 Rwy'n gofio. Rwy'n gofio. Rwy'n gofio. Rwy'n gofio, a'n ni, Rwyn. Ann O'n – sorry, I've had to write this down because it's a lot – Ann O'n's Chrissie's House is an on call 24 hour centre to help response interventions surrounding suicide, so that's for people who have suicidal thoughts and for people who have lost somebody through suicide. Rwy'n gofio. Rwy'n gofio, but I don't own suicide. I don't own Chrissie's House. I'm the founder of Chrissie's House. The founder of Chrissie's House. You're the founder of Chrissie's House. Chris is how it's the charity that was set up because I lost my son Christopher to suicide and I'm very well thank you. Good, it's good to have you on because I've been trying to get you on for a while now, I know you're a busy woman. So let's get straight at it, Christopher passed away in 2011, that's correct. Was there any signs or anything to show that he was having those suicidal thoughts? Yeah, not at the time, but when you look retrospectively, you can pick up the Christopher as pretty, pretty ill. We did discuss it, we got him to go to the doctor, he went to the doctor, he was referred for post-traumatic stress to a psychiatrist. The psychiatrist gave him medication and between giving the medication and him dying, you know, it wasn't enough, it wasn't enough so Christopher took his life. And it does say on some medications that you can go even though you're there to help prevent suicide but it says on the box you can go to a cyber. Yes. So it's a sticky one for anybody? It's difficult because there's nobody, no one at all wants them to die of suicide. It's not the doctors, it's not the psychiatrists, it's getting the balance of having somebody to pick up people in their absolute distress, you know, if they're feeling like having suicidal thoughts. Maybe they've been given prescription drugs and, you know, the suicide ideation comes into them, you know, so just get somebody at that point to say it's okay but here as we're doing Chris's house. It's bridging a gap, Chris's house is supposed to bridge a gap between asking for help and getting to the point that you've lost hope that the help isn't there. And I think that's the major problem, I know a lot of people's asking for help, they're too, I don't know if they're too proud, it's the number one killer in the UK they're now for me and it's scary to think that nobody can ask for help because everybody's got problems, everybody's got demons, everybody's got some sort of thing that can trigger it. And it's scary to think that there's too much pride to ask for help, they're too embarrassed. I don't think it's pride, there's a lot of factors in it, you know, people are despondent, they don't believe that anyone can help them when they're like that, you know, when they're in their darkest hour they actually don't believe that there's anyone can help. Sometimes, like Christopher, when he went and asked for help and was given medication and probably, I don't know, I'm not in his head nor was I in his head, he thought, is that it? Is that all there is? It's not all there is. Until you're affected by suicide, you actually don't know the amount of help that's there for people. You know, there's all sorts of grassroots charities and there's major mental health charities all working to prevent suicide. There is a stigma attached, it's lessening, it's lessening certainly, you know, because there's more awareness being raised all the time. But there is a stigma to what people worry about their jobs, is it going to affect their jobs, is it going to affect their life? As I've seen, it's been a weaker person, they haven't been manned up. Probably the best way to man up is to speak up, you know, and get in touch with your own self, you know, be more true to yourself. There's so many factors that come into play in so many different levels, social media, addictions, just people no feeling good enough, people no feeling good enough, no feeling that they are enough. You know, the bar is raised so high for some people now. You know, they can go, champagne, charles and think everything's okay, you know, front stage. But there's no matter if it's going on in their mind. So how do they get, being the big guy that was out there, like Olaf saw jokes and everything else, to admit that they're that guy sitting in their own feeling so isolated and so alone, and so hopeless that nobody, how do we get that message to say, you know, you are worth it, you are enough? There has to be a whole shift in people's attitudes. Not paying lip service to actually doing it. Chris's house is the only place in Scotland that's independent of NHS. I know that there's a crisis centre in Edinburgh. It's called Crisis that is attached to, I'm not sure, I think it's between the NHS in Penumbra. It's another mental health service. We've got Sam H. They've got houses that they take people. Oddly enough, there's waiting lists even for the third sector. There's waiting lists for it to be seen. Chris's house, there's absolutely no waiting list. None. It's a very non-clinical environment. You've been in it, James. That's amazing. It's quite amazing. There was a big place held in Liverpool last week. James's place, fabulous, for guys to be able to go in and talk at Leisure, at