 All right. Hi guys. So thank you for joining me today at the presentation and delivering for empowering content managers using business principles Just as sir, thank you for organizing this getting people that kind of talk about stuff that they're passionate for web So it's nice to Okay, the main goal and share knowledge So yeah, so this presentation the title could be ambiguous and it kind of is a remix of the presentation presented at jubiladoa trailer this year and During the presentation. I had some comments with people saying like each you can't say no to leadership difficult How do you negotiate with clients and I kind of tried to get To go back a step and try to figure out like how did I come up with this solution with workflows and Negotiating deliverables and kind of getting at that attitude. So After digging a bit I figured hey, I have a business background. This is not typical with Content managers, so I could I kind of started with marketing. I got to become a marketing did marketing communications for a number of years Bellen of the web and then went into a full web position went to the registrar All this is in the context of jubiladoa So that was managing about 20% of the web traffic at the university a lot of volume A lot of the variables and then I wanted something a bit closer to my first love which was marketing So then now I'm at the faculty of engineering at the University of Ottawa strategist and web content management and design and I'm within embarking a communications team, so things to go fast Web sell my only priority Social media hat Help up with this so there's a lot of stuff And this presentation is not for people who necessarily should work in marketing communications team, but it's I'm hoping to inspire you to help you with decision models and Negotiate with your managers and directors to collaborate to get your goals And yeah, my next house probably get me even longer probably gonna have an even more than first five number of responsibilities, but Yeah All of you, I'm sure work on the projects all of you manage and By manage, I don't mean just content you probably might have But I supervise either fit formally or just can play at years So you have to manage your content. Make sure that quality controls part of your job Operations and basically like I said earlier everything else so helping out with each of my cables to representations or not So we talked about titles Yeah, so when you get a job you get a title that doesn't necessarily mean that those are your responsibilities and What I want to say today is you're more than your title you're more than Just an employee You're an expert basically you're an expert and you should be heard And I'm gonna show you a bit of frameworks and tools on like how to approach problems and hopefully When you get to get to those decisions can be like, ah, yeah, I saw this at people north this decision mode so I want you to be a leader and with leadership you get respect By being vocal You'll be advising your team But positioning self as an expert will be sought after by being resourceful You're gonna be trusted and by being proactive you're gonna be approachable So I was talking about bringing some business principles I know a lot for content managers usually come from the technical screen your developer. Maybe maybe your designer But back onto the business that I was trying to say hey Maybe I'll start with a higher level stuff So I'm gonna go with organizational behavior and I look my puns so I'm gonna go with a B theme So organization behavior or as we say in business just will be Yeah, so ask yourself. What's the prime objective of your organization? I know a couple of you have attended the presentation before so don't spoil it But it is a trick question because all of your objectives or the prime objective of your organizations are all the same It's to survive. So what does survival? You can't manage your content. You won't have the cash flow to pay your employees There's no way that you're gonna Get to your your mission values or your objectives because basically Business is key and if you can get to talk business, you can get in line with your leadership and get eye-to-eye and basically Put the web on the map when it comes to operations. Yeah, so this is kind of more like friendly approach to survival Yeah, so now that we know the main the main prime objective of the organization Ask yourself, how will you ensure that your organization survives or thrives with your work? So like what do you bring to your organization? So like how are you gonna help it? Either pivot or how are you gonna help it persevere during crunch times and avoid your company organization perish So When it comes to goal alignment If you haven't already done this exercise Try to figure out exactly like the value of how how do you help your organization in terms of mission? So what's your like? What's your team's mission? If you work in a bigger organization, what's your department's mission? What's your organization's mission and then compare that to the competition? Like how do you align? How can you collaborate and then how do you compete and then? Yeah, find out what value you and others contribute to the organization. So like does your team have in-house expertise for teaming or user interface Like how do you find that? How do you find people who are really good at editing and grammar or like have access to those style gets in your reservation? So by finding out which teams have those strengths, it's easier to collaborate I'm aware this is high level. We're gonna get a bit more to the nitty-gritty So on the B team like figure out where your height is at And then for web For survival, there's the organizational part of the survival, but there's also the individual side. So With web there could be this feeling of a caretaker's guilt like this is my website I'm responsible for this if we don't have 100% uptime how are the users gonna access the content? What I'm trying to say here is Content is almost like a village. We need the editors that come in you need the content owners who are gonna supply you the content We're gonna fly you and say like hey this content is no longer up to date like this event was last year You have to have the developers who