 You are just starting to record in. Julian, can I just check? Can you see my screen, by the way? Can you see the slide? Yes, we can. Okay, super. Okay, thanks. We can. That's very cool. And I guess we've got Ross as well, right? We've got other Valero people. Correct. Ross is starting in from Australia, yeah. He is. It's glass of wine time there. Yeah, here it's coffee time. Lots of coffee time. Yeah, here we are on our third coffee, fourth coffee. So, all right. So have you started recording? Yeah, all right. So I'll kick it off. Julian. So welcome everyone to this trade finance SIG. We've got a special today with Belair. It was very exciting. I've been asked to just read out the anti-trust policy. As you know, we all have anti-trust policy. You can read this on our web if you want. I'll read it quickly. The Linux Foundation meetings involve participation by industry competitors. And it's the intention of the Linux Foundation to conduct all of its activities in accordance with applicable anti-trust and competition laws. It is therefore extremely important. The attendees are here to meeting agendas and we wear and not participate in any activities that are prohibited under applicable U.S. state, federal or anti-trust and competition laws. So if you want to learn more about that, please look up on our website and happy to provide more information. I'm now going to hand you to Andre, who's going to kick off our chair, who's going to kick off the session today. Thank you. Welcome everybody. Yeah, I step in. I'm sorry for the old days. It's not that good. I don't know what's going on. You know, it's my big place to have it. You sound good. It sounds good now. I don't know what's going on. It leaps sometimes. It's locked down. I don't know what's going wrong. Anyway, it's my pleasure to have Yakko today. I asked him to join us on a call. And then base, because I would like to go deeper into this subject, which is really important. It's one of the major ones in trade finance. So today we'll, you know, we'll present solutions devised by Bolero in terms of trade finance and specifically on electronic bills of ladies. Yakko, please step in. Take the world. I'm in the global community for global trade finance. So they think there's a tool coming in. Yeah, yeah, I step in. Yakko presentation. Sorry that Yakko, apologies for turning it late, but go ahead. No worries, no worries. I'm actually at a customer location. So apologies for that. That's okay. It's always good to be at customers, right? Yeah. And I did ask a customer, do they know Bolero? And I know Gigi, do you know Bolero? He knows Bolero. So that's, that's, that's, that's where you go. That's really nice. So, so thank you all for joining. And thanks to Julian and thanks to Andrea for allowing me to, to, to do a presentation for you today. What I will try and do today is not make it too complex and try to come in high level. So what do we do from a Bolero perspective? How do we link, you know, the physical supply chain to the financial supply chain? How do we work with the traditional trade environments and the trade products? And how do we connect to, I would say, you know, the latest initiatives out there in terms of, you know, blockchain technology and blockchain initiatives out there. And I'll come in from a very pragmatic perspective. There is room at the end for a Q&A. And I really, really, really ask you to please send in your questions or maybe we can open it up at the end. So everybody can ask their questions verbally because I know it is a, it can be a difficult topic, but I'll try and explain it as, as simple as I can. And I'm sure it will work out. So I have a few slides for you. I think they will also be shared after the session. So let me just go to the first slide. I have a small agenda for today. Introduction about myself. Global trade, why things are changing and why do they have to change and how are we involved there? Then I'll go more into, you know, what we are doing there and how long we're already doing that in terms of, you know, how we connect banks and corporates and how we also, you know, enable electronic bills of lading and how these are used out there in the business. And as I said, Q&A in the back. So just a few words about me so you know who is this Dutch guy with the grey hair and what is he all about. So my background is in trade finance and commodity finance, mainly from the banking side, but also from a factoring and a full fading perspective. I've done everything under the sun, I would say over the last 35 years. And I would say the last eight, nine years I'm heavily focusing on digitization in trade. That means that amongst other things I'm also part of the International Chamber of Commerce. I am working in the steering committee for digital trade. And with it that I'm actually co-chairing a subgroup, which is around fintech adoption. And basically it's around how can fintechs in the broad sense, then be best prepared when they start to engage into discussions with, for instance, banks, or other financial institutions on, you know, how to work together. What questions can you expect from a bank in terms of technology security, but even around your company. And basically what we tried to do with that stream is to make it easier for fintechs to start working with these banks and these financial institutions out there, because you know we all realize digitization and technology will play a much bigger role in trade going forward. And so that's me in a nutshell. I'm heading up the global sales force. Ross is on the call today from Australia. We have a team in Hong Kong in Singapore in Austria Europe, and in the UK and I'm actually based in the Netherlands myself. Also at any point after today if you have any questions, feel free to reach out. You know I'm always happy to explain and happy to help if possible. So let's go into the presentation and go through the slides and try to give you a bit more background when we know what is this Bolero and what have we been doing and what is our business area. So, I'm sure you have seen pictures like this and I've also seen last week you know from Joel, you had a lot of information about collections and electronic collections. But basically, this is the space where Bolero has been operating in for over 22 years. We focus on you know what we call the physical supply chain so the goods coming from A to B around the globe and to enable those shipments to take place to be you know that the goods