 Okay, this is our second case clinic for OGM plus food systems reimagining on July 15, 2021. I'm going to find the link to the case clinic PDF in my brain and posted to our chat. There's, it's on the theory you website. The presencing website, I think. But up that chat paste boom. There it is. So Stacy this this document does a really nice job of outlining the process we're going to go through. We use it last time worked really well. I'm happy to be the timer again, unless somebody else wants to do that. But this is nice because it gives us steps to go through for digging a little deeper into, in this case, policies initiative. Thanks for joining us. Hey, how's it going. Good. How are you. Not too bad. Thanks to be part of this. Thanks. These days I feel like how are you doing always requires some kind of a modifier response like doing fine all things considered or something like that because there's just so much flying around the world right now. Nancy thanks for joining our conversation. We have a non compliant frog joining. Just say no. Hi, Nancy. Nice to meet you guys. Gordon. Nancy is the team leader for the citizen climate lobby acting. Fantastic. Fantastic. That's awesome. Thank you. Thanks for being here. Simon much handsomer than the frog. And we're still a couple of minutes early. So let's wait a couple of minutes. Anybody who'd like to just check in. That would be a lovely thing to do. So Neil, great to see you. Hi Jerry. Glad you're here. How are you feeling. Much better. I'm feeling much better seeing you. I love that. Dang only I had that effect on everyone. You do you do. And nice to see you. Well, this is great. This can be fun. It's Christiana from our evolutionary leadership seminar. Can you hear me. Yes. Hello, and Holland. Poland or Holland. Holland. Yes. Yes. Very nice to see Klaus and very nice to see everybody else. Yep. This is great to meet Pete Phil. Thanks for joining. I think Sam is on his way in. Right. He promised to be here. Yeah. I'd love to wait until we have him. He's pretty central to the process. And I'll repost the link in the chat there Sam. I'll repost the link in the chat to the PDF of the process that we're using for this call. It's called a case clinic. Courtesy of the Presencing Institute. So if anybody wants to. Follow along. I will be following that as instructions. Hey, Tim, Isaac, John, thanks for joining. Thanks for joining. Yeah. Tim, you're still muted if you're trying to say something, but it doesn't look like you're speaking now. Yeah, nice to see you, Klaus. Thanks for the invite. Cool. Thanks. Shall we proceed? Sounds good. Do we want to do any kind of check in? How does anybody feel about just checking in briefly as a, as a small group? I'm seeing no particular motion toward check in. So maybe we step into our process. We're doing a case clinic as we did before when Sam was the client of the case clinic project process today. Klaus is the client of the process. And we will. We will begin with basically Klaus having 15 minutes to present a case that is, that represents a personal aspiration and a leadership challenge that he's working on. And maybe we'll include what his personal learning threshold is, what he needs to let go of and learn things of that nature. Our job is to not try to fix the problem, but listen deeply while attending to what shows up for us. So let's be present for this process. Sam, you're more experienced at this process than I am. Do you want to add anything else for us as we go in? Well, my understanding is that we were going to have just a small number of people here actually participating in the case clinic. Whereas the majority of the people here would just be observing the whole process. So I think it would be helpful to just make a distinction as to who is sort of, as we said in the fishbowl and who's observing. That was my suspicion as well. But yeah, other than that, like I think it's, yeah, most of the people who are going to be in have participated already. And other than that, I think it's just kind of listening and experiencing the process together. So Klaus, do you have any strong feelings about who is in the fishbowl and who is not? And by fishbowl here we mean the process we're going to step through has individuals that are in the fishbowl basically putting their feedback observations into the process and each of which takes time. So if we were all to actually be in the fishbowl, we wouldn't make it through our allotted time. Sam, how many people do you think would be good to have in the fishbowl? Like minimum four and maximum like seven or eight. That includes Klaus. Sounds good. So one way is to just have people raise hands if they want to be in the fishbowl and see if that number falls under seven. So if you'll put your hands up, if you'd like to be in the fishbowl. So Cristiana, Sumit, actually, if you'll click on the raise hand icon that I can make sure I get this right. Who else? So I've got Sumit, Sam, Jordan. We asked John. John would like to be in it. John, would you like to be in the fishbowl? You are muted right now. We can't hear you. Excellent. I think Jordan and Cristiana had their hands up as well. Yes. So the list I have is Sumit, so meet Jordan, Cristiana, Sam, John and Jerry. That's six of us. And Klaus will be there. Technically. So yeah, I would say that's good. So maybe I'll step outside the fishbowl and just sort of moderate and do the calling of the dance. That way there's six of us and I think that'll be a little more manageable. That's that makes sense. Cool. You can go ahead and put your hands. If you want less people, I can be out. It doesn't matter. I think we'd love to hear what you have to say, Cristiana. So I'm going to step out because I'm, I'm perfectly happy being annoying on the chat. And we'll offer feedback to Klaus later on. So I, you know, I love that you're all here and happy to have you in the inside of the process. So good. If you can, you can lower your hands at this point and then what else. Anything else as preamble. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I'm going to pass the floor to Klaus. Good. Then Klaus, you have 15 minutes. To present your case. And then just, I'm going to read through the intention statement by the case giver. So take a moment to reflect on your sense of calling and clarify these questions. Number one, what is your current situation? What key challenge or question are you up against? What future are you trying to create? Threshold, what do you need to let go of? And what do you need to learn? Help. Where do you need input or help? And coaches, we're to, you are to listen deeply and you can ask clarifying questions, but don't give advice at this point and listen, listen with all of yourself. Good. And I will be the timer. So Klaus, what I'll do is when the, when we're down to sort of two minutes left, we're going to go ahead and get to one. And this means you're at the 15 minutes. I'd also like, it's like a solidarity sort of symbol, I guess. And go right ahead. Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Jerry and Sam for, for making this happen. I wanted to start with some thoughts, what got us into this initiative and provide some context of, of our thinking. We're really at a unique moment now in our collective history, because climate change has advanced and past tipping points that may well be irreversible at this point. The Arctic ice has shrunk to the point where it no longer supports ocean streams, ocean currents and air streams, which have governed our weather patterns now for thousands of years. So today we, we already see the impacts on California, the Gulf Coast, Mississippi River Delta and other regions, which are no longer reliable producers. But at the same time, you know, over the last 30, 40 years, we have had a concentration of crops that have now become a huge risk to the food supply to our food security. Just think of California, which produces 50% of the nation's food and vegetables, 25% of dairy and beef and many other key crops. At the same time, you know, we have introduced agricultural methods that rely on fossil fuel based chemical, chemicals and mined minerals, which have destroyed much of our top soil already. One third of our top soil is gone. It damages water resources. It's clearly unsustainable. You can put a timeline on when we are running out of input materials and we have known that for a good number of years yet, you know, we continue to export these practices into vulnerable communities around the world. You know, we're building synthetic nitrogen fertilizer plants