 The debate is raging on once again. Are Indians considered Asian or not? Let's find out. Andrew, it is very rare that a comedy sketch sparks an international discussion, but that's what happened when Ronnie Chang made a joke on The Daily Show about Indians not being Asian. Now, and since then, there are so many other videos and so many clips and so much debating and so many comments that happened since then. Guys, we're gonna go through them. We're gonna talk about it. Maybe we'll try to come up with an answer at the end. So please hit that like button and check out other episodes of Hot Pop Boys. Let's run the clips. It's the new prime minister of the week, Rishi Sunak. And I know everyone is really excited that this is the first Asian prime minister, but let's be clear. Indians are not Asians, okay? Okay, there's still people, great people. They're just not Asian people, okay? No, no, no, answer me this. If this guy is Asian, how come when he became prime minister, I felt absolutely nothing? I mean, when I was down at Dim Sum Palace this morning, me and the fellas were like, oh, shit, that's me up there. I feel seen. I love how Indians try to have it both ways, like being Indian and Asian. Pick a lane, okay? Yeah, I bet if I show up in a Bollywood film, I'm just gonna blend right in, right? Because all just one people is having a good time. Yo, Ronnie went in on this, and I'll tell you this Andrew, this sparked like 300, 400,000 comments, internet comments globally. I'm sure at Asian student unions at all of the colleges, they were heated debates. There was like just like a lot more that came from this than you would expect. Yeah, I mean, it was a really funny bit, but obviously the reason why people are talking about, and that's why you have so many comments from India is because the Daily Show is such a global and international show. Ronnie and Trevor are both international people. So when they say it, it even means more than just like Americans debating it. And since this clip came out over the past four weeks, bro, there are so many other internet channels that have responded or made videos asking Indians in India, if they're Asian. And I think it's actually more of a legitimate question in Asia because more of the AAPI, sort of like, I don't wanna say, you know, Wokey groups in America, they were more like, oh my gosh, what Ronnie said is a threat to unity. And like, but then people at India were like, no, let's have this debate. I think it is worthy like that. It's always been on my mind. Guys, when we're talking about identity and we're talking about how people feel, I mean, guys, this is the season to do it. Everybody's talking about it. So let's have the conversation. And I think it's, like you said, Andrew, it's interesting because people in India can speak English as one of their main languages. So it allows the internet comments to be representative of a way that they feel in Asia that like no other Asian country could do. Let's see some responses from India. Do you personally see yourself as Asian or Indian? I would prefer to be as an Indian. First of all, Do you personally see yourself as Asian or Indian? I would prefer to be as an Indian. First of all, I'll say I'm an Indian and an Asian afterwards. Specifically Indian, but Asians? Indian, and I feel proud to be called or known as Indian. I think I see myself as an Indian. If any foreigner would call you Asian, would he be offended? Not really, because I am an Asian. I am a part of this continent. So I wouldn't be offended. I don't think people would think of us as Asian. They would think of us as Indian, but that's their ignorance, right? But it makes sense because they're in Asia, so why call yourself Asian while you're in India because you're already in that country? So I get it that that's why there's a rift between the Asian Americans who want to use a unifying term in order to feel together because we're a minority. Well, I would say select Asian Americans have that, I guess more, and that's not right or wrong, that political agenda. But I'm saying it makes sense because you're only 6% of the population. You want to feel like you have a stronger group, so you try to find the similarities. Okay, we all go to similar schools. We have similar passions as far as academics, right? Okay, we eat rice, take off our shoes, and we enter the house. We all have old traditions. Them subjects. Right, so you unite on that. And I'm not saying that there's not actually similarities. I just think in India and in Asia, like if you're in Japan, yeah, I could see Japanese people more even saying like, well, you know, I am Japanese, but I am Asian. Yeah, what you're referring to is more about the context that you're living in. Obviously, in a Western context, everybody's sort of different from the dominant group in America, which is represented by Anglo-Saxons. But like, I don't know, it just shows you that context is everything. All right, this is a clip of an Indian American comedian who is actually against using the term South Asian and just wants to use Indian. Word to him. Ronnie, I'm with you, brother. I've been saying this for almost 10 years now. I am Indian. We are Indian. Why are we so afraid to use this term? Indian, Hindu, there's nothing wrong with that. Okay, there are 1.3 billion