can leave the port and the goods can be cleared at the other port when they come in through customs, the port authorities, and all other things you know we focus on the documents around those physical supply chains and we actually focus on having them in a digital format in an electronic format. That's also why I'm going to talk a lot about electronic bills of late later today. However, these documents are great and this data is great, but you need to use these for transactions underlying transactions, which can in our case range from anything from open account payments means you know just a buyer and a seller doing a transaction on the platform and using these electronic documents, for instance the seller to claim the payment with the buyer and the buyer using these documents electronically to you know receive the goods, you know, by handing over the documents to the local agent or the local carrier. So that's on these documents but these documents can also be used on friends on the bank transactions. I'm sure you've heard about products like you know, let us have credit. Again Joel spoke about documentary collections. There are other transactions out there that can be done by banks or even by other parties and by other parties I mean all these initiatives that I have popped up and have matured like for instance contour and all these new initiatives out there do we connect as well. I'll come to that later in the presentation as well. So, basically, you can use these documents and the data of these documents to trigger traditional trade products, open account transactions but also blockchain transactions for us, by the way, it doesn't really matter if our electronic documents are used under, you know, blockchain transactions on corda or hyper lecture or Ethereum, we connect to any, but I just want to make clear from the start, we are not on the blockchain ourselves, we still have traditional technology and traditional ways of exchanging these documents safely. Although of course we know we also use security and we hash documents already for 22 years for instance. This is the area in which we operate. And actually, one of our core components is of course this electronic document this electronic transport document, which is called a bill of lading, and actually the name bolero stands for bill of lading electronic registry So, so much about you know where we are what we have been doing for 22 years. What we also do is we connect all the parties in this environment so we connect corporates to corporates corporates to banks, banks to other banks we connect for instance also insurance companies, what have you that's on the platform I'll come to that later in the presentation as well. So, digitization, it can deliver a clear advantage. There are many advantages for going digital in trade. And let me touch upon a few why they can be interested from from various angles so if I, I look at this screen and I start on the left hand and I look at cash management. Man we talk to exporters. Why do they want to move away from paper why do they want to go digital with their documents. Basically, a big driver for them is actually speeding things up in terms of you know getting paid for instance, whether it's a site transaction. They can present the documents more quickly to the buyer, or even to the bank. And if it's a deferred payments they can ask for financing, much more quickly because they will get the documents and the data much more quickly from the shipping company from the carrier, and they could present it much more quickly to whomever they want to get the money from. As said, if it's a deferred payment they can also ask for financing much quick more quickly as well. Additional benefit in the trade world is that usually you have to make sure that these documents are correct, that there are no discrepancies. When you start to use electronic documents, you will also reduce the risk of discrepancies. Not only when you create those documents, but only should you have made a mistake. It's much more easy to quickly return a set of documents back to the presenter and say you know you have to change things because you made a mistake, then it is to do with paper documents. So again, there are additional benefits as well. If I look at the almost the center of this slide you see minimizing risks. Paper is much more open to fraud than, especially in our case you know digital documents and having handling data in a secured way. We have seen a lot of things happening in the, in the commodity finance space recently where fraud was committed. When you start to work with digital documents and a secure platform like Bolero, you massively reduce the risk for fraud. Just to give you one example, these bills of lading and again I will explain later how it works in detail are not only just transport documents, but they also have a function which is called you know that they can give title, you can have actually some power over the underlying goods. So often these documents are for instance used as collateral for financing. And you know from a Bolero perspective, if you are pledging such a document to a to a lender, that lender knows that they're the sole pledgeee holder they know that they're the single holder of that pledge. So it cannot also be pledged to someone else. So that risk minimizes the risk for a for a lender, but there are other ways why it can be much easier. And of course also with this whole COVID-19 crisis. You know, everybody is working from home or fortunately some people are going back to the office now, but you know the disruption was really really really big when paper suddenly got stuck around the globe. And it's not, you know, reaching the buyer from the shipping company or not from the buyer from the seller I mean, or from the between the banks. It was really a nightmare. So also with electronic documents you can minimize risks of documents getting delayed or lost or what have you on the right hand side. You see operational efficiencies. Now that's also a very interesting part. Let me focus here on the buyer side for instance. When you see that a buyer is receiving goods, usually to pick up those goods in the port, they will need the documents and they will need especially the bill of lading or in our case the electronic bill of lading. If they don't have those documents at the time that the vessel arrives or the goods need to be picked up, they will incur a lot of costs. The goods can be, you know, the marriage costs