 Welcome once again to the breakfast. At least one student has been shot dead by police who are trying to break up a protest over increased tuition fees in Kaduna. The students of the Kaduna State College of Education were demonstrating the hiking fees by more than 100%. Joining us to talk about this is the Public Relations Officer of the Nigerian Association of University Students, Mista Shonei and Lekong. Good morning. Thanks for joining us. Good morning. Let's first of all start with understanding the reason behind the protest and what exactly happened. Once again, thank you for having me on your TV. Thank you very much. Firstly, we really need to understand that we are in a very critical situation in this country with all sectors down, most importantly, the education sector, which will represent. A word I can say that a couple of times ago, the Kaduna State Government increased the tuition fee of all states on institutions in the States for about 100% increment. So, and a couple with the fact that we don't know the current situation of the states with the government refusing to pay a salary to optimum level, sometimes they hold even pensioners, their pensions and all that. So, an increment situation fee, even if just by 1% at home can metamorphose into a student's peaceful protest, because we have a bad economy, we have a situation in the country where people are going through hard means to even survive, not to mention talking about an increment tuition fee. And this was what led the Student of Kaduna State College of Education to come out in mass yesterday to protest and register their displacement about the increment of the tuition fees without necessarily forgetting the product. In this same Kaduna State, the governor of the state had used the mechanism of the authorities of the institutions to compare the students and their parents or guardians to sign a kind of form which would keep them in perpetual silence that whatever the university or the college of education or the polytechnic in Kaduna State management decides, that would, that would, or the students would always comply and live by it. So, all of these conditions are conditions that restrict, that put restrictions on the mental right of humans, not necessarily students. Now, not to mention when students who are educated or supposed to always make their opinion known. So, this was what necessitated the protest yesterday, incrementing tuition fee, the unusual barbaric form that the students were compelled to sign so that they conform with any policies of different institutions in the state. Was it a violent protest? We all know the situation we find ourselves in this country. If there is anyone that has made the, that has disrupted, disrupted the protest, it is the men of the Nigerian police and other paramilitary forces on ground. Students could not have been violent. Did they see the governor? Of course, they could not have been, they are under on innocent people. So, why would they have been violent in the first instance? These are peaceful protesters. The same manner the Nigerian police force disrupts protestors in Lagos, disrupts protestors in Kando, disrupts protestors even at the Eagle Square in Abuja. That was the same thing that happened yesterday. They started shooting sporadically and people started running for the safety of their lives. So, no, no, no violence from the angle of the student at all. Okay, Mr. Laker, a statement by the police spokesman Mohamed Jalege said that the protesters blocked the convoy of a military sector commander and they injured him and someone else. Can you confirm that that happened? Thank you very much. The question would like, would like to ask ourselves as citizens who understand the situation of this country very well is that who, which civilian would have that audacity, that courage to injure a military, a military man? Even in a situation whereby there is no protest, we are we are just walking by going by daily activities as civilians. We all know how we panic when we see a typical Nigerian soldier in uniform. So what if it wasn't in uniform? Is it possible that that may have happened? That could not have been possible. So, Mr. Laker, are you, Mr. Laker, are you then, are you then saying that the police statement is false? Of course, the police as an antecedent of always covering putting up a bandit to cover up their illicit acts. It happened in 2015 in the Federal University of Agricultural Development. A student was shot. The police came up with another story. It happens everywhere. This is not the first time this kind of story. In fact, it would not be surprised if the Nigerian police force headquarters make a statement today again that, in fact, their officers were injured, their officers did not shoot at all, that they did not even go to the quarters down with tear gas. It is not so unusual for the Nigerian police force to issue statements that contradict to the analysis. Okay, so, Laker, the bone of contention here in the first place was about increase in, you know, school fees. And we know that particularly for this school, this Federal College of Education in Gidangwaiakafanchan, in Kaduna State, students say the school fees was increased from 25,000 era to 75,000 era. Is that what applies to every other state school in Kaduna or was just College of Education? No, it's not only in Kaduna State University, it was increased to over 100,000 era. From what? From how much? They pay barely less than about 50,000 era. So then the government, you see, we have a situation in this country whereby it is even impossible for any Nigerian student to state categorically how much we pay as fees per session. Because apart from the tuition fee, you find, okay, for instance, but in a normal standard, 24th century, the tuition fee should include the medical bills, electricity bills and other things. But we have a situation in Nigeria that you pay, you have a situation whereby you pay 100,000 as tuition fee, you still have to pay medical fees separately, you pay computer fee separately, different levels. So it becomes even difficult to state categorically that this is the fees we pay in our institutions in this country. So it's just that Governor Nguyen Bufai has just taken it too far, too far that his counterpart is playing the oppressive game better than his counterpart. All right, share with us what's the current situation on ground. The reports say that one student was killed. Can you confirm that that happened as a result of police fire? And then also, where are we currently with regards to protest? Well, thank you very much. The student was killed by the men of the Nigerian police. In fact, if I am maybe to your correspondence, I can send pictures of the deceased students, several of them were injured. And this morning, one would have expected