in Africa, in India and South America. We're selling GMO seeds to increase yield per acre, which cause significant externalities. And our way of treating and raising animals violate basic principles of nature. Another issue that is really a mess here is the social economics, the community level impacts of our food system. The base of pyramid economics in the US show a classic market failure. We have food deserts in inner cities and in rural communities. We have millions of people who are unable to feed their families without government handouts. But yet when you look at cultures around the world, who have lived for thousands of years on the same land without destroying their soil and with sustaining themselves through famines and cop failures and pestilence and wars, they have been able to feed their population. There's an indigenous wisdom in these Cree scenes. When you look at Japan or Vietnam or Germany or France, Spain, all of these Cree scenes have been aligned over time with sustainable forms of agriculture. And you see even in third world countries, colorful street foods and small scale vendors who have free access to markets, they're fed through micro farms and micro processors. There is a kind of knowledge and wisdom in these Cree scenes that we have lost in our industrial approach to raising food. So we can say with some certain data food security requires decentralization and redundancy. And it requires communities to protect their food supply and their ecosystem. And centralized systems are simply unable to accommodate local needs in times of disruptive change. And I wanted to give an example from my experience when I got assigned to the Hong Kong project, the Hong Kong Disneyland project, I was behind the schedule and I needed to provide sizing assumptions for the two hotels in the scene park. And we were still opening Disney's California Adventure with 28 food concepts from hot dog cart to fine dining. But we had to get over so in April 2001, my colleague from Walt Disney World and I went on a visit research trip to Hong Kong and mainland China which was organized by our Hong Kong office. And there's one example that really stuck with me when we went to Guangzhou visiting the White Swan Hotel. It's a wonderful hotel at the time. One of the first examples of China's reentry into the capitalist market, free market system. So we were sitting around the table in gorgeous dining room, incredible menus and so on. And they served us noodle dish, noodles in broth. And the general manager from the hotel started the conversation by saying, we're serving you this humble noodle dish here because this humble noodle dish inspired China's revolution. And Chairman Deng at the time came to our city and he gave a long speech on economics and he ended it by saying to be rich is beautiful. And everyone tried to figure out what does that mean, right? And a few days later, someone opened up, he saw the table with a cooker and he started serving this noodle dish in the broth. And everybody expected him to get arrested and hauled away because at the time China was a highly centralized economy. You couldn't move anything without permission from the government. Consequently, millions of people died of starvation during that time, the Cultural Revolution of China. But nothing happened. The guy kept selling. And a month later, someone else opened up a noodle shop, a noodle stand and he put some chairs around it. And again, nothing happened. A month later, there were noodle shops all over the city and within a year, the food business in China, food system in China just exploded. Every city and China returned to its 4,000 years of indigenous knowledge of food. China was a culture that survived incredible hardships during this time, but they survived this. And by re-instituting their ancient wisdom about how to feed themselves and how to call food and they were able to lay the foundation for China's modernization tribe. And when I think of this and then I think about our multinational corporations that really created the equivalent of a plant economy. You have very few people making decisions in a system that is very rigid and that is vertically integrated and priddled because of its rigidity. And it is completely unable to cope with disruptive changes at the local level. So regeneration is a local affair, but to adjust to unique conditions of soil availability and climate and also really important socio-economics, the impact that changes to the system will cause in the community that has not been made part of the design criteria for food innovations of the industrial system. Now they're making changes today, they're innovating the technical solutions to a problem that is highly emotional, highly personal. So what we are proposing, there are already so many amazing efforts on the way and everything I've been saying so far, everyone here knows and understands that you're already working on it. Any idea that I've ever been able to think of, someone has done it already, you go on Google and it's out there. But the question we want to address is how can we scale what is already working and make it accessible where needed, when needed without duplication of efforts or supporting and amplifying, find where we can help and assist building tools and processes that are replicable and that can be applied universally across the system. And so let me talk for a moment about food system design. Growing food, aggregating, processing, logistics, wholesale, retail, they all follow the same principles. Local variations are endless. No matter if you serve kimchi or sauerkraut, the same process that gets the product from the farm so the processes to the fork are the same in every country. So after I left Hong Kong, Disneyland, once they were opened in 2008, I joined Metro Cash and Carries, the largest food wholesaler in the world as a corporate strategist. And I worked as head of corporate target group marketing. So we were in 30 countries, we had over 700 locations, more than 6,000 salespeople in the field. And I had a team in each country, just three, four people, but highly, I mean, MBAs and so highly trained people. And our mission was to identify target group customers, customers that you could classify as a group that similar purchasing or likewise purchasing needs in terms of the assortment and in terms of pricing and service intensity and so on. And so I got to travel all over the world to do what we called market orders. Because I would come in, I would conduct four seminars per year in Eastern Europe, Asia and then one international, but then in between I would travel to individual countries to assist these teams to take a deep dive. So I got to India, to Russia, to China, to Germany, to France, to Spain. I mean, 30 countries we were operating in. And what I learned is that when you look at this, when you look at food from a systems perspective, it's all the same, right? So the accounts receivable systems in India are quite quirky compared to how they do it in Germany, but it's an accounts receivable system. Now, if you want to do logistics in India, that's pretty adventurous. You know, you have a guy in the richer transport your food, but it's a logistics system. And so we were able to standardize our operation from a high level from a planning perspective, but then customize it at the local level to a great degree. So for example, we empowered one competitive differentiation that we really pushed down was that our store managers were empowered to source local products. So key vendors like a local butcher or baker or alcohol distiller, we put their products on our shelf. And we often times lost leaders because we pulled in the local market who had developed a multi-generational loyalty to these brands. And that became a very powerful way for us to differentiate ourselves. So in summary here, all communities are unique. And we can't impose solutions from the outside in. We have to build from the inside out. And what we are proposing here is to develop a mapping exercise where we map the unique resources and capacities of a community as a first step. That requires guidance and structure in form of questions to be explored, and which we can build, which we can develop training materials and we can develop standardized process structures and then work to develop local community-based innovations, impact specialists, train them, help them through the mapping exercise, the kinds of questions that need to be asked to identify and understand the local system. And then link them, develop a blueprint out of this. And