organization doing similar work, but that paid more Are the metrics changing on the value of retention because people are changing jobs more quickly? I don't know that people are changing jobs more quickly Well, I suppose they are because our unemployment rate is low. I mean, there's I think the september number was 2.9 percent and I think I read that there's something like 7 000 open positions So we're competing with hundreds of other organizations for the same qualified candidate pool so possibly I also think another measure of success for both pay plans non union and the fire pay plan is How How our employees move throughout the system? So one of the things julie was very careful and building out in the system was grades that overlap and The evaluation chart with the job descriptions that show employees how they can advance in their career within the organization So I think a measure will be how many of our Employees move up in grades or up in positions over time as opposed to coming here getting really good experience And going to another city for that next professional move If they can see a path here that they would stay and keep that local expertise here I think we have some great examples of that on our team already We also have some examples of that not on our team where we haven't been able to retain somebody here and give them that next growth opportunity similarly in the fire department how you can Come in as a community member who wants to serve and wants to give back gain skills and grow in kind of in leadership positions within the fire department because you have more skills that are able to operate different apparatus Do different technical skills do different trainings, etc. So I think it's both that retention, but also promotion within the organization I think it would be helpful for us Especially if this is something that's proposed to be on a three to five year schedule and regular schedule Which it should be should be a standardized thing is to really think about how we measure Its impact and its success um and I think because of Changing workforce demographics and the fact that people just don't have an interest in staying in jobs as long um I think it's going to be more than just retention Maybe it's you know consistent exit interview data that indicate what role wage is played I think for us having You guys are responsible for making these kinds of professional recommendations about what it looks like from uh Right we're We are expecting you to be the professional management team That's looking and thinking about that. I think from a cost benefit analysis for us In putting potential dollars forward, um from the taxpayers that having that Uh something in in on the back end of this that's going to very carefully consider Uh what its impact would be would be very helpful Not obviously as much for this you've Creating the justification for the system and it's way overdue from a timing perspective I think that's going to be really important as a next step Again, I think the exit interview is a key one there. Maybe it's an employee satisfaction survey too about what people I mean if you go into the Best business right by the Vermont business magazine The wage survey is a huge portion of how they grade those is how people feel that they're compensated in relation to their professional peers No, I just get paid enough, right? So So I will Same talking speaking a little bit out of school here We are not competitive with our surrounding communities. I mean even with this proposal our Ranges are below the average for cities in Shannon County So I worry a little about that because I think you know I will use me so as not to put other other staff If I were to compare my salary to city manager salaries, it's it that's not where I'm going to get my professional satisfaction I'm going to get my professional satisfaction by being part of a team that's doing innovative things and as thoughtful and as connected and working for an interesting community I'm not sure we're ever going to win on the employee satisfaction question based on compensation Yeah, which is appropriate. I mean, I think given our demographics I was actually going to Ask the question about the wage data comparison But I mean the same is true for the school district employees and that At least on the school district side the funding is shared more broadly across the state We don't have that luxury on the city side. We really have to draw from our tax base within the city boundaries and We have to I think our compensation plans need to reflect The ability of our residents to support And I do think that the job satisfaction Does come from more than just compensation. I think to me the biggest benefit and To this is being fair clear equitable and eliminating the risk of bias It's just an absolute necessity that will address those concerns and I appreciate the work that went into doing it and I just want to Like I have Some of our other conversations cost us against looking to south burlington or wilson or shellburn as Sort of the marketplace. I mean, I know we're in jitney county. And so that's a factor, but I also think That's not our economic reality city And that's that context is appreciated and I don't disagree with what you said It doesn't mean we don't have to explain it to people And doesn't mean that we don't have to tie a transactional value Of an expenditure to the taxpayer from an expectation standpoint If I weren't sitting in government, I would demand the same thing from them And telling me what benefit transaction am I getting from that saying that we've made Something that's not good a little bit better and we feel better about ourselves for that It's not an excuse not not a reason why most people I think are going to accept that So I do think we've got to balance those two conversations and discussions and in the secondary piece I just want to bring up in this is kind of large Philosophical stuff for us, but I just we I don't think we can take an action like this where you're moving the baseline natural appreciation of expenses for the city On an annual basis. This is not just impact one year It's it moves the needle for then what the cola impacts going to be a year over a year Is that This body needs to understand every time we make decisions like this that there's a long term time Impact for that and that has to steer and guide Decisions that we make in other areas about the way our our tax base is being managed It's nice to to do what's right and do the right things We have to in my opinion back that up With responsible sound fiscal decisions that then support The growth in expenses that we're creating by doing something like this, which is absolutely the right thing to do But I just I can't let some of this go without throwing that back into our laps that we have a fiduciary responsibility for people Not to just do what's good for the humans at work here who do a great and wonderful job every day and year, but also to be sure that we're committed to Pushing forward strategies that make this financial sustainable long term So box I agree with that a little bit. I do kind of have a little some points of disagreement and one that's I think it's not just about Doing the right thing, but I think we heard there's an economic incentive For this if 20 percent of our positions go through turnover an annual basis and we're spending 30 percent of that position on Managing that turnover. This is a smart investment for the taxpayer. It's It's fiscally responsible, but I also do think we should pay people what they are worth and I do and I do I am interested in comparing ourselves to the surrounding communities because People's cost of living is just as high here Despite potentially getting paid wages that are less than their colleagues in similar positions around the state or around the region I do agree. There are a lot of Financial pressure points in general fiscally and when you see right now, but I think this is smart economics And also that's from a values perspective how we're treating our people. I think it's important Other questions comments concerns Do The next question for the body is get number one is There are any benefit from a budgetary development standpoint, etc to approving this now versus At a later meeting day I just want to put that out there So at the next meeting we will be presenting a budget to you right so in the absence of a vote on this We will be making some assumptions Because we will have to Build the budget based on some salaries so we should at least So if there are big if you are thinking about big changes So this is a lot of information it's a discussion that some of you have never engaged in before And for most