of us. We don't need a cardinal direction. That's what's up. Chinese, Japanese, Korean, they're not calling themselves East Asian. We're the only ones who will put a cardinal direction on 1.3 billion people. Why do we need this kind of permission, okay? I mean, I could see why Rajiv said y'all is a comedian by the way. He does, he has a very funny way of just speaking, yeah. David, what do you think about what he said? He said, Indians need to own up to being Indian and not need to say South Asian. But I guess my question is what about like Bengalis in Pakistan, they should just go by their country and the nation name too? I don't know. Yeah, I think later in the video he says use Desi as the unifying term. I mean, I agree that, you know, I think that being Indian is different enough from being I guess like a Mongoloid Asian because of the separation of the Himalayas. I totally see where he's coming from. But my only thing is like it's hard to fully expect just because Indians self-identify like as Indian, right? That everybody else in America is gonna give them the nuance of identifying them as their own continent. I guess, you know, his point was a little bit confusing because he's like saying a lot because he's like, yeah, we are Indian and I don't like the term South Asian and then we are Hindu. But if you're not Hindu, then just say you're Desi. But here's the only thing is it's like it's hard to expect Americans because Americans sort of like the prison tribes, you know, black, Latino, white, Asian. Those are the only ways they see it. They only want to see four. They want to group people together. Yeah, they would see four major prison groups because that's how it's grouped. David, David, you don't listen. I only got enough space in my brain for four or five categories max, all right? If you try to make it 12, 13, fourth I'm not even gonna address you. Yeah, because not everybody is like an educated comedian in New York City where you've probably got like 200 different colors in your mind, right? Other people gotta think about other things. Yeah, your average American is painting with the most basic crayon package you could possibly buy in elementary school. So I think that's the only aspect. He would need to address the mechanics of how you're gonna get everybody in America to refer to you as Indian or Desi over being part of the larger Asian subgroup. Yeah, by the way, he was saying that a lot of East Asians don't use the term East Asian. I'm actually okay with using that term. I think that's a term that maybe people could use more if they want to instead of just saying the specific country because the East Asian cultures are very similar, right? They're more closer together. So I guess like South Asian also includes the Bengalis, Pakistani, Sri Lankans, et cetera, et cetera, right? The Desi countries, right? Yeah, the Desi countries, you know, the brown countries, the people who... But then he said don't use brown either because he said Latinos have brown. Well, I don't know. You guys let me know. I get where he's coming from though because I think that Desi people came to America. It's one of the most like recent groups to come in large numbers to America even more recent than East Asians or Southeast Asians. So they're more like thinking like, should we use the predetermined terms or should we try to just forge ahead with our own? All right, moving on to the next clip Andrew, this is actually from another Desi comedian. Yo, this application doesn't even have my ethnicity. All right, I'm just gonna put other Indian. It says Asian right there. So? So you're Asian? No, I'm not. What is this? Asia? And what is that? India? So you're Asian? Do you just keep a map of Asia with you? That's not the point. I'm just saying when people say Asian, they think of you guys. What do you mean you guys? You know? What the fuck? I'm just saying the East Asians kind of hijacked the word. Oh, we hijacked the word. That's ironic. What the fuck? I think you're wrong here, man. Okay, watch this. Hey, Phil. What's up, man? Okay, so I was walking down the street and I saw this Asian guy today. All right? Okay, what are you imagining? All right, I gently look him up. Thank you. Exactly, see? All right, I'll see you later, man. Oh, man, you know, I was really impressed by this comedy sketch, and that's why it has like, you know, a half million views because it dressed a lot. It like got into, you know, larger stereotypes about people thinking that Indians are more like Middle Eastern, possibly, you know, more, I guess, terrorist jokes. It was talking about how Asians are always identified by their squinty or the slanted eyes or whatever like that. The mongoloid eyes are possibly the monolids. And of course, they left it up to the black American guy who's just like, I don't know, man, you look like Jet Lee, that's real good. Yeah, I mean, I think what the point is is that a lot of it is context. I think in America, right, we want to focus on the similarities. We want to focus on our parents being strict. You take off your shoes, we all eat rice. We all want to get good grades. We're academic focused. But yeah, there are a lot of cultural differences. Religion, look, I mean, phenotype, the Himalayas split us up like, whatever, right? And kind of Nepal is kind of like