related to the carrier, but it can also be cost for, you know, asking the bank for a for a shipping guarantee because you know the documents are not there and they still want to pick up the goods, or they have to ask the carrier for a TELX release, or they have to have different processes in place with LOIs and what have you. So, you know, not having the documents arrive on time at the buyer side also confronts them with a lot of problems. Okay, these can all be solved with, you know, using electronic documents and using, you know, a platform like Bolero. So it makes clear advantages. However, let's be honest, you know, in the last 22 years, digitization hasn't really, really massively taken off in trade. From an ICC perspective, you know, a lot of work has gone into, you know, updating the rules and making special conditions for electronic documents to be used under collections, again to Joel's point, or under letters of credit. But still, the market and the business is very traditional, very paper based and reluctant to change. So it is very important that these benefits are clear, but it's also important that you know the authorities, the ports, the customs, the banks, the whole ecosystem is open to move away from paper, because before you can do any smart contract, whether it's on blockchain or whether it's on any other technology, you have to move away from paper. These transactions should not be used with paper. Okay, so how does it work from a Bolero perspective? So as said, you know, we've been doing this for 22 years now. We are connecting parties over, you know, our network. And basically, this means the parties that you're seeing here. Seamlessly, we enable corporates to connect friends to their banks to apply for letters of credit, or for bank guarantees or standby lcs but if they're on the exporting side, they can receive those transactions as being the beneficiary. You know, and especially for large corporates, they deal with multiple banks and they don't want to use all these bank portals and they can just use the Bolero portal to reach all these banks. It's interoperable. The legal framework, I'm going to come to that in the next slide because that is really important and I'll also come in from, you know, how that is important for, you know, even the most high tech solutions out there. And of course, a network of network. We connect. We connect to anybody that makes sense from a trade finance perspective, whether it's banks on traditional products, whether it's initiatives like you know, microchairs, corn chain contour, and boy, and many more in the in the blockchain space, as said whether it's quarter hyperlature, Ethereum, it doesn't matter to us, as long as there is a need for transport data transport documents, smart contracts that are triggered with documents that actually focus on the physical supply chain. So from that perspective, network of networks, but we also connect to whomever we need. Now, on the next slide, let's now talk more about what we do and why the platform is so important and again the platform can connect to anything. And also within the platform there are a few key components, which I will address, and hopefully that will make clear for why Bolero is not just about technology, but it is also about you know trust. It's also about legal infrastructures and you know it's also about the title registry. As said, in the beginning, you know we enable these electronic documents to be created, we enable them to be exchanged and we enable them to be used over the platform. Now, for electronic documents to work a legal infrastructure is key. All parties handling these electronic documents must agree to how things are being done, and what is the legal status, what is the validity, and how can you use these electronic documents. Now, let me give you a very simple example and I'm not I'm not sure if anybody can see also my video here but I'm actually based in the Netherlands and let me just give you a very simple example, you know, here in the Netherlands we have the euro as a currency. Now, I have here a 20 euro banknote right. If I were to take my iPhone here and I would make a picture of this 20 euro banknote and I would turn it into a PDF. I would digitally sign it, I would hash it, I would encrypt it, I would make it available securely over the Bolero network to any of you attending this session today. And you would receive it. Have I really given you 20 euros at that moment. Really, I've given you an image of 20 euro notes, I still have the original here in Amsterdam, I can still spend it, and you have a very secure way, maybe even a structured data way, you have an image of a 20 euro banknote but you can't really use it. Now, you can imagine from a Bolero platform, if you have an electronic bill of lading, which is a contract of carriage, which is a title document as I said, which is a negotiable document as I said, you need to be sure that it can be used that it has value. Now for me as a person here to turn this into, you know, digital currency right now for instance I would have to go to my bank, I have to deposit it into my account, and then I can electronically transfer 20 euros to you. In our scenario for an electronic bill of lading to be really working and to be really be able to be exchanged between parties, we have what's called the legal framework which we call the rulebook. So that means that all parties involved in the use of an electronic bill of lading have agreed to the Bolero rulebook have agreed to the Bolero legal infrastructure. That means if a carrier like a CMA or an Evergreen or a MERSC, if they create an electronic bill of lading over the Bolero platform and make it available for instance to the exporter. It is a real electronic bill of lading. It is a contract of carriage. It actually if you look at, you know, the PDF version of it it looks exactly the same as a paper bill of lading, but it also has the same functionalities. You can endorse it, you can end it over to a bank as collateral for financing. Everything you can do with a paper bill of lading, you can do with an electronic bill of lading. So what I tried to say here it's not about you know the data. It's not just about the image is not about the secure transfer of a file, or you know hashing it what we do as well we fingerprint it. But also you need to have the legal infrastructure and to support it to make sure that it can actually be used as it is intended to use. The next thing on the center