 The email me before they're done with the show and how many people never finished the show by the number of people who told me yesterday that the video started midway. And the thing is, if you watch all the way to the end, so you know- Oh my God, Gary Shandling died? What? What? Hold on. We interrupt this excuse making. No, wait, wait, wait. That can't be right. Is this a Twitter thing? Better, I swear to God. No, it's a variety thing. Variety from- Oh, no way. Oh. I actually liked him. He was 66, but- I can't play too young. That's 66. I mean, 66 is minimum these days. Like, you want people to live longer than that. Pretty fast, though. It's not through note-note. The cause of death has not been released. Over to come. Wow, that's sad. Every show, comedy show that you like owes everything to The Larry Sander Show. If you have not watched The Larry Sander Show, you're not doing your duty as an American. It's, yeah, daily show. Yeah. Here's how good The Larry Sander Show was. A fake show about a talk show was so beloved that when Conan O'Brien was about, when he got the late show, or whatever, the one that Jimmy found. He got late night. When he got late night, it was Gary Shandling, Gary Shandling turned it down to go from playing a guy who hosted a show to really hosting the late night show. He was so beloved that they won. He was like, wow. And he said, no, because he shouldn't. It would have been bad for him to do it. I mean, it's already, Jerry's still out on whether this was a good move for Colbert to go from playing a character doing a talk show to actually hosting a late night talk show. But at least get a talk show every night. Yeah. Like, you didn't like have a successful movie or television show where he played it for like 12 episodes a year. Five-Dog and Gary Shandling. Oh, the freestyle battles. Yeah, in heaven. All right, shall we reminisce more about Gary Shandling? One last, my favorite line in Larry Sander's show is, I forget who he's yelling at. The show is not for you to get laid. It's for Larry to get laid. Let me close this door. All right, man. I nail that play button on the theme show every day because I can see a big old circle. All right, you ready? Let's go. Let's do it. Money burning a hole in your pocket? Then your money's probably on fire. Seek medical attention. If you want to support your favorite podcast, however, go to dailytechnewshow.com slash support. This is the Daily Tech News 4, Thursday, March 24th, 2016. I'm Tom Merritt joining me today as he does most Thursdays. Mr. Justin Robert Young of the Internet. You got so many things going on these days, man. I don't even know how to introduce you anymore. Well, how about this? As the DTNS contributor, that's what I am first and foremost when I step inside this squared circle of tech news. And beloved at that. We've got an interesting take on a couple of different stories today. There's a Farhad Manju column in the New York Times about how not everything can be the Uber of everything. And part of the reason for that is the constricting financial funding. And we've been hearing the birds yelling that the VC sky is falling for years. Maybe it finally is. We're going to talk about that. We will find out whether the horn of Joramon has blown over Silicon Valley and winter is truly here. But let's start off with the headlines. Sony Computer Entertainment, which the Verge rightly reminds us is becoming Sony Interactive Entertainment next week, has formed a new company already called ForwardWorks, wholly owned company, but it will be a company on its own. ForwardWorks is going to make smartphone games. New company will use PlayStation characters and IP to make, quote, full-fledged game titles. None of those half-fledged game titles you've been playing. Azushi Morita, who is the head of Sony Computer Entertainment in Japan and Asia right now, will become president of the new company, ForwardWorks, and it will incorporate on April 1st, the same day that all of the changeovers in Sony's organization happened, and it will initially focus on games for users in Japan and Asia. So this is a, I mean, very obviously, a play toward mobile, but you gotta wonder, are we entering kind of a second age of mobile gaming? You've seen so many kind of independent companies step in. You've seen larger companies repurpose themselves like Blizzard has with Hearthstone to create very successful titles that have done very well for them. I almost wonder where Sony wants to focus and specifically it's going to be interesting to see their efforts parallels with Nintendo's, which is another company that you would think could have gotten into this earlier and yet has played it very cautious and conservative. And that may be what Sony is talking about when they say full-fledged games. Mitomo is a fun little thing, but it's not Super Mario, right? And they're sort of implying, if it was good enough to you do on the PlayStation Vita, we're gonna make it for iOS and Android now. So I don't know that this is a bad idea in a world where Sony runs, sensor making as it's most profitable arguably arm for cameras as well as the PlayStation and movies and in a film studio. Like it makes sense for them to say, hey, this mobile gaming thing, people like it. We've got some great IP. Let's create a company that walls it off, shields it off from the rest of the corporation has to stand on its own, but is wholly owned by us. So we get all the benefit if it works. Remember yesterday when we told you about the chatbot Tay from Microsoft? That mimics teens. Well, much like the bus station in where you are broadcasting, Tom Los Angeles, the fresh face Tay got off into the big wide world of the internet and man, did it get dark quick. Microsoft had to shut down the bot after it began making offensive statements. You see the bot sometime pair it back statements with its own comedic commentary. That led people to provoking Tay into saying nice things among other things about Hitler and denying the Holocaust. In Microsoft spokesman doltek crunch quote, we have taken Tay offline and are making adjustments. In other words, Tay was a little too much like a teenager and now Microsoft has to treat Tay like a teenager and give Tay a timeout. Yeah, this one, you almost kind of wonder why this wasn't something that was brought up before Tay got released. Like it seemed like a, I mean, obviously if it was completely corrupted within 24 hours, then there were no fail safes or at least not effective fail safes that they could nip this in the bud while it was going on, right? My guess, you wanna know my guess? Yeah. I feel like it was a lack of imagination and I don't mean that in a combat and almost in a laudatory way. Like they probably did try saying nasty things to it like the F word and stuff. Like, what do people do this? Like, okay, how will it handle