 The process to alter Nigeria's national revenue allocation formula has begun. Benres State Governor Samuel Autumn is now advocating, you know, a change in how revenue is shared amongst the federal government, states and local government. We've invited a public affairs analyst, Mr. Nik Aguli, to shed more light on this with us. Good morning, Mr. Aguli. Good morning. Thank you for having me this morning. All right. I want to lay out the facts, first of all. Presently, Nigeria's allocation formula is 52.63% for the state, for the federal government. And we also have 26.72% for states and 20.6% for the local government areas. Now, this formula is what has been in use since the 90s. So do you think it's time for a review or we're just fine? Thank you very much for that question. To be honest, my view is that we should not even be talking about revenue allocation because where is the revenue coming from? The revenue is derived principally from the oil, gas and the Niger Delta and taxation being raised from federally collected taxes. And we shouldn't have this in the bottle economy where the two types of government, the state and the local government, are looking up to their mother, the federal government, to breastfeed them every month. I agree that if a mother breastfeeds children, it gets to a point where the children are able to print for themselves and are given 60 years old. And we have this state that have been existed from 60 years, from 40. I think the youngest of our state should be like 30 years old. How can a mother keep breastfeeding a 30-year-old asset? This democracy that we copy from the United States of America, there is no revenue sharing the federal government of the United States. We want to copy a system of government that unfortunately and tragically too, we decided to copy what they said or copy right. The United States don't share revenue. Though Biden does not share revenue to any governor or county in the United States, they generate the outlaw revenue. It will interest Nigerians to know that in the United States, who is the most pressing with copy, it is the state and local government that send money to the takers. I'm not the other way around as you are practicing. In Nigeria today, we owe the 36th place of the federation and the FCP. Every state has been endowed with enough retortings that if the governor and local government are not lesbians and they look in words to unlock the value embedded in their state, nobody will be talking about looking to have been there for money. This is my view about this matter. Mr. Agole, since we currently have the current format that we're working with until we're able to achieve a change in format and let states now start to depend solely on what they can generate, I want us to first of all look at what we currently have closely. Why does it feel like regardless of how much these states get every month, it's still not enough to achieve what they need? Because they still are seeking more funds. You still see states lobbying for loans from outside the country even. You still see states seeking grants to finance themselves better. In 2020, a state like Aquabomb received about $146 billion from the federal government. The Delta State I think received about $186 billion from the federal government and it still doesn't seem to be enough. So would you say that this is because of mismanagement of funds or the state really just needs more money to be able to function? This is the brutal truth. The brutal truth is that there is no state in Nigeria that depends on federal allocation that is going to develop. It's impossible. If you check what is happening, when the federally allocated funds get to the state, the state, state money government and state officials make a way with what we do that and that is what is happening year in, year out, year in, year out. We are having expectations of development, having expectations of state government working, having expectations of state vector schools, vector health care, vector roads, better working, coming into our homes and it's not happening. And it has not happened, look, we started this current democracy in 1999. So from each state, they either have their state governor or in some cities they support governor. So you have city people who have come into the governor, depending on federal allocation, they make the best performance, every year they make budgets to see the state are not developing. I mean it is said that it is only a madman that can't do the same thing and expecting different results. The state simply needs to use what is coming from the center to unlock the values that they get in their hospital. You spoke about Governor Atom. And Governor Atom is my governor. I am from Benire, but I tell you that the biggest resource of Benire State is the fertile land with a good climate to match. What has Governor Atom done to unlock value in the agricultural space in his sixth year in office? He does nothing. He drives around, he looks at the fertile land, right parallel, but he doesn't track it. That is where the money is. Because if Benire mechanizes and begins to cultivate their soil, money will be coming from the United States to buy food, will be coming from Europe to buy food, from Australia money will be coming from all over the world into Benire to buy food. And that is why we will be talking about government having enough money to develop the state. As long as auto-carrying is on the cashier, going to the federal government to get allocation to my pay salary, salary that is going to be paid, his oil salary, his oil pension, his own contractors, you can see that this money is not going to be enough. So in 2023, Nigerians have to look carefully. Any candidate standing for the position of governor or local government chairman, or even Nigeria as a champion, that has no idea as how they will look in what to generate value and develop their state, you give them a vote and the same situation is going to continue. So we're discussing today. Mr Agouleh, I need to ask you this question. Do you think Nigeria's current political structure allows for such autonomy of state? Or do you think we will need that restructuring that we all keep talking about? Let me answer your question in two parts. Yes, Nigeria needs restructuring. I want to admit