 Okay, just testing. And this is our second and last meeting of the week for the General Housing Military Affairs Committee. And today we have with us Ken Schatz from the Agency of Human Services and Eileen Peltier from Downstreet Housing and Community Development. When we last chatted with them, we'd last chatted with Ken, I think, we would have been right after we started Zoom meetings or it might have been back when we were still in the building. And we certainly haven't visited with Eileen since then but the issues in front of us today for today is to get a real update on what's been happening with the folks that we had tried to identify in what's now as 333 about homelessness prevention or taking care, providing services for people who are either homeless or at risk of being homeless which includes not only shelter in place but finding out what that means and what resources were available. We had some conversations back with that some weeks ago. Since then there have been some major changes and some actions that were taken by both the state and by different organizations including Downstreet and Capstone, the Department of Health. And so I just wanted to get an update with that. We have commissioner Schatz with us just for about 45 minutes or so. So I wanted to lead off with him and just hand the mic to him and just Ken if you could just give commissioner, if you could just start with kind of the broad view of what has been working and then kind of come back to what has not been working and what we might have to wait for federal money for or what we may have to do legislatively in the near future to deal with some of the issues that we've been dealing with that would be great. Okay, so this is Ken Schatz. I'm the commissioner of the Department for Children and Families. I appreciate the opportunity to meet with you to provide information to you about what's going on and we'll do my best to answer questions that you may have. Obviously the COVID-19 pandemic has had a tremendous impact on all of us but as we did talk about at the beginning of this crisis the population of people who are homeless are particularly impacted. They're particularly vulnerable for any number of reasons and so I believe to the credit of I think both the state and our network of community providers and stakeholders we have actually in Vermont stepped up to do the best we can to address the needs of that population so that we have not seen substantial numbers of homeless people testing positive for COVID-19. So in and of itself that is really a piece of good news suggesting that some of the things that we've done have had some positive impact but the risks are still there and they're still very significant and there has been substantial dislocation for a variety of people. So that to put it in the general context as you asked one of the things the state did was basically wave our normal restrictive general assistance emergency housing rules and essentially are dealing with the population of homeless as being eligible for shelter as if every night was an all weather conditions night meaning that we recognize we need to provide shelter for homeless people in light of this pandemic and so to that end we've worked with shelter providers and hotels around the state for the most part shelters have either substantially reduce their capacity to enable them to apply appropriate social distancing approaches consistent with the health department's guidance or have closed their facility completely and are operating more in motels. So the impact of that is we currently are supporting approximately 1500 people in motels around the state and that includes approximately 200 children that's separate from the numbers of people who are still actually in shelters which is smaller but I don't have a count of that to be honest. It's particularly significant in light of the fact those of you who are familiar with the point in time count may recall that the last one done indicated approximately 1100 and here I am telling you we've got 1500 people in motels plus more in shelters our sense of that. First of all, we know that point in time count is a helpful tool but is not really scientific. It depends on a lot of factors. So we've never looked at that as the end all be all but obviously it's very significant that we have such a higher number of people in motels. We think that partly relates to the fact that there are people who were precariously housed if you will meaning that people were doubling up with other family members or neighbors or friends but in light of the pandemic and the advice to reduce contact with other individuals to avoid spread of the virus people have had to separate. And so that's a factor to the extent that some people were honestly living in tents or in other places again because of the pandemic they may have felt that it was better to move inside to motels. So substantial number of people in motels and on the one hand again we've talked about motels a lot in the past and in some respects some of the same the advantages there in terms of roof over people's head to the extent their rooms we can sort of enable people to in fact do the social distancing as appropriate. But on the other hand it also congregates people in a way that's not necessarily always healthy or helpful. And so we're doing our best to manage those situations. I think it's hard for our community providers who are also of course significantly impacted by the pandemic including some of their staff not being available by simply the dislocation it makes it harder for them to provide services to the population which are now in different places rather than in the shelters. So that's been an ongoing challenge. I will say that the timeframe for the waiver that we've given with respect to GA was initially till April 15th. We have now extended that to May 15th consistent with the governor's extension of the stay home stay safe order. So that's the idea is that from our perspective we want to provide some sense of stability to the homeless population that we're not in the middle of this pandemic going to put them at risk also to try to continue the work we're doing to stabilize the supports that we want to provide. And some communities have been better than others to be straightforward about it and being able to provide those supports. Nothing new here. We know a lot of this population has substantial mental health issues significant substance abuse issues. So that is also part of our challenge. We are working together again with community providers but also the state emergency operation center to try to figure out how we can support this population. Again, as you may recall or know we did set aside a harbor place in Burlington as an isolation facility for people who have symptoms of COVID-19. Again, the good news is that we've only had three or four people there reflection of a relatively small number of homeless people who have symptoms. Similarly, we have created a recovery facility at the Holiday Inn in Burlington. That was a facility where we actually were housing 60 plus families as part of our general assistance approach. A lot of work was done by community providers by state folks. We've literally moved all 60 to an alternative motel. Part of the idea was to move them all to one place because we were concerned about if we separated those folks would we get into issues of potentially dispersing from the virus? And we think we avoided that. Obviously, we're always mindful of the people who have symptoms. We are in a better place now in terms of the availability of testing and there are protocols to enable people to get tested as needed. But again, we were able to make that move successfully to make the Holiday Inn available as a recovery site. So that's certainly a piece of good news. One of the hiccups and we share some responsibility in this is that because we needed to move quickly to try to provide shelter to try to avoid the spread of the pandemic we didn't do as well as we should have with respect to talking with local officials local law enforcement about what was coming what was happening and I need to own that. But we're working hard at that to try to have those communications more frequently and to try to keep people informed about what's going on. Again, for the most part to be clear these are members of their communities where the reality is the homeless population is us. And so the reality is that by putting more people in motels though there's heightened visibility and simply the significant number of people in one place causes some challenges. So on a more positive note, we're certainly seeing as you probably have seen from the health department communications that we do seem to have flattened the curve to a certain extent. We also of course have to be really careful to not change course too quickly but that has enabled us to start thinking, okay, what happens after the stay home, stay safe, governor order and we're working on that. Obviously with this large number of people in motels it also makes that particularly challenging to figure out how to provide a reasonable transition for this population that does have mental health issues, some abuse issues, obviously low income if any income transportation problems, you know the routine in terms of the challenges. So I think we have gotten to a place now feeling that we've got the isolation facility, we've got a recovery facility, we've got people in motels. So now we are starting to think of how do we make the transition and how do we support people to do that? So that to be candid is a work in progress. Some good news in terms of funding is that we obviously have received word that there is some more federal funding that's coming with respect to COVID-19. The numbers are still unclear though but one particular source of funding was the emergency solutions grant money which is typically part of the HOP, the housing opportunities program that the grant funding that operates out of OEO. So OEO did issue last week a supplemental request for proposals to enable providers to identify what needs, could they identify what support that they need to help address the pandemic? And so we set that up on a rolling basis recognizing that if community providers are ready to move quickly, we wanted to be responsive to that. But candidly and going to Representative Stevens point, we've obviously spent a lot of extra money in terms of supporting people in motels. It's safe to say we have far exceed our general assistance budget. We don't know yet though what portion of federal monies we can use for which purposes that's still a challenge for our financial people. And we're still working on getting guidance from the federal government. And so as I think we've indicated on a couple of occasions to different committees, the administration is planning to submit some sort of supplemental appropriation request. We don't know exactly what those numbers will be in the housing realm but you can expect that. I do appreciate the point again, Representative Stevens, that you made about that legislation and the draft. And as you recall, we certainly participated in that both in the house and then subsequently a little bit in the Senate conversations. And again, all the areas that were listed in terms of support for