there on the bottom what you will see is the title registry. Coming back to the bank note if I have a paper bank note and I would hand it off to Andrea for instance, and I put it in his hands let's say we're in the same room. It's clear that Andrea is now holding the 20 euro bank notes in an electronic scenario, or a digital scenario you also want to make sure that if you know the document passes from one party to another party that it is absolutely clear who is holding the original at any given point from a Bolero perspective to control that transfer or handover of documents or giving title or endorsing. All of that is registered in what we call the title registry. So that's a function within Bolero, which at any given point is absolutely certain of, for instance, who is holding the original electronic document. If you compare it to blockchain language, it would be a notary function. So basically we act as a notary where we are always on the planet shore, who is holding the original document when there's a very important feature and a feature why, you know, even the blockchain initiatives come to us, you know peace course, as said you need a legal infrastructure, as said, you need a title registry, and we support that. I will talk more about Bill of Leading in a second how it actually looks and works, but you know this is just to set the outline for you know how and why it works and why you need more than just data, or you just need more than a smart contract or like you. Of course the platform needs to be secure. We connect all these parties we also have data matching elements in there as well. And of course these documents are flying over on the right hand side you see the network which is another representation of what I explained earlier, and on the left hand side, you see just as a sample some of the things we offer. So to each of them, some a bit longer some a bit smaller, but basically we offer a lot of applications, which can be used, either via our web interface, or which can be used also from an API connectivity if we linking for instance to other platforms or other solutions and those are in the areas of less credit guarantees presentations, which can also be in relation to collections for instance. We do have a supply chain solution supply chain finance solution which for instance one major bank has been using that already for a long time to automate supply chain finance they have supply chain finance program. Where, you know, data from purchase order is matched against data from the actual invoice and a and shipment data, and then if the seller would like to receive financing that whole process is matched automatically and managed automatically and that's where we provide you know the, the data matching, as you see on the on the right on the middle on the on the platform side. And of course, electronic bills of lady. So, in terms of using this so what we notice is we have two type of main users so we have main users that use the web interface. We are now rolling out our new web interface for our clients to use Bolero, as said with their banks with their carriers or using electronic documents or what have you. The name of the new technology platform or the new the new user experience is called Galileo. It's extremely intuitive. We have, you know, rolled this out we've been as said you know, over 20 years in this business and I can tell you in 20 years you get a lot of client feedback. You know, all these, all these different areas and we've incorporated all that feedback to make sure that you know the user experience is up to date. But also in the background, we've ensured that you know, since connectivity is key these days, that's the Galileo platform and the Bolero proposition can easily integrate with you know any other solution out there, whether it be systems as clients, whether it's back office systems as banks, or whether it's blockchain initiatives out there. And that can be done by simple API calls and protocols. That is how we operate from focus on this session today, one of the services we provide this EBL as a service electronic build of leading as a service. Smart contract initiative out there that would like to you know connect to Bolero to enable the use of electronic bills of leading to either trigger the smart contract or to be part of the conditions of a smart contract. We can enable that in the background. So we also sometimes see that the actual users of the transactions are using third party applications and then we are just in the background there to facilitate and act as the pipe for instance between the shipping company and the initiative. To the sellers and the buyers and then the solutions out there. So that's basically from a technology perspective, we are very agnostic and we are very flexible to connect, whomever we need to connect to. I won't go through this too much. So basically, Letters of Credit, that's, you know, where the clients and the banks can communicate on and they can utilize them. I'm going to switch to the bills of leading because I think that's most relevant for the audience today. Of course, guarantees can be handled over the platform and then when I say guarantees I mean bank guarantees but also mean stand by Letters of Credit. You know, we have customers that do thousands and thousands of these transactions over our platform with multiple banks. And of course, when you look at two multiple banks, we have over 70 banking groups globally connected to to Bolero. Big names, small names and even when you see a big name. It doesn't mean just one location but it means often you know globally. So we have a big reach out there for all these clients. And of course the corporates. Right. In the end, everything we do. And I think this is true for any initiative out there. It's all about the corporates. It's all about the customers. You do everything for the customers to either make their life easier or to enable financing for them or to enable things to go faster. That's risky. That is what we do and that's what we are in this business already for so long. And if you forget about, you know, what's in it for the clients what's in it for the corporates then you might as well close shop. That's the most important thing. So, of course, to be able to be an electronic bill of leading provider and EBL provider. You are nowhere if you don't have the network, if you don't have the network with the carriers carriers are the shipping companies, you know these vessel