 So have you been to rural Rajasthan before? Actually I have been to Nimrana and the villages around there which is quite a remarkable development because so many factories have come in and you can see a village transform. So when we were kids, papa took us to Nimrana and we had gone there on a picnic and we got attacked by bees. I think my dad got like 25 or something. My mother like covered me with a blanket. I got nine or something. She was protective, that's good. Here there is Ranthambore, have you been there? I have been to Ranthambore before. Of course I came just for the Yatra so I don't see the safari. There are 16 cubs there. So everybody who is going there is seeing three or four tigers. So what is your view about what's going on economically in India, in the world? Discussing the United States and China. So the next year is going to be more difficult than this one. Of course this one had lots of difficulties with the war and all that but because growth is going to slow in the world more generally people are raising interest rates that brings down growth. India is also going to be hit. Indian interest rates have also gone up but Indian exports have been slowing quite a bit and India's inflation problem is more a commodity inflation problem vegetable inflation problem and that is also going to be negative for growth. So I think that we would be lucky if we do five percent next year. See the problem with the growth numbers is that you have to understand what you are measuring with respect to. We had a terrible quarter last year and measuring with respect to that you look very good. So ideally what you do is look before the pandemic in 2019 and look at now. And if you look at 2022 vis-a-vis 2019 it's about two percent a year. That's too low for us and what do you attribute that to? Pandemic was part of the problem but we were slowing before the pandemic. We had gone from nine to five. And we haven't really generated reforms which will generate growth. There is one more thing happening in India. Four, five Punjaps are getting very rich and they are able to go into every business. And the rest of India is staying behind. The farmers and the poor are becoming one of them. And then there are five, six, ten, fifteen people who are becoming another one. One of them is being fulfilled and the other one is being destroyed. So what should we do about the inequality that is increasing? This is a very big problem. It's not just about the industrious. The upper middle class has increased in the pandemic. Because they could work from home. And the poor people would have to go to the factory. And if the factory was closed, they wouldn't be able to come. So this divide has increased in the pandemic. And the poorest people get everything in the grey ration. The rich people have no losses. The lower middle class is in the middle. They have a lot of losses. The jobs are closed. The unemployment is increasing. The debt is increasing. The debt is increasing. The interest rate is increasing. So they have a lot of losses. We have to look at them. And we have to make the policies for them. Because there is a lot of pain there. And what you are saying is that there is a concentration of the industrious. We have to look at that too. We cannot be against capitalism. But we have to fight for the competition. That means we can fight against monopoly. We can fight against monopoly. But capitalism is good for small businesses. Big businesses are good too. But monopoly is not good. You can get it from the agricultural sector. So there is food processing, there is a cold chain, there is export of fruits and vegetables. So there can be a second green revolution. Second green revolution. A new type of vegetables, milk, dairy products, poultry, all this can happen. And we have to do processing here. Because the labour should be used here. And near the farm? Near the farm. And I think it also has a green component. If you all do processing near the farm, the weight of what you will sell here and there will be less. So the energy consumption will be less. And if we look ahead, energy consumption is very important. And it should be reduced. And what is happening in the US? What is happening in the US and in the rest of the world? The price is increasing there a lot. And the central banks are trying to reduce the price. The RBI Federal Reserve or the European Central Bank. And that is why the prices are increasing. And the cost of production will be reduced. And the problem for India is that our exports will also be reduced. Next year, our exports will be reduced a lot. And our growth will also be reduced a lot. When I was leaving Maharashtra, the textile industry there was saying that Bangladesh has utilized its export policy very well. And they have made the entire industry competitive with the export policy. What do you think about this? How can this be done? The most important industry is the textile industry. They make clothes and export them. And they have done two or three things that have helped them succeed. First, they allow big factories, not small factories. Because they need scale economies. So they allow big factories. I think labour is largely women. So they employ a lot of women in the textile industry. And the policy is very predictable. It doesn't change. So that industry has just taken off because it's using low skilled workers. On my way, I found out that Belarie was the centre of jeans production. And there were 4.5 lakh people working there. The clothes used to come from Gujarat. And the stitching used to be in Belarie. And it used to be in people's homes. Some used to make one piece, some used to sew, some used to wash. It was decentralized. And GST and Note Bandi finished it. And that industry is actually from the time of the British. 