support your security with the platform so Don't Don't put it all on yourself The other part is also remember your realm of influence sometimes when there's let's say a security breach there's only so much that you can't do when it comes to content management, so it's finding those resources, but also not to stress too much about it because Once again, it seems work The other part is to take some breaks If you burn out so if you work at 100% for an extended period of time and then work at 0% because you can't manage it anymore Overall the efficiency would probably be better if you work at 80% and make sure that you Take your time to accomplish your goals on the long term and I'll talk more about stress in a couple minutes The other part is it's okay to fail sometimes and to learn from your lessons. The important part is obviously to share those lessons And to acknowledge like when you fail Finally, reducing the stress is with the new control. So stress is good But too much of it can make you burn out So about 12 years ago, I spoke to a vice president that's the rocks and We're talking about organizational behaviors, and he said I want to stress my employees and to me that was kind of An odd comment and what he was talking about or they're into was you stress. It's kind of this optimal spot when it comes to motivation The reason why you would want to stress your employees is you don't want them to be bored or underwhelmed Unmotivated, but you don't want them to be too stressed So that they get anxiety attacks and get overwhelmed. So there's a fine balance and when I'm talking about stress You can apply to yourself, but also your your web team So like how can you motivate people to want to have more engagement with either like your updates? Hey, there's an update like just probably this this is the value that's bringing to the organization On the more real perspective basically, let's say your team is on the boat If you're not motivated enough, you don't reach as much of performance You can get close to it, that's probably okay But if you go overboard all the ship crashes at least some of the some of your teammates go overboard and then you guys are going to pick them up so Just trying to give you some mental imagery about how to how stress could be perceived Another way to manage stress within your control is to control your environment to a certain degree So my friend who works at the National Arts Center He kind of introduced me to this concept of a nook. So making your work environment as comfortable as possible. So this could be Decorations adding some color Enhancing your light. So if you're looking at documentation or wireframing if you can see what you're working on or refer to it It's a lot easier to design Getting some ergonomics some chairs that actually fit properly So you don't have to worry about how your legs are feeling and your folks focus on your work And on the left. It's my I have a static work environment And I'm right. That's my home. So you can see that there's kind of like a Recreation of like that that comfort level that what I find comfortable And yes, I have an Apple keyboard with a Windows computer, but I won't get into that Yeah, so we talked about notes. So your own comfort, but then there's Having new employees So when you're a newbie if you're an employee It takes about three to six months to guess to understand and make sure to work The reality of your web what the operational cycles are going to be looking like And then if you're management of leadership more information vaporize for Responsibilities you're looking at that six to six months to year to get them to your position or comfortable so When you're the newbie This is your window of opportunity for making an impact. So getting those quick wins those low-hanging fruits showing hey I understood their problem. I stopped it. I'm getting some credentials and some Some credibility in terms of like I understand what you're like, trust me I want to collaborate with you and this is a good way to Showcase other people that working web like oh that this person gets it. I want to collaborate with this person So you're kind of like hey on you Same thing with leadership except With leadership, this is a good time to come in and say okay, sir If somebody else is new like it if somebody else in coming in in the leadership position That's a good way to advocate for your agenda. So go for a coffee say like hey This is the reality the web let that see right away. So later on when there's like next year This person knows the guy exactly who you are what you're doing and you don't have to Ask for a heart cell or soft cell. You already have that relationship built up When it's a new employee that comes into the fold That's where you can kind of gauge there. There's expertise level like okay. You understand CSS, you know JavaScript, okay? Well, this is my portfolio like you can you help me out with this and in exchange. I'll help Manage your website section in a better faster way. Let's find something that works for both of us So it's just like Getting touched faster with people so you don't wait to the last minute test for favors Self-understanding will give you wings So how do you communicate with others? Are you directing your emails? Are you catering to their emotions? How do you process information? Are you tactile? Are you visual? Are you auditory? So How do you learn? What drives you in my case? I love white framing. I like designing. I like Taking an idea conceptualizing it and spinning it back onto the web in a seamless experience What distracts you is that that third email from somebody that sets you the same request on the same day And then they follow up with a phone call Is it that question that you get asked by the editor? Is it an h2 header that should have been an h3 header? And can you work on all that and flip it around? So how would your colleagues? Communicate with each other or they direct Are they nuanced do they have a different approach or they're gonna try to come around Piss you an idea come back later How they process information what drives them? How to get somebody excited about your your content projects? What do you know they're gonna stumble upon and they're gonna get obsessive about a certain