 Think Tech Hawaii, civil engagement lives here. Welcome to Out and About on the Think Tech live streaming network series. I'm your host David Tosaka. This is my premier show and I'm delighted that you're joining us here today. We'll be exploring topics of all different kinds of things, organization, events, people and it really is going to be a lot of fun for me. As a disclaimer, any views or opinions expressed by me are strictly my own and not connected with any organization. Joining me in the studio today is my good friend Abe Lee. Abe is a realtor, developer, real estate teacher who has been involved in real estate in Hawaii for over 40 years. Welcome to the show Abe. Thank you very much. Tell us about your history in real estate Abe and how you got started. Well, maybe I can go back a little more than that. I was born in Korea and came when I was eight years old and my father was a professor of accounting at the University of Hawaii and my mother was a teacher in Korea but when she came to Hawaii she didn't speak English so she had to work in a pantry at the hotels chopping vegetables for a lady. So I went to university high school which is an affiliate of the University of Hawaii and graduated and then went to the University of Hawaii and I got a degree in Asian studies. No offense to Asian studies people but it's what I call a good for nothing degree until you get your master's or PhD. So I knew I wanted to go to work and so I thought, okay, what am I going to do after I graduate from college? Because that was expected of us. You know the Asian mentality, professor, teacher, parents. So I got a job selling insurance and I thought, okay, if I sell insurance and I make families rich when the people die into beneficiary or the insured but I thought, why don't I make some people rich while they're alive and so hence real estate and so I had a chance to sell life insurance and then to sell real estate. Then my agent for the insurance company said, oh Abe, you can't do both. And I said, oh I thought I was an independent agent and so I said, well then I'm gonna turn in my resignation so I went into real estate. So that was back in 1973, 74 when I got my real estate license. So it's been a few years. So where is your, what has been some of the things that have marked your career in real estate that stand out for you? Well, when I first started, I worked for a lady named Liz Baker who was in a Pan Am building and I'll never forget Liz because she was an older lady. Now I was 24 my due and Liz is in her 60s. So at that time she was ancient, right? Of course now I'm 70 and people think I'm ancient but so Liz sold real estate for her husband who was a developer. So the husband built the buildings and her company sold the units, projects. So I had a chance to do a project called the Canal House at the end of Kapahulu by Alawai Canal. And so it was a wonderful opportunity to sell units to first time home buyers. So that's how I got started in project sales. And I talked to anybody and everybody and said, hey, there's a project coming up at the end of Kapahulu, are you interested? And I was fortunate in selling eight units in that project. And I was I think number one or two in sales at that time. So I got the bug about doing project sales. Then I worked for a fellow named Bob Allen who did a Century Center, the tall building right at the corner of Kapilani and Kalakawa. And he developed a project called Century Executive Center but he also did Century Square, Century Center and Executive Center. So I got involved in real estate sales in project sales at that point too. So that was really a great opportunity for me to learn how to do project sales. Why do you think it's so hard for people to understand real estate and why does Hawaii have such a very low rate of home ownership? Well, okay. First of all, let's talk about the real estate portion. Real estate is not rocket science but it does take a lot of work and you do have to have some knowledge of what you're doing. Otherwise you could get caught in this problem of buying the wrong property at the wrong price, in the wrong location or whatever. So I think most of it is because there's lack of knowledge and about the people being familiar with the processes that go on. So in my pre-licensing course that I teach, I teach my agents or students how to go through the 25 chapters of the textbook and a lot of it has to do with law, with disclosure, how you will tie it to property, about different groups that are involved in that process. So in Hawaii, I believe we have a 58% home ownership rate. On the mainland it's 65%. So we're 7% lower. And part of the reason is obviously it's higher priced homes. Our median price is $770,000 right now for a house and a condominium is close to $410,000. And by the way, a median price is, if you have 100 homes, the 50th home, halfway is a median price. So you got half of the homes over $770,000 and half of the homes that are below $770,000 for homes. And of course for condominiums would be $410,000 or $420,000. So a young couple just starting out in Hawaii would say, wow, I can't afford a $770,000 home or a $420,000 condo. So that's a problem. People think that they cannot afford to buy a home. But what they forget is half the homes are below $420,000 and half the homes are below $770,000. So there is a market for what I would call the more moderate priced units. Of course they'd have to move out of town. They can't be in town. But in town we're lucky if you can find a house for under a million dollars now. That's a run down small lot, small house. What I call a termite palace. And so you have to move out of town to start but it can't be done. And so a lot of people think that they can't afford to buy a house in Hawaii. But they really can if they are taught the right process. I see that you've written two books recently and one of them is called How to Become a First Time Home Buyer. What is the beginning step if a person wanted to buy a home in Hawaii? Okay, well I'm glad you asked that. Let's say you're a