restructuring. I mean that the federal government has to relieve majority of the 68 items on the exclusivity of participation. The federal government should not have more than eight items on the exclusivity. What should be on the exclusiveness should be defined, foreign policy, economy, like currency teaching, because we have to issue one currency. Those are the kind of things that should be on the exclusivity of Nigeria's constitution. The rest of the items on the constitution should be devoted to the state and local government. These are governments that are closest to the people. When we come out there, the federal republic of Nigeria, it's a scam. We are not running a federal government. When we run a federal system of government, we are running a unit three system of government. So how can we come out there to a federal republic and we are in fact not running a unit three system of government? So as far as restructuring is concerned, that is my mind about it. But let me now answer your second question. You are saying even in the current structure, at the state's handicap, in terms of unlocking value in your state, because every state in Nigeria like I said is black. Is it that they have land for the culture? They have mineral resources in the ground to be taxed or they have poverty potential? Nigeria is black, all around. Can the state unlock value even with the current culture that we have? The answer is the capital years. Well, this question is what stops the government from mechanizing that the culture of Nigeria? Nothing, nothing. The federal government will not stop him. Nothing stops him. He has all the powers to kill the soil in Nigeria and bring in value from countries are not coming to buy food. So pounds, dollars, everything will be coming to Nigeria to buy food. That is one of the problems we develop in the state and give a price to every other state in Nigeria. Mr. Agole, you mentioned earlier that in the next elections, citizens should or they electorate, should look out for governors or candidates who have ideas that can unlock these potentials. I wanted to quickly also mention that these ideas are very, very many and campaign promises can be sweeter than sugar sometimes. But it's what happens after they get into power that is next. So I want to get your view on what makes governors in Nigeria so lazy, what makes them get into that position and completely lose interest in internally generated revenue and looking out for ways that they can boost that revenue. And how can they electorate and show that they don't continue to allow such characters get into office? I want to thank you for the word you have used, lazy. And that is exactly what these guys are. These guys are lazy. All the governors and local governments in Nigeria are lazy. And the reason they are lazy is because there is a big mama of the federal government who is preceding them every month to the federal allocation committee, sending the billions of Naira monthly. Look, after I'm here, if I was guaranteed that my father would be sending me a check of 10 million every month for all the days of my life, I could probably know what, I could probably not do anything to generate the income for myself. And this is what is the problem. That we copy the most person from America, but we are running it in our own way. If you buy cars, you have to rent a car in a product with the manufacturer specification. You can only buy a car and the manufacturer will try to move forward and they try to pull down. This is what is happening to Nigeria. We copy the democracy that the local country should generate revenue and take to the center. Our own is that we are now using the center to pay money to the center local government. The opposite direction is from the work for us. Is it that we go and start our own system of government? But if it is this America or we either oppressing the way the Americans are doing or we are lost, take the second part of your question. How do Nigerians know we meet up with their promises? 2023 taxes are coming. We have so many people in my state, by the way, we have more than 100 individuals that have come forward and they want to be governor. How can they electorate, see if they are betraying, don't also have their eyes on their location and don't also really want to follow the case or looking around. The simple answer is the electorate needs to look at a degree. They need to look at track record. They need to see what the people have done in the past, what the people have done in the past and what their promises are. They don't want to make us or something around anything. Who never had the track record of what anything successfully is what we still have in our head. You know that that man is not going to do what he doesn't have. That's why we need to look at what these candidates have done in the past. There's enough history for them to use. Ms. Agulay, I want you to just quickly remember and apologies that we're moving away from the discussion on states and now talking about the electoral process. But I think that one of the challenges is the fact that we have a similarly flawed electoral process and you know if you do not get you know parties picking the right candidates you can't really make this selection that you're referring to because it's really who is on the ballot that determines who gets voted for. So there is that but even after the elections you know when these you know people get into power there's still the need for people the citizens to be able to make stronger demands of their governors. The people of Benway state should be able to remind Governor Tom of how much he received from the federal government you know in 2020 and since the time that he's been there and also how much he's been able to generate as internally generated revenue since the time that he's been in that position and remind him that he has absolutely no excuse to be demanding more money when he is not been able to show working. I thank you very very much for that question. What you are saying is actually up. You see democracies have pillars. These pillars must be great to support democracy to run very well and one of the pillars is the sanctity of the electoral process. You also have the independence of the judiciary. You have the rule of law. You have the independence of the