that? Okay. And the pure engineering impulse is to like build the bot so you don't have to program it to look for certain things, just have it learn. And maybe they just assumed a little too much of a balance of nice people versus trolley people. Well, I mean, but also like, I mean, again, Tay is very new to this world. You gotta hold the hand a little bit. Maybe just for the first 24 hours, you're watching what's coming in and you're saying, no, no, no, let's know that word. Let's, in fact, let's just go ahead and blacklist words like Hitler and the Holocaust. Well, my guess is that's exactly what they're doing. Like, oh, okay, this is how we learn. Great, now that we've realized that the internet's going to go that way, we'll make adjustments. Let's just have anything that comes into the intake, have an automatic response of you. Like, and just move on. I feel like that would be the very tame response to all the things that wound up corrupting its intake. Yeah, yeah. But it is a little bit of a failure of the machine learning, not a failure as in like this thing's full of crap. I just mean like the ultimate machine learning, the ideal would learn quickly about those sorts of things and know like, oh, but these people are saying bad things and react with like, whoa, why are you bringing that up? So it didn't learn that lesson very fast. Embarrassment for Microsoft. You know, lots of parents probably empathize with Microsoft, right? Kids said the darnest things. It's these days. Google has developed an Android app called Accessibility Scanner, which can call out interface elements on your screen that can be improved. The app will look for things like where text may need to be larger, whether touch targets have the proper colors to stick out or maybe need better contrast. Accessibility Scanner is available now in the Google Play Store, meant for devs to be able to improve the accessibility of their apps, but it might be good for folks who need more accessible apps to be able to communicate with those developers and have a list that they can easily point to. Yeah, you know, this is a, I'm glad they're going about it this way. I'm glad they're making it a priority. I'm glad we're talking about it because, you know, this is kind of the silent curse of the internet is for people that very much rely on these accessibility features. It's just kind of forgotten unless there is some large point made to say, like, hey, look, very often again, it's not a lot, make the font a little bigger, make the color a little different, not anything that's gonna totally break somebody's design or anything. Make that button pop out a little easier. That's all. Just good idea. Venture Beat reports that sources tell it YouTube is working on a live streaming app called YouTube Connect. A source close to the matter says functionality is similar to Periscope and Facebook Live. You log in using your Google account and begin streaming. Other features include chat, tagging, and a news feed that highlights the latest clip from friends or subscribed YouTube channels. Streamed videos can be viewed from the app or YouTube channel and are saved to the app. YouTube Connect will be available for iOS and Android. All right, so first I got really excited when I read this article because partly the reason was my wife was in the other room listening to an all hands meeting and I was like, is that what they're talking about in there? But then I didn't ask her because that would be uncomfortable. And also all I could hear was a guy that kind of sounded like Steve Carell but I couldn't make out anything he was saying. Second I got excited because I was like, ooh, live streaming more hangout-like things that I can make use of for podcasts. And no, this is Periscope. This is a Periscope competitor. But all that aside, all my personal baggage aside, it seems like a no-brainer YouTube should do this. Is it a no-brainer? Because what makes Periscope and Facebook Live and Meerkat before it interesting is that it very easily plugged into a place where people were hanging out right now. Obviously YouTube has a tremendous amount of traffic but the amount of time that you are there when someone that you want to watch live is streaming live is probably not as much as people who are just hanging out on Facebook and Twitter and have it open all the time and you are more likely to randomly catch something. Now you are then relying on either the same problem Meerkat had where Twitter was able to revoke some of their elements in terms of their growth or that people have the alerts turned on on their YouTube app. So now you are reaching people like that. Which obviously they got a tremendous advantage in terms of an install base but I don't know. To me the most exciting part about this is if they had a chat room that wasn't just YouTube comments because that is the biggest hurdle that YouTube has in terms of live streaming is that having all your comments be YouTube comments is just a bad idea and it's never worked and I don't think that having more platforms to shove what is a vital element of live stream content into will make it any better. The that all makes sense and I can't disagree with you. I think the reason I think it's probably a good idea for YouTube is the amount of effort they have to do to make this happen is less than it would be for a Meerkat or a Periscope or even a Facebook because they already have a lot of the infrastructure in place to stream video, right? That's what they do. The other thing that even Periscope has had to try to do and Facebook certainly trying to do this is get popular people on the platform to popularize it, right? We need celebrities to be on here so that people come and watch it and then realize the other things that they could also be watching, YouTube's got that. Now it's within its own YouTube averse believe me but you have the Fine Brothers, PewDiePie, Grace Helbig, those kinds of folks suddenly and the list goes on and on and on. Suddenly start streaming. Their fans, the same ones that run around following them screaming at VidCon will also run screaming to that app to see what they're up to. If it is something that the creators wanna do and that's where the experience is paramount. Like yeah, they can launch it big and they can have all these things and you can pop it but all these people that you just named are successful for reasons because they identified platforms that worked for them and they put their effort into it and while ignoring others. Many times that came with big pressure and big money to switch platforms because they had an audience and they could do more for the platform than the platform could do for them and I think this is just another element of that. Yeah. Pebble CEO Eric Minjikowski told Tech Insider that the company will lay off 40 employees this week, about 