the Rees. We've been doing it for three years here in Scotland, without any big fanfare about it, and we do it very, very well. We've had over 700 people helped in Chris's house, and it's not a wee bit of anxiety. We take that a wee bit of anxiety seriously, just the same, because it's value in the person. But we've also put people in with their open marks around their neck, where somebody's actually caught them before they've died. We've had serious interventions, very serious interventions. Very often we have to use a duty of care and call the police for people. Again, the police in the ambulance, very responsive. You know what, everybody's doing the best that they can. There's now a new scheme, £4.2 million, and more is coming. Many more millions are coming into North Lanarkshire where we are. Distress, brief intervention. There's still some hiccups in that as well. Do you know what their pile is? Distress, brief intervention. Any help at all is good. We're not saying that what we do is the only way. It's absolutely not. There isn't a one fit for all. Everyone's different. I've got people attached to Chris's house as you know. You've met them, I've introduced them. They're different techniques for your mental wellness. People's mental wellness. I wouldn't have gone to the gym. You know, it's not my thing. But I've got a young guy in protein G. He's Matt Dixon, you've met him too. Anyone from Chris's house, Matt will put them in and work with them so well. Free charge. You know, everybody wants to help, everybody wants to make a difference. I've got James Raffagin raising him off techniques. I've got Carol Robertson, my whole load of haveners. We use a lot, an awful lot of havening in Chris's house. We use CBT, we use DBT, we've got psychotherapy. The only thing we won't use in the alternative therapies are clinical hypnotherapy. It's a bit of a mind field. Is that about NLP? No, clinical hypnotherapies. It's a four year course. If somebody comes in, obviously you've got these different techniques and methods. How do you fit that method on to somebody and say, right, they maybe need this one or that one? What's the difference? Depending on the trauma. If somebody's presented me a trauma and it's an act of trauma, say somebody's just found somebody that's died by suicide. You know what the flashbacks that they get. We can use havening as a technique to get that trauma deep attention. Can you speak about havening because a lot of people might not know that? Yes, because I know. In the amygdala, it all links with the parasympathetic system. In the brain. In the neuropathways. Now you've got fight, flight or freeze. When the amygdala, when the amparisceptors come out in the amygdala, it puts you into fight, flight or freeze. Now that's your adrenaline, your adrenaline rush. That's constantly. It's the toxic stress. Stress is good. Adrenaline is good. We need it. But if it's toxic stress, it's moving your neuropathways to different ways. Poison? Yes. It's infecting. It's causing sort of unwellness. That can be depotentiated through the havening touch. It's all working in the psychosensory. It's working in the neuropathways and separating the emotion for that trauma. Now EMDR does that as well. As an NLP can help with that as well. All of these, you have to respect that everybody that's working in these fields. All of them are effective. It's finding the right one for the right person. When they come into Chrissie's house and they have a long chat, we can find out. If it doesn't work, we'll move on to another one. We'll tell them that right to the offset. It's not the case that I'm moving you. It's not working. It's how do you feel about that? We treat every single person on an individual basis, individual level. Immediately, just coming into the surroundings of Chrissie's house, you see people's shoulders going down. They start to relax, their tears come. They've arrived and they've got hope. As long as there's a wee bit of hope, that's when their mindset starts working because they've asked for help and they're getting it now. That's the main priorities to ask first to show that. Of course we can and that's an upsetting thing as well, because we spoke about the numbers that people are jumping off. Kingston Bridge and Erskine Bridge is constant and we don't obviously hear about it all the time, but it's nearly every day and these numbers are terrifying. It's not just homeless people, it's people just giving up. They've had enough and to think that you're no good enough and you think you're better off away from everybody. It's heartbreaking. So what age was Christopher when he first passed 36? 