operators. We have over 200 actually we have around 230 I think the biggest count is, and we have major carriers, like for instance you see your names like evergreen and CMA with whom we are fully integrated into the back office environment. If you would go to these carriers and you would look up, you know, emails of leading on their websites, you will probably not find the name Bolero there, but we are actually there in the background. Facilitating, you know, the electronic bill of leading. And of course our legal infrastructure is also the basis thereof and also the platform is also in the background to exchange these documents and this data securely. So, there you won't see us prominently but we are there in the background, but even for a small carrier that maybe does a few shipments we also have a web user interface and they can also get going with us so for us it doesn't really matter. Again, it is the corporates who are in the driving seat. If a corporate for a, for instance for a short shipping route doesn't want to take the risk of you know these paper documents taken too long to go from a to b. Once to use electronic bills of leading, you know, they typically come to us and together with them, we do our utmost to make that work for in this case for instance a short shipping crowd. We were the first. There are more initiatives out there there's competition out there. We also see a lot of very new initiatives out there. The underlying technology, honestly, I think it's irrelevant. And I maybe, you know, I know I know I'm talking to the hyper ledger community now. So, but I think the underlying technology is irrelevant. It is about, you know, what does it solve. What does it do. Does it work. Is there adoption. Does it make sense. And and and do you have the proper infrastructure to make it work in all these countries. And and you know that people are comfortable with it. Technology, if you talk to the corporates, you know, they couldn't care less about the technology whether to put is very black and white if it's an Excel sheet or if it's you know, a hyper ledger solution, as long as it release them from issues pain problems, it means up gets, you know, then they're open to it. So I'm also in our perspective, you know, our technology, you know, we are we're web based software as a surface, but I hardly talk about the technology when I talk to our corporates and our banks and all other clients around the globe. It is more about, you know, what does it do. And how does it help me in my day to day business. But as said, we were the first we we we still like to think ourselves of the Coca Cola of the electronic bill of lading. There are more initiatives out there and honestly, I only welcome that because you know, there is so much ground to cover globally. And, you know, the more the merrier from that perspective. Now, let me go more into you know electronic bills of lading. What is it and how does it work and why does it work. So, let me explain for those of you are a bit unaware maybe of what a bill of lading is what it is and how it how a paper one is different from an electronic bill of lading. So, a bill of lading in essence basically is a contract of carriage to, you know, enable a set of goods to be shipped from a to be the the shipper the exporter will then receive this document from the shipping company. Basically, it will has a few functions. So it's a contract of carriage. It also is a negotiable document if it's issued like that, which means that it can be used to be transferred to another party. It is also a title document. So that means it gives control of the goods. And that's why I said, you know, sometimes banks love to get a bill of lading from a client if they're financing because then if the loan is not replayed. So it's somewhat control by having the bill of lading and then they can, you know, exercise their right on the pledge and try to recover the lost, for instance from selling the goods. And it's a document that is being used, you know, widely, I would say for hundreds and hundreds of years all around the globe. So it's a very important document in trade, I would say it's for ocean going. It's the most important document out there and it's widely used. So what's the difference within a paper bill of lading and electronic bill of lading a few things. First of all, of course, stating the obvious it's electronic instead of paper for it to work you need this legal infrastructure for it to work you need to have a way to exchange them securely and have that tracked in a title registry. And that's what Bolero is all about. But also if you look at the bill of lading over Bolero you will see a few differences. The first difference what you will see is normally a paper bill of lading is issued in three original and a few non negotiable copies. The reason for that is, again, very old fashioned. You know, usually in the old days, one original used to travel in captain's mail, you know, with the captain of the vessel, he would have one copy. The client would present these other two copies usually to a bank for instance under a letter of credit, and the bank would send those documents in two separate meals to the other bank of the buyer and you know hoping at least one of them would make it to the end for the for the transaction to be used in taking it when are you looking at an electronic bill of lading. There's always just one original because it doesn't get lost it doesn't get delayed. So why have three copies it doesn't make sense. So this is one original. That's the first big difference. The second big difference is if you look at the paper bill of lading, you will see that people have signed it with a wet signature. Of course in a digital environment. It doesn't make sense to have an image of a signature, you need to have a digital signature from a Bolero perspective, again the legal infrastructure the rulebook covers the digital signature. Another question I always get. Yeah, is that digital signature is that in line with my local regulations in my country. I can tell you, often it probably is not the case, but because all the parties acting over Bolero have agreed to the legal infrastructure, which is based on English law. Then, if all parties agree to the rule of the game, it can work all around the globe, regardless of any local deviations or what have you. So the digital signature represented by words if you look at it on the image is covered by the legal infrastructure or the rulebook. The