25% of its staff. Minjikowski blamed slower funding from VCs for the layoffs saying money is pretty tight these days. He also wants Pebble to focus on health and fitness. I think that's telling. Pebble will start selling in India next month in partnership with Amazon. Shout out Steve Kovac on the scoop. Yeah, this is, I mean, so now imagine, you know, I have a more flowing main than I had before. I'm resting my head on the hilt of my broadsword in the Eddard Snow Stark meme and winter is coming. So you believe that Minjikowski is going to individually inform these 40 people because he who gives the sentence must swing the sword. Must swing the sword. This is interesting. You saw, obviously this comes 24 hours after the Apple event where they slash prices on the Apple Watch. I think people have said when the Apple Watch was in its cycle about to be released that there was going to be a lot of attention on what the Apple Watch was going to sell and the market share that it was going to take because if Apple can't make wearables work, then there is a large question on exactly how much is this going, how big of a business is this going to be? And what you are seeing now from the Pebble CEO, whatever is internally and how many people that they need to have on there to make their balance sheets work is whatever that is. He is sending signals to say we are going to focus on what we know people buy wearables for which is health and fitness. It's not about knowing what is happening on your phone. It's not about this other stuff. This is what we are going to double down and focus on which is a crowded marketplace that has a few entrenched players already in it. It's, man, wearables. Remember when they were the cute girl? Yeah, yeah. I feel like maybe Apple got into the Watch game too early and I am not one who dooms them then and says, and therefore Apple is done. You know what, they get to make mistakes every once in a while. Believe me, they've made them before. See, hi-fi. But what they did right with tablets was everyone saw the promise of tablets but nobody wanted to use any of the tablets that were made and they waited until they made a tablet that people wanted to use, right? And maybe the time was right. Maybe they waited until people were ready for tablets. With watches, it feels like what you're saying is absolutely true. People want to use them for health and fitness right now and that's it. We know they could be good for other things but nobody is really either ready for that or making the product that makes us use it for these supposed other risk notification type stuff. Well, no, let me say this. I think the deal for Apple is different than Pebble because Apple is selling a peripheral for a product they already own and they will always be able to have an inside track on. Pebble only succeeds if the larger wearable market is so big that effectively an aftermarket tailored device can succeed. The iPhone and iOS devices are a huge part of the smart phone market and they will always lag behind Apple because Apple will always give their own product a better chance to succeed. I love my Apple Watch. I wear my Apple Watch every day. I very much enjoy it. I think that Apple's game now is, hey, let's just figure out how this peripheral works for us as opposed to the burden of Pebble which is we need this entire market to be a thing if we're gonna survive and that's why we're a profitable market. For sure. Facebook is testing a tool that alerts users when an impersonator uses their name and profile photo. The user will be asked if the profile in question is theirs. If you say yes, the profile will be manually reviewed by Facebook according to Facebook head of global safety and to Jean Davis. Antigone, I'm guessing. Yeah, sure. I mean, sounds legit. The feature is active in 75% of the world with the rest to follow in the near future. Facebook is testing a way to report non-consensual intimate photos and photo privacy check tool that lets users review who can see posted photos. Yeah, I don't have much to say other than this all seems good. A way to let you know, hey, somebody might be trolling you with a fake profile here which happens to a lot of people. May not ever happen to you. Hopefully it doesn't. But it can be socially damaging, especially if you're in a business that works on reputation and a chance for Facebook to make sure that the person isn't just flying off the handle because they happen to see someone who has the same name as them and go like, wait a minute, is it really okay? Yeah, this is definitely a violation and let's get rid of it. This is a lot more widespread than you might think. All these chat or bots that are there to spam you, it's not like these bot people are going out and commissioning local models to take photos. They're scraping them and oftentimes using the same names so they can weasel their way into your good graces and spam you with nonsense. So not only is this a kind of revenge porn sort of element to it, but this is a major issue in terms of the sanctity of your friends list. Google announced the cloud machine learning platform available in limited preview as a cloud service. One part lets developers build machine learning models from their own data. Another part of it offers pre-trained models. In other words, any app can take advantage of the machine learning powers behind things like Google photo, voice recognition, Google translate and others. Google seems to me, it's about time they got in the business that Amazon identified a long time ago, which is you build a lot of big things. Why not rent them out to other people to use? Yeah, that's always, Google's had always a very interesting relationship with the fact that like, they've always had this server advantage and people wanted them to do Google, you know, back in our day, we used to speculate it'd be called G drive, you know, now Google drive is a thing, but they were years late to that. You know, they were years late to the idea that hey look, we can just store a bunch of stuff. This seems, I totally agree with you. You know, this is where they should be. Roevee, maker of electronic program guides for TVs and talks to acquire Tivo, maker of devices that use electronic program guides. While both companies make real products, the Verge notes that both of them make most of their money from patents. And a truism is that the company with the taller stack of patents generally makes more money on patents. Tivo's CEO stepped down in November and has yet to be replaced. So that would indicate to me they may have had an inkling that this was coming or at least possible or something they wanted to pursue. And yeah, Roevee and Tivo combining their patents, especially with Tivo's patents either expiring or still in court cases being tested, they might wanna get some backstop there. Certainly