first time home buyer, David, and you're about 30 years younger or 40 years younger. And you say, hey Abe, I'd like to buy a house. I have a process that I go through with my first time home buyers. And I tell them, let's meet at the office in front of a computer where we have access to the multiple listening service which is a super duper computer that shows all the homes that are listed for condominiums and single family homes on the island of Oahu. So we'll sit down with the client and we'll say, hey, let's look at what price range are you looking at? What neighborhood are you looking at? How many bedrooms? How many bathrooms? What lot size do you want? What can you afford? So that's the first thing we do. We sit down and talk. I also tell them that we need to meet face to face so that if we can, unless they're a mainland buyer or something, but if they are in Oahu, then we meet. And I say, the reason I want you to meet is because I want to see you face to face and see if you like me. Because if you don't like me then you shouldn't work with me. And the other is I want to meet you and see if I like you. Because if the personality doesn't match then we shouldn't work with each other and they should go find somebody else. So that's the first thing I do. I meet with them. And usually I like to have both husband and wife at the meeting. So once we meet, then it's the first time buying, I tell them to go to the Hawaii Homeownership Center. And Hawaii Homeownership Center is a nonprofit group and they teach people how to prepare for homeownership. And because they're a nonprofit, they have no vested interests in the customers coming to get their nine hours of lessons. And they're part of a national network called NeighborWorks. And NeighborWorks is a nonprofit group funded by the federal government to help nonprofits get started in each region. And there's over 200 regions in the United States. And Hawaii Homeownership Center is one of the two that are authorized on Oahu or in Hawaii. So I send them there. And then they get to go through nine hours of classes and they get to listen to realtors and I volunteer teach there. They get to listen to a guy named Dale Tome who's the education director. And then they get to meet loan officers and realtors, et cetera. And then once they finish the nine hours, they're assigned to a consultant or counselor. And that counselor will sit down with them and work out a budget and say, okay, what can you afford? And let's look at your credit report. Let's look at your credit score. How can we improve your credit score and improve your credit report, et cetera? So once they are done with the nine hours of classes, then they'll come back to meet. Then we'll meet at our office again and now we have an idea of what prices they're looking at and they kind of have an idea what the credit score is like and all this stuff. So then we have a chance then to really look into how should we go about buying this home of yours? And I have a story that, in fact, I wrote it in the book and I don't mention their name. It's a young couple and husband and wife. Wife didn't work. Husband was a sole breadwinner and they had three children. And so they come to me and says, okay, we like you. We want to go through the H-H-O-C, Hawaii Homeownership Center. So they did and they came back. And so I said, okay, how much can you afford? And he says, 130,000. I said, did I hear you right? 130,000 is all you can afford. And this was about five years ago, all right? So I said, okay, let's go on a computer. It looks to look up properties that are 130,000, 140,000. I think there are maybe three or four units available and they're all on the west side, like Nanakuli, Bailei, Waianae, et cetera. And I said, you know, I know you didn't want to go to the west side, but that's the only choice you got. Are you interested? And they said, yeah, I guess so. And it was a four bedroom, one and a half bathroom. Now mind you, it was a townhouse and it was what they call a short sale, which means that the seller owed the bank more money than the properties want to sell for. So they're going to be short, I don't know, 10, 20, 30,000. So we had to get the seller's bank to approve the purchase. And the seller's bank said, yes. So we got our contract accepted, but it took the bank for the seller a year and a half to finish the paperwork. And I'm going, you kidding me? We got this deal in escrow and my clients were waiting for a year and a half to buy this property. In the meantime, they had their fourth child. So they had their fourth kid and they finally moved in. And that was about five years ago. So I wrote about them in the book because they were a true example of patience and they knew that they had to start somewhere and then they knew they had to go out of town. And guess what? They called me up last year. Yeah, last year and said, hey, we're ready to move up. Can you help us find a bigger place? Not a bigger place, but a more expensive one, closer to town. So in a five-year period, they have moved up from 130,000 and I think they qualify for about 400, 420,000 now. So it gives them a lot more breathing room and latitude. So that's one of my, what I call the stars in my book. Wow. That's quite a story, Abe. And I can see you have the heart for helping first-time homebuyer. Okay, we're gonna be coming up on a short break. I'm David Sasaka and this is out and about on the Think Tech Streaming Network series. We're talking about Abe Lee, who is a realtor, developer, real estate teacher who has been involved in real estate for a long time. How's that, Abe? Yep, over 40 years. We'll be back in a minute. So stay tuned for more of this story. Aloha, my name is Mark Shklav. I am the host of Think Tech Hawaii's Law Across the Sea. Law Across the Sea comes on every other Monday at 11 a.m. Please join us. I like to bring in guests that talk about all types of things that come across the sea to Hawaii, not just law, love, people, ideas, history. Please join us for Law Across the Sea. Aloha. It's that I can play, so