this blending part in between where... Bhutan as well. I saw this really interesting comment and this was from Indian. And he was like, you know, it's very complicated because North Indians are Indo-Aryan or mixed with Middle Eastern genes. The South Indians are Dervidian and then mixed are the Northeast Indians who are mongoloids are also mixed with those different bloodlines because India is a very diverse country with a wide variety of face structure and skin color. We resemble almost every single ethnicity that exists in Asia. So he was saying that India's in a very unique sort of position. And I will say this, I did hear an Indian comedian friend tell me one time, we got Indians that could pass as white. We got Indians that could pass as black. We have Indians that could pass as every single type of Asian in Asia as well. And then of course you've got an overall, I guess what you're thinking of a classic Indian Dervidian look which could be anywhere from like darker to lighter. Right. So what if you're like a very East Asian looking Indian person which there are essentially East Asian bloodlines in India. So nationality-wise you're Indian, you speak Hindi but then you like look Chinese. Right. So it's complicated. So I guess, yeah, I guess what would you say? Like, I guess anybody commenting like, what would you put? But obviously at the end of the joke, they were bonding over, you know, stem subjects, strict academic standards from the parents, rice, probably, you know, taking off your shoes, things like that, and leches. All right, next up, Andrew, we don't have a video. We actually have a meme that went really viral on Reddit recently, Andrew. What is it trying to say? All right, so Asians according to Americans are Korean, Thai, Cambodian, like Mongoloid East Asian looking people, right? Like people who kind of look like a version of us, David. Oh man, why'd they pick the thug for Cambodia, man? Ah, they put Filipino under John Cho. So I think they're just throwing it around. I mean, all of these people could be Chinese, to be honest. And then on the British side, you have mostly desi-looking people. Now you have, like, more, I guess, lighter skin. Almost more of a Middle Eastern desi mix look. And then they do have one, I guess, Oriental guy. I heard, Andrew, that the older people in England, maybe like above 60, they would refer to them as Oriental. Yes, bro, I was working in LA once, and there was an older British lady. She called you Oriental, right? They came to the store, yeah, and then she told my co-worker that she was looking for me. She goes, yes, I was talking and speaking to that Oriental man. And then my co-worker comes back and is like, hey, that lady just called you Oriental? Like, is that race? That's pretty racist, right? And then I thought about, I was like, I think she's old school. You know what the interesting thing is, Andrew? Oriental, I believe, was also used in America. And that was a more specific term because you would probably only say that East Asian people or that look, Southeast Asian or Oriental, even though I heard even like in the 1400s, the Middle East was the Orient. It's because you could get a Persian rug. A lot of these terms even changed. You know whatever Asia was or whoever invented that term, Asia from the Greek or the Latins? Like that wasn't always referring to East Asia at the beginning. Yeah, you know why it was? But it was like, because Iran was there, right? And Iran was still the end of the Silk Road, so they still were getting silk and all this fine china. So that's like, I could see why the Western-Western people got confused. It's almost like Asia for a while was more Western and then we're like Asia, Asia. That's where we're from. Yeah, that's the Orient-Orient. What is he? To you. Well, he's a man. No, ethnicity. What's my ethnicity? What's your ethnicity? Like, what would you call people that look like them? I would say you're in the Asian market. I just need to understand a thing. So you're ordering a hooker, right? And your description is, I want an Asian girl. And then something that looks like him shows up. Yeah, with a beard. And at no point are you like, what the fuck? Are you doing him? How do you say the Asian that we're all thinking about? I'll just say Asian and just roll the dice, bro. They love Daniel. Do you guys identify as Asian? No. That's what they called you in Texas? No, they call me different things. They just became Indian. What did you start as before? What do they call me in Texas? They called ice on me in Texas. OK, so this was a pretty funny clip from a flagrant podcast, Andrew with Andrew Schultz. Basically, he's asking KSI, who's British, what does he consider Akash? And he was like, you know, something in the Asian market, which is a really funny British way of something like something in that zone. Right. And then Akash goes off to say, and Akash is Punjabi, by the way. He says, we don't identify as Asian. I actually found, and by the way, guys, don't crucify me, internet. I'm just saying what I noticed. I noticed that Northern Indians, specifically Punjabis, are less likely to call themselves Asian than someone who's South Asian, from way down South Indian. You know what I've got to say? I feel like that this is a conversation that South Asians or Indians