36. He was your oldest in which spoke earlier. Obviously the first two years was difficult. Obviously we see now the amazing things you're doing at Chrissie's house. You're that bubbly and happy and very soft-spoken. I came in all loud and daft and what to say to the world. You're like, James, calm down. I'm like, right, okay. So we make me calm, but obviously it's not been like that the first two years, obviously lining your bed. I didn't go out of my bed. I was just laying the couch with a blanket around me. I walked around the house with a blanket around me. I was safe to blanket. I didn't really speak much. Some nights during the night I would go to the cemetery in my pajamas. Do you know? This is the one that has been my desk. Do you know? I said, there's people out in that cemetery during the night. What do you think they're doing that? Really? Same as me. It's happening. It's when you think of the ripple effect of suicide. Now, we've got a close family, an immediately close family, and we've all destroyed, devastated, but was so the job that they had to keep me alive to stop me, my guilt as a mother that could need to save her son. That was me. Then he's got a wee boy that's left. That's... A child will think, why did my parent... Why was I known off? Why did my parent leave me? And you know, Christopher adored his wee boy. Absolutely adored him. But when people are in that mindset, they think their families are better off without them. They're a burden. They're a burden. Do you know what? And that's the saddest thing. If these people that died by suicide could see their funerals for the people that did. Care? Care. Do you know what? They were shocking. I would say there was nearly a thousand people at Christopher's funeral. Do you know what? It was massive. Absolutely. I don't know. Can't remember a bit. It put me in a very dark place. Very, very dark place. I did his brothers and his aunties, his uncles, his cousins, his pals. That's a huge ripple. I was standing and asking the question, why did I not speak to me? Why did I not see it? Does everybody blame themselves? Did you blame yourself at the start? Absolutely. Absolutely. I blame myself for every scalp. Because I was a mum with a scalp. It rains back sides and more. That was the way it was 40 years ago. 43 years ago. Especially with three boys that were just plowing round about the floor when you're trying to get them up. The shocks and stuff. That's the way it is. The way it was, it was easy this way. It was quicker. So every scalp, every row, we were in the Waltons. Did you repeat that over and over in your head then? Man. Man. I. Every wrong word. Every argument. You torture yourself. Absolutely. Maybe if I did that. Maybe if that was me. You know. Completely. And that would blame yourself. I came into the bit that no matter what I did in bringing up my sons, I did the best I could at the time and the circumstance that I was in. You know, I have to accept that there's nothing I can do about it. I love my sons. I love my sons. Christopher loved his mother. It was, if I had been there during that night, if I wouldn't have, you know, if I had been in my house, or if I had been in his house, it wouldn't have happened. You know. But that's all that's been about sometimes. You keep repeating it and repeating it and it's as sad as it is. The trauma that you've went through, you've saved 700 odd people. So sometimes that bad loss or that tragic loss that you get to go, do you know what? I'm going to do something about this. It's changed you as a person completely. It's probably changed your family. And even though you're going to get these thoughts, we're natural. It's going to, you're going to think about the past. It happens. But like I say, the first week you opened Christy's house, you had seven people walking the door who were suicidal. Do you know what I mean? Which is crazy. And it is. And even though the fuckups that I've done in the past, I've still got to thank it. A lot of shit I'm not proud of. I've got to thank it. Because I've made this a man I'm other now. It's making the changes. It's a part of the journey. Everybody's cards are dealt differently, but it's not about the cards you're dealt with. It's about how you play them. We can sit there and we can, and you've got to grieve. You've got to sit on the couch. You're not just going to walk about and high five people the first week or the first year. You're going to have that pain the rest of your life. Absolutely. And we've spoke about it before when I had Parmalam and Rowan. It's not about times of healer. You adapt. You learn the pain. It's different. You love it. You love it. You learn how to write and move on with it and try and help others. And the results that you are getting in Christy's house are unbelievable. I just think, and I hope more people get involved because it's still quite early days. It's still quite... It's a baby. Yeah, it's growing, but the amount of people are getting involved and the amount of people behind it. Because I worked with Jim when I came to Vizier's last week. It's about breathing techniques. We spoke about that earlier. The breathing techniques is the Wim Hof method. Wim Hof lost his wife to suicide. It's the one that doesn't know. Wim Hof's got documentaries on YouTube and they're saying that he's obviously his methods are helping the world people with depression, fear and anxiety. Just for breathing techniques. And I struggle with those struggling anxiety and I bark my demons every day when I've done this class last Friday. I don't know if it lasted 30 minutes or no. I felt so calm. I was with my big pal James and we sat there and we were breathing. And everybody sat up and everybody was so calm and so happy. We left that class so happy just for breathing techniques and I felt if everything was released and it might sound crazy. Check out this guy