of us we've just kind of said hey globally We know this is an issue that's upcoming and needs to be done for the last several years. We've had this conversation so I turn back to the council Somebody has spent some more time has a different degree of comfort with this to say Do you have additional questions? You think may surface as a result of spending some more time with this material since you had it since friday for some of you Or are there End up asking for a motion whether there's comfort moving forward with the proposal as is And you know the secondary piece is the financial Discussions do come later when it comes to dollars and cents But this would at least enact the framework and allow a budget to be Constructed based off of this And my own voice and your reservations about taking it on tonight is a voting item Are there other questions comments concerns for jeweler or jesse? I guess I wonder How might this policy Incentivize Growing a diverse work force Certainly by having competitive salaries. I mean we um, it gives us some leverage in Attracting talent from other places to musky. Um, and by the way, so I mean outside the borders of vermont potentially Um, I think also the language that we've changed in our job description to have equivalents Is probably more important in terms of growing a diverse population within our workforce Other questions comes concerns for jeweler jesse or chiefs The whole leadership team really did participate in this process. So if there are questions for any of them as well Many of them are here You know, we only get brief opportunities to express our appreciation for each and every one of you do every day, but Please do know we're talking about dollars and cents here, but You are a massively appreciated group of humans that does tremendous tremendous work and thank you for all that you do Any questions comments concerns from the public? So seeing and hearing none I don't intend a motion for approval of the non-union fire compensation policies and the plan Second motion by Eric second by howling for the discussion Seeing hearing none all those in favor to say aye Aye Motion carries Thank you for your work. Thank you. Thank you all very much Well done Wait actually, don't we All right, next up we have fraternal order of the police contract um and Chief heber is here as well to discuss this. So we have um our negotiation team Myself angela julie and the chief Have been engaged in negotiations for a success of collective bargaining agreement with our fraternal order of police that our union that represents Police and dispatchers since march their contract expired at the end of june and we have reached a Agreed to contract that is presented here before you the union ratified it on Friday morning So it is done on their end And if you i'm happy to walk through the significant concerns here, but if there are Um, if there is a question about whether you would approve it, I would I would suggest that that be done in executive session first Um, just because if we need to go back to the table That could uh Disadvantage us Can I recommend that we just high point the major changes in the contract if you were just a layman read side by each Yep, um, so I I did send a confidential memo To you all with some highlights, but just to for the public just to um and for you all to Draw your attention to some particular places. Um So as you know, and we're going to talk about later in the agenda We are working on a the community voted to move towards a regional dispatch model So we included a provision. We agreed to a severance provision for dispatchers if the city discontinues providing that service A severance opportunity that would be provided to those dispatchers who are laid off The uh condition there is that they are employed on the last day of the layoff So this ensures the city some succession planning. So if that transfers to happen We are able to maintain our service delivery until that last day and Then the new organization picks up from there We move to a model where holidays Are paid as they occur in the previous contract people were allowed to Carry forward their holidays. So it was creating quite an overtime and scheduling challenge for us administratively With this new model the holiday is compensated on the day it happens and Releases us from that scheduling challenge We had a real view of equity going into this contracted goal of treating our police officers and Dispatchers the same as we treat all others They in their previous contract had a health insurance cap They they were if the cost of their health insurance went above a percentage of their salary They were capped out. So they were actually paying less for health insurance than the rest of our employees so we're Incrementally stepping up that cap to for parity across the organization We discontinued the practice of the city paying for the union dues. Um, it was Something that was entered into the contract in the last negotiation session Although we continued our commitment to paying the civil liability insurance, which had been the city's intent from the beginning So we're achieving that by paying a lump sum towards that criminal liability insurance But discontinuing the practice of paying The dues and then it's a three-year contract We created a safety committee and a labor management committee Which are best practices that many that julie and i have always had before in our cba's that we've stood up with our AFSCME contract And now f.o.p. Will continue in the same direction and then finally we put into place a Cola range for wage increases as opposed to just additional increases on top of cola to again look at parity across the employee groups Anything significant i missed And this is with this if this contract is approved all of these changes We can do within the f.y.19 budget. There's no additional funds needed. That was the next question Okay, are there other public questions or concerns from council for uh, jesse To their chief hebert In a moment i'll entertain a motion if a councilor holds a question in regards to specific negotiation conversations or Something in regards to whether or not you may want to Agree with this contract or not around specific provisions. That is something that is covered by Um I hope the meeting law is a potential executive session item So, um, if you've got something that that lingers in your mind when we open up for motions You could also make a motion to enter into an executive session. That's something that you help Are there any public questions for jesse? to your chief hebert at this time I want to say thank you all For your work and negotiations and other difficult and i know you just got up from the table like nine We're good for a while here. Yeah, the air here barely refreshed in the room. So thank you very much I appreciate all the time of work. This is one of these unsung things that people don't understand What a big deal it is and how much time and energy it takes in the course of doing stuff like Main street and swimming pools that this is this is really a big thing. So thank you Questions concerns from the public Okay, um, so with that I would entertain a motion in regards to the proposed approval of the criminal order of the police contract Motion to approve on the coal second by eric any further discussion Seeing and hearing none all those in favor please say aye Aye and those opposed Motion carries This is a successful visit julie Thank you very much Thank you chief Oh sure Next up on the same vein Is chitin county public safety authority update and fund out about the issue Um So the chief is going to stay up here with me for a moment. Um I think my paper is organized here Um, so we've been on time meeting day. Uh, the voters approved us Continuing to explore looking at a regional dispatch model The board of directors was stood up comprised of the town and city managers and their designees from the six communities who moved forward We have issued in the last since we started meeting in april we have issued a rfp for technical assistance, which is really the Consultant who will finalize the development of the chintin county public safety authority Look at technology. Look at standard operating procedures. Look at staffing. Look at location Really all of those technical details that are required before we actually flip a switch to say this new organization Would consider taking a 911 call Um, so the rfp was issued in june. There was a review committee chief hebert sat on that review committee on behalf of Winooski Dispatchers were also invited to participate and provide feedback, which was great and we got a lot of Incredibly useful feedback from them through the process And at the last