 What is it that you are trying to teach people, show people how people are fine? And what is this all about? I just think it's a peace of mind, being a living demonstration of peace of mind, living in the present moment, learning to trust in higher self, God, higher power, whatever people feel comfortable calling other source or the peace within. And then we just blow along with it and travel along and just share ideas about forgiveness, about how to forgive, how to let go of judgments and grievances and hurts and pains. Why is that important? Just for the peace of mind, just because the peace of mind and grievances don't go together or hurts and pains and struggles are part of an illusion of, you might say, duality where the mind is struggling to survive and struggling to reconcile things and to make its way through the world and the peace of mind is more of a surrender into the moment and trusting that if we listen to our inner guide that everything will be provided and everything will be peaceful. So that's what we do. Which is probably very difficult for a lot of people. This guy did it for the controls. Rusty, how did you get involved in this? Well, I've been on a spiritual path since 1978 when I first discovered A Course in Miracles. I've also done other paths along the way, but 15 months ago I met David and realized that he was taking the Course to a very, very deep level that I had encountered before. In terms of what? Well, actually A Course in Miracles has some pretty radical ideas in it, which other groups that I had been in, those ideas are kind of just brushed aside like God did not create the world. Or there is no world. Those are both ideas that are in the Course. Yeah. So I was very interested and intrigued by what I was hearing and David had tapes of old gatherings from years ago. And I would go for walks and I would listen to hours and hours of these tapes. And David's tapes? And David's tapes. And I would go to the kitchen table with him and I was hearing the identical message and that really amazed me. Did he keep it? Did he say? Consistency. Consistency is a very profound witness to constant peace and constant joy. So I said, I want that. Oh, it's up to me. And it's available to all of us. Yes. I think. Yes. And that's the whole teaching that is available. It's right there. It's tucked in your heart. It's just covered over by concepts of beliefs and that really need to be just looked at and questioned. And then when you start to just question what you believe and you're open to a new direction, it guides you to trust more in the present moment and that you don't need to use your past learning to survive. You can use your intuition and listening to God within yourself to be in joy and happiness. I get a lot better information perhaps. Oh yeah. Very informed. Yeah. I attended your gathering. One of the things that you were saying is that this was an experiential event for you. There's one thing about theology and reading theology. It's sort of theology, but it's not the same as living it. Is that where you're coming from with this and what I heard the rest of say? Yeah. The theology, the concepts, they're like launching pads kind of like without sending a rocket into space. You've got to have a good launch and everyone has to start somewhere. So there are many theologies, many philosophies. It doesn't really matter which one you're listening to, does it, or doesn't it? What happens is you go along and you really have to get in touch with the inner voice. And there are so many paths to God in form, but we could say that the content of all religions point to that peace of mind or that inner peace. That's really what the religion is about. It's really not about forms and rituals. Those could be helpful. Yeah, buildings, I mean, forms, rituals, buildings, groups, organizations, those could be stepping stones. But then the deeper you go into it, the more you start to see that it's a living experience and that you don't try to organize it or make a structure out of it. You just let it flow through you and like radiate through you. And it just changes your perception of the world from looking for grievances and looking to blame somebody or looking to pin, scapegoat somebody for something. So you realize that the hurt or the deep guilt that you had been carrying was just a misperception in your mind and you're able to let that go. And it feels wonderful then. And you've used the Course in Miracles to kind of help get you launched. Is that right? Yeah. You both, and I too have studied the Course in Miracles for a long time. It doesn't change your reality. So where you are is not where you were. Yeah. But how does it do that? Well, it's just a reflection of your mind's desire. So really, the Course like any path, if you really have a desire to heal, whether you're using the Course or another modality or the Bible or if you are into nature, Taoism, and there's many different tools. It doesn't matter. But if you really have that desire to heal, then you're willing to let those repressed memories and repressed unconscious emotions and beliefs come to the surface. And then you're able to let those thoughts go. When you're not even aware of them, that they're dictating your experiences on this earth, then it's like you're more like a robot that's just being run through an unconscious computer program. But when you're allowed to, when you give your mind permission to let those come up and really take a look and question them, then it's very empowering because you're not at the mercy of those unconscious beliefs. Isn't it very scary? It can seem that way when you're opening your mind to what seems to be the unknown. Which is just yourself. Right, which is just yourself and God. But this world of duality and multiplicity and fragmentation the mind becomes so accustomed to it that now it thinks that there's going to be some big sacrifice that it's going to have to give up what it knows to go into the unknown. And in one sense, it is a letting go of what seems familiar for a very joyful experience which is just coming back to the