then through this blueprint, link them to resources that are now customized, ready to engage, knowing what needs to be done in this community. And hopefully through this process develop scale. So I think I'll leave it at this. Thanks, Bas. You have a minute 30 left on the clock, but that was great. The next thing is actually stillness for the coaches. And I'll just repeat the coaches are Sumit, Jordan, Christiana, Sam, John, and Klaus. For the coaches to just go into three minutes of stillness. And Gary. Yes. Usually we would use the rest of the time here to just ask clarifying questions. Oh, good point. Thanks. Yeah. Let's do that. Please unmute yourself and ask me questions you have about Klaus and what he's proposing. Go ahead, Christiana. Klaus, are the supermarkets entering the conversation? Like, are they part of the conversation? We want them to be part of the conversation. But I think it will require local engagement. I think every supermarket chain in the U.S., whether that's Gorka or Walmart or Costco have made on their website commitments to support local sourcing. In our reality, our tomatoes here come from Mexico. Now I have to go to the farmers market to get a local tomato. But I think from within the community, you know, we need to develop the impetus to demand products to be on the shelf and to develop alternative retail structures. Klaus, is this only U.S. initiative? No, not at all. In fact, I think the first case study we will have is from Costa Rica. So by the way, I didn't mention this, but obviously what we need to do is develop proof of concept. That means we need to find two, three, four million partners that goes through a prototype approach so we can map the whole process and learn from it and then make it replicable. Sumit. So I'm curious what sort of your driving goal is. Is it localization or is it health and nutrition or something else? You have to have sort of one key goal, right? Yeah, I would say it's replicability of community standards food system design. So just to follow up on that. So is it necessarily better? Is the community system, food system necessarily better? Has somebody kind of, you know, done an analysis of the various aspects in which it is better or not better than today's broken system? So the idea of localizing food and the concern around local ecology is in my mind based on the principles that regenerative practices have to be localized. You can't apply the same types of crops and seeds in Oregon as you do in Florida or California. You know, you have to have a localized, you have to localize what you can call in a specific region based on the existing ecology, whereas the industrial processes are really imposing a type of agriculture that is overpowering nature by the use of chemicals, if that makes sense. So in a way, the industrial agriculture is also about replicability, unfortunately. So we want a different kind of replicability is what I'm hearing is maybe driven by nature. Agriculture should be designed based on nature of the location. By overall analysis, I also meant, you know, people talk about GAGs and you're driving or shipping food from here to there has a cost. So the net cost of today's system versus the net cost of a better system, I think it would be nice to see some numbers on that. Yeah, the carbon footprint of food, yes. So the standardization is really behind is one level back in the process structure. But it may see many, many iterations and variations at the community level. Thank you so much to meet and Sam is reminding me that the coaches are so meet George Christiana, Sam and John, and the rest of us are observers. So you're anybody else with comments or questions, you're welcome to use the chat, but let's limit the fish bowl process to the people who are actually coaches here. So thank you for that we've run through our time for that piece of the clinic. And our next step is three minutes of stillness in which listen to your heart, connect with your heart to what you're hearing, listen to what resonates, what images, metaphors, feelings and gestures come out for you to capture the essence of what you heard. So this is this is less our normal analytic responses and more our heart and images and other other aspects of our responses. So I will hit a timer for three minutes and bring us out of three minutes of silence so that the coaches and everyone else can can sit and pay attention to that. That is my marvelous techno timer, which marks the end of our three minutes. And our next stage is mirroring 10 minutes of mirroring 10 minutes of music. So that's where we pay attention to images. Sort of our open mind feelings are open heart and gestures are open will, and then we'll go through each of the coaches to share images and metaphors, feelings and gestures that showed up in the silence or while you were listening to class give his case story, and then at the end, class will reflect back on what he's heard from this process. So I'm setting a timer for 10 minutes, and So why don't I start with Sumita? Sorry, so I'm supposed to share the picture in my head? Yes. If you've got images, just your sort of open heart, open mind, open will, anything that showed up that way. So because I'm an engineer, I have a nerdy image, which is a system block diagram. Nice. So it starts with food growth, creation of food, and it ends up in the impact on human health and longevity, et cetera. And in between is everything from after food growth. You have packaging, distribution, sale, consumption. And I'm imagining the system exists in every location, but there's different aspects to it. And there's different sort of pivot points and trigger points in it. And probably we want to have a way to estimate the impact of each block on nature. So GHGs, biodiversity, climate, any number of things, circularity, equity, right? So we can simply have these metrics for each of the blocks. And it'll just vary across the world. But different metrics will be important in different parts of the world and would have to be tweaked. So that's kind of my wish list for diagram. Nice. I almost kind of want to like extract it. If Sum had a plug-in where we could display what's in your head, that would be really cool. Jordan, your turn, please. The image that I have is of a coherent, reintegrated, flourishing living system that can cause all generations of life to thrive for 1,000 years. And in that context, the system that we're mapping here is part of a higher-order way of being of the human species on the planet that regeneratively integrates us, reintegrates us with life and its source. And so as I'm envisioning a community that's going through this mapping and blueprint process and starting to heal itself and renew its environment and people are getting healthier and rising, there's going to be all the same parallel needs that need the same kind of blueprint and mapping in order for every community, every local community, to move from where it is currently towards its best and highest potential supported by the rest of the global community. And so the underlying infrastructure on which this movement from where each local community is through the processes of healing and regeneration towards its best and highest potential needs to be comprehensive and interlinked. And I can imagine Klaus leading out and representatives into some communities whose main need is this food system. And then that's going to lead into other parts of the system and other places their main need might be education. And so that educational work might shift consciousness and then link back to the food systems realignment. So I think if we're going to have any hope of succeeding in that realizing that vision of the type of better world that we hope our grandchildren's grandchildren flourish in, we're going to have to think really integral and then come right back to this quarterly sprint that we can help Klaus take here to get those first mapping and processing. But I'd encourage us not to think about, not to lose sight of the total dimensions of wellbeing that are the goal that we're hopefully moving towards together. Thanks Jordan. Christiana? Yes. You see, when I was doing my business plan, I had this image in my head which is rather amplified in this gathering. Imagine that we have a table of seven people and they are in a community in a village that already has the answers. That's very important because the people that they were in the village, they were autonomous, they were producing their food and they were having an economy that was a flourishing economy. So they have the