board meeting the Board of directors voted to approve the To award the contract to an organization called ixp consulting which is a consulting firm who runs regional dispatch Centers across the country and has done this kind of integration before The total value of the contract for fy 19 is One a hundred thousand dollars the winooski portion of that is the six thousand nine hundred and twenty six dollars According to our Population size. It's a population formula So as this is We did anticipate that this was unfunded one-time Costs so we're asking for fund balance to do this as a significant caveat to that I will say that this is the first step of that Those startup dollars that we will need over time And we will need to think critically as we go into fy 20 of Is that is that those additional startup dollars? We need to continue this work into fy 20 Dollars that we build into an operational budget or dollars that we use one-time funds to pay for Just as a reminder to the council and for those who are new to this conversation The while the Funding model has not been approved by you yet. And that is the final vote you would need to take to move to regional dispatch The concept is that the communities that choose to move For the first two years of operations will trans transfer the money They are currently spending On dispatch services to the new entity to fund that and then in year three that funding formula will be adjusted Based on calls for service So there's a question about is this a one time are these startup costs a one-time expense or an operational expense? That's something the board is still considering But I just wanted to flag that This 6900 is not the only request we will see for these startup costs Maybe good as much as we could to try to preview those I think I know it's that's probably hard. Sorry, but yeah So the challenge we the board is facing here is Um, I that's really IXP assuming we get the funding for all the communities This kind of request is going to all the communities this month So we will not give the consultant a notice to proceed until that funding is put together But the work IXP will do is really the work to develop that budget And we won't know that until the FY 20 budgets are finalized So there is some projections and we certainly have those but there are going to be projections until IXP is up and running I have some questions about the and I get to this point contracts and award it Well the contract is a little Set in stone. I remember people bid for a specific scope of service or Um, so yes, they responded to an RFP that had the scope of services that's attached here The contract has not So the board has voted to award it to IXP But we'll not issue a notice to proceed unless we can get the money raised from the community So I misspoke. I meant that the scope of service is pretty much set in stone, but I just want to flag some areas of Wonder I guess and not necessarily concerned at this point, but There's a lot of references to services that would Be consolidated versus services that would stay local Um, and I don't I mean in my mind of reason to do this There were two reasons one to improve the quality of service and response time But also to potentially become more efficient, um in operations and not duplicate Services and so I don't see The study necessarily bringing back recommendations in terms of there's efficient use of technology But not necessarily efficient use of personnel um, and so I'm just concerned that the result is going to come back with a plan that doesn't necessarily focus on the Efficient use of shared resources side of the equation. It's more on the how do we Provide the services, but also still maintain some local service at the local level and I find that Challenging to to see how that's going to end with a lot of communities saying this is a financial win for us particularly if the If the approach is to transfer all budgeted costs in year one and yet there's still an expectation that there's going to be some Level of local service provided. I don't know how that is supposed to work So I would just Say I mean I think these are important issues to study and I think it's to me the big unanswered question is How does this how do we then go to our taxpayers and say not only are you getting better service, but we're not duplicating services That we're becoming more efficient in the way we approach dispatch I've got a lot of experience And It becomes exciting to add to the service provision side of things and less exciting to talk about what that might what it might look like in terms of eliminating, you know Because that means humans So I don't I don't that's not that I don't support moving forward with the study, but I would I would encourage the board to really dig into that question It feels like I know what I want to Yeah, we're going to get this report and it's going to Result in a pretty high price tag So a couple of points make in and these are really things I've heard from the chiefs. So if I miss Speaking here, correct me So I think that's a I think rick and I share that concern and one of the things that I heard the chief Say often through the review process as we were looking at the consultants and sitting with the other chiefs from across the county is This is not we are not interested in how you coordinate six communities Efforts, we are interested in building a new thing Right and that the six communities will have to figure out how to adapt to that new thing And I think that that's something rick really emphasized through the review processes a consultant Who's just going to come in and put together binders of six different standard operating procedures? Isn't Isn't the effect we're looking for here Um, I think the challenge for us specifically in winoski is that we are the only department Um, who is considering moving that doesn't have an administrative support for the police department Our records retention clerk or something like that So I think the challenge for us will be When calls, you know, our calls will be if we go in this direction the calls will be moved over But in terms of preparing for court or working with our officers here or doing scheduling or parking ticket reconciliation or Administrative tasks our dispatchers are currently doing the other dispatchers in the county are not doing because they have Other administrative support That's going to be the challenge for us and and rick and I don't have good answers for that yet And likely won't until IXB has a model of yes, they're going to do this part of The court tracking process, but they're not going to do that part or this works with officers in this way The courts also works with officers in this way, but but needs dispatch support here So I think that's going to be an ongoing conversation And I think because we are the community that doesn't have that administrative support Um rick's really been carried the mantle of Again that this is now a collection of other processes that this independent body will now administer This is a whole new thing. So we are very we agree with you and are um, and are very focused on On thinking about that I capture that Sometimes I listen to you Well, it's important because anytime a contractor comes in If you're responding rfp, sometimes they can take these things off in their own direction If there's not strong pushback in direction from The deafening group and the group that puts the bumpers on the bowling alley, right and keeps them focused on what they're supposed to produce Actually, it's about the Good luck. Thanks Uh questions concerns for justy and chief on this And I'm assuming we'll end up with some a presentation of some time as this work progresses Absolutely Questions comments concerns from the public So you're seeing and hearing none. I entertain a motion for approval for the chitin county public safety authority fund balance allocation request So Motion by house second by christine any further discussion Seeing hearing none. All those in favor, please say aye. Aye. And those opposed motion carries. Thanks for your work on this Sure, uh, we're gonna take a two minute break. We'll reconvene at 8 12 Okay, uh, we will now Reconvene uh, regular city council meeting and pick up the agenda where we left off, which will be certain item 8 Which is the um, cip preview including that service model Cip it's so exciting If that if the work you heard previously, sorry I'm getting a little punch at 8 10 from julie about the work She and angela have led about this in the last six months. This is the equivalent on the public work side. It's super excited I'm super excited I'm going to carry that I was not so Cip so just to give kind of general overview for the