have plenty of other patents that are reliable, but Roevee can also get the advantages of having the device that uses their electronic program guides. Seems like a match made in heaven to me. Yeah, you know, this is the old corporate dosido. Yeah, researchers at Baidu published a paper describing how it can use Baidu maps to predict areas where crowds may be forming in dangerous sizes that could lead to stampedes and death by crushing something that is far too frequent in some places, including China. As people look up routes to their destination, the new method could issue an alert if the number of queries crosses a certain threshold. This could also be used by malls and theme parks to anticipate crowd size for the day or to manage road traffic, obviously. It could also be used to anticipate protests. A demonstration system has been made, but it has not yet been implemented anywhere. This is one of those stories that if you were to read it 12, 15 years ago, maybe certainly the further back you go, I think the more hysteric the reaction would be, but now it's kind of a yawn story, right? Yeah, this is great data. Yeah, Waze does that. Yeah, we love using these maps. But 15, 20 years ago, if you read it to be like, these private companies are tracking where you're going and selling that data to the highest bidder. But listen, I think this is a great way to get it out there that, oh, well, we want to make sure that crowd crushing doesn't happen. But also Disney, if you'd like to know what your headcount's going to be for the day, here's another analytics element that we can sell to you. And this one is easily defensible, and maybe we as a society are getting more literate about this. They can very easily say, all we do is give you the total number of destination points for particular destinations. We don't have to know what the route is, where they're coming from, who they are, nothing. It's just that final number. Or, I mean, but if you're buying it, you're right, and where they stand the tin for the heck of it. Yeah. Hulu launched an app designed for the Samsung Gear VR headset available in the Gear VR Oculus Store. It includes normal content, as well as 25 original VR shows and films. Those are available, even if you're not subscribed to Hulu. Hulu says it's the first of several VR apps for different platforms. So if you're watching the 2D stuff, you can choose what destination you want to watch them in. They just show up as a big screen in front of you. I like the beach. I want to go, I'm going to go take my Gear VR to the beach and watch Hulu in it in the beach setting. Big day for content on VR. And I'll leave that there and have everybody else search to see what other big press announcement there was about content for VR. Content on VR, I mean, listen, it's a family show. Yeah, all right. Oh, you're talking about Du Boink? Yeah. That was in yesterday's show. Okay, good. I got to hear Scott Johnson read that headline. Oh, you made Scott read the Du Boink? Oh, Scott wanted to read, he was excited to read that headline. It's always the quiet ones. Yeah. At the Lion Conference in Tokyo, Lion CEO Takeshi Iizawa announced new features around shopping, including an auto login for users who move from Lion to an unrelated service. You wouldn't have to re-login to keep your purchase going. Users in Japan can complete payments using Lion Pay. The app will also add a coupon book, digital rewards card and in-app shops. Lion's API will allow connections to in-store beacons and chatbots for customer service, for instance. Lion also announced Lion Mobile. That'll be an NVNO that runs on the NTT DOKEMO Network coming to Japan this summer for 50 yen a month. That's about $4.50 US and will have things like free access to certain features, certain data features without counting against your data gap. You know, I think it's really hard for us to understand exactly how big of a brand Lion is, right? Like Lion just feels like it's in that place that a company like Virgin was in the 90s in the UK and in America where it's like, you know, listen, like they can just kind of get into everything because they are in a slipstream of cool and useful that is very, very popular with a demographic. And they've locked up a market, right, with Japan. Like they've got a tech-hungry, innovative market ready to spend money. Why wouldn't they come up with all these different ways? Thanks to ST71398, Captain Kipper, Go Share, SP Sheridan and more for submitting some of these stories on the subreddit. Go and submit some yourself or vote on them at dailytechnewshow.reddit.com and that is a look at the headlines. So. You know that Bedoink press release dropped that early? I didn't know. I thought it was later in the afternoon. Well, you know, there's nothing wrong with that. It's perfectly normal. So Farhan Manju, writing in the New York Times today, had an article about does the Uber model translate? Like why aren't we getting the Uber for everything? Maybe it only works for Uber. One of the things that he said was VC funding is drying up, putting profit pressure on things. Uber had a market that was very inefficient, the taxi market to attack. So they were possibly going to make money a little easier than some of these other markets and these other markets are now facing venture capitalists who are saying, where's the profit? Which they didn't use to ask as early in the cycle. We also saw that CB Insights said that deal activity from VCs plummeted to the lowest point since Q1 2014 in the last quarter of 2015 and funding dollars fell to their lowest point since the summer of 2014 in that same quarter. We saw Spoon Rocket go down in flames, not able to make enough money to convince, they were making money, but they couldn't make enough money to convince the seed funding to keep coming in. The third round I think or the second round is what they were going after. Justin, are we in the bust? Is this the VC bust? I don't think it's a bust. If it is a bust, this is the earliest that we are seeing the effects of it. It's a chilling. That's why I mentioned that winter is coming. Winter is coming. There will be a moment where a lot of these ideas are going to have to produce and have to show profits sooner than they did in a more robust and speculative era for VC money where people were a lot more interested in grabbing lottery tickets to chase a trend, right? I just think there is a cyclical nature to this. Uber was such a gigantic success that it wasn't like we didn't see Uber for blank. We saw every Uber for blank. It's just that a lot of those are having to face harsh realities and having to have the money spicket is getting a little bit tighter. But that's not to say that there haven't been successes. Instacart recently has kind of been a bit of a surprise because they said, well, listen, we're not