prevention of eviction and prevention of homelessness in addition to specific supports would all be welcome when the time comes. And so as we develop plans for how to transition out of the pandemic, clearly there'll be more conversation about that. You know, some of these issues are just the same issues that have always existed. The challenge of availability of housing that people can actually afford continues to be a tremendous challenge. And so we have to deal with that as constructively as we can but it's not as if that problem has gone away. I do think that, you know, the communities have really stepped up and the continuance of care are very active in trying to work together to try to address this problem, but it is challenging. And so with, I knew you asked me what if any changes are planned with the coming warmer weather? And I put that in the context of we clearly will look once the restrictions related to stay safe, stay home are eased, we'll look to reduce the numbers of people in motels but we wanna do that in a manner that's safe for those individuals and families who are homeless. And, you know, to the extent we can move into more stable housing, obviously that would be wonderful but I won't deny that that will be an incredible challenge. So let me stop there. Glad to answer any questions you have. And a representative trying to know, I see you but just one quick question that I have Ken is well, when this is over, I mean, we're doing something that's extraordinary here. We're getting, this is getting everybody we can reach off the streets for the sake of the public. Good. When this is over and we transition back, I mean, hotels are gonna have to have their hotel rooms back in order to do the business they're used to doing. Are we gonna be able to look back on this with a real set of numbers to give us a real, not just a ballpark figure but a closer to reality figure of what it's gonna take to house this many people on a permanent basis? Or is that something, you know, I mean, I'm just looking at, I'm just thinking beyond, you know, this particular crisis and looking ahead because we've always talked about what it could cost or what it should cost. And I'm just wondering, have you been filing this away so that we can look at this data later and really try to find some definite policy decisions moving forward? So what I will say to you is we want to, so I know we've dusted off the roadmap to try the work that was done a couple of years ago to try to address the problem of homelessness and have in mind, can we come out of this crisis with in fact a better normal? So clearly that's on our mind. I don't know how successful we'll be in either identifying those numbers or revising the plans that have been previously made. And frankly, how far we'll get in actually implementing some improvements but let me assure you, I want to do that. All right, I'm gonna go ahead and send it over to Chip. Representative Triano, hold on. There you go. Thanks for coming in Ken and sharing this with us. And whenever the conversation regarding affordable housing comes up, the first thing that comes to my mind is that affordable housing is not affordable if you have nothing. So that's the real problem that we're facing. But my question is really, how are we handling grocery shopping and necessities for these folks that are in motels? I know that my room at the Econologue is now occupied, I understand. So I guess Shaws is actually walking distance from there but I guess I'm wondering, and I understand that there is a fair amount of support for these folks once they are installed into these hotel rooms. I just wondering if you could comment on that a little bit. Sure, we're trying. So I think that in the beginning to be straightforward about it, again, we wanted to encourage people to stay in their rooms, to not be, even if there are restaurants or food stores within walking distance, we want to be consistent with the governor and health commissioners recommendation. So we have been providing food for people in hotels. It was a little bit, one community did its own thing after another. And frankly, again, in many respects, that was really positive, really good. We have actually in the last week or so, try to develop a more coordinated approach around the state. And I think we've made a lot of progress in moving forward in that approach. But again, from our perspective, it does make sense for us to deliver food to those people in the motels to try to reduce the spread of the pandemic. Yeah, most of them have many fridges and microwaves. So that helps a little bit, I guess. Thanks, Ken. Yep. All right, Representative Howard. Thank you. Commissioner, I found out some disturbing news yesterday from a constituent, I live in Rutland. And it was, am I understanding that a hotel, the Econolodge, was going to be open to homeless people. And they were all equipped, you know, masks were ordered, food service, everything was all in place. And then a call was made that 25 people were going to be sent to Burlington. So I don't understand why that happened. And I don't understand why people would be taken out of the community that they live in to go to another, you know, two hours away. So I don't know if you are aware of that. And if you could explain to me what, you know, transpired. So I have to be honest, I don't know about that. I will check back into it and get back to you. I'll be straightforward. I meant to do this in the beginning, but one of the reasons you're kind of stuck with me doing this presentation is because the other people involved on the more direct level with addressing this issue are incredibly hard at work doing detail work. And again, it's my compliments to them. And I apologize, Representative Howard, for not knowing the answer to that, but I will find out and get back to you. But our staff is working extremely hard to manage the situation. So again, I will check back and let you know. Okay. Thank you very much. Representative Hengo. Thank you. Commissioner. I'm not sure if you can answer this, but back in February, we heard from Sarah Phillips. From OEO and there was going to be a new roll out of a new program. Sorry, I've got stuff popping up on my screen here. I apologize. There was going to be a new program around emergency housing and restructure of it. And it was going to involve a budget ask and whatnot. And we, we all know that we really don't know what's going on with the budget right now. Is that in your mind on hold and can that be safely put aside for now? So I think that there were two parts of our budget that address issues related to homelessness. One was what we referred to as the emergency housing restructure where we proposed that instead of operating the GA program as a regulatory matter, we would give monies the monies to communities to address a homelessness needs with more flexibility. The second piece was to expand family supportive housing to enable people to make the step from homelessness to more stable housing. And that's been a successful program in seven areas. And we wanted to spread it around the state. What I would say is the fiscal year 21 budget as you correctly indicated. Is certainly unclear where we're all going with that. It is premature. So no actual decisions have been made about changing anything to be straightforward with respect to the emergency housing restructure. There had been a lot of conversation and discussion about that proposal. Ultimately. The house appropriations committee made it pretty clear that they wanted to postpone implementation of that till April. I think that's pretty straightforward. We would not do it sooner at this point. I will share with you. One of the things about this crisis that has occurred to me is actually why there may be great benefits. Giving communities more flexibility, more money to try to address issues of homelessness. So I think that from my perspective, that approach is still on the table, but certainly to be straightforward about it, implementation would be delayed. Okay. You said April. Did you mean August? Maybe a decision would be made on that or no? No. I want to talk about a decision. I was talking about implementation. That's what the house appropriations committee said that they wanted to do. Not. So not this month a year from now. Yeah. Okay. Great. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. Representative Gonzalez. Thank you. Ken, it's, it's. It's good to know that people are present. It's good to know that. Ken, it's, it's. It's good to know that people are probably using hotels who need to, as a, as a means to self-isolate. So if they're housing situations. We're precarious and overcrowded. And so that there's this opportunity to access. I'm also thinking about folks who are in situations right now where they are overcrowded and they don't. You know, I'm not sure if that's fine, but that if somebody in their household does get. Symptoms, then there would be no option for isolating. And so I'm wondering if. There's outreach or how folks who are in that situation. So not. Exactly homeless, but are not able to have the isolation. Needed and no additional housing. I do appreciate that question. I think that, you know, I think it's a good question. I think it's a good question. I think it's a good question. I think it's a good question. I think it has been utilized by the agency human services to make sure we're talking on a regular basis. The. The state. Emergency. Operation center is also standing by to make sure we have appropriate. Guidances and protocols. So the idea would be in my mind. Obviously we're encouraging anybody who's got symptoms to talk to them. To determine whether a test is appropriate. Or warranted. And because we have been working very closely with the health department, the guidance would also go out in terms of how to isolate as needed. And the information about the availability of. For example. If someone is in an apartment with too many people, let's just put it that way for the size of the space to engage in social distancing. And somebody had symptoms. Or. Was. Frankly. COVID-19 positive. The idea would be. Is. Harbour place or for that matter, the holiday in. When it's not necessarily limited by any stretch to people who are homeless. So that the idea would be at least in my mind. If someone. It was living in an apartment with too many people. And the idea would be. We would connect to make sure that as a system, we provided some safe place for the person to live. That's the goal anyway. I don't want to tell you we're perfect. We're not, but, but we certainly recognize that we. Do want to control the spread of the virus. And as a follow up to that, one of the things that has, has come up is potentially folks who are working on farms who don't have access. They don't have access to homes. They don't have access to homes that are undocumented. And having access to housing. In that way. And so have a question specifically about those folks. And language access. But then also. Not just folks that would be undocumented, but language access and knowledge about the different options. So I am hearing that. Through your healthcare provider is the way in, but knowing that in my community, there are a lot of different languages. And I think that I can certainly, I mean, again, my general understanding is we are all working together to try to address every circumstance. From a health and safety perspective, but I can certainly look into and make sure that we have appropriate outreach to those communities to address those situations. If they arrive. Great. Thank you. Yeah. Ken, this is Tom. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. On the housing of these 1500 folks. In essence, we caught a break because everything had to close down and places had to empty out. Do you have an idea of. First of all, the percentage of people who. Out of. Who are left in shelters who are still congregating by choice or choosing not to go, to a shelter. And, you know, and then following up on that, I think, is, is what happens. I mean, what do you envision in this transition? Or is it too soon to start thinking about what that's going to be like? Yeah. Let me go with the first question first. And I think the overwhelming majority of people are in motels. I don't have an exact number, but even the shelters that are sort of operating or actually operating in motels. I don't have an exact number. I don't have an exact number. I don't have an exact number. I don't have a small number that are actually in what were shelter spaces. The issue of, again, as I mentioned earlier, I don't have a very specific plan at this point. We're working on it in terms of we recognize. That at least until May 15th, we're still under the governor's stay, stay home order. And we're still under the governor's stay. And we're still under the governor's stay. So I think we're going to have to come up with an approach that can be safe and hopefully lead to more stable housing. For more people. And do we have an idea? And maybe this might be better, at least in central Vermont for Eileen. But do you have in a sense of how many. Of these folks are families with children. I mean, obviously there's a, there's a bunch of facets of, of that we've heard about education issues, access issues, food issues. I mean, is that something you're, you're, you can speak to right now? Or is that something we can. I mean, I don't want to tell you, these are exact numbers because numbers fluctuate a little bit, but I'm going to estimate again, as I said, 1500 people total in motels. Approximately 200 of them are children. So it's a significant, so I can't actually identify families. I apologize. I know 1,300 adults, but the reality is that it's a, you know, it's a substantial number of families. No, that is, that is a substantial number of kids and, and, but we do, we know where they are. We do. We're keeping track of the population in different hotels around the state. And frankly, we're talking about, there have been some questions raised about mixing. And so we have in some communities been discussing whether we can't more centrally locate families separate from single individuals. It depends on the size of the community, but we're, and central one is one of those areas where we're actually working on that. And I mean, may have more specific information than I do to be sure, but we're definitely aware of that. The significant number of children and families and wanting to adjust appropriately to, to maintain, you know, their safety too. And I guess last question for me would be, is there anything here in this world that the administration sees is necessary for legislation in the coming weeks that will help the situation? Or do you feel like you have the with, with what's been passed that you have the, the ability to do what you need to do to get through this next chunk of time? So I do think with the legislation that's been passed, we have what we need right now. That doesn't mean I won't come back to you or we won't come back to you in the future, maybe even in the near future, but right now we have what we need very specifically. You gave us emergency authority to promulgate rules. We may very well take advantage of that. We've certainly, as I indicated already, we've certainly waived significant rules in our GA program, in our childcare program, for example. And so we appreciate that, but I don't have a request right now. Thank you for asking, though. Okay. No, please stay in touch either through you or Sean or Sarah or anybody else who is, is available, but I just want to appreciate your time with taking the time to fill us in on the administration's perspective on what's been going on. I also want to appreciate all the work that's been, that's gone on into this. I think this has been a human effort to get people off the streets and to get them as safe as possible. And so I wanted to thank you and your crew for doing this work. It's been, it's been seen and noticed and appreciated. So thank you. I appreciate that. I will pass that on. Please do. So, and, and you may, you may unhook yourself from the meeting at any time you need to, but I will have to go pretty soon. Thank you. All right. Thanks, Ken. So we'll move over to Eileen and Eileen. I'm going to butcher what it is the organization. If I try to explain it. So I just want to pass the microphone to you to really kind of educate us a little bit on what, and what's been happening with down street and capstone and, and the department of health, which is, which is not a unique organization. I believe it's at least in, I know it's in Chittin County. There's a similar organization in Chittin County, I believe, but if you could just fill us in on what's been going on, I think that would be great. I think that would be great. I think that would be great. I think that would be great. I think that would be great. I think that would be great. I think that would be what drove it and where you are. That would be great. And we'll have questions. As we go along. Great. Good afternoon, everyone. So I mean Peltier from a down street and from the probably worst named organization we ever created, but we did it really quickly. And we have about 30 people working with us. For calling ourselves. When not rock, but you know, good morning. I'll give you an update. I'm with the three of them in the response command center. How's that for a mouthful? You needed to, you need a dictionary of acronyms for that. It's crazy. Yeah. It's a anyways. And I am one of the three unified commanders. We are using the ICS structure for FEMA. We are not an official state. our accountable community for health in central Vermont, which in central Vermont is called Thrive. So I would, you know, I always like to make a little speech and I did do some writing this morning and I wanna sort of share what I think is happening at least in central Vermont. And because of Winocroc has been so successful and sort of bringing home and community-based partners together in collaboration with central Vermont Medical Center, we have been asked on several occasions by the state to sort of think and help them strategize around the issues of homelessness, the issues of feeding individuals who are both homeless, but also in the congregate housing settings, into seniors, as well as the population of people who traditionally go to the food banks. And I'm sure you're aware there's been a real run on the food banks and other parts of the country and some in Vermont as well. So we've been involved in those things so I'm happy to discuss that as well. So to begin, to state the obvious, we're in some tough times or I'd like to say as the Buddhist tradition would say, we're passing through some difficulties. I prefer the idea of passing through to stuck or buried under the weight of our misfortunes, passing through suggest movement and opportunity for change. A friend described it as follows, we're on a fast moving lifeboat. We're in fact many lifeboats bouncing over the rapids. We have left our tranquil, albeit very imperfect lake and we are heading to a brand new place. We have two missions to ensure as many as possible, make the journey successfully and to ensure we land in a better place. One thing we know about viruses is that they attack our most vulnerable spots. They look for weak spots and they head straight there. We also know that systems are only as strong as the weakest component. This pandemic began as a medical event. Today, we understand that beyond the medical event, there is a much larger socioeconomic event already overhead, vulnerable components of our socioeconomic system in Vermont like rural hospitals, small family owned businesses, seniors and young families struggling to make ends meet and our housing infrastructure are the points of access for this viral economic event. It is the socioeconomic event that will strain our resources and challenge our values. Interestingly, early on in the medical event required we address homelessness in order to protect all of us. We were told to stay home, stay safe. But as we all well know, some 1200 Vermonters didn't have a home to stay safe in. With swift action we housed nearly our entire homeless population. In Washington County, we housed 236 people, including 44 children in seven different hotels. We immediately set up a system to feed everyone three meals a day. We did incredible work to flatten the curve and it does appear that that's working. You've asked me to speak to the current state of the hotels and the people there. First, some good news. People have a roof over their head and a warm bed and a shower. They have three meals a day. Some are connected to the state support system for the first time. In Washington County, we are rapidly doing intakes of many new individuals and families for our coordinated entry program. We very much believe that right now we have a unique opportunity to work with this population on their longer term needs. Many individuals that are homeless have substance use and or mental health problems. By connecting now to each guest in the hotel, individuals can be referred to the necessary providers that can support their individual needs. We should be funding these services right now. So as not to miss an opportunity to connect homeless individuals to the support they need to move forward during and after this crisis. Along with these successes, our hotel system of housing the homeless is facing some very steep challenges. The state and service providers are in discussions to strategize solutions. In Washington County, we are having success at the Econolodge which is filled with people coming from the shelters and whom are familiar with the rules associated with being in shelter. Goods Marathon Haven is managing that site. At the other hotels, things are considerably different. On April 3rd, Winock Rock sent a memo to the state to share our urgent concern that the hilltop where some 89 people including 40 or so children are currently housed was honestly a hot mess and could quickly become a hot spot. The state responded quickly and agreed to fund Goods Marathon Haven to provide services at the hilltop. Almost two weeks later, we are still very concerned. Herrick DeAngelis, who I know you heard from recently is the executive director of Goods Marathon Haven. The situation at the Econolodge is good but not at the hilltop end. Goods Marathon Haven recently established an office there with 24 seven staff and they have the cooperation of the hotel management. However, there has been extensive disregard of the Haven's role and no