 Okay, good afternoon and welcome to the journey toward racial equity. So for our online audience, if you're sharing about us through your social media channels, please use the hashtag WEF22. And please note that both the folks here and our online audiences can get involved in the session by submitting your questions to the panelists via the Slido app. And hopefully we'll have about 10 minutes for Q&A at the end of the session. Okay, onward. My name is Cheryl Dorsey. I'm president of Echoing Green, a global social innovation organization. I'm also a member of WEF's Global Alliance for Social Entrepreneurship and a number of WEF groups that are centering racial equity and equitable recovery efforts. So we all know that tomorrow marks the second anniversary of the murder of Mr. George Floyd by a Minneapolis police officer. Millions of people took to the streets around the world, including me, during a summer of uprisings, hopeful that this time, that this murder would finally stop the killings of black and brown bodies and force a true racial reckoning. So the question is, what good came from these protests? So in my country, the United States, some states and local municipalities, indeed, past or instituted police reforms, money poured into Black Lives Matter, as well as other racial justice organizations and black institutions, space was created to examine the racial inequities exposed by the COVID pandemic and also expanded to highlight the horrific rise in implications of anti-Asian attacks. When we look at the numbers, over 66 percent of S&P 500 companies issued public statements about their efforts to promote racial equity. The largest companies in the world pledged upwards of $67 billion towards racial equity. And many people began their own personal journeys to reach out across difference and become more actively anti-racist. There was increased understanding even about what racial equity is, right? It's a process of eliminating racial disparities and improving outcomes for everyone. And the underlying aspiration that when racial equity is finally achieved, race will no longer factor into or determine one's socioeconomic outcomes. But two years on, where we are today, from my perspective, the opportunity for true transformative change in my country and globally, I believe, has dissipated. Why do I say that? We're not only seeing a reversal in course on issues like police reform and the right to protest, but also there's a growing backlash against things like even a full and accurate teaching of racial history. There are multiple crises that have overtaken the headlines that the war in Ukraine, inflation and fears about alluming global recession. Companies represented here have shifted to managing the war for talent, the important return to work and remote first workplace conversations and tackling global supply chain issues. And interestingly, as of January of this year, by some measures, only 1% of the $67 billion pledged toward racial equity by the largest companies in the world has been dispersed. Only 22 Fortune 500 companies fully cover race and ethnicity in their ESG reporting. And when you look across U.S. companies, there are more than 48,000 open jobs for directors and vice presidents of DEI. So we've got a stellar panel this afternoon to dig into these issues and discuss what progress businesses have made or not on these promises two years later and what must be done to help businesses attain the goal of racial justice on the job in society. So I'm going to welcome quickly my panelists and we're going to dig in. From my far end, welcome Pam Chan, who is the Global Head and Chief Investment Officer, Alternative Solutions Group of BlackRock. Next to her, we have Winnie Bianema, the Under Secretary General of the United Nations, an Executive Director of the Joint UN Program on HIV, AIDS, and a Co-Chair of the UN's new group, Senior Africans Group. And Madam Secretary is going to tell us more about the initiative when we get to her and last but not least, we have Alex Liu, Managing Partner and Chairman of Kearney. So welcome you all. And before I jump in with questions, let me just say I do believe at the end of this session, this August group can help me push back against, as James Baldwin said, my wise desire not to be betrayed by too much hoping. So we've got a lot riding on you all to just help us look better about the state of the world. Okay, so I'm going to actually start with an old-fashioned survey. Can you raise your hands, including our panelists, if you think corporate attention to racial justice issues is being sustained? Raise your hand if you believe that's the case. Yikes, okay. Can you raise your hand if you think the attention to racial justice has dissipated? Okay, for those of you joining us online, the preponderance of hands that were raised thought that we are not paying enough attention to racial justice issues. So Pam, I'm going to start with you. Can you continue to set a baseline for us? What is BlackRock doing around DEI? And how do you see yourself as a change agent helping your company address these issues and drive progress? Wonderful, thank you, Cheryl. I'm so honored to be on this August panel, truly unqualified to be beside all these panelists. So first I would say that we are very proud to be one of the founding members of the West Partnership for Racial Justice in Business, which I know Kearney is as well. And so hopefully more and more attention there. I actually, a baseline is actually the word I took out of your question, which is what is our baseline? It's our