losing money, question mark, which in Valley terms is, you know, might as well be GE. Right. It's a blue chip suddenly. But that's the change, right? It used to be like, ah, we don't care if you make money. We don't care if you make money before you go IPO. And those days seem to be over. There's a great article from Dan Primmick over at Fortune talking about, well, actually talking with the CEO of Instacart, Apurva Mehta, about all of the things they're doing to create that situation where they are now on what is called gross margin positive. In other words, if you don't count marketing and HR and all these other overhead costs, every delivery they make is making money. And they're now unit economic profitable, which means they're actually making money in 10 of their markets. But they had to do a lot. They had to lower salaries for people. They had to raise the delivery rate. They had to look for more efficient ways to do the deliveries. They had to put in some work. Well, and that's, I think, what we're looking at is that now the, our underpants gnome equation is gonna need a number two. It's not just gonna be Uber for baseball cards, dot, dot, dot profit, right? Like you're going to need to figure out where this connects exactly how much money you can afford to spend per transaction. And it's starting to claim victims. Spoon rocket, which I loved. But it is always one of those companies where me and my wife Ashley and Belmont always used to joke around that like, this is being in the Bay Area is fantastic because you directly reap the rewards of VCs spending a ridiculous amount of money on the hilariously unprofitable businesses and something like Spoon Rocket, which was effectively tech company cafeteria food kept in a car heated sufficiently that you could order on your app and get it delivered to you was not going to be around forever. But we got to enjoy it while it was, which is fun. Well, they raised 13.5 million in seed funding and series A funding, I think combined in 2013 and 2014. They were at an eight million revenue run rate and they just, the funding wouldn't show back up again. And so I think, well, I don't think we're seeing a bust. I think we're seeing what a lot of people hoped would see a slow deflation. You know, the big inflatable ball you're sitting on is just starting to lose air a little bit more every day. And you know that it might go flat. And so you better go grab that pump. But it's not, it's not explosively, you know, exploding and throwing its pieces into the air if I can torture that metaphor. It's, it is a more, and a lot of people said because it was venture capital funding it wouldn't bust like the dot-com bust. It wouldn't fall apart like the housing market that it would be this sort of gradual easing back. Now it was a big drop in Q4 2015, don't get me wrong. But at the same time, it's taking money away from things that I think a lot of people look at and go, well, that seems like it was pretty risky anyway. And it's overall a slow removal of money. You still have the big three Uber, Airbnb, et cetera getting their solid funding because they're solid businesses. But also let's take a look at Uber specifically and its legacy because what is very, very curious is that a lot of these companies that we're seeing, including Instacart, including Spoonrocket, including Postmates, right? These are not just apps where you release it into the world and then people who wanna use it use it and their relationship is directly between the app and the company and its users. This is something that especially in California, you know, and all around the country, there is a question on how you are employing people. You have to deal with employees. When you adjust your algorithm in your app, like let's say Airbnb. If Airbnb said, hey, you wanna know what, we're gonna kick back to you guys 12 cents less and that'll save us X amount. Then it's one person making a decision each time they look to opt in into that service. If you have somebody that you've convinced to go get a new Honda Civic with Uber or any of these other companies to say, look, we're gonna readjust what we're paying you, now you have, even if it's not in the courts, a primary employer-employee relationship that affects them emotionally and you have to figure out a lot of different ways to deal with it and this is kind of a step up for our app economy, right? It is another layer here that is complicated to deal with and I think what you're seeing is the smart companies, especially in very low overhead areas like food and food delivery where margins are historically not gigantic, you know, Uber for Faberge eggs would do fantastic, Uber for a $5 meal is harder to make money on. It's a thin margin, right. And you are seeing smart companies, like I think Instagard's very, very smart to get out ahead of this and even just project, like hey, look, look at this article in Fortune, is half them talking about look how smart we are. Like look, we have, oh, I watched AlphaGo and I was saying, look, that's like what we're doing. I'm not saying it's not, I'm saying it's smart that they are talking like that. Well, and it's a very different conversation, right? It used to be look how much money we're spending on features and this is a very different approach here. Yeah, it's like, oh, look, now the message we wanna get out, our corporate message isn't we're bringing the best and the brightest. Isn't look how much we're spending on our users. Isn't look how famous we are. Look, here's us with Snoop Dogg. It is corporate responsibility and investment in analytics so they can better understand where they're making money and let's break down exactly region by region how much money we make per customer, which sounds frighteningly like real business and not are wacky through the looking glass, Silicon Valley economics. Well, unlike bots as demonstrated by Tay, maybe apps have grown up finally or this is the point of which they start to grow up. Remember the dream of web 2.0 if I may throw you into the way back machine was you create the service and the people just use it and you don't have to do anything but maintain the service, right? That was YouTube. YouTube apparently recently revealed started as the idea was a dating service where you just have people put up videos of themselves and then meet each other somehow but it still became a platform of like you just put up the videos, we sit back and let your videos run profit, right? Well, the first thing they ran into was anti-piracy but even beyond that, now YouTube is having to do all of this creator outreach and funding videos and they realize, well, you know what? That works up to a point but if you really want to improve the product and the quality of the product you have to take more of a hand in it and I think these kinds of apps are showing that as