way to enforce consequences for unsafe or inappropriate behavior. A recent incident in which a guest assaulted a motel staff person and retained her room is illustrative of this. Goods Marathon Haven needs to be able to implement a set of rules that are appropriate for these semi congregate settings given the public health situation and the governor stay at home order. They need to be able to back up enforcement with the forfeiture of the room. Rick also asked for a security presence in concert with the Berlin police department. These requests are being considered but it does seem unlikely that the rules will change due to the need to respect individual rights. I would imagine there are similar challenges in at least some settings across the state. The need to address immediate health and safety concerns is important and urgent. We don't want to end up housing and feeding 1200, I guess it's 1500 people with a system that is not safe either from a COVID-19 hotspot or from typical safety concerns in these types of settings. So I think it is reasonable at this point to say everyone is in the lifeboats but some are having a tougher ride than others and we are certainly not down the river yet. In terms of the larger goal to end up in a better place I'm not aware of any significant planning as of yet. Some of the pre COVID-19 discussions about restructuring the GA voucher program may be a place to start. First and foremost, we have an issue with access to affordable housing due to a huge lack of housing vouchers. Rick reports that 85% of the 161 households in motels right now in Washington County are singles and childless couples. So 85% are single or childless couples. It is too hard for these people to get into low cost simple safe housing. They don't fit into the federal voucher programs that often have challenging guidelines. As well, they may have a challenging history as a tenant or a criminal background that can make it challenging to either get into the housing or to often stay in that housing. The next challenge to housing the currently homeless population is funding for services at the housing site. Currently 19% of down streets portfolio serve previously homeless folks. For some, we have some case management but most do not have services provided at their homes. For many, housing was the leg up they needed and they are doing well. For others, successfully staying housed is a real challenge. It is likely that the homeless in hotels are in the second category and will need much more than four walls and a roof to be successfully housed. Supply of safe, decent affordable housing is a big challenge in many areas of the state our statewide vacancy rate is extremely low. Some of this is due to the need for new construction. Some is due to apartments being repurposed into Airbnb or high-end apartments that are unaffordable for many Vermonters. Regardless of the root causes the challenge for the currently homeless population is primarily vouchers and services. And for some challenging risky behavior there results in a removal from an apartment. One solution down streets is trying related to the behavior challenge is to provide the tiny mighty homes that's what we're calling them where an individual has their own home and is less likely to cause safety concerns with the other tenants in the housing community. As well, permanent supportive housing like Great River Terrace in Putney or Beacon Place in Shelburne are working in some areas but are unlikely sustainable without vouchers and services. To some degree, there will always be a need for an emergency shelter. We need to support our emergency shelter system better. According to Rick, the current situation is highlighting the need to rebuild the emergency housing homeless system at least in Washington County. He states that we have insufficient funding to operate effectively. Good Samaritan Haven must raise one third of their operating budget in private donations. This is too much for a small rural organization. As well, there is insufficient technical assistance for best practices, facilities are inadequate and there are very few easily accessible step-up options available for those who have entered the system to get into permanent housing. So to recap, the areas we need assistance include the rules for homeless staying in hotels, funding for enhanced services at the hotels to address compliance, safety and root causes of homelessness. So this is a request that currently Washington County Mental Health has made a request for some staffing. A revamp of the general assistance voucher program, more project-based vouchers in the state affordable housing system, funds for services at housing sites, funds for innovative solutions like the tiny mighty homes and a revamp of the emergency shelter system. It's my understanding that the current time line is to end the GA vouchers on May 15th. It's also my assumption and hope that the state will be convening a group task with defining the future path for the homeless population in hotels. If in fact, this hasn't already happened. In my mind, this is a critical next step as we transition from the medical event to the socioeconomic event before us now. I recognize the huge challenges before you all as you begin to understand the financial impact of COVID-19 on our state's financial health. I thank you for your diligence in serving Vermont and for your commitment to keeping Vermont healthy in the coming weeks and months. Closing, I wanna share a very brief quote from Arun Hadi Roy, who is an Indian author who recently wrote about the impact of COVID-19 in India. She says, historically, pandemics have forced humans to break with the past and imagine their world anew. This one is no different. It is a portal, a gateway between one world and the next. We can choose to walk through it, dragging the carcasses of our prejudice and hatred, our avarice, our data banks and dead ideas, our dead rivers and smoky skies behind us. Or we can walk through lightly with little luggage ready to imagine another world and ready to fight for it. And as you know, I strongly believe that most of this concerns we have and issues we have around homelessness are related to those root causes of stigma and trauma and social isolation. So I think that quote is just really telling and speaks to the opportunity that we have before us. So thank you for your time. And as I said, I'm happy to answer any questions. I'm going to start right off with Tommy Walls. He's been waiting here. Representative Walls. Thank you. I've got a question, Nyleen. Ken mentioned the numbers and how the count currently is well above the point in time count, which is no surprise. And he's surmising that some of these people may have been, for example, perhaps they were couch surfing or they were in some other kind of situation that no longer applies. And I'm just wondering if anybody has any sense if there's a growth in homelessness being occasioned by COVID-19 by layoffs. And if so, I'm just trying to figure out what the impact is on this, on employment and homelessness if there's some way of quantifying that. So I think we can pretty confidently say that the 1500 people in the hotels is closer to the number as Representative Stevens or Chair Stevens was saying, what's the true number? I think that's pretty close to the true number that has existed for some time. And I think as I said in my comments is a real opportunity to attract that population but projecting out the socioeconomic event that we're talking about how that is gonna affect long-term needs for affordable housing or an increase in homelessness really depends on how we respond now, right? So I think in some ways they're separate issues. We have, what is the sort of population of about 1500 people primarily chronically homeless population who have multiple needs, multiple challenges. The episodic homeless event that's probably before us for some people, meaning it related to a job loss but they probably can climb back out of that if systems are put in place to support that. So I know you talked this morning about staying on evictions for the time being. Those kinds of things will help obviously the unemployment. We at Down Street are trying to project the impact to our organization. Of course, we have no intention of evicting people although I will say I appreciate the language where there are sometimes extreme exceptions when you have a real health and safety issue for the rest of your residents. So even in an event like this you might have to take some action. I appreciate that bit of flexibility and I think it's needed. But we're trying to project out what losses we will have in revenue. And that gives us some sense. So what we're seeing in April, I will tell you is a decrease in a pretty substantial decrease in rental payments but not as substantial as we had thought. And I think that we'll see a new bump of this after the federal additional stimulus, the federal additional unemployment payment of $600 a week ends at the end of June, I believe. So I think it's gonna be hard to predict that episode of homelessness until we really have a sense of when the economic system can come back online. But they are really separate events. And I think if you think of homelessness in terms of chronic and episodic that helps us to sort of think about what we're dealing with both issues right now. One was a pre-existing position of vulnerability. The other will be an episodic event related to the economic downturn. Well, my big concern is episodic or not, you're being stretched to the limits now and potentially it could be much worse if the response to job layoffs and that kind of thing is not sufficient and a lot more people have than find themselves homeless. Yes, absolutely. And I think it speaks to the needs of having these kinds of vouchers available. So looking at the GA system, do we think of it in a different way? Do we convert some of those dollars into project-based permanent vouchers where whether it's in the nonprofit housing portfolio or the private portfolio, getting more of those on the street, getting people houses gonna make a difference. But they are two different populations. And if we can sort of help the episodic event through by economic stimulus programming, we can reduce the long-term impact of that. Whereas the 1500 I think is a need that is probably pretty consistent with capitalist systems like we have in this country that there's always gonna be a certain percentage of that. Okay, thank you. And Eileen, can I just go back a little bit and maybe we need to talk to Rick DeAngelis a little bit in the future if he has time. But the difference in populations between Econolodge and the Hilltop, can you speak to that? Like why is the population in Hilltop so much more difficult than that in Econolodge? So the population at the Econolodge was moved there from the Goods, Merritt and Haven shelter. They had ongoing relationships with the shelter. So many of them were shelter residents for a number of months, up to 90 days in theory, sometimes longer. So, and we were reaching towards the end of the season. So they were used to the rules that you have in a shelter, right? They were the people who could sort of tolerate those set of rules to be housed and kept warm during the winter. When they