purpose, right? And our purpose is to help more and more people achieve financial well-being. So I'm an investor. I'm the Chief Investment Officer of our investment team. And so normally I focus on the financial well-being, what returns am I delivering for clients? But I think the more and more people, it's actually just as if not more important than the latter part of our purpose. And so when I think about DEI within the four walls of BlackRock, we think about it on three levels. One, we think about talent and culture. That's both from our representation, career-paving, as well as how we create a culture of inclusion. And we did 1,000 inclusion dialogues that our Chief Diversity Officer, Michelle Gads and Williams, is an incredible force just for good. Two is in our role as a fiduciary in how we manage money. Some of you in the audience actually may know we have an impact opportunities fund in the U.S. that seeks to accelerate positive economic outcomes for under-capitalized communities, Black, Latino, Native American, but do so in a way that's not just diverse own companies, but also the assets and enterprises that support those communities in a way that creates collective wealth for both our clients and those communities, which I think is super important as we think about the economic opportunity of really investing. And then lastly is really policy and social impact. So whether that is engaging with our companies in which we're a shareholder on board diversity or from a social impact perspective, I'm very proud to say that at least from the social impact grants that we committed to in 2020, as of today, we are over 60% deployed. And by the end of June, we will probably be at 90%. So we're almost done. Not done this first stage, right? Not done done. So those are some of the elements that I would lead with from a baseline perspective. And then as Mia's change agent, I think it's a couple of things. One is I'm very proud to be leading that impact opportunities fund, first of all, which now we're getting to about a billion dollars just to give you all a sense of scale. And two, I think it's really just being a role model in the room. There are very few women of color who are CIOs of businesses that look like me in all respects and also having a culture of inclusion, which I think just means acting that way yourself. So that's what I would say. And I so appreciate the specificity, Pam. That was terrific. Alex, I'm going to ask you the same question. Well, sure. Thanks. I think for myself and for the companies that I touch, the clients I serve and the company I lead, I very much appreciate that perspective, which is to you want to be effective, you want to be authentic, and you want to pick up the pace. You know, I do believe in the role model example. I tell my own story. I share my belief system. I share that with other CEOs. I share that with the communities, the communications, et cetera. So I think it's very important. I have the power of appointment. So one issue is representation. How can you belong in a company or a community if you don't see people like yourself, however you define that? So that's something I've tried to pick up the pace on. In terms of leading a people-based business, we're a global business. We catch all religions, states, countries around the world. And there's a lot of intersectionality involved in this topic. It's not just one race or even just interracial. It is how do you create a culture of belonging? It's not just about statistics and intentions. As you said, we've got to move to outcomes. And we track that. We measure that. We file a report, much like public and private companies do. We're proud to hold ourselves to high standards. In executing that, I've tried to communicate. It's not just about the statistics. It's also about a culture of allyship. Being empathetic about who other people are, where they're coming from. Because as you say, as a journey, in any journey, people are different starting points. There's fear, there's anger, there's gratitude. There's all kinds of emotions. So I try to make that a key part of it, which leads to a culture that you can be proud of. Now, specifically, some of the things we've done, we've brought in, for example, our recruiting to different sources of talent. My father taught in historically black colleges and universities his whole life in the South. Great universities under resourced and under recruited at. We're doing that. We have diversity boot camps to bring in people to involve and educate them on consulting. And when people join, we actually have a program of further sponsorship. So we give them internal mentors. We call them an internal board of directors to give them advice on how to navigate some of the things they may not necessarily know. And of course, representation at the most senior levels. We have a program that we sponsor for black entrepreneurs. We call it a venture boot camp. So we like have a mini Silicon Valley sort of shark tank or whatever the analogy is to give them advice on how to build a business from scratch. Because these are folks that may not have had the same type of opportunity. So those are some examples of that. I think creating a culture of belonging and measuring that, asking people, do you feel like this is a just place? Do you feel engaged? So it's a lot of things that need to happen. And I think, you know, proud to be part of that in some small way. Well, again, I also appreciate the level of specificity. And also as the daughter, proud daughter of two HBCU grads, thank you for raising that as well with your