need to have even more, I guess. That's why I guess the comedian Rajiv was talking to the Indian market and his Indian fan base about it because I think it's an internal conversation because I think there's a disagreement. Some people say there's a line between North Indians who are more potentially Anglo or Aryan Indian, right, mixed with everybody up there. And then there's a line that's drawn or an invisible line. And then the Southern Indians are more Dravidian, which is generally like darker skin, like Aziz and sorry. Yeah. I mean, like I said, guys, we're not Indian experts about the Indiosphere. That's just what I know. But that would be an interesting internal debate. So like I think terms that I think are useful nowadays and maybe these are too many terms. You let me know in the comments down below if you guys are like, ah, I don't want to be too exact or yeah. And all this talk is already getting confusing, man. I'm going back to the four colors. Hey, Billy Bob, I can't believe you even watched as much of the video. But like terms like Desi, Daisy, Desi, and then Pan-Asian, which is like all Asian. So maybe in America, you're like, I'm Pan-Asian American. I relate to everybody. There's East Asian, which I'm OK with using Southeast Asian, of course. And then there's Anglo-Aryan Indian, which is a new term that people started bringing up a little bit more Dravidian Indian. You know what I notice is like on subtle curry traits, they use curry as a bonding way to bond all South Asians. But I totally understand why they wouldn't. They probably would not want people outside of the group identifying them that way. It's almost like, you know, in Asia, you can identify with using I guess like chopsticks and rice, but you wouldn't want other people to identify you that way. Yeah, well, you know, I think this brings up a conversation of like, what are you willing to take from outsiders calling you that, right? Because within the group, you can say whatever you want, you can go hard, make fun of people. Yeah, because it's all in the family. Yeah, you can know, yeah, it's all within the family. You can talk about hierarchy. But then when people on the outside who are perceived to be on the outside or actually are outside. Yeah, because your imagine just walking by, hey, it's little curry traits that people would be offended. Yeah, and then they're like, what are you talking about, man? You can't say that. And then I'm like, I'm from India, man. I'm from Eastern, Northeast India. What if I said that, like, I'm from the Assam region, you know, Chinatown, you know, I've been there. This is a clip of Asian boss asking Indian people to respond to the Rani Chang clip. This time where he's coming from, because if I see some person who doesn't look like me become, get into a power position of authority, I won't really relate with him. I relate with Rishi Sona because he looks like me. If he didn't look like me, I probably would not relate with him. So I don't really mind this. I think it's funny. He made a joke and I think it's a good joke. He's a great comedian. He's playing to the American stereotype of Indians versus Asians. In America, you think of Asians as East Asians and you think of Indians and Pakistanis and Bangladeshis as Indians, right? He's just playing to that stereotype. It's got no global context. I don't think any Indian should ever worry about it. And I actually think it's a funny joke. He's quite hilarious. So when you travel overseas, have you ever been called Asian by foreigners? Or do they call you entirely different? I haven't been called Asian. I've been called Indian, in fact. Yeah, I mean, I think that that guy summed it up pretty well. In America, people sort of use Asian as a substitute for the word, I guess, mongoloid or oriental because those words are like, you know, even though they're very specific, the connotation has been negative at point. So those are like outlawed words to use. But it is true that the term Asian is way more amorphous and way more vague because it's more wide encompassing. And that's what's causing the confusion. So that's the dynamic that Ronnie was joking off of. Yo, how weird would it be if like white people or black people started coming up to us and being like, hey, you guys are a mongoloid, right? That would be funny because we use this term amongst ourselves, at least amongst people who are into this type of anthropology, biology talk, right? And like, you know, culture talk. But like, if you had an outsider just coming in like, yeah, you know, East Asian mongoloids, yeah, right? And then I'd be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess. Yeah, well, it's because the term mongoloid for a while, I guess like a hundred years ago was used to describe people with Down syndrome or like, I don't know guys. To wrap this up, David, what is the answer to the question, are Indians considered Asian or not? Okay, so we just watched a bunch of videos with their opinions, right, Andrew? But I actually did some scientific research. Okay, so here's the funny side. This random Korean guy just wanted to say, listen, if you can do basic calculations without a calculator, to me, you're an Asian. That's a funny way of saying it, right? Like that's bonding us all together. Like you said, Andrew, as long