last main difference is that normally, if you would endorse a bill of lading so I would say you know this bill of lading is mine, but I'm now going to endorse it to Andrea in a paper scenario, I would put a stamp on it and I would say you know for me. And now to the order of Andrea in case of an electronic bill of lading that is done by updating this title registry this notary function. So you won't see an image of an stamp, for instance, if you look at the PDF file, which is official representation of the electronic bill of lady. Other than that, an electronic bill of lading looks exactly the same. So clients, if they see an electronic bill of lading they'll immediately recognize and understand it. The same front the same back the same colors, because of course it's issued by the exact same carrier that would issue a paper bill of lading. So, hopefully, in a nutshell this explains why a bill of lading is what is different between electronic bill of lading paper bill of lading, but actually the usage thereof is exactly the same as a paper bill of lading from a smart contract perspective and from and from a data exchange perspective of course there is also data behind it. Some carriers provide you know the raw data and XML format to us, some only provide metadata at a higher level, but of course these documents can be used in connection to smart contracts. They can be used as proof of performance, or for instance we can go as far as having a conditional release of these documents by saying, if a smart contract has been triggered correctly. Bolero will automatically release the documents from the seller to the buyer, so the buyer can take these documents and actually take possession of the goods. Those are a very interesting element we're now doing that for instance with the Marco Polo project, again a blockchain initiative where you know it's one thing to trigger a smart contract, but the buyer and the seller would need still need to exchange you know the documents or the title for instance in the background so that the other party can pick up the goods and clear them to customs for instance. So that's where you know we we introduce the element of a conditional release whereby we act as a call it an escrow or or a secure party that will then enable these documents to be automatically exchanged between the parties. Once for instance a smart contract has been triggered positively. Thank you for time. Okay, I do want to leave some room for questions so I'll go towards wrapping it up now. So what are electronic presentations. electronic presentations basically means that our clients. Again, I'm not going to repeat them all use these electronic documents. These are transactions, anything from open account to traditional trade products also like the collections that you all speaking about, but also blockchain transactions for instance like the the electronic lcs over over contour for instance. For those things to be able to happen. It's not just the fact that you need electronic documents or data, you would also need those transactions to be enabled to use electronic documents. These are all of traditional letters of credit for instance. They are usually used with paper documents if you want to start using electronic documents under traditional letters of credit, which is perfectly possible. Then for instance you have to change the rules, or you have to change. You don't have to change the rules, you have to mention that other rules apply. In the case of a letter of credit, it would be normally the ucp 600. But if you start to use electronic documents, you would have to say that the letters of credit is subject to the e ucp electronic rules for, you know, handling lots of credit. The same goes for if you want to start using electronic documents under collections. You would have to say that that collection is subject to the e ucp. So those are the electronic rules or the rules for electronic transactions for documentary collections. Again, these are all icc publications, especially the e ucp and the e ucp are available free of charge to download if you go to icc.org website, you can download them for free and then you can see what those those rules entail. Basically, you would have to make sure that those transactions are subject to those rules for it to work. Also, of course in those transactions you need to make sure that the conditions are in line with using electronic documents so you should no longer say that documents have to be presented at the counter of a bank at a certain date, because now you would have to say that these documents have to be presented over the Bolero platform at a certain date. And of course, you would have to make sure that the documents that are prescribed are no longer, you know, paper documents, not free thirds regional of bill of lading, but of course electronic documents and that's where we help our clients with templates with guidance, often with hand holding through the first transactions because it's not easy to think or rethink the way you have been doing your transactions for for decades I would say, and start using electronic documents or you know, even those those those smart contracts. And basically, so the what you would need is then a platform like Bolero to do that and this is not a sales pitch. I'm just trying here to explain how we work. So final slides, and again it's it's it's in the tech that you will be receiving after today. So going digital, whether it's you know just going paperless or whether it's you know moving to to smart contracts or or ELC's or or collections. There are benefits in it for all parties. Here you have the highlights from the seller's perspective from the buyer's perspective from financial institutions and from carriers. It's not that you know here is the solution have a go. Good luck. You also need to be able to help these customers on the journey. I often say that you know in trade finance digitization is is is not a revolution. It's an evolution. It is unfortunately a slow process. Also because there are so many parties involved. Not only it was just a buyer and the seller, but you have customs regulations you have shippers. You have the carriers you have the customs. There's so many parties involved, which doesn't always make it easy. But if you come in from a business angle, you know, you will succeed. So having said this and knowing we have, I would say a little over 10 minutes left in the session I would love to open it up for questions. So, Andrea