answers. They have left and the village is empty because they are not producing income. Now let's go and let's get Klaus into the picture here. Klaus is one person that can be almost like a catalyst between different players. Now, we need to start with, so in the table, there is ancient wisdom of how did we produce food and we were able to exist for 3000 years and yet something happened and we got all broken down. Now there is only the supermarket and these people that they even know when they have the answers, they go to the supermarket. Now, what is important is that when we finish this conversation, there is another image, that of a symposium. Now, in order for the symposium is the last step. The first step is that we get living soil because that's what they did at the past. So we start with living soil, we produce food that is good for our health, good for our body, but we need to democratize the food chain. So the people that are producing it get fair wages and they stay at the village. Then, what is important is not so much the food but who's sitting around the table because it's people oriented. That's how our community thrives. Then, we say fine. Then... It's over, Edith. Go ahead, there was just a little bit of noise, I just muted that line. So then, when you democratize the chain, you share your food with other people. And that's very important, part of the wellness. At the end, you engage into a conversation. So even though you have a team that is trying to solve problems that is doing the design, Samit can be there as an engineer and all the technical guys can be there. At the end of this, there is philosophy because this is what leads humanity a step further. So I closed my eyes and I saw my village getting sparkled again, but there is interchange between the old wisdom and the new wisdom. And there is also little guys with a very old guys solving one problem. How can they have income that they can be proud and they can stay in place? Thank you, Christiana. We have only two minutes left of our 10 minutes and we've got Sam and John for comments and then feedback from class. I'll be quick. What came up for me was a feeling of frustration and the story I have about that is why don't they already get it? Why don't they get it already? Right. Briefing to the point. John, it's your floor. Yeah. Before we started the exercise, my question was, who is the technology partner or tech stack to do this? And what I visualized is there's a lot of people around the world that are looking in their own ways to map out and it's very challenging and they're not quite sure how to do it so that this could in a potential make it easier for people to go through the process of bringing back more local food and healthy soils. So a visualize that might make some people happy who have a lot of challenges and that the crash of the system is happening but most people are in denial and this could be a tool when people wake up to the collapse that is happening. Thank you, John. Klaus, any reflections on this round of comments? Yeah. I think we need to be like very honest that this is a design, an iterative design process, right? This is not, we have answers here. We have a lot of questions. As an example, I was driving home yesterday listening to PBS and listening in on a discussion from our Klamath Falls region here in Oregon. It's at the border between Oregon and California and that region is flat out of water and the debate that was taking place was between and she always worried about losing the entire fish stock because there wasn't enough water to run along the river and between farmers who were losing the irrigation rights and scientists who were weighing in on this is a really long term issue. This is not going to be solved any time soon. And the farmer was basically saying he's ready to pick up his guns and open up the water spigots because it's his right. He's entitled to this. The NGO were saying we by all means, if this river wants to try, we will have lost a number of species forever. They're not coming back, right? Once that river is dead, you can't just restart it. And so then the question came, what is this farmer growing? I mean, the reporter asked, so what do you grow that needs irrigation? Well, it's growing alpha alpha. Now, hey, for export to China and that's a really water-intensive kind of crop. And then you go, well, is this really the best crop to grow? Is this really the best crop to apply our scarce water resources to when we are running into trouble going vegetables, right? But then how do you get this conversation going? So here I see a community that is urgently in need of a mediator where someone is in the middle to discuss what are our options? What's the situation? What are our options? Where do we go? And then develop a blueprint to say, we need these and these resources. I was listening to a farmer from California flat out of water, a coin also alpha, flooding the fields, right? I mean, the old method of flooding the field with water an incredibly wasteful approach. And this farmer, she was saying, I'd be willing to retool and co-olives or co-other crops that are conducive for the climate I'm in and they are much less water-intensive, but I need help. I mean, I don't have investment capital to make this work. So besides identifying such issues, we also need to identify resources to bring to these communities to help them. But if government or whoever corporate interests applying top-down resources, pushing top-down, that doesn't have the level of granularity that you need to solve real local problems. So that's trying to explain the need for this innovations brokerage in the middle to really take a deep dive, community level, understand what the issues are, and then not find solutions but develop a blueprint of where the system is breaking down and where the system needs repair. Thanks, Toss. And we've gone through a little more than our 10 minutes there. So we're entering 20 minutes of generative dialogue, which we've kind of already entered. And I want to read the instructions and ask you to just listen to the instructions and let them soak in a bit because this is about generative dialogue. And we're doing some of it, but I think we could do more of it. So coaches, please reflect together on the remarks of the case giver and move into a generative dialogue and how these observations can offer new perspectives on the case, go with the flow of the dialogue, build on each other's ideas, stay in service of the case giver without pressure to fix or resolve their challenge. So now we've got 20 minutes for any of the coaches to jump in as they would like and head in that direction. Klaus, as you've been running a processes like this in 30 countries, you have a clear vision and idea for what's needed. So we get into generative dialogue here. Can you help guide that conversation by helping to articulate the greatest kind of needs or roadblocks that you see on the way to activating this vision that you hold very clearly? Yeah, I would say the first thing we need to be very articulate about is that we're not competing with anyone, but seek to help and amplify instead. As I was saying, there is so much great work in process already. It makes no sense to reinvent this or to start from scratch anywhere, but rather to engage and to support and to amplify. And then also be very honest about there's a lot of work required to develop training materials, to develop process structures and so on. So we do need some advanced model prototypes. So we need to prototype this a few groups who are already deep into it who already have reached a level of sophistication where they can really guide us because in the process design, we need the guidance coming from the local community on how to engage. And another thought I have is that we really need to be very conscious of the existing relationships within communities, right? You can't just come in and assert power structures. So let's say, I mean, you really should start through the local city council. You wanna go to the Rotary Club, to the Farm Bureau. We want to work with local groups who are already in there and as a first step, engage just like we did here with an SIS scenario. We really are in trouble, you know? I mean, I can't believe that we don't talk about food security when you are thinking about California running tri, right? When you think about climate wide family, big agricultural region, flat out of water. Now you look around the Gulf of Mexico states getting hit with one storm after the next, wiping out crops. So what are we