to hear the breaking news that a student of a College of Education in Cardinal States have started disrupting the cities or the city of the society, the community in which their school is located. But yet, these students are still well-contributed. They are still planning on how to progress peacefully on how to engage the government in a peaceful manner. At least they should pass a message to the Cardinal States government and the Nigerian government at large that we have a generation of youth and students who are so coordinated, very peaceful in for that manner. And who are these students that could have seen one of their colleagues or probably even more to be found out, shot dead. And the next morning, they will still be peaceful. There wouldn't be violence deported from that place. So that should tell us that the student could not have been violent in the persistence without police unnecessary repression. So as of this morning, the students are still coordinating themselves, having meetings to look forward on what I want to do because in the persistence, the reason behind the protest was the unnecessary increment in the attrition fee. Now added to it is the fact that a live at the last athlete somewhere injured, effectively a responsible government should have issued a statement regretting its action because the governor cannot claim not to be the the chief security officer of the state. So whatever the men of the Nigerian police could have done yesterday is the governor who finds equally liable for whatever they they've done yesterday. So it's expected we should have made a statement regretting the action and as a matter of fact trying to call me to set you the crisis that okay these are in fact as a matter of call the junior leaders of that particular campus. Endage them. This is how things are done in the civil society. So Lekong, a statement from the deputy governor in Kaduna, Dr. Hadid Zabala-Rabbi says that the increase in school fees will not be reversed. What then would the students do continue to protest, continue to seek dialogue when the government has insisted that they're not going back on the hiking school fees? Okay the question is we we have three steps in our leader. We say consultation, consolidation and then confrontation. The confrontation of course is the protest action. The tradition here has been increased for a while now. These students leaders have consulted the institution management, the state government, but you know Hadid the only response the government would give them is to through the institution management give them a kind of undertaking form to fill with the appearance that whatever the management of the institution decides or whatever the government policy is they would always abide by it. We I mean we are nothing. I'm a student of political science. I can't read, I haven't read the mystery that at any point in time even the government of any government as at 17th century. I have their citizens not to converge, not to express their displeasure about policies of the state. So if the deputy governor is saying that the tuition fee cannot be decreased what should come to mind is that why do they keep on increasing tuition fee every year stating that the economy is bad, the government can no longer fund education freely. Education has never been we in the first instance. So they should stop giving us we can no longer fund education. It has never been free. But are you why have they not caused the expenses that the states incur on political office orders? Well that's a that's a different conversation. You know that let's you know remain and I get I get it I get it I just want us to I understand your point you know about having to reduce expenses of government or the cost to run government in the state you know and that might make it easier for universities to run but what happens next is does the protest then continue? Is there a consideration of maybe going to court? Is there other unions that may want to join hands with the students union to maybe approach a court and see what the court says in Kaduna state? Well thank you very much you see we are we are not we are progressive students ideological for that matter will continue to use the legal and political action because the library lost there has to be a damage there has to be a damage so that's in itself a set aside a court case in the first instance. Other unions we ask ourselves that for how long would we keep quiet even if we it will resort to engaging in dialogue now do we have the kind of government that that is ready to listen and dialogue no this is a government in fact what would have even given us the assurance that nobody has to be nobody has to be told that the what happened in Kaduna was not violent until the Nigerian police force started that violence attitude is what happened when the Nigerian legal Congress in that particular state also took up an action we also want the state government to deal so invariably what I'm trying to say in essence is that we are still coordinating ourselves no amount of repression can keep us silent in our country these people have for so long destroyed this nation and it is our own out of every generation out of relative obscurity must discover its own mission is either with betrayed or with feelings that's grand final so invariably we have to keep the pressure high the government there has never been a time in the history of any nation that the government among the people the people would always win no matter how long it takes if you look at the you know last protest in Kaduna by the NLC with regards to sacking of workers in Kaduna state I'm not sure how much success that that achieved so does that also maybe tell you that Kaduna state government is not one to renurge or to reverse its policies regardless of protests yes yes we have I know we like I have said earlier home that the Kaduna state government under government is well known for such policies and actions over time so we are not caught by surprise about what happened yesterday for some of us who are really taking keen interest in what has been going on in Kaduna for a while now we are not surprised because it's not unusual of the government of dust but what is most important is that the more I think the governor and his executive need to learn from history that the more the people are oppressed the more you begin to raise their consciousness a time will come would rise and the time is now but no I cannot cannot ban protest because it is a fundamental human right guaranteed by the constitution of the better public of Nigeria if governor is saying that protest is not allowed in the state then he's indirectly telling us that the constitution of the better public of Nigeria is not applicable in Kaduna states which invariably means that he himself is not a