any chance you play at all. That's my life, I love music. So we do it. Hi, I'm Ethan Allen, host on Think Tech Hawaii of Pacific Partnerships in Education. Every other Tuesday afternoon at 3 p.m., I hope you'll join us as we explore the value, the accomplishments, and the challenges of education here in the Pacific Islands. We're live. I'm David Tasaka with Out and About on the Think Tech streaming network. Talking with Abe Lee Realtor, real estate developer, all around Guru for the real estate people in Hawaii. Abe, tell us more about your journeys in helping people get their first home. Sure, I'll be glad to. Well, the reason I'm so passionate about this and the reason I volunteer as a committee member for the Hawaii Homeownership Center Development Committee is really, it's kind of intertwined. When I first got our first home, this was in Salt Lake City, Utah. I was in graduate school and the money that I made from that project that I did at Canal House, that gave me my down payment for a house in Salt Lake City, Utah. So we bought a duplex and we lived downstairs in a basement and we rented the upstairs, which was a bigger unit, to a PhD candidate and I was a master's degree candidate. So our mortgage was, I think, $200, if you can believe it. We bought it for 36,000 dollars, right? So once I finished my grad school work, I came back to Hawaii and we sold that house for $50,000 in Utah, but when we came home, the cheapest home was $70,000. So there's $20,000 differential and there's no way we could afford it. So we rented and we had three children by the time we had to move out of our unit that we're renting and by there was a basement in a house, way in the back and our neighbors were the flying bomber cockroaches. And so every night I'd have to go out and shoot, specialize and kill 10, 20, 50 brooches because my wife didn't like brooches. So we were asked to leave and we're basically going to be homeless if we didn't find a place. So my wife would call and say, hey, we're looking for two-bedroom, three-bedroom in town and is there a place available? And almost all the owners and property managers would say, how many children do you have? And we'd say we have three and they said, you can't fit in a two-bedroom, you have too many kids. So really a two-bedroom, we could squeeze but they said, no. So every day this happened and our deadline was getting shorter and shorter. So one day my wife called and this guy says, oh, come down, we'll let you look at it. And five kids, five people in the family, no problem. I'm like, whoa, so we go down there, it's on a corner of our limo street in Lucitana. So that's coming down from Roosevelt High School by Punchbowl and you hit a T. And at that corner there's an apartment building, a walk-up. And the manager happened to be a priest who had fallen in love with a nun. And so they gave up the vows, they stayed in the church, gave up their vows and had five or six children together and they're the property manager. So they said, three kids, no problem. So they rented us the place. And I tell you, it was a blessing because if we did not get that apartment we would have really been homeless because we had to move out soon. So I still remember that couple, how wonderful they were and they actually gave us a chance to rent the unit. I told my wife at that time, the next time we move we're gonna be in a house. I will not subject ourselves to become tenants again. So there was a real motivation for me to buy a house. Well, I helped develop a small piece of property on Lunar Little Street between Peacoy and Pensacola across the post office, right next to Freeway. And my client had six homes, five little cottages, about 600 square foot cottages and their house was in the back and their house is about 1200 square feet. So they asked me if I would help them find a developer because they were in financial trouble. And so I looked for developers and I heard their presentation and I thought, gee, I think I can do better. So like a dummy, I said, no guts, no glory. So I said, hey, why don't I do the development for you? And I don't know what I'm doing, but I'd like to help you. So they did, they were very nice and they trusted me and they allowed me to develop their property. So we condominiumized the six homes. Now these are single family homes, okay? And as my consulting fee, they gave me $50,000, which is twice as much as what I made as an accountant at Deloitte Haskins and Zell back in 1979, 80. So with that 50,000, I said, can I buy one of the homes and the lot? The lot, mind you, was 1400 square foot lot, the land area and the cottage was 600 square feet, 60 years old. So we tore that house down, got along to build a house with the 50,000 down as equity. So we built the 1400 square foot home, 700 square feet up and down with a 1400 square foot lot with one parking stone. That was our castle, our first home in Hawaii. But you know what? That saved us, because we finally had a home in Hawaii. And by then I think we had four children and we're able to call this our home. And then subsequently we moved to Manoa once and then we moved to Manoa twice. And where we are currently is where I'm gonna die. Because it's our dream home basically. And so we've been very, very blessed to have that opportunity to create affordable housing. So my goal has always been, as I developed real estate, to do affordable housing for first time buyers. And I would rather, no offense to others, but I'd rather sell to first time home buyers to be able to help them get started in Hawaii home ownership. And that's been my passion for the last 35, 40 years. Wow, that's great. Tell us about your new book and books now, two books. And I've been a bit involved in it. Sure, well thanks to you actually. I was able to publish the books with your help. But what happened was we talked about how can we help people and get the word out. So I teach a class on first time home ownership and what happens in buying a house, the mortgages and the finances and all this other stuff. So with your