doing about this, right? I mean, this is real and urgent. And the worst thing we can do is have our companies go and source food from Mexico or other third world countries and take their food away, right? And import it in here. And that just transfers our problem to other places. So we need to find a solution here in the United States for the United States. And so to have someone who's already in the middle of it inside the community, but then brainstorm ideas. And so what we would like to do on the support level is to link up with supporting these groups that are already out in the field, right? There are groups who it's like the WFOOTBUCK group who has developed a local currency that you can apply within your community. Now there is the intentional community group that helps you set up intentional type of kibbutz type of operations and so on. So there's already so much on the way. They're funders, they're impact funds that are looking for projects. And if we can develop a blueprint and then go to an impact investor or apply for grant money, saying here specifically, what we need to develop in this community, I think we have a much better chance to attract the money to the right places. Thanks, Klaus. Any other coaches with other folks? Yeah, I'll come in. Oh, sorry, Sammy had your hand up. Kind of just some questions that I'm sitting with. I think one that I keep coming back to, which maybe will be forever, but it's like if there's so many local solutions that are already happening and people in their communities building relationships with each other, what is it that we're really helping with? Like what is it that we can really do with them that they're not already doing on their own? And so that's just like a question that I'm sitting with. Another question that I'm sitting with is what are my needs and like why am I here? And I would like to offer that to everyone else as well. And I think just lightly to lightly answer that, like I think partly like at some point I need to make some money. At some point I like I'm a bit fearful or worried about the future of the food that I might have access to. I wanna have some work that feels like purposeful and meaningful, like I'm contributing to something good. Yeah, and then one other question that is just really alive is like on Tuesday this week I was talking working next to someone in a kitchen who's basically like one of the local food leaders in the community. And like she runs a restaurant and she's like a leader in a local co-op and she's basically working seven days a week. And it's like, how could we get, how could we support her to have enough time to actually do a mapping process? How could we like have someone actually just like run her kitchen for a few days so that she could have that free time? And yeah, it's like seems simple in some ways. Oh, we can just do a mapping process. But like, yeah, when I think about that specific person it's like, wow, to actually get her time would be really difficult. Yeah, Sam, I really appreciate what you're saying. And I think one of the design imperatives that we need to keep in mind here is that we need to find funding for people to make a living. I mean, it's completely unfair to ask people to volunteer their time who have to meet pay rent and support the family and so on, and this is really important work. So one key effort has to be that we secure some funding. So there's seed money at least so we can start and that we bake into the design a revenue generating capacity so we can pay salaries and attract talent to it. Now, unfortunately at this point the talent is going to all the wrong places. And so how do we change that and get some trained and experienced professionals into this space who can amplify these efforts and not just that, but have all our volunteers who have dedicated so much time working for next to nothing or for free also be taken care of. So I think that is really super important. I think whoever the impact specialist is or the spoke rich function needs to be funded inside the community. Now in some places you have cities that have a sustainability manager and we may be able to convince the city council to free some time from this person or this group of people to work with us and do this analysis. In other cases, some communities they're either too small or they're not organized yet and they may need someone to come in and start from scratch. But I think most communities already have sustainability management efforts on their way. Thanks Hans, Sumita. May I suggest something Klaus? I think that if we focus on who has a stake in finding the answer or who has a stake in getting that protocol. And I don't mean getting the protocol in a copyrighted way, but there are several stake people that they have a stake in those answers. So it goes without saying to ask them to pay to be there. So let's say that they pay, I'm just giving an example, okay? A thousand euros or a thousand dollars for being maybe a week in a place. Then if the local people are subsidized, two or three of them to sit at that table with the people that are seeking the answers that might be a hybrid kind of solution. And then of course, the academics should be somewhere on that table because their job is to record, analyze and synthesize the answers. So all of a sudden you have not one solution but a hybrid solution that is partly self-financed, partly given to the community and partly a task that people are already paid to do. So maybe we should be thinking financing and not only in one way, but in several ways. Thanks, Sumit and John. So to answer sort of Sam's question about they're all doing their own thing, I'll share an anecdote. So about one and a half years ago, we tried to approach the city of San Jose to help them with their stakeholder management process and we went nowhere. Now, one and a half years later, the Bay Area Conservation Organization and Florida and San Diego, they're all suddenly waking up that their stakeholder management processes are completely ad hoc. They have like a document, a paper that they lose when the guy leaves the job. So they're not waking up that they need to actually have institutional history and record of these things. So I think there is increasing interest in managing those that are underrepresented, those that are not powerful corporations or well-recognized universities or nonprofits. So I think there is going to be increasing interest and the one service that Klaus's effort could provide is structure to things that are so unstructured. They have no support. And even giving a simple structure by helping them put their data in, for example, my favorite block diagram, right? And doing like an ESG type service to them by analyzing their local system and helping them improve it before offering any solutions or suggestions, right? You're not telling them what to do. You're just doing a semi-neutral analysis and showing them, look, this is how it is today and here's where we think. We could go look for a foundation to fund your effort, right? Here's the bigger gap. So I think that might be a critical. Thank you very much. Yeah, to follow up on Samit, looking at lack of records or the system, it's kind of ad hoc that I would ask Klaus is, who are the technology players today who, you know, let's face it, the technology players have vacuumed up most of the dollars in our economic model. Who could be a potential partner that would see this as a way to demonstrate their technology stack that would want this to be adopted by communities all over the globe as a potential partner and funder obviously it's not asking them to lead it but to use their technology and maybe with some grants. So who out there, you know, which technology, are we talking Monday.com, you know, like Salesforce, you know, or just maybe I'll leave it at that but just thinking about who could be a partner there. Jordan, do you have a comment? Yeah, I could just quickly speak to that. If it's useful to the group on this phone, we can bring to bear some hybrid legal infrastructure through which we can spin up sovereign entities that can both run internal for-profit regenerative economies and augment with donor dollars. One of the things that, well, one of the things we invested about three quarters of a million dollars in the first part of this year was advancing a platform to do exactly this kind of thing of coordinating and measuring impact. So for a relatively small, yeah, so I mean, within Q3 here, we could have that system completely adapted and ready to run this. And it would be interesting