public that is Our five-year sort of outlook on capital asset planning That goes over, you know, how do we procure? How do we finance? What are we replacing for our capital assets? And those are defined as having a useful life of three years and Through our city when you see policy, there's thresholds for what uh, capital asset is so for example infrastructure anything over $20,000 would be considered a capital asset that would be included into the cip program So what we're doing for fy 20 is is reorganizing the cip And I've provided sort of a summary cover sheet of How we're categorizing each asset class Sort of by infrastructure fleet facilities and then with a more detailed breakdown of that category So this is You know exciting but behind it as he's even more exciting. I think more exciting So that's where we get into really looking at each asset classification So for example pavement, you know, we're not looking at five years We're looking at every single street in monoski trying to plan out When are we going to do a maintenance or paving or reconstruction activity on that street? So we can't just look at, you know, five years for an asset like that We'd have to look at the entire category And then we also have to look at how that overlays with other assets. So, you know, our water infrastructure Obviously we want to overlay those, you know replacements or work So that we're not, you know, paving a road and then coming back years later or a year later and doing water main replacement So I didn't give you the extra of our water main replacement But we have a 20 year outlook for a water main replacement You'll see for fy 20 that we'll overlay with our, you know, pavement pavement assets Work So same with fleet, we've gone out and we've looked at, we've categorized every, you know, general one fleet and kind of put a replacement year life cycle Figure for those And then same with facilities, we do have some more work to do with facilities looking at kind of the major components or roofs, HVAC systems We have some work there to look at but We'll have the majority that filled in for fy 20 So I think what I'm sort of looking for some feedback tonight is Based on the summary sheet, you know, what kind of maybe information or additional information You all may find helpful for fy 20 We will be looking at including existing debt service as part of this so you can kind of see Categorically, you know, what we already have sort of what we're expanding on For those each of those assets But that's that's sort of what we're previewing here tonight is The organization of the the CIP So just to say that a slightly different way You know in the past or last year, I don't know about historically but last year as part of the budget you received a 10 or 15 page excel sheet of all of our assets divided out over Over multiple years. So it was it was hard to understand I thought what what these kind of what we were spending on each category of infrastructure type So john brought his expertise from doing cip planning in other communities and has built this model So so as part of that fy 20 budget process, you'll receive an entire cip across general fund waterfront wastewater funds That's a lot of information. So we wanted to start Giving you what this model looks like so you could become familiar with the spreadsheets and then understand how You know these documents work together So the document that looks like this table one is the cover sheet to the general fund cip All you will see on this sheet is the Not all you'll see what you'll see on the sheet is the revenue the different Asset areas what will be done in the years? We're specifically talking about but behind each of these asset areas Is detailed spreadsheets that categorize the entire fleet every street in the city Every water line in the city etc And we can certainly dive down into those as part of the budget process But want to kind of outline that process to you I think it might be helpful john if you just walk on table one specifically walk through Um, you know, maybe using the streets as the example what each of these columns represent. Sure. So currently in the general fund Cip, I think we just have online called street reconstruction. That's pretty much a catchall or anything related to street work So what we've done is is break it out into the classifications that We actually perform work and we can assign an actual tag of street that we're going to be doing work on so Item one would be a full street reconstruction. So typically that happens hand in hand when we're doing utility repair work So for this example, we're looking at hickok street potentially for fy 20 So we're firming up some numbers on the general fund side, but that's mainly going to be a water mean replacement project Item two would be a rehab. So that's what you would typically see like where you come through and you mill And fill back an inch and a half of payment That gives the the street another say 15 years of life expectancy So that's our most typical kind of payment project that we do throughout the city and then One that i'm hoping we can start Providing a little additional funding to is is really payment preservation type work. So that's a lower cost Main activity, but it'll extend the life of payments say another five years and It's the the idea of keeping good roads and and good condition So we're not getting to that, you know stage two rehab We can push that out maybe another five or ten years Which is more expensive And then streetscape would be kind of a catchall for anything Pavement replacements, for example East down on manuski falls away. There's there's some downtown pavers popping That would be a typical project in say the streetscaping category And then other transportation work. So that would be looking at main street doing some joint repair Replacements right at the the top of the circulator Then of course we have, you know, we've got through bridges here in manuski We're currently reviewing Right now there's nothing that's You know significant level cip work for the you know main street bridge and we were street bridge, but we're tracking We're going to be tracking that further to see if we should be starting set money aside for any You know major repair work in the future and then traffic signals and street lighting or the other two sort of infrastructure related pieces we We we are we have an analysis going on right now through East coast signals one of our consultants that they're analyzing all our traffic signals to see You know, what level service are the end? Is there any you know immediate repair needs? What should we be budgeting out the next couple years for potential replacement of equipment? So that will also be included in this f point 20 So that takes us through the philosophical underpinnings of why you put these things where they are which is really great Could you guys walk through the columns? Like the column headers and explain what each column is and especially for recognition that To have you didn't see the old sheet either or approach it in any kind of passed way with how we chunk You know reserve expenditures out how we budget for the capital budget We'll just start by saying with the capital budgets funded separately, right? So there's a special set of signer tax rate that funds the capital budget That's got a little escalator in it from year to year So there's a set amount of funds that's coming into there And then it is its own separate budget item that's planned out over time It's not baked into the public works You know general operations budget it's set aside for those capital projects, which is really well explained here I just wanted to verbalize that as we start that since we're not in budget mode yet But I think if if you could talk through I think really the number one thing so talk about the allocated gf capital piece and then work down into the columns And defining what what those mean when you say reserve balances f y 20 total project College f y 20 reserve allocation and then what the years That would be really helpful. Sure. So above the allocated general fund capital That is I believe by resolution The amount that's set aside From the general fund to the capital reserve funds. So These numbers Have not been vetted by angelina. So take that into consideration But that this is the projected set aside say for f y 20 that 431 thousand And then the additional capital funds That is I believe annually. Yeah, that's the dedicated fund you're talking about. Yeah So moving down to the main sort of Body of spreadsheet so to reserve balance forward So those are funds that you know, they've been budgeted previous years and have been carried forward So these are