dad. So Madam Secretary, we're sort of civil society, governmental representatives on this panel. And global audiences can be quick to write off racial equity as simply a US issue. But we both know and all of us know that that isn't true. And we know it has global relevance in applying a racial equity lens outside of the US and it just requires a different way of thinking about it. You know, it's interesting in some European countries, for example, it is actually illegal to collect data on the racial and ethnic identity of employees. Can you provide us with some perspective on the global nature of the racial equity conversation? Thank you. And good afternoon, colleagues. I really want to start by thanking Pam and Alex for your leadership in your organizations on this important issue. And to also start by saying may George Floyd and the victims at Buffalo rest in peace. So and it's good that we're having this conversation on the second anniversary of the killing of George Floyd. But I'm feeling that there's something wrong here. Look at our panel. Don't you think something is missing? I mean, we are black and brown people here. The people with the privilege who practice the racism are not here. Something is wrong. So yes, in the global space, there is racism and we must tackle it. It's been with us for 500 years. It was an idea and ideology created to justify an economy of slavery. And it has stayed slavery ended, colonialism ended. But the idea, the ideology has remained and we have to remove it, fight it, take it out of its tuitions, out of our minds. Now you talk about the global space. Well, let me put it this way. Racism is not only when black people or brown people cannot breathe because of police violence, which we talked about. Racism is when black people, brown people, people of color, take their last breath because of policy violence, policy violence. When they are denied life-saving, pandemic-ending medicines because they live in majority black countries or brown countries, when they can't access care, education, because debt is choking them, what would you call that? That's racism. I want to take one issue, a recent one. A year and a half since the first doses of COVID were delivered, 75% of the people in high-income countries where, which are predominantly white, are fully vaccinated. But only 13% of people in lower-income countries, mostly brown and black, are vaccinated. 75, 13, wouldn't you call that racism? Well, you might not. You might say it's greed and profit, but let's examine it further. The companies that have this life-saving technology, health technology, have refused to share the rights and recipes with countries in the global south. OK, you could say it's greed. But what about their governments who put hundreds of billions of dollars into the innovation, who are not leveraging that money and bringing that technology so that others can produce for themselves? Isn't that racism? South Africa president Cyril Ramaphosa has called it vaccine apartheid. That's what he called it. The UN Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination called it, I quote, a pattern that replicates slavery and colonial-era racial hierarchies. It's not me. The UN Committee has called it that. President Ramaphosa has called it vaccine apartheid. So let's name it. Some global policies, some global rules, embed racism in them and have outcomes that are racist. Africans were told by the pharmaceutical companies who refused to share their technology that the vaccine was too complicated for Africans to make that that's why they were not sharing it. Is that not racism? When antiretroviral treatment was discovered in America, this treatment was available for people in the North, in Europe and America. People living with HIV could go on this treatment and live longer and happy lives. People in the South continue to die, particularly in Africa. 12 million people died unnecessarily for 10 years as people demanded and demanded for this treatment, the price to come down, to be made cheaply in countries like India and Brazil, 10 years later it became available, but 12 million had died. Was that not racism? And this is embedded in the trade rules that allow a company to hike a price, create an artificial demand, and people die. So we are seeing racism embedded in global policies and it's not addressed. And I'm not seeing here the businessmen and the presidents who should be here listening to this. I'm seeing people who are like me convinced that there is racism. So anyway, today, my last point, there are new treatments. They are called long-acting HIV medicines. This is the area I work in. They've just come on the market. In America, you have people taking this injection that keeps them from acquiring HIV for a couple of months. So they don't have to take a daily pill, but they can take a job. This treatment is also coming for this long-acting medicine for treatment is also coming soon. You will have an injection that can keep you healthy for maybe four, five months. You don't need to take tablets every day. But these are not going to be available for people in Africa where the majority of HIV people living with HIV live for girls and young women who have no access, fear actually, the society condemning them. So they fear stigma. They would need this job to stay alive. Gay men who are criminalized in many countries in the South would need this injection because then they don't have to be seen taking tablets or appearing at clinics often. But it won't be there because it will be priced by this company and there's no government