if that technology platform rather than being, you know, one of the large companies was another sovereign entity that was co-stewarded within the same thing. So I think we have the tools to bear where within the next 30, 60 days, we can have this basically automated. Yeah, also to your point, John, I don't think there is currently one entity of one technology that would cover what we're talking about but there are many, many that apply very specialized to very specific issues. I mean, it could be the farmer who needs, I mean, for example, a brokerage. A brokerage is a huge issue because the lack of market intelligence going back and forth between what the market wants and what the farmer produces is completely lacking because it's all inside the corporate structure. So you need to build a brokerage function that identifies potential markets and communicates that potential to the farmer and then communicates back to the market what the farmer can and cannot do. So this is the typical function of a broker and our community level farmers are basically flying plant. You know, when you look at all the farmer's markets and GSA's combined in the United States comprise something like 1% of total food sales. You know, and the idea of food hubs to develop like a parallel system competing with this chugging out is completely behind, right? I mean, you cannot compete with this commercial sector. You need to engage the commercial sector to participate in the solution. And so my idea of a food hub is basically a brokerage function to connect community players from farmer to processor to logistics provider to restaurants to school canteens and so on. Does that make sense? And then I think Jerry and Pete and Jordan from Open Global Mind have the capacity to develop a technology solution that provides an information platform on what are the resources out there to solve specific issues. Thank you. We're down to a minute and a half at this point of the 20 minute discussion section. Any coaches with any last thoughts here? Jordan, go ahead. No, I'm okay. Let somebody else have the space. I did put the question into the chart. Anybody has thought of community to community trading where people do it from one community to the next community and they do the trading just an open question here to be discussed. Just to take that really quick, there were deep into thought on that, Christiana and in ways that could be locally stewarded and one of the other parallel technologies we're developing and prototype in parallel with us is local currency but interoperable local currencies to facilitate that exchange. I think what you're saying is deeply important and we have to make whole fractal communities with our own internal regenerative spiral and then the interconnection and right relationship of all the different communities around the world who are moving towards the same goal is a really critical part of the process which is why I think that undergirding infrastructure which is both technology platform and kind of shared vision and values and the broader thing that we're all helping each other move towards is such a critical aspect to establish the trust that allows for trade, that allows for kind of that re-complexification of local community. Thanks, Jordan. I would love to hear from Joshua. Joshua and I had a conversation last week and Joshua is running a really interesting program within the TRC platform. What are your thoughts so far, Joshua? Yeah, I was just typing something out, just my thoughts of what was the conversation that we're having but one thing that I potentially see especially within local communities is really diving in and finding the connectors and identifying the personas that are connectors within the communities and some of the other, I think of Malcolm Gladwell's tipping point book where he identifies those three people towards moving but if your program and the system when we're creating these mapping systems identifies who the connectors are, who the salespeople are in a community that are gonna help sell the initiatives and the things going on and then who the mavens are, the people that are really knowledgeable within the community and your system really hones in on finding those and how to find those people within a community. I think you can quickly map the system really, really quick and be able to go in and help get an understanding especially those mavens. If you have a system that really goes in and can identify those mavens and then those mavens will know that the area really well but you're bound to find a few connectors in that process in finding those mavens and those connectors will find the salesman, will find everybody else and it kind of aggregates and builds upon itself and then you have a way to then drag and drop that into another area if you know how to quickly identify those three types of people. So we're done with the discussion portion of this case clinic and the next phase is closing remarks where each of the coaches, we have eight minutes for each of the coaches to say, to offer their thoughts and also for Klaus to say, to address how he now sees his situation and his path forward and how has that changed or improved from our conversation. So I invite the coaches to step in and I'm gonna start in the eight minute timer. We'll randomly go to Sam first. I'm not sure. I guess, I mean, just a general like thank you for sharing Klaus, thank you everyone else for participating. I'm curious mostly at this point to reflect on the process as a whole. And yeah, just appreciating everyone for being here and sharing and trying this out with us. And Sam, thank you because that's the third bullet under the closing remarks, which is expressions of genuine appreciation for each other. So thank you for jumping right there. Any other coaches, coach comments on closing this session? Yeah, just first off, I wanted to thank you, Jerry for facilitating this. And I like the symbol of, you know, no time versus, you know, kind of how you did that. That's a good takeaway to use, like the metaphor. And, you know, Klaus, appreciate your willing to, you know, kind of be, share your vision, be vulnerable and see, you know, get feedback from people. You know, I think a lot of us feel this kind of collapse. It's not a good feeling to watch, especially those of us who've been working on this for a while and seeing what's going on and I think it's a good idea to how to provide tools for communities to help them deal with what's going on and what may be coming on. So thanks for doing that. And yeah, appreciate that. Thanks, John. Jordan, were you gonna jump in? Happy to. I think we need to get into action. Klaus has been, you know, as I've got to know Klaus, he's been looking for groups to move in for, you know, seven, eight years now and the crisis is not getting any less urgent and it's turning into a metacrisis that is intertwined with all the other suffering and injustice flowing from the same root causes as this. And I think we need to go out in unity as sovereign individuals to tackle that whole basket of crises and we need to start now. And so, you know, Klaus, we've talked, if it's useful to you, we can spin up a sovereign entity that would allow you to take in both for-profit and non-profit funds. I'd be willing to provide 20 grand in matching funds against whatever this group can pull in together to start seeding the actual progress. I think we should lay out a quarterly sprint and my intuition is that that probably involves Kerry's work in Modesto. She spent three years, you know, building relationships. So that could be a key prototype. So if this group can put together its network, you know, here within the next 30 days we could have a actual entity form that can give and receive funds. We could unlock some of those matching funds. We could help Kerry and empower her work. I know there's other people on this call who also have access to one or two others. And so I'd like to just vote that we, you know, as a sovereign individual, Klaus, I'm here to move in support of you and you're welcome to use any infrastructure or things that we've built that are useful to you. And yeah, I'd just like to know out of the call what other sovereign individuals here, regardless of brand, et cetera, are willing to move together and help realize this. And I think whatever that coalition is, let's just, let's get it going. We've got a couple of co-champions. We've got the resources and let's move. So I'm here in support, Klaus. Let's do it, man. And I think following under that umbrella that you just