well. In fact, Twitch, which, you know, you can disclose it in a second, Twitch is gonna move to the San Diego Comic-Con or San Diego Comic-Con, might as well be called the San Diego Convention Center because they wanna have a lot more panels for people to come to and talk about the things that create on Twitch. They're making the outreach in the real world not that old idea of like, all we gotta do is put up the website and then people use it and we sit back and profit. But, and those are all examples of companies that are on, that they are either a provider, then they have a middle layer and then they have the end users, you know? And that's something that you're right is a departure from the wet and wild dream of web 2.0 which was just, here is a automaton vending machine that people find so interesting. They wanna keep coming back to and all we gotta do is send out a repairman here and again to replace parts and dream up new features to keep people coming back. No, it's, you actually need employees, whether or not they're actually employees, people who get paid from your service, right? And that's what we're looking at. Although I could really go for, you know, some braised short ribs that I used to get from Spoon Rocket. Man, you know, Halcyon days. Well, you can get them from Sprig now. They're actually a lot better. They're just also a lot more expensive. Yeah, no, I mean, because then you could have Caviar that's another similar service. By that point, you might as well go for Postmates. You might as well just get delivery from a place that doesn't deliver. We are a DoorDash family, but yeah, I get what you're saying. Oh, well, I'll tell you what, you know, who knows? I bet you Tay. What does Tay say about this? What she wakes back up. Yeah, when she, someone emailed me when Tay wakes up from her nap. Our pick of the day is the Tay chat bot. No, it's not. Our pick of the day is from Darren who was listening to our conversation about messaging platforms, not far off actually, and said, check out FLEEP. It's Messaging Meets Email. I started using it recently and it works out great. FLEEP.io, I know, F-L-E-E-P.io. But the genius part of it is that it actually can allow people to continue to message with you without downloading the client. They can just keep the conversation going through email if they want to install the client, they can. I'm sure this is great. And I'm very much looking forward to trying it out. I just can't get over the fact that it sounds like something that Rick would ask Morty to hand him, like, you know. Hand me the FLEEP. Yeah. No, the FLEEP. What are you gonna do with all that FLEEP? All right, our message of the day comes from Chris who says, am I the only one? Yes. No, I'm just kidding, Chris. In fact, I had a great email back and forth with Chris about this. He says, am I the only one that gets a little frustrated when it comes to all the peripherals that VR developers are trying to roll out? The Sony ice cream cones, he means PlayStation Move, the Microsoft Connect, they both fell flat. I'm more interested in them getting the screen resolution, the head tracking, the connection standards, right? I feel like all the peripherals detract from what the real goal should be, have a really visual immersive experience. I wish developers would just work on first person experiences from a normal gaming standpoint, shooters, flight simulators, driving. I don't need expensive bird flight peripherals collecting dust in the corner. Which I wrote it back. What's the bird flight peripheral you're talking about? Apparently, somniacs.co is creating an installation. It's really not a peripheral where you can simulate flying by having bird wings attached and a fan that makes it feel like the wind is in your hair and everything. I don't think that's what he's really worried about. But what do you think about this idea that he's saying, are we too concerned about the controllers at this point? He doesn't mind just holding the Xbox One controller with his Oculus. And that's fine. And rest assured, Chris, that there are people who are waking up and going to sleep every day with only the thoughts of how to make those problems, how to solve those problems in between, right? Like there are plenty of developers that are focusing on just that problem. What you are seeing now in the peripheral market is a lot of lottery tickets on what's going to be the thing that helps take this further, right? Is there an element that is missing? And maybe there's not. Maybe it is all just something in a headset and you have a very rudimentary thing like a control that we don't care about. But you can't blame these companies for trying Oh no, wait, maybe it needs something else. Maybe there's another element because it's not like the VR experience now is so compelling that you're like, oh God, of course we don't need this extraneous element. So I don't blame these companies for trying. If anything, it is an indictment on where we are in the general VR experience right now. The things that I told Chris were like handed dependence is going to be unimmersive if you're holding a controller in some games. So that's why the Vive has these independent controllers. Oculus has theirs coming, they're not ready yet. And that's why Sony is using the move. And I feel like Sony is doing exactly what he wants. They're just repurposing an old thing, the move to be their independent controllers. Otherwise you're using the DualShock controller. It didn't help their resolution the way he wanted it to. But it's early days. Yeah, no matter how you look at it. Wild West, man. Well, thank you, Justin, Robert Young. Of course, Night Attack, WeirdThings.com, the Jurymore podcast, Monday Hotline Bling. Did I say Monday? It's like my grandma, Roxy. Yeah, also there's no more Jurymore podcast. That was the one we did, we did. Oh, it's not Jurymore, I was, when I said that even, I mean, that's what's written here, but. That's fine. No, there's a Jurypodcast that is just me. I cut the dead weight of my wife and it's just me talking. Wow, haven't even been married a year. Look at that. Okay, she's gonna punch me in the face. So here's what I'd like you all to check out. Go to Patreon, speaking of the Jurypodcast, go to patreon.com.com slash JURY. That is where you can find both the Jurypodcast, all my one mic shows. The Jurypodcast, the Politics, Politics, Politics show. It is the best bargain on the internet. Go ahead and check that out. Patreon.com slash JURY. Do it, folks. Get it happening. Make it, it'll make your week better. Guarantee. Thank you to everyone who supports the show, dailytechnewshow.com slash support. Our next milestone goal is a monthly round table show. We're getting very close to full day six where Peter Wells will be doing shows every week on our Sunday, his Monday. And so our next