as you can just do the basic arithmetic. Something to bond us, yeah, okay. But then I read this other thing that said it really has to do with the Himalayas. India is certainly part of Asia. However, there are different geographical and physical constraints that also led them to have a different cultural development in India. Even though there was the passage of Buddhism through the Himalayas from Nepal over to, obviously, East Asia and Southeast Asia, there's different political concerns. There's different countries that we think about. People in India are much more likely to think about the Middle East than people in East Asia or Southeast Asia are going to think about what's going on in Britain and the Middle East. So there's, yes, but it's also different. That's the answer. Yes, but Indians are definitely Asian, but it is also different due to the Himalayas and just more interaction with other groups. You know what my opinion is, and just speaking from an American standpoint, being around other Asians in America, it's like when you have a common goal and you wanna align yourselves politically and get something done, you team up as Asian. We're all Asian. We are from Asia and we do share similarities. We are fighting discrimination at the Harvard Emissions. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, my Asian brother, our kid, they studied so hard, but they said they got too many Asian at Harvard. It messed up. Yeah, don't worry, man. The Hindus are being discriminated against too, man. They don't wanna explain the venue fruit. They don't wanna explain that. And I think that when you wanna get something done, you team up, but internally, you all know each other's different. And I don't think that the two communities, if you wanna call just the Asian community, one community, right? And then the Indian community or South Asian community, I don't necessarily think they mix as much as they could, but I think at the end of the day, just takes time. I think India has a lot of conversations to have amongst themselves too, because they have a lot of different shades of each other. Yeah, I think it's a cool conversation. Like we said, I don't know the answer. The answer is yes, Indians are Asian. Using the term Asian, but there probably should be some more specific terms, Andrew. What terms could be better? Because Mongoloids out, you know, Daisy or Dravidian, that's gonna be tough to get people to use it. Oriental's out even though nobody wants to use the word chinky, because that's like- How about this? How about this? If you're Indian or brown, but you know how to use chopsticks and you drink boba, you're Asian. If you're Nikki Haley and you're Punjabi, not Asian. What about countries like Cambodia and India? I mean, I'm sorry, Cambodia and Thailand, where they've got a pretty decent amount of exposure to the Indian sphere, where they have Hinduism and things like that. Yeah, I mean, I think people like Tim Grover, who is Punjabi, he might just consider himself Indian, and not Asian. You're saying Nikki Haley and Tim Grover probably do not see themselves as Asian. Would they even more specifically consider themselves just Punjabi? Yeah, it's possible. It's possible based on what I know- I'm not speaking for them. I'm just saying that these two people do not look like typical Asian Indians at all. Yeah, I mean, listen guys, I think that this discussion can go on forever and that's why it's a fun discussion to have. But at the end of the day, it's all love. You know why the Ronnie clip went viral? Is because Ronnie gave an answer to this. While a lot of people don't want to give the answer. That's the joke is that Ronnie had the answer. The truth is it's complicated, but of course it's funny. Yeah, much love to everybody guys. Like we said, we're just trying to review the clips and just do some basic research off Google. I don't know. You can identify as anything you want, man. You know, at one point in history, the Japanese, they didn't really want to call themselves Asian. They just considered themselves Japanese. Yeah, it's still to this day. I would say the older ones definitely do not want to. Mix with everybody else. We are not Asian. I mean, it almost has to do with like the separation from the pack. I would say like Japan and Korea, obviously they have a certain level of like success. That other Asian countries don't fully have. I know Singapore is very rich as well, but they don't maybe don't have like the sports teams and stuff like that. So it's like, it just has to do with like, how much are you with the group or how much are you feeling like you're elevating beyond it or how much are you treated different? The last thing that I would say that is my major takeaway is you really have to look at these like really interesting British colonies in Asia, whether we're talking about Singapore, Malaysia, Hong Kong. You know what I mean? That's really where you saw Indians and Chinese mix. And maybe to some extent the term Asian in America, whatever that means, it's just not that serious. Yeah. It's not that serious maybe. Cause it's such a broad term and encompasses everybody. So anyways guys, let us know what you think in the comments down below. Thank you so much for watching. We are the hot pop boys. And until next time, we out. Peace.