4.5 lakh people used to work there. Today there are 50,000 people working there. And that means everything is over. So there is a lot of opportunity. But it needs finance and support. There are a lot of classes in India that make different things. There is a speciality in every district. So by focusing on that, helping them, giving them support, we can also make an industry there. It can be done. They need technological support. Finance, credit loans. And what you are saying is a certainty about policy. That it will not go up and down. You cannot export one day. Yes, do export one day. Stability. Tell me one thing. You were in Parbhaiya. In India, one person can take a loan of 2 lakh crore rupees. That means he gets the money of the entire bank. But when a small business bank loan is taken, then a lot of questions are asked. And actually, the big one is also important, the small one is also important. But the small ones are ignored. The small ones are ignored. So why does this happen and how do we change it? You can change it. And the information you were saying earlier, the small businesses, they sell it. And there is a revenue stream, they have sales. If those sales, if the bank knows that the sales are stable, they are growing, then they can lend. But we need that information to be collected and made available. That is happening. The FinTech is going on in India. They are starting to think about all this. But in India everything needs to be 10 times. But see, I don't know of a single Indian company. That small-medium company. And now there is a big company. But if you look at it in the US, then a small company grows in 5, 7, 10 years. So why is this happening in India? You are absolutely right. Too many of our small firms don't grow big. They die or they stay strong. So why is that not happening? That is needed. You need a path to grow. So here is the problem. They get used to some of the benefits of staying small. The inspector doesn't come. If you don't give taxes, then no one will trouble you. So they stay under the radar screen of the government. Instead of being helped by the government. What you need is, you stay under the radar screen until you get a business which works. But then once you start growing, I am going to look at you, but I am going to help you. I am not going to just tax you. I am not going to just make your life miserable. We need that situation. So many of these small businesses get benefits. As soon as they become bigger, we take away those benefits. So there is no incentive to grow bigger. Why not instead say, if you grow bigger, you will have these benefits for 5 years. Then they will come off. But then by that time you are so big, you don't care. So can we do things like that? So you are saying that to make a transition from a small business to a big business in India, there is a huge cost that has to be sort of managed. Absolutely. Absolutely. And the cost is rent seeking in some way. Today is largely rent seeking. Exactly. You see how many firms are stuck at 10 workers or 20 workers because that's when the regulations start kicking in. I mean the only one, the only I was thinking about it, the only one I can think of, the top of my head, is Haldiram's, which went from being a small fellow and he scaled up. And there are a couple of that of them, but they are not as many as they should be. We need many Haldiram's, right? We need many Haldiram's. And of course we have some of our tech firms that have grown very, very big. But we need far more of that. And you are exactly right. It's the growth which creates the jobs. Small firms by themselves don't create so many jobs. It's when they grow that they create so many jobs. We need to make that possible. When a lot of farmers say to me that as soon as they get their crops the same way the Commerce Ministry takes away the export import policy and their price goes down the same day when they get their crops. This is a very big problem. We keep saying that we are there for the farmers but the export policy and the import policy are made for the middle class, urban middle class. If the price of onions increases then we import it. And if the farmer's price goes down then I think there should be a stable policy. Export import. If the price increases a lot then we can import it. The export men shouldn't do it because the export men are against the farmer. If the farmer says that they can't export it then they have to sell it in the domestic market and they don't get anything. So how does one think about this unemployment issue? Because it's everywhere. I speak to kids and I ask them what you want to do and they only answer five things. Lawyer, doctor, IAS, military, engineer. So the imagination is for most kids in India is that we can only do these five things and then the other thing is most of them are not hopeful of getting even those jobs. No, unemployment is a big problem. The thing is that people only want government jobs because they have pension and security. And they keep looking for it and you know that very few people can work in government. If you open up the government then more than 1% or 2% will be employed there. So I think we have to increase the private sector because the jobs there can be increased daily. And one is the private sector. If we buy technology in an agriculture then jobs can be created there too. And this formal sector we are only looking at manufacturing this PLI scheme and so on. But we also have to look at services because there can be a lot of jobs in services. And you were saying earlier that there is a new way of getting jobs in services. Yes, these consulting firms they used to sell their services in America and they used to work in the back office in India this is a power point presentation. These days they are employing consultants in India those consultants work like they are in America and they are giving presentations on Zoom they are actually as if they are working in America which means they get much higher salaries. Do you need English for this? We need English and higher education. For higher education we need primary education and secondary education. So you know that this pandemic has happened and a lot of children have not gone to school for 2 years. Not only for 2 years but they have forgotten. They are 3 years behind their class. So what are we going to do? We will bring them back and we don't take into account that they are not able to deal with the class they are in. So the problem is we are going to suffer these kids are not going to be able to do the high quality work. So we have to pay a lot more attention to