milestone goal would get us to a monthly round table show. In fact, we've almost got one for virtual reality just without even trying. Just a bunch of different conversations that are going around with people, like a guy named Travis that we met at the LA meetup who's been working on this for years. Allison Sheridan's interested. Justin and I were talking about it before the show. Aaron Carson, obviously an expert on the beat. So if you are interested in us adding kind of, not a single topic, it might be a dual topic, but more of an in-depth discussion show once a month, patreon.com slash DTNS. The best thing you could do though is just tell people about the show. If every single one of you would today, mention Daily Tech News Show to somebody who doesn't already watch or listen. Our email address is feedback at dailytechnewshow.com. Give us a call 51259 daily, 5125932459. Catch the show live Monday through Friday, 430 p.m. Eastern at alphageekradio.com and diamondclub.tv. And visit our website at dailytechnewshow.com. Back tomorrow with Aaron Kitchin and Len Peralta. Talk to you then. This show is part of the Frog Pants Network. Get more at frogpants.com. Diamond Club, hope you have enjoyed this program. Boom, push the boom. What you gonna do with all that fleet? All that fleet in your Jeep? I'm gonna get you cheap. Man, there was a really good one very early that was Tay related. Did Showbot document it? I think so. Cases? No. No, there's another one, let me see. Parents, was it about parents? Microsoft's Tay got really, you know. Oh, smells like AI spirit. That's the one that I really liked. You like that one? Although, that might be a little meta. With the bot off. Yeah. That's dangerous. I just love it, like I would love to see just the montage of all the horrific things that the day Bop was saying set to like. Ba-da-da-da, ba-da-da-da, ba-da-da-da, ba-da-da-da. Here we are, Tay, entertain us. Just make it the title. Or do you wanna make sure that the everyone. Where is it? Right there, I, here. Smells like AI spirit from Beatmaster. Yeah, so it has one vote on it. Has two now. Two. Thanks to Roger Chang. Yeah, we can go with that. Oh, now it's number one. Look at that. Boom. See, what happens, man? This is what happens when the media conspires to push something more than something else. It's called gatekeeping. Oh, oh, wait a minute. Wait, did you guys hear that Tater's gonna Tate is withdrawing from the race? Yeah, sorry. You just throw it away your vote. You know, when I hear Tater's, I think of Po-Tater's. Po-Tater's? What's up, Tater? What do you think of the fans of Tay Allen or the haters of Tay Allen? We had a mass text reference in the chat room yesterday. Nice. We first did the day story. Awesome. Well, hey guys, I'm gonna hit the bricks. Oh yeah, go do that thing. Sweet. Report back, I just know. Cheers. Brick hitting. Brick hitting. I think today I recorded everything properly. Still says live streaming, so that's good. I saw it run. Yeah, it's still live. If you wanna know the slack sound that you may have heard come over my mic in the show was Jenny telling me that she had finally got to the end of yesterday's show. Oh nice. Cause she had written, hey, today's video started late. I'm sure you know. And I was like, you didn't watch all the way to the end of the show, did you? And then right then at 1.53 PM, no, I just listened. So there you go. She didn't watch. Oh, yeah, all right. That's what I do next. Put that in the backseat. Lamar, Brian did that. Stuart Shaffay. That show was brand first, like what, two decades? Which show? The Computer Chronicles. Oh yeah. You know, I never caught it when it was on. You know, I don't want to be too critical of it. I had issues, but I mean, part of it was at the time. Don't you have issues? Hot women. Actually, I don't have issues with hot women. No, it was at the time, like, you know, I was like in junior high and like, yeah, you had compute, home family computing, bite, like a couple of other, but there wasn't a lot of computer stuff. And I was like, whoa, it's on TV, and I get to see these things actually run instead of read about how like the cursor or the screen changes is like pretty awesome. I couldn't own an Amiga, but I could see someone use one on TV. Do, do, do, do, do, do. Hey, so interestingly, Roger, are you logged in as yourself? Yeah, you're logged in yourself, never mind. Oh, in the chat room? No, in the hangout. One of these days, log in as DTNS, and I want to see if you're able to switch the video. Let me see, I can do that right now, can't I? Or is that gonna break it? No, you're gonna get logged back in. Yeah, I want to test something. Got an idea. Well, can't, I'm gonna run it in a different browser. Or is that gonna break everything? No, I don't think it'll break everything, but we might get some nasty feedback from you if you don't mute one of them. All right, I'll mute. All right, you can that one. I wonder what, oh, you might not be able to get your camera either since it's on the same machine. We'll see. Wow, he really went, it's really gone. So sad. Now, what I want to do is, so those of you who go to diamondclub.tv, and I'm just blanking on the name of what we call that, you know that you can see the stories come up in, as we're talking. What is that called? The second screen? Is it just second screen? Guess what we just called second screen? I thought it was something even crazier than that. But yeah, so I was thinking what if we had the second screen as a member of the hangout? And at first I was thinking Sergeant Muffin would have to do something. But Tinvec and Beatmaster showed us, or pointed out that we could just run diamondclub.tv. Oh, but we'll be on delay. That might be the problem with it, is we'll be on delay. We could, we could do second screen, anyway. All right, there's Roger coming back. But we could do second screen for the show. Roger could capture it. Hello, Roger. What happened? I'm trying to figure out how to do this without. Oh yeah, you get a, you have to like turn down the volume on the other one too or something. All right, how's that? All right, you've been fine for us. Okay, so I am technically running on two accounts right now and I'm maxing out my CPU. So what do, what do you- Okay, so what I want you to do is choose yourself in the hangout right now. Even though I'm talking- That's DTNS, so do you want to choose DTNS? Just click on yourself to switch it to yourself. Yeah. Are you doing that now? Yes, I've done that. And I'm gonna talk and I wanna see if it actually changes back to you, to me, because I'm running the hangout and now I'm gonna stop talking. Didn't work. Unclick yourself. Oh, okay, sorry. So you saw yourself the whole time, right? Yes, I saw myself the entire time. Nah, that was a little workaround I was gonna try. Oh, is this to get