Again, they need to be vetted by angelina, but that's what we were showing on the f y 19 budgets I've I have broken them out a little bit based on, you know, bring them into categories And then what we're showing is the f y the next common loavers the f y 20 total project costs So what is that project going to cost? Without any, you know reserve fund use And then the following column is The allocated reserve fund from the balance board And then you have the five years of fiscal year So the the idea here is trying to balance The use of reserves against the increase a potential increase or expenditure of the existing tax rate And how you plan for that expenditure over five years. So for example and again not looking at these numbers Um, these aren't necessarily the the quote-unquote right numbers But if you look at three for example, we have 20 so street preservation We have 20 000 in reserves a total project cost of 24 6 So in this line where we would be recommending the use of 10 000 of those set aside reserves And then the balance in the f y 20 tax rate allocation And then you'll see that in future years we're Recommending each year we reinvest 25 000 additional money into that preventative maintenance target area So that's how you can kind of see how that We're trying to build that model of how we're going to invest in our infrastructure year to year And then also call out what we're actually going to do with that money so we can start saying to the public Yes, we know your street is a pavement condition index of 69 We're not doing it this year But here's where it would be on a schedule out a couple of years and and communicating that back to the public So they understand that there's a plan Yeah, each one of those so right now, you know, we show 25 000 But each one of those will be designated a street and the actual budget that we've that we've Kind of estimated based on some paid escalation numbers An interesting thing we're starting to look at is Kind of displaying that to the public. Um, so You know with the new website one of the things we're exploring is You know working with cc rpc and creating a module on the website that shows A map where you know folks can kind of click on and see You know five-year capital plan here are the streets that we are looking at potentially doing the next five years Just a real easy display To show folks where that funding could be going And just one more reminder on this and then we can move on to the debt modeling unless there are other questions We are building these cips outside of the main street and pool process Ultimately, of course, those will be integrated fully into the city-wide cip and the related debt service But as we made the commitment through the main street project not to use our our existing cip needed for All of this other infrastructure Dedicated to that. We are really focusing on the build out of that separate from those two capital projects And I think should know also John has been vetting this structure with the public works commission as well And so they've seen a lot of this and and helped inform what these models look like I think it's going to be a little practice with it. Yeah, I think it's us It's a huge leap with two feet in the right direction personally. I'm just looking at it's much more It's more meaningful the information that's here and Gives us more actual information that helps inform what the pace of investment looks like I think that's really good. I think one thing I think having access to the Low up is great and keeps it simple. I think having What I like to call the angela sheet available too is also really important and Because I like to look at the angela sheet And get into that level of detail when we get to the budget time It's not always necessary needed But I think the big thing that that will do that the the way we did the last time as cumbersome as it was Is also flag any large capital projects because of our limited budget that we're not funding that we should be aware of that we are Acknowledging that we are ignoring Because what we used to do is just put them on there and then have an expense down the road and be like well And by the way, we're not putting any money towards this, right? This is just functionally. Where is the money going? And I think this is a more meaningful exercise But I think somewhere we need to bridge We need to have that opportunity to acknowledge what we're not funding from a capital perspective too if that makes sense Maybe that's a memo of here at the top You know 10 things that we are most concerned about that we're not funding that we think are only here in the background that you Should be aware of Um, or you know, maybe it's just having that detail available. I don't know. I was when looking at this That was my initial thinking. I think this is so much more clearly organized The other thing I was I was going to do is with these FY 20 projects is actually create sort of a Project sheet for each of them to it gives a better description Instead of just having you know A line item here and actually tells like, okay, this is what we're doing. This is what the project is This is the financial tool we're using to you know find it and that's sort of more in depth for for each one Yeah, I mean in government they call that in lapis like Lapis and federal governments the is the word that's used if you do funding notifications to if you're into funding sheets I think it'd be great and you guys are already doing a great job of this But anytime there's a capital expenditure of any kind having a small write-up of it Even if it's not a big deal On-face and the grants go up in schemes your projects to get the habit of putting those into a Standardized format and putting them online is really huge for people to be able to see what was done in addition to seeing that plan ahead, even if it's $80,000 on the signage You know to make sure the public's aware that that occurred from a notification standpoint Sorry, cool. Well, I think uh, like an illus. I don't know that I need to It would help. I don't think it would I need to in depth write up a very Project that look that may have other Uses but will be very useful Would be sort of an ill a case illustration. So this road You know, this is what's been put into the reserve balance allocated to this function over time This is the total cost of the project just to help people understand how to read The chart because it is a new way of looking at the information. Yeah Um, I think an eye process information better when I can see it rather than when I can hear it. So Appreciate your Talking us through it, but I'm still like, well, who does that actually mean for hick-hawk street? Or whatever. So thanks other feedback questions concerns This is really this is exactly what we wanted for tonight is just to it is it is a lot of information So we didn't want to give you the whole thing on one night and be like All right done any questions I tried to think about some of it's going to take I think one application I like I said, I think regardless of what happens You can tell all the effort energy and thought went into it and that it's a huge huge improvement right off the bat Yeah, and it's I mean, it's meant to be a living document. So it'll You know get more refined and as much details needed to kind of get the point across So any feedback you have after this What's up with this thing? So really what we're we're doing is You know, we've refined it to Include some additional information that we've received since the last time we presented But I think the main point we're we're trying to look at here is with fy 20 looming The main Revenue factor For fy 20 is that local options tax. So I think You know besides giving you a certain update of this depth model, which I'm sure will be updated again as we get You know even more information I think what we're trying to do is is get some feedback on that local options tax for as a revenue piece As to whether we think it's a good idea or whether we think it's appropriate So so at our next meeting we will be bringing you an fy 20 budget and that fy 20 budget will reflect revenue streams and expended church streams And these two project these two so we just talked about the cip and our regular infrastructure planning This is the other half of that equation. We've been talking about this a lot Um So we're we're trying to take your temperature a little on Given what we've heard from you i.e. Move quickly ahead with a pool We now have an engineering contract where we've had the kickoff meeting We're running full steam into full design on that and anticipation of taking out a bond anticipation of the spring and then a Bond in the summer to pay for the