education. One of the things that I am noticing while I am walking is what is being done to the small and medium businesses in this country. The backbone of employment in the country and all of them are complaining. They are complaining of an unfair GST they are complaining of course of demonetization, Covid. They are also complaining of no support for small businesses and most of them can't ever imagine transforming from a small business to a big business. It's not even in their mind. I ask them, you know, do you see yourself actually scaling up and they are like, well no, that's impossible. So how do you think about that issue? No, so we have gone about this process of maybe unintended formalization. Demonetization forced a lot of companies that were informal to go out of business. GST is forcing a lot of small companies that earlier didn't pay significant taxes. Now it's forcing them to pay taxes and they are uncompetitive if they start paying taxes. So this dual economy is being shut down. And of course, you know, you need to create some reason for them to become formal. If for example they could get more credit from the bank as they became more formal. They could show their receipts, they could show that. But credit is also very slow right now. The benefits of formalization are not there. The costs of formalization are there. And so many of them are hurting. Now what is true is as they shrink, our bigger firms are doing very well because they are occupying some of the space. So in a sense the inequality between firms is increasing. You look at profitability amongst the big firms. It's very good. And they could also raise money during the pandemic because the small firms couldn't. What you want is to give the small fellow a chance to sell and not put a whole lot of burden on him. The big fellow can take care of paying the taxes and all that. So if you look at the history of India, a very revolutionary step came from Swatantrakta, Andolan. After that there was Hari Karanti, after that there was Safeed Karanti, and then there was the computer revolution. So what can be the revolution now? There are two types of revolution. I was just talking about service revolution. We can work in America from here without going to America. That is one. Like doctors, they can provide telemedicine services to the US and earn a lot of foreign exchange. Our service exports are 250 billion. So if we just grow that, that will make us a superpower in exports. So that's one. Second, you were talking about Hari Karanti, green revolution. But we have a new kind of green revolution, sustainability emissions. If we push on that, we can be at the frontier building windmills, building solar plants, making our buildings green. And the most damage from climate change will be in South Asia. You've already seen Bangladesh suffer. You've seen Pakistan suffer. India is not far behind. We occupy the same territory. So we have to push very hard for a green revolution elsewhere. But also we can be at the forefront because everybody is trying to get in. We can make a lot of windmills solar because we have a huge demand. But we can also innovate. And so I think there are lots of possibilities. But we should be forward thinking. I was going to the parliament once. And my friend from the security guards there. So I asked a security guard what he was doing. So he told me that he was having a lot of fun. I said, what happened? He said, I bought Adani stock. And he was making a lot of money. But I thought that it was a solid class. And it is very risky to do such a thing. But I don't think it is risky. The stock market is increasing. And I watch it on TV that advertisements come that invest in the stock market. And those who are relatively financially weak. They are also speculating. So there is a lot of risk in this. What is your opinion on this? You are a retail investor. And you have some money. And you are investing a lot in this. Sure. They don't understand. They are watching that its return is very good. So we will invest in this. But the problem is that they don't analyze. Why is the return coming from where? Now you see in America this cryptocurrency problem. There was a lot of return. Bitcoin was sold for 2-3 money. It reached up to $67,000. But now it has become a husband. And now it has become poor again. Because after that it has fallen. And mostly poor people buy it when it is at $67,000. At the height. At the height. And then they see that it keeps falling. Because these rich people sell only then. And those who don't have any information. Those who don't have financial sophistication. They buy only then. But this problem of information. We talked about the stock market. But I think this information problem. I am listening to you. This information problem is very deep. Especially in poor people. In farmers, in poor people. Do they get information or not? That's why we say that consumer protection should be there. That they should be told. These are your rights. These are your rights. And those who sell, they cannot violate these rights. Are you enjoying this? It's nice. How can you not enjoy this view? But also, I think you are doing this Sampradaik Ekta. And you are going on a journey for peace. I think that is something the country needs. Regardless of what political party you are in. It has to be to connect with India. Absolutely. And peace is beneficial to brotherhood. And if you are thinking. Someone was saying in a speech. Which house can stand when the brothers are fighting? It can't. You have to have internal harmony. To have external security. A lot of people are saying that we can fight internally. We will suppress this minority. And we will be strong outside. This is one thing. But the second thing that is so important. In today's world. Where America, China, Ukraine are spreading hatred everywhere. In that world, India can show a way. And India can play a big role. It is our history, our culture. And it is our strength. And people are also our strength. And I think a lot of people, a lot of countries are looking at us. What will India say? What examples will India set? And that is why we should think. What are we doing? And in what direction are we going?