I'm not sure how you want to go about the questions if you would like to have the questions in the chat or if we open the open up the sound for people to ask questions. I have a few questions that were, you know, given to me on the chat. First of all, you know, the actual we're talking about e-bills of leading, but you know, being both of us trade finance position is what about the rest of the documents which are usually required to be presented under normal collections, or in LC, you know that these calls for instance, insurance certificates or policies, the call for certificates of origins. What is the status in digitization in terms of these documents? Very good question. So let me come in from two angles there. So first of all, to trigger trade transactions, like for instance, a letter of credit, a letter of credit can be payable against almost anything. So a letter of credit can be payable against an unsigned invoice alone, if you want to. Of course, that is very minimal. So in practice, you see that, you know, a lot of documents are prescribed to be presented under a letter of credit. It's not necessary, but this is what happens. So what we see with our customers, what they do under the letter of credit, they, for instance, you know, they will of course always prescribe, you know, an invoice and packing these and waitlist what have you. They will prescribe an electronic bill of leading, of course, you know, as the transport document. So in supporting documents, what we see is that sometimes under the LC copies of these documents are presented under the LC. So for instance, a copy of certificate of origin or a copy of the fight sanitary certificate. The reason being that there are currently, I would say no global standards yet on these other supporting documents. However, however, however, we are very closely involved in those initiatives where it comes to electronic certificates origin, or where it comes to electronic certificates that say certificate mostly used in Agri. And we are working closely with, for instance, the Grain Council on that one as well. So, so there are things happening in that space. But it is still early days for all documents to be truly digital and globally accepted. So sometimes what we see, and that's also why I say it's an evolution, not a revolution to enable these transactions and I mean the underlying shipments to be affected globally. Sometimes some documents in a paper format have to travel directly between the seller and the buyer. Unfortunately, that is still the case for some jurisdictions or some countries. However, to trigger these trade transactions, you know, that can be done fully digital. So it's a split. Fortunately, maybe I can elaborate a bit more is what we see out there now is that and again, COVID-19 has been a big push there as well is that governments are opening up much more now to digitization. Just to give you one example, Peru in South America has said, you know, within a few months for any import or export going into and out of Peru, electronic documents should be the norm and paper documents should be the exception. So we see that things are happening. But honestly, it is a transition. It is a transition. The world is not digital yet, totally when it comes to trade finance. Absolutely. You know, you know what my thoughts are because we we often talk. I agree with you is slow one, but it will happen. You know, basically it's just a starter. COVID-19 just gave very spark to it. Definitely. And what I can tell you without mentioning the name, you know, one of our carriers between the month of March and April of this year. We saw a an increase of volumes of electronic bills of leading issued by the factor of four it quadrupled. So we saw that, you know, the companies. So I mean, exporters and importers moved to electronic bills of leading. We didn't see that exact same spike on the banking side. So that means that the banks are moving less quickly or are less flexible. Maybe I should put it like that to quickly move to doing more e presentations and handling electronic documents. So corporates are very quick to adjust and apply. And that also comes back to my statement at the beginning. It has to make sense to the corporates. So why did they quickly jump and why did these numbers quadruple in in April compared to March is because the paper documents got stuck at that time. And they thought, ooh, you know, these these carriers over Bolero can offer these electronic bills of leading. Okay, let's use that because we want to trade to continue. Absolutely. What I noticed is bank are very slow in reacting. Maybe they had investments in legacy systems. I don't know why but really they are stuck on traditions. They're two more. One is related to the bills of leading, of course, both of them actually. First thing is, what about the endorsement, you know, bills of leading shall be often doors, whether you're under a collection or under an LC. The endorsement is a very normal feature indeed for paper bills of leading, and it's also a very normal feature for the below Bolero electronic bills of leading. The endorsements are being handled and registered in this title registry what I mentioned. So the title registry. Once I would endorse the bill of leading to you Andrea. The title registry is actually updated with this endorsement and now it is very clear that I have endorsed this bill of leading to you. I would then endorse it to the next party and to the next party to the next party. Each time the title registry is updated. There's an audit trail of that. And basically it mirrors the paper process if you endorse a paper bill of leading three four five six seven times, you will see a string of stamps and signatures in a Bolero environment. You will not see those stamps and signatures actually in the title registry, you will see the endorsement trail, and you will also see who is the latest the latest party to whom the bill of leading has been endorsed. Basically, an electronic bill of leading anything you can do with the paper bill of leading you can do with a electronic bill of leading. Maybe if you permit me I would also like to explain very quickly that sometimes the chain breaks. So sometimes let's say Andrea you want to to endorse the bill of leading to Julian for whatever reason and Julian is not on Bolero, or for whatever reason you know doesn't want to receive an electronic bill of leading. Then you Andrea as being the last holder of this electronic