Wim Hof. It's unbelievable. But that's man's doing. He can control his body temperature. He can control his subquart. He's no subquart. He's conscious mind and he's controlling the central nervous system just for his breathing techniques. The guy's running up mountains. It's scientifically proven. Now it's scientifically proven because in the past we're trying to make it as if it's crazy. The mainstream, he didn't want to promote this because it's natural and it's free. He don't want that. Do you know what I mean? Pharmaceuticals are going to make money on that. So Wim Hof and Jim's an amazing man because Jim used to do Ironmans and I don't know if he did judo or whatever. But three is karate. I don't know what Danny is. But Jim had to arrive at that through a journey researching as well for his betterness to get ready house demons. Wim Hof obviously started that after he lost his wife and was left with the children. Now there's a big Wim Hof weekend coming up in Wisher. The first weekend in August. So we're going to be buying it and they're promoting that. The Havenin under the auspices of Carol Robertson and the Rudins. They developed the Havenin technique, Paul McKenna. All these methods are fabulous. They're new and people are skeptical and cynical. I'm watching them working. I'm watching them working. I've got four Havenins in Chrissie's house and they're working alongside your mainstream therapists. We use elastic therapists like Brachy, Reflexology, Aromatherapy. Everything combined. There's something to suit somebody. We can't be losing. The breathing techniques are unbelievable when I'm going to do the 10-week course with Jim and I'm going to bring it to Glasgow and try it. Listen, it may not be for everybody, but it seems to be working. I've only done it once and the way I felt after it was unbelievable. Because he says release. Because I've all got all this anxiety in the persona and the big man act. I'm just a fucking scared wee boy. Do you know what I mean? I'm sure I can get to her free hand before the end of the day. I just think the breathing techniques and there was a sense when I was saying if you keep breathing because I was getting tingles in my hand but he's saying just go through it and go through it just for deep breaths and I was worried but I don't know if that's the fear because in my mind I'm thinking they're all looking at me. That was the insecure he's kicking in and I just let go and then everybody sat up and it's unbelievable and I'm hoping to get this course done and bring it to Glasgow because there's so many people just with these breathing techniques that can take control of your mind again and take away the anxiety and the fear, the depression. It's unbelievable. So for the... Do you want these breathing techniques as well? I was in one and I haven't put a lot of effort in them because I'm time constrained and people say I should take time but when I'm taking time I've got a new grandson I've got a new Christopher's son Noy's no more son he's my grandson and I'm sorry. She has got a new grandson. 15 times last week. It's the standard joke line now Did I tell him that I've got a new grandson? I'm so over the moon and she's called Christopher Christopher Andrew so I was in one of the breathing classes with Jim and I watched a man he was in my group of adolescents and I brought Jim in to do the breathing method with him because he was with him Oresler was a man getting into this breathing when we came out here and I said to Jim, is he okay? Do we need to get a doctor for this? He was so he was like he was like spasms he was getting into it he was totally blown away with the breathing he was totally blown away his head was clear but you know it's all good but you have to despite as well that there is a need some people get very very mental well and they need medical attention as well and that's what I'm saying with suicide and I'm not against it, I'm not a doctor but I keep saying the medication listen if it's if your ready to go suicide if it can pull you back a couple of steps to maybe sort you out and look at the bigger picture but for me medication does numb your pain it suppresses your feelings and emotions you're not really handling it it's eventually going to build up maybe the liver, kidneys all that shit's doing at your insides as well so with the breathing techniques is it sending all the oxygen is it more oxygen that goes to the brain as your whole body's getting alternated so that's where you're feeling more alive more energy I see a big similarity with Haven the brain is there's a bit of EMDR I've moved in did you used to be a psychologist? no I was never a psychologist no I studied no no at all there's big differences in that no no no so when did you used to I studied that I studied social science so it gave me a good foundation for understanding when people are talking and you know when they're talking about the brain and the parts of the brain and stuff I do a lot of courses I'm not I'm a mami I'm just a mami, no I'm no psychologist I went to Cali up there Glasgow Caledonia I'm not a snob if you want to go to snob if you want to go to snob if you need to go to Glasgow or Strathclyde so no I'm not a uni snob but that's what I'm saying it gave me the