described, Jordan, and I'd like to voice my support for Klaus. And I'm eager to find ways in which this sort of crystallizes into a sovereign entity or a venture or a set of things that we can all get behind, that themselves support other people out in the world already having success doing some of the pieces of what we've been talking about. I think it's important here not to reinvent the wheel, but rather to find the people who've already got like, that woman over there's got like a hub thing and you plug things into it and then it rolls. I don't really know how it works, but that kind of thing. And then together, I think we can create cascade more movement. Sumit, did you want to jump in? Sure. Yeah, so I think I really liked the way Klaus articulated the proposal. It's relatively analytical compared to some of the other Boil the Ocean ambitions. So I liked your more analytical and structured approach with the history and the future. And thank you for Sam, really, for driving and pushing this. And thank you for Jerry hosting this. So I think I enjoy the kind of trying to put structure on things process. So we can potentially help with that. But I think what I'm learning in all my other projects is we should really go after funding immediately and look for all the government proposals, whoever has connections into foundations or whatever, climate foundation and others. I think we can sit around and design something optimal, but nobody will care. I think the group should just totally focus on how to get funding. Thanks to me. And my gratitude to all of you for being here and participating and putting your wisdom into the circles has been really helpful. We have a minute and a half left on this last stretch. Klaus, do you want to reflect on the process and where we are and what you think you might do differently going forward? Yeah, thank you, everyone, for engaging and offering some insights and ideas and feedback. I mean, it's really helpful. Yeah, I think going forward, we need a few case studies to work with and I just want to be like super humble about this, right? I mean, the only confidence I have is in my ability to figure stuff out. That's it, but we need to figure stuff out and we need to do it collectively. So there is a, and I'm speaking to this in the frame of theory, you know, social systems design theory, where once you go through the bottom of the yule and you climb up towards crystallizing and prototyping, the key word is iterate, iterate, iterate, right? I mean, it's, we have, I think, a thought structure. You know, we have an idea that seems to resonate and seems to make sense, but now we have to put meat on the skeleton, so to speak. I'm sorry, that's a very budget kind of process, but... You know, if the metaphor fits, where? That's bad too. But we have to fill out now, right? And so that can only happen through community engagement and so to John, you were putting out that you're already working on something you would love to learn from you. I know you have a very advanced group of people already in place and I'm sure we can learn from you and piggyback on this. We have a nice, I mean, a great support structure open global mind, you know, has some amazing resources to give the folks who are willing to support this and put some tools behind it. Yeah, I think we could be ready to go. So please let me know who would be interested. We have to set up some kind of communication structure, maybe Slack or something to see who would like to be part of this and then find a way to get us organized for the next step. We already have one other case clinic lined up with someone from Costa Rica who is also already operates a food hub and she's very interested to conduct the next case clinic. So to use the same process for her to explain her situation, her environment and see what we can do to evolve the support structure from there. Thank you. If you think that this case clinic is a good starting point, right? For a community to get to launch their project and we can continue to do this. Jordan? Thanks so much, Klaas. I was just gonna, I can also offer Klaas if it's useful. I can spin up on our Slack, I know that's useful but I'd love to know just which of the people on the phone are projects. We all know the intention that needs to come into reality and I think that we're generally aligned on it and we're gonna be able to advance down the critical path of bringing intention into reality based on the amount of focus, time, energy and resources go to it. So I'm happy to put some time towards it and I just love to know coming out of this what other people on the phone or on the call here are willing to kind of focus and help move this forward with Klaas over the next quarter. Doesn't have to be a permanent thing but let's move for a quarter here and see where we can get. So on the process for this clinic right now we should have two minutes of quiet journaling but I'm gonna take sort of moderator's prerogative and do what appears to be occurring completely organically here which is like release everybody who's on the call who's been very nicely an observer so far and in the chat to jump into the conversation. I also realized that some people will have to drop off the call so we will not be offended if you have to drop off but please let's go to Gil and Sumit and then me. Klaas I can't commit time but without committing time I offer you time if I can be helpful in any way and I offer some money into Jordan's match. Jordan thank you for the proposition. Awesome and thank you Gil. Let's go Sumit and then me. Yes I think I have a chat with Klaas we're scheduled to talk tomorrow to sort of fine-tune sort of more what we can where we can help. Generally we've been working with sort of communities of practice to create data hubs, working hubs, using AI of course you have to throw an AI there to sort of information and then to help sort of things move faster. So that's the general way. Thank you Sumit and go ahead. Yeah I think Klaas first of all thank you for letting me join you since we only met two weeks ago so thanks for letting me jump in so recently but I think as we talked about I'm making this pivot myself in the short and sad I wanna jump in and where I think where I can help right now is putting some together to run for the next quarter, right? That's where my capacity is because I am stopped doing what I was doing to focus on that. So I think this is something we can talk about offline because I have the time and I think I have some of the skills to help move it for the next quarter. Awesome man thank you. Thanks so much Ann. So I wanna just go back a little bit rewind and address one of Sam's awesome questions which is how on earth is his colleague who is an ace in local food systems and working like way too hard seven days a week supposed to take some time to map anything and just go back to the mapping segment of what information brokers or sorry innovation brokers ought to be doing. And I'd love to help unpack just the mapping segment because I think that right now it's just evanescent it's a floaty idea, it has no texture at all. And I think that if a couple of us who care about mapping would sort of close in on it and say hey open street maps already exists and has a bunch of data about everywhere. Like there are some towns in Germany where every shrub and tree has been mapped on a layer of open street maps and they're looking around going what else do we map? Right so there's energy, there's community, there's data already out there but there's lots of other forms of mapping including sort of local privately held maps. There are people working with indigenous tribes to map their local territories and some of those maps contain dangerous information because you don't really want the pharmaceutical explorers necessarily knowing where the sacred tree is or whatever. And here I'm echoing too much avatar and home tree but still you get what I'm saying. But I'm really interested in sort of taking that slice and saying what might mapping look like what already exists? Can we prototype a mapping exercise only who would like to volunteer for that? How do we make it so that for the people on the ground who care the most and our clients I think cause your clients and all of this to make it as non-disturbing as possible and as fruitful and useful as possible. And then also to connect it back to the general scheme of shared data and all these kinds of places. So I'd love to maybe that's a topic for a focused conversation or call in the future. Anybody? How do we stay in touch? How