encouragement, I wrote this book and it's how to become a first time home buyer. And then you said, hey, we can put it on Amazon Kindle and it's gonna be really cheap, $2.99. So I thought, wow, that's great. And then I found out that you can have a print on demand as well as Amazon Kindle. So I asked you about that and we did. And so hence we got the book. And so we're very fortunate. How to become a first time home buyer is a one. I'm sorry, I'm biased on this. It's a great book on how to get started in buying a home in Hawaii. And the book was written so they could be actually used nationally. So some of the things that I talk about in the book like say the mortgage credit certificate, which is a wonderful concept put up by the federal government. So if you buy a home and you get this MCC credit, then part of your interest is a tax credit off of your tax return. And the other balance is a tax deduction. So if you understand the difference between a tax credit and tax deduction is a big difference. We talk about that. I also talk about the obstacles to becoming a homeowner. I also talk about what they call a FICO score. There are two software program engineers. They figure out a way to predict what's the chances of someone defaulting on a loan. So we have that portion in there. So we've got lots of stuff in there about the first steps in buying a home, how to deal with a loan officer, how to deal with a realtor, how to do with banks, mortgage credit certificate, government grants and loans. I also talk about VA and FHA financing and also USDA financing. Now people don't know too much about USDA financing, but it's the US Department of Agriculture and they let you borrow money 100% nothing down. If the home that you buy is in an outlying area where the population is less than 20,000 people. So not too many people know that, that that type of financing is available. Of course, they know that VA loans are available because VA, anybody that's a veteran, can borrow money with nothing down and 100% financing. So when people say I can't afford to buy a house, I tell them, there's nothing down programs. There's also the FHA program that's 3.5% down. So you don't have to have 20% down. You can do it for way less than that. So I think the people need to be more educated and hence I wrote the book based on the continuing education course that I've been teaching for several years and so far the response has been very positive from the students that have read the book. If you were to give a potential first-time home buyer one piece of advice, how can they get started in the process? First, I think you have to have a desire because if you don't have a desire, then you're not gonna do it. And my suggestion is to meet with a really good realtor that is concerned about your welfare as willing to work with a first-time home buyer. Now, some realtors will not because they are going after the high end but there are a lot of realtors that are very good that are concerned about the first-time home buyer and that's what you should hook up with. Meet with them and see what they'll do for you. Second, I highly recommend that they go to Hawaii Home Monitor Center and get educated so that they can then go to the nine-hour class and by the fee for that is $60 one-time lifetime membership fee for you and your family and the extended family. So it's really inexpensive. So go through that program because they also have government grants and loans sometimes that are available only to Hawaii Home Monitor Center graduates or what we call the NeighborWorks affiliates. So there are programs out there that actually help. So that's the second. And then of course, a third is come back and meet with the realtors and see where can I buy. Now, I had a young couple, another couple. I met with them, they went to HHOC, came back and said, okay, we're ready to buy a house. So he said, we're looking for a three-bedroom house in the pro-city IAEA area under $450,000 because that's what they qualify for. I said, okay. So, and I won't tell them that they're dreaming. So, because I knew what the market was like. So they came in the office, I put them on the multiple listen service and I said, okay, IAEA pro-city $450,000 or lower. And guess what, one house showed up on a computer screen. All right, just one. So the couple said, oh, maybe we gotta go out further, huh? And I said, well, I don't want to tell you that but I think you may have to. Eventually they ended up in Makakilo and they bought a place for $320,000 for bedroom. So it was within the budget but it had to be about 10 miles out further out than what they wanted. But they at least had a start and were able to buy in. So we need to work with people from the very beginning and help them to get acclimated to the sticker shock of prices being high and then be able to be realistic about what they can afford. So if someone wanted to find out more information, can they contact you and meet with you like how that couple did to get in? Yes, I'd be glad to. Like I say, my passion is to help first-hand home buyers. So they can call me anytime they want on my phone. That's 216-4999, 216-4999. Or if they go to ablyseminars.com, which is my school, at the bottom you'll say contact us at my email and my phone number should be there. At least my email is there. So either email me or call me. And by the way, I have wonderful agents in my company that most of them have gone to the Hawaii Home Ownership Center. Because one of my goals is to have every one of my agents go through HHOC as a student, as an agent, so that they're familiar with the program. And we have wonderful agents that have gone through the program and are start supporters of the first-hand home ownership program. Okay, brings us to the end of my first program with my special guest, Abe Lee. See this program and all of new adventures every third Monday on Out and About on the Think Tech Network. Aloha everyone. Come back and see us again. More and more adventures lie ahead. Thank you for watching. And we'll see you soon. Aloha.