background understanding it I was a sales rep I was a cleaner in my town I'm not anything I'm just somebody that lost her son and decided that do something about it I'm going to say I'm not anything because like I say Christy's house it's 700 people and that's momentum but that's a team that's a team of volunteers I'm not trying to be humble I've got the vision that I wanted I had a vision and I'm putting that vision into play but I couldn't do it without the people at work for nothing in Christy's house what's the ages from what age to oldest I tell you if it's a child at a parent's can it be a child at nine it's getting sent to me calms it's okay and we've had a woman at 80 so there is now a socio-economic socio-economic category I was out there the local counciller for our area and people jumped to it is it drugs, is it drink is it all the food depression for the year there is now there is now a reason that we can pinpoint you know I took around to one of Christopher Pall's graves as we'll stand there his clothing is going on is that lack of education no there is now probably the millionaires that are taking their lives is that lack of money is that social deprivation but there is a big factor as in the social deprivation and the inhumanity in this country at the minute in the divide in the poverty poverty has got big impacts on people's wellness hunger, homelessness stress it's causing toxic stress it's causing toxic stress the need to keep up with the Joneses with people with their kids and stuff it's massive peer pressure absolutely massive the main root of the causes though for the numbers, for men why do you think men is higher than women it's like you say men find it more difficult to open up and talk because our culture is like you're a big baby you're standing there greeting like a big lassie they're tiny boys aren't supposed to cry boys have the same emotions as women a great order of time now that's because you've found yourself you've found something beautiful fucking cross my path I swear again sorry no no, I agree on it I agree on it too I see green at tampon adverts and don't worry about women that's I think it's a lot to do with men have got a lot of pressure on them to be the provider you know get right back to cavemen hunters and gatherers men have got a lot of pressure to be the strong one but it's not weak it's not weak to identify your emotions and say do you know what actually I could cry do you know it's not weak to be a role model that cries when they're sad it's natural it's not weak to be a role model that cuddles your adult child do you know what can I say I need a hug hug every day and a hug's me now do you think the schooling can come in to play with us? absolutely they have to educate for any age for the mindset and the natural stuff about energies and living everything comes within working on the brain and the mindset even working on death I believe we've got to kind of accept it because when people die we go right off the rails especially me back in the past I couldn't handle it so I had behind to drink the drugs because it made me feel I don't care but looking back now I was so weak man I was so vulnerable because I didn't understand death I'm thinking always thought people live forever you kind of don't see it and then once one goes two goes and then I'm kind of just kind of get a harm queen of get a song for that queen of get a song for that who wants to live forever who wants to live forever but at that stage when you don't really understand death and somebody dies you don't know how to handle it well there's different cultures and there's different religions that I remember when I was wee my papa died and was getting buried the day that I made my first communion and I had to go in view my papa's body and came a kiss you're terrified you're shriven but in the Catholic religion in my in my years we were we were engulfed and they died you to go in and sit in the rosaries every night did they get buried you know what the coffins lying open your bodys that now you know but you take that as normal now you'd be horrified people take selfies now no it's a fucking sex society definitely I just think but for the suicide thing it is massive it's really massive and I think a lot of people are asked that there's no need for it but a lot more people are opening up to it and the numbers have dropped is that true? 1% they say it dropped I think you'll find in this years I'll have to go up again and wish just lately between March and me there were 7 deaths just in Washer that's a small place 7 suicide deaths just in that area in surrounding it the village is surrounding it Wishing remains so numbers are even higher in Glasgow then? there's been 2 in Shorts at Anwarth within the past 4 weeks it's sad to think people can go it's heartbreaking they've had boys at 16, 17, 19 a life in front of them they've had new status it's heartbreaking for this heartbreaking for the community it's certainly heartbreaking for me that's certainly Chris's house on the door why is there nothing like this in Glasgow why is there nothing like this in the big cities the suicide shelters are the places where people can go there's this drop-in centre in the town centre but I think it's only open to 10 