element and can you work on helping them out with this? food for thought so to me I'm talking about business today, but I understand that there's a bit more at least this is what I think is Useful traits for shall I get good content? There's the business side. So business awareness don't need to be a business person There's the people skills Because content is made by people There's the technical competence and design for y'all Communication styles What's what's your comfort area? So for me Technology, but do you have a technical background? So when you start again wait for acronyms, is it the same acronym in business? Is it the same acronym as in design? So when you say UI or AI are they talking about artificial intelligence? Are they talking about our information architect? I'm sorry. That's a terrible example, but you know what I mean Yeah, those acronyms or language or approach is the same are you starting with a user-centric approach? You're looking for a tool first approach something that's rigid robust or you just talk like thinking about money in the bottom line So something I like is to do some self-improvement. I'm a huge sucker for it I've done taking a lot of workshops. I've taken a lot of workshops for management and supervision and Accessibility and all that fun stuff. Well, what I find to be fun stuff And one of the test is the Myers-Briggs test. So this one's free It's called as extinct personalities takes about 15 minutes to do And at the end they spew up a personality or a type Or stereotype that they think it's best for you. So in my case I've been fluctuating mostly towards the logician. So introverted, intuition, thinking, shatter ups and it Highlights what they think is strengths or weaknesses of your personality, but also your working styles If your team feels comfortable, I would recommend maybe doing that as a team exercise I'll spend 15 minutes in it have a good laugh about like, oh Well, I can totally relate to this person and then you can see where those gaps are for communication styles. Oh, yeah, I totally like design first or I'll totally think about Concepts before thinking about how people feel Great. So you're energized. You're a salt-aware expert. That way. So we've talked a lot about theory Let's go a bit more theoretical. A bit more details Pleasant with your energy So when are your peaks? I'm sure you know your peaks So like Brian was saying earlier, he's an early bird. I'm definitely not an early bird Or your lunch croak you work during the lunchtime when everybody's gone So you can actually get stuff done or you have an evening owl And then when you know those peaks like oh, yeah, I'm really like I'm really feeling energized right now What should you do with that? Personally what I've what I've been kind of developing is Going for the conceptual and strategic stuff stuff that thinks a lot takes a lot of energy to To get things done so like earlier yesterday Close up labs was talking about like developing a conference style guide That's the time to do it You're taking all those considerations of your position and trying to cram it down into one document or one page Yeah, put that effort into that so high-level stuff When you're a bit more tired go for designing to create a stuff to learning still using some energy but not being brain dead or just Exhausted so like tinkering Adjusting those widgets those alignments. Maybe it's like CSS and When you're super tired or exhausted or you can't think further do the repetitive stuff the dreaded stuff Go find those deadlings erase them right Change the labels of your aliases for URLs like doesn't take much thinking power and just do it If if you spend your energy here timing what you can do is plan for when you're tired. So that's an idea And finally structure sometime or unstructured time By that I mean Technology is always evolving. There's always new stuff. There's always the platform is changing. There's always new modules So earlier I was talking about not always working at 100% safe 10% of time for learning safe 10% of your time for going to the coffees and meeting those new visa And yeah, you can justify that with business objectives So do the most of your daytime Don't try the new recipes that require a lot of energy. So when you're crunch time, you should focus on the critical path That a principle I like is the right principle. So if 20% of your efforts if you 80% of the impact What the hell is the other 8% that you have? So recently what we did is the contents strategy and I was that analysis I did a deep dive into your content look at your news article at the University of Ottawa Faculty of Engineering and Kind of they identified like oh wow these articles are getting a lot of Engagement like this person there are a lot of people who are spending four minutes on this article versus this article Or we had a few clicks Didn't have a lot of time on them. So like how do you eliminate that so you can? Maximize your impact in terms of content right Be selfish about complex change by that I mean minimize the distractions I Like to focus on my work and then something distracts me. That's one of the complex changes from what you were focused on that Has a that has a constant energy So there's two ways to go about it is I minimize that so you can work outside of the office or just say like this is my busy hat Or you can reschedule with people and say like hey, no, okay I got your idea. I wrote it down or send me an email and I can't think about it right now because I'm trying to focus And then if you have difficult decisions that are That you're humphonging it's not necessarily only up to you to do this decision you can always throw into your your manager's court or your director's court and managers to the decision decisions all the time, so they have an attitude for Slicing the cake and give you some directions All right project management So for everything that you do as a fun exercise Try to consider putting all your efforts in this triangle How much time is going to take you how much resources or how many resources is this Work going to take you and how many people or efforts it's going to take you So I know this developer named Sean that fun boots and he made this app for fun Calculate how much a government