moved them to the Econolodge, it's still under, it's essentially still the shelter. They were able, the state took over the entire Econolodge and has a contract. So it's being operated completely by the Goods, Merritt and Haven as if it is, so essentially they moved the shelter to the Econolodge because they couldn't social distance in the shelter because it was just basically a big open room, right? So they're able to maintain all of there. They have agreements that are signed that an individual signs when they come in around their behavior, they have one, two, three strikes, they're removed. So all those kinds of systems and approaches and policies exist. What's happening at the hilltop and the five other hotels, but there's a real concentration at the hilltop. So that's the one we're most concerned about is those are individual vouchers provided by the state. So an individual gets a voucher, picks a hotel, goes there and the relationship is with the state, right? In the voucher and the hotel is just providing the room, they're getting the check. So for a few weeks, there were essentially no services happening at the hilltop. It was just sort of the traditional GA program, right? The idea in that program is you get a voucher to stay in a hotel, you're encouraged to seek out services but you don't have to. So what in effect, there's no way to address behavior challenges. So we've got this population of people who are all housed together, we're feeding them three meals a day, which is great. They have a lot of time on their hands like many of us do in some ways. And this is a population of people in both settings but who are used to risky behavior and are not necessarily influenced by the risk of COVID-19 infection or spread, being the cause of a spread. These are people who are dealing with substance use disorder. They may have more important immediate concerns of the day. So it's really difficult and challenging to manage that behavior. So Rick has stepped in to the hilltop at our, we basically forced him into this and is trying to manage it but he doesn't have any of the tools that he has in the O'Connell Lodge where it's basically his shelter because, and the state is even saying, you are not allowed to discharge someone. So in the past, the hotels have been able to say, you're smoking in your room, you need to leave but the state is in effect saying, that's not happening right now because we're flattening the curve. So it's become a little bit of, it's been referred to as the Wild Wild West up there and it's a real challenge. So Rick is very, very concerned about it. And we are, as I said, there was a call as recently as two o'clock yesterday afternoon to speak with the state about how to rein the situation. Representative Triana. Unmuted, yeah, okay. So there's about 4.6 million, I guess, coming in to HUD in the form of block grants. Now as that money in the form of block grants able to better assist the needs that we have right now then it would have been if it was designated somewhere, can you explain or do you have an idea of how that's likely to work? From what I understand that the additional emergency block grants that are coming into the state will primarily be economic stimulus. So business development, childcare programs. So I believe that the community development block grant funds that are coming are not gonna be for housing specifically. There may be some small portion of it, but it doesn't sound like that's what will be happening with that. It's more focused on that sort of economic stimulus, which will hopefully, as I was saying earlier, reduce the homelessness surge that we may have related to the economic event. The funds that are available to us. And so currently the state is paying for obviously the hotels for the Econolodge. They are now transitioning to paying for the food in different parts of the state that's been done through volunteer programs, community action and a whole bunch of different ways. They are establishing contracts with all of those. So with the hopes that FEMA will be able to funds will be able to pay for that. And that is part of the on Sunday FEMA actually issued their guidance on what they'll pay for for this event and what they won't. So to me, there doesn't seem to be any clear funding that's gonna address the homelessness issue at this point. But to some degree, I guess it remains to be seen. I think some of the bigger hope is with being able to identify this population, the 1500, get them through the coordinated entry system into our system, start to be able to work with them. And it would just be fantastic if we could get some case management into those hotels in the next four weeks before we lose track of these people. And that was one of our requests yesterday was to basically hurry up and support that. And cause as you can imagine, all of these nonprofits are extending way beyond their cash availability to just do the right thing. And we're reaching this sort of critical point where everyone's starting to get anxious about how long they can sustain that. So we're not able to just throw some services at that, at least in Washington County, we don't feel like we can and we've asked for the state to support that. Thank you. Representative Hango, can you unmute? There you go. Thank you. I guess I'm still confused on a couple of things. The first is the situation at the one motel shelter versus the other one. And is it because, is one so much more challenging because you mentioned individual vouchers. So they're just individuals who in any other time other than COVID-19 emergency time, they would have also been housed together in some sort of motel or would they have been housed in a shelter where there were rules? So it could be both, but the ones at the hilltop are primarily people who would have just gotten like a cold weather emergency voucher. So first of all, you're not there for as long. Second of all, you're not there 24 hours a day. And so that's part of it. But it really does come down to this control of the hotel, you know, the, as I said, the state signed a contract to lease the entire Econolodge. So it is essentially the Good Samaritan Haven Shelter relocated. So they're able to implement and utilize their rules whereas at the hotel at the hilltop. And just so you know, it's the same owner. So it's not really the ownership is not the challenge. Yeah, no structure. So at the hilltop, the structure is such that, you know, it's a relationship with the state. Here's your voucher. Here's how you can use it. And the state is sort of saying because of COVID-19, they're not sort of, they're essentially saying because of COVID-19, the traditional rules, which were a hotel owner could basically ask somebody to leave, right? Or not really in place anymore. Or they're leaving and they're moving to another, you know, a hotel down the road and sort of the same situation is happening. Whereas in the past, the hotel had a little more control and was able to say no. And it's just the concentration. I mean, I don't believe the hilltop typically has, you know, essentially all of their rooms serving people through the GA program. Right, so my thought process is if Good Samaritan Haven has some backup that they will be able to run this hotel like a shelter. And in that case, will the state back them up on that that this is a shelter? It's not just a hotel with vouchers. That's the challenge. And it's unclear right now to be perfectly honest. There's, you know, it is, and I don't say that in a way to sort of criticize the state's thinking on it. They're coming at it from the perspective of individual rights, right? Right, and I can understand. It's a real standard, yeah. And that's why people are non-compliant because they're suddenly being told that they have to have three meals served to them and stay in a room and, you know, et cetera, et cetera. Whereas the rest of us who are fortunate enough to live in homes and apartments can to some degree come and go as we please right now as long as we're following social distancing and staying home as much as possible. And we are able to come and go from the hotels to be clear. They, and they are, that's sort of one of the things that is very concerning to people is that they're coming and going as often as they are, but because you can kind of see it, right? You or I could be doing that and you wouldn't necessarily notice that. They're getting on the train to buses and causing problems, you know, there's issues with the buses and social distancing on the buses and all kinds of stuff. Yeah, so it's like being under a microscope, basically. So that was one part. I just wanted to clarify where that was going. And it sounds like just a little more guidance needs to be given to everybody that this is really a shelter situation. It's not your typical motel voucher situation at this point because it is a national public health emergency that we have going on. And my other question is back to the chronic versus episodic homelessness. And I'm feeling like the chronic homeless population is the one that we've always been trying to help. And the episodic homelessness, I think, in respect to Representative Walts' questioning, line of questioning, that we're going to see more of when the state of emergency is over and maybe the stay on evictions and foreclosures has been lifted and people are trying to get jobs back, maybe can't because there are no businesses that are able to employ them. I'm seeing that is going to be a spike. And I'm hoping that that is just going to be a temporary thing. So are those the people that we should be focusing temporary shelter solutions for and the chronically homeless are the ones we need to be focusing on permanent housing solutions? Are you seeing it like that? To some degree, yes. So when you think about emergency housing systems, ideally the vast majority of the people they are serving is episodic homelessness, meaning you're there because of a job loss, a domestic violence. There's something that happens that you can get through and re-stabilize and get into housing. And so there are studies out there that say most people in homeless shelters, in fact, like 85% to 90% are in that episodic homelessness and that is just sort of the reality of the world. And they will move through that with little need for services or support, right? They're able to get through that in an economy where there are options and jobs. And I'm not in an economy that has 20 to 30% unemployment. That would be a different thing, but in a traditional situation, they can move through that. And then the other, five to 15% is chronically homeless and typically dealing with complex challenges beyond an episode that caused the homelessness, whether it's domestic violence or a loss of a job. So those are the two different populations. So for the population that we're seeing coming, like the economic refugees or whatever we're gonna be calling this population, it's pretty, I think it's gonna be pretty hard to predict until we see when the executive order gets lifted. And honestly, what you saw me mention is what it does for an employment, right? So even with the executive order lifted in our tourism economy, I don't know if you all saw VHFA's publication yesterday, they were talking about some of the economics