o'clock fucks sake so that maybe they commit suicide at 11 at 12 o'clock at night do you know what I mean couldn't some of the doctors don't do it after 6 either they don't know what I mean so there needs to be they're trying to change things the thing is you have to remember again you have to remember that there's people what I know he's been 20 years studying suicide research he can't dismiss the fact that people have studied years to try and get a solution to this doctors have studied for 7 years to become doctors they don't specialise in suicide they don't specialise in depression psychiatrists do the brain is so difficult there are guinea pigs when you talk about medication but these guys have studied and worked hard to get to where they're at you know there's a certain snow brain nursing and everybody that's that's worked and that's their vocation so they think they believe in what they're doing but they've got the power because they've got the validation science and university masters and PhDs and everything else behind them for a wee mami here like me to go up and say that's no working they're not going to take care of that but people that have got compassion will say do you know what working together that should help there is other ways it's all about compassion and empathy there's a bit of getting everybody to go absolutely you find that in charity as well there's too many egos as well at times I find that in Christi's house people come into Christi's house and they think they can do better so they go in she's this and she's that and she's I'm doing the best I can but do you know what I feel that some people go and pick one of your veins pick your vein pick a vein this is a society where people are people are judging people are trying to do what you can to save lives and let's say the results speak for themselves and this is because I believe that's guilt so when we were doing the homeless stuff I know you get wankers saying bad stuff I believe that's guilt because they ain't got the balls to do that they know deep inside that they should be helping why are you sitting behind a screen why are you talking about something else that's trying to do a good deed just because doctors are listening and they're amazing they do research through books and they might not understand energies are positive vibes because it's no scientific information but the majority are this is what I believe in I read this for this book, this medication here but you go to the member every prescription they give they're getting paid for it they don't want an actual remedy they go for a nice walk start eating cleaner start surrounding yourself with positive people these wee small steps do help you're talking to somebody who is like that as well just to see yourself a negativity which is difficult but even cleaning up your diet going for a walk if you're feeling that condensed and stuck and see if you go on in nature it can make the world a better place because you start seeing things you go wait a minute the world is a bigger place and I'm not saying it works for everybody but the small steps through natural remedies and through kindness and being better try to become a better person which is difficult it's fucking hard man especially in the society we're in I say you're still doing good things and people are still getting wee digs or might say this and might say that and is it doctors and other people that are saying that it's still working or do you get that? I don't really get it it's like well you know I had a paramedic when I say one day when I had to phone them and somebody disclosed that they're taking an overdose they're in our door they disclosed they're taking an overdose and I phoned paramedics we kind of do anything about somebody taking an overdose we kind of detox people do you know we we can't paramedics is it's like you need to see the professionals then it's okay that's okay my psych is there because I haven't studied I haven't worked with it I haven't had a 19 years experience 15 years experience working in the council sector or whatever so it's a bad illegal dig isn't it? we're new so people are skeptical about anything that's new they're cynical I say try these look up the man when I'm off and he comes across crazy but in my opinion we're all nuts we're all fucking crazy are you lying now it's no popular for saying what is normal we're all nuts he's a Glasgow psychiatrist but then Bethlehem he said what is normal we actually have to all ask ourselves that question what is normal is it societal normal is it the norm of society you know there's boundaries there's laws there's rules in society everybody try to fit in with everybody else and try to be everybody else instead of being an individual creativity as soon as you're born we've all got a gift we've all got greatness but everybody's trying to compete but you're all nothing everybody but if you take a step outside the box you realise who am I they forget they've come so disconnected and I think that's a big party and you've got feeling you know something's right there's certain schools and there's reshaffed schools you went to nursery and you went to school and you got a new book that's assuming that every single one in that school is at the same level