construction starting next year, etc Same thing on the main street side to do the full engineering all at once is a fairly large contract Um, it will require expenditure of that debt in fy 20 Um, and here's the model right now. Here is the model We are looking at building into the fy 20 budget that includes a lot of assumptions for example Tolerance to go to the public and ask for local options Rooms, meals and alcohol and sales tax and then at the bottom What the tax rate increases which is 4.6 in fy 20 Including those revenue streams and if there's not appetite to do that We we can build, you know, we can present other options That's what we're trying to take the temperature on Is that tax rate impact? Comfortable not saying you have to vote say yes tonight, but are we in the right? Ballpark, are you comfortable with those revenue streams and remind us of what we had In the budget memo discussed last time in terms of expected natural appreciation of current operations Under current operation status. We were at what percent from the increased perspective For the operations for the fy 20 budget outside of this. Yes, you said kola, which right now is 2.8 I don't think we'll bring you on something that high. I think we said levels You said level service no new ads kola, right? Yeah I was thinking the previous the conversation we hit that around two Ish So two 2.5 seems with kola and natural increase of cost of goods So we'd be looking at close to seven Combine correctly that Beyond fy 21 the model anticipates no additional annual rates of increase or is that just we haven't put them yet So what we assumed is that that revenue From the tax rate increase would carry forward And that there would be a one and a half percent increase in this model for fy 21 to cover some You know the full bond amount of the main street project, but once that sort of revenue was generated There wouldn't be a need to increase right. It's not a one-year bump up to 1.12 It's a it maintains in the tax rate. We're not doing every year more and more other than cost of increases But assuming those I mean the the problem with this The problem with presenting lots of models like this to you is that there are lots of decision points baked into each line of this So yes, that's right assuming that for example In fy 22 You're comfortable with those two sale those two local options taxes and a main street set aside and implementing impact fees So see those revenue lines on three four on On the three box and the four box So each of those require another decision point right like the tip funding set aside, right exactly So when we get out, this is really different though than the last numbers we saw I mean from an increase of tax base increase perspective I think on the last one we assumed I think we didn't carry that revenue forward on the last model Who's 13 percent last time? So it's 13 percent if there's no new revenues. Yeah, if there's no offsetting revenues, right? and are all are we essentially capturing all of the new revenue that may be out there That's what we're attempting to do a few other ideas. We are all ears for these projects and there's a phasing Yes to it. Yes. Also, the main street is happening over two phases rather than all at once And what's the 50 percent tip funding set aside so does that mean that 50 percent of the Funds coming in from the tip at that point could be available for other purposes Right. So we're not consuming. Sorry the entirety of the tip Exactly Exactly, and then it steps down. You'll see over time as well. So one of the things So in box one In phase two for main street, you see the debt not picking up until FY 25 i.e. when the tip expires Um, and then using that tip set aside. So in FY 25, assuming all goes well We'll have about 1.2 1.3 million dollars returning to the general fund So what we're the decision point of this line is do you want a future commit? 50 of that revenue To this debt service and then step it down Over time as outlined You know, I looked at this the thing that I did was circle the The places where I thought there was the most of all potential volatility in the modeling As to where to try to identify the risk And I think you know for me it's It's four, right? It's the items grouped in four With that being said they're also Not the largest sources of funds So I I just when I looked at this I went in with A plus or minus a percent, you know attitude When it came to both of these tax impacts and the zeros further on You know personally, I walked away I mean, this is tremendous from a just general perspective If these actually come to fruition, this is tremendously good news And it's a very vastly different revenue Picture than I think we started with I know it is So try to pull back some of those other ones and understand where my disconnect was coming from the tax rate perspective, but I guess I'm I found the loose margin there to be pretty comfortable when it comes to four and was not the concern of that And then I guess I'll just close off to say that I think We invested in creating the tip to create infrastructure that would help the city grow and thrive And it's done that it's done its job And it's going to create revenue a revenue source now that I think the responsible thing to do with it Is to reinvest it in the that same line of investment because But for us doing that our city would be in a really vast a different place financially And from a sustainability standpoint, who knows what it would look like here So I think trying to double down on that investment to do a very similarly Purposed project is Is exactly what that morally to make calls for And to not just have it dwindled into operations eventually etc. I think reinvesting in hardscape is the right thing to do Because that's how it got there. That's how the egg was created So I agree with the tiff modeling is That's a long way to say that um, I also I feel similarly that reinvesting part of that makes sense and is the logical thing to do with some of that money I like We can get into like numbers later. I don't know half seems fine to me on hand. Um I do want to discuss the local options tax though You know, we've talked about this before that we I think we've said that we pretty much on board this broken community. It's already kind of been really before before but I recall discussing a one percent increase And I I don't know this offhand, but I believe that's what we are surrounded by Oh, sorry. That's my fault So these all are one percent the two percent is year-to-year growth So assuming two percent increase in the revenue It is all one percent It's a one percent local option sacks on rooms, meals, and alcohol and a one percent Local option sacks on sales Yeah, we're not legally allowed to do anymore. Yeah I thought we were doubling that suddenly. No We're just assuming that receipts will increase by two percent a year Okay, that makes sense. Thank you I support a local options sales tax for rooms, meals, and alcohol And we'd like to see that move forward. I don't support a local options general sales tax Can you speak to your feelings behind that? Yeah, I think in general I think sales tax is something that's pretty regressive that it's people who Are less economically and franchised Harder than it does people who have more spending money To me it's more palatable if it's stuff like rooms, meals, and alcohol, which is generally That's money people are spending out of an expendable budget Whereas if we're taxing toilet paper and tuna fish That doesn't feel that doesn't feel right to me Um, and I know it's not significant. You know, it's you can look at You know, three cents on a can of beans and be like that's not significant But having watched when I you know like, you know A lot of my neighbors going in and buying a can of beans with pocket change Like it it has a significant impact on people. So This is something I can't get on board with Is there any ability to carve out groceries? I mean there's I don't believe there's a sales tax on food. Yeah Because we have a lot of like boutiques In town or high-end The services that I would not want to Exempt those particular businesses from contributing to the infrastructure needs of the community I heard about the journals But if they're not, if they're not a restaurant basically, I mean we're basically hitting the Restaurants at Potentially Hotel And not the The new crop of businesses that's Growing So, um If this is something that we move forward We I will provide you we didn't provide for you today a comprehensive overview of what's included and what's not included Um, or a historic breakdown of this over time. Um, I will we will be sure to do that in advance of any vote This is this is