telling them that we need this for other people. So I just want to say that there's much to do at the global level in the global rules to remove the racism that's embedded there and that I applaud what companies are doing at the company level, but they should also join us to call for global policies that don't allow companies to hoard something that's life-saving. Thank you. Well, Madam Secretary, that was brilliant. I was closing my eyes and I could sort of hear the words and the writings of Ibram Kendi stand from the beginning. The idea of racism and where it comes from and your mantra was that not racism. It's just brilliant and beautiful and heart-wrenching. But the power of the Secretary's words, that's a form of accountability, right? That is the velvet hammer that we need more of. And so I am certainly grateful to you. And now let's turn to accountability and transparency and what it means for business leaders like Alex and Pam. So we've seen a lot about racial equity audits and how they're gaining traction in companies, right? You've got self-assessment tools like WEF's partnering for racial justice and business initiative, or there was a recent report by Laura Murphy who led audits at companies like Airbnb and Facebook sort of summarizing the rationale and codifying the 10 principles for doing them well, or I think in many ways, the gold standard policy links, CEO blueprint for racial equity, which a lot of B Corps are using, Airbnb, Starbucks, Facebook, State Street, Uber, to name a few, committed to proper racial equity audits. But during the last two proxy seasons, many others were pressured to do them and avoided it. So for example, Citibank, which made a billion dollar commitment to racial equity when asked to do a racial equity audit of the whole company, they refused. So Pam, coming back to you, BlackRock did commit to a proper racial equity audit. Can you talk about the company's rationale for this and the importance of transparency and accountability and its impacts on business structure and culture? Yeah, I wanna come back to one of the points that Alex said that we're on a journey. So I think while we're proud of the progress that we've made to date, we acknowledge that there's so much more work to be done. And the reason why we signed up for the third party racial equity audit, which is actually ongoing as we speak, is so that we can identify the places where we can be better and so that we can build on what we've already set out. So I think it's really being honest and understanding that we're on this journey and how we can ultimately improve. And it's not until you actually, and as Madam Secretary, as you described, it's only when you actually look at the stuff that's kind of ugly that you can actually fix it. And so that's really been the rationale for why we signed up for that. I would also say making DEI and creating inclusive culture part of our performance reviews and compensation processes. And that is with all credit to the leadership of the firm really standing behind it and saying that this has teeth. This is not something soft that is a optional ancillary activity. This is key to how we run our business, how we build our people and how we deliver for our clients. Thank you for that. And Alex, as a follow-up, you've written and spoken quite a bit about how we engage business leaders to set new global standards for racial equity. Can you please share more with all of us? Well, I think, to Madam Secretary's point, I think it's important to have- Winnie, please, okay, fine. The courageous conversations because these are tough conversations. And I think the people that are underrepresented here, they're overrepresented in other ways. And I think the important thing to me is not the minimum needed, which is the accountability, the communications, the role modeling, the telling the story, why I believe, a lot of fellow CEOs do that. It is translating that power into the middle of the organizations, at least in the private sector context, because that's where the power is. This is about power. Yes. Who holds it? Absolutely. Who's in the room? Absolutely. Who's deciding on election decisions, promotion decisions. Who's funding it? Yes. Who's paying for it. And I think what I would like to see happen is, aspirationally, the leaders of companies like myself and others, clients alike, is to have that reality. It's not about them and their intentions and commitments and pledges, which you mentioned quite well, they're underdelibered on. Why is that? And also not the next generation of folks, many represented here, who think that what we're doing is not bold enough or fast enough. I agree with that. But the problem is in the middle of the company. That's where power is. And I think breaking through that very now, who do you promote to be in the middle of the power? And how are you resourcing them? Are you actually role modeling, et cetera? The final thing that I would say, and maybe this is more of an aspirational point, to me, the minimum standard is, here's our numbers. Yeah. And they should get better. And it's not a straight line, it's a journey. But I look at it, not DEI, but ABC. Allyship, belonging, and culture. Allyship, we have a digital program where we have people go through it to be certified. Am I a good ally? Do I know what it means to be on the other side of anything? And we measure belonging. Every quarter, every few months, et cetera. Do you feel engaged? Do you feel this is a just place? Do you feel that you can be yourself? Because being yourself should be good enough. In my company, in