meeting costs so you can put a couple of generals into the app You can put in a couple of director generals some clerks It's how these how many employees are in the meeting and excuse out the salary for the hour That was spent so you can look at the meetings whenever you have a meeting discussion for a button Let's say on your website. How much of this button competition cost me? 500 dollars is that a good is that a good amount of time spent for a button decision? maybe So try to look at it on yeah more of a financial and effort perspective Another thing I really like is an Eisenhower matrix. This is really good for prior organization Unfortunate that my manager is very open to new concepts and we've applied this for for meetings. So this avoids the town hall meeting It avoids having the web last within the meeting or your portfolio last meeting and the way it works is really Which you ask is so urgent not urgent important on important whatever is urgent So timing and important you would right away anything that is not urgent or important you plan Not important but urgent you delegate. That's my favorite. So you can get Not because I don't want to do it, but it also gives experience for whoever else is taking on those responsibilities And it gives you a bit of a cloud in terms of supervision leadership And not important you can't eliminate it put in your back burner or just revise it later. Maybe it's gonna bubble up Obviously That's also the small again cat. It's like impact. So if you have something that is low like tiny but urgent important and There's something else that is huge and urgent important like obviously the huge thing shit or anything else Okay, big project critical passion be taken consideration first So far so good. I know I speak a bit fast And I'm not going through this life past now All right, leaving my interaction. That's the management principle So let's say you have a scenario where I have this content update that is required and I have This client or editor that needs to do the update This is kind of like a mental scenario how to present the information so you get ready to present the information You come in with self-confidence about your ass You come in with empathy your perspective stated. It's not top-down I mean with a communication and a supportive Approach and then you clarify. So like here's the presentation that here's the update that I need for me to do These are the deadlines that that are Part of the work This is the impact that's gonna happen and this is easy to stick holders So if I develop you have a conversation like oh, no, but this person actually has a competing kind of Update going on they have to work on this social media post So you develop it until you get an understanding and then they ship 100% of the time So if they don't ship if it's not shipped properly what happens is you can go back to terrifying so like oh, I thought we had this understanding What happened? Go back with self-confidence like this is what we have to do And you just keep doing that cycle until we conclude This is a bit heavier So management does come into a valve so the more autonomous somebody is the more that they ship They lose to the valve the more control that she gives to the person if they don't deliver if they're not respecting the deadlines or Basically not being a team player Titan that valve So this is Like a situational leadership scenario In summary why has this is important behavior on the path of the leader or yourself and On the x-axis the path behavior is like how directive you are Very quickly basically paint is somebody that's able motivated that wants to show up to work So that's like your ideal employee You don't have a lot of those and basically you can give them a project and they're gonna go and run with it They don't need support Afterwards you have the loop or are free Somebody that's competent able guidance, so they're kind of like oh, this is I'm not necessarily comfortable with this or like how how do I like How do I get around it? So you need to get in with support afterwards that this person who's very eager So often it's newbies or in our case. It's admin staff who are you know, it's like I love what I have So I used to give them a bit more training Enthusiasm is there, but the technical expertise not built yet. So like how to how to write excessively for the web That would be that part and then the green or the employees who are not motivated not confident yet and that's where you have to be controlled out of the title so you have to Almost like they're gonna take a lot of your time in terms of that's provision so we kind of put the parallel of approval permissions in terms of Component management and a paid employee would probably get webmaster level access or Higher level so they can actually do some that's some layouts A good employee could maybe have that but you have to have maybe a more than check in a revision kind of model Orange employee editor or contributor in that green Maybe no access because they will just destroy your pages and Your healthy website. Yeah, he goes that's gonna go down So in my case our faculty we have employees of all types and I do have some people where stakeholders or People like you simply don't give access because it hadn't respected the understanding that we had in the past Yeah, so talked about delegation now for yourself Everybody works in the digital age Everybody has emails phones chat groups. Hopefully We started the university having around chat groups Obviously in person What I like to do is be predictable so standardizing The amount of time that they can expect to have a response for me So let's say the dean sends me an update obviously in priority But if they send me an email they can expect to have a reply within 48 hours all the time If they give me a phone call and I'm available. I'll pick up the phone If they come in person, I'll talk to them over schedule Why I want to be predictable is when somebody comes within asked They know exactly what to expect and they won't try to bypass the system So like for example, somebody comes with a project. They send me an email doesn't work in any column. You're right away That's not being very respectful for a day from my time and for two It's almost