of what's happening and the data around counties that have more jobs are related to tourism. And those particular counties are seeing already, seeing a greater impact, greater usage of food shelves, right? So we're not seeing homelessness, yes, but we're seeing what the first thing we're gonna see is the food shelves getting utilized. Washington County, for example, is not seeing that huge surge on food shelves because we are much less related to the tourism economy. So if the tourism economy is shut down for the rest of this year because no one wants to travel, right? Just because it's scary, that's gonna have a significant effect on that number. If we come back from that more quickly, if we get a vaccine or something changes and we're truly past worrying about this, I think we'll be in a different place. So temporary housing will be a need, but I also think there's opportunity for systems and support around, we are gonna be looking at foreclosures. Can we do something to stay foreclosures for some period of time? Can we extend unemployment benefits? I mean, because this is short-term. So setting up an entire system of temporary housing and leaving other units vacant doesn't entirely make a lot of sense. I mean, I'm hoping that we're at 20 to 30% unemployment rate is a short-term event. I guess we don't really know that, but... So one last thing, because I didn't see anybody else's hands up, I just wanted to clarify the 4.6 million that's coming from the federal government. I was under the impression that some of that was to be used for housing and I just tried to find my notes, can't find them. So you're... Yeah, I don't have it in front of me, and I have to say I haven't spent a ton of time on this because some of my other colleagues in the housing world are spending more time on thinking about sort of the long-term availability of funds for housing, but I'm pretty sure it was more focused on economic stimulus type things and businesses. You know, addressing those things will help to address that episodic homelessness, right? I mean, thinking in sizes of this event we're dealing with, if we can get the small businesses back on track, if we can get those rural hospitals, the funding so that they stay open, I mean, rural hospitals can be the biggest employer in a small little community. And we have several that are hanging by the financial thread. If we can do those kinds of things, then we're gonna reduce the need for temporary shelter for temporary homelessness. Thank you. Lisa, I think the breakdown came from Earhart Monca. So probably if you go back two weeks ago or so from either there was a document that was posted from either the VAHC or from Earhart in particular, that would have that breakdown. But I'd also say that was two weeks ago or three weeks ago. And who knows if that money was broken down in the same way as it was discussed back then. I think there's been no real decision, there's been no real guidance coming from the federal government on how that can be used. But I was pretty sure Earhart listed a whole bunch of housing. He did, I mean, he was pretty positive about the way it was breaking down, at least for what their state was getting or that the state was, I mean, the state gets the state minimums. At the very least, we get the state minimums, which is something that protects rural states from getting shortchanged. A lot of the larger states get per capita based numbers. But that said, we haven't heard how it's gonna break down in the near future. And to be clear though, community development block grant funds are typically for capital investments, like so developing new housing, which we need. But as somebody said early on, I think it was Rep Walls who said, well, if you don't have, or maybe it was you, Rep Troiano, that if we don't have any money, affordable housing is not affordable. So without some mechanism for vouchers coming through from the state in my mind because they're not coming from the federal or maybe the state housing authority will be granted some flexibility to release more vouchers, I don't know. That doesn't address this episodic homelessness, right? Okay, so I'm seeing on Earhart submitted testimony, $4.6 million for housing assistance grants through CUD, through the Department of Housing and Urban Development. So that's all, so that sounds like vouchers. Okay, I just wanted to clarify that because your statement that it probably wasn't going to apply to housing confused me. There may be actually two different pots of money because I can see the writing that I'm saying, but it might be a different pot of money that I'm referring to. Okay, because there is another pot of money for $4.7 million in community development block grants, which is going to social services. That's what I was thinking. So that's a different, and in addition to that is $4.6 million for housing assistance grants through HUD. So that's not additional vouchers, which is a good thing. So that could address temporary. Great. Certainly for renters. And whether that's open to homeowners as well, I hope it might be in some way because we'll have homeowners in these kind of situations are sometimes more of a risk, right? Particularly if we've got national banks in the mix. That's the figure that I was referring to. I had that printed out in front of me when I brought that up. So it's $4.6 million in block grants to HUD. Right. Well, actually two things. The block grants are not the HUD. Yeah, the HUD is just, yeah. Sorry, there's $4.6 million in community block grants, which is for social services. That's $4.7, sorry. And $4.6 for HUD. So it's two separate, four point, whatever, $4.5 million in block grant will go to the state, you know, commerce and community development. The HUD assistance will go probably to the state housing authority or some version of that if that helps make sense out of it. Yes, thank you. It's a lot of alphabet soup. Yep. Eileen, in terms of using hotels, I mean, I think it's an interesting situation with the Hiltapa and using the state vouchers. I think the only way I could see it becoming a shelter the way that Econolodge would be is that if it was emptied out and a contract was signed and then people were brought in, because I mean, the people who are at Econolodge don't have vouchers, correct? I mean, this is, the state is paying for the rooms straight out as opposed to the individual vouchers that people went through the system to get on their own. And I get that individual rights and but you'd almost have to like clear out the hotel in order to have a clean slate to move forward with a contract. Right. And it's all in good, you know, good intentions. The state, I don't know if you recall, they had the hyper, I forget what it was called, but they initially opened... Hyper vulnerable. Yeah, the hyper vulnerable, you know, they opened that up with great intention, you know. But and I think we all did not anticipate the numbers that we're seeing either, right? So, yeah, it is, it's sort of a frustrating system challenge. If we had it to do over again, yes, we'd do it all like the Econolodge. The and the hotel room nights with the vouchers. I mean, these are several years ago when Harbor Place came into effect, which was supposed to be a place of transitional housing, of people going through episodic homelessness, primarily, but with services attached to them and the way it was funded and the way it happened was we were able to only pay 35 or $40 a night for these rooms. But hotel rooms even back then were expensive or they were twice that. Is that the same? Are we still paying that $80 a night or $85 a night for these hotel rooms? So I don't know what the hotel, that what the state is doing at the hilltop. My guess is yes, that they just extended, you know, so it's whatever the GA rate is, which is I think around $80 on the Econolodge. I know that I was the one who originally talked to the owner. They asked for that amount of money and I said to them, well, you can try, but you'd be empty. And if I was the state, I would negotiate. I know the state negotiated. I don't know where they landed on that. So with the Econolodge, you know, they had a little more leverage to negotiate, right? Because they were taken over the whole hotel. So with, to the organization that's formed in response with Capstone and the Department of Health, can you just give us a little bit of a breakdown on, in terms of like, is this the group that's feeding people? I mean, you said it, you said, you know, volunteer groups are feeding people, who's paying for the food? What are they getting? But also just in general, you have a whole, I know I've seen your structure. You have 30 people working under this structure that is aside from their jobs. Can you just talk about that a little bit? Yeah, so the concept is that what we in effect did was redeploy some of our staff, right? Some are volunteer, like I'm assuming my time is volunteering and I'm fortunate enough to have a fabulous COO at Down Street, holding down the fort. So I'm able to do this work. There are other people who are being employed by Capstone primarily. Capstone as a community action agency will get a certain amount of money. They already know what that amount of money is. So this is the emergency services block grant versus the community development block grant. So they will be able to use some of those funds and potentially FEMA funds to pay for the staffing of the structure. But it's a lot of, there's a lot of names in there that are volunteers from different organizations within the Thrive Network, which is essentially all of the home and community based service providers in central Vermont. So we reached out to our Thrive Network. We basically went to them and said, we wanna set up this structure. We've gotta have a coordinator response to dealing with and supporting the most vulnerable in our area and at the same time, very focused on flattening the, reducing the medical search. So that was our initial objective. And we are factoring in conversations right now about what does that mean for where we're going? We've sort of, we, well, we're hoping in a few days that Commissioner Levine is gonna say we have successfully made it over the peak and where we're on the right side of things and we're past the med surge. We heard from CVMC yesterday at our afternoon call and they're prepared to manage significantly more people than they've seen. So I think that that issue is primarily addressed. But as we know, we're dealing with this economic crisis now. So we're trying to determine what's our role. It is a, it's a emergency response system. So the intention is not that this is a structure that will stand forever. The intention is that it's standing up to address an emergency event. When we started this, we were thinking it was entirely a medical event. And we could all pop the champagne and high five in a few weeks when we sort of got through that significant surge. Obviously it's evolved and there's much more happening. So we're trying to determine what our role is. At some point we will sort of reintegrate into the accountable community for health thrive system. We think that it's a really strong structure to have in place, I believe Upper Valley Strong has a similar structure that they formed during Irene and they stood