mora. Like yes, we would entertain a conversation or no, don't don't bring it to us And I the tax department issues of almost annual clarification memo on this because there's always something new that some people are taxing other people I can tell you Property management for examples when those things it's been a big thing or some cities apply it to that and some don't and it's You know fight back and forth. So it's a bit of a moving turk. So I think some education on that would be great Because we've spent time on the rooms mills and alcohol on peace but less time on the sort of general broader sales There's in the end We're talking about Revenue need and you come from somewhere. So it's if it's not there It's going to go back into this bottom line property tax impact And I think too that's then is going to become the The conversation because I don't like hitting anybody with taxes, but it's I'm trying to find that balance. So maybe having a better understanding of what its actual ramifications would be on Exactly what goods and for services because there are some services that are considered transactional. I don't know Right. It's complicated I think you know some of the tax department I may have used him last week um The a huge caveat to this as well and I and I we're not going to have clarity. I don't think on this The impact of this to winewski yet Is that with the new cloud taxation the sales to local option sales tax also applies to anything that's delivered to winewski Um, and that and that just started So when I look at the receipts data, you know, the numbers that are based here are based on the receipts from fy 18 Those weren't included. You know, the amazon deliveries weren't included in those receipts And we're not going to have a good projection of that at this For another whole year So I don't know if that would increase this sales tax number by 20 percent or by 100 percent. It's How much amazon delivers or You know what i'm saying about the cloud taxation Yeah, the other thing that would be nice is if you could just make mention of airbnb Um, and our ability to capture taxes on that so that airbnb's are do um Are taxed from a rooms meals and alcohol perspective But again, that hasn't got that hasn't been in place long enough to see reflected in the receipts So right now if you look at the rooms meals and alcohol receipts data on the tax department website for fy 18 There is no rooms tax Collected and winooski because we have no hotels and they hadn't implemented yet with airbnb So we that's again an unknown similar I don't think of any other additional sources in life I mean the other thing we've talked about before is a Taxi or car service registration fee to operate within the city's compliance Which berlington runs a registration program? And we've kicked around this concept of a joint regional Thing To do that in case you want to do another regionalization project just on the fly Um, what is that? Yeah, so uh vehicle service a vehicle service registration tax So it requires anybody doing a car or vehicle for hire to pay a registration for your tax or something Okay. Yeah, and so There is one in berlington, right? They have to pay a licensing tax I think my gut has always been that that's an arbitrary thing for enforcement It's not a moneymaker because the work that needs to be done and set it up is probably in that negative but Just throw that out in the course of these taxes It might be something worth a quick look I think that is interesting to think about for down the line I wouldn't Particularly be interested in discussing that at the same time as these It's a whole new work project. Yeah I find this number to be pretty palpable given what we're talking about doing And I find the revenue structure to be generally something that um I agree that the answer to those questions about the sales tax is Are there other things that we need to be brought back to report in this discussion? Better I just have a clarifying question about the the Revenue for the pool It's it's a constant Uh figure is that just the the 15 year period divided by 15? Why wouldn't that show any kind of I have a spreadsheet that complements that We did not update the revenues from the pool from the last model I can send you that that Pool revenue projection um I think that is I think what we're trying to do is be conservative with the revenues on that and we did not Put my inflation factor on it, but I can send you that that I'll still out to the other thing you do by not going over 50 in the tip is if you have to hit something in an emergency situation where one of these other revenue streams fail that You got that Other questions comments concerns or items that could help inform this conversation for the next time it comes to us I think the resulting resounding commentary is that you guys did a really great work with both of these things And spreadsheets and thank you very much What a dominant excel Questions comments concerns from the public It's really fun to listen to john and angela talk I love excel Okay, item i fy policy priorities and strategy update economic vitality. Thanks for visiting john Thanks john So being that it is 10 of 9 I I would love to hear from you If there are specific things within the memo that I have given to you that you would like to hear me talk about I did have a plan that involved going over Progress on the three priority strategies and then a brief discussion of the windewski small business zone But I am open to whatever would work best for you this evening. May I make a suggestion? Yeah Because our next meeting is really going to be focused on the tiff global settlement Which includes parking and the tiff build out We skip those you have the updates here in front of you I would like heather to share the analysis She's done on the local parcel parcel business parcel data analysis that we talked about in the strategy and then small business Zone program. I think if we just hit those two those are kind of the new things that Um, okay, so I have completed the parcel analysis for downtown and the gateway businesses And I really want to make the point that that's not all the businesses in the city And especially that some of our largest employers are up on tygen That's about a third of the total citywide jobs up on tygen. So we are not talking about all of the businesses but In looking at Local ownership, I found that we have 21 percent through downtown and the gateways that are windewski based ownership 84 percent jitney kelly ownership and 95 percent vermont ownership So we do have a high percentage of locally owned business in the city um, I think it's really important that we balance our efforts on both Maintaining those opportunities for the small entrepreneurs To start businesses for local residents start businesses, but also to maintain those employment opportunities that may not be locally owned but our opportunities for our residents as well So I've given you a few Recommended resources that I would say would be useful in creating opportunities for locally owned business startups One of them is the first one is supporting a co-working space that's looking to come into the community And one of the reasons behind that is because we actually have a really high percentage of Windewski workers who work from home. It's 7.4 percent Which is a lot higher than chitening county, which is I think 4.9 or something like that and burlington is 3.3 So it's an unusually high percentage I'll talk with you in a few minutes about possible revisions to the windewski small business loan program to better utilize the funds I think we should be hosting some of our partner organizations to bring together small business development centers score cboa women's small business program and center for women in enterprise to have workshops in the community So instead of reinventing the wheel here, I can bring in partners and offer those opportunities to our community I would certainly recommend creating a business startup guide. Ultimately, I would like that to be an online something That's online as well on our new website In Syracuse, I did an annual retail recruitment event and that was where I pulled together All of the businesses that have expressed any interest in coming into Syracuse as well as landing institutions leasing agents business owners that they could tell about their successes downtown organization score Sba and other small business development partners as well as city staff. So you could kind of it was, you know One-stop shopping So I would recommend doing something along that line Providing a commercial space locator on the economic development page of the website, although right now it means it's pretty easy because There aren't that many spaces So I kind of have them in my head but having that available online So someone at three o'clock in the morning thinking about wanting to start a business doesn't rule out when you skip Because they can't look us up Providing support to businesses throughout the main street project And also I'd recommend that I'd like to attend An economic development and international economic development council training entrepreneurial and small business development strategies this year So those are my baseline beginning recommendations If any of you are interested in how The local business parcel analysis breaks down Based on different gateways or the downtown or any of that I have that information as well. Happy to share it Could you? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely So downtown businesses are 15 percent Winooski based 79 percent Chittenden county ownership and 97 percent Vermont ownership East Allen gateway businesses are nine percent Winooski based 91 percent Chittenden county and 91 percent Vermont ownership Mallets Bay have has the highest Winooski based ownership and the highest Vermont ownership at 33 percent Winooski based 83 percent Chittenden county based and 100 percent Vermont ownership Main street gateway businesses break down as 29 percent Winooski based ownership 87 percent Chittenden county and 94 percent Vermont ownership So I'm going to move on if that's okay to the small business loan program discussion At this point I have Recommended that actually now it's 10 businesses. It was eight. It was at the time that I wrote this but 10 potential businesses or existing businesses Apply for the Winooski small business loan program Only one of those was eligible for that program because we can only fund Tier three loans based on the way that the memorandum of understanding was written So we can do buy downs of the lower risk loans at tier one and tier two But it's really only the highest risk loans that even get to our program for consideration If they qualify for those higher tier loans, then they're just funded through opportunities credit union So my recommendation would be that we move forward and talk with the Small business loan committee about the possibility of coming back with a recommendation for you For a certain percentage of the funds that are made available for interest rate buy downs specifically Which would then make all Winooski businesses regardless of what their credit history is in some way eligible for the program So anything coming through would then be considered for the Winooski small business loan program if it's a Winooski business And Well, we'll get to that when we get there. I think it's great that you guys are thinking about it Just something that I'd like to discuss with the committee and come back with a recommendation I don't have a specific percentage in mind But I wanted to touch base with you and see what your appetite was for us to look at that because right now We're not using it to support business at all. It's just sitting Right and previously there was a council that wanted to hold very tightly To the idea that the money needs needed to regenerate itself Which in a situation where you're just buying down interest. It doesn't right it goes out. It's a direct cost But we have money to spend it. It's always been kind of the balancing conversation discussions And that's why I would recommend a percentage of it. So we know some of it is still evolving But you know, there's a certain amount that we're willing to that's great. Yeah What do you think that demand is for such I think if we were doing interest rate buy downs, we would have more takers on that I definitely think there are some businesses that would have been interested in that but Knowing that they're eligible for a tier one loan and you know, we just end up with an opportunities loan They're not as interested in going for that program. So, um If you go earlier to the memo, yeah, the council's priorities and policies discussion where we talked about using rate city resources Yeah To create employment opportunities for residents that expand availability of goods and services for residents So I guess I'd be interested in I'm I'm I guess a philosophical issue with making public funds available to any Small business owner without consideration of the public good So I would want to see some connect connect So we right now we tied it to Risk or you know the inability to secure financing because your credit wasn't And maybe that wasn't the right criteria to look at but I don't I don't feel comfortable abandoning all criteria and just say First come first serve if you're no matter whether you're a high-end You know serve it, you know, whatever providing goods and services that You know are available to a small slice of the community versus Well, you know What we heard through that process where you know members of the community have certain businesses that they are really Feeling a need for So how do we make that connection between public funding from some shared public good? We do still have the criteria that are used to evaluate the loans So I think those criteria and I I don't have them in front of me. I apologize for that but Those criteria would still apply to the interest rate buy-downs at least that's the way I'm imagining it So we've already established that it has to be meeting these certain needs in the community. So higher scoring Interest rate buy-downs would then be eligible or could even set some see that together. Yeah Because that was a while ago. Yeah, that was March Yeah, the scoring matrix and if you go with that model where that's prioritized We might want to think about an open season an open and closed state for an rfp I mean, and I'm just gonna idea this again I was also just gonna say too if the committee thinks that they need to To get to use it, you know, the state's done a lot of analysis recently on their evolving loan funds and come back with the conclusion that grant a portion of grant injection is necessary To get mostly or all of us to go the revolving loan funds to be used So the state is now Putting grant funding into almost all of our loving loan funds that it's utilizing for housing and economic development And that's something that just changed like Last year and this year So they're saying basically to get people to take the $15,000 in loan We need to give $3,000 in a grant, you know So yeah, if they want to if they have got good reasoning and rationed through that when they start to review this To propose something to the back. I just we might not go for it But I would encourage them to think outside of the box and how you get the funds utilized too. Great. Thank you Not feel wed to this This was just something I threw together What else That's helpful. I think that gives us some Yeah, that absolutely gives us some guidance and it's something the grant percentage is something I'm familiar with in Syracuse and we might have specific things that we want to incentivize with that So for example, we could have that percentage be a facade grant or you know, something that would provide a direct benefit When previously for example opportunities was able to pair revolving loan fund through one entity with a grant fund from a yackel foundation that provided Upfront grant injection towards new american families or purchasing farming equipment to Work with new farms for new americans and to order cash machines and registered management business management tools So they took a loan, but there was also a grant component too. It was really helpful Also, just to speak highly of a partner and I'm sorry and I will disclose I used to work there, but if you haven't been the opportunities web page recently You should go there tonight after work because I think like the five major Businesses that they they're highlighting from a funding perspective are all musky businesses Which is pretty cool. That's That has an entity that the city fought very hard to get to come in here and it's You'll get some good results This is a great job on the update overall too. Thank you for all your work And I know it's not reflective of the housing Work and everything else that's going on So I really appreciate all the all the thought that went into it and the work that's been done. Thank you Thank you other questions comes concerns for heather and jesse on the academic sexuality report Okay, so top two take backs for st. Michael's class. What are they gonna be? I Okay, that concludes tonight's uh regular agenda and entertain a motion adjourn Motion by Nicole second by Erick. Any further discussion? So you can hear none of those in favor please say aye. Aye. And those opposed motion curious