three arms of government. The executive administrator, the judiciary. Without this ingredient democracy is going to work. And this is why each of the problems and I mean we're discussing today was discussing economy. What's this economy on what if the electoral process is not producing the right managers of the economy. I mean this is why it is that president want to worry. The portfolio industry bill and the electoral bill. The president has to pay attention to the portfolio industry bill. Why is he not paying attention to the electoral bill so that we can show a better process. The economy we are. Those who don't have anything to offer, they have only their eyes of better location. From becoming a proper local public chairman or even the president. The main power point and that point is if the electoral process is as it is. This is governor's and little government chairman or even president. The citizens have been given the most power in the constitution to checkmate those elected to meet them. Natalia has a unique situation where we are in the democracy of the nation every two years. In the four years cycle, we are left people, they are not governing well and we are hoping for the best election. The constitution has provided us the power to follow through the governor's process and to participate in the democracy director. There are two governments. You have the executive, the legislature, the judiciary and the people. We also address another matter. Granted that the electoral process is strong and the president is developing concrete concerning a new bill. If we come to point it with the choice and president Boopari has not attended the new electoral bill into law. What options do we have as a Brazilian? We have two options. You see that we sit at home, not come out to vote or we come out to vote. Unfortunately of someone sitting at home, we only ensure continuity of the misgovernment that we are all trying about. The only hope that we understand of something changing is if Nigeria comes out to vote, not to vote. There were 30 million votes in 2019 presidential election. What if we have 50 million, 90 million that didn't poop out in 2023? To show that we are aware of the process, we just need that they deserve. So when people sit at home, they expect change. Change is not going to happen. So even at home as the electoral process is, it means there's been chance for us from the current trajectory that we are all. And Nigeria is going to approach, register, get the voter card to be ready for the party in 2023. Okay, Mr Agoule, at the beginning of the show, you mentioned that the focus of states should be on revenue generation, right? And you mentioned sources of that generation, which should be oil and non-oil sources, including taxation. So I want us to take the example of the River States case. So River States actually took the FIRS to courts, basically challenging who had the constitutional duty to receive a VAT, value added tax in the state. And the courts actually favoured River State government, saying that they have the right to collect taxes. But just yesterday, we have a statement from the FIRS, Director of Communications, warning residents of River States to continue to pay their taxes to the FIRS or face penalties because they have gone ahead for a state of execution on that matter. So really, where does this leave us? Where the River State governments want that judgment? And it all seemed like, oh, this is something other states should emulate. So states can go ahead and generate revenue internally, collect their taxes, so that they can be able to do the things that states should do for their citizens. But now that we have a case where the FIRS is challenging that judgment, appealing that judgment, where does that leave us regarding revenue generation for states and allocation? Let me answer your question in two parts. The first part is that we are running a democracy where the rule of law has to be supreme. So the River State government has won a case. If indeed the FIRS has got a state of execution, they've got a judgment for a state of execution, the judgment of the lower court. Then, River State individuals will have to obey the ruling of the court by continuing to pay taxes to FIRS. But if FIRS is yet to get that state of execution, it then means that the judgment of the court as obtained at River State is complete. And River State individuals will be breaking the law with the continuing pay taxes to the FIRS. So that is one point. The other part is that, what is my view about states collecting their taxes? And my answer is yes, states should be collecting their taxes. You see, in a normal situation, where there are some states in the north, you know, they have state, they have sharia, they will not allow the sale of cigarettes, alcohol, things like that. Okay? When you have it in the cloud, my legos, rivers, alcohol, they are selling alcohol, cigarettes, and all those things. And the VAT that is being generated from the state of alcohol is coming into a central court, held by the FIRS, and then the FIRS now divides the VAT. It gives it to the state in the north. Who thought I love the state of alcohol? How does that work? Who kept me in the progressions and things like that are happening? So every state should be empowered to, I mean, VAT is a consumer tax. If you go to the United States, from where we copied the democracy, it is the state of local country that collects consumer tax. It is the state of local government. You don't expect the state government to pump down and be collecting small, small things that are consumer tax. We should have a state government that is, that is really ubiquitous, ubiquitous, like different foreign policies, and those kind of things. So a reverse state government is right in the state that they are taking. We believe that that judgment should be successful in all the states of the federation. Let all the states do it if they are local practice. That's my view on this. All right. All right, Mr. Nika Guley, Public Affairs Analyst. We appreciate your perspectives on the program this morning. Have a great day. Thank you everyone. Thank you. All right. Up next, we'll be taking a look at the ranking of universities in Nigeria side by side her global counterparts after the break. Stay with us.