it up again in the past few weeks. So we actually think the accountable communities for health around the state should have the structure, should have this expertise to be able to respond in emergency. So it's an entirely different, you know, system. It's an entirely different business model and effect and leadership model that allows us to use a whole bunch of people, you know, delegate responsibilities really quickly and turn things around really quickly. You know, so we initially were asked, we were just beginning to form when we were asked to help relocate the homeless population. And at the same time also to be looking for sites for congregate housing settings for COVID positive people, you know. And if you think of the state, I think one of the things that Sue Minter often says about this is that the reason Winock Rock needs to exist is because we don't have county government. So we're looking at trying to fill in the gaps. You all know there are many, many mutual age groups. There are more volunteers, I mean, we're Vermonters. We're out there doing what we need to do. But how do we connect those dots and how can someone be sort of at the regional or, you know, for lack of a better term, sort of county government level seeing where those gaps are? So that's been the role we played. A lot of what we've been doing has been assisting the state. Honestly, we did a lot of kind of behind the scenes work at the community level, helping think through the Goddard challenge. We're feeding all of the individuals at the hotel, but for the past two weekends ago, I spent the entire weekend writing a statewide plan for what we think will be a mass feeding event. There will be, we think, you know, as you've seen around the country, there's been huge lines serving tons of people at food shelves. So how are we gonna address that in the state of Vermont? And we developed a whole statewide response to that and have been engaged with the state around what that looks like. So I think you heard Commissioner Shat say how we work with the regional levels is been part of what we've learned by establishing this Winock Rock. And like I said, Upper Valley Strong exists, NEC Prosper, and then in Burlington, I don't know what the name of their group is, but I think that's been a really helpful system that's both allowed us to sort of interact up to the state and then down to the local community levels. It's been somewhat imperfect, so I will say some communities have not liked the idea of the sort of regional entity as they saw it as we were in between them in the state. And that's, you know, we're not, we shouldn't have named ourselves, we'll be named ourselves, but it was, you know, at midnight. We just started trying to include all the names that, you know, all the words we wanted in there. Cause, you know, we don't have authority. What we're trying to do is, you know, collaborate with these partners that we have through Thrive been working with regularly for three years. So it's been a really nice boost to the aspirations of this accountable community for health Thrive to actually see what we can do when we need to do it. And using this ICS command structure has been really an incredible learning experience and quite effective. So I'll leave it at that, I guess. Does that help? Yeah, absolutely. Further questions for Eileen? I have, I did have one more quick comment about the Rutland situation. I forget who asked that. Was it you, Rep. Gonzalez? Rep Howard, yep. Or Howard, okay. I'm not certain, but I believe what that is, is that that is related to a congregate housing site. If you've heard about it, the state was standing up several congregate housing sites for COVID-19 positive individuals. One being in Plainfield at Goddard, one in Rutland and one in Burlington. And the determination was made that we did not need that many sites based on what the projections related to the surge and where we're at in a surge. So they shut those down. So I do not believe that there were, I'd be surprised if there were 25 people who were transported to Burlington. And I think the stories might be getting mixed up between those two different things. As far as I know, I'm not aware of any shelter closing in Rutland, but I'm not fully aware of everything, but I've been on a lot of calls statewide for the homeless stuff. So, and I haven't heard that, but I just wonder if it might be related to that change in need related to the congregate housing sites. Okay, Representative Kalaki. Yes, Eileen, thank you so much for everything you do. And I would hope that you would share your writing with us as well. You write so well and you capture things so beautifully that it would be helpful to me as I try to talk about some of the work you've been doing to have your words as well. So I would appreciate that. Happy to share it. Representative Triano, you're not, can you unmute? I'm hitting the button here, so I'm meeting. There you go. Okay, so I just wanted to say, Eileen, that it is just so impressive what we heard here today as to what's actually happening to accommodate our homeless population. And as you may know, it's an issue that's really close to my heart. So my wife is on the board of the Hardwick area food pantry and they had gone through some initial changes. And it actually asked me to contact the governor regarding the National Guard being called out to distribute some food in a way that they would take it from the food shelves and actually deliver it and eliminate some of this curbside service that what they were experiencing difficulties with. But I have to say, just taking 1500 people and all these children around the state and lodging them and feeding them is just a massive undertaking that I just am so grateful to hear from you and Ken on and just congratulate you on the great work that you're doing. Thank you. I mean, I will say it's an entire mix of different people responding. So in Central Vermont, it's capstone and they just were all over it and they did an amazing job in other regions as a community action agency, but there are other, some restaurants engaged, there are churches feeding. So it's your classic Vermont response. It's a little different in every community. I can speak a little bit to what is happening with the food distribution there, there's a multifaceted initiative happening and part of that does include FEMA, MREs probably coming into the state. I think by the lead by the end of the week that will be allowed to feed people. There'll be a, you know, so I've been very impressed. I'm actually part of this food meeting Vermont initiative with the state's preparedness and response and, you know, we're hoping, it's been a very interesting journey being part of this, you know, being asked to, you know, a month ago to set up 170 beds at Goddard College for COVID positive individuals and, you know, running around doing that work and then laying in bed at night and going, am I really doing this? Are we really gonna need this? And fortunately, as we're doing the good work, we didn't need it. So similar on the food side, I believe they're doing an excellent job of preparing for that worst case scenario and hopefully won't need it. There's a lot of good work happening at the state level. And I have to say incredible state employees are working incredibly hard. So as Commissioner Schatz said, his team is all over it. And overall, I've been nothing but impressed with the level of responsiveness and listening to what the communities are saying on the ground. This is what we're seeing. This is what we need. It's like when we made that phone call or wrote the email about the hilltop, I think I sent it at 6.30 in the morning. And I want to say it's 7.15, I got a response from the state to tell the good Samaritan human to go ahead and hire staff to get up there. So, you know, it's working. It's a lot to do. And as I think he also said several times, we're not gonna get it perfectly right. But, you know, I think one of the nice things about Vermont is where Vermont was first and political parties and all that stuff second and that all goes away when you're dealing with emergency and it's been really nice to see how well we can work together at the state level. And the responsiveness I think even started, it started really early on. I mean, there was chatter almost immediately up in Chittin County that there are five hotels that are available for sale. And that quickly morphed into a conversation about leasing. And we've seen that with the Connell Lodge where the administration was very amenable and open to making sure that these hotels became available for the isolation purposes. And I appreciate you sharing all this, also reminding us how sobering it is that it's not easy just to get people into rooms and feed them three times a day but providing the services is, you know, something that we have heard again and again as part of the ongoing process to try to alleviate homelessness, but that there's always gonna be populations that are very difficult if the situation's not right or if the services aren't available. So I appreciate you sharing that sobering news that it's still a struggle for people. And I think as time, hopefully over the next couple of weeks when the state understands what we have in terms of the federal package and how we can utilize it, I'm certainly hope that the work that we do helps you and helps the agency make sure that these folks aren't forgotten. Representative Gonzalez. Thank you so much. Yeah, I just wanna echo Representative Seedens of this very big important work. And as I went talking to Commissioner Schaast and asking about folks that are undocumented and accessing people as essential workers on farms and accessing housing when they're not exactly in an unhoused situation, but wondering if there's been conversation or talk of potentially using trailers for kind of as stock gaps for different things for folks who are in that precariously housed in this middle in the pandemic where they need more spaces. And I know that there has been efforts around medical care providers and networks of people across the country that have been using empty trailers and things for those kinds of situations. And didn't know if that's in part of the conversation around housing essential workers in different places where they need to be isolated but are not actually experiencing homelessness. Right, it was brought up, was definitely a conversation. What they're finding is because our surge is not as steep because we're doing all the right things that there really hasn't been the need for the essential workers I think are finding housing. I will say that the precariously housed, the precariously fed, that's the area that Winock Rock is starting to focus on now and really saying so as an example, the food shelf at Capstone has seen a decline in number of people coming. They have many seniors who come. So they're in that sort of pipe or they're vulnerable, they cannot go to the food shelf. So we've called them this week, reached out because Capstone has that information has reached out to just the, I think about 30 people in Barry and what we are seeing is that they are hungry, they are struggling. And so we sort of termed them the sort of the quiet struggling. So that's what's gonna happen with this. There