a, wait, do you wanna get a copy of the stream or just the- No, no, no. What I wanna do is have the second, I wanna use second screen on diamondclub.tv which shows the pages. And I was like, what if we could put second screen in the hangout? And someone suggested, well, you could have the, you could do screen capture of diamondclub.tv with the second screen running. And so I was like, oh, well, Roger could do that instead of hiding himself. You could just have second screen up. And I said, but, and then I was thinking, but it will never be front and center. It will, and I was like, well, I wonder if Roger could click on himself to make it front and center, but no, you can't. Even when you're logged in as DTS. All right, you can go back to the other account or do whatever now. I don't know if that made sense. But the, yeah, the only, you know how like on Fridays, I can click on Len and make him the center. And then if I forget, everyone's like, hey, Tom, you forgot. So I was hoping if Roger were logged in as DTS, he could do that too, but apparently not. But that's because you actually set up the hangout, right? Yeah, I guess it knows that I'm the one who set up the hangout and you're just an imposter. Why does that have to be so smart? Yeah, it still might work because I could still occasionally go to that. But if I forget to unclick it or something. And then, but the second screen would just basically stream it into Diamond Club. Well, the second screen, what the second screen does, Jackie Hearn does it for cord killers. You put up, you put URLs in and the second screen shows the page you're talking about. I guess if we did the second screen and I put it in the hangout though, that would be an inception because if someone was watching second screen, then it would also be showing up at the hangout every once in a while, but yes. Sergeant Muffin says, all problems would be solved if I wasn't at work while you record the show. Yeah, man, I know. One of these days, we'll make a Patreon level for that. We'll work around your schedule. Yeah, seriously. Okay, wonder if SoundCloud's gonna be better today. Oh, that's a nice little tidbit factoid or a factoid. What's that? The computer Chronicles was, the producer for it was Jim Henson. I'm sure that's a complete coincidence of having the same exact name. Yeah, yeah. Jim Henson, two in IMDb probably. I think I'm Tom Merritt, two or three in IMDb. I used to be in IMDb. I don't think I am anymore. Why would they take you out? It's not like the show suddenly doesn't exist. I mean, I know it doesn't get made, but it still happened. It's a historical fact. Oh no, I'm number one. So I am the first Roger. Wait, that's weird, because that's Chan. I have a G in my name. So wait, there's a one, there's a two, then who is three? Three is missing. Every one of them? Yes, producer screensavers. Yeah. But no one put me down for call for help. I've had tech TV shows come and go. I've had my roles added and removed. I don't understand the removing, because there was never one that was wrong. They were always straight out of the credits. Wait, someone also put me in for this week in tech and that's tough, yeah. As a, because you've been on it as a guest host, as a guest. Yes. That's an appearance credit. But yeah, it's in itself. That's funny. But they don't have a call for help and they don't have any of, they don't have tech Zella. I don't have any of the other stuff I did. Signal by Sony is not a TV series. Actually, W Scottis one is suggesting what we need is a switcher. And it's like, well, yeah. Yes, a video switcher would totally help or a beefy computer we could run. That would require us to do what Brushwood does. I mean, I can do what Justin does and do it myself, but I'm not gonna be as good of a host for the show if I do that. And what Brushwood does is he hires someone and builds such a whole big studio, which I could do. I just prefer to spend my time and money on other things right now and don't have a lot of extra leftover. So it's for you. So anyway, yes. I mean, another thing I could do would be sell the show to somebody with a bunch of resources. Again, these are all on a gradient. What I was looking for with this particular solution was an elegant way to just make that happen without any ongoing commitments. You mean basically, and you couldn't share your screen. Second screen, that's what second screen was for. Yeah, Sergeant Muffin's right. There are simpler ways to do it than Brian does it. That's true, because I don't need to have all those cameras. I could just do it the way Chad does it. But then again, it's still the. The mental switch. Yeah, I don't know. Unless you make the switch like a foot button. So you don't have to mess up with your hands. You just hit left toe, left toe. Well, the other thing is you could just feed it into another lap. Well, you're here, right? You could switch. The question is. Can I go? Well, you could. We could have you sort of hang out, right? Or we could, I don't know, we could set up all this equipment at your house and I just send you my video and then you switch. Yeah, I like the flexibility of not having to have a physical location too. Yes, I just think there has to be a, there seems like there's a simpler solution to all this. I can't think of it right now. And it's explicitly you want to send it to Diamond Club or do you want to just send it to like this The actual. Well, all I was wanting to do, and I made it way more complicated in the explanation by trying to figure out how to do it at the same time, is take the second screen, do you know what that is? You mean you like your tablet? No, second screen on diamondclub.tv is a feature that shows you web pages that are being talked about. Okay. Okay, so all I was thinking was, ah, if someone's doing that, then could we have that browser screen in the hangout? As its own guest, if you will. That makes sense. Yeah, but what if I shared a desk screen? Well, yeah, I mean the easy, the way to do it, well, first of all, we have to do it and we have to do the second screen thing. But then instead of hiding yourself, you can just change to share screen to that screen. Yeah, that part is easy. Then the question is, do we make you set up the hangout so that you can do that switching? Maybe we do. And Sergeant Muffin is also solving the problem. I thought Sergeant Muffin was at work. Problem solved, it was his stream and you stream. Let's talk offline, toggle between the page and them. That Sergeant Muffin may have solved it. Are you in the chat room, Roger? Yeah. Let's chat with him in a minute. I think I've finished publishing the show, so. Just by taking the stream. All right. Yeah, I am. I did it, I published the show while trying to figure all that out. That was crazy. Okay, I guess I'm done. Wow. Thanks everybody. We'll talk to you tomorrow.