like harassing it, but you also want to be respectful for everybody else who are using proper channels for doing some requests So that kind of ties into the aspect of like rewarding goes through shit. So You want to reward people who Ship on time, but also respect your time. So if somebody is always delivering on time You can kind of schedule your time a bit better to to get through your workflow going Favors to do Boster collaboration And by that that's kind of like what I've learned to when we're talking about newbies. So you do favor put it into To dirt the house box. Oh, okay. You gave me a favor So I'm getting a bit of trust which you they're gonna do a favor for you put that in your favorite box I guess and then when you when you build that that type of capacity the collaboration of usually flowers starting to run out of time, okay, and Yeah, so the idea with collaboration is the more people that you can get on board and to collaborate The more you're gonna be able to influence the web agenda For example at the University of Ottawa, we're in a decentralized system. All the webmasters are in faculties or services and Being alone can be kind of lonely and we all have our struggles but when we get together to talk about something collaboratively we recognize that there are like Opportunities for growth for improving streamlining tools And we can also all want to get her to push for our agenda with leadership So by kind of creating those that collaborative aspect of Of the needs together there's dirt it does elevate everybody at the same time Technologies change and changes management so we one of the presentations from yesterday was talking about how machine learning can figure out Your emotions within within words, so that's kind of creepy for me It's creepy cool, but not everybody in at least for my team or in marketing communications or marketing in communication coordinator could be Kind of sketched up with the web So it's your responsibility to be the debt will change management person in your team that says hey web is cool Hey, this is the impact that web is bringing and you have to clarify that because It could be ambiguous So I have a friend Jason who loves to doodle and whenever there's something complicated new happening when you do it up It makes it a lot easier to understand the change and it takes away the resistance and brings everybody on board Okay, so I presented a lot of models today And Hopefully it's gonna give you some ideas of setting boundaries To say yes or no to requests to say yes or no to delegation. Yes or no to management Yeah, so as I recap and talk about understanding the mission of your organization your team have a feel energized Consider how you communicate Write your energy waves some approaches to management And being predictable and the team player in terms of collaboration Yeah, so alone your web practitioner, but together we're co pieces colony with a much wider wider range of skills and I want once again to reiterate your more than your title Your leader you're an expert and you should be heard during these. Thank you much any questions Does any of this resonate with you? Do you have any like? Oh, yeah, this person's definitely like a pink employee Sure For example That's a tough one For me at least like obviously like the physical environment It's kind of a tough one But at least for the walking parts you can set up standards And that's kind of like bring back the aspect of self-confidence Where you you can't say no to people and say like okay? Well, this is my busy hour. I have that in the past There's I guess two strategies that come up to mind the first one is to have it in your calendar So like walk off the time when you focus on on work Yeah, and the other one is just like look at this is worth it's getting them to to bounce back So like scheduling sometimes so like right now not a good time. I Will schedule you later or I'll schedule you a skirt Sorry, I'll schedule you now for later or let's reevaluate that during another meeting So kind of like having a block of time and usually people are kind of responsive when you say like I'm gonna dedicate this amount of time with you Cabit if it's something that's not important to urgent you can just say like I'll talk to my management and we'll get back to you to see if that's that aligns with my responsibilities So you can kind of use all like juggles through all those little tools. That's probably what I would do But yeah, open environment is a tough one Another another way to do it's like just have headphones on and kind of say like headphones on means don't talk to me And then I guess it's up to you to be Headphones that are not like they're not noise canceling, but they're And it's like it's locked out enough of the noise that I can focus I don't wear them all day. It's more like I need to focus on this thing Yeah You have to be careful about not looking too cold either like you can't ignore someone because you have the headphones on so you Can't you kind of have to like really right every time like this is this is my quite headphone time and And at the very at the very last is if they still kind of like push you can go back to your manager and be like Okay, well, which ones are my priority in terms of work, and then you can go back to the person like if you Want to talk for you about this I spoke to my manager my director and they're saying this is more important So if you want to like elevate it or put it up to food chain go talk to them. So like just deflect Yeah So And so One thing you like you're already it's already too late by the time they're walking they decided that you're a person they should interrupt so The headphones they works sometimes to make people not decide that you're a person to drop I also read a study somewhere that people are Some percentage less likely to interrupt a person who appears to be working with their tongue sticking out I Don't mean in a weird way. I mean that that particular expression that is used in cartoons of like something really hearty-way like that I mean it's kind of comfortable sit like that all the time, but people will actually not approach it for a bit that if like there's some psychological Biological indication that means that busy with me long. I