present moment. The music plays a part in this too. I'm going to ask it for you at least. Maybe for many people. Because music is so powerful and I did hear you sing last night and it's beautiful. But how does the music sit into this whole experience for you? Well, actually exactly at the same time in 1978 that I started the course. I also started hearing songs, receiving songs. And I'm not musically trained. So it was all from the inner that I had to learn. So there's been hundreds of songs over the years. But every experience, every flushing up, every forgiveness, every lesson seemingly turned into another song. And it was like, I always think in terms of the process of like scrubbing windows. So I'm a window washer basically. That's what I do. I'm washing the window of the mind. And then every time that I clean some more away, more light comes through. And it comes from me in the form of songs mostly. So since I met David, there's been like 1995 new songs that have come through that window of the mind. Hasn't been such intense cleansing going on. And I mean, you feel safe with this. I'm taking it that this is not a difficult process. I mean, for the years of doing this, yes, I do. But it definitely doesn't feel comfortable when the stuff is coming. But it always feels wonderful. It's like having the baby analogy feels wonderful after. And I think it's important for people to know so that they can notice fear. And the course does give us this whole idea of love and fear and that kind of a duality thing. So what is that all about? It's kind of like going through the darkness to the light. People will say, I got to make it through the tunnel, through the light at the end of the tunnel. That the course is really not a course in like trying to sugarcoat and use affirmations over the top of conscious beliefs to try to kind of like affirm your way into a state of bliss and happiness. But it's more the introduction basically saying that this is of course not a course on teaching the meaning of love but on removing the obstacles to the awareness of what's present. I say that of all the wonderful spiritualities of the parental wisdom that is really going through the darkness, letting it come up and handing it over to the spirit and saying, this is not serving me anymore. I want peace and happiness and these unconscious beliefs are blocking and covering and shrouding this happiness from my awareness. So it takes a lot of willingness to take the lid off so to speak and then let whatever needs to come up come up. Do you feel like what you're doing is your life's work? Yeah, it feels like it's the life's work for myself and for the whole universe in the sense that I feel like people come to it in different ways and the spirit guides them to open to this in many, many different ways. But it feels like it is my life's work. But you're dedicating your life to traveling around the world and teaching, huh? It seems that way. There are times when I've been off in my hermitage experiences where I'm just in a state of peace and quiet and I feel it's equally valuable. It just looks a little different. When I'm out gallivanting around and doing seemingly public gatherings and meeting hundreds and thousands of people and sharing these ideas, that's one aspect of the way it looks. And then when I'm in deep meditation for long periods of time or playing with my little four-legged cat and four-legged cat doing whatever, it's a state of mind. And so it does kind of take it out of the connotation of travel because I really don't see myself necessarily as a traveler. I just stay in the present moment. And one time somebody asked me, what's the difference between like a yogi who meditates will say for 16 to 20 hours a day and someone like Mother Teresa who is literally traveling all over the globe and taking people out the streets and working with her sisters of charity and so forth. And I said in forum, there's an enormous difference, but in content, that piece of the yogi, that piece of Mother Teresa, the piece of a minister, whoever has devoted their life to a piece of mind is really the same. So I don't really identify with the forums. I just stay in the moment. Well, I guess the obvious question for our audience is, how do you do that? How do you stay in the moment? Because every moment is okay. I mean, you know, and I know that if you stop and you just get to right where you are, you're like really okay, no matter what's going on. How do you spend all your time there? Yeah, well, you start to, it takes a lot of trust and it takes miracles because the past has taught us that this is a world of scarcity and lack of confrontations and conflicts. And it's like within this world initially when the mind perceives itself, it's just trying to survive a lot of time. It gets into survival mode. And therefore, the past is believed as very real in the future. It's like you've got to do all these things and plan and be careful that these consequences that happened in the past don't happen again. So it's really, through the ego, you might say that the present moment is skipped over because there's so much of a focus on future planning and defending against these kind of negative consequences. So you have miracles and they start to show you that things work out, synchronicities, like we were talking about at the beginning before we started. The synchronicities start showing up in your life. Things start working out without your effort. You start to realize that there's something else that works here other than this personality self that's struggling and striving. So the more miracles you have, the more your trust level goes up. Which is why the function of miracles, right? Yes, to increase your trust level. You're never going to be able to let go of fear unless you have trust in something else that puts your faith in. So theologies can talk about God, but it has to be a living experience before you're willing to little by little let go of that past learning and come to present trust. So how did you do it? Did you just kind of like begin handing it over gradually or did