other companies. And then it leads the culture. That is just culture. That is equal, global. That respects history and doesn't shy away from it, but also wants to take action and make it a better place. The theme of this place here, too. As well said, ABC, allyship, belonging, culture. Sort of listening to each of you talk and was sort of listening to this idea of, as Winnie said, who is not in the room and why it matters for these kinds of conversations. And then sort of measurement conversations that business leaders like Pam and Alex go through to hold us all accountable. And it was interesting in getting ready for this panel. Last week I was talking to an amazing social innovator, Anu Gupta, who founded a company called Be More America. He's a leading expert on the science of bias. And Be More America is a really interesting ed tech company that works with organizations to break bias, right? It's a data-driven approach to doing it. And they have found that a daily mindfulness practice, if racism is an idea, which we know it is, a daily mindfulness practice, that in addition to all the benefits of reducing stress and anxiety and burnout, when you target it to transform the mental habits of stereotyping, turns out to be the most promising intervention to enable behavior change on issues of race, right? So this notion of what are the sorts of innovations the bright spots around sort of breaking down structural racism. And Winnie, I'd love to turn back to you globally, what you see, how do we fix this? Share some more with us. Thank you. I think the starting point has to be that those who experience racism have the space and the psychological safety to speak their truth. All these policies, workplaces, whatever that are driven from the top and that are not coming from those who experience racism themselves and led by themselves, I don't have faith in them. I'll tell you a story. I was leading an organization called Oxfam International and we were decolonizing ourselves. And we had a meeting of our country directors, more than 90 of them in India. And I thought I had a good idea and I said, we're talking about increasing the number of country directors who are black and brown. We're talking about decolonizing. Why don't we have a working group? We're going to have four, five working groups. Let's have one of just people from the South, country directors from the South, from Africa, from Asia, let them give us their views. And then there was panic. He said, but you are dividing us. He said, no, no, no, I'm not dividing us. We have five working groups. Let's have one which is purely people from the South. Let's hear what they have to say about southernizing and decolonizing. So they agreed. When the time came, me and an Indian woman, we sat and waited for the southerners to come. Came one man who was from Eastern Europe. And we said, this is the southern group. And he said, yes, but I'm southern too. He said, no, you're not. You're from Eastern Europe. And he said, but I feel southern. It's not how you feel. So he had to go. Then came another woman. This woman was British. And she came and she sat with us. And we said, this is the southern group. And she said, I am southern. Said, why? I've worked all my life in the South. How can you exclude me? Said, if you're not excluding you, go join group one, two, three, four. This is for people from the South. But the southerners went to group one, two, three. They didn't come. They didn't feel the psychological safety to identify and to speak their truth. We had to go and pull them from there and say, it's okay, come and talk with us. And when we presented our reports, it was interesting that all the groups said the same things, the same aspirations of this global organization that must be equal, that must have no racism. But when it came to practical suggestions of what to do to achieve it, it was only our group that said, we want quotas. We want to set a quota and say that by this year, we will have one third of our country directors all from the South. That time we had only like 20%. You know, we set concrete targets. The other groups also talked about the same things, didn't set targets. So my point is that when policies to route out racism are led by the people themselves who feel it, then it happens. When it is driven by others who feel for you, they may feel for you, but they will not feel and drive with the same passion and commitment as yourself. So that's my point. Well, preach, Madam Secretary. That's all I have to say. Yes, yes, I would give you a mic to drop if I had one. So it's just all good. This panel is spectacular. And it was gonna go to a third section, but I want to open it up to questions because you've got a really incredible group representing some really important perspectives with deep knowledge and credibility on these issues. So raise your hand, I'll call on you, and then please ask your question. Yes. Do we have a mic? Yes, thank you. Thank you. Thank you to the four of you. I'm actually, I don't know. I'm Arab American and specifically Palestinian American. And if you are American, we have a census and the census actually doesn't have a box for us. So it comes down to also policymakers, right? And exactly what you're speaking to is in the private sector, of course, but the policymakers in our government, they're making decisions for the underrepresented minorities to your point. There is no speaking our truth, right? Bottoms up or tops down when you don't see your representation or when you don't have a voice within that space. So that happens, I'm