bill of leading, you can request the shipping company, the carrier to replace the electronic bill of leading with a paper bill of leading that actually mirrors and replaces the electronic bill of leading. So if Julian for whatever reason needs a paper document, he will then have three thirds original bill of leading, which he can use for instance to clear the codes locally, because in reality, sometimes the chain breaks, and we have a mechanism for when if the chain breaks, that you can always go back to paper. It's not that you print it off yourself. No, you have to request the carrier to provide you with a paper bill of leading to replace the digital bill of leading. And that is also covered by the legal infrastructure is covered by the rulebook, and we see that for instance a lot in China, where sometimes you know the final buyer is not known until last minute or for any other reason. There is a mechanism to act and to handle if the chain breaks at some point, which I can tell you happens in reality. Absolutely so Joe. Just one more question from our friend Joel is, I read a good reading with an increasing number of e bill or if the e bills of leading providers. How do you see the e bill of leading landscape bulb. If each e bill of leading platform manages its own digital original document. If the role knows we function. How do these e bill of leading documents become possible across different platform. Very good. Very good question. Very good question. Of course, you know, being being the first 22 years ago that that that problem if I may say did not exist because we were the only ones and over time, you know, other players have come into the market and I said you know I welcome that because I often call it a blue ocean to stay in the shipping terms there's there's so much to do. Of course right now on the paper bill of leading of course you know you have the same issue right if a paper bill of leading is issued by one carrier, the other carrier country do a lot with it. But what is happening right now in the background which I think is very good is that all these parties are now talking to each other. Right now, again, this is a driver from the ICC, there is the digital standards initiative the DSI where we are talking together with these other providers. Okay, can how can we think about interoperability. How can we look into maybe you know, either synchronizing or connecting the legal infrastructure the rule books and stuff so those things are happening we are very actively participating in that as well. So I think over time, there will be interoperability. I don't think that there will be just one winner and that everybody will turn to that party know for whatever reason you know people will always select one or the other. But I think definitely the DSI that is just standard initiative now from ICC. I think one of the first sessions actually happened this week and interoperability is a key topic that's going to be discussed and addressed there. This is a very important question and I was planning to ask you to I mean from my side, what is the possibility if we have in some ways to compete with what is happening or to let's say reproduce what goes on in the material world and physical world. Interoperability is absolutely one thing that has to be fixed and possibility as well. You know our things work in real world from bank from corporate to the bank and to the other bank in the important country. That should be fixed. Absolutely. 100% correct Andrea. Any other questions from the attendance, gentlemen, Julian or Ross as well. No, I don't think I think we're coming very much to the end here now anyway right presentation. Thank you very much. The one question I add is you said that you're working with some of the blockchain obviously where this is about blockchain here. But I assume you're working with I know you're working with a number of platforms. How do you, how do you interact with the blockchain like the WeDoc trade, the DLT ledger? How do you interact with them? Very, very good question Julian. So basically what we do there is we enable the use of these electronic bills of lading under these transactions. So just to give you one example, maybe Contour is a nice one where the exporter can then pick up the Bolero electronic bill of lading and make that available for instance to the negotiating bank. They don't access the Bolero platform, they meaning the exporter and they meaning the bank. We are just a pipe in the background, enabling the electronic bill of lading to be used and enabling the legal infrastructures to be used enable the title registry to be used, and basically by means of you know API connectivity. Those documents can be used under these transactions for Marco Polo for instance we go one step further that's when I talk about you know this conditional release where not only we enable the use of these electronic bills of lading. Under these transactions but also we access sort of an escrow where you know if we hear back from Marco Polo that the Marco Polo transaction has matched that you know that everything is in order. We will automatically transfer the documents you know to the buyer and of course they need those documents so thereby reducing the concern of the buyer that hey my smart contract is triggered so probably I will get be debited, but you know how do I get my hands on the documents that we need to you know obtain the goods from the from the from the port. So, from our perspective is basically that's why I mentioned with you know EBL as a service electronic bills of lading as a service. That's how we connect to these these various initiatives and it depends on what the nature of the initiative is, is it a finance platform, then we enable for instance the function where you know the bill of lading can be pledged to a lender for instance as security for security. So, it depends on the nature of the of the initiative, how we actually interact but it's it's done by API connectivity. Okay, excellent. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for your presentation and so glad to have you here. Hopefully, we'll have the chance to hear from you again in the future, as we agreed upon. So, stay tuned guys and we'll have more insights from Yaco and Bolero in the future. Thanks everybody for attending. We'll see in two weeks time we're going to have one more very interesting presentation. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Bye Yaco. Bye Julien. Have a nice day.