you have like a big aha moment and it's like, you know, this is really, this is really it. This really works. There was many, many, many miracles and it just seemed to occur over years where there was lots of big aha moments. But then there comes a point when you really feel the safety to just really surrender and say, okay, this can be my life's purpose and that I don't need to be concerned about the details. And that's what I was told when I was working with the Course. When I was listening to Jesus, Holy Spirit, he was saying, I will handle the details. If you'll give me your mind to use for working miracles, Christ said, I'll work the miracles through you and I'll handle all the details. And with that kind of an offering, you know, it's quite easy to say yes to and that's what I did. And it turns out to work, is it true? Oh yeah, that's the, I would say the proofs in the pudding kind of thing when you really have the experience of that joy just bubbling up and it becomes consistent. Then you say, well, okay, this is serving me. And then fear really seems like a distant memory. It's just like going, huh? It's like not there. It's like you got rid of it, just it's not there. It was never there. I mean, it feels, the joy feels so strong. It feels like Christ has always been present and the fear has been the stranger. And now it's like a distant stranger. How is all this experience for you, Resta? Well, it's kind of like, David used the analogy of, if you're willing, it's like a water slide. The trick is not to hang on with your fingernails as you're going down the water slide. The trick is to relax and surrender and let the spirit carry you. So for me, it has been the developing of trust. But what's been wonderful, especially on this trip, we've been on the road now for a little over a month, is the witnesses coming forth and people exploding in joy and finding the peace and joining in purpose and like just suddenly shaking themselves and waking up and discovering their gifts. Every place that we've been, every gathering, there's been so much joy and so much laughter. And even when people have painful things seemingly coming up or realizations about things that they've been stuck in and they share it with all of us, and we all laugh it away. You know, the belly laughs just, it's all of it all away. And so it's just so beautiful to see each one beginning to wake up, ignite, shine. So I feel it's a privilege just the way that people open their homes to us and open their hearts and minds to us. It's really beautiful. Well, your message is important, but how did you end up here? Yes. Well, I have a website, Awakening, typeinmind.net, and then I believe Grant, who lives there, he was on the Founder website and was on a global mailing list that I have called Awakening in Christ and was reading the messages. And before he knew anyone that was really into the course, he was able to connect and feel the love and support through the Internet that way, which is kind of a fun thing nowadays, because people can do it anywhere. And you could be on an island and have a little access to an Internet and then really receive a lot that way. So I just put out on my global mailing list that I'd be traveling through from Texas and working my way over through towards Florida. And he said, why don't you come and stop and do a gathering? And so he worked with Kathy at our Peace House in Cincinnati to set it up. And here we are. We showed up. Wonderful. Now we put your website on the screen, so you might have more. What is your Peace House? What is that? Oh, it's a little house. It was built in 1847 in Cincinnati. It looks like a little gingerbread house with little green shingles. And it's a place where we have computers so we can extend a lot pretty much with the global ministry that way. And a lot of peace and joy. We have a couple kitty cats there, as I mentioned, the three-legged one and the four-legged one. And people come and visit us for quiet retreats or to just have heart-to-heart discussions and so forth. And we kind of spring forth from there. And so we're traveling a lot, but it's a lot of times it's just nice to have a quiet place to pray and meditate and to receive visitors. And we're so warmly received where we go and we're taken into people's homes. So your home base is actually the Peace House in Cincinnati and you go out from there. Yeah, if people wanted to write to us, they could write to us there or the people sometimes would say, where's your postal mailing address? If you're living in a state of the kingdom of heaven, where's your postal mailing address on earth? And at this point, that's just a place that we've used as a central point for us. Yeah, because we do need to send it there. So what are some of the major tenets of the Course in Miracles? And what are some of the teachings in there that can help to direct people watching today? Well, the first one comes to mind is that God and love are real and that is, you might call it eternity, incident, these are qualities and characteristics of reality. And that the perceptual world of the time-space cosmos is ever changing. It's finite. It had a beginning, it'll have an end. It's always in flux and change. And so the Course teaches you to come to the present moment, which is really the gateway to eternity. And the present moment will be your point of power or your point of forgiveness, where you could loosen your mind from the illusions. So the teachings of the Course are really on forgiveness and complete forgiveness would be atonement. So when we talk about someone like Jesus Christ, Jesus was simply one who recognized the face of Christ, who awoke from the dream of the world. And now it's just this beautiful, gentle voice, very synonymous with the Holy Spirit in the mind that guides the mind to wake up from a dream of a nightmare of sin and guilt and sickness, fear, pain, so forth. So what role does to do this play in this whole thing? It's the key point. You said that, but I don't think people understood it. I think you really need to drive it home. Yeah. Forgiveness is forgiving