sure, everywhere, but that's kind of the comment I wanted to leave and if you had any thoughts on that as well. Please. Anyone like to jump in? I agree with you. Yeah? Okay. Yes. Indidi, I see your hand up over there. Thank you so much. My name is... My name is Indidi Munele. I'm a social entrepreneur from Nigeria. This has been an excellent panel. Two questions. One to Madam Secretary. One of my biggest frustrations, and I'm sure you share it, is the lack of diversity at the top, especially in development organizations such as the one you lead. What are some concrete steps that we who are not in those roles can take to support this equity and inclusion? Because, as you've said, representation matters, but they're just too few and we can count them really on one hand. And that's the first question. The second one is an issue that's near and dear to Cheryl and my heart, is funding flows. And Bridgepan has this great report on funding in Africa of the $9 billion that was supposed to be allocated to Africa, only 6% went to local organizations. We also see of the 10 startups that got funding in Kenya in 2020 only two are Kenyan. So we're even facing bias in our continent where funders and others are prioritizing foreign white founders to black founders. What can we do? And maybe we can hear from Chan to shift funding flows to ensure equity and to drive the economic transformation required. Thanks. Great questions. Do you want to start with your first question? Winnie, you want to start and then we'll go to Pam. Okay. You raise an important point that within our global institutions, intergovernmental, like I, that at the top is still predominantly white. And that even though many people are coming in who are black and brown, they're still in the lower levels. That's a fact. And it takes leadership to address it. It takes affirmative policies as well to do it. There's often controversy about affirmative action. Some people think it means you're less qualified. No. It just means that the starting point for competition, the ground is not level. It's leveling the ground so that people can compete in equality. The United Nations was created, a whole human rights declaration was made about the equality of people. But for most of us black and brown people, we were not equal. We were subjects. We were not citizens of countries. We're subjects, because we're colonial subjects. So the history of our organization comes from that. And to change it, you cannot say, come and we compete the same. Yeah, I can come to compete, but if the panels from the top are full of people of one race, I will not be appreciated. So we take affirmative action to dismantle, to remove the historical imbalances. Secretary General Gutierrez has done that on the side of gender. He has set a target and he has appointed women in leadership positions. I am one of them. And there's parity at the top. But on the race issue, he's still got a challenge. And that's why we formed our group. We formed a group we call ourselves the UN Senior Africans Group. We created it when George Floyd was executed in America. We felt outraged and we said, this is unacceptable. We're going to make a statement about America and racism. But we must walk the talk in our organization. So we said, we'll create a group to challenge racism within the UN as well. And we've been working on it. We challenged Secretary General and he set up a task force. He did an action plan. He's now appointed a senior advisor on racism. And we are still saying we want to see results. Those are institutional changes, but let's see the results. Let's see the structures change. Let's see the staffing change. But yeah, we are a product of an institution born from colonialism and racism is the idea that justifies colonialism and we have work to do. Thank you, Anipam. By the way, thank you for the very thoughtful question. We spent a lot of time thinking about undercapitalization and the funding issue. And I guess I'll bring it the US lens because that's where I spend most of my time. And you look at kind of all the dreary stats of like less than 1% of VC money goes to minority owned or led startups for instance, right? But countless other stats like that. I think there's a couple of things that we can do and that we are doing at our company. One is actually to make the investment case for investing behind those diverse business owners and leaders as well as those enterprises that serve those communities. I think a couple of things. One, the Kellogg Foundation has done some incredible work on racial equity. And one of the stats that I found or numbers that I always cite is 2.7 trillion of GDP in the US would be gained if we close the black racial equity wealth gap. That is a huge number. Not to mention the Latino community in the US would be the eighth largest country in the world by GDP if it was its own distinct country, right? And it's growing incredibly fast. So there's an investment case. I personally always feel quite bothered and uncomfortable when people say, I'm gonna take a risk on so and so. Why? I really, even saying it aloud gives me goosebumps. And so I think we really need to make the investment case. And the second thing that I would say is actually showing up so that you can actually listen and empathize with those that we're gonna invest in. So for instance, with the impact fund that I mentioned, we added to our team a completely diverse team of private market investors. By the way, a lot of people tell me, you can't find diverse investors, super hard to find. I think you just need to have the