so that's the assumption that starts off in and then you've got other kids falling back you've got other kids that can't read properly you know whether it's dyslexia or whatever else but just because they can't read the book doesn't mean they cannae dice up nails no no but this is what society is conditions conditions to people to achieve of course isn't it you're no good enough at schools that's what you use the left side part of your brain which is numbers memorisation the right side is your creativity we're a need obviously we're a need we're progressing we've progressed so far with science and education stuff we're so backward on it I think we're going backwards as human beings we've progressed and we've advanced so far that we've got to stand still we've kind of forgotten why we're on this fucking planet we don't know if we came from monkeys or avatars or we can go round in circles saying we're aliens we don't know we just need to agree that love, compassion, honesty or the natural traits in life is the way that we should be and I still get angry and upset I see people and I think to myself I'd love to punch fuck at you and that's what I say inside to you and I go right he's not really there and I'm being honest I can do all these breathing techniques in yoga but I still get angry and agitated it's a natural emotion unhappist, naturally to be angry but it's just about trying to channel it and a better understanding and a better life and feel your emotions where am I feeling this, why am I feeling that which is a very difficult thing to do it's the thing with parents now as well they're doing everything to make sure their children don't be sad they're getting frantic because they don't understand it we just get everything, we buy them, we do we spend time, we do this, do that we'll always be sad you know it's natural to be sad at times it's natural to be angry it's natural to be happy what do you think is the main trigger point for it all though there must be something that's triggering it for the numbers to be higher for me as well what do you think is the trigger point even if you're asking for a specific thing there's no specific trigger is that what you're saying that all these people have got the same trigger if you're asking for one trigger there's none the mindset are the when people come in they ask them there's a mindset way beyond anything that we understand James because we're still here they're gone, they're gone further they're gone further what I know only few people that have made serious attempts on their life coming into Christ's house are they don't often have a recollection of before they actually did the act so you can't remember it, it's like a black out it's like a black out so there's no place that we've been so we can't understand it because we've not been there I don't know what like Professor O'Connor is speaking to if he gets to that he's probably more he's the man that does the suicidal research Glasgow you know I'll let you get him in here hard man he's just had a big he's working with Sam H that's going to the Association of Mental Health on a big study on why men in particular you know his work his work influences and can influence the government procedures he's highly involved in the stress relief intervention his whole thing is about suicide prevention his whole work is researching what causes it and he's been doing it for 20 years with no got a cause so here you're starting to ask me what triggers that I'm a mami I think we could then always be certain it could just be the way of life that's the thing with suicide you don't have to get the answer to why because you know what even if they write a letter it makes sense to the person that's writing the letter one that night around that morning or on that day it makes sense to them when they're writing at the time but if I'm sitting as a mother looking at a letter which I didn't get a letter is such I get sporadic notes there isn't a good enough excuse in there for my son to die there isn't a good enough excuse for the letter it still leaves with the family why why we could have worked to that we could have fixed that do you know some people say well there's nothing we could do to you and that's what they need to say and that's what they need to feel to get some semblance of peace within the shelf but an actual fact the way this is my opinion is that it doesn't matter what they say if it's 50,000 brownie date if it's I've committed as a realist there's nothing can be fixed nothing so why would some so they're not thinking I'm actually a burden I'm going to bring trouble at my family it doesn't matter what it is it can be fixed but they don't think that the suicide person the person that's died by suicide hasn't thought that out they wouldn't have liked that pain in their family they wouldn't have do it so do you think there will be a chemical imbalance as well with the mindset everything can be the brain as well the brain can trigger a lot of things and the brain's a tricky thing that we're still trying to study absolutely if you hit a drink of drugs then it can be a trauma maybe you've been abused or younger maybe your dad was an alcoholic they kind of know why that stuff has not been but for the suicide thing