legitimate governor because it is on upon the basis condition of that same 1999 constitution that's the election and the process that brought him into power was based so governor say that protest is not allowed in Kaduna state is meaning to say that the constitution of the better public of Nigeria is not allowed in the state thereby saying that he himself is not legitimate to govern the state all right would not allow an individual to go forth or over human rights all right let's talk let's talk about the immigration can stop that yeah let's talk about the student who died now is there any information on on the on the student who died you know what can you tell us about him or yeah it's actually if if like I said that if possible I would have sent a picture it was short state like every other student joined the protest but for now in fact a lot of students who could have shown up and identified with him are really scared to come out we all know the kind of situation we have in Kaduna state so we are still trying our best possible at least to identify with him with the parents you know when situations like this come up it's just so sad that for every time students want to express their displeasure would have to lose most times gets enjoyed or even lose one of some of our members just to say that this day we do not want it so for now there has not been a wish to the family isn't we have to link to some other students who are really scared right now because of what happened in Kaduna state yesterday so we just don't before the end of today we should be able to unravel their full identity identify with the parents and then from there would know what's next thing to take on that okay so like all the news also says that even the police spokesman confirmed that actually three students were injured and they were rushed to the hospital but that one student unfortunately died also other news reports are saying that two students died and can you confirm if the death toll is actually two and if not what's the medical status the health of the other two students who are injured oh thank you um for her we are not to use propaganda to achieve our aim as at this moment I can only authority categorically states that the students died several others were injured of course the Nigerian police would not report that 20 students were injured it is expected of them it is expected if not for the press coverage yesterday that made the news go viral yesterday the Nigerian police could have even said that there was no injury at all nobody was shot no students died so it is so we if we want to have fans we wouldn't wouldn't be taking the reports for the statement of the Nigerian police so serious so several students were injured some of them might know injury some of them critical ones at least that they could escape with it but we can only keep record of those that we have attend and that is why the Nigerian police can still come out to stay that look okay just three students were injured one died and all of that so at that this moment I can categorically see that only one have been confirmed with my head to be dead okay whoever was still guiding you permission about the situation of things for you okay so mr leco I also want to ask you the police right in their statement said that they conducted themselves professionally but the statements that you've made confirmed that that exactly didn't happen and one challenge with protests in Nigeria is how the police conduct themselves how they fire tear gas and you know injure some people so how do you expect in an ideal society for the police the law enforcement officials to react or conduct themselves during protest well thank you very much yeah I first refused that claim by the Nigerian police that they conducted themselves professionally in that I would it's something that is known to us we are now in a situation in the country whereby even the press the journalist and press may have to put on bulletproof to cover protest actions across the country so if the police the men of the Nigerian police have been conducting themselves in professional and ethical manner we wouldn't have gotten to that stage in this country but let's leave that for now expectedly a professional police force should come there not with guns as if they want to kill animals not with guns they can they we we also see it across in in civil societies same nations what they do is if you want to dispatch protesters bring up water tankers flush them with waters these are these are at the at the maximum level these are ways to disperse protesters now that you start shooting your your citizens now that you start killing innocent people evoke these tear gas how do they how do they how do they release these tear gas is it not directly aiming at people i just mentioned the situation that happened in 2020-15 at the federal university of agriculture federal university of agricultural agriculture that it was a tear gas canister that hit a particular student title by name on his left hi and that was great so if the tear gas had been professionally shot you couldn't have hit him so what we are trying to say in essence is that you got that there is in fact maybe there should be a proper training for the men of the Nigerian police or now to handle situations like that maybe a psychological class or training can be can be done for them but i would not equally be surprised by the action of the Nigerian policemen over time because the reality is that they are also vexing their hunger on innocent people they are not equally okay they are not satisfied they are not comfortable if you go to their to their command go to respective police headquarters for months where they live where the government provides for them to stay you see that no no in in fact if you put some animals in those places all right those animals would force it within two days all right um they call so it's expected that they are not to be we can't have a police that is not well facilitated that is not well trained like foreign counterparts to behave like the civil and professional police all right thank you very much thank you very much we hope that there is you know some dialogue and of course there you know is an agreement between the state governor and the students and so all this will end but thank you very much for your time and for speaking with us we will be calling you in again if there's other developments thanks for speaking with us thank you for having me thank okay so we'll take a break here and move from that issue in Kaduna state to um in more national one and that's because the vice president of Nigeria has mentioned that global tech companies would soon begin to pay taxes does the Nigerian finance act um actually allow that so we discussed and all that um with an expert in taxation after the break