the illusion is what it's about. In other words, we were starting to talk about this last night that you don't need to forgive the truth. You need to forgive illusions. So when you feel a grievance and a hurt coming out about what somebody said or did to you or what somebody didn't say or didn't do, Well, maybe you think they might have said. They might have said right. They're about those thoughts are all involved with the ego or guilt and those need to be released or forgiven. So you might say that another way of coming at it would be to say that your mind is very powerful and your mind is very causative. So that the illusion... Because your mind actually does co-create with God. So if you're co-creating, you're making stuff happen, right? Well, in heaven, we co-create with God in the sense that God created Christ and Christ has creations. But in terms of this world, it really is about forgiving the projections, forgiving, attempting to hurl the guilt out onto persons, places, things, and to blame and point the finger. Bringing it back to your mind is starting to realize that, gee, I've done this thing to myself, and now I want it undone. It doesn't include beating yourself up or does it? No, it doesn't. I mean, that would be the ego. It would say, you know, bring it back and, okay, you did this to yourself and you're guilty. It says bring it back, take the projection off of the body, off of your brothers and sisters, bring it back to your mind, and quickly give it over to the Holy Spirit. Give it over to the light. Let it be undone by bringing the darkness to the light. So that's a key point there, is forgiveness is giving it over to the Holy Spirit. And how do you do that? Willingness. You just have to be willing. That was the point that was brought up, and you brought it up together in last night, but if you're willing, if you just have a little willingness to do it with the power of all the Holy Spirit, the universe with you, then it ignites this transformation of mind. But it does, that little willingness takes a lot. And as you do it consistently, then you might say that your mind develops a great willingness to see that all things work together for good, and that every event that seems to happen is gently planned for your waking, and also that there's a way of looking at it without judgment or fear. And at that point, you can live in a state of peace and joy always. You know, not just a really good day. It's just all right. Yes. You could call that salvation, you could call that enlightenment, you could call that Self-Realization, but that's the state of mind that it's a joyful, happy dream where you're looking upon the world through happy eyes, through peace and forgiveness. And you're really not looking then to get anything back from the world. You're just letting the love of God pour through you and shine, and it's like bringing a blanket of peace to the whole world, and it's really a blessing. As you travel, you find in the same kinds of experiences are happening for you, Rasta, where you find more peace, more joy, more trust, and all those kinds of things. Absolutely. It's like the songs are all about peace, and they seem to come from within me from that place of peace and joy. It's almost like messages from my inner self to that which seems to experience the world and those reassuring and gentle. And we do give all kinds of things away. We live totally by divine providence. And so if ones come to the website, they can get CDs. They can get tapes or CDs of David's past gatherings or the ones that we do on the road. We're able to put them right up on the Web now like the one last night who recorded that they will go back to the peace house and put that up on the Web. So all kinds of resources on that Web site for people who want to learn more about coming to this peace. And you have CDs. You have beautiful CDs. Since last June. There's been eight CDs actually. See how it is like, huh? There's just another miracle here. I guess just because of course a miracle is like a common thread here. I mean, it's a book that you both read. It might be something that our audience is interested in. Can you tell us a little bit about the book or what it is or how you get it or anything like that in the last couple of minutes that we have? Yeah. You can purchase it at most large bookstores and chains. You've got places to write online and get it at bookstores that are online. And it's just about 1200 and some odd pages with a text and a workbook and a teacher's manual. So it's like Jesus just saying, I know that you've got some guilt and fear that you're dealing with. I know you've got some struggles and tribulations and trials in this world, but be of good cheer. I've overcome the world and I'm going to give you a roadmap. And here's your roadmap. Here's a text to give you some ideas of the metaphysics that will be helpful for you. Those will be helpful in applying the workbook. So taking this one lesson a day for 365 days to go through the mind, healing, and transformation. And then a manual for teachers for those that are called to share pieces of their life's work. Some of the questions and difficulties that come up, Jesus gives real direct answers to a lot of those questions. And you're using Jesus. Do you feel like the source of this information is Jesus? Is that kind of learning? Yeah, you could say the Christ mind. The Christ consciousness. The Christ consciousness is coming through. In other words, the Spirit has to use the symbols of the world and words are definitely of the world, but the Spirit can use those as signposts to point to an experience of the present moment. So in that sense, you could say that Jesus or the Christ Spirit is coming through and using it. And so that's where we're coming from. We're out of time, but it is available. The book is available. There are website addresses on our screen. So if you're interested, if you're looking for a spiritual path, this might be one for you. Thank you for being here with us, David. And the blessing. Thank you for being here. And thank you for watching the extra mile.