they're still that's too clear, it's too cut and drive we know that aces that's adverse childhood effects we know that that causes trauma we knew that for John Bulby's theatre John Bulby is a psychologist he did the study that proved material deprivation of the lucky bonding where mothers and sons mothers and sons mothers and children that had adverse childhood effects on the child then they studied the latchkey kids in the 90s now we've got resilience and aces aware and everybody we know what's wrong but who's going to stop it where's the resources to stop it all these techniques like Wim Hof The Rudin's Havering they're all new people are gradually is gradually creeping in it's a massive shift we're looking for a quick fix we're looking for a quick fix but we're saying we know this works take it but people aren't ready to take things all the time they have to go their journey they have to go their journey so orly enough people and you've got life coaches that are trying their best to change people's lives you can choose us to do this I'll be there and this is what good but that's a big journey before that life coach gets to where it's at you've got people that think if they pay for counselling it must be better counselling because they have their own therapy they've got their own clinics but they give their time for the realty crisis house they understand Mac Im she's CBT and we're just in the process of getting the BSAP registration which DBT dialectical behavioural therapy it's like a long therapy but we're not trying to be on mental health organisation we're a crisis organisation people that have lost people at suicide because most of us in crisis house have lost a close member or if not a close member a friend to suicide so you can understand that we hold a lot of people safely through support groups through one to one counselling through yoga we do yoga in crisis house as well we do art therapy there's so much we open things out to the community there's so much people trying so there is no one trigger and there is no one remedy either there's no panacea there's no one easy panacea although every single therapist thinks there is panacea that's what they believe in and that's what they work in so if we disrespect that if it works it works and that's and I think for everybody that's working on your team if they've lost somebody at suicide you're probably keeping yourselves in a good place as well because you've all been through it as well so only you're helping others which is good for people that's watching how for anybody that's in this struggle for anybody that's got at suicide or for anybody that's lost suicide how can they get in contact how can they maybe we've got a facebook page that's about nine and a half thousand people follow on it they can try to email the page they can come on to our website email us our phone if we're not in the office the phone comes through at my house so I'm always on call I can walk in the door as they do they can't walk in the door I'm not saying that don't show up at all sorts of areas but I go home you've won the number they've won two, three, six, seven, double, six, seven, double, five I go home but the phone gets transferred through to my mobile I'll answer the phone if you come through to my machine it's because I won the phone to somebody there's the smart items there's breathing space all these people are there to listen they spoke at the stage show he's trying to get the phone lines on the bridges in Glasgow so that people can at least get a chance to speak to somebody before they decide to put themselves over a bridge there's so many people jump off bridges but we don't hear or hear about it so he's trying to set up something where the government to get phones put there they can lift a phone straight through to Samara and say we're on call 24 hours a day which is unbelievable there's so many people do that and we don't hear about it and we're saying we see that boat driving up and down all the time I just thought it was all I thought it was done I think it was looking for bodies every day there's Mr Patrick I can't remember the same Patrick so for anybody that's maybe too scared to think that there's no hope completely unknown missing Chris's house as you know yourself our building hasn't even got decals in the window we've no signage yeah I actually have to come where I dress and that's so that people feel comfortable that people don't know that they're coming into that building they could be coming into the volunteer they could be coming into anything but it works and so for anybody that thinks check it out man, Twitter, Facebook, Chris's house and what you're doing and I think it's unbelievable and it's amazing like I said I've met you and the staff you're a bit crazy about the restaurant that's fine I'm kidding on this what you've done honestly it's amazing and even though they've thrown me a done it shows that listen bad shit happens but we can also make good things happen from it and I think you're amazing women no doubt we'll be doing a lot of stuff in the future I really appreciate you coming on I love you to death man thank you James amazing for coming on and hopefully we'll get a few things from this and later say never give up so thank you