are gonna be new populations of people who are getting by now, who may have never interacted with the system that we all know so well with all the alphabet soup and don't know how to access that, don't know how to connect with that. So we're looking at trying to figure out how do we reach down into that community? I think another example is, well, similar to that is, so if you talk to the Meals on Wheels program, they are bringing in new people to serve, they are able to manage that capacity, but that doesn't mean that there aren't, for every one person they're bringing in, maybe five other seniors who don't know to make that phone call and make that connection because this is a new thing for them. So it's an interesting challenge. And I think that's where I tell myself that the community-based mutual aid groups are connecting. I know here, I had heard in Montpelier that people are actually putting little green cards in your window, meaning I'm okay, red, I need help. We, like every social challenge, we're never gonna do this all at the state system level. And I think at some point we have to rely on individuals to support each other. And there's so many of those things happening. Recently, we had a question of, and we know this is happening, so neighbors are shopping for neighbors and we realized we had to teach seniors how to use Venmo or some sort of, because they're handing cash to people they don't know or they're, how does that work? So that was a gap that we could fill. So we're looking at, all right, how do we get out there and share some information with seniors about you can use the system and we'll show you how to do it, call our call center. So I agree, I think there's an unknown aspect of this. And hopefully people are reaching out if they have needs and neighbors are helping neighbors and we're closing that gap. But it's a little hard to tell at this point. Any further questions for Eileen? No, thank you so much for showing up and giving us a rundown. This has been, as I mentioned, just educational and sobering, but glad to know that I think if we looked at our original legislation that was in S333 or in that language that many of those boxes have been checked off by the work that's been going on by the administration and by groups such as Winock, Rock. And so Eileen, I guess, thank you so much for showing up, for coming by and sharing. Thank you for all that you're doing and the creative ways that you're doing it now. You all look like pros. It's a cool YouTube Zoom. I would hardly call us professionals, but, you know. You did well. I only didn't unmute myself twice today. So that's a start. Anything further committee that you want to share either on the subject or just an open conversation for the next few minutes, I can unmute us or we can just say, I believe we are on tap for a very similar schedule next week. Is that true, Ron, in terms of timing that we've been scheduled in? I have not seen the official statement, but we've been given to believe that to be the case. So I think one of the things that's come up in coordination, we didn't discuss it, it didn't really come up today, but in discussion with others is that the, one of the bills that we were working on had a rental registry. And maybe Eileen, I don't know if you're still if you still want to participate, but one of the ideas in H739, I believe, was this idea of the rental registry, which again, given, I think when we discussed this when I was asking Commissioner Schatz about this earlier, it was this serendipity of having a pandemic is that these hotels were vacant and so we could take people and move them into it. But under other circumstances, it's possible in other ways that if the hotels weren't available, where would we find these apartments and whatnot? And I think that was part of the thinking behind the rental registry, but perhaps I'm not, we haven't set up a schedule for next week, but I think we'll check to see maybe if this is worthy of conversation, considering it's existing, it's an existing bill. It's not, we haven't passed it yet and we did get to a point of passing it, but whether it's worthy of conversation, just to be part of the preparation of events such as this. I mean, no one thought that we would have a statewide shutdown like this. And if we were lucky in any way, it was simply because these hotels were available for rental at this time. But at any rate, if there are other things that people want to see us discuss, whether it's existing legislation that we have or other issues that we wanna catch up on, let me know through email or text phone call. And, but plan on having us here in Zoom at the same time next week, which would be Tuesday and Wednesday. Other than that, do good work. I know I've had an increase of phone calls from constituents and especially on the UI issues. Matt, you were on TV the other day about your business issues, well, for your business and those are certainly things that we can get caught up on. Yeah, the rollout of the CARES Act components have been clunky to say the least. Yeah, I mean, they changed the rules. I mean, again, this goes, I think, connecting it to Lisa, to the idea of like, where's that money going? Is it going to HUD? Is it coming from this whole CARES Act thing? I know I've told constituents, we told, we had multiple phone conversations with restaurant owners and small business owners and so in Waterbury and it was just wait till the CARES Act comes out. Just, it's going to do this, this, this, this and this. And then once the rules came out and it was rolled out, it was, I'd say disappointment to say the least. It was, Yeah, there was a massive rules change or rules clarification, I should say, came out at 11 p.m. Thursday before you were able to submit applications at 9 a.m. Friday. And we didn't even have application templates to look at until that happened. And there were significant changes to the structure of the loan terms. If you fell out of compliance for the debt to be forgiven, they changed the loan terms drastically. So it's created a lot of anxiety within the business community to say the least. Well, and one of the things that they were trumpeting was this EIDL grant, which was supposed to be $10,000. You just had to apply and you may not qualify for the loan, but hey, here's $10,000. And that got changed to what? $1,000 per employee. $1,000 per employee up to $10,000. I only know one person who has seen a check. I have any, I put it on for my request and maybe, wow, we're creeping up on two and a half weeks now and I haven't even received an email response. They're supposed to follow up with you because that's attached to another loan program. Right, right. And I've heard Matt's story. I've heard, on the other hand, I've heard that there's some banks that have been really good on this and have been really helpful to their clients and people have gotten their money as promised. Our local lenders have been wonderful with navigating this because they're all SBA certified for the most part. And I've found them to be the most helpful for everyone. And it's just navigating this information which is the difficult part. So I would say that the local lending institutions have been very positive. It's just getting, they just keep changing the rules in the middle of the game at the federal level and that's what's frustrating. Yeah, go ahead, Lisa. So I think maybe we could hear from the federal delegation again at some point when they have a better idea of how we can disseminate all this information and get it to our constituents because let's face it, most of us have small businesses in our communities. That's who our constituents are. And until we can say to them until we're blue in the face, well, we're waiting for the feds, we're waiting for the feds, blah, blah, blah. And then that only goes so far. So it helps to have, I think, pieces of real information like April 24th is when you're gonna start seeing your checks or this is when you're gonna start being able to apply and this is who's gonna be able to apply. Yep. So the more information we have, the better. No, I agree. I do have a call tomorrow with Chris Saunders from Senator Leahy's office again with the Main Street Alliance Crab and a few other business owners. So I'm hoping to get some more clarity on that very point you just raised. Maybe you can give us a presentation, Matt. I have actually been doing that for my local rotary and partnership. Yeah, you can do YouTube. At this point, Matt, I almost feel like I'm a CARES Act stimulus consultant for like a wide range of folks. Oh, well, now I know who to talk to. I've definitely had my head in it pretty deep for a couple of weeks. So if you have any questions, everybody just, Thank you. Yeah, reach out. And there is a group that just formed with the folks from Stonecutter. I believe I think I saw that Seth Stewart anyway was part of a group that was offering consulting to small businesses and restaurants to try to navigate through this for free, or at least that's what I saw in one response. So if that's something that you can pass on, but it's been, I know Chip has heard, the representative of Toronto has heard from a number of people for a couple of weeks now about the disappointment with the UI. And I know that the House leadership has been, and the Senate leadership has been at the administration to try to expedite enlarging the response system. And it is probably more logistical than it is financial, but it has been a real strain on people because as someone reminded me this morning, it's been a month since they've had a paycheck. And all I could say was, geez, when it comes, it's gonna be a big paycheck, but that doesn't help them when they are down to their last few dollars in their bank account right now and they have bills to pay, Representative Hango. So on that note, because we have Emily here, I do wanna say the House leadership has been amazing about putting together information as soon as they get it, as soon as they get questions, they're finding out answers. We've really, I'm amazed at how responsive and nimble that that system turned out to be. And I'm very grateful to the people who have been putting it together. So don't get me wrong about the no information. It's more coming from the federal level, but whenever we get little tidbits of information, House leadership's been right on it. So I really appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you, Representative Hango, and I'll pass that along to the rest. Please do, thank you. Great. Yeah, Missy's earning her salary. Yeah. So, all right, I am, I have a call at 3.30, and then at four o'clock, and as I'm sure we all have something lined up over the next couple of days, but please enjoy the weather as cool as it's going to be. It's been great to see you guys the last couple of days, and hopefully the next time I see you, I'll be feeling a little bit better, and we will keep on keeping on running. I will discuss it and we'll check in to see if we can get a schedule set up for next week. So probably you'll know by Monday. We're not meeting on Monday. We know that. But just keep looking in your mailbox, and if you have folks that you think we should invite in, please feel free to, like I said, text or email Ron and I, and we'll see what we can set up.