don't know The If you recognize the disconnect between what you think your role is and what everybody what some other people I think your role is you have two choices one choices is to ask the question. You're asking me Which is I think my role is to do this working everyone else take my role things my role is to handle whatever The other choices to say Okay, there's a goal that's not being played by anybody right now that everyone is defaulting to me and Then like like Maximo saying you could then maybe take that It seems like we need a Whatever this is and if you feel like you don't mind you wouldn't mind playing that role You could say I'd like to do this, but then I can't also do this other thing that I need to be focused on But if you don't feel comfortable in that way if you're not happy that people are like you'd rather be doing the world We're thinking about Then yet probably Worth it investigating some kind of change with your Management in terms of even like can you work with me some of the time you can get something done Right a lot of places will be inflexible I don't know if I But the point we're all I was also thinking from managing the top of all this etiquette And these are guidelines to follow so it's more like you can have your own guidelines and rules But people have to expect them It's better if it comes from above Communicated how do people know about so I think it's more As a change management thing and even people coming to know And I was a learning great comment by the way comments I was a learning about like getting people to power to get empowered numbers I'm assuming you're not the only one that's feeling bad in your office at the moment So maybe what you could do is kind of like do a little survey get some names see like how many people are feeling that way And maybe you guys can cluster in a certain area of the room or kind of like present that policy To managements and then it's you can like influence that some respect Yeah, it's not easy. It's not easy Trouble managing people who keep pinning me in check Be there for people Like if they know that you respond all the time It's like they always get you and like sometimes I'm in the zone and I'm doing something Somebody will want me to try to shoot something and it's like it's very difficult for me to be polite Yeah Zero to two days I guess my philosophy for chat is it could even be like zero to never but Yeah, for whatever I disabled the sound notifications so I don't get that queue of complex change that happens all the time and The other part is you could schedule when you go check the chat So maybe chat doesn't mean to be instantaneous, but it could be every three hours So you could decide to have chat in the morning look at your chat and then at noon look at your chats And then yeah, it depends on the workflow But I don't think there needs to be that instance like not all comments Required to be responded right away. So for me, it's kind of like this this this we're all working together while having like a Present conversation and then this is kind of like an offshoot comments. So maybe we can talk about it later If you could also try to explore like certain having certain topics in chat So like this is kind of like a bigger vessel just shoot it by email. So we can make a change channels Some ideas, but yeah I think it's also that like maybe you set the expectation now people that you will respond Instantaneously or as like if you set the expectation that like, you know, I'll check it when I can type of things then Like because now everyone is gonna want to talk to you by chat if they're like, oh, this is how I get your Yeah, but you have to kind of try and change that expectation Oh, yeah I do that for some steam like a game playing out we can go up here offline See what's going on When you see that On my end I have a lot of commentators that call me throughout the day and Usually I encourage them to call whenever they have the question Because it might be easier to explain on the phone versus email. Some of them also are quick wins. So it's all about the impact versus the effort so it's something that's gonna take you two minutes just, you know, Take a break to do it for two minutes and you know, they don't have to wait for two days for you to respond If not, what I do I just tell them send me email. I'll put it in my play already So you can give them those two kind of things you can assess you can check your text or chat by the way And that's the situation if it's something that's gonna take you five minutes Sometimes it's good to take a break from whatever you're doing and go back, you know Fresh eyes to your project and in that five minute, you can just do those quick things that So they don't have to wait for that much longer. So it's all about Self-care self-confidence being stern and For project management or like any types of requests usually I work in Asana like a platform for more like Project-oriented stuff and then you request I just send it like even if it's their request by chat I'll send myself an email. So it's like that's how I manage my request. So Everything gets like into two channels. And that's it There's a really fantastic slightly old but still fantastic and still very relevant book out there time It was written from the point of view of system what we used to call system administrators So it's called time management for system administrators. It's off. It's from O'Reilly and It really should have been titled time management for technical workers who really get interrupted Because that's really what it's useful for and so whether you're you can no matter what kind of work you do That involves the need to be focused for periods of time, you know, it's not like that Can recommend it enough if you just don't worry about the examples Because there's he gives lots of examples of their various administration specific but the the the techniques for managing your time managing interruptions figuring out other people's expectations all of that stuff is very Very relevant to actually both both of the situations in a lot of the stuff that might seem to stop Well, it is a love it so it is break time, but if you have any more questions or comments first We can say hello. Thank you for attending You