conviction and the commitment to look and find them. Incredibly talented. They have track records, right? All the good stuff. And then when they go, and I was really heartened by this, actually I asked them, what's been one of the observations you've had over the last year or so as we've been deploying our money? And they said, we always spend a few minutes with the companies and the enterprises we're meeting with. And everybody kind of looks around the table and it's like, wow, is this the meeting? This meeting is a little different than all the other meetings I've had. And so I think it's actually just representing but also meeting people where they are and actually having that conviction because you yourself are part of it. So. That's great. I want to follow, because Alex, you run a people business, you mentioned the venture boot camp work that you do at Kearney. Did anything resonate with what you heard from both Pam and Winnie? Well, all of it resonated. So I appreciate those perspectives. I was just, I was going to say a couple of things. One, we all have blind spots. I think part of the reason why things aren't happening is because one blind spot is the one that was just highlighted here, which is a fear that there's a zero sum game. I'm helping someone, but I'm hurting someone else. And that's divisive. It's been politicized. And that's an issue that we have to address. The second piece is when you go from intentions and targets and commitments and then accountability to outcomes, you can't escape the root causes in the middle. And I think that's to me the point about, well, that's a black solution, but where's the white support? Which is a quote from Ron Parker for the ELC. He's a great fellow. And that's one of the most memorable quotes I had to sort of guide how I build a culture. Yes. A culture of belonging. All sorts of self-identified who you are is fine, but being in a place where, yeah, we had systemic racism. I've been a victim of it too. If you haven't felt it, that's not your problem. It's our problem. And so anyway, those are some blind spots I think we need to overcome to get to the targets and that's journey to the end, that that's aspirational, not just what was us. I appreciate you calling out a group like ELC for sure. Winnie, you wanted to add something quickly and we'll try to get a couple more questions? Yeah. Maybe first take a question. Sure. But I wanted to pick up on his point on the culture of organization. A pruning racism means to be deliberate about the organizational culture you're building. You see, people who have privilege do not understand many times. They have unconscious bias. They don't understand that an organization has been built around their culture and they fit. And they want everybody else to fit and they don't understand that that's also a racism. The fact that I'm trying all the time to conform to how you operate, you're not trying to conform to mine. So being deliberate about that, when I was growing up, my teacher, one of my teachers was an Indian woman. She used to come to the class with my physics teacher wearing her saree every day. And I remember it had a powerful impact on me because all the other teachers were all in a Western dress. They were African, they were white, but they had to, there was a dress code. She defied it. She came in her saree. And when we talk about how we all realized she was the first person to help us to question the culture of our school. So you find that challenging the rules and shaping the culture is one way to uproot racism and you need white people to be conscious of their privilege and to be part of dismantling the culture in the organization. That's about giving up their privilege. So this is something I do in my own organization and I force people to keep questioning these things about, I mean, look in my country, people in the courts, when you go to the court, the judge still wears a white wig. Can you imagine that wisdom is associated with white women? Women still go to the courts. The lawyers, you see them wearing little black skirts. You can't wear your African dress in the court. I mean, this is racism that's not yet removed from our institutions. We have a lot to do. We have a lot to do. I love both Alex and Wendy's point. I mean, it's not, moving beyond Alex to co-conspirators. We've got to be co-conspirators in this. It requires all hands on deck all the time. Just brilliant. I subconsciously must have left my phone in the green room because I want to talk to you all day. I have no idea how much more time we have. I'm gonna stay here all day with you all if we're allowed to, but oh, I just got this. Okay, so may I make a suggestion? We need a full day on this with leaders like Alex and Winnie and Pam, point of moderator privilege. Quickly, last final comments. We're grateful to you all for your leadership. Let's go down the road, Pam, then Winnie, then Alex. Close it out for us. I think we just, we need to do more and we need to do more and we need to do more. I don't know what to say beyond that. I think that we understand conceptually the problems we face, and now it's not the what, it's the how. Perfect, thank you. Winnie? Yeah, we have to speak our truth. We have to create the safety for people who suffer racism to speak their truth. Then we get the solutions. Yes, thank you. Alex, I'm still optimistic. Stay on the journey. It's our journey. And ABCs that stick with allyship, belonging culture and a lot of good things happen. Brilliant, will you please join me in thanking this extraordinary panel? Thank you all so much.