do we maintain communications? So class, we already have a food system rethinking the food system channel on the Mattermost which is like Slack. So we're happy to use that as a communication vehicle and I'll put a link to that in the chat here. But if you'd rather use something else. No one. Please tell everybody where. No, that sounds good. Please go ahead. I just want to formalize my offering A, I'm very committed time wise to this idea. I've been working on it for very many years. Second, I would like to see it done. So I am formally making an offer for my community to be considered. And Klaus, if I can be of any help to you or your team, please contact me. Thank you. Amazing. Thank you, Christiana. Awesome. Carrie, you said a bunch of really great stuff in the chat during the whole call and you just mentioned Ben Missimer who I'm not familiar with. Would you like to jump in and bring us up to speed on some of what you're thinking? Oh, I feel hesitant to do that because it's not really part of the formal clinic, but I offered all that stuff in the chat just sort of for history's sake and for those who might be curious to explore it, but would be very happy to explore, be bringing my work into a potential case study in Modesto and looking at the entire Central Valley if that's relevant. Yeah, and just happy to continue to participate in whatever way feels useful to a future of regeneration and well-being. Thank you. And we are off-roading off the end of the formal clinic process at this point so don't worry about that. Anyone else with closing thoughts? Just to quickly generally build on what Carrie said, Carrie, I love the idea of Modesto and Central Valley because they're fractally nested so that would be a really powerful demonstration if we're able to do that. So thank you for that. I just flew home to Portland from Fresno Sunday afternoon when it was 112 degrees in Fresno on the ground because they were having a heat dome too. And I flew over Yosemite, which was pretty beautiful, although it was kind of misty where I saw a fire, a medium-sized fire that was burning and then a whole bunch of reservoirs that had big bathtub rings, which just made my heart sore for the drought that everybody's under and the hardships that we're going over. I felt like I got a literally a 15,000-foot view of the trauma that a lot of the country is going through. So we'd love to see what we can do that doesn't add work and adds a lot of value to the communities that are suffering right now. And some of the suffering is of such large scale. My cab driver when I landed on Friday last week knew a lot about grapes and because Fresno is the raising capital of the world, of course, and he was telling me that above a certain temperature, the grapes basically just cook off and you don't get raisins because they didn't grow big enough to make a raisin. I mean, thank you that just accelerates the process of having raisins, but it does not. And it only takes a spike like that in the crop's room. So at some level, some of these forces coming in are much larger than what individuals can handle. And there's some prospect of reversing desertification, doing a bunch of other things at a macro scale, but I think those questions are on the table as well. And then Klaus, you've phrased, and another piece of this whole puzzle that I'm really intrigued about is, hey, we're growing this crop like lettuce or something that's very water intensive and we're shipping our water to a different country. Short of commanding farmers to grow something different or whatever, what is a mechanism to get everybody to steer toward more useful use of land? I won't say equitable, I won't say fair, I won't say economic or efficient because all those birds perry freight, but how does that conversation happen? And what are the mechanisms where we can see one another and our effects on the environment as a whole so that the smaller scale decisions are made in unison? And I'll give a small side story. On the island of Bali, there are rituals, thousand-year-old rituals that are repeated in the subox, which are the water districts that come off the mountain. And these rituals, it turns out, they discovered the hard way, contain algorithms for whose field should lie fallow, who gets how much water off the mountain, et cetera, et cetera. The thousand-year-old ritual actually contains wisdom about how to allocate scarce resources across the farms. Fabulous. Can we like figure out how to blend the best of the old and the new to solve some of these problems in the process? I think respecting and honoring some of the people who came up with these answers a really long time ago across Latin America to something called a milpa, which is basically intercropping, really smart intercropping. That's very old wisdom. And there's people in Central America who are like, regenerative farming sounds really cool. Why don't we get any credit? Like this isn't a new thing. This is an old thing. So we need to tap into all these energies in some way that actually works for a lot of people. Yeah, Switzerland actually has that same indigenous wisdom where they allocate how many cows you can graze on your field so you don't destroy the meadows. Yeah, I've been struggling with this idea of coordination because I mean, we obviously have a dysfunctional government. So these planning decisions are currently being made by basically multinational companies with by very few people who are making sourcing decisions and to the detriment of individual communities or disregarding the needs of communities. At the same time, you need to have a certain level of aggregation because obviously some communities can call more types of products that are needed in other places, right? So how do you share this intelligence? The only answer I can think of at this point is that first of all, take care of your own community, take care of your own needs, take care of your own food supply and then produce surplus, right? And then we have to develop a mapping tool and that may be Salesforce or that may be some other tool out there so that we can move surpluses into locations where they are needed. But it's a completely crowned up effort, right? And if we don't do this crowned up effort then companies, corporations will do it for us, right? And it will not be what we have in mind. It will be taking on forms that are best defined in when you look at the World Economic Forum, high-tech farming solutions that are really completely disregard socioeconomic needs of communities and develop standardized solutions. This is going to be one of the puzzles that we have to sort out and I hope we get to this point, right? Because first of all, we have to secure community level in smaller ways and then build up from there. Last call, anybody who hasn't talked very much, Nancy, Simon, Arlene, anyone else who didn't jump in? This is your Stacey. This is your chance to drop into the conversation if you'd like, no pressure. And Jordan, did you wanna have a last word? No, just thank you guys so much for participating. Thanks for your work in service of life and I'm so excited to see this taking little shape. Like Klaus said, all the great work, all the heroes like Christiana, Gary, everybody, Josh, everybody's out there on the front lines. And so we're just, I'm so excited to see people getting organized to move in support of everybody who's been alone on the front lines. And I think we have something exceedingly powerful and that this call is happening and been on three other calls like this this week. And just please know you're not alone and there's a rising community ready to move in support of you. And we have all the tools, all the resources. We just need to get a little organized. So I hope you guys don't mind the little push. I'm gonna work with Klaus here to get this structured and funded for the prototype. And let's keep navigating quarter by quarter. I can't possibly know where this is gonna lead. All the forces of the existing system will align against it as we start to be successful. So we just need to start making progress, get quarters into this and get some momentum. And then we'll build from there. So I'm excited to move with you and then whatever I have that I can offer, it's yours. So please. Thank you. That sounds like a very nice place to wrap. Thank you. Thank you, John